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Quote from: timhawk on July 30, 2013, 08:05:22 PMQuote from: Stevesie60 on July 30, 2013, 07:58:15 PMHave you dorks ever compared Klein's numbers vs. OU and Manziel's numbers vs. OU? I feel like I'm trying to explain to Ryan Wallace that Lebron is good here.Klein vs OU: 149 pass yds, 0 TD 0 INT 79 rush yds 1 TDWON GAME 24-19Manziel vs OU: 287 pass yds, 2 TD 1 INT 229 rush yds, 2 TDWON GAME 41-13You know I'm on your side, right?
Quote from: Stevesie60 on July 30, 2013, 07:58:15 PMHave you dorks ever compared Klein's numbers vs. OU and Manziel's numbers vs. OU? I feel like I'm trying to explain to Ryan Wallace that Lebron is good here.Klein vs OU: 149 pass yds, 0 TD 0 INT 79 rush yds 1 TDWON GAME 24-19Manziel vs OU: 287 pass yds, 2 TD 1 INT 229 rush yds, 2 TDWON GAME 41-13
Have you dorks ever compared Klein's numbers vs. OU and Manziel's numbers vs. OU? I feel like I'm trying to explain to Ryan Wallace that Lebron is good here.
The main reasons Manziel won the Heisman: beating Alabama and flashy highlight reel plays. A ton of his stats came against really shitty teams (5 TDs vs 1AA Sam Houston State, 5 TDs vs 1AA SC State, 5 TDs vs 3-9 Auburn, 4 TDs vs 4-8 Pig Aggie, 5 TDs vs 5-7 Missouri). More than half of his TDs came against crap competition.If anyone really voted for him to win the Heisman because of his stats and not because of beating Alabama and flashy plays (and I'm sure some people did) they are retards. He wasn't scoring 5 TDs/game when he was playing against teams that weren't totally overmatched.
Quote from: Jackstack99EMAW on July 30, 2013, 08:04:16 PMNot as far off as timhawk thinks, as stats don't show the whole story really, but yeah Manziel definitely deserved it as a player over Klein. As a person and all the "values" that the Heisman is supposed to stand for, lol, no.I agree, as a person he's crap, but he's a better player than Klein. Hiesman is all about on the field performance.
Not as far off as timhawk thinks, as stats don't show the whole story really, but yeah Manziel definitely deserved it as a player over Klein. As a person and all the "values" that the Heisman is supposed to stand for, lol, no.
Quote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:03:47 PMThe main reasons Manziel won the Heisman: beating Alabama and flashy highlight reel plays. A ton of his stats came against really shitty teams (5 TDs vs 1AA Sam Houston State, 5 TDs vs 1AA SC State, 5 TDs vs 3-9 Auburn, 4 TDs vs 4-8 Pig Aggie, 5 TDs vs 5-7 Missouri). More than half of his TDs came against crap competition.If anyone really voted for him to win the Heisman because of his stats and not because of beating Alabama and flashy plays (and I'm sure some people did) they are retards. He wasn't scoring 5 TDs/game when he was playing against teams that weren't totally overmatched.so you're saying stats for Hiesman should only be considered from "big games"?
Quote from: timhawk on July 30, 2013, 08:10:53 PMQuote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:03:47 PMThe main reasons Manziel won the Heisman: beating Alabama and flashy highlight reel plays. A ton of his stats came against really shitty teams (5 TDs vs 1AA Sam Houston State, 5 TDs vs 1AA SC State, 5 TDs vs 3-9 Auburn, 4 TDs vs 4-8 Pig Aggie, 5 TDs vs 5-7 Missouri). More than half of his TDs came against crap competition.If anyone really voted for him to win the Heisman because of his stats and not because of beating Alabama and flashy plays (and I'm sure some people did) they are retards. He wasn't scoring 5 TDs/game when he was playing against teams that weren't totally overmatched.so you're saying stats for Hiesman should only be considered from "big games"?When 10 of your TDs are against 1AA teams, that devalues the "but he had better stats" argument. I really don't think that's an unreasonable argument. The Heisman is most definitely won in big games. No way in hell Manziel wins it if Aggie lost to Alabama.As far as the Oklahoma comparison, you might have a point if the Heisman was awarded after the bowl games, but it's not.
And in the interest of being fair, here are Klein's TD numbers vs 1AA teams/teams with losing records2 TDs vs Missouri State3 TDs vs North Texas4 TDs vs KUNine of Klein's TDs came against crap competition as opposed to 24 for Manziel. I'm too lazy to go into yardage for these same games but I'd be willing to bet that Manziel also has a much higher percentage of his total yards against bad teams than Klein as well.
Quote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:16:57 PMQuote from: timhawk on July 30, 2013, 08:10:53 PMQuote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:03:47 PMThe main reasons Manziel won the Heisman: beating Alabama and flashy highlight reel plays. A ton of his stats came against really shitty teams (5 TDs vs 1AA Sam Houston State, 5 TDs vs 1AA SC State, 5 TDs vs 3-9 Auburn, 4 TDs vs 4-8 Pig Aggie, 5 TDs vs 5-7 Missouri). More than half of his TDs came against crap competition.If anyone really voted for him to win the Heisman because of his stats and not because of beating Alabama and flashy plays (and I'm sure some people did) they are retards. He wasn't scoring 5 TDs/game when he was playing against teams that weren't totally overmatched.so you're saying stats for Hiesman should only be considered from "big games"?When 10 of your TDs are against 1AA teams, that devalues the "but he had better stats" argument. I really don't think that's an unreasonable argument. The Heisman is most definitely won in big games. No way in hell Manziel wins it if Aggie lost to Alabama.As far as the Oklahoma comparison, you might have a point if the Heisman was awarded after the bowl games, but it's not.like posted above...what tough defenses did ksu play?
Quote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:25:46 PMAnd in the interest of being fair, here are Klein's TD numbers vs 1AA teams/teams with losing records2 TDs vs Missouri State3 TDs vs North Texas4 TDs vs KUNine of Klein's TDs came against crap competition as opposed to 24 for Manziel. I'm too lazy to go into yardage for these same games but I'd be willing to bet that Manziel also has a much higher percentage of his total yards against bad teams than Klein as well.but we are talking about horrible teams right? so throw in Kleins 7 TD he had against that stout WVU defense while you're at it. and btw if you are that good you should put up HUGE numbers against scrub teams.
Quote from: timhawk on July 30, 2013, 08:23:08 PMQuote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:16:57 PMQuote from: timhawk on July 30, 2013, 08:10:53 PMQuote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:03:47 PMThe main reasons Manziel won the Heisman: beating Alabama and flashy highlight reel plays. A ton of his stats came against really shitty teams (5 TDs vs 1AA Sam Houston State, 5 TDs vs 1AA SC State, 5 TDs vs 3-9 Auburn, 4 TDs vs 4-8 Pig Aggie, 5 TDs vs 5-7 Missouri). More than half of his TDs came against crap competition.If anyone really voted for him to win the Heisman because of his stats and not because of beating Alabama and flashy plays (and I'm sure some people did) they are retards. He wasn't scoring 5 TDs/game when he was playing against teams that weren't totally overmatched.so you're saying stats for Hiesman should only be considered from "big games"?When 10 of your TDs are against 1AA teams, that devalues the "but he had better stats" argument. I really don't think that's an unreasonable argument. The Heisman is most definitely won in big games. No way in hell Manziel wins it if Aggie lost to Alabama.As far as the Oklahoma comparison, you might have a point if the Heisman was awarded after the bowl games, but it's not.like posted above...what tough defenses did ksu play?Aggie played more elite teams than KSU, but they also played a lot more bodybag games, which led to Manziel's inflated numbers. KSU only played three games against teams that didn't go to a bowl game, A&M played six. Like I said, Manziel won the Heisman because he played great in one of Aggie's tough games and made highlight reel plays all season. Klein was only going to win if KSU went 12-0 and we didn't so it's fine with me that he didn't win, but arguing that Manziel deserved to win because of stats is asinine.
I don't know that week 4 OU vs bowl week OU is really a fair comparison. But yes, A&M finished ridiculously hot.
Quote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:30:10 PMQuote from: timhawk on July 30, 2013, 08:23:08 PMQuote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:16:57 PMQuote from: timhawk on July 30, 2013, 08:10:53 PMQuote from: Shacks on July 30, 2013, 08:03:47 PMThe main reasons Manziel won the Heisman: beating Alabama and flashy highlight reel plays. A ton of his stats came against really shitty teams (5 TDs vs 1AA Sam Houston State, 5 TDs vs 1AA SC State, 5 TDs vs 3-9 Auburn, 4 TDs vs 4-8 Pig Aggie, 5 TDs vs 5-7 Missouri). More than half of his TDs came against crap competition.If anyone really voted for him to win the Heisman because of his stats and not because of beating Alabama and flashy plays (and I'm sure some people did) they are retards. He wasn't scoring 5 TDs/game when he was playing against teams that weren't totally overmatched.so you're saying stats for Hiesman should only be considered from "big games"?When 10 of your TDs are against 1AA teams, that devalues the "but he had better stats" argument. I really don't think that's an unreasonable argument. The Heisman is most definitely won in big games. No way in hell Manziel wins it if Aggie lost to Alabama.As far as the Oklahoma comparison, you might have a point if the Heisman was awarded after the bowl games, but it's not.like posted above...what tough defenses did ksu play?Aggie played more elite teams than KSU, but they also played a lot more bodybag games, which led to Manziel's inflated numbers. KSU only played three games against teams that didn't go to a bowl game, A&M played six. Like I said, Manziel won the Heisman because he played great in one of Aggie's tough games and made highlight reel plays all season. Klein was only going to win if KSU went 12-0 and we didn't so it's fine with me that he didn't win, but arguing that Manziel deserved to win because of stats is asinine.you do know they pick a Heisman based on stats right? not who's the better christian
Quote from: EMAWmeister on July 30, 2013, 08:39:08 PMI don't know that week 4 OU vs bowl week OU is really a fair comparison. But yes, A&M finished ridiculously hot.how is that not fair? OU had a whole month to gameplan against Manziel and still couldnt stop him.
