oscar is on the clock...

[8manpick]

I want to cry

[EMAWzified]

Who could have guessed oscar was on teamburnitdown? The bastid. I'd like to smush a custid in that stupid looking mouth of his.

[kso_FAN]

Oh and team #WishyWashy gets an excuse to refrain from judgement   

I'm pretty sure this is me and I've said several times now if anything this only makes judgement more clear, at least for me. Things should be pretty clear by the end of year 3 and very clear by the end of year 4. This is a good thing IMO.

And I get the "oscar is already what he is" thought process and for the most part that's true. But I'm still going to judge him on what he does at K-State, because its still a different league and a different enough situation that he could have more success (or failure) than he did in his last job. That is what will get him fired or allow him to stay here. That's been my stand from the start.

Sincerely,
#teamfence

[ednksu]

fan in a worse case scenario, how long do you give a coach?  I'm not saying that scenario has anything to do with ncaa issues, player misconduct, or coach misconduct.  But the program is completely falling apart, not winning games, not recruiting D1 players, the perfect storm of Wooly and Asbury coaching. 

Am I wrong that your minimum for oscar is 4 years before a decision should/could be made?

[kso_FAN]

fan in a worse case scenario, how long do you give a coach?  I'm not saying that scenario has anything to do with ncaa issues, player misconduct, or coach misconduct.  But the program is completely falling apart, not winning games, not recruiting D1 players, the perfect storm of Wooly and Asbury coaching. 

Am I wrong that your minimum for oscar is 4 years before a decision should/could be made?

No, if the next 2 years are complete disasters, then a move could be made after year 3. See Ron Prince.

[michigancat]

And I get the "oscar is already what he is" thought process and for the most part that's true. But I'm still going to judge him on what he does at K-State, because its still a different league and a different enough situation that he could have more success (or failure) than he did in his last job. That is what will get him fired or allow him to stay here. That's been my stand from the start.

Sincerely,
#teamfence

are the jobs REALLY that different? What are the differences that could lead to more success than he had at Illinois?

[catzacker]

The worst case scenario is two years of mediocrity followed by a crappy year or two.  oscar failing teribbly the next two years is "best" case,  imo.

[Dr Rick Daris]

if only we had multiple more data points and three more years of eFG numbers to crunch then i could plug it into a formula that might possibly allow me to maybe sort of slightly lean one way or the other on this. beep boo bop bo beep bootcfg ansi.sys command defrag.

[Cire]

If we don't finish top 3 or 4 next year it is a disaster

If we don't finish top 3 or 4 the following year it is a disaster.

The big 12 is complete garbage, he runs off an all big 12 player and a guy that would break some of Pullen's records.  I'm not changing my expectations.  If he loses these kids he's got to deal with it.

[lopakman]

oscar will be here for a long time.  He's Currie's guy.  I can't see any scenario that oscar gets fired short of a major scandel.  So someone start digging.

[Cire]

anyone else heard rumors of oscar asking angel to see his green card?

[kougar24]

fan in a worse case scenario, how long do you give a coach?  I'm not saying that scenario has anything to do with ncaa issues, player misconduct, or coach misconduct.  But the program is completely falling apart, not winning games, not recruiting D1 players, the perfect storm of Wooly and Asbury coaching. 

Am I wrong that your minimum for oscar is 4 years before a decision should/could be made?

No, if the next 2 years are complete disasters, then a move could be made after year 3. See Ron Prince.

What if Year 2 is meh and Year 3 is disastrous? Do you give him a 4th?

[The Whale]

fan in a worse case scenario, how long do you give a coach?  I'm not saying that scenario has anything to do with ncaa issues, player misconduct, or coach misconduct.  But the program is completely falling apart, not winning games, not recruiting D1 players, the perfect storm of Wooly and Asbury coaching. 

Am I wrong that your minimum for oscar is 4 years before a decision should/could be made?

No, if the next 2 years are complete disasters, then a move could be made after year 3. See Ron Prince.

What if Year 2 is meh and Year 3 is disastrous? Do you give him a 4th?

Shouldn't we be expecting the opposite?  Disastrous year 2 (no/fresman PG, no shot blocker), meh year 3, 4, 5, 6, retirement.  Basketball head hired as replacement.

[kougar24]

fan in a worse case scenario, how long do you give a coach?  I'm not saying that scenario has anything to do with ncaa issues, player misconduct, or coach misconduct.  But the program is completely falling apart, not winning games, not recruiting D1 players, the perfect storm of Wooly and Asbury coaching. 

Am I wrong that your minimum for oscar is 4 years before a decision should/could be made?

No, if the next 2 years are complete disasters, then a move could be made after year 3. See Ron Prince.

What if Year 2 is meh and Year 3 is disastrous? Do you give him a 4th?

Shouldn't we be expecting the opposite?  Disastrous year 2 (no/fresman PG, no shot blocker), meh year 3, 4, 5, 6, retirement.  Basketball head hired as replacement.

It's not about what I expect; I was asking what _FAN would expect under that scenario.

If Year 2 is disastrous, I would fire him then. No Year 3.

[Cire]

I fully expect for next year to be meh, only because the big 12 will be dog shlt.  14 will be meh at best depending on the rest of the big 12.

[ChiComCat]

13/14 - miss NIT
14/15 - NIT

If he has these results the next two years, he gets a 3rd.  EMAW Hoops Everyone!

[kougar24]

13/14 - miss NIT
14/15 - NIT

If he has these results the next two years, he gets a 3rd.  EMAW Hoops Everyone!

The first time we miss the NCAAs, and oscar doesn't get fired, that Currie billboard is goin' up.

[kso_FAN]

What if Year 2 is meh and Year 3 is disastrous? Do you give him a 4th?

Shouldn't we be expecting the opposite?  Disastrous year 2 (no/fresman PG, no shot blocker), meh year 3, 4, 5, 6, retirement.  Basketball head hired as replacement.

It's not about what I expect; I was asking what _FAN would expect under that scenario.

If Year 2 is disastrous, I would fire him then. No Year 3.

I've been wrong plenty of times, but I try to keep my speculations realistic.

Everyone knows that even if next year is a disaster, he's not going to get fired. It would take 2 consecutive disaster years to fire oscar at this point. A meh next year followed by a disaster in year 3 will likely get him a very hot seat in year 4.

One of my points in this thread is that with Angel, oscar was going to probably get at least 5 more years at minimum. IMO, losing Angel brings that minimum to 4 years, maybe 3 if the back to back disaster season scenario takes place. But IMO, 3 straight years of meh and he's on a very hot seat, if not gone.

FYI, IMO a meh season means NIT/bubblish season. Disaster = typical sub .500 Woolyish season with absolute disaster = TA's final season.

[kougar24]

The NIT is a disaster.

[michigancat]

What if Year 2 is meh and Year 3 is disastrous? Do you give him a 4th?

Shouldn't we be expecting the opposite?  Disastrous year 2 (no/fresman PG, no shot blocker), meh year 3, 4, 5, 6, retirement.  Basketball head hired as replacement.

It's not about what I expect; I was asking what _FAN would expect under that scenario.

If Year 2 is disastrous, I would fire him then. No Year 3.

I've been wrong plenty of times, but I try to keep my speculations realistic.

Everyone knows that even if next year is a disaster, he's not going to get fired. It would take 2 consecutive disaster years to fire oscar at this point. A meh next year followed by a disaster in year 3 will likely get him a very hot seat in year 4.

One of my points in this thread is that with Angel, oscar was going to probably get at least 5 more years at minimum. IMO, losing Angel brings that minimum to 4 years, maybe 3 if the back to back disaster season scenario takes place. But IMO, 3 straight years of meh and he's on a very hot seat, if not gone.

FYI, IMO a meh season means NIT/bubblish season. Disaster = typical sub .500 Woolyish season with absolute disaster = TA's final season.

I think a firm NIT season now = a sub .500 Wooly season 7 years ago

Maybe that's not fair. who knows.

[OregonSmock]

What if oscar/Lowry know what they're doing?  What if Chester Frazier handpicked Jevon Thomas and Nigel Johnson and believes that these two guys have the potential to be really good players? 

K-State fans have a right to be upset about Angel leaving, but after thinking about things a little bit, I'm not sure that this loss will be as devastating as it seems.  Angel is a really good player, and it always sucks losing good players, but Angel did have moments where he was out-matched athletically and times when he didn't take care of the ball.  Look at his stat line from the LaSalle game and tell me that he didn't piss down his pants that day:

http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330812306

(36 minutes, 0-6 fg, 4:3 a/to, 2 stl, 2 pts)


To tell you the truth, I don't think oscar and co. are all that upset that Angel is transferring.  K-State's bread and butter next year will be Southwell and Gipson, and honestly, that's a pretty damn good one/two punch.  K-State's task will be finding an inside presence on defense (maybe DJamer/Neville Fincher?) and a reliable starting point guard.  When it's all said and done, I think at least one of Jevon Thomas/Nigel Johnson will end up being a really good player for K-State.  As for the rest of the roster, Nino Williams will be improved.  Westicles/Foster could make an impact... we'll see.  The '13 recruiting class for K-State is really just a big question mark.  These kids aren't highly ranked or anything like that, but they still seem like guys who could be impact players at a mid major program, and maybe that's what Weber needs.  Eventually Weber will have to land a top 50-75 prospect, but right now the program looks like it will have enough talent to at least make the NCAA tourney.

[kougar24]

Look at beems, setting us up for the kill.

[kso_FAN]

What if oscar/Lowry know what they're doing?  What if Chester Frazier handpicked Jevon Thomas and Nigel Johnson and believes that these two guys have the potential to be really good players? 

K-State fans have a right to be upset about Angel leaving, but after thinking about things a little bit, I'm not sure that this loss will be as devastating as it seems.  Angel is a really good player, and it always sucks losing good players, but Angel did have moments where he was out-matched athletically and times when he didn't take care of the ball.  Look at his stat line from the LaSalle game and tell me that he didn't piss down his pants that day:

http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330812306

(36 minutes, 0-6 fg, 4:3 a/to, 2 stl, 2 pts)


To tell you the truth, I don't think oscar and co. are all that upset that Angel is transferring.  K-State's bread and butter next year will be Southwell and Gipson, and honestly, that's a pretty damn good one/two punch.  K-State's task will be finding an inside presence on defense (maybe DJamer/Neville Fincher?) and a reliable starting point guard.  When it's all said and done, I think at least one of Jevon Thomas/Nigel Johnson will end up being a really good player for K-State.  As for the rest of the roster, Nino Williams will be improved.  Westicles/Foster could make an impact... we'll see.  The '13 recruiting class for K-State is really just a big question mark.  These kids aren't highly ranked or anything like that, but they still seem like guys who could be impact players at a mid major program, and maybe that's what Weber needs.  Eventually Weber will have to land a top 50-75 prospect, but right now the program looks like it will have enough talent to at least make the NCAA tourney.

Thanks beems.

[Mr Bread]

What if oscar/Lowry know what they're doing?  What if Chester Frazier handpicked Jevon Thomas and Nigel Johnson and believes that these two guys have the potential to be really good players? 

K-State fans have a right to be upset about Angel leaving, but after thinking about things a little bit, I'm not sure that this loss will be as devastating as it seems.  Angel is a really good player, and it always sucks losing good players, but Angel did have moments where he was out-matched athletically and times when he didn't take care of the ball.  Look at his stat line from the LaSalle game and tell me that he didn't piss down his pants that day:

http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330812306

(36 minutes, 0-6 fg, 4:3 a/to, 2 stl, 2 pts)


To tell you the truth, I don't think oscar and co. are all that upset that Angel is transferring.  K-State's bread and butter next year will be Southwell and Gipson, and honestly, that's a pretty damn good one/two punch.  K-State's task will be finding an inside presence on defense (maybe DJamer/Neville Fincher?) and a reliable starting point guard.  When it's all said and done, I think at least one of Jevon Thomas/Nigel Johnson will end up being a really good player for K-State.  As for the rest of the roster, Nino Williams will be improved.  Westicles/Foster could make an impact... we'll see.  The '13 recruiting class for K-State is really just a big question mark.  These kids aren't highly ranked or anything like that, but they still seem like guys who could be impact players at a mid major program, and maybe that's what Weber needs.  Eventually Weber will have to land a top 50-75 prospect, but right now the program looks like it will have enough talent to at least make the NCAA tourney.

[OregonSmock]

What if oscar/Lowry know what they're doing?  What if Chester Frazier handpicked Jevon Thomas and Nigel Johnson and believes that these two guys have the potential to be really good players? 

K-State fans have a right to be upset about Angel leaving, but after thinking about things a little bit, I'm not sure that this loss will be as devastating as it seems.  Angel is a really good player, and it always sucks losing good players, but Angel did have moments where he was out-matched athletically and times when he didn't take care of the ball.  Look at his stat line from the LaSalle game and tell me that he didn't piss down his pants that day:

http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=330812306

(36 minutes, 0-6 fg, 4:3 a/to, 2 stl, 2 pts)


To tell you the truth, I don't think oscar and co. are all that upset that Angel is transferring.  K-State's bread and butter next year will be Southwell and Gipson, and honestly, that's a pretty damn good one/two punch.  K-State's task will be finding an inside presence on defense (maybe DJamer/Neville Fincher?) and a reliable starting point guard.  When it's all said and done, I think at least one of Jevon Thomas/Nigel Johnson will end up being a really good player for K-State.  As for the rest of the roster, Nino Williams will be improved.  Westicles/Foster could make an impact... we'll see.  The '13 recruiting class for K-State is really just a big question mark.  These kids aren't highly ranked or anything like that, but they still seem like guys who could be impact players at a mid major program, and maybe that's what Weber needs.  Eventually Weber will have to land a top 50-75 prospect, but right now the program looks like it will have enough talent to at least make the NCAA tourney.

This is the Dee Brown/Chester Frazier transition all over again, isn't it?