The KU Rayhawks are NOT going through a rough patch. They make Raytown, Missouri proud!

[sonofdaxjones]

I can see your point to an extent with Louisville, UK and Nebraska.   However economic benefit models around sports venues are generally way over blown, typically part of the hyperbolic campaign to get tax payers to foot the bill.   I'm not against government financing, but in the cases of large venues like the KFC Yum Center, I'd like to see the schools have to put some skin in the game up front.

In the case of RCP, the City of Lawrentucky has already revised down the economic impact numbers.

I'm not defending the Lawrence deal because i see no economic impact from a track complex.  economic impact is more clear in the case of large, multi-purpose civic arenas in larger cities like Kansas City and Louisville.  Sprint Center has been the positive model of economic impact.  If KC had an urban basketball school like Nova, Xavier, Cincy, Creighton, etc. it would make perfect sense for the school to lease the facility from the City.  often hyperbolic, sure.  But, in the case of downtown arenas that can fill the dates and make the City money, I think a civic/university partnership makes perfect sense.     

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

[BleedEMAW]

After reading the latest disclosures about Rock Chalk Park, I don't know if I'd be embarrassed as hell knowing how hard K-State would be suckling off the taxpayers teat if they were to ever enter into a similar agreement.  Or, if I should high five everyone at K-State for taking local government for such a ride.

I guess Kudo's to ku for taking a page out of Cornhole U Athletics (Nebraska) playbook and grabbing that taxpayer teat with both hands and taking a nice long pull.

If you are referring to the new PBA in Lincoln, it was never about NU more about the inferiority complex between Lincoln and Omaha.     The city of Lincoln is the one trying to get the University system to build stuff that they can use without having to pay a majority of the cost.

[Belvis Noland]

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

I don't know the details of every arena in America.  Obviously, there are plenty of examples of losers and situations where companies like AEG bamboozle taxpayers into funding these civic projects that don't end up producing any ROI.  But, KC and Louisville are not amongst the loser category.  The economic impact of SC has been tremendous and the facilty posts operating profits in the 1.5-2mil range every year.  "Sprint Center/AEG provided more than $1.47 million in unanticipated revenue to the city of KCMO through a profit-sharing provision in the arena management agreement. Since opening in 2007, Sprint Center/AEG has provided more than $9.3 million to the city of KCMO as part of this unique public-private partnership."  Lousiville has posted operating profits of 1mil-2mil in each of the last 2 years. 

I guess I just don't see why it should matter if the school puts any skin in the game.  The University is like any commercial tenant.  Pay your agreed lease, don't get the profits.  The City gets the profits.  Or, University owns the facility and keeps all profits.  I dunno.  Maybe that's too simplistic of a way to view it.     

[sonofdaxjones]

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

I don't know the details of every arena in America.  Obviously, there are plenty of examples of losers and situations where companies like AEG bamboozle taxpayers into funding these civic projects that don't end up producing any ROI.  But, KC and Louisville are not amongst the loser category.  The economic impact of SC has been tremendous and the facilty posts operating profits in the 1.5-2mil range every year.  "Sprint Center/AEG provided more than $1.47 million in unanticipated revenue to the city of KCMO through a profit-sharing provision in the arena management agreement. Since opening in 2007, Sprint Center/AEG has provided more than $9.3 million to the city of KCMO as part of this unique public-private partnership."  Lousiville has posted operating profits of 1mil-2mil in each of the last 2 years. 

I guess I just don't see why it should matter if the school puts any skin in the game.  The University is like any commercial tenant.  Pay your agreed lease, don't get the profits.  The City gets the profits.  Or, University owns the facility and keeps all profits.  I dunno.  Maybe that's too simplistic of a way to view it.   

I am discussing specific university and public taxpayer arrangements in towns and cities which revolve almost solely around, or at minimum extensively around colleges/universities.   Entities like Sprint Center don't belong in that discussion.   The PNC Center in Raleigh (for example) belongs in that discussion because while the RDU area has a lot of other things going on, NC State is a huge player sitting right there in the middle of Raleigh. 

No Louisville Basketball, probably no KFC Yum Center.   

There's nothing wrong with doing this stuff, I (as in me) would rather see the schools have more skin in the game up front, in addition, I don't buy the PR hype from politicians.   This has been studied extensively and the financial proclamations are almost ALWAYS overblown by civic types.

[OregonSmock]

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

I don't know the details of every arena in America.  Obviously, there are plenty of examples of losers and situations where companies like AEG bamboozle taxpayers into funding these civic projects that don't end up producing any ROI.  But, KC and Louisville are not amongst the loser category.  The economic impact of SC has been tremendous and the facilty posts operating profits in the 1.5-2mil range every year.  "Sprint Center/AEG provided more than $1.47 million in unanticipated revenue to the city of KCMO through a profit-sharing provision in the arena management agreement. Since opening in 2007, Sprint Center/AEG has provided more than $9.3 million to the city of KCMO as part of this unique public-private partnership."  Lousiville has posted operating profits of 1mil-2mil in each of the last 2 years. 

I guess I just don't see why it should matter if the school puts any skin in the game.  The University is like any commercial tenant.  Pay your agreed lease, don't get the profits.  The City gets the profits.  Or, University owns the facility and keeps all profits.  I dunno.  Maybe that's too simplistic of a way to view it.   

I am just butthurt that KU is so much bigger and more bad ass than K-State.

fyp

[sonofdaxjones]

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

I don't know the details of every arena in America.  Obviously, there are plenty of examples of losers and situations where companies like AEG bamboozle taxpayers into funding these civic projects that don't end up producing any ROI.  But, KC and Louisville are not amongst the loser category.  The economic impact of SC has been tremendous and the facilty posts operating profits in the 1.5-2mil range every year.  "Sprint Center/AEG provided more than $1.47 million in unanticipated revenue to the city of KCMO through a profit-sharing provision in the arena management agreement. Since opening in 2007, Sprint Center/AEG has provided more than $9.3 million to the city of KCMO as part of this unique public-private partnership."  Lousiville has posted operating profits of 1mil-2mil in each of the last 2 years. 

I guess I just don't see why it should matter if the school puts any skin in the game.  The University is like any commercial tenant.  Pay your agreed lease, don't get the profits.  The City gets the profits.  Or, University owns the facility and keeps all profits.  I dunno.  Maybe that's too simplistic of a way to view it.   

I am just butthurt that KU is so much bigger and more bad ass than K-State.

fyp

Nothing says big and bad ass like sticking the mid sized Kansas town for almost the entire bill on a new track complex while using 18 months worth of donations to make the athletic department actually look profitable on an annual audited financial report (a fact that is not noted anywhere on ku's annual audited report BTW). 

Sad

[OregonSmock]

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

I don't know the details of every arena in America.  Obviously, there are plenty of examples of losers and situations where companies like AEG bamboozle taxpayers into funding these civic projects that don't end up producing any ROI.  But, KC and Louisville are not amongst the loser category.  The economic impact of SC has been tremendous and the facilty posts operating profits in the 1.5-2mil range every year.  "Sprint Center/AEG provided more than $1.47 million in unanticipated revenue to the city of KCMO through a profit-sharing provision in the arena management agreement. Since opening in 2007, Sprint Center/AEG has provided more than $9.3 million to the city of KCMO as part of this unique public-private partnership."  Lousiville has posted operating profits of 1mil-2mil in each of the last 2 years. 

I guess I just don't see why it should matter if the school puts any skin in the game.  The University is like any commercial tenant.  Pay your agreed lease, don't get the profits.  The City gets the profits.  Or, University owns the facility and keeps all profits.  I dunno.  Maybe that's too simplistic of a way to view it.   

I am just butthurt that KU is so much bigger and more bad ass than K-State.

fyp

Yep, I'm butthurt

fyp

[sonofdaxjones]

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

I don't know the details of every arena in America.  Obviously, there are plenty of examples of losers and situations where companies like AEG bamboozle taxpayers into funding these civic projects that don't end up producing any ROI.  But, KC and Louisville are not amongst the loser category.  The economic impact of SC has been tremendous and the facilty posts operating profits in the 1.5-2mil range every year.  "Sprint Center/AEG provided more than $1.47 million in unanticipated revenue to the city of KCMO through a profit-sharing provision in the arena management agreement. Since opening in 2007, Sprint Center/AEG has provided more than $9.3 million to the city of KCMO as part of this unique public-private partnership."  Lousiville has posted operating profits of 1mil-2mil in each of the last 2 years. 

I guess I just don't see why it should matter if the school puts any skin in the game.  The University is like any commercial tenant.  Pay your agreed lease, don't get the profits.  The City gets the profits.  Or, University owns the facility and keeps all profits.  I dunno.  Maybe that's too simplistic of a way to view it.   

I am just butthurt that KU is so much bigger and more bad ass than K-State.

fyp

Yep, I'm butthurt

fyp

Well look at the perpetually angry ku fan who looks to invalidate the $168 million dollars worth of facilities improvements at K-State over 4 years at every turn, while defending his book cooking athletic department and their latching on to the government teat at every turn.

Sad

[420seriouscat69]

Beems, rest your fingers, I got this one for you:

Dur. Endowment. Dur. Your coach is going to die. Dur. Will lap you 10 years from now so it doesn't matter. Dur. Sex. Dur. 'Taters. Dur.

[The Big Train]

[MadCat]

Beems, rest your fingers, I got this one for you:

Dur. Endowment. Dur. Your coach is going to die. Dur. Will lap you 10 years from now so it doesn't matter. Dur. Sex. Dur. 'Taters. Dur. Harley Track. Dur.

[SEK_EMAW]

Beems, rest your fingers, I got this one for you:

Dur. Endowment. Dur. Your coach is going to die. Dur. Will lap you 10 years from now so it doesn't matter. Dur. Sex. Dur. 'Taters. Dur. Harley Track. Dur. Parking Lots. Dur

[deputy dawg]

Dur. Endowment. Dur. Your coach is going to die. Dur. Will lap you 10 years from now so it doesn't matter. Dur. Sex. Dur. 'Taters. Dur. Harley Track. Dur. Parking Lots. Dur Cruise ships, Dur

[_33]

BMW is owning this thread.  #mashedtaters

[KITNfury]

BMW is owning this thread.  #mashedtaters

#mushedtaters

[Bqqkie Pimp]

I see what you're saying and I don't necessarily disagree, but again, I'd prefer the schools have to put some significant skin in the game in these types arrangements.   For example the entire development that includes the KFC Yum Center in Louisville has a half a billion dollars worth of debt to go along with it, and the arena by itself is break even at best.   

On the flip side, take the PNC Center in Raleigh.  NC State put in $30 million up front towards the cost of construction.   If these schools can raise millions to build other facilities, they can raise millions to take some of the load off the debt burden of taxpayers.

I don't know the details of every arena in America.  Obviously, there are plenty of examples of losers and situations where companies like AEG bamboozle taxpayers into funding these civic projects that don't end up producing any ROI.  But, KC and Louisville are not amongst the loser category.  The economic impact of SC has been tremendous and the facilty posts operating profits in the 1.5-2mil range every year.  "Sprint Center/AEG provided more than $1.47 million in unanticipated revenue to the city of KCMO through a profit-sharing provision in the arena management agreement. Since opening in 2007, Sprint Center/AEG has provided more than $9.3 million to the city of KCMO as part of this unique public-private partnership."  Lousiville has posted operating profits of 1mil-2mil in each of the last 2 years. 

I guess I just don't see why it should matter if the school puts any skin in the game.  The University is like any commercial tenant.  Pay your agreed lease, don't get the profits.  The City gets the profits.  Or, University owns the facility and keeps all profits.  I dunno.  Maybe that's too simplistic of a way to view it.   

I am just butthurt that KU is so much bigger and more bad ass than K-State.

fyp

Yep, I'm butthurt

fyp

Well look at the perpetually angry ku fan who looks to invalidate the $168 million dollars worth of facilities improvements at K-State over 4 years at every turn, while defending his book cooking athletic department and their latching on to the government teat at every turn.

Sad

[Rage Against the McKee]

BMW is owning this thread.  #mashedtaters

Yep. These guys should all go park their car or something. Plenty of space, guys!

[Havs]

Low end for KU will be facade improvements which fill in the checkerboard spaces beneath the upper decks and a dug in field, similar to what happened at Texas, making the arc much more compact, similar to Purdue. Track space in between the South Endzone and scoreboard could be used as bleachers if ticket demand rises above 50k.

[jtksu]

Low end for KU will be facade improvements which fill in the checkerboard spaces beneath the upper decks and a dug in field, similar to what happened at Texas, making the arc much more compact, similar to Purdue. Track space in between the South Endzone and scoreboard could be used as bleachers if ticket demand rises above 50k.

I guess KState fans will buy up shitty seats every other year but worrying about needing seating above 50,000 at Memorial is pretty laughable.

[KITNfury]

It will be a lot of fun watching the phog scramble for ways to discredit the nez when the pics get released. Really looking forward to it.

Merlin's family funhouse castle

[Cire]

Bill in a blue merlin robe with a wand in front of the castle

[Dugout DickStone]

Ku fans I know are insanely jealous that we are going to have the best football facilities in the conference while they have the worst.

[MouseRat]

Ku fans I know are insanely jealous that we are going to have the best football facilities in the conference while they have the worst.

While I think you're right about KSU having the best facilities I have to disagree with your argument about KU fans being jealous.  My guess is - and I'm only speculating - that KU fans aren't jealous because they don't really care which is the very reason why they are so terrible.

[star seed 7]

mouseloser should not be allowed to post on this blog.  #fuckingterrible

[MouseRat]

mouseloser should not be allowed to post on this blog.  #fuckingterrible

Dude, idk who pissed in your Cheerios, but good grief!