Frank watch 2012:

[Fuktard]

Franks in line for an extension...if hes' using USC for anything more than leverage he is an absolute moron.  Greg Marshall turned down $2M per from the Nubbs to stay at WSU making $900k, he understands it's smart to be choosy, and patient.  Frank will eventually take another job, but I can't imagine it won't be a top 15 program, or his beloved Miami.  Those are the only 2 options that make sense.

[kso_FAN]

According to what I can find in his contract (http://cjonline.com/sites/default/files/Frank%20Martin's%20contract%20(2010)_0.pdf) Frank made $1.56 million this year if he got all bonuses. However, I'm not certain on all bonuses, but that gives him the benefit of the doubt for all.

His base this year was $1.3 million.
The bonus for a 9-7 Big 12 record was 4%, I'm assuming he got the same for 10-8. That adds $52K.
The bonus for an Torn-a-ment birth was 8%. That's $104K.
The bonus for APR scores is $25K or $50K. I gave him the higher number.
The bonus for GSR is $50K. I gave it to him.

That leaves the questions...

Is Frank worth more?
What is the worth of selling out the arena every season?
What is the worth of the coach being the face of the program? (he was seleced by CBS for a reason)
What is the worth of continuing to finish above .500 in the league?
What is the worth of 4 of 5 NCAA seasons with first round wins in each?

This just doesn't seem hard to me. I like the escalating salary and I can see the caution in some people. I suppose at the end of the day to me it just make sense to give Frank a bit of a boost, even $300-400K, to stroke his ego.

[jtksu]

Getting  kinda tired of Frank's act.  Between the mass eye hernias and the yearly money grab it's hard to not be mad at him.  I do find  it interesting how the same people who claim battered women's syndrome in regards to Snyder are the same people who are openly declaring that we can't and won't ever do better than Frank.  Meh.

[pissclams]

Getting  kinda tired of Frank's act.  Between the mass eye hernias and the yearly money grab it's hard to not be mad at him.  I do find  it interesting how the same people who claim battered women's syndrome in regards to Snyder are the same people who are openly declaring that we can't and won't ever do better than Frank.  Meh.

what is better than frank?

[theKSU]

I'm not claiming--we can't, and we won't.  Of course we're all tired of the act. 

[Dr Rick Daris]

According to what I can find in his contract (http://cjonline.com/sites/default/files/Frank%20Martin's%20contract%20(2010)_0.pdf) Frank made $1.56 million this year if he got all bonuses. However, I'm not certain on all bonuses, but that gives him the benefit of the doubt for all.

His base this year was $1.3 million.
The bonus for a 9-7 Big 12 record was 4%, I'm assuming he got the same for 10-8. That adds $52K.
The bonus for an Torn-a-ment birth was 8%. That's $104K.
The bonus for APR scores is $25K or $50K. I gave him the higher number.
The bonus for GSR is $50K. I gave it to him.

That leaves the questions...

Is Frank worth more?
What is the worth of selling out the arena every season?
What is the worth of the coach being the face of the program? (he was seleced by CBS for a reason)
What is the worth of continuing to finish above .500 in the league?
What is the worth of 4 of 5 NCAA seasons with first round wins in each?

This just doesn't seem hard to me. I like the escalating salary and I can see the caution in some people. I suppose at the end of the day to me it just make sense to give Frank a bit of a boost, even $300-400K, to stroke his ego.

so this is a couple hundred thousand below what you said yesterday. as to whether or not he's worth it, that's not even a question. as to whether or not a few more hundred thousand would make a difference, i doubt it. seems like he's gone.

[pissclams]

that was dax that said that yesterday, leave _FAN the eff OUT OF THIS.

[kso_FAN]

so this is a couple hundred thousand below what you said yesterday. as to whether or not he's worth it, that's not even a question. as to whether or not a few more hundred thousand would make a difference, i doubt it. seems like he's gone.

 

[MakeItRain]

Of course we're all tired of the act.

We all are?  That's news to me

[theKSU]

The flirting with a new job every year act gets tired.

[Dr Rick Daris]

Getting  kinda tired of Frank's act.  Between the mass eye hernias and the yearly money grab it's hard to not be mad at him.  I do find  it interesting how the same people who claim battered women's syndrome in regards to Snyder are the same people who are openly declaring that we can't and won't ever do better than Frank.  Meh.

what does yearly money grab mean?

frank got his first contract. three years later they negotiated his second contract and in this second contract there were contengencies that would require both sides to renogotiate again in two years. frank met those and they are now required per contract to re-enter negotiations.

[slimz]

According to what I can find in his contract (http://cjonline.com/sites/default/files/Frank%20Martin's%20contract%20(2010)_0.pdf) Frank made $1.56 million this year if he got all bonuses. However, I'm not certain on all bonuses, but that gives him the benefit of the doubt for all.

His base this year was $1.3 million.
The bonus for a 9-7 Big 12 record was 4%, I'm assuming he got the same for 10-8. That adds $52K.
The bonus for an Torn-a-ment birth was 8%. That's $104K.
The bonus for APR scores is $25K or $50K. I gave him the higher number.
The bonus for GSR is $50K. I gave it to him.

That leaves the questions...

Is Frank worth more?
What is the worth of selling out the arena every season?
What is the worth of the coach being the face of the program? (he was seleced by CBS for a reason)
What is the worth of continuing to finish above .500 in the league?
What is the worth of 4 of 5 NCAA seasons with first round wins in each?

This just doesn't seem hard to me. I like the escalating salary and I can see the caution in some people. I suppose at the end of the day to me it just make sense to give Frank a bit of a boost, even $300-400K, to stroke his ego.

I could see going to about $1.75 million. At this point, Frank is Bo Ryan-lite. They've both peaked at losing a Regional Final. They both usually win a game or two in the tourney and bow out (although Bo gets to the Sweet 16 a bit more on average, which makes him worth a bit more). Bo's won 3 conference titles and 2 conf tourneys in 11 years, and Frank hasn't won any, so there's more worth there. Bo went to $2.1 million after 10 years (all tourney) at his school, 3 confy titles, 2 tourney titles.  I'm not sure Frank's justified in getting to $2 millions at this point without any trophies.

[Dr Rick Daris]

so this is a couple hundred thousand below what you said yesterday. as to whether or not he's worth it, that's not even a question. as to whether or not a few more hundred thousand would make a difference, i doubt it. seems like he's gone.

 

ha. saw the numbers and linked contract and just naturally assumed dax post. didn't even look to see who posted it.

[jtksu]

Not referring to an actual contract negotiations, I'm all for him getting solid pay.  I'm just tired of him whoring himself all over every spring.  Either he does it because he's genuinely interested in leaving or because he wants more leverage.  Either way, it's getting old.

[Dr Rick Daris]

According to what I can find in his contract (http://cjonline.com/sites/default/files/Frank%20Martin's%20contract%20(2010)_0.pdf) Frank made $1.56 million this year if he got all bonuses. However, I'm not certain on all bonuses, but that gives him the benefit of the doubt for all.

His base this year was $1.3 million.
The bonus for a 9-7 Big 12 record was 4%, I'm assuming he got the same for 10-8. That adds $52K.
The bonus for an Torn-a-ment birth was 8%. That's $104K.
The bonus for APR scores is $25K or $50K. I gave him the higher number.
The bonus for GSR is $50K. I gave it to him.

That leaves the questions...

Is Frank worth more?
What is the worth of selling out the arena every season?
What is the worth of the coach being the face of the program? (he was seleced by CBS for a reason)
What is the worth of continuing to finish above .500 in the league?
What is the worth of 4 of 5 NCAA seasons with first round wins in each?

This just doesn't seem hard to me. I like the escalating salary and I can see the caution in some people. I suppose at the end of the day to me it just make sense to give Frank a bit of a boost, even $300-400K, to stroke his ego.

I could see going to about $1.75 million. At this point, Frank is Bo Ryan-lite. They've both peaked at losing a Regional Final. They both usually win a game or two in the tourney and bow out (although Bo gets to the Sweet 16 a bit more on average, which makes him worth a bit more). Bo's won 3 conference titles and 2 conf tourneys in 11 years, and Frank hasn't won any, so there's more worth there. Bo went to $2.1 million after 10 years (all tourney) at his school, 3 confy titles, 2 tourney titles.  I'm not sure Frank's justified in getting to $2 millions at this point without any trophies.

it really surprises me how many people here care how much frank makes. the athletic dept made over twenty million dollars last year. why do you dumbasses give a crap if the best thing to happen to kstate basketball in the last thirty years makes a couple hundred thousand more per year?

[kso_FAN]

so this is a couple hundred thousand below what you said yesterday. as to whether or not he's worth it, that's not even a question. as to whether or not a few more hundred thousand would make a difference, i doubt it. seems like he's gone.

 

ha. saw the numbers and linked contract and just naturally assumed dax post. didn't even look to see who posted it.

I figured if Frank's $$$ were going to be discussed, someone should actually look it up and run the numbers.

[AppleJack]

someone list potential replacement candidates 

[sonofdaxjones]

I didn't read everybody's post, but it appears some of you are missing my point about Frank being our coach for the entire contract year.

If Frank is the coach at K-State next month, on top of his regular salary and bonuses he gets another $250K contract fullfilment bonus.

I'd have to go back and look but I think a "contract year" in Frank's contract starts in April or May.

[kso_FAN]

According to what I can find in his contract (http://cjonline.com/sites/default/files/Frank%20Martin's%20contract%20(2010)_0.pdf) Frank made $1.56 million this year if he got all bonuses. However, I'm not certain on all bonuses, but that gives him the benefit of the doubt for all.

His base this year was $1.3 million.
The bonus for a 9-7 Big 12 record was 4%, I'm assuming he got the same for 10-8. That adds $52K.
The bonus for an Torn-a-ment birth was 8%. That's $104K.
The bonus for APR scores is $25K or $50K. I gave him the higher number.
The bonus for GSR is $50K. I gave it to him.

That leaves the questions...

Is Frank worth more?
What is the worth of selling out the arena every season?
What is the worth of the coach being the face of the program? (he was seleced by CBS for a reason)
What is the worth of continuing to finish above .500 in the league?
What is the worth of 4 of 5 NCAA seasons with first round wins in each?

This just doesn't seem hard to me. I like the escalating salary and I can see the caution in some people. I suppose at the end of the day to me it just make sense to give Frank a bit of a boost, even $300-400K, to stroke his ego.

I could see going to about $1.75 million. At this point, Frank is Bo Ryan-lite. They've both peaked at losing a Regional Final. They both usually win a game or two in the tourney and bow out (although Bo gets to the Sweet 16 a bit more on average, which makes him worth a bit more). Bo's won 3 conference titles and 2 conf tourneys in 11 years, and Frank hasn't won any, so there's more worth there. Bo went to $2.1 million after 10 years (all tourney) at his school, 3 confy titles, 2 tourney titles.  I'm not sure Frank's justified in getting to $2 millions at this point without any trophies.

it really surprises me how many people here care how much frank makes. the athletic dept made over twenty million dollars last year. why do you dumbasses give a crap if the best thing to happen to kstate basketball in the last thirty years makes a couple hundred thousand more per year?

Frank has proven enough to me, even with the attrition and somewhat weird recruiting, that he's worth 1.8-2.0 mill.

[slimz]

it really surprises me how many people here care how much frank makes. the athletic dept made over twenty million dollars last year. why do you dumbasses give a crap if the best thing to happen to kstate basketball in the last thirty years makes a couple hundred thousand more per year?

This:

I figured if Frank's $$$ were going to be discussed, someone should actually look it up and run the numbers.

I don't really care if the AD wants to give him $2,000,000 or $5,000,000 to try to keep him. Since people were talking #'s, I thought I'd throw a comparison coach out there and evaluate where his results would land him. Obviously, there are other factors besides performance that come into play.

[kso_FAN]

I didn't read everybody's post, but it appears some of you are missing my point about Frank being our coach for the entire contract year.

If Frank is the coach at K-State next month, on top of his regular salary and bonuses he gets another $250K contract fullfilment bonus.

I'd have to go back and look but I think a "contract year" in Frank's contract starts in April or May.

True on the $250K.

I would guarantee that Frnk/Katz don't count bonuses and especially the retention bonus when comparing his numbers to other coaches. I bet they think of the $1.3 mil base. Granted, I'm sure the merits of this logic would bring more great debate.

[Fuktard]

You can't just say "well the athletic dept made $20M so give Frank more"...at some point you draw a line and to draw that line you have to look at alternatives.  Frank is clearly a good coach, is he $2M good?  I don't know the answer, but it needs to be asked.   Who else could we get if we start offering $2M per?  Again, I don't know the answer.  I love Frank, but I will admit this crap every year is already old and it likely doesn't stop anytime soon.  It surely can't help recruiting.  The Franking is also getting old.  If Sprads leaves, I will be very disappointed.  This is a kid who Frank loves and he clearly isn't "loved" in return...that's bothersome.  Does this baggage come with every coach expecting $2M per? 

[kso_FAN]

You can't just say "well the athletic dept made $20M so give Frank more"...at some point you draw a line and to draw that line you have to look at alternatives.  Frank is clearly a good coach, is he $2M good?  I don't know the answer, but it needs to be asked.   Who else could we get if we start offering $2M per?  Again, I don't know the answer.  I love Frank, but I will admit this crap every year is already old and it likely doesn't stop anytime soon.  It surely can't help recruiting.  The Franking is also getting old.  If Sprads leaves, I will be very disappointed.  This is a kid who Frank loves and he clearly isn't "loved" in return...that's bothersome.  Does this baggage come with every coach expecting $2M per? 

The point to me is there is no guarantee on what $2 mil would bring to K-State, but it would seem to me that $2 mil would likely keep the guy we have. And that guy has already proven to be pretty darn good.

[Fuktard]

You can't just say "well the athletic dept made $20M so give Frank more"...at some point you draw a line and to draw that line you have to look at alternatives.  Frank is clearly a good coach, is he $2M good?  I don't know the answer, but it needs to be asked.   Who else could we get if we start offering $2M per?  Again, I don't know the answer.  I love Frank, but I will admit this crap every year is already old and it likely doesn't stop anytime soon.  It surely can't help recruiting.  The Franking is also getting old.  If Sprads leaves, I will be very disappointed.  This is a kid who Frank loves and he clearly isn't "loved" in return...that's bothersome.  Does this baggage come with every coach expecting $2M per? 

The point to me is there is no guarantee on what $2 mil would bring to K-State, but it would seem to me that $2 mil would likely keep the guy we have. And that guy has already proven to be pretty darn good.

I don't disagree.  I would feel better if the $2M included some sort of very expensive out clause, so we (and future recruits) don't have to deal with this each year.   Don't think for a second other coaches aren't using this against us in the recruiting battles.  I'll be shocked if we land any recruit this spring that has quality alternatives.

[Dr Rick Daris]

You can't just say "well the athletic dept made $20M so give Frank more"...at some point you draw a line and to draw that line you have to look at alternatives.  Frank is clearly a good coach, is he $2M good?  I don't know the answer, but it needs to be asked.   Who else could we get if we start offering $2M per?  Again, I don't know the answer.  I love Frank, but I will admit this crap every year is already old and it likely doesn't stop anytime soon.  It surely can't help recruiting.  The Franking is also getting old.  If Sprads leaves, I will be very disappointed.  This is a kid who Frank loves and he clearly isn't "loved" in return...that's bothersome.  Does this baggage come with every coach expecting $2M per?

in order to replace frank with a coach of similar ability, etc. what do you think we would have to pay and do you even think that we would be able to hire one away from their current school? because illinois just offered shaka 2.5 and got turned down. nebraska if offering really, really good money and is getting turned down left and right. this really doesn't seem that hard to me. if we're able to lure someone comparable away (strongly doubt we could) then we'll be paying much more than 1.55 average that frank will make over the lifetime of his current contract and if we can't then we're stuck hiring doc sadler 2.0 for 1.1. all that matters is what someone else thinks frank is worth and how much it would cost to replace him assuming you would even be able to. there is no situation that makes more sense then paying him more and trying to keep him.