Author Topic: Hypothetical: How long to create a society similar to ours only from scratch? (Read 7398 times)

nicname · « **on:** May 01, 2014, 05:18:30 AM »

I'm not talking governments, etc. I'm talking about tech advances. How long until ag? How long crude then more advanced weaponry? How long until simple machines? How long until engines (steam, coal, etc.), then transportation, telegraphs, phones, computers, etc.?

The scenario is you take a representative swath of 100,000 ( aged 13-50) modern people, set them in an environment identical to earth with no tools, no domesticated animals or crops, etc. It's a fertile world with a temperate climate. Flora and fauna are similar to what they would have been at the time of the neolithic revolution.

I'm guessing they could develop something similar/ close to ours within 1,000 years. Optimistic estimate is closer to 500 years.

steve dave · « **Reply #1 on:** May 01, 2014, 06:07:21 AM »

less than one lifetime. ~80.

slobber · « **Reply #2 on:** May 01, 2014, 07:42:01 AM »

What is the first major thing they create? A gasoline engine? That would have to be pretty high up on the list. Also, staplers would be needed pretty quickly. There would be a ton of user manuals and notes that would easily get mixed up if they weren't stapled together.

So-
1. gasoline engines
2. staplers
3. ?
4. ?
5. ?

Boom Roasted · « **Reply #3 on:** May 01, 2014, 08:01:46 AM »

Finding and mining metal would have to be top of this list. Also, there would be a whole pile of people that would have plenty of trouble just surviving. All the knowledge they would have now would be great, but they would be more skilled in using computers than hand tools

Tobias · « **Reply #4 on:** May 01, 2014, 08:05:48 AM »

Quote from: slobber on May 01, 2014, 07:42:01 AM

fertilizer, GMO's

KITNfury · « **Reply #5 on:** May 01, 2014, 08:06:30 AM »

^^Agree with priority is finding and refining resources.

But the ultimate goal would be energy (electricity). Technology would roll after that.

puniraptor · « **Reply #6 on:** May 01, 2014, 08:09:53 AM »

thousands of years. the first generations would be only living for subsistence, and the knowledge of what is even possible would be lost or relegated to myth

slobber · « **Reply #7 on:** May 01, 2014, 08:10:15 AM »

Well you guys are talking about what they have to find. I am talking about what they have to create.
In your scenario, food, shelter would be 1 and 2. In my scenario, what comes after staplers? Probably pesticides. Tobias is ahead of himself with GMO's. That is somewhere around 8.

TownieCat · « **Reply #8 on:** May 01, 2014, 08:13:06 AM »

5,000 years, give or take a century.

slobber · « **Reply #9 on:** May 01, 2014, 08:13:53 AM »

My real answer is about 150 years.

I think there would be a strange period when the babies of this society started to grow up and the parents were working on things that the babies had never seen. Hearing adult conversations about computers would be really strange when there are no computers around. All of the adults would have all of this common knowledge in their heads and the kids would be growing up without anything concrete as a reference to what the adults were talking about.

EllRobersonisInnocent · « **Reply #10 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:14:24 AM »

2,000 years minimum.

michigancat · « **Reply #11 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:22:23 AM »

A big problem is that agriculture has made us what we are today. We wouldn't have the intelligence without agriculture.

Or would we send people who already know about agriculture and technology to a place with nothing?

Dugout DickStone · « **Reply #12 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:22:36 AM »

How much access to caves do they have?

slobber · « **Reply #13 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:23:36 AM »

Quote from: slobber on May 01, 2014, 08:13:53 AM

My real answer is about 150 years.

I think there would be a strange period when the babies of this society started to grow up and the parents were working on things that the babies had never seen. Hearing adult conversations about computers would be really strange when there are no computers around. All of the adults would have all of this common knowledge in their heads and the kids would be growing up without anything concrete as a reference to what the adults were talking about.

That's pretty insightful, slobber.

michigancat · « **Reply #14 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:26:38 AM »

Never mind, just read the op more closely.

The Tonya Harding of Twitter Users Creep · « **Reply #15 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:27:35 AM »

facebook has got to be top 3 priority

Emo EMAW · « **Reply #16 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:28:56 AM »

You guys are assuming that society as we know it is desirable. These people may decide to just do whatever they damn please and take us in a different direction.

michigancat · « **Reply #17 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:30:51 AM »

If I was going to this world I would try to sneak in lots of books.

slobber · « **Reply #18 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:31:41 AM »

Quote from: The Tonya Harding of Twitter Users Creep on May 01, 2014, 09:27:35 AM

facebook has got to be top 3 priority

1. Gasoline Engine
2. Staplers
3. Facebook
4. Pesticides (I'll concede to Facebook, but I think it is stupid other than some great posts in that one thread on gE.)
5. ?
6. ?
7. ?
8. GMO's
9. ?
10. ?

Rage Against the McKee · « **Reply #19 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:31:49 AM »

It would probably take about 2000 years or so. It would be a lot faster if somebody in the 100,000 already knows how to make paper.

Emo EMAW · « **Reply #20 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:33:33 AM »

I had a similar discussion with a pretty experienced and brilliant engineer. Dude worked at the Honeywell nuke place for a long time, knows a lot of stuff. Anyway, I asked him if he was transplanted back in time to the dawn of the industrial age, and he was allowed to share as much knowledge as he could with the scholars and engineers of the day, how much further ahead would we be? His response: none, they'd think he was crazy.

slobber · « **Reply #21 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:34:33 AM »

Quote from: Rage Against the McKee on May 01, 2014, 09:31:49 AM

It would probably take about 2000 years or so. It would be a lot faster if somebody in the 100,000 already knows how to make paper.

My daughter could make crude paper in 2nd grade. All she needed was some recycled paper, water, and a blender. BOOM! PAPER ISSUE SOLVED!

Maybe they will make staplers before the end of 3rd grade?

michigancat · « **Reply #22 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:38:00 AM »

My plan for society would be:

1) paper/ink- write down all you know about modern earth. Assign people writing assignments based on areas of expertise.
1b) In parallel with the writers, dedicate all metal experts to building a printing press. This will develop society the fastest, and weapons for hunting could also be developed as residuals.

2) once the printing press is up and running, work on developing ships to explore the world and find new resources.

3) while folks are out exploring, work on an electricity network

At this point, it's pretty much all gravy. I think you could get to electricity and ships in a generation or two.

Rage Against the McKee · « **Reply #23 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:39:57 AM »

Quote from: slobber on May 01, 2014, 09:34:33 AM

Quote from: Rage Against the McKee on May 01, 2014, 09:31:49 AM
It would probably take about 2000 years or so. It would be a lot faster if somebody in the 100,000 already knows how to make paper.
My daughter could make crude paper in 2nd grade. All she needed was some recycled paper, water, and a blender. BOOM! PAPER ISSUE SOLVED!

Maybe they will make staplers before the end of 3rd grade?

Yeah, but there wouldn't be any paper to recycle if they didn't have some guy who already knew how to make it. You could probably make a blender with a few gears and some horses. Paper would be tough, though.

slobber · « **Reply #24 on:** May 01, 2014, 09:40:41 AM »

Quote from: michigancat on May 01, 2014, 09:38:00 AM

My plan for society would be:

1) paper/ink- write down all you know about modern earth. Assign people writing assignments based on areas of expertise.
1b) In parallel with the writers, dedicate all metal experts to building a printing press. This will develop society the fastest, and weapons for hunting could also be developed as residuals.

2) once the printing press is up and running, work on developing ships to explore the world and find new resources.

3) while folks are out exploring, work on an electricity network

At this point, it's pretty much all gravy. I think you could get to electricity and ships in a generation or two.

Gravy would be a pretty important piece, but #4? That seems high.