And it begins...

[Rage Against the McKee]

I don't mind redshirting Diaz because his skill set is just so much better than any of our other bigs'. If he does manage to bulk up to the point that he can start rebounding and playing defense, he could end up being better than JO. I think a redshirt would give him a chance at doing that, and if he doesn't show any improvement over the course of his redshirt year, just find somebody better and frank him.

[Dr Rick Daris]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

[kso_FAN]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

I think they could have played together fine, I just don't think Gray was coming once Angel stayed. I think the oscar favor for Orris makes some sense, but still dumb.

[Dr Rick Daris]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

I think they could have played together fine, I just don't think Gray was coming once Angel stayed.

why do you think that? staff wouldn't have wanted them both? gray wouldn't have wanted to come if angel was here? angel was only going to stay if we didn't sign gray? other scenario?

[pissclams]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

angel and gray are pretty much identical players, more often than not you'd want a shooting guard to play off of the pg. 

[michigancat]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

yeah. it's really hard to defend Oriss over Gray. Hasn't stopped people here from trying though.

[michigancat]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

I think they could have played together fine, I just don't think Gray was coming once Angel stayed.

why do you think that? staff wouldn't have wanted them both? gray wouldn't have wanted to come if angel was here? angel was only going to stay if we didn't sign gray? other scenario?

well, we did cancel Gray's visit after Angel said he would stay. That move made it pretty likely Gray wouldn't come here.

[pissclams]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

yeah. it's really hard to defend Oriss over Gray. Hasn't stopped people here from trying though.

really?  i didn't realize anyone here was happy with the way that went down.

[michigancat]

angel and gray are pretty much identical players, more often than not you'd want a shooting guard to play off of the pg.

why? how would Gray playing next to Angel be worse than Will, Tay, or Orris?

[Dr Rick Daris]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

angel and gray are pretty much identical players, more often than not you'd want a shooting guard to play off of the pg.

well more often than not you'd want kobe bryant to play off the pg, but that still doesn't explain why the two of them couldn't both have scholarships on the same college basketball team.

[michigancat]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

yeah. it's really hard to defend Oriss over Gray. Hasn't stopped people here from trying though.

really?  i didn't realize anyone here was happy with the way that went down.

you and Fan both made excuses for the decision with your last posts. you may not be happy, but you're trying to downplay the impact.

[kso_FAN]

why do you think that? staff wouldn't have wanted them both? gray wouldn't have wanted to come if angel was here? angel was only going to stay if we didn't sign gray? other scenario?

I think the staff wasn't sure if Angel was going to stay. They recruited Gray as a replacement for Angel and sold it to Gray that way. Once Angel stayed we probably weren't completely done with Gray, but knew our chances were slim because we sold immediate playing time, which he was able to get at Tech. Also, once Angel was back, oscar was more likely to take a chance on Orris, which I think was a mistake.

[pissclams]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

angel and gray are pretty much identical players, more often than not you'd want a shooting guard to play off of the pg.

well more often than not you'd want kobe bryant to play off the pg, but that still doesn't explain why the two of them couldn't both have scholarships on the same college basketball team.

that's a good point but kobe didn't play college hoops.  i doubt gray would want to sit on the bench and watch angel eat his minutes.  regardless, you asked the question as to why they wouldn't have been on the courtat the same time for parts of the game.  i guess the answer is they wouldn't have been on the same roster which would mean that one of them would have had to suit  up for the other one's team and play a few minutes and that would be an ncaa violation.  so, riddle solved i guess.

[pissclams]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

yeah. it's really hard to defend Oriss over Gray. Hasn't stopped people here from trying though.

really?  i didn't realize anyone here was happy with the way that went down.

you and Fan both made excuses for the decision with your last posts. you may not be happy, but you're trying to downplay the impact.

the impact?  no, i'm not at all.  you don't know what you're talking about.

[Dr Rick Daris]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

angel and gray are pretty much identical players, more often than not you'd want a shooting guard to play off of the pg.

well more often than not you'd want kobe bryant to play off the pg, but that still doesn't explain why the two of them couldn't both have scholarships on the same college basketball team.

that's a good point but kobe didn't play college hoops.  i doubt gray would want to sit on the bench and watch angel eat his minutes.  regardless, you asked the question as to why they wouldn't have been on the courtat the same time for parts of the game.  i guess the answer is they wouldn't have been on the same roster which would mean that one of them would have had to suit  up for the other one's team and play a few minutes and that would be an ncaa violation.  so, riddle solved i guess.

well i doubt most players actually want to sit on the bench while other players eat their minutes, but it happens literally (no, literally) every where, every year and has for the last 100 years. so the notion that kstate couldn't sign a top 150 guard because they already had a player with a similar skill set on the roster is therefore and afore too ridiculous to me and has been summarily rejected.

[michigancat]

why do you think that? staff wouldn't have wanted them both? gray wouldn't have wanted to come if angel was here? angel was only going to stay if we didn't sign gray? other scenario?

I think the staff wasn't sure if Angel was going to stay. They recruited Gray as a replacement for Angel and sold it to Gray that way. Once Angel stayed we probably weren't completely done with Gray, but knew our chances were slim because we sold immediate playing time, which he was able to get at Tech.

Actually, we were probably completely done with Gray when Angel stayed.

Gray on April 15:

"K-State is the number one school on my list right now. I really like what I have heard about the school and the program so far."

Angel announced he was staying April 16.

From a Bossi update April 25:

Kansas State elected to pass on 2012 Rivals150 point guard Josh Gray. However, they did end up offering another Texan after the weekend.

Gray quote from April 24:

I love the fans they couldn't get any better it's the coach & staff that lost interest I guess because they haven't yet return my call

http://www.bringonthecats.com/2012/4/24/2970749/josh-gray-says-k-state-wouldnt-return-his-calls

[kso_FAN]

Thanks.

Very dumb. Probably the worst thing oscar has done so far. (worse than losing to La Salle)

[pissclams]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

angel and gray are pretty much identical players, more often than not you'd want a shooting guard to play off of the pg.

well more often than not you'd want kobe bryant to play off the pg, but that still doesn't explain why the two of them couldn't both have scholarships on the same college basketball team.

that's a good point but kobe didn't play college hoops.  i doubt gray would want to sit on the bench and watch angel eat his minutes.  regardless, you asked the question as to why they wouldn't have been on the courtat the same time for parts of the game.  i guess the answer is they wouldn't have been on the same roster which would mean that one of them would have had to suit  up for the other one's team and play a few minutes and that would be an ncaa violation.  so, riddle solved i guess.

well i doubt most players actually want to sit on the bench while other players eat their minutes, but it happens literally (no, literally) every where, every year and has for the last 100 years. so the notion that kstate couldn't sign a top 150 guard because they already had a player with a similar skill set on the roster is therefore and afore too ridiculous to me and has been summarily rejected.

you asked why there was some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games.  not why kstate couldn't sign a top 150 guard if we already had a player with a similar skill set on our roster.

why didn't we sign him if he still wanted to come here after angel said he was coming back?  the only answer i can come up with is that the staff made a big mistake.

[PowercatPat]

why do you think that? staff wouldn't have wanted them both? gray wouldn't have wanted to come if angel was here? angel was only going to stay if we didn't sign gray? other scenario?

I think the staff wasn't sure if Angel was going to stay. They recruited Gray as a replacement for Angel and sold it to Gray that way. Once Angel stayed we probably weren't completely done with Gray, but knew our chances were slim because we sold immediate playing time, which he was able to get at Tech.

Actually, we were probably completely done with Gray when Angel stayed.

Gray on April 15:

"K-State is the number one school on my list right now. I really like what I have heard about the school and the program so far."

Angel announced he was staying April 16.

From a Bossi update April 25:

Kansas State elected to pass on 2012 Rivals150 point guard Josh Gray. However, they did end up offering another Texan after the weekend.

Gray quote from April 24:

I love the fans they couldn't get any better it's the coach & staff that lost interest I guess because they haven't yet return my call

http://www.bringonthecats.com/2012/4/24/2970749/josh-gray-says-k-state-wouldnt-return-his-calls

LOL at oscar. JFC

[catzacker]

I think it is difficult to play those two together given how oscar wants to play offensively which limits us defensively (i.e. small 4 man, lack of presence around the rim).

[Dr Rick Daris]

-johnson isn't going anywhwere. weber loves him. i don't mind him.

-giving orris a scholarship was lol to the point that i'm pretty sure weber did it as a favor to someone or some kind of quid pro quo that didn't work out. the absolute correct call would've been to never give him a scholarship and then give that one to gray. that way we aren't left with a "well we will only offer gray if art leaves scenario." and why the hell is there some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games? that's the dumbest talk in this whole thread. jesus.

angel and gray are pretty much identical players, more often than not you'd want a shooting guard to play off of the pg.

well more often than not you'd want kobe bryant to play off the pg, but that still doesn't explain why the two of them couldn't both have scholarships on the same college basketball team.

that's a good point but kobe didn't play college hoops.  i doubt gray would want to sit on the bench and watch angel eat his minutes.  regardless, you asked the question as to why they wouldn't have been on the courtat the same time for parts of the game.  i guess the answer is they wouldn't have been on the same roster which would mean that one of them would have had to suit  up for the other one's team and play a few minutes and that would be an ncaa violation.  so, riddle solved i guess.

well i doubt most players actually want to sit on the bench while other players eat their minutes, but it happens literally (no, literally) every where, every year and has for the last 100 years. so the notion that kstate couldn't sign a top 150 guard because they already had a player with a similar skill set on the roster is therefore and afore too ridiculous to me and has been summarily rejected.

you asked why there was some kind of assumption that those two couldn't have been on the court at the same time for parts of games.  not why kstate couldn't sign a top 150 guard if we already had a player with a similar skill set on our roster.

why didn't we sign him if he still wanted to come here after angel said he was coming back?  the only answer i can come up with is that the staff made a big mistake.

ok. so i guess my opinion is that it would've been possible to get both, it would've been the correct move to get both and it would have been feasible (if not advisable) to play them both at the same time on the same team.  it sure seemed like a lot here didn't agree with all or any of that and i couldn't understand why. 

[SwiftCat]

I think it is difficult to play those two together given how oscar wants to play offensively which limits us defensively (i.e. small 4 man, lack of presence around the rim).

Does oscar even want to play like that? We switched to a 4 guard line-up out of necessity, and JO started the entire second half of the season.

[pissclams]

i wish we had him, especially with angel's injuries. i didn't realize he still wanted to be ksu cat hoops even after angel recommitted himself.
i think we can all agree that king oscar wouldn't start him or anyone including kobe over will though.

[michigancat]

I think it is difficult to play those two together given how oscar wants to play offensively which limits us defensively (i.e. small 4 man, lack of presence around the rim).

So we're better off with Will or Tay or Orris? nope.

[Dr Rick Daris]

i'm choosing to believe that sr art and jr gray would've been the second coming of senior dc and junior jake and nobody here is going to be able to convince me otherwise. so there.

also can we get an arms crossed emoticon with a kind of smirk on his face or something and call it "daris"? this would've been such a great place for it.