Official religion of NC

[CNS]

The Federal Gov does a crap job with education anyway. Maybe they shouldn't have the right to drag the US down with them?

The federal government doesn't do anything but set standards and provide funding. The standards are not high enough as it is. I can't imagine how low they would be in some states without a federal mandate.

Guess we don't need the Dept of Education then. Besides, does setting higher standards actually work? The system is completely broken, like everything else.

It would work if people were actually willing to take a hard line on students who don't meet them. You should either meet the standards or not pass.

Agreed.  The schools I have family and friends in now actually concern themselves with the social impact of the child and what being held back will do rather than simply if that child passes on grades.  They then spend more money pulling that kid out of the higher grade to spend one on one time with the kid to try to catch the kid up on reading/math/whatevs rather than just failing him and letting stay in the grade he didn't pass along with the other students in that grade.  Creates a losing situation. 

My wife has been teaching at the elementary level over a decade and hasn't heard of one kid being held back in that time. 

[p1k3]

Hold the students accountable. I agree with that. We should hold teachers accountable as well, tho.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Hold the students accountable. I agree with that. We should hold teachers accountable as well, tho.

As long as the standard isn't something ridiculous like 100% of students passing the class, I agree. Different schools should have different standards for teachers based upon the socio-economic backgrounds of their student population. Basically, within a school, performance should be evaluated relative to that of the other teachers teaching those same students, and it should be entirely up to that school's administration.

[Emo EMAW]

It's the parents you guise.

[Rage Against the McKee]

It's the parents you guise.

In most cases, yes. That doesn't mean that the school system should go ahead and pass a first grader who can't read so he/she can drag down their second grade class while they try to catch up. I don't think it's really a big deal if some kids take 14 or 15 years to graduate high school, rather than 12, and society would benefit from having less people who are completely unemployable.

[Emo EMAW]

I just think those kids that can't cut it shouldn't go through high school.  Just ship them right off to a vocational school or put them to work doing menial labor that they're going to end up doing anyway.

[0.42]

I love Ron Paul kids who want to do away with the Department of Education and would inevitably turn around and bitch when they lost their ability to get Pell Grants and student loans. Adorable.

[Shacks]

I just think those kids that can't cut it shouldn't go through high school.  Just ship them right off to a vocational school or put them to work doing menial labor that they're going to end up doing anyway.

This is something I can get behind.  Society as a whole really needs to steer away from this "Everyone has to go to college if you want to achieve anything" idea.  Not everyone is cut out for higher education, but all you ever hear once you get to high school is that you absolutely have to get a college degree.

[CNS]

Guys, that vocational idea would have to include math.  the idea of getting through life on the level of math that kids who are struggling in middle school have had is 

That said, I agree that the vocational route should be an option.  Would give them a better shot at something higher than min wage.

Also, parents are the problem 99.99% of the time. 

[ednksu]

Where'd FSD go?

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Where'd FSD go?

Did I miss something?

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

State's rights, imo. If a state wants to raise their kids to be a bunch of bigoted, Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!), and white dumb fucks than more power to them. Doesn't make the bill right, or constitutional tho.

You're an idiot.

Pull their federal funding from anything education if they don't recognize their rulings.  Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

That would be unconstitutional you dolt.  Also, nice doltish stereotype you ignorant rough ridin' bigot.

And you're an idiot.

If you think the federal govt can defund a state for a passing a bill like this, well then you are brain dead.

Well than I must be brain dead, along with your demi-god Reagan, the Secretary of Transportation Liz Dole, and 7 rough ridin' Supreme Court Justices
http://www.oyez.org/cases/1980-1989/1986/1986_86_260

Goddamnit you idiot, that's not even close to the same thing 

[p1k3]

I love Ron Paul kids who want to do away with the Department of Education and would inevitably turn around and bitch when they lost their ability to get Pell Grants and student loans. Adorable.

I'll take "Things driving up college tuition for 100, Alex".

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

How would anyone ever go to college without a $400 pell grant and a 6.8% federal loan???

[0.42]

I love Ron Paul kids who want to do away with the Department of Education and would inevitably turn around and bitch when they lost their ability to get Pell Grants and student loans. Adorable.

I'll take "Things driving up college tuition for 100, Alex".

Generally it's (often Republican) state legislatures de-regulating tuition and/or starving higher ed institutions of funding that drives up tuition. Texas is a prime example of both of these. Financial aid driving up tuition costs is mostly a libertarian myth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/the-urban-legend-of-the-bennett-hypothesis-or-why-student-aid-is-not-driving-up-college-costs/2012/05/31/gJQAFvEX5U_blog.html

How would anyone ever go to college without a $400 pell grant and a 6.8% federal loan???

FSD gonna FSD.

[p1k3]

I love Ron Paul kids who want to do away with the Department of Education and would inevitably turn around and bitch when they lost their ability to get Pell Grants and student loans. Adorable.

I'll take "Things driving up college tuition for 100, Alex".

Generally it's (often Republican) state legislatures de-regulating tuition and/or starving higher ed institutions of funding that drives up tuition. Texas is a prime example of both of these. Financial aid driving up tuition costs is mostly a libertarian myth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/the-urban-legend-of-the-bennett-hypothesis-or-why-student-aid-is-not-driving-up-college-costs/2012/05/31/gJQAFvEX5U_blog.html

How would anyone ever go to college without a $400 pell grant and a 6.8% federal loan???

FSD gonna FSD.

Oh. It's the Republicans fault. Right.

According to most experts, there is no relationship between federal student aid and tuition increases, including at private nonprofit institutions.

“There is no convincing evidence that increases in Pell Grants feed tuition increases in either public or private not-for-profit institutions.” (italics added)

– Sandy Baum, higher education economist, policy analyst for the College Board, New York Times, Feb. 3, 2010

Any butt buddy to Krugman should not be listed as "most experts". I can just as easily google an article in support of this Libertarian myth and it probably doesn't quote people that works with a guy that asked for a housing bubble to get out of the dot com bubble.


Fwiw, I'm not against loans and grants and stuff.

[ednksu]

Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

State's rights, imo. If a state wants to raise their kids to be a bunch of bigoted, Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!), and white dumb fucks than more power to them. Doesn't make the bill right, or constitutional tho.

You're an idiot.

Pull their federal funding from anything education if they don't recognize their rulings.  Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

That would be unconstitutional you dolt.  Also, nice doltish stereotype you ignorant rough ridin' bigot.

And you're an idiot.

If you think the federal govt can defund a state for a passing a bill like this, well then you are brain dead.

Well than I must be brain dead, along with your demi-god Reagan, the Secretary of Transportation Liz Dole, and 7 rough ridin' Supreme Court Justices
http://www.oyez.org/cases/1980-1989/1986/1986_86_260

Goddamnit you idiot, that's not even close to the same thing 

  God damn you have no idea what is going on.  I didn't think you were this dumb, wait, yes I did.
Stare Decsis, how does it work_icpmagnets.jpg

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

State's rights, imo. If a state wants to raise their kids to be a bunch of bigoted, Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!), and white dumb fucks than more power to them. Doesn't make the bill right, or constitutional tho.

You're an idiot.

Pull their federal funding from anything education if they don't recognize their rulings.  Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

That would be unconstitutional you dolt.  Also, nice doltish stereotype you ignorant rough ridin' bigot.

And you're an idiot.

If you think the federal govt can defund a state for a passing a bill like this, well then you are brain dead.

Well than I must be brain dead, along with your demi-god Reagan, the Secretary of Transportation Liz Dole, and 7 rough ridin' Supreme Court Justices
http://www.oyez.org/cases/1980-1989/1986/1986_86_260

Goddamnit you idiot, that's not even close to the same thing 

  God damn you have no idea what is going on.  I didn't think you were this dumb, wait, yes I did.
Stare Decsis, how does it work_icpmagnets.jpg

Wow, triple face palm here.


You either really don't understand the holding of the case you cite, or have no idea what stare decides means, likely both. This is so rough ridin' pathetic. The saddest thing is 2/3 of the ignoramous that post on this board probably think you're on to something which is what makes this board such a disgusting display of humanity.

[ednksu]

Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

State's rights, imo. If a state wants to raise their kids to be a bunch of bigoted, Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!), and white dumb fucks than more power to them. Doesn't make the bill right, or constitutional tho.

You're an idiot.

Pull their federal funding from anything education if they don't recognize their rulings.  Their kids will grow up being taught the earth is 5000 years old and Abraham had a pet dinosaur.

That would be unconstitutional you dolt.  Also, nice doltish stereotype you ignorant rough ridin' bigot.

And you're an idiot.

If you think the federal govt can defund a state for a passing a bill like this, well then you are brain dead.

Well than I must be brain dead, along with your demi-god Reagan, the Secretary of Transportation Liz Dole, and 7 rough ridin' Supreme Court Justices
http://www.oyez.org/cases/1980-1989/1986/1986_86_260

Goddamnit you idiot, that's not even close to the same thing 

  God damn you have no idea what is going on.  I didn't think you were this dumb, wait, yes I did.
Stare Decsis, how does it work_icpmagnets.jpg

Wow, triple face palm here.


You either really don't understand the holding of the case you cite, or have no idea what stare decides means, likely both. This is so rough ridin' pathetic. The saddest thing is 2/3 of the ignoramous that post on this board probably think you're on to something which is what makes this board such a disgusting display of humanity.

 
Keep going
 
Tell me more about how the fed can't withhold dollars in order to coerce states
 

[michigancat]

"Triple face palm" is such a great line.