here we go again@%$&#

[sys]

I freaking understand that this team is a bubble team.  I freaking saw it really goddamn early.  But that doesn't mean I accept that as being okay. 

have you ever thought that you would be a happier person if you rooted for sports teams other than kstate and whatever local pro teams you like?  i don't mean this sarcastically.

[michigancat]

What I don't understand are the faction who don't like the direction of recruiting, don't like the roster management, don't like in game coaching decisions but expect 27-5 seasons and conference championships.

what is so hard to understand? Realizing that this team's talent level and age is consistent with that of a bubble/NIT team doesn't mean that it was okay for Frank to have allowed this team to end up with that talent level and age. 

I freaking understand that this team is a bubble team.  I freaking saw it really goddamn early.  But that doesn't mean I accept that as being okay. 

Why do you seem to ignore the possibility of improvement? I think he's built the foundation for a very good team in 2-3 years. It might not be better than KU, but it could make a deep NCAA run similar to 09-10.

[catzacker]

I freaking understand that this team is a bubble team.  I freaking saw it really goddamn early.  But that doesn't mean I accept that as being okay. 

have you ever thought that you would be a happier person if you rooted for sports teams other than kstate and whatever local pro teams you like?  i don't mean this sarcastically.

yes.  I was an OU fan growing up.  Got fairly spoiled with Billy and Barry running the show. 

Why do you seem to ignore the possibility of improvement? I think he's built the foundation for a very good team in 2-3 years. It might not be better than KU, but it could make a deep NCAA run similar to 09-10.

I want an oompa loompa now.

[MakeItRain]

Tubbs' first five years at OU he had 3 NCAA tournament appearances (two second round exits and an elite 8), an NIT, and didn't qualify for any tournament once.

[catzacker]

Tubbs didn't qualify for any tournament his first year, then NIT, then 8 ncaa's in a row (before the wheels fell off) including an Elite 8 and a F4.  He won the Conf 5 times, the Conf Tourney twice. 

Frank can't hold Billy's jock.

[MakeItRain]

Tubbs didn't qualify for any tournament his first year, then NIT, then 8 ncaa's in a row (before the wheels fell off) including an Elite 8 and a F4.  He won the Conf 5 times, the Conf Tourney twice. 

Frank can't hold Billy's jock.

I love Billy Tubbs, my dad is an OU grad, I spent many days of my youth at LNC, KU beat OU for the National Championship 2 days before my 12th birthday.  Frank will have a similar conference and overall winning percentage than Billy Tubbs at the same point in their major conference careers, Tubbs will likely be three games better when figuring win percentage.  If I compared first five years to first five years straight up it would be a blood bath.  Frank will have more post season appearances and the same number of NCAA tournament wins if Frank doesn't win a NCAA tournament game this season.  The only thing Billy did his first five years at OU that Frank isn't doing his first five years as a coach is the one regular season conference title and two tournament titles, but like I said they will have similar winning percentages.  Fact is the start of Frank's coaching career is similar to the start of Billy's career at OU, he already had 4 years of seasoning before OU.  So your assertion of Frank can't hold Billy's jock has more to do with your miserable ass meat peeping existence, and less to do with what both men has actually accomplished at the same point in their careers.

[catzacker]

Would you like to bet on how many final fours and conf championships frank will have in 5 years?  Glossing over conf tourney championships and a league championship as if they are meaningless is rough ridin' ridiculous.  It's not my fault frank wasn't good enough to coach at lamar prior to coming to ksu.

[MakeItRain]

Yes, I would.  So not only does Frank suck now, but you think he will suck well into the future?  It must suck being you.  I love the fact that I'm actually able to experience happiness and satisfaction.

[catzacker]

Pfft...disappointment and happiness are not mutually exclusive emotions.  but continue to make this about me instead of frank nor achieving what billy did if that will make you happy.

[felix rex]

Tubbs didn't qualify for any tournament his first year, then NIT, then 8 ncaa's in a row (before the wheels fell off) including an Elite 8 and a F4.  He won the Conf 5 times, the Conf Tourney twice. 

Frank can't hold Billy's jock.

I love Billy Tubbs, my dad is an OU grad, I spent many days of my youth at LNC, KU beat OU for the National Championship 2 days before my 12th birthday.  Frank will have a similar conference and overall winning percentage than Billy Tubbs at the same point in their major conference careers, Tubbs will likely be three games better when figuring win percentage.  If I compared first five years to first five years straight up it would be a blood bath.  Frank will have more post season appearances and the same number of NCAA tournament wins if Frank doesn't win a NCAA tournament game this season.  The only thing Billy did his first five years at OU that Frank isn't doing his first five years as a coach is the one regular season conference title and two tournament titles, but like I said they will have similar winning percentages.  Fact is the start of Frank's coaching career is similar to the start of Billy's career at OU, he already had 4 years of seasoning before OU.  So your assertion of Frank can't hold Billy's jock has more to do with your miserable ass meat peeping existence, and less to do with what both men has actually accomplished at the same point in their careers.

Yeah, I mean other than three conference championships, he accomplished nothing of note.

[MakeItRain]

Tubbs didn't qualify for any tournament his first year, then NIT, then 8 ncaa's in a row (before the wheels fell off) including an Elite 8 and a F4.  He won the Conf 5 times, the Conf Tourney twice. 

Frank can't hold Billy's jock.

I love Billy Tubbs, my dad is an OU grad, I spent many days of my youth at LNC, KU beat OU for the National Championship 2 days before my 12th birthday.  Frank will have a similar conference and overall winning percentage than Billy Tubbs at the same point in their major conference careers, Tubbs will likely be three games better when figuring win percentage.  If I compared first five years to first five years straight up it would be a blood bath.  Frank will have more post season appearances and the same number of NCAA tournament wins if Frank doesn't win a NCAA tournament game this season.  The only thing Billy did his first five years at OU that Frank isn't doing his first five years as a coach is the one regular season conference title and two tournament titles, but like I said they will have similar winning percentages.  Fact is the start of Frank's coaching career is similar to the start of Billy's career at OU, he already had 4 years of seasoning before OU.  So your assertion of Frank can't hold Billy's jock has more to do with your miserable ass meat peeping existence, and less to do with what both men has actually accomplished at the same point in their careers.

Yeah, I mean other than three conference championships, he accomplished nothing of note.

How in the hell did you get that, out of that?

[felix rex]

Well, as long as we were just glossing over conference titles, I wanted in. It looked comforting.

[MakeItRain]

Yeah, I mean other than three conference championships, he accomplished nothing of note.

Goodness.  Don't even know where one starts with this...

sarcasm, although I'm quite pissed that Rex annihilated the context of my post to fire his sarcastic salvo.  I mean he might as well highlighted the word blood in my post and used it to point out that I said Billy Tubbs menstruates.

[wabash909]

Yeah, I mean other than three conference championships, he accomplished nothing of note.

Goodness.  Don't even know where one starts with this...

sarcasm, although I'm quite pissed that Rex annihilated the context of my post to fire his sarcastic salvo.  I mean he might as well highlighted the word blood in my post and used it to point out that I said Billy Tubbs menstruates.

Dude, 3 conference titles in his first five years at OU.  That's like career stuff. 

Come on, we all love Frank, but there is no comparison.

[MakeItRain]

Yeah, I mean other than three conference championships, he accomplished nothing of note.

Goodness.  Don't even know where one starts with this...

sarcasm, although I'm quite pissed that Rex annihilated the context of my post to fire his sarcastic salvo.  I mean he might as well highlighted the word blood in my post and used it to point out that I said Billy Tubbs menstruates.

Dude, 3 conference titles in his first five years at OU.  That's like career stuff. 

Come on, we all love Frank, but there is no comparison.

Wait you've confused me, clarify

[wabash909]

Conference titles.  They're kind of a big deal.

Like, I will be pleased if Frank win three in a fifteen year career at K-State, much less three in his first five.

Hell, I think Hartman had like five in twenty years here.

[MakeItRain]

Oh no I get it, you think I'm glossing over Billy Tubbs' three titles too.  Not sure where that come from but whatever.  I will offer context to Billy Tubbs though.  As I already said, it should be noted that Tubbs' first five years at OU weren't his first five years as a head coach.  Out of his first five years at OU he won those conference championships in years 4 & 5.  Those two years Wayman Tisdale won his second and third conference POY awards.  I wonder what Frank would have done if he had Mike and Bill for their sophomore and junior years too.  Billy Tubbs went to the elite eight with a three time conference player of the year, Frank went with Luis Colon and Chris Merriweather.  If Wayman Tisdale played in today's climate he would have been gone after his freshman year and there is no way in hell Billy would have had the resume the next two years he had.

One more thing

we're going to the NIT this year.  That's 2 in 5.  1 in 8 years? okay.  2 in 5, not okay.  
 

Billy's last five at OU

1989-1990    Oklahoma    27-5    11-3 T-2nd    NCAA 2nd Round
1990-1991    Oklahoma    20-15    5-9    T-6th    NIT 3rd Round
1991-1992    Oklahoma    21-9    8-6    T-2nd    NCAA 1st Round
1992-1993    Oklahoma    20-12    7-7    T-5th    NIT 2nd Round
1993-1994    Oklahoma    15-13    6-8    5th            NIT 1st Round
Two NCAA appearances and one damn tournament win in five years

So this Frank can't hold Billy's jock is complete revisionist bullshit.  I hate you idiots for forcing me to speak ill about Billy Tubbs, to this day my favorite college basketball coach ever.

[wabash909]

I think I've just got a thing for conference titles.  Not winning one in like thirty five years will do that to you.

[catzacker]

Billy's last years were noted in my post earlier.  And if frank has a similar stretch he should be gone too. Though I believe technically tubbs resigned.  Speaking factually about someone isn't speaking ill of them, doesn't mean you hate them ir think they suck.  same goes for frank.

[MakeItRain]

Billy's last years were noted in my post earlier.  And if frank has a similar stretch he should be gone too. Though I believe technically tubbs resigned.  Speaking factually about someone isn't speaking ill of them, doesn't mean you hate them ir think they suck.  same goes for frank.

So will you acknowledge that Frank would have at least matched Billy's two good years if Mike stayed?  Billy would not have had the services of Wayman Tisdale for three years if he coached 15 years later?

[sys]

conf tournament titles aren't the same as reg season titles.

[kso_FAN]

I think I've just got a thing for conference titles.  Not winning one in like thirty five years will do that to you.

Yeah, it would be nice to win one in my lifetime (while I can remember it). I'm getting close to being 40. Dang.

[sonofdaxjones]

When a school is paying a basketball coach nearly $2 million a year and building them Taj Mahal practice facilities, they should pretty much make the NCAA tourney every year.

There's lots of school that have done the same and they don't make the NCAA tourney every year, but those schools aren't considered one of the Top 25 college basketball programs of all time.  So lets start acting fans of one of the Top 25 basketball programs of all time and expect to make the NCAA tourney every year.    Oh and quit trying to pile on with all these bullcac strawman arguments about how UConn or somebody else similar misses the tournament here and there, like the fans of those programs think that's perfectly fine.   Because they don't think its perfectly fine, even with the great success they've had lately.    The fans of those programs are pi$$ed when they don't make the NCAA tourney and rightfully so, and all K-State fans should be pi$$ed when the K-State program doesn't make the NCAA tourney.    

  

[Rage Against the McKee]

When a school is paying a basketball coach nearly $2 million a year and building them Taj Mahal practice facilities, they should pretty much make the NCAA tourney every year.

There's lots of school that have done the same and they don't make the NCAA tourney every year, but those schools aren't considered one of the Top 25 college basketball programs of all time.  So lets start acting fans of one of the Top 25 basketball programs of all time and expect to make the NCAA tourney every year.    Oh and quit trying to pile on with all these bullcac strawman arguments about how UConn or somebody else similar misses the tournament here and there, like the fans of those programs think that's perfectly fine.   Because they don't think its perfectly fine, even with the great success they've had lately.    The fans of those programs are pi$$ed when they don't make the NCAA tourney and rightfully so, and all K-State fans should be pi$$ed when the K-State program doesn't make the NCAA tourney.    

  

Top 25 basketball programs of all time usually don't miss the tournament 20 years in a row. I think Frank is doing pretty well considering what was here before him.

[sonofdaxjones]

K-State didn't miss the tourney 20 years in a row. 

However, it was that 15 year stretch of only making it twice that kept K-State from being considered a top 15 college basketball program of all time, and that period really sucked and there was no excuse for it.   Just like there's really no excuse for not making the NCAA tourney every year now,  K-State should always be in the upper half of the conference, and most of that time in the upper 3rd.    K-State spends a lot of money on athletics for only having the minimum number of sports to be considered a full time D1 school.   So asking the major sports at K-State to perform well every year is not unreasonable on any level.