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Messages - michigancat

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1
Interesting thread in the topic:

I learned a lot from this video. Good to look back

https://youtu.be/J3D2iyBqlCk

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Interesting thread in the topic:


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Kansas State Football / Re: the stupidity of ksu
« on: Today at 12:05:14 AM »
Ohio State following Kansas State's lead


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?s=21
Hell yeah

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https://jbhandleyblog.com/home/2020/6/28/secondwave

I don't think he's right about the herd immunity being under 20%. The paper he linked to that he said found a 20% HIT didn't actually say that.

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Essentially Flyertalk / Re: Tornado Season 2020
« on: July 08, 2020, 10:24:32 PM »
Holy crap some of this guys videos from today :horrorsurprise:






Something about how happy he is seems....off. even though it didn't look like there was much to damage.

Also get a real camera, jeez

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Quote
This right here.......
I’m sick of covid-19.
I’m sick of black vs. white.
I’m sick of Democrats vs. Republicans.
I’m sick of gay vs. straight.
I’m REALLY sick of the media.
I’m sick of the language being used and plastered all over the media...
I’m sick of no one being allowed to think what they want & feel what they do without offending someone.
I am sick of the people who are out there jumping on the bandwagon to protest just to cause mass confusion and more hatred and to riot, loot, and destroy...
I am sick of blaming the world for the sins of a few.
We’re one race—the human race. We All Matter!
You want to support President Trump? You do it! It’s your choice.
You want to support Biden? Fine... also your choice!
You want to believe in God? Okay, believe in God.
You want to believe in magical creatures that fly around & sprinkle fairy dust to make life better? Awesome... you do it!!
BUT how about being mature enough to be able to deal with the fact that everyone doesn’t have the same exact mind-set as you. Having our own minds is what makes us all individuals and beautiful. If you can’t handle that fact....I’m sorry!! I don’t have to agree with everything you believe in.
So be a decent human being without being hateful.
Copy and paste if you agree.

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Kansas State Football / Re: K-State opens -8 vs Buffalo
« on: July 08, 2020, 08:48:09 PM »
Aren't they like really good?

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Kansas State Football / Re: No 2020 College Football :-(
« on: July 08, 2020, 08:17:40 PM »


Temperature checks would for sure stop some symptomatic spreaders. Weird to think they're a bad idea

I think the push back is that it may tempt folks to think that it's sufficient.

I don't think that's any different from masks or the six foot distancing guidelines. Neither of those prevent infections but they both help a lot. Temperature checks aren't right for every situation but they're still pretty useful.

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Kansas State Football / Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« on: July 08, 2020, 07:21:08 PM »
You can't educate someone old enough to be in college away from being a racist.
Depends on your definition of educate, but racists aren’t irredeemable, ideologically, imo.  Whether that’s a fight worth fighting is a different matter.

College students are crazy impressionable though.
By educate, I mean someone representing the University providing material to a student with the intent to teach them something.

I don't believe in the excuse of ignorance as a true cause of racism for anyone raised (except for extremely extenuating circumstances) in this country.

You're probably right on the first part, but I disagree on the second - again, depends on your definition of "racist". I think there are plenty of casual dog-whistley racists that are that way because they never interacted with minorities.

I'd say an example is when I grew up I used the phrase "jewed him down" quite a bit. I didn't know any Jews or really understand why it was wrong! I probably even used it in college. I don't use that phrase any more.

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The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Re: Is it really racism...
« on: July 08, 2020, 07:10:45 PM »
if this becomes the official Karen thread then this info needs to be here so it isn't missed


named it the "CAREN Act"


:lol:

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Kansas State Football / Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« on: July 08, 2020, 07:04:41 PM »
You can't educate someone old enough to be in college away from being a racist.
Depends on your definition of educate, but racists aren’t irredeemable, ideologically, imo.  Whether that’s a fight worth fighting is a different matter.

College students are crazy impressionable though.

yeah I don't understand how chings is coming up with this. I've definitely evolved on race relations since I left college. Granted it wasn't necessarily driven by someone "educating" me, but learning and listening was part of it.

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Kansas State Football / Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« on: July 08, 2020, 06:07:10 PM »




The only thing that will actually fix the problem is society not accepting racism, not implementing rules against it.
It could quiet it to some degree, but winning over minds is the real prize. I don't think rules really affect that.
Rules might not be best way in your opinion but they could definitely help.

If you force knuckleheads like Jaden underground or off campus you definitely make it more difficult for them to organize and get attention. I'm sure he would attract lots of folks who go College Republicans -> TPUSA -> America First who might have just stopped at College Republicans if the America First wasn't an option

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Kansas State Football / Re: No 2020 College Football :-(
« on: July 08, 2020, 05:59:08 PM »
Temperature checks would for sure stop some symptomatic spreaders. Weird to think they're a bad idea

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Kansas State Football / Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« on: July 08, 2020, 05:53:12 PM »


The only thing that will actually fix the problem is society not accepting racism, not implementing rules against it.

Rules might not be best way in your opinion but they could definitely help.

17
But I think the letter was an opportunity to suggest "hey maybe we should hold our horses on some of this stuff and be sure as we can that what we're doing/calling for is a good idea" in those kinds of situations.

I don't know if you're referring to Civis or the #Mob, but

a) maybe Civis did hold their horses and consider what they were doing and
b) did anyone actually demand he was fired? I saw that some guy tagged the Civis CEO but I didn't see any demands (I also didn't look hard)

the other examples the letter shared were pretty vague

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Kansas State Football / Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« on: July 08, 2020, 04:58:12 PM »
Personally I don't think there is anything to solve. Racist speech should not be punished by the government.

I think publicly-subsidized college should be looked at as a benefit. Is not receiving a benefit a punishment? Are there any government benefits that can be withheld from racists? (I asked a question to this effect a while back and didn't receive an answer)

I can honestly kind of see arguments both ways.

I also asked the question earlier about which other government services should be denied to Jaden and got no response.

I don't think America First Students should be a non-profit or receive support from KSU, even if they meet the minimum number of members or get faculty sponsorship

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Kansas State Football / Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« on: July 08, 2020, 04:45:30 PM »
Personally I don't think there is anything to solve. Racist speech should not be punished by the government.

I think publicly-subsidized college should be looked at as a benefit. Is not receiving a benefit a punishment? Are there any government benefits that can be withheld from racists? (I asked a question to this effect a while back and didn't receive an answer)

I can honestly kind of see arguments both ways.

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My only issue with the letter is that #cancelling someone is a form of speech.  That's how it's supposed to work.  Person A says something, society analyzes it and reacts accordingly -- whether neutrally, in support, or in opposition.  I really don't have any problem with people calling out or canceling or whatever.  That's part of Speech too, baby. 

Seen in the best light, the letter is a call for more nuanced thought and consideration of how we oppose ideas we disagree with.  Which I think is a great and smart thing to consider, but keeping in mind that sometimes, reprehensible ideas don't deserve much nuance or thought or discussion.

none of the people who signed are at risk of being cancelled. They just don't want criticism from regular people.

while it is ludicrous to argue that the principle is invalid if there is a class of people powerful, influential or successful enough to not be subject to negative consequences that others may face or fear for the same actions, david shor was fired just a month or so ago for a (perfectly reasonable) tweet.  by any standard, shor was influential and successful in his field.

I don't know enough about Shor or the company and their clients, but I can see how that tweet could damage relationships with clients or maybe violate an internal social media policy. I can certainly get a passive-aggressive condescending vibe from the tweet and his adjacent ones and got the sense from replies that there's a bit of a history with similar tweets. Also considering he's NDA'd up I'm assuming he got a decent payout and probably walked away with a larger profile than he would have had otherwise.

At the same time, I don't think the "mob" was all that large and it wouldn't have been an issue for Civis to stand up for him. :dunno:
I think it's fair enough for him to be upset by that episode, the hypothetical decent payout and larger profile notwithstanding.

I don't disagree with that. But like from my very brief research of Civis, they're kinda focused on getting left-leaning clients - one article mentioned that the Biden campaign spent six figures on them. It isn't a stretch to think the Biden campaign might want to disassociate from support of a study like that (and by association, so would civis, even if it was scientifically rigorous and well done). My very brief experience working with consultants is they can be very touchy about offending clients. I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think this was just about placating a twitter mob or is a great example of "cancel culture" at work.

Although, yikes

https://www.civisanalytics.com/mission/

Quote
1. First, and most importantly, we seek truth through scientific rigor.

The scientific method is at the core of everything we do. That’s because, after more than 700 years, it’s still the best process for determining truth. And our customers trust us and our technology because truth is the new anchor of good business.

2. We tell the truth, and we admit when we’re wrong.

We call it out with candor, empathy, and the license to be disproven – even when it’s awkward. We’d rather be fired than lie or obfuscate.

....

9. We do the right thing, even when it costs us money.

Data science is powerful: it can be used for good or bad. We’ll often pursue powerful social good work at a loss, and we’ll responsibly decline work that does wrong, even if it’s lucrative.

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Kansas State Football / Re: No 2020 College Football :-(
« on: July 08, 2020, 03:19:42 PM »
I trust Dana more than the this is march guy

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My only issue with the letter is that #cancelling someone is a form of speech.  That's how it's supposed to work.  Person A says something, society analyzes it and reacts accordingly -- whether neutrally, in support, or in opposition.  I really don't have any problem with people calling out or canceling or whatever.  That's part of Speech too, baby. 

Seen in the best light, the letter is a call for more nuanced thought and consideration of how we oppose ideas we disagree with.  Which I think is a great and smart thing to consider, but keeping in mind that sometimes, reprehensible ideas don't deserve much nuance or thought or discussion.

none of the people who signed are at risk of being cancelled. They just don't want criticism from regular people.

while it is ludicrous to argue that the principle is invalid if there is a class of people powerful, influential or successful enough to not be subject to negative consequences that others may face or fear for the same actions, david shor was fired just a month or so ago for a (perfectly reasonable) tweet.  by any standard, shor was influential and successful in his field.

I don't know enough about Shor or the company and their clients, but I can see how that tweet could damage relationships with clients or maybe violate an internal social media policy. I can certainly get a passive-aggressive condescending vibe from the tweet and his adjacent ones and got the sense from replies that there's a bit of a history with similar tweets. Also considering he's NDA'd up I'm assuming he got a decent payout and probably walked away with a larger profile than he would have had otherwise.

At the same time, I don't think the "mob" was all that large and it wouldn't have been an issue for Civis to stand up for him. :dunno:

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we definitely haven't fully reopened by any definition

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Kansas State Football / Re: Athletes Forcing Change
« on: July 08, 2020, 02:04:33 PM »
and you would be wrong. what in my writing has conveyed an intention to not understand? i am asking questions to get better educated. that is how we solve problems. and neither of you can tell me what the campus culture is like at KSU that is threatening to people of color.

The black students quoted the article explained themselves quite well, you're just either ignoring or dismissing them.

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Kansas State Football / Re: No 2020 College Football :-(
« on: July 08, 2020, 01:30:14 PM »
i just don't think there's much of a risk of transmission in that setting -- at least no more than in a restaurant, train station, or city street.  i don't think CFB is going to happen anyway, but a reduced capacity situation seems basically harmless to me, relative to everything else that's allowed.

it depends on the exact setup (with concessions, security, bathrooms, and other indoor spaces), but it's certainly higher risk than any city street and most train stations in the US these days, but yeah I can see it being comparable to restaurants depending on the details. There are also unknowns like weather delays which could throw a wrench into things.

Most importantly, it's a completely unnecessary risk for the revenue.
because college athletic departments are flush with cash at the moment? 

I was thinking more along the lines that college athletic departments are about the last industry that needs to be saved plus you can do the whole "how many deaths is 7 games of limited revenue worth?" exercise plus the possible PR/financial fallout if a superspreading event occurs.

I mean, the industry that exploits unpaid athletes for "profit" putting its community at risk to squeeze out as much revenue as possible when actual for-profit leagues around the world are not is not a good look
if the pros dont go then yes it would be a bad look for colleges. but we dont have that answer yet. and we dont have an answer as to how much risk the athletes are putting into their communities either. they are a very minor portion of the overall student population. i dont think the network money is small potatoes. We still have 7 weeks until season starts. lets see how the teams infection rates look in mid august after practicing for a few weeks face to face. and lets continue to monitor recoveries. and i'm all for taking player opinions into account. we need a system that allows players to sit out without repercussions

FWIW I'm not worried about playing games. I think reopening colleges this fall is a bad idea but playing football doesn't make it any worse if they're open. crowds of 20k might though.

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