Rick Barnes is a monster.

[steve dave]

Rick Barnes has been to the NCAA tourny 16 years in a row 

[0.42]

I guess anybody could win at UNC, too? 

• Brown coached the Tar Heels to five consecutive bowl games, including UNC's only two New Year's Day bowl games in more than half a century
• They were ranked in the AP Top 25 every week from October 1992 through the start of the 1995 season.
• They finished in the final rankings in four out of five years, including two straight appearances in the top 10.
• They also won 10 regular-season games in 1993 and 1997, only the second and third times the Tar Heels have accomplished this.

Where in my post did I say that Mack couldn't succeed at other schools? He did a fantastic job at UNC and Tulane. He did a great job at UT, and he along with the UT athletic department now has put the football program in such a good position that just about anyone could succeed there. That's a compliment to Mack, because their football program certainly wasn't like that 15 years ago.

Case in point: even with last year's abortion of a season when Mack got overly stubborn and didn't address major team issues until after the season was over, Texas is still on a lot of people's lists to make the Top 25 this year and they're touted as having an outside shot at a Big 12 title. There is only one other school in the conference and very few schools in the nation where a 5-7 team can get that kind of respect. This is a matter of opinion, but I'd argue that Texas would still be receiving national respect even if Mack had retired last year and they had a new coach in Austin this year. Mack has built such an effective machine that just about any blatantly incompetent coach could effectively ride it for 2-3 years before the bottom would start to fall out. There are very, very few programs that have that kind of insurance.

[felix rex]

"We would love to win a national championship, but we're not obsessed with it because we're obsessed with these guys trying to live their NBA dream. What's happened to Kevin Durant, LaMarcus Aldridge, T.J. Ford -- I'd give up a national title for all of our guys to be able to live their dream."

This quote is so genius

To put this in appropriate language, Rick Barnes is like the Allen Nation of NCAA basketball.

[felix rex]

I guess anybody could win at UNC, too? 

• Brown coached the Tar Heels to five consecutive bowl games, including UNC's only two New Year's Day bowl games in more than half a century
• They were ranked in the AP Top 25 every week from October 1992 through the start of the 1995 season.
• They finished in the final rankings in four out of five years, including two straight appearances in the top 10.
• They also won 10 regular-season games in 1993 and 1997, only the second and third times the Tar Heels have accomplished this.

Where in my post did I say that Mack couldn't succeed at other schools? He did a fantastic job at UNC and Tulane. He did a great job at UT, and he along with the UT athletic department now has put the football program in such a good position that just about anyone could succeed there. That's a compliment to Mack, because their football program certainly wasn't like that 15 years ago.

Case in point: even with last year's abortion of a season when Mack got overly stubborn and didn't address major team issues until after the season was over, Texas is still on a lot of people's lists to make the Top 25 this year and they're touted as having an outside shot at a Big 12 title. There is only one other school in the conference and very few schools in the nation where a 5-7 team can get that kind of respect. This is a matter of opinion, but I'd argue that Texas would still be receiving national respect even if Mack had retired last year and they had a new coach in Austin this year. Mack has built such an effective machine that just about any blatantly incompetent coach could effectively ride it for 2-3 years before the bottom would start to fall out. There are very, very few programs that have that kind of insurance.

My point wasn't that Mack couldn't succeed at other places.

[0.42]

Rick Barnes has been to the NCAA tourny 16 years in a row 

Bill Self has been to 13 NCAA's in a row, and he gets called out here consistently for being a terrible coach. Do you agree with that?

Barnes has been at Texas for 13 years, and with the level of support he's gotten since he started, they should've made the NCAA's each of those 13 years. Like I said, competent, not great. I'd argue that his years at Clemson were more impressive since it's next to impossible to win there consistently.

[Rage Against the McKee]

so basically nobody could win there except for Mack/Rick but since Mack/Rick kicked so much ass now anyone can win there?   

Well clearly their football program won in the past, they'd just fallen into a mediocre period because of neglect. Yes, Mack kicked enough ass so that now anyone can win there. Mack is a fantastic recruiter, a great team manager (last year aside), and an adequate x's and o's coach; and with enough administrative support he turned Texas back into the football juggernaut that it should be. I'm not trying to criticize Mack here, but now it's at the point where Turner Gill could coax out 10 win seasons there.

My main point is that Rick Barnes stepped into the most underachieving basketball program of all time caused by a lack of AD support and used administrative support and his recruiting prowess to turn the program into where it should be. He's not a bad coach, but he's not a great one either. I'd argue that administrative support was the main factor in bringing UT basketball to prominence, and Barnes rode that wave of momentum. In that sense he's a good program manager and an adequate recruiter (aka, he's not a complete dumbass). That brings me to my main point: anyone who has a moderate level of competence could win in UT basketball with the current level of support it gets from the athletic department. And yes, I am criticizing Rick Barnes, because a coach with good to great skills wouldn't have UT flaming out in the first or second round every year.

Posts like this just make me feel very, very sorry for the poor sob who has to replace Mack. Mack is the best coach Texas has ever had. It's ridiculous to expect anybody else to duplicate his success.

 

Mack would and does coach circles around his old wrinkly ass.

[steve dave]

Rick Barnes has been to the NCAA tourny 16 years in a row 

Bill Self has been to 13 NCAA's in a row, and he gets called out here consistently for being a terrible coach. Do you agree with that?

Barnes has been at Texas for 13 years, and with the level of support he's gotten since he started, they should've made the NCAA's each of those 13 years. Like I said, competent, not great. I'd argue that his years at Clemson were more impressive since it's next to impossible to win there consistently.

So your argument that Rick Barnes is competant but not great is that he's equal with Bill Self?

[0.42]

I guess anybody could win at UNC, too? 

• Brown coached the Tar Heels to five consecutive bowl games, including UNC's only two New Year's Day bowl games in more than half a century
• They were ranked in the AP Top 25 every week from October 1992 through the start of the 1995 season.
• They finished in the final rankings in four out of five years, including two straight appearances in the top 10.
• They also won 10 regular-season games in 1993 and 1997, only the second and third times the Tar Heels have accomplished this.

Where in my post did I say that Mack couldn't succeed at other schools? He did a fantastic job at UNC and Tulane. He did a great job at UT, and he along with the UT athletic department now has put the football program in such a good position that just about anyone could succeed there. That's a compliment to Mack, because their football program certainly wasn't like that 15 years ago.

Case in point: even with last year's abortion of a season when Mack got overly stubborn and didn't address major team issues until after the season was over, Texas is still on a lot of people's lists to make the Top 25 this year and they're touted as having an outside shot at a Big 12 title. There is only one other school in the conference and very few schools in the nation where a 5-7 team can get that kind of respect. This is a matter of opinion, but I'd argue that Texas would still be receiving national respect even if Mack had retired last year and they had a new coach in Austin this year. Mack has built such an effective machine that just about any blatantly incompetent coach could effectively ride it for 2-3 years before the bottom would start to fall out. There are very, very few programs that have that kind of insurance.

My point wasn't that Mack couldn't succeed at other places.

Ok, so you're trying to point out holes in my argument that UT football is now self-sustaining. I moved from Chapel Hill to the Austin area right about the same time Mack did, and I can tell you that Mack inherited a much better program infrastructure than what he had at UNC. Sure, UT was decrepit at the time, but there was ample room to expand and succeed. UNC hit their peak under Mack just as UT has, but there wasn't nearly as much of a recruiting and fan base in place to keep the bottom from falling out. UT now has first pick of the strongest state for high school talent in the country, and there is a massive population base to draw fans from. UNC, while they have some good things going for them, does not have nearly as many resources at their disposal as UT does.

[0.42]

Rick Barnes has been to the NCAA tourny 16 years in a row 

Bill Self has been to 13 NCAA's in a row, and he gets called out here consistently for being a terrible coach. Do you agree with that?

Barnes has been at Texas for 13 years, and with the level of support he's gotten since he started, they should've made the NCAA's each of those 13 years. Like I said, competent, not great. I'd argue that his years at Clemson were more impressive since it's next to impossible to win there consistently.

So your argument that Rick Barnes is competant but not great is that he's equal with Bill Self?

Actually, no, I was just trying to get a better idea of where you're coming from on this. Bill Self > Barnes IMO. If Self was at UT, they'd have won 2-3 nattys by now.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Rick Barnes has been to the NCAA tourny 16 years in a row 

Bill Self has been to 13 NCAA's in a row, and he gets called out here consistently for being a terrible coach. Do you agree with that?

Barnes has been at Texas for 13 years, and with the level of support he's gotten since he started, they should've made the NCAA's each of those 13 years. Like I said, competent, not great. I'd argue that his years at Clemson were more impressive since it's next to impossible to win there consistently.

So your argument that Rick Barnes is competant but not great is that he's equal with Bill Self?

Other than one fluke NCAA run by Self, the two coaches are basically equal, only Self builds his teams by ruining his players' professional careers while Rick does everything he can to make sure his players succeed in life. Neither coach performs all that well in the NCAA tournament in a typical year.

[felix rex]

My point was that Mack wins (and wins big) where others didn't/don't.

[0.42]

My point was that Mack wins (and wins big) where others didn't/don't.

I can agree with this.

[steve dave]

My point was that Mack wins (and wins big) where others didn't/don't.

I can agree with this.

also Barnes

[0.42]

My point was that Mack wins (and wins big) where others didn't/don't.

I can agree with this.

also Barnes

 

[Rage Against the McKee]

JFC, guys, just being successful at Texas puts you in an elite group of coaches. Almost nobody has done it.

[steve dave]

JFC, guys, just being successful at Texas puts you in an elite group of coaches. Almost nobody has done it.

In both major sports only one man has had even moderate success (obv. not counting men named Barnes/Brown)

[wetwillie]

account deletion probablity increasing exponentially

[0.42]

account deletion probablity increasing exponentially

 

JFC, guys, just being successful at Texas puts you in an elite group of coaches. Almost nobody has done it.

We aren't talking about Baylor or Texas Tech where a lack of basketball history keeps you from really getting a decent foothold in the sport. Texas should and does have the resources to be successful in basketball. My point is that while Rick Barnes isn't a bad coach, he's not of a high enough caliber to help Texas reach their program's full potential.

[felix rex]

RECRUIT FARMING

Coaching is really the business of converting charisma and facilities into recruits and recruits into harvestable championship products in a sustainable manner. From this perspective we see that those of us in the championship business are really in the recruit business. Rick Barnes, editor of the Stockman Recruit Farmer, would say we are "recruit farmers" first and foremost and that our charisma, facilities and championships are the combines with which we harvest our talent.

Most of us have considered the championship business, not the recruit business, as our primary occupation. As a result, our focus has been on the championships. We have a relatively poor understanding of how our players grow and respond to recruiting. An understanding of this relationship is fundamental to successful coaching.

[Rage Against the McKee]

account deletion probablity increasing exponentially

 

JFC, guys, just being successful at Texas puts you in an elite group of coaches. Almost nobody has done it.

We aren't talking about Baylor or Texas Tech where a lack of basketball history keeps you from really getting a decent foothold in the sport. Texas should and does have the resources to be successful in basketball. My point is that while Rick Barnes isn't a bad coach, he's not of a high enough caliber to help Texas reach their program's full potential.

Baylor was in the elite 8 two years ago, so I'm not sure what you mean by a "decent foothold." I don't think Texas' basketball history prior to Rick Barnes is really much better than Texas Tech's or Baylor's.

[OregonSmock]

My point was that Mack wins (and wins big) where others didn't/don't.

I can agree with this.

also Barnes

Take your foot off of the Rick Barnes dick sucking pedal for a second.  JFC. 

[Rage Against the McKee]

I can't think of 5 coaches I'd rather have than Barnes. If we could get any coach in the country, my top 5 would be:

1. Calipari
2. Coach K
3. Izzo
4. Roy Williams
5. Rick Barnes

[steve dave]

Calipari def. and probably Izzo too but I don't know about Roy and K.  They inherited great jobs (unlike Barnes).

[Rage Against the McKee]

Calipari def. and probably Izzo too but I don't know about Roy and K.  They inherited great jobs (unlike Barnes).

Roy might not belong, but K definitely does. Sure, he has a great job, but he still had to go out and win all those national championships. They don't win themselves, regardless of what some internet retards try to tell you.

[OregonSmock]

I can't think of 5 coaches I'd rather have than Barnes. If we could get any coach in the country, my top 5 would be:

1. Calipari
2. Coach K
3. Izzo
4. Roy Williams
5. Rick Barnes

 


This is the kind of list I'd expect from a fan of a program with zero national titles in any team sport.