Stansberry's Investment Advisory

[Rage Against the McKee]

The middle class is shrinking because we have an abundance of Americans who simply are not smart or educated enough to get a good job that doesn't require a lot of work and they don't want to put in the work necessary to earn a decent living.

So this is all a welfare problem? It has nothing to do with newly minted $$ hitting the top first - deteriorating purchasing power of the dollar - and the new cheap money takin too long to hit the consumers on the bottom?


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I don't think it's a welfare problem so much as an education problem. Yesterday's factory workers are today's Wal-Mart cashiers, and the pay just isn't comparable.

[HeinBallz]

The middle class is shrinking because we have an abundance of Americans who simply are not smart or educated enough to get a good job that doesn't require a lot of work and they don't want to put in the work necessary to earn a decent living.

So this is all a welfare problem? It has nothing to do with newly minted $$ hitting the top first - deteriorating purchasing power of the dollar - and the new cheap money takin too long to hit the consumers on the bottom?


Sent from my iPhone using DealWithItBitches.

I don't think it's a welfare problem so much as an education problem. Yesterday's factory workers are today's Wal-Mart cashiers, and the pay just isn't comparable.

But you understand that by the laws of supply and demand, someone has to be your consumer.  Are you really suggesting that an entire decade of college graduates are entering the workforce through unemployment lines - and they're not capable or smart enough to even be factory workers?  Furthermore, do you know any factory workers?  It doesn't take much qualification.  Suggesting that it's all a lack of work force and has nothing to do with intentional debasement of our currency seems naive.  If its a problem with stimulating consumers to spend, why didn't qe1 and qe2 have an impact?


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[Kat Kid]

The middle class is shrinking because we have an abundance of Americans who simply are not smart or educated enough to get a good job that doesn't require a lot of work and they don't want to put in the work necessary to earn a decent living.

So this is all a welfare problem? It has nothing to do with newly minted $$ hitting the top first - deteriorating purchasing power of the dollar - and the new cheap money takin too long to hit the consumers on the bottom?


Sent from my iPhone using DealWithItBitches.

I don't think it's a welfare problem so much as an education problem. Yesterday's factory workers are today's Wal-Mart cashiers, and the pay just isn't comparable.

But you understand that by the laws of supply and demand, someone has to be your consumer.  Are you really suggesting that an entire decade of college graduates are entering the workforce through unemployment lines - and they're not capable or smart enough to even be factory workers?  Furthermore, do you know any factory workers?  It doesn't take much qualification.  Suggesting that it's all a lack of work force and has nothing to do with intentional debasement of our currency seems naive.  If its a problem with stimulating consumers to spend, why didn't qe1 and qe2 have an impact?


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they did have an impact.

[HeinBallz]

They had a temporary impact - but the very nature of print $$ inevitably drives an economy into recession.  A couple of execs making off with a couple golden handshakes is not the impact I was suggesting.   I'm talking about a thriving economy.


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[Rage Against the McKee]

The middle class is shrinking because we have an abundance of Americans who simply are not smart or educated enough to get a good job that doesn't require a lot of work and they don't want to put in the work necessary to earn a decent living.

So this is all a welfare problem? It has nothing to do with newly minted $$ hitting the top first - deteriorating purchasing power of the dollar - and the new cheap money takin too long to hit the consumers on the bottom?


Sent from my iPhone using DealWithItBitches.

I don't think it's a welfare problem so much as an education problem. Yesterday's factory workers are today's Wal-Mart cashiers, and the pay just isn't comparable.

But you understand that by the laws of supply and demand, someone has to be your consumer.  Are you really suggesting that an entire decade of college graduates are entering the workforce through unemployment lines - and they're not capable or smart enough to even be factory workers?  Furthermore, do you know any factory workers?  It doesn't take much qualification.  Suggesting that it's all a lack of work force and has nothing to do with intentional debasement of our currency seems naive.  If its a problem with stimulating consumers to spend, why didn't qe1 and qe2 have an impact?


Sent from my iPhone using DealWithItBitches.

They are smart enough to be factory workers, but there are far fewer factory jobs than there used to be. These people should be pushed to a technical school so learn a trade like welding or bricklaying, but they are either too unmotivated or too uninformed to realize that these are good jobs in high demand.

[michigancat]

this thread is trying to morph into a rand novel, only less boring

[8manpick]

this thread is trying to morph into a rand novel, only less boring

IIRC, there wasn't much of a middle class in Atlas Shrugged

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[06wildcat]

They had a temporary impact - but the very nature of print $$ inevitably drives an economy into recession.  A couple of execs making off with a couple golden handshakes is not the impact I was suggesting.   I'm talking about a thriving economy.


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You do realize the effects of qe and qe2 will last for years to come right? There are lots of tools that can be used to fight inflation. Printing money and distributing it widely is the ONLY thing to combat deflation. And deflation is exponentially worse than inflation between 15-25 percent.

The real problem with qe and qe2 is that it hasn't been spread widely enough. It has basically made money incredibly cheap for people who were already doing OK.

[kstatefreak42]

http://pro.stansberryresearch.com/1202ENDOFAMR/PPSIN705/

Thank you previous generations. Thank you. So much. Our future is so bleak.

"The demand for dollars from the rest of the world has been of inestimable benefit to the US Economy. It quite simply allows Americans to consume more than they produce and save less than they invest; in other words, to live beyond our means."- Barrons's

"Indeed, it is unlikely that ammericans themselves will escape the inflationary consequences of current fed policy...the fed is financing a vast and rising federal deficit, following a practice that has been a surefire prescription for domestic inflation from the time immemorial."- George Melloan

Tried to watch, he talked so goddam much and so uselessly I had to close.

yeah i didnt even listen the whole way through. haha

[06wildcat]

I read an article the other day about how there's 600K unfilled factory type jobs in the United States.   The primary crux of the article is that there's not enough people in the workforce (ex: machinists) to fill the jobs.   Factory owners were talking about how many of the "younger" folks didn't consider working in a factory cool or good enough for them.   I am sure some of the jobs didn't pay that well, but they mainly talked about the many factory jobs that paid $20 plus dollars an hour once apprenticeship periods were over.

Same is true of over-the-road trucking, although the pay is about equal for even shittier conditions.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I read an article the other day about how there's 600K unfilled factory type jobs in the United States.   The primary crux of the article is that there's not enough people in the workforce (ex: machinists) to fill the jobs.   Factory owners were talking about how many of the "younger" folks didn't consider working in a factory cool or good enough for them.   I am sure some of the jobs didn't pay that well, but they mainly talked about the many factory jobs that paid $20 plus dollars an hour once apprenticeship periods were over.

Same is true of over-the-road trucking, although the pay is about equal for even shittier conditions.

The point is that there are many jobs that would place people firmly in the middle class, but people are choosing lower class jobs instead. I don't really think this is a problem because we can fill those jobs with immigrant labor and move on, but I'm sure a lot of you guys disagree with that.

[michigancat]

Does $20/hour make you firmly middle class any more?

[slobber]

I would think $40k/yr would get you into the middle class. Maybe lower middle, but still middle.

[HeinBallz]

Who the hell chooses to work at walmart over a factory job with benefits?

[Rage Against the McKee]

Does $20/hour make you firmly middle class any more?

It does in the midwest.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Who the hell chooses to work at walmart over a factory job with benefits?

Lots of people, apparently.

[michigancat]

Who the hell chooses to work at walmart over a factory job with benefits?

Lots of people, apparently.

where are you getting this info? I think there are a lot of factors at play. First, I imagine a $20/hr manufacturing job requires quite a bit of skill, or you're working in a nasty job like a foundry or something. I would work for a hypothetical $10/hr in Wal-Mart over a hypothetical $20/hr in a foundry.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Who the hell chooses to work at walmart over a factory job with benefits?

Lots of people, apparently.

where are you getting this info? I think there are a lot of factors at play. First, I imagine a $20/hr manufacturing job requires quite a bit of skill, or you're working in a nasty job like a foundry or something. I would work for a hypothetical $10/hr in Wal-Mart over a hypothetical $20/hr in a foundry.

I'm assuming most of the factory jobs are pretty hard and nasty. Why wouldn't people be working them, otherwise? I'm not going to feel sorry for somebody who decides not to go work that job and ends up making less, though.

[HeinBallz]

This isn't the 1930's where work conditions are unbearable.  I know tons of factory guys that walked in with nothing but a high-school diploma and making $15 an hour to start and after 2 years or so up around $20/hour.  Alternatively, I know people begging to get a job in as some factory worker, because they're sick of working at bank of america - those jobs just are not there.

[michigancat]

Who the hell chooses to work at walmart over a factory job with benefits?

Lots of people, apparently.

where are you getting this info? I think there are a lot of factors at play. First, I imagine a $20/hr manufacturing job requires quite a bit of skill, or you're working in a nasty job like a foundry or something. I would work for a hypothetical $10/hr in Wal-Mart over a hypothetical $20/hr in a foundry.

I'm assuming most of the factory jobs are pretty hard and nasty. Why wouldn't people be working them, otherwise? I'm not going to feel sorry for somebody who decides not to go work that job and ends up making less, though.

there are huge variations in hardness and nastyness. I didn't know this was about feeling sorry for people.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Who the hell chooses to work at walmart over a factory job with benefits?

Lots of people, apparently.

where are you getting this info? I think there are a lot of factors at play. First, I imagine a $20/hr manufacturing job requires quite a bit of skill, or you're working in a nasty job like a foundry or something. I would work for a hypothetical $10/hr in Wal-Mart over a hypothetical $20/hr in a foundry.

I'm assuming most of the factory jobs are pretty hard and nasty. Why wouldn't people be working them, otherwise? I'm not going to feel sorry for somebody who decides not to go work that job and ends up making less, though.

there are huge variations in hardness and nastyness. I didn't know this was about feeling sorry for people.

Yes, I wasn't saying that all factory jobs were hard or nasty. I just think it's a valid assumption that $20 per hour jobs that don't require skilled labor and go unfilled must either be very hard or nasty.

[Dugout DickStone]

If this guy thinks the dollar is dead, why is he asking for $49

[sys]

I read an article the other day about how there's 600K unfilled factory type jobs in the United States.   The primary crux of the article is that there's not enough people in the workforce (ex: machinists) to fill the jobs.   Factory owners were talking about how many of the "younger" folks didn't consider working in a factory cool or good enough for them.   I am sure some of the jobs didn't pay that well, but they mainly talked about the many factory jobs that paid $20 plus dollars an hour once apprenticeship periods were over.

they outsourced skilled factory jobs to other countries, and now complain they can't find workers when their aging skilled labor is retiring.  there aren't skilled replacements because they haven't been hiring and training younger workers in quantities to replace the aging labor.  hard to find a good tanner or blacksmith anymore too.  many universities don't even offer blacksmithery degrees.  rough ridin' lazy americans.

if they really wanted workers, they could hire unskilled labor and train it.  they don't want to, they want to bitch to the hack media until someone else agrees to fund the cost of worker training.

[kstatefreak42]

Were f*cked