Who is ready for some ACA rulin' today?

[Rage Against the McKee]

True story:  Mrs. SF had to have a minor procedure a while back (she's fine and thanks for the T's and P's).  The dr office lady called me up and asked me if I wanted to run it all on insurance???  I was like, WTF are you talking about?  She said, "you have awesome insurance so you want to".  I said, WTF are you talking about and she said, never mind, I just wanted to check.  I asked her again why would I not want it to go on my insurance.  Her reply:  " Well, since it is a minor procedure, some people would just pay out of pocket.  I said, why would I want to do that?  She says: "well, if you pay out of pocket the hospital will charge you around $1200, but if you run it through your insurance the hospital and dr will bill them about $8000 and paying the lesser amount yourself puts less towards your maximums".

I am fracking fascinated by this.  I have great insurance so I didn't really give a shazbot!, but it was amazing to me.  I mean, ideally I should have called up my hr person lady and said "hey, I will pay this out of pocket if you reimburse me, it will save you 7 grand".  When it was all cleared I looked and the final payment was 4 grand.

I think Obamacare eliminates the maximums, fwiw.

[HeinBallz]

I'm fascinated by all the anger produced by this.  This is a small part to a very large problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Rage Against the McKee]

I'm fascinated by all the anger produced by this.  This is a small part to a very large problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well, my hospital-going experience is limited to a 3 hour wait at the walk-in clinic with pneumonia because no doctor was willing to see me, but I think it makes people angry because it is incredibly nontransparent. The hospital does not charge all of their customers the same rate for the same service, and you never have any idea of what to expect the bill to be until it arrives, other than to expect it to be expensive.

[michigancat]

ANECDOTES

[Trim]

The hospital does not charge all of their customers the same rate for the same service,

This isn't true.  The charges are uniform.  Some people have insurance or some sort of coverage with which that coverage provider has long ago negotiated a contract by which should the insurance provider make prompt payment of a predetermined percentage, the health provider will by agreement write off the other portion.  Insurance companies then use those arrangements to sell themselves to prospective insurance customers (employers or individuals) as the best insurance provider.

If you have a coupon for something and get half-off whatever you're buying, you're not getting charged less than the guy without coupon.

and you never have any idea of what to expect the bill to be until it arrives, other than to expect it to be expensive.

What are you proposing?  You get in a car wreck and are mumped up and taken to the hospital.  At what point should the price negotiation take place?

I'll be having a summary judgment hearing in the next 2 months on all these issues.  I really want you to come.  PM me your contact info so when I have to schedule, I can make sure you're available.  We'll pak after I win.

[sonofdaxjones]

Gonna be a great deal for some companies, and lots of new regulatons being written/to be written.   Great stuff for gubment cheese policy wonk types.

[Stupid Fitz]

ANECDOTES

Antidotes would fix it better IMO.

[Stupid Fitz]

I'm fascinated by all the anger produced by this.  This is a small part to a very large problem.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well, my hospital-going experience is limited to a 3 hour wait at the walk-in clinic with pneumonia because no doctor was willing to see me, but I think it makes people angry because it is incredibly nontransparent. The hospital does not charge all of their customers the same rate for the same service, and you never have any idea of what to expect the bill to be until it arrives, other than to expect it to be expensive.

People that live deep in the forest don't count. We can't help everyone.

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

[john "teach me how to" dougie]

It’s a lawyer’s dream!
Officials have already drafted 13,000 pages of new regulations for the new ObamaTax law.
FOX News reported:

    With the Supreme Court giving President Obama’s new health care law a green light, federal and state officials are turning to implementation of the law — a lengthy and massive undertaking still in its early stages, but already costing money and expanding the government.

    The Health and Human Services Department “was given a billion dollars implementation money,” Republican Rep. Denny Rehberg of Montana said. “That money is gone already on additional bureaucrats and IT programs, computerization for the implementation.”

    “Oh boy,” Stan Dorn of the Urban Institute said. “HHS has a huge amount of work to do and the states do, too. There will be new health insurance marketplaces in every state in the country, places you can go online, compare health plans.”

    The IRS, Health and Human Services and many other agencies will now write thousands of pages of regulations — an effort well under way:

    “There’s already 13,000 pages of regulations, and they’re not even done yet,” Rehberg said.

    “It’s a delegation of extensive authority from Congress to the Department of Health and Human Services and a lot of boards and commissions and bureaus throughout the bureaucracy,” Matt Spalding of the Heritage Foundation said. “We counted about 180 or so.”

    There has been much focus on the mandate that all Americans obtain health insurance, but analysts say that’s just a small part of the law — covering only a few pages out of the law’s 2700.

    “The fact of the matter is the mandate is about two percent of the whole piece of the legislation,” Spalding said. “It’s a minor part.”

    Much bigger than the mandate itself are the insurance exchanges that will administer $681 billion in subsidies over 10 years, which will require a lot of new federal workers at the IRS and health department.

    “They are asking for several hundred new employees,” Dorn said. “You have rules you need to write and you need lawyers, so there are lots of things you need to do when you are standing up a new enterprise.”

    For some, though, the bottom line is clear and troubling: The federal government is about to assume massive new powers.

[Trim]

If stuff is good, I don't care if it's lots of pages. 

[slobber]

If stuff is good, I don't care if it's like lots of pages.

FYP (attempt at lawyer joke)

[Trim]

If stuff is good, I don't care if it's like lots of pages.

FYP (attempt at lawyer joke)

Good try, good effort.

[slobber]

If stuff is good, I don't care if it's like lots of pages.

FYP (attempt at lawyer joke)

Good try, good effort.

LOL!
BTW, you were slaying it earlier with NK. Every time he tried to turn it into something else, you lawyered him like a boss. (not joking)

[Trim]

If stuff is good, I don't care if it's like lots of pages.

FYP (attempt at lawyer joke)

Good try, good effort.

LOL!
BTW, you were slaying it earlier with NK. Every time he tried to turn it into something else, you lawyered him like a boss. (not joking)

 

I still feel icky here in the pit.

[Rage Against the McKee]

The hospital does not charge all of their customers the same rate for the same service,

This isn't true.  The charges are uniform.  Some people have insurance or some sort of coverage with which that coverage provider has long ago negotiated a contract by which should the insurance provider make prompt payment of a predetermined percentage, the health provider will by agreement write off the other portion.  Insurance companies then use those arrangements to sell themselves to prospective insurance customers (employers or individuals) as the best insurance provider.

If you have a coupon for something and get half-off whatever you're buying, you're not getting charged less than the guy without coupon.

and you never have any idea of what to expect the bill to be until it arrives, other than to expect it to be expensive.

What are you proposing?  You get in a car wreck and are mumped up and taken to the hospital.  At what point should the price negotiation take place?

I'll be having a summary judgment hearing in the next 2 months on all these issues.  I really want you to come.  PM me your contact info so when I have to schedule, I can make sure you're available.  We'll pak after I win.

I'm not proposing anything. I was simply saying why it is frustrating. It would make more sense, to me at least, to just get a bill of hours from all of the staff who helped you out that includes overhead, plus a daily rate for the room and the real cost of any medicine administered. Maybe that's just because that's the kind of bill I'm used to dealing with, though. I just don't like overhead being built into the price of goods that most sane people would assume are complimentary.

[Rage Against the McKee]

If I am working on a project for somebody, that person gets billed about $150 per hour for my service. That cost includes my salary, equipment, and overhead. If somebody comes into my office, I will offer them a bottle of water or a soda. They won't be charged for the beverage. Let's say the total cost of the project is $200,000. The hospital equivalent would be me charging $50,000 for the service, $50 for the beverage, $15 per gallon of fuel used, $25,000 for vehicle service fees, $1,000 for report binding, etc. The final cost would still end up being $200,000, but anybody who sees that bill is going to get pissed off, and rightfully so.

People in a hospital generally don't feel well. It doesn't make sense to give them a bill that encourages them to not use tissues or take pain pills. It would make a lot more sense to me if hospitals just had a blanket charge for their service that included things like tylenol, ice, and tissues.

[michigancat]

ANALOGIES!

[Rage Against the McKee]

ANALOGIES!

YES!!!

[Trim]

NK, do you do a lot of emergency urgent care projects?

[Rage Against the McKee]

NK, do you do a lot of emergency urgent care projects?

No, but how hard would it really be for the hospital to just bill based upon the hours the doctor spends in the ER and the liability risk? You don't think the itemized bills look just a little bit ridiculous? I know the final cost would end up being about the same, but what's the point of billing for cheap items?

[Trim]

You don't think the itemized bills look just a little bit ridiculous?

The real-life ones?  No.

[Rage Against the McKee]

You don't think the itemized bills look just a little bit ridiculous?

The real-life ones?  No.

That's good to know. I've honestly only seen the ones people bitch and moan about on the internet. I'm sure the claims are exaggerated, but it really is strange to me that something like a tylenol pill would show up on a bill at all.

[Trim]

That's good to know. I've honestly only seen the ones people bitch and moan about on the internet. I'm sure the claims are exaggerated, but it really is strange to me that something like a tylenol pill would show up on a bill at all.

Yeah, if I didn't have my primary career as co-owner of goEMAW, internet bitching and moaning would be a real pain in my ass.

[Rage Against the McKee]

That's good to know. I've honestly only seen the ones people bitch and moan about on the internet. I'm sure the claims are exaggerated, but it really is strange to me that something like a tylenol pill would show up on a bill at all.

Yeah, if I didn't have my primary career as co-owner of goEMAW, internet bitching and moaning would be a real pain in my ass.

Yes, I imagine it would.