Author Topic: George Zimmerman is a piece of crap  (Read 199649 times)

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Offline CNS

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Re: Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #800 on: June 29, 2013, 11:28:06 AM »
Maybe you should answer this question with some guy sitting on your chest punching you in the face over and over again.

It doesn't matter if Zimmerman was following him around poking him with a stick. The only fact that matters is that he started wailing on him.

Yep, just go around with your gun and eff with people until they do something about it, and then shoot them.

Wild wild west style.  This is john wayne and clint eastwood's fault.

Offline steve dave

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #801 on: June 29, 2013, 11:42:39 AM »
it's the dream of every powerless person who now owns a gun and feels some sort of power for the first time in their life. GZ has spent hours in front of the mirror with his gun, the suddenly empowered gun owner. USA.

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #802 on: June 29, 2013, 12:17:03 PM »
But also he took those MMA lessons.
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Offline kim carnes

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #803 on: June 29, 2013, 12:28:02 PM »
Travyon did a ground and pound move on GZ

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #804 on: June 29, 2013, 12:32:04 PM »
Travyon did a ground and pound move on GZ

If true, GZ deserved it. :thumbs:
"walking around mhk and crying in the rain because of love lost is the absolute purest and best thing in the world.  i hope i fall in love during the next few weeks and get my heart broken and it starts raining just to experience it one last time."   --Dlew12

Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #805 on: June 29, 2013, 01:09:24 PM »
Unfortunately, I think this all comes down to race. For some, because they think GZ racially profiled TM, he got what he deserved, and it doesn't matter who attacked who, or how the fight progressed, or the injuries that were sustained - no set of facts would give GZ the right to shoot in self defense. GZ racially profiled Martin and got what he deserved.

If these were two white guys, aside from nobody caring about the case, I really doubt they would feel so convinced that GZ had it coming.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline Trim

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #806 on: June 29, 2013, 01:13:01 PM »
For some, because they think GZ racially profiled TM, he got what he deserved, and it doesn't matter who attacked who, or how the fight progressed, or the injuries that were sustained - no set of facts would give GZ the right to shoot in self defense. GZ racially profiled Martin and got what he deserved.

I'm good with this if you substitute "wrongly pursued a guy while armed with a gun" for "racially profiled."

Hey, that makes the whole thing simple and not about race!

Offline steve dave

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #807 on: June 29, 2013, 01:14:06 PM »
Unfortunately, I think this all comes down to race. For some, because they think GZ racially profiled TM, he got what he deserved, and it doesn't matter who attacked who, or how the fight progressed, or the injuries that were sustained - no set of facts would give GZ the right to shoot in self defense. GZ racially profiled Martin and got what he deserved.

If these were two white guys, aside from nobody caring about the case, I really doubt they would feel so convinced that GZ had it coming.

those claiming race baiting the people who are bringing up race the most in this thread. there isn't one thing going on with this mumped up situation. there are multiple things. He may have racially profiled the kid. but, that's not the primary thing he did wrong. killing him was.

Offline kim carnes

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #808 on: June 29, 2013, 01:53:17 PM »
i don't think some of the white people who are defending GZ realize he is mexican.

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #809 on: June 29, 2013, 02:03:10 PM »
i don't think some of the white people who are defending GZ realize he is mexican.

It was pretty awesome when the msm first got wind of it and were making it white on black, then they were like, "oops, hes hispanic, uhh lets just not talk about his race', now there just like "some innocent black kid" and all the race baiters are :shakesfist: and still screaming racist and stuff

So lame. So predictable. So overplayed. So liberal.
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Offline Dugout DickStone

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #810 on: June 29, 2013, 02:15:48 PM »
It's going to come down to how that law is worded.

Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #811 on: June 29, 2013, 02:22:40 PM »
i don't think some of the white people who are defending GZ realize he is mexican.

He's not. He's half white half Peruvian or some crap, and it really doesn't matter except for those who see everything through the prism of race.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #812 on: June 29, 2013, 02:25:08 PM »
For some, because they think GZ racially profiled TM, he got what he deserved, and it doesn't matter who attacked who, or how the fight progressed, or the injuries that were sustained - no set of facts would give GZ the right to shoot in self defense. GZ racially profiled Martin and got what he deserved.

I'm good with this if you substitute "wrongly pursued a guy while armed with a gun" for "racially profiled."

Hey, that makes the whole thing simple and not about race!

Yeah, respectfully, I think the whole "wrongly followed" thing is driven at least in part by a sense that TM was racially profiled. Again, I really doubt you would have the same convictions if TM had been white, but I could be wrong.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

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Offline Trim

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #814 on: June 29, 2013, 02:32:40 PM »
For some, because they think GZ racially profiled TM, he got what he deserved, and it doesn't matter who attacked who, or how the fight progressed, or the injuries that were sustained - no set of facts would give GZ the right to shoot in self defense. GZ racially profiled Martin and got what he deserved.

I'm good with this if you substitute "wrongly pursued a guy while armed with a gun" for "racially profiled."

Hey, that makes the whole thing simple and not about race!

Yeah, respectfully, I think the whole "wrongly followed" thing is driven at least in part by a sense that TM was racially profiled. Again, I really doubt you would have the same convictions if TM had been white, but I could be wrong.

No, it's driven by how normal people don't go out with guns and get in confrontational situations with others.

Offline K-S-U-Wildcats!

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #815 on: June 29, 2013, 02:55:48 PM »
It's going to come down to how that law is worded.

More precisely, it's going to come down to how the jurors understand the law, and whether they decide to faithfully follow it. The judge and the attorneys will try their best to educate the jurors on the law, but that only goes so far. It is quite possible that the jury may just "split the baby" and acquit on murder but convict on manslaughter, which is one reason why prosecutors often overcharge.

And just FYI, here are the laws at issue:

1. Second Degree Murder: There was an unlawful killing of the victim by an act imminently dangerous to another and demonstrating a depraved mind without regard for human life. (This is where the state's allegations that GZ was a racist POS come into play, because otherwise it's gonna be really hard to prove the "depraved mind" part).

2. Manslaughter: An act that was neither excusable, nor justified that resulted in the death of another person. (This one is easy. GZ is guilty unless he acted in self defense. There is no dispute that he killed TM).

3. Self Defense: There are a number of statutes that come into play here, but ultimately it will come down to whether GZ reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent great bodily harm or death to himself or another. (This is what the case really boils down to.)

4. Burden of Proof: The state must prove Nos. 1 or 2, AND disprove No. 3, "beyond a reasonable doubt."
I've said it before and I'll say it again, K-State fans could have beheaded the entire KU team at midcourt, and K-State fans would be celebrating it this morning.  They are the ISIS of Big 12 fanbases.

Offline Trim

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #816 on: June 29, 2013, 03:54:30 PM »
It's going to come down to how that law is worded.

More precisely, it's going to come down to how the jurors understand the law, and whether they decide to faithfully follow it. The judge and the attorneys will try their best to educate the jurors on the law, but that only goes so far. It is quite possible that the jury may just "split the baby" and acquit on murder but convict on manslaughter, which is one reason why prosecutors often overcharge.

And just FYI, here are the laws at issue:

1. Second Degree Murder: There was an unlawful killing of the victim by an act imminently dangerous to another and demonstrating a depraved mind without regard for human life. (This is where the state's allegations that GZ was a racist POS come into play, because otherwise it's gonna be really hard to prove the "depraved mind" part).

2. Manslaughter: An act that was neither excusable, nor justified that resulted in the death of another person. (This one is easy. GZ is guilty unless he acted in self defense. There is no dispute that he killed TM).

3. Self Defense: There are a number of statutes that come into play here, but ultimately it will come down to whether GZ reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent great bodily harm or death to himself or another. (This is what the case really boils down to.)

4. Burden of Proof: The state must prove Nos. 1 or 2, AND disprove No. 3, "beyond a reasonable doubt."

On #1, "depraved mind" is, as the late, great Kenny Santucci from RW/RR fame once said, simply not caring whether one lives or dies.  They don't need to prove some beef Zimmerman had with Martin, or "those people" to put it in Pit terms.

On #3, I linked the statute.  The presumptions come in when one's dwelling/residence/vehicle was entered.  So you're left with this:

Quote
(3)?A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

Was George engaged in lawful activity?  Was he attacked while in a place he had a right to be?  If so, did he have a reasonable belief that he needed to shoot Travon to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself?

Offline sys

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #817 on: June 29, 2013, 04:57:57 PM »
Quote
(3)?A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

i'm no lawyer, and i don't know the facts of the case, but based on the above and on reading this thread, it'd seem to me that both zimmerman and martin had a right to kill each other.
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Offline Trim

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #818 on: June 29, 2013, 05:15:40 PM »
Quote
(3)?A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

i'm no lawyer, and i don't know the facts of the case, but based on the above and on reading this thread, it'd seem to me that both zimmerman and martin had a right to kill each other.

It's definitely crossed my mind that the same law Zimmerman's relying on may be more applicable to Martin busting up Zimmerman.  If so, I'd argue that the law can't apply to Zimmerman shooting because he wasn't engaged in lawful activity or in a place he had a right to be.  He'd been rough ridin' with people to the point where he got rightfully got his ass kicked and/or he was in Martin's space (enough to where Martin had to kick his ass).

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #819 on: June 29, 2013, 05:21:22 PM »
But the talk radio I was listening to in south Alabama yesterday assures me that nothing matters in this case up until the point that TM struck GZ. None of the leadup matters. Sorry.

Oh! Also I was assured through the host's insinuations that Trayvon was a terrible person because he had previously dabbled in marijuana. Made no mention of George Zimmerman's previous documented history of nearly having a mark on his record of felonious assault on a police officer. http://www.nbcnews.com/video/nightly-news/46910559#46910559
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Offline Shacks

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #820 on: June 29, 2013, 05:44:58 PM »
Quote
(3)?A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

i'm no lawyer, and i don't know the facts of the case, but based on the above and on reading this thread, it'd seem to me that both zimmerman and martin had a right to kill each other.

It's definitely crossed my mind that the same law Zimmerman's relying on may be more applicable to Martin busting up Zimmerman.  If so, I'd argue that the law can't apply to Zimmerman shooting because he wasn't engaged in lawful activity or in a place he had a right to be.  He'd been rough ridin' with people to the point where he got rightfully got his ass kicked and/or he was in Martin's space (enough to where Martin had to kick his ass).

How was anything Zimmerman did before shooting Martin unlawful?  It's not illegal for him to be in that neighborhood.  It's not illegal for a private citizen to racially profile someone.  It's not illegal to ask someone what they're doing.  It's not illegal to ignore a 911 operator.  Those last three might be asking for trouble, but they aren't illegal.  GZ is at fault for the confrontation happening due to ignoring the 911 operator, but nothing he did before the shooting broke the law.

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #821 on: June 29, 2013, 05:58:28 PM »
Ok so I haven't followed the case outside this thread, did tm deliver some swift blows and then get up to leave and got blasted? Or did he get shot while still wailing on him?
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Offline Trim

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #822 on: June 29, 2013, 06:01:49 PM »
Quote
(3)?A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

i'm no lawyer, and i don't know the facts of the case, but based on the above and on reading this thread, it'd seem to me that both zimmerman and martin had a right to kill each other.

It's definitely crossed my mind that the same law Zimmerman's relying on may be more applicable to Martin busting up Zimmerman.  If so, I'd argue that the law can't apply to Zimmerman shooting because he wasn't engaged in lawful activity or in a place he had a right to be.  He'd been rough ridin' with people to the point where he got rightfully got his ass kicked and/or he was in Martin's space (enough to where Martin had to kick his ass).

How was anything Zimmerman did before shooting Martin unlawful?  It's not illegal for him to be in that neighborhood.  It's not illegal for a private citizen to racially profile someone.  It's not illegal to ask someone what they're doing.  It's not illegal to ignore a 911 operator.  Those last three might be asking for trouble, but they aren't illegal.  GZ is at fault for the confrontation happening due to ignoring the 911 operator, but nothing he did before the shooting broke the law.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0784/Sections/0784.011.html

:dunno:

I'd ask Martin for details, but, you know...

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #823 on: June 29, 2013, 06:02:49 PM »
Ok so I haven't followed the case outside this thread, did tm deliver some swift blows and then get up to leave and got blasted? Or did he get shot while still wailing on him?

I'm sure Zimmerman will maintain it was while he was getting wailed on.  Martin hasn't commented.

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Re: Trayvon Martin
« Reply #824 on: June 29, 2013, 06:10:56 PM »
Ok so I haven't followed the case outside this thread, did tm deliver some swift blows and then get up to leave and got blasted? Or did he get shot while still wailing on him?

I'm sure Zimmerman will maintain it was while he was getting wailed on.  Martin hasn't commented.

Can't they tell with chowder burns from the gunshot wounds at what distance he was shot? 
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