Diaz

[Belvis Noland]

the idea that williams isn't a scholarship level d1 player is absolutely Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!).

I'm probably being too harsh on him, but I expected more out of him at this point.  He's shown nothing. 

I mean, tell me what you like about his game? 

[sys]

I mean, tell me what you like about his game? 

he's played like 5 minutes.  the only thing i can conclude is that he's obviously not better than the guys that are playing.

[420seriouscat69]

the idea that williams isn't a scholarship level d1 player is absolutely Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!).

I'm probably being too harsh on him, but I expected more out of him at this point.  He's shown nothing. 

I mean, tell me what you like about his game? 

Of course he hasn't. He averages like 1 minute a game. In mop up duty however I think he's shown opportunity to have a nice 3 ball. He's playing tight with his time, you would too. Give him some minutes and I'm sure you'd see his game open up.

[Belvis Noland]

he's played like 5 minutes.  the only thing i can conclude is that he's obviously not better than the guys that are playing.

That's kind of the point, no? 

Those guys championing Nino as a good use of a scholarship really have no basis.  He never plays.  Conclusion?  He's not good enough to get minutes.  Conclusion?  true freshman and juco guys are better than him.   

[Belvis Noland]

Of course he hasn't. He averages like 1 minute a game. In mop up duty however I think he's shown opportunity to have a nice 3 ball. He's playing tight with his time, you would too. Give him some minutes and I'm sure you'd see his game open up.

This is such a Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) argument.  Nino would be a lot better if he had more minutes!!!

FACT:  Nino would get more minutes if he was a better player. 

[Belvis Noland]

And btw, Nino is a forward.  not a guard. 

Per the roster, he's competing with Samuels, Ojeleye and Watson for minutes.

He's a 6-5 forward.  Doesn't have good ball skills.   

[sys]

And btw, Nino is a forward.  not a guard. 

Per the roster, he's competing with Samuels, Ojeleye and Watson for minutes.

He's a 6-5 forward.  Doesn't have good ball skills.   

compared to those guys, he has great ball skills.


i don't agree with your implication that because he's not getting minutes that he was a recruiting mistake.  you can't play 13 guys.  even if you have the best 13 players in the country (not saying kstate does, don't try and straw man your way away from the argument), and even if your coach plays his bench more than he probably should, about 3-4 of them aren't going to get minutes.

[michigancat]

Nino is competing w/ McGruder and Southwell for minutes more than anyone.

[Belvis Noland]

i don't agree with your implication that because he's not getting minutes that he was a recruiting mistake.  you can't play 13 guys.  even if you have the best 13 players in the country (not saying kstate does, don't try and straw man your way away from the argument), and even if your coach plays his bench more than he probably should, about 3-4 of them aren't going to get minutes.

Didn't say it was a mistake to recruit him.  Just saying that he hasn't panned out since he's been here.  If his sophomore season is as worthless as this season has been, it wouldn't bother me in the slightest if Frank ran him off to open up a scholarship.  

[Belvis Noland]

Nino is competing w/ McGruder and Southwell for minutes more than anyone.

With a 6-5 frame, yes, this is what one would assume.  But, he's listed as a forward on the roster, whereas McGruder and Southwell are listed as guards.  He plays a different position and, hence, technically doesn't compete with McGruder and Southwell.  As a practical matter, I have no idea who he competes with because he's not good enough to see any playing time.   

[Belvis Noland]

Look, the proof is in the stat line.  Frank is running an 11-man rotation on the floor.  One of the deepest teams in the Conference.  Anybody who can contribute gets minutes.  Plenty of 1st and 2nd year guys and JuCos.   

A-Rod
Sprad
McGruder
Irving
Southwell
JJones
Samuels
JO
Gip
Diaz
Ojeleye

Then, we've got 2 walk-ons, 2 crap juco guys, and Nino who are fighting for the table scraps.   

Maybe he'll turn into the toughest 6-5 forward in the BigXII.  Or maybe he'll develop ball handling skills at the age of 20. 

[Pete]

I don't think Nino was a recruiting mistake per se, I mean he was an in-state kid and all...and MoKan, which in retrospect has amounted to jack crap for us.

[michigancat]

Nino is competing w/ McGruder and Southwell for minutes more than anyone.

With a 6-5 frame, yes, this is what one would assume.  But, he's listed as a forward on the roster, whereas McGruder and Southwell are listed as guards.  He plays a different position and, hence, technically doesn't compete with McGruder and Southwell.  As a practical matter, I have no idea who he competes with because he's not good enough to see any playing time.   

jesus christ I can't believe I fed the troll.

[Belvis Noland]

jesus christ I can't believe I fed the troll.

jezuscrist, I can't believe I waste my time arguing with people who don't even know what f'ing position Nino plays. 

[gatoveintisiete]

So much knowledge in this thread. 

[kstate4life]

This thread needs a title change, very misleading.

[sys]

This thread needs a title change, very misleading.

my guess is that the staff anticipated having more minutes available for guys like williams and lawrence, playing frequently with a single post.  but that the early success of gipson and to a lesser extent diaz have let them play a more traditional lineup.  so, it's a little related.

[bakerman]

jesus christ I can't believe I fed the troll.

jezuscrist, I can't believe I waste my time arguing with people who don't even know what f'ing position Nino plays. 

just because he's listed as a forward, doesn't mean he's not competing with Rod and Shane for the 3 spot. at 6'5" he's not exactly a 4. Obviously Rod is going to get the majority of the 3 minutes, followed by Shane, then Nino. There just aren't that many minutes left after the first two guys unless you are in a blowout.

[puniraptor]

I can't wait until this turns into a Colin Klein photoshop meme thread 

[MakeItRain]

Look, the proof is in the stat line.  Frank is running an 11-man rotation on the floor.  One of the deepest teams in the Conference.  Anybody who can contribute gets minutes.  Plenty of 1st and 2nd year guys and JuCos.   

A-Rod
Sprad
McGruder
Irving
Southwell
JJones
Samuels
JO
Gip
Diaz
Ojeleye

Then, we've got 2 walk-ons, 2 crap juco guys, and Nino who are fighting for the table scraps.   

Maybe he'll turn into the toughest 6-5 forward in the BigXII.  Or maybe he'll develop ball handling skills at the age of 20. 

Two things, first I don't care how they're listed and I don't think Frank does either but Rodney and Shane are not guards.  We have three guards who play, possibly four with Jones.  Rodney is the starting small forward, Angel is the first guard off of the bench and he's dubbed for either Tay or Will.  We've never had Tay, Will, & ar-t in together so its safe to assume that is the guard rotation.  I haven't studied (he hasn't played enough) Jones' to say for sure what his sub pattern is, though I'm pretty sure he's a shooting guard exclusively.  There is no way you can think Rodney is a guard unless you think Tay is the small forward.

Secondly, no one knows if Nino is the answer, however you need to realize that he isn't playing behind any freshman or first year jucos (with the possible exception of Jones).  Angel, Gip, and Diaz all play different positions.  The shooting guard/small forward positions in the depth chart ahead on Nino are held by players who have more experience.  Shane has the benefit of playing all last season, its safe to assume that Nino's practice time was limited if he was recovering from two concussions in a short period of time.  If he and Jones are competing for PT (I don't think they are) there's no shame that a junior is getting more tic because he's better offensively than a rs freshman recovering from PCS.

[kougar24]

This thread needs a title change, very misleading.

my guess is that the staff anticipated having more minutes available for guys like williams and lawrence, playing frequently with a single post.  but that the early success of gipson and to a lesser extent diaz have let them play a more traditional lineup.  so, it's a little related.

Well done.

[Belvis Noland]

Two things, first I don't care how they're listed and I don't think Frank does either but Rodney and Shane are not guards. 

I won't argue.  Frank puts guys on the floor, regardless of position on roster.  granted.  I do believe he generally puts his bigs in the paint/FT line and everybody else on the perimeter (including his 3s MacG and Southwell). 

I'm just concerned that Nino's a classic college tweener.  Not big enough to play inside, not good enough shooter/ball handler to play outside.  Maybe he'll surprise me when he starts getting more minutes.   

The problem is the minutes.  All of these experienced players that currently keep him on the bench... all return next year.  Maybe he'll play well in 2013-2014? 

Personally, I think Diaz could be another problem for the Ninos of the world.  If Diaz has the range that the recruiting experts observed, I can see him playing a lot more minutes in different spots on the floor, inside and out.  I'm really excited about our front court.  Add in an impact perimeter player and this team could be pretty awesome. 

[Emo EMAW]

FTR, if we don't get Semi then we should fire Frank.

[kitten_mittons]

jfc, belvis and emo.


i hope you aren't the same people complaining that kstate isn't recruiting semi ojeleye hard enough.

FTR, if we don't get Semi then we should fire Frank.

[sys]

good job, emo.