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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Football => Topic started by: CHONGS on October 07, 2010, 11:20:50 PM
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????
and no I don't want ron back so don't be stupid
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1. Hes black
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2. He's black
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Couldn't beat KU.
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one point to chum!
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couldn't keep any good assistants
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0 fer KU, MU & NU- you swap the two ctr wins for two wins vs the above & Ron is still here earning his millions
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Terrible recruiting classes. He didn't even have the transfers that Snyd's has been getting.
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we're getting there and making me feel better too!
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1. Poor recruiting. Not just personnel, but he had no strategy. 23 jucos is Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) and messes it up years in the future (which is part of our problem now).
2. Bad bad bad bad team management. Including coaches and players.
3. A steady decline in all facets of the team (performance, recruiting, and even morale).
4. Assistant coaches. The only thing worse than a Chris Cosh defense is a Tim Tibesar defense. Tonight was a night shout out to squinty, though.
5. Looking like crap against MU KU and NU for 3 straight years.
Not sure there needs to be 5 more after these 5 reasons. Especially when college football is all about recruiting and assistant coaches.
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Because rough waters. duh.
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Ok I started this thread to make me feel like things have improved, but honestly how many of these reasons still exist today? Most of them I fear.
Just how long can we keep using Prince as a scapegoat?
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His leadership classes he taught were terrible.
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he lost a lot of games.
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Ok I started this thread to make me feel like things have improved, but honestly how many of these reasons still exist today? Most of them I fear.
Just how long can we keep using Prince as a scapegoat?
The only difference between Prince and Snyder at this point is that the shirt tucks like Snyder. That's it.
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Ok I started this thread to make me feel like things have improved, but honestly how many of these reasons still exist today? Most of them I fear.
Just how long can we keep using Prince as a scapegoat?
The only difference between Prince and Snyder at this point is that the shirt tucks like Snyder. That's it.
Pluses for Bill:
1. Transfer players and better over all recruiting than Prince even if not up to Big 12 standards.
2. D.T.
3. His offensive scheme is better suited for college (if he has his QB)
Pluses for Prince:
1. His first move was to go out and get his QB.
2. Had the good sense to go out and Raheem Morris. (thus he understood the importance of young energetic coaches)
Minuses for Bill:
1. Retread coaching staff that will never be moved out after proving they can't do the job
2. Scares QBs and QB recruits
Minuses for HCRP:
1. Terrible offensive scheme
2. Players hated him and didn't perform for him
3. Coaches hated him and didn't perform for him and then left him
4. Somehow managed to be a worse recruiter than Bill
5. Lost secret notebook plan
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Purple pants
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Ok I started this thread to make me feel like things have improved, but honestly how many of these reasons still exist today? Most of them I fear.
Just how long can we keep using Prince as a scapegoat?
The only difference between Prince and Snyder at this point is that the shirt tucks like Snyder. That's it.
Prince's 73-31 loss to a 5-7 Nebraska team was worse than last night. Fact.
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Prince's 73-31 loss to a 5-7 Nebraska team was worse than last night. Fact.
:party: :woot: :party:
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Ok I started this thread to make me feel like things have improved, but honestly how many of these reasons still exist today? Most of them I fear.
Just how long can we keep using Prince as a scapegoat?
The only difference between Prince and Snyder at this point is that the shirt tucks like Snyder. That's it.
Prince's 73-31 loss to a 5-7 Nebraska team was worse than last night. Fact.
This is the big tard talking point/moral victory today.
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Ok I started this thread to make me feel like things have improved, but honestly how many of these reasons still exist today? Most of them I fear.
Just how long can we keep using Prince as a scapegoat?
The only difference between Prince and Snyder at this point is that the shirt tucks like Snyder. That's it.
Prince's 73-31 loss to a 5-7 Nebraska team was worse than last night. Fact.
This is the big tard talking point/moral victory today.
And here I was thinking that it might mean we were marginally better under Snyder -- thus a "difference." :dunno:
(Haven't seen or heard any tard talking points this morning, so I'm proud to have come up with this tard talking point on my own.)
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Prince couldn't recruit.
Like it or not, Snyder and WRSOAT is actually pulling in a "decent" 'cruiting class.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
Smith, the Browns, Harper. None of these guys would be here. None.
Really, this is a dumb thread. Really dumb. Dis Snyder all you want, but this is dumb.
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Ok I started this thread to make me feel like things have improved, but honestly how many of these reasons still exist today? Most of them I fear.
Just how long can we keep using Prince as a scapegoat?
The only difference between Prince and Snyder at this point is that the shirt tucks like Snyder. That's it.
Prince's 73-31 loss to a 5-7 Nebraska team was worse than last night. Fact.
This is the big tard talking point/moral victory today.
And here I was thinking that it might mean we were marginally better under Snyder -- thus a "difference." :dunno:
(Haven't seen or heard any tard talking points this morning, so I'm proud to have come up with this tard talking point on my own.)
The problem comes when you are justing looking at the total number of points allowed. Yes NU scored more points on that Prince team, but the tempo of that game was much higher (both Prince and Cal were uptempo). If you take into account tempo, this years game was worse defensively.
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I don't think there's any question that Prince was worse than Snyd's, for a number of reasons. One big one is how he burnt bridges in all local recruiting circles. Like others have said, Prince brought in youth on the coaching staff, but the good ones left and the ones that stayed only did so because no one else would want to hire them. Unfortunately, we may have a similar issue here with this staff. Koenning left, and the coordinator positions seem very average, both in playcalling and recruiting. Although recruiting is looking much better this year.
We all know that Snyder is not going to be a long-term solution (which is why I worry about no HCIW w/ similar schemes), but at least he's not burning bridges and completely wrecking the program the way Prince did.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
:lol:
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
Smith, the Browns, Harper. None of these guys would be here. None.
Really, this is a dumb thread. Really dumb. Dis Snyder all you want, but this is dumb.
I'll buy a ticket on this train.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
Point taken.
BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points. Not unusual though that this would be the case.
But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
Smith, the Browns, Harper. None of these guys would be here. None.
Really, this is a dumb thread. Really dumb. Dis Snyder all you want, but this is dumb.
The purpose is not to dis Snyder, but to access what has actually been improved. Of course I don't want Prince back, we have to look to see what problems still exist. KSU has been in a malaise since 2004 and it has been a pretty consistent malaise despite coaching changes.
A lot of the reasons people wanted Bill to step down in 2004 are still here.
A lot of the reasons people wanted Prince fired are still here.
To me that is the elephant in the room. Its been 6 years now of the same bad defense and poor recruiting.
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The Smith/Harper/Browns talk is only going to buy OB so much time, though.
Smith has been good, but now he's done for the year.
Harper hasn't done anything worthwhile.
There's no way of knowing if either Brown will do much, given their short history at other schools.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
Point taken.
BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points. Not unusual though that this would be the case.
But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
It is a completely legit point.
I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time. We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.
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Did you guys honestly think we would win this game?
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But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
It's legit if you want to say Snyder is better than Prince at something. But I don't think being a little better than Prince is a good enough reason for Snyder to be here earning $2 million a year.
I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time. We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.
Oooh, this is a good point.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
Point taken.
BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points. Not unusual though that this would be the case.
But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.
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Did you guys honestly think we would win this game?
No, but that's not the point.
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But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
It's legit if you want to say Snyder is better than Prince at something. But I don't think being a little better then Prince is a good enough reason for Snyder to be here earning $2 million a year.
I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time. We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.
Oooh, this is a good point.
The problem is I think "turn around a program" this time around is likely going to look like 8-4 bowl teams and not DOD type teams.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
Point taken.
BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points. Not unusual though that this would be the case.
But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.
Tuggle? Sams?
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But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
It's legit if you want to say Snyder is better than Prince at something. But I don't think being a little better then Prince is a good enough reason for Snyder to be here earning $2 million a year.
I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time. We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.
Oooh, this is a good point.
The problem is I think "turn around a program" this time around is likely going to look like 8-4 bowl teams and not DOD type teams.
I would be 100% satisfied with that. If we get that I am a happy man.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
Point taken.
BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points. Not unusual though that this would be the case.
But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.
Tuggle? Sams?
Sure, there's hope. But talking strictly in present tense, they're meaningless.
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Prince would be 2-3 with this schedule/personnel, maybe 3-2. Just sayin'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GwjfUFyY6M&ob=av2e
Point taken.
BTW, your meltdown has been good, but backed up with really good points. Not unusual though that this would be the case.
But you got to at least give me the Smith/Browns/Harper point is legit. I mean, those are some of our more talented guys.
Harper and Smith are legit, but they're rendered meaningless when the only way we can get them ball is on reverses and 5 yard roll outs.
Tuggle? Sams?
Sure, there's hope. But talking strictly in present tense, they're meaningless.
So what you are saying is that he is slowly getting players here that fits his scheme? :dunno:
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Michigan and OK... I get that you're not impressed with what Snyd's is doing. There may very well be some validity to that, some of which I'll readily admit. Just 2 things --
1. He's not as bad as you're making him out to be
2. Present a realistic scenario in which we either can hire someone better right now. And I don't mean pipe dreams. I mean realistic possibilities.
I guess from my vantage point, it could be a lot worse -- after the Prince debacle, going with a known quantity who would appease donors, provide stability, and re-open some bridges for local recruiting wasn't the worst decision we could have gone for. My worry is that what happens when Synd's retires again -- which is why I think it's absurd that there seems to be no roadmap by Snyd's or Currie in this regard.
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I am not 100% anti-Snyder2.0 yet because it seems like recruiting is on an uptic, but next year is put up or shut up time. We decided 2.5 years was long enough to get recruits and turn around a program.
Agreed, except for the fact that Prince's firing happened in large part because the team got progressively worse. I don't think that we've gotten worse at games/recruiting so far. But I would agree in so much that overall we need so see improvement next year over this year. That's realistic coming off a marginal season, and it simply holds Snyd's accountable for his most basic premise.
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1. He's not as bad as you're making him out to be.
No, he's exactly as bad as I'm making him out to be.
2. Present a realistic scenario in which we either can hire someone better right now. And I don't mean pipe dreams. I mean realistic possibilities.
Mike Leach is better, realistic and available right now. RIGHT THE eff NOW.
I guess from my vantage point, it could be a lot worse.
A lot worse would be difficult.
I guess from my vantage point, it could be a lot worse -- after the Prince debacle, going with a known quantity who would appease donors, provide stability, and re-open some bridges for local recruiting wasn't the worst decision we could have gone for.
Anyone can do those things. You don't have to be a "known quantity" to do everything you listed.
My worry is that what happens when Synd's retires again -- which is why I think it's absurd that there seems to be no roadmap by Snyd's or Currie in this regard.
That's exactly why you don't hire old men to be football coaches. If you have a "plan", you're telling kids you'll bail on them. If you don't, the other coaches will tell kids you'll bail on them.
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Anyone that says Leach isn't a possibility can STFU. You think that dude wouldn't love more to come right back to the Big 12 and stick it to Tech every year?
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micat doing what micat does best.
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Mike Leach is better, realistic and available right now. RIGHT THE foooock NOW.
Would you give Leach more than 2.5 years to build a "successful" program, if necessary? (Not necessarily opposed to the Leach idea, but just curious).
A lot worse would be difficult.
Agreed.
Anyone can do those things.
Really? Would have to disagree with that.
That's exactly why you don't hire old men to be football coaches. If you have a "plan", you're telling kids you'll bail on them. If you don't, the other coaches will tell kids you'll bail on them.
Definitely has the potential to be a problem, but not so sure it IS a problem. Also, I'm not saying we have to be all public with it, but it bothers me that there has been no indication of any plan.
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What I mean about having a plan in place could simply be this. Snyd's agrees that when an excellent coaching candidate is available, the university can gauge their interest, and if it looks like a go, Snyd's would be willing to step down. I'm disappointed that we're not pursuing something like this, and/or that Snyd's would never do something like this.
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If we could hire Leach. It would be exactly like that time Rusty was like "We need to hire Huggins. RIGHT NOW! He's just sitting there!!" and everyone was all like "We can't do that! We're K-State! We almost went .500 in league anyway."
And then :gocho:
It could happen again. I want it to happen so bad.
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What I mean about having a plan in place could simply be this. Snyd's agrees that when an excellent coaching candidate is available, the university can gauge their interest, and if it looks like a go, Snyd's would be willing to step down. I'm disappointed that we're not pursuing something like this, and/or that Snyd's would never do something like this.
eff that. We don't need to give Snyder options. When the time is right, change the locks.
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My chips are all in with Team Old Balls.
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If Ron hadn't tried to bang Raheems wife, they both still might be here.
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The problem is I think "turn around a program" this time around is likely going to look like 8-4 bowl teams and not DOD type teams.
I would be 100% satisfied with that. If we get that I am a happy man.
An 8-4 bowl team would be fantastic.
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If Ron hadn't tried to bang Raheems wife, they both still might be here.
thought it was the Manhattan native that left for AF
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Would love to see Klien slinging the ball around in Leach's offense. RIGHT THE eff NOW!!!
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I've actually been impressed with this recruiting class. Running the ball and defense is what makes a team consistently good. We're a couple LB's and safeties (And Coordinator) away from being decent, I think.
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Would you give Leach more than 2.5 years to build a "successful" program, if necessary? (Not necessarily opposed to the Leach idea, but just curious).
Yes, because he won't be 80 at the end of his 3rd season.