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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Football => Topic started by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 11:35:39 AM

Title: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 11:35:39 AM
A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different, other than the fact that all people involved at LSU won't get fired like they did at Baylor.

This is gross

https://twitter.com/USATODAY/status/1328293986721738754
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 11:39:38 AM
https://twitter.com/careschroeder/status/1328388147831582723
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 11:42:09 AM
https://twitter.com/brooklenmicah/status/1328358981157474305

https://twitter.com/karlicarpenter_/status/1328549459781947392
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: wetwillie on November 17, 2020, 11:46:49 AM
I’m good with burning that university to the ground as well
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: Trim on November 17, 2020, 11:54:12 AM
A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different

You already know the difference is that LSU isn't in our conference and didn't crush our national 'ship hopes one year.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 12:44:08 PM
A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different

You already know the difference is that LSU isn't in our conference and didn't crush our national 'ship hopes one year.

That's always what a lot of the outrage was about, but people were too scared to admit it.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: Institutional Control on November 17, 2020, 12:58:22 PM
I'm fine with Orgeron going to Italy to coach before finally settling into a west Louisiana high school coaching position.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 17, 2020, 01:21:26 PM
LSU should lose its football program, imo.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: michigancat on November 17, 2020, 01:26:55 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: wetwillie on November 17, 2020, 01:30:13 PM
I still remember Daris being super defensive about Kendall not getting punished for his fathers actions which I thought was strange but I was pretty much eff em ban em all at that point.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: star seed 7 on November 17, 2020, 01:36:52 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

This pretty much covers it for me.

Didn’t Baylor keep having problems even after everyone was fired?
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 01:43:47 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 01:46:46 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Didn’t Baylor keep having problems even after everyone was fired?

Do they still have an environment that doesn't take women's safety as seriously as they should? I dunno probably.

Did they have any publicized issues covering up rapes after they fired the AD, President, football coach, and cleaning out the title IX office? No, they did not.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 17, 2020, 01:53:18 PM
Baylor had a 2003 scandal as well, with basketball players killing one another, drugs, and coach cover ups. BTW, that documentary is on Showtime right now. Totally forgot about half that story.

But yes, if LSU is scum AF, ban them too. I don't think anyone started a thread about it, because it's an out of conference story.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 17, 2020, 01:57:58 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

It is a football problem, though. When an institution values football or any other activity above the safety and welfare of its students (or children in the case of Penn State), then that activity is a major problem and it needs to be eliminated. Baylor, Penn State, and LSU should not have football programs, and major conferences should want nothing to do with them. Without that sort of action, we can just expect to see this sort of behavior continue at other schools.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 02:22:27 PM
Baylor had a 2003 scandal as well, with basketball players killing one another, drugs, and coach cover ups. BTW, that documentary is on Showtime right now. Totally forgot about half that story.

But yes, if LSU is scum AF, ban them too. I don't think anyone started a thread about it, because it's an out of conference story.

Baylor didn't have a scandal with Dave Bliss. They found out what he did and immediately fired him.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 02:28:55 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

It is a football problem, though. When an institution values football or any other activity above the safety and welfare of its students (or children in the case of Penn State), then that activity is a major problem and it needs to be eliminated. Baylor, Penn State, and LSU should not have football programs, and major conferences should want nothing to do with them. Without that sort of action, we can just expect to see this sort of behavior continue at other schools.

In the case of Baylor and LSU football players contributed to a larger campus wide issue. Both had very high profile cases of women raped by non athletes but the universities didn't act to protect the women raped or other women on the campus. Football culture is in many cases, toxic at big schools, but dismissing this as a football issue gives a lot of people cover as someone else's issue. When football players are committing these crimes, it's usually a black man assaulting a white woman, and too a lot of people, that's dog bites man. The issue of these campuses not taking these assaults seriously is largely a factor of white men being allowed, unchecked, to violate women. Did you see the tweets I posted? The Student Body President has no say over athletics at LSU.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: Gooch on November 17, 2020, 02:52:13 PM
A lot of people on this board and around the Big 12 got real loud about Baylor, someone is going to need to tell me how this is different

You already know the difference is that LSU isn't in our conference and didn't crush our national 'ship hopes one year.

That's always what a lot of the outrage was about, but people were too scared to admit it.
link=topic=42384.msg2027665#msg2027665 date=1605641413]
I still remember Daris being super defensive about Kendall not getting punished for his fathers actions which I thought was strange but I was pretty much eff em ban em all at that point.
[/quote]
The finger taping is enough on its own for him to be cancelled.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: michigancat on November 17, 2020, 03:37:19 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

I mean Baylor was a pretty prolonged affair - the news first broke with Ukwuachu in August 2015 and Briles didn't get fired until May 2016. So there was a lot of time for it to brew. https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/15745248/line-events-rise-dismissal-baylor-bears-coach-art-briles

it's also kind of interesting to see the actual discussion ramp up starting in that August:

https://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=29421.225

I won't belabor this further but I don't disagree with anything you're saying about rape culture on American college campuses.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: ChiComCat on November 17, 2020, 03:49:52 PM
It took me a minute to get there but I'm seeing MIR's point.  There's certainly a racial component to it but I also think associating the issues with a football team makes it seem like there is a specific entity that can be held responsible which is comforting. 
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 04:36:07 PM
I honestly didn't know about it until this thread, MiR. I don't know why you're finger-wagging at everyone for not being outraged enough. IMO Coach O should be fired and/or there should be severe penalties to the University and program.

Because nearly the entirety of this fan base including many (most?) on this board was super indignant about Baylor. Didn't give two fucks about the victims, or the fact that the issue on Baylor is less reflective about that school and more reflective about colleges everywhere and our society, about how we view and treat women. Many still think that Baylor is some anomaly and should be kicked out of the Big 12. I've had this conversation on this site within the year.

I've gotten my ass dragged all over the midwest for five years, now I'm screaming in everyone's face who talked crap. What's more important is that everyone stop acting like this crap doesn't just happen at Baylor or Michigan State or Syracuse or Ohio State or Penn State. Or stop acting like it's just a football problem. Even USA Today are attaching articles talking about how the NCAA isn't punishing these schools, as if that's what we need to be focusing on.

I mean Baylor was a pretty prolonged affair - the news first broke with Ukwuachu in August 2015 and Briles didn't get fired until May 2016. So there was a lot of time for it to brew. https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/15745248/line-events-rise-dismissal-baylor-bears-coach-art-briles

it's also kind of interesting to see the actual discussion ramp up starting in that August:

https://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=29421.225

I won't belabor this further but I don't disagree with anything you're saying about rape culture on American college campuses.

FWIW, it looks like the LSU story has a similar timeframe. I understand not reading the story, it's very long, but they've contacted LSU and Coach O and wrote about this previously.

Louisiana has a very short statute of limitations with regard to charges of this nature, and it appears that they are just attempting to run out the clock.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 17, 2020, 04:49:03 PM
It took me a minute to get there but I'm seeing MIR's point.  There's certainly a racial component to it but I also think associating the issues with a football team makes it seem like there is a specific entity that can be held responsible which is comforting.

I just don't get the sense that universities go out of their way to cover up crimes of this nature when the offenders aren't athletes. There was no racial component to Jerry Sandusky raping boys in the showers at Penn State, and I also think the university probably would have cared at least a little bit about boys getting raped on their campus if the rapist wasn't one of their football coaches. Maybe I'm wrong about that, though.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: pissclams on November 17, 2020, 07:58:11 PM
i’m just here to defend lsu and condemn baylor, just like everyone else here because of course we didn’t care about the victims and only were mad because baylor beat us in a football game

this thread is a sanctimonious pile of dogshit
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: pissclams on November 17, 2020, 08:00:14 PM
a more politically correct way to say it would be, agree to disagree!
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 09:09:11 PM
It took me a minute to get there but I'm seeing MIR's point.  There's certainly a racial component to it but I also think associating the issues with a football team makes it seem like there is a specific entity that can be held responsible which is comforting.

I just don't get the sense that universities go out of their way to cover up crimes of this nature when the offenders aren't athletes.

Well documented cases at Baylor and LSU notwithstanding, it's been happening on a large scale since at least the 90's. The federal crime reporting laws had to be changed because schools were fudging stats to show that campuses only had one or two assaults a year, this was widespread, including at K-State, we on the black student union attempted more than once to get the K-State Police to release the actual numbers.

Instead of facing the problem head on and being proactive, schools would rather act as if they don't have predators walking around on their campuses, it's harder to recruit non student athletes, and to keep school donors happy if you say, "we have a problem with sexual assaults on this campus and we need to fix it." That's not an island a university president wants to be on.

There's plenty of research showing that schools still have little to no interest in fixing this.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/survey-finds-evidence-of-widespread-sexual-violence-at-33-universities/2019/10/14/bd75dcde-ee82-11e9-b648-76bcf86eb67e_story.html?outputType=amp

https://www.capitalgazette.com/news/ac-cn-cns-sexual-assaults-20190817-vocwixliuvanjotl3lx2dekz74-story.html?outputType=amp

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/01/why-the-prevalence-of-campus-sexual-assault-is-so-hard-to-quantify/427002/

I actually somewhat back what ChiComCat said, I actually have more promise that football programs can clean their house, before the larger universities. I believe most coaches aren't like Art Briles and apparently Coach O and will boot a football player who's proven to be a danger to the community.

Worth noting that the Department of Education, isn't helpful here
https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/2020/08/14/betsy-devoss-controversial-new-rule-campus-sexual-assault-goes-into-effect/
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 8manpick on November 17, 2020, 09:14:30 PM
We play Baylor 3 times a year in things I care about, and we play LSU never in my life. There are tons of things worth getting outraged about in the world, but you kinda have to pick and choose to fit it all in.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 09:17:17 PM
i’m just here to defend lsu and condemn baylor, just like everyone else here because of course we didn’t care about the victims and only were mad because baylor beat us in a football game

this thread is a sanctimonious pile of dogshit

You seem really mad, you good?
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2020, 09:23:29 PM
We play Baylor 3 times a year in things I care about, and we play LSU never in my life. There are tons of things worth getting outraged about in the world, but you kinda have to pick and choose to fit it all in.

I appreciate the candor. Don't tell pissclams, apparently pointing out all the sanctimony and finger wagging to Baylor was more about settling football scores and less about caring for the effected women, is a sanctimonious cross that must be bared. If we're not allowed to call this out, you can't be allowed to admit to doing it.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 18, 2020, 08:33:22 AM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.   






Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on November 18, 2020, 08:46:32 AM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.

at the risk of sounding like a "mind reader" i'm going to go out on a limb and say that carlton dotson's choice to commit murder was because he wanted to murder and not a product of the culture that had been created around him at baylor university.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 18, 2020, 08:51:22 AM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.

at the risk of sounding like a "mind reader" i'm going to go out on a limb and say that carlton dotson's choice to commit murder was because he wanted to murder and not a product of the culture that had been created around him at baylor university.

That's true and I should amend that to being a school that as I recall enabled a basketball coach to try and cover it up.

Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 10:55:14 AM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.

at the risk of sounding like a "mind reader" i'm going to go out on a limb and say that carlton dotson's choice to commit murder was because he wanted to murder and not a product of the culture that had been created around him at baylor university.

That's true and I should amend that to being a school that as I recall enabled a basketball coach to try and cover it up.

That's 1000% false. Bliss was fired the week the allegations were made. They even fired the athletic director who, to this day, has never been implicated in wrongdoing.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 18, 2020, 11:06:55 AM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.

at the risk of sounding like a "mind reader" i'm going to go out on a limb and say that carlton dotson's choice to commit murder was because he wanted to murder and not a product of the culture that had been created around him at baylor university.

That's true and I should amend that to being a school that as I recall enabled a basketball coach to try and cover it up.

That's 1000% false. Bliss was fired the week the allegations were made. They even fired the athletic director who, to this day, has never been implicated in wrongdoing.

That doesn't mean crap.  You had a basketball coach who felt he was at a place he could go away with the cover-up.

Using factual history as our guide, he had ample reason to believe that given the culture that we now know with 1000% certainty existed within the hierarchy of oversight at the university.

Your OP and entire (typical) performance in this thread has been :lol: :lol: bullshit (as usual)





Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 11:48:20 AM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.

at the risk of sounding like a "mind reader" i'm going to go out on a limb and say that carlton dotson's choice to commit murder was because he wanted to murder and not a product of the culture that had been created around him at baylor university.

That's true and I should amend that to being a school that as I recall enabled a basketball coach to try and cover it up.

That's 1000% false. Bliss was fired the week the allegations were made. They even fired the athletic director who, to this day, has never been implicated in wrongdoing.

That doesn't mean crap.  You had a basketball coach who felt he was at a place he could go away with the cover-up.

Using factual history as our guide, he had ample reason to believe that given the culture that we now know with 1000% certainty existed within the hierarchy of oversight at the university.

Your OP and entire (typical) performance in this thread has been :lol: :lol: bullshit (as usual)

Just to be clear here, you stated that Baylor created an environment that allowed Carlton Dotson to murder Patrick Dennehy and enabled Dave Bliss to cover up said murder. That is unquestionably and verifiably false. Then you spoke to his state of mind, which obviously trying to go back 17 years ago to read the mind of someone we knew little to nothing about, is silly at best.

I don't care what you think about my entire (typical) "performance," but your entire argument with tying what Bliss did to the Baylor administration is based on a couple of straight mistruths, then supported by an opinion that is essentially a fairy tale.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: michigancat on November 18, 2020, 12:28:50 PM
We play Baylor 3 times a year in things I care about, and we play LSU never in my life. There are tons of things worth getting outraged about in the world, but you kinda have to pick and choose to fit it all in.

I appreciate the candor. Don't tell pissclams, apparently pointing out all the sanctimony and finger wagging to Baylor was more about settling football scores and less about caring for the effected women, is a sanctimonious cross that must be bared. If we're not allowed to call this out, you can't be allowed to admit to doing it.

MiR there are women abused throughout society all over the world, yet you aren't here posting about it every day, just when LSU has a scandal. I wonder why? Maybe because this is a discussion forum centered on college athletics? In particular, a college athletics program in the Big 12?
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 18, 2020, 01:01:08 PM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.

at the risk of sounding like a "mind reader" i'm going to go out on a limb and say that carlton dotson's choice to commit murder was because he wanted to murder and not a product of the culture that had been created around him at baylor university.

That's true and I should amend that to being a school that as I recall enabled a basketball coach to try and cover it up.

That's 1000% false. Bliss was fired the week the allegations were made. They even fired the athletic director who, to this day, has never been implicated in wrongdoing.

That doesn't mean crap.  You had a basketball coach who felt he was at a place he could go away with the cover-up.

Using factual history as our guide, he had ample reason to believe that given the culture that we now know with 1000% certainty existed within the hierarchy of oversight at the university.

Your OP and entire (typical) performance in this thread has been :lol: :lol: bullshit (as usual)

Just to be clear here, you stated that Baylor created an environment that allowed Carlton Dotson to murder Patrick Dennehy and enabled Dave Bliss to cover up said murder. That is unquestionably and verifiably false. Then you spoke to his state of mind, which obviously trying to go back 17 years ago to read the mind of someone we knew little to nothing about, is silly at best.

I don't care what you think about my entire (typical) "performance," but your entire argument with tying what Bliss did to the Baylor administration is based on a couple of straight mistruths, then supported by an opinion that is essentially a fairy tale.

Thanks for your opinion, but I have viewed Baylor as a corruption enabling culture hiding behind their perverted Christian values . . . for decades.   In my viewpoint, Dave Bliss absolutely felt as though he could make it through to the other side precisely because of that institutions long history of hiding behind their private religious school veil.   
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 01:07:51 PM
We play Baylor 3 times a year in things I care about, and we play LSU never in my life. There are tons of things worth getting outraged about in the world, but you kinda have to pick and choose to fit it all in.

I appreciate the candor. Don't tell pissclams, apparently pointing out all the sanctimony and finger wagging to Baylor was more about settling football scores and less about caring for the effected women, is a sanctimonious cross that must be bared. If we're not allowed to call this out, you can't be allowed to admit to doing it.

MiR there are women abused throughout society all over the world, yet you aren't here posting about it every day, just when LSU has a scandal. I wonder why? Maybe because this is a discussion forum centered on college athletics? In particular, a college athletics program in the Big 12?

Maybe I'm being inarticulate, although trim seemed to get the point. I think we agree here. Whenever this is discussed as it relates to Baylor people act like it's a Baylor issue and not a societal one, my only point is that it's not a Baylor problem and "kicking them out" won't solve a damn thing other than to make some people feel as if it was some retribution of a Saturday November night nearly a decade ago. There's still a substantial amount of people who think that Baylor represented some one off and are in need of a punishment.

As far as the sports angle goes, the only thing that makes what happened at Baylor more significant here than what's currently happening to the defending national champion is November 17, 2012. It's cool that now everyone seems to be comfortable with this fact, it's never been the case the several times this has come up before.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 01:09:49 PM
Please post below if your outrage and disgust with the culture at Baylor university was derived entirely and exclusively by their beatdown of K-State in 2012.

Also, please confirm that your disgust with Baylor was derived from a purely sanctimonious, dare I say finger pointing perspective. Not by the fact that Baylor was one of, if not the most egregious mishandlings of sexual assault, sexual predation, systemic misogyny, outright abuse and institution wide corruption ever witnessed in the history of U.S. higher education and athletics.  Not to mention a university that created a culture that enabled an environment where people were . . . murdered.  On top of being a university that completely and quite clearly disavowed the entirety of the values in which they supposedly espouse/adhere and (allegedly) serve as the bedrock of their institution in order to protect their football team and athletic department.

I ask that you also confirm that your disgust with Baylor precludes you from being engaged in, aware of, and not the least bit concerned about similar activities at K-State or any other institution of higher learning.

at the risk of sounding like a "mind reader" i'm going to go out on a limb and say that carlton dotson's choice to commit murder was because he wanted to murder and not a product of the culture that had been created around him at baylor university.

That's true and I should amend that to being a school that as I recall enabled a basketball coach to try and cover it up.

That's 1000% false. Bliss was fired the week the allegations were made. They even fired the athletic director who, to this day, has never been implicated in wrongdoing.

That doesn't mean crap.  You had a basketball coach who felt he was at a place he could go away with the cover-up.

Using factual history as our guide, he had ample reason to believe that given the culture that we now know with 1000% certainty existed within the hierarchy of oversight at the university.

Your OP and entire (typical) performance in this thread has been :lol: :lol: bullshit (as usual)

Just to be clear here, you stated that Baylor created an environment that allowed Carlton Dotson to murder Patrick Dennehy and enabled Dave Bliss to cover up said murder. That is unquestionably and verifiably false. Then you spoke to his state of mind, which obviously trying to go back 17 years ago to read the mind of someone we knew little to nothing about, is silly at best.

I don't care what you think about my entire (typical) "performance," but your entire argument with tying what Bliss did to the Baylor administration is based on a couple of straight mistruths, then supported by an opinion that is essentially a fairy tale.

Thanks for your opinion, but I have viewed Baylor as a corruption enabling culture hiding behind their perverted Christian values . . . for decades.   In my viewpoint, Dave Bliss absolutely felt as though he could make it through to the other side precisely because of that institutions long history of hiding behind their private religious school veil.   

If it's not presented as a fact I have no problem with this opinion, I don't know enough to even rebut its merits.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 8manpick on November 18, 2020, 01:20:30 PM
We play Baylor 3 times a year in things I care about, and we play LSU never in my life. There are tons of things worth getting outraged about in the world, but you kinda have to pick and choose to fit it all in.

I appreciate the candor. Don't tell pissclams, apparently pointing out all the sanctimony and finger wagging to Baylor was more about settling football scores and less about caring for the effected women, is a sanctimonious cross that must be bared. If we're not allowed to call this out, you can't be allowed to admit to doing it.

MiR there are women abused throughout society all over the world, yet you aren't here posting about it every day, just when LSU has a scandal. I wonder why? Maybe because this is a discussion forum centered on college athletics? In particular, a college athletics program in the Big 12?

Maybe I'm being inarticulate, although trim seemed to get the point. I think we agree here. Whenever this is discussed as it relates to Baylor people act like it's a Baylor issue and not a societal one, my only point is that it's not a Baylor problem and "kicking them out" won't solve a damn thing other than to make some people feel as if it was some retribution of a Saturday November night nearly a decade ago. There's still a substantial amount of people who think that Baylor represented some one off and are in need of a punishment.

As far as the sports angle goes, the only thing that makes what happened at Baylor more significant here than what's currently happening to the defending national champion is November 17, 2012. It's cool that now everyone seems to be comfortable with this fact, it's never been the case the several times this has come up before.
This was also a sports BBS back then
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 18, 2020, 01:36:13 PM
I don't know why you're upset we'd give an in conference opponent the business, for a lifetime of "WTF's?!" and more attention vs another corrupt school down the road in a different conference. They should all rot in hell. Good point.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: michigancat on November 18, 2020, 01:36:44 PM
We play Baylor 3 times a year in things I care about, and we play LSU never in my life. There are tons of things worth getting outraged about in the world, but you kinda have to pick and choose to fit it all in.

I appreciate the candor. Don't tell pissclams, apparently pointing out all the sanctimony and finger wagging to Baylor was more about settling football scores and less about caring for the effected women, is a sanctimonious cross that must be bared. If we're not allowed to call this out, you can't be allowed to admit to doing it.

MiR there are women abused throughout society all over the world, yet you aren't here posting about it every day, just when LSU has a scandal. I wonder why? Maybe because this is a discussion forum centered on college athletics? In particular, a college athletics program in the Big 12?

Maybe I'm being inarticulate, although trim seemed to get the point. I think we agree here. Whenever this is discussed as it relates to Baylor people act like it's a Baylor issue and not a societal one, my only point is that it's not a Baylor problem and "kicking them out" won't solve a damn thing other than to make some people feel as if it was some retribution of a Saturday November night nearly a decade ago. There's still a substantial amount of people who think that Baylor represented some one off and are in need of a punishment.

As far as the sports angle goes, the only thing that makes what happened at Baylor more significant here than what's currently happening to the defending national champion is November 17, 2012. It's cool that now everyone seems to be comfortable with this fact, it's never been the case the several times this has come up before.

It's absolutely because they're in our conference/closer to our orbit and therefore more likely to be discussed, regardless of one game. Just like a college football scandal is more likely to be discussed than an NBA one. Or a sports scandal is more likely to be discussed than a corporate scandal. You get the idea.

Also I don't think anyone reading this thread today thinks campus rape culture is/was purely a Baylor thing.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 18, 2020, 01:40:56 PM
Weird thread
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: star seed 7 on November 18, 2020, 01:47:07 PM
Personally, a football game in 2012 has no bearing on my feelings about kicking Baylor out of the conference.

Mir, you make some good points otherwise, but that part is semi-offensive that you assume people who disagree with you only care about a game instead of victims.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 18, 2020, 01:50:47 PM
Is ESPN not blowing this story up? If not maybe you should contact them
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 18, 2020, 01:50:56 PM
Personally, a football game in 2012 has no bearing on my feelings about kicking Baylor out of the conference.

Mir, you make some good points otherwise, but that part is semi-offensive that you assume people who disagree with you only care about a game instead of victims.
This. I haven't thought twice about 2012 in like a long time. '98 lives in my dome 24/7/365. They haven't carried themselves well for awhile in this conference. We're going to make fun of them, just like we do every other school in the Big 12. eff'em!

Also, my Baylor hatred started more when they started landing top 10 classes out of nowhere in bball, in the middle of nowhere. That's when I really started thinking "WTF?!" to myself.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: waks on November 18, 2020, 01:54:30 PM
I actually somewhat back what ChiComCat said, I actually have more promise that football programs can clean their house, before the larger universities. I believe most coaches aren't like Art Briles and apparently Coach O and will boot a football player who's proven to be a danger to the community.
I was merely 13 at the time so I admittedly do not remember all of the details but were you outraged at LHC Bill Snyder when he let an accused Ell Roberson play in the Fiesta Bowl? Wasn't Bill's explanation for letting him play something to the effect of the whole team shouldn't be punished for an individual's actions? I am admittedly stirring the pot here but it seems relevant.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 18, 2020, 01:57:43 PM
Baylor released emails where administrators described the victims as "perverted tarts" and wanted to expel them for violating school policy.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: pissclams on November 18, 2020, 02:01:49 PM
i’m just here to defend lsu and condemn baylor, just like everyone else here because of course we didn’t care about the victims and only were mad because baylor beat us in a football game

this thread is a sanctimonious pile of dogshit

You seem really mad, you good?
that's not really mad or mad
what did i type that allowed you to conclude that? 

i'm sure when you constructed this thread in your mind, it seemed like a better idea than how it came across to many of us though
which is fine, happens in the life of a pro-bbs'r
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 04:52:23 PM

Also I don't think anyone reading this thread today thinks campus rape culture is/was purely a Baylor thing.


Mir, you make some good points otherwise, but that part is semi-offensive that you assume people who disagree with you only care about a game instead of victims.

I mean the threads are still there, it's not like I'm making this up, there was plenty of "only at Baylor and Penn State" talk going on.

Siete, it's has nothing to do with who agrees with me or doesn't, and your summation is an oversimplification. There are people on this very page who have said that they cared more about Baylor than what happened at LSU. That doesn't make these people inherently bad, but it's an implication that rooting interests has infiltrated the conversation about violence against women on campus, and while this very well may be human nature, I think we can all agree that rooting interests have no place in these conversations.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 04:57:54 PM
I actually somewhat back what ChiComCat said, I actually have more promise that football programs can clean their house, before the larger universities. I believe most coaches aren't like Art Briles and apparently Coach O and will boot a football player who's proven to be a danger to the community.
I was merely 13 at the time so I admittedly do not remember all of the details but were you outraged at LHC Bill Snyder when he let an accused Ell Roberson play in the Fiesta Bowl? Wasn't Bill's explanation for letting him play something to the effect of the whole team shouldn't be punished for an individual's actions? I am admittedly stirring the pot here but it seems relevant.

I don't remember how I felt about Ell playing at the time, everything happened so fast. I do know that he was suspended for a curfew violation and not related to the rape accusation. He also was legally cleared very quickly, like two days after the accusation if I remember correctly.

You didn't ask but what Bill did to Ell after they got back to Manhattan was disgusting and it should have been a fireable offense. He let western kansas hicks make a decision for him that could have ruined Ell's life, thankfully it didn't.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 8manpick on November 18, 2020, 04:59:35 PM

Also I don't think anyone reading this thread today thinks campus rape culture is/was purely a Baylor thing.


Mir, you make some good points otherwise, but that part is semi-offensive that you assume people who disagree with you only care about a game instead of victims.

I mean the threads are still there, it's not like I'm making this up, there was plenty of "only at Baylor and Penn State" talk going on.

Siete, it's has nothing to do with who agrees with me or doesn't, and your summation is an oversimplification. There are people on this very page who have said that they cared more about Baylor than what happened at LSU. That doesn't make these people inherently bad, but it's an implication that rooting interests has infiltrated the conversation about violence against women on campus, and while this very well may be human nature, I think we can all agree that rooting interests have no place in these conversations.
I guess by extension we should spend our whole time on this board talking about the Catholic Church or the Boy Scouts then? Those are far greater problems than the Baylor/Penn St/LSU issues. Rooting interests frame what we spend time and effort caring about, and I don’t think there is anything wrong with that.  If someone goes out of their way to say that Baylor’s violence against women is bad, and LSU’s is less bad, that is clearly dumb, but there isn’t a rule that we need to care equally.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 05:04:56 PM
i’m just here to defend lsu and condemn baylor, just like everyone else here because of course we didn’t care about the victims and only were mad because baylor beat us in a football game

this thread is a sanctimonious pile of dogshit

You seem really mad, you good?
that's not really mad or mad
what did i type that allowed you to conclude that? 

i'm sure when you constructed this thread in your mind, it seemed like a better idea than how it came across to many of us though
which is fine, happens in the life of a pro-bbs'r

My only regret about this thread is that I didn't bump posts from other people that illustrated my point, but honestly it wasn't necessary and the overall sentiment that we're more comfortable dragging a conference foe, for whatever reason, is more important. I don't care that some people are offended or annoyed or whatever.

I've certainly said some mumped up things on this board including using the R word. If someone pointed it out, then it's whatever, being criticised for what I say isn't going to bother me in the least.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 05:09:52 PM

Also I don't think anyone reading this thread today thinks campus rape culture is/was purely a Baylor thing.


Mir, you make some good points otherwise, but that part is semi-offensive that you assume people who disagree with you only care about a game instead of victims.

I mean the threads are still there, it's not like I'm making this up, there was plenty of "only at Baylor and Penn State" talk going on.

Siete, it's has nothing to do with who agrees with me or doesn't, and your summation is an oversimplification. There are people on this very page who have said that they cared more about Baylor than what happened at LSU. That doesn't make these people inherently bad, but it's an implication that rooting interests has infiltrated the conversation about violence against women on campus, and while this very well may be human nature, I think we can all agree that rooting interests have no place in these conversations.
I guess by extension we should spend our whole time on this board talking about the Catholic Church or the Boy Scouts then? Those are far greater problems than the Baylor/Penn St/LSU issues. Rooting interests frame what we spend time and effort caring about, and I don’t think there is anything wrong with that.  If someone goes out of their way to say that Baylor’s violence against women is bad, and LSU’s is less bad, that is clearly dumb, but there isn’t a rule that we need to care equally.

You're 100% right about that, you don't have to care equally, it's not up to me or anyone else to determine how much someone should care about something.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 8manpick on November 18, 2020, 05:17:35 PM
I guess maybe I’m missing your point entirely then. It seems like you’ve said we do need to care just as much about LSU as we did about Baylor?  I’m saying that the rooting interests do (rightfully) have a part in the conversation.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 18, 2020, 08:35:21 PM
@MIR, we honestly have no clue where this is coming from. Help us! Also, who did you know in the 2003 program to negate bliss, as a side piece to the Baylor program problem that year?
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 18, 2020, 08:41:51 PM
Also, go get me a login and password over at a LSU forum and I’ll bug the crap out of them tonight vs gE. Everybody wins. Report back ASAP. Make my username: wetwille, password: Swampass69
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: wetwillie on November 18, 2020, 08:53:25 PM
You son of a bitch
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 18, 2020, 08:56:50 PM
 :lol: ;)
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2020, 09:44:46 PM
I guess maybe I’m missing your point entirely then. It seems like you’ve said we do need to care just as much about LSU as we did about Baylor?  I’m saying that the rooting interests do (rightfully) have a part in the conversation.

I do think everyone should care as much, whether it's at Baylor, LSU, or San Jose State. it's not my place to tell you to do so, I'm not your father. When I said earlier that I appreciate your candor, I meant it. I think that thought process is wrong and horribly flawed, but that doesn't make you a bad person or anything. I do think it's a lack of perspective IMO, but you are certainly entitled to your thoughts and I really appreciate you being honest about it.

I do think it's funny you have more than once expressed that you do take your rooting interests into account when discussing these things and like two or three posts later people are telling me that no one does this.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 18, 2020, 10:31:44 PM
 :facepalm:
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: pissclams on November 18, 2020, 10:33:11 PM
i’m just here to defend lsu and condemn baylor, just like everyone else here because of course we didn’t care about the victims and only were mad because baylor beat us in a football game

this thread is a sanctimonious pile of dogshit

You seem really mad, you good?
that's not really mad or mad
what did i type that allowed you to conclude that? 

i'm sure when you constructed this thread in your mind, it seemed like a better idea than how it came across to many of us though
which is fine, happens in the life of a pro-bbs'r

My only regret about this thread is that I didn't bump posts from other people that illustrated my point, but honestly it wasn't necessary and the overall sentiment that we're more comfortable dragging a conference foe, for whatever reason, is more important. I don't care that some people are offended or annoyed or whatever.

I've certainly said some mumped up things on this board including using the R word. If someone pointed it out, then it's whatever, being criticised for what I say isn't going to bother me in the least.
that’s fair and I’m not at all upset by this thread.
i do think it is consistent with your take all along on the baylor issue regardless of how wrong I think that you are on it.  but definitely no reason to be mad. 
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: 8manpick on November 18, 2020, 10:45:13 PM
I guess maybe I’m missing your point entirely then. It seems like you’ve said we do need to care just as much about LSU as we did about Baylor?  I’m saying that the rooting interests do (rightfully) have a part in the conversation.

I do think everyone should care as much, whether it's at Baylor, LSU, or San Jose State. it's not my place to tell you to do so, I'm not your father. When I said earlier that I appreciate your candor, I meant it. I think that thought process is wrong and horribly flawed, but that doesn't make you a bad person or anything. I do think it's a lack of perspective IMO, but you are certainly entitled to your thoughts and I really appreciate you being honest about it.

I do think it's funny you have more than once expressed that you do take your rooting interests into account when discussing these things and like two or three posts later people are telling me that no one does this.
I’m genuinely interested in this now, and I think my point is more nuanced than I’ve successfully conveyed thus far. I would honestly like to hear more of your view on this, if I come off as sarcastic it isn’t intended, and I blame bourbon.

I think that regardless of the location, violence against women, and the institutional coverup thereof. at any school (or non-school) is equally abhorrent. That would seemingly go without saying.  I think we may be missing each other on the distinction of caring something is happening vs wanting to discuss it on gE.

I am much more interested in discussing it when it is happening in a sports program we play multiple times a year.  If it was happening in the English dept at BC, I’d think that it was terrible, but probably wouldn’t spend much time BBSing about it.  If we want to discuss large scale societal problems, I think there is a limited utility in pointing towards singular points of incidence anyway. In a pseudo-parallel, does it really matter on the grand scale if we talk a ton about Sandy Hook and Columbine, but not X school shooting? 

Are we obligated to be express our outrage about all injustice in the universe, no matter how adjacent to our own lives?
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 19, 2020, 12:10:31 AM
i’m just here to defend lsu and condemn baylor, just like everyone else here because of course we didn’t care about the victims and only were mad because baylor beat us in a football game

this thread is a sanctimonious pile of dogshit

You seem really mad, you good?
that's not really mad or mad
what did i type that allowed you to conclude that? 

i'm sure when you constructed this thread in your mind, it seemed like a better idea than how it came across to many of us though
which is fine, happens in the life of a pro-bbs'r

My only regret about this thread is that I didn't bump posts from other people that illustrated my point, but honestly it wasn't necessary and the overall sentiment that we're more comfortable dragging a conference foe, for whatever reason, is more important. I don't care that some people are offended or annoyed or whatever.

I've certainly said some mumped up things on this board including using the R word. If someone pointed it out, then it's whatever, being criticised for what I say isn't going to bother me in the least.
that’s fair and I’m not at all upset by this thread.
i do think it is consistent with your take all along on the baylor issue regardless of how wrong I think that you are on it.  but definitely no reason to be mad.

 :cheers:
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 19, 2020, 12:45:59 AM
I guess maybe I’m missing your point entirely then. It seems like you’ve said we do need to care just as much about LSU as we did about Baylor?  I’m saying that the rooting interests do (rightfully) have a part in the conversation.

I do think everyone should care as much, whether it's at Baylor, LSU, or San Jose State. it's not my place to tell you to do so, I'm not your father. When I said earlier that I appreciate your candor, I meant it. I think that thought process is wrong and horribly flawed, but that doesn't make you a bad person or anything. I do think it's a lack of perspective IMO, but you are certainly entitled to your thoughts and I really appreciate you being honest about it.

I do think it's funny you have more than once expressed that you do take your rooting interests into account when discussing these things and like two or three posts later people are telling me that no one does this.
I’m genuinely interested in this now, and I think my point is more nuanced than I’ve successfully conveyed thus far. I would honestly like to hear more of your view on this, if I come off as sarcastic it isn’t intended, and I blame bourbon.

I think that regardless of the location, violence against women, and the institutional coverup thereof. at any school (or non-school) is equally abhorrent. That would seemingly go without saying.  I think we may be missing each other on the distinction of caring something is happening vs wanting to discuss it on gE.

I am much more interested in discussing it when it is happening in a sports program we play multiple times a year.  If it was happening in the English dept at BC, I’d think that it was terrible, but probably wouldn’t spend much time BBSing about it.  If we want to discuss large scale societal problems, I think there is a limited utility in pointing towards singular points of incidence anyway. In a pseudo-parallel, does it really matter on the grand scale if we talk a ton about Sandy Hook and Columbine, but not X school shooting? 

Are we obligated to be express our outrage about all injustice in the universe, no matter how adjacent to our own lives?

I think we may have reached the point where the forum in which this conversation doesn't allow for the nuance we need for this conversation, that was definitely a miscalculation on my part, but let's keep trying.

I think possibly we agree more than we disagree, a large jumping off point though is the newsworthiness to this and most college football fan bases. This isn't a D3 school in Virginia, it's the defending national champions. One of the accused was the best defensive player on that team and won the Thorpe Award. Ultimately my issue with how we viewed Baylor is not that people didn't care about the victims, but for a lot of people the story was about that this was substantial enough for Art Briles (name autocorrects to crimes) to no longer be kicking our asses, for many people the victims, the crimes, and learning from what happened was tertiary at best.

Of course there will be variance to how much one would care about victims and the crime based on proximity, sports or otherwise. I guess I'm glad that now five years later the conversation has moved beyond Art Briles bad.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: michigancat on November 20, 2020, 10:23:42 AM
I will say I think the national CFB media isn't giving it the attention it deserves. I really only follow national CFB news via twitter and there isn't the amount of chatter compared to what you might see from everyone watching #PXIIAfterDark
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 20, 2020, 12:54:08 PM
I think a lot of that is outside of Yahoo, a lot of sports investigative media departments have been shuttered. Without the army of investigative reporters at ESPN, the Baylor and Michigan State stories don't get the publicity they did. The Ohio State wrestling story was also fairly quiet.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: michigancat on November 20, 2020, 05:29:42 PM
I think a lot of that is outside of Yahoo, a lot of sports investigative media departments have been shuttered. Without the army of investigative reporters at ESPN, the Baylor and Michigan State stories don't get the publicity they did. The Ohio State wrestling story was also fairly quiet.

I think it goes beyond that, like I didn't see anything discussing it from folks like Spencer Hall and Richard Johnson which was disappointing. maybe they discussed it on their SECTV show but nothing on twitter. Plenty of tweets about Muschamp though.
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: MakeItRain on November 20, 2020, 07:24:42 PM
I think a lot of that is outside of Yahoo, a lot of sports investigative media departments have been shuttered. Without the army of investigative reporters at ESPN, the Baylor and Michigan State stories don't get the publicity they did. The Ohio State wrestling story was also fairly quiet.

I think it goes beyond that, like I didn't see anything discussing it from folks like Spencer Hall and Richard Johnson which was disappointing it. maybe they discussed it on their SECTV show but nothing on twitter. Plenty of tweets about Muschamp though.

No chance
Title: Re: So...LSU
Post by: wetwillie on November 20, 2020, 10:23:50 PM
So they are going to get away with it huh