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General Discussion => The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit => Topic started by: sonofdaxjones on August 21, 2014, 08:24:46 AM
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just a shade under 110 million people in the US on at least one type of means tested social welfare program.
Right around 50% of the population on some sort of government aid.
Another large group of people flowing into the US are or will be placed on some type of government social welfare program.
Overload and implode.
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Right around 50% of the population on some sort of government aid.
That figure seems ridiculously low. Source?
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The next generations are so completely utterly mumped it's beyond our current comprehension.
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Right around 50% of the population on some sort of government aid.
That figure seems ridiculously low. Source?
2012 Census
That number has likely surpassed 50%.
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I wonder how they define "government aid".
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I wonder how they define "government aid".
Welfare, Veterans Benefits, Medicaid/Medicare, Social Security, WIC, SSI, TAFNF etc. etc.
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I wonder how they define "government aid".
Welfare, Veterans Benefits, Medicaid/Medicare, Social Security, WIC, SSI, TAFNF etc. etc.
Oh, so it's only counting government aid to poor folks. I guess that makes sense.
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Well cRusty you'll have to rail against government largess to corporations and such in another thread.
You might start with the corporations that his administration excused from Obama Care and work your way from there.
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That seems like a lot of work, I was hoping you'd do it for me with a link.
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That seems like a lot of work, I was hoping you'd do it for me with a link.
I admire you for doing what most progressive liberal types on this board do quite well, that is: Deflect, re-direct and obfuscate.
Now, back to the topic at hand. More people taking (by millions) than people producing what's going to be taken, with millions more likely to be added to the takers by the stroke of the executive pen.
A sustainable path cRusty? Only resolved by more taxes?
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I think a good step toward sustainability would be to eliminate many of the different aid programs and just give cash to those that need it. You could eliminate crazy amounts of bureaucracy that way.
Also fix the public education system in poor communities. Not real sure the best way to do this.
What are your ideas?
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good thing obama as actively working to decrease the size of our military. that will help to not add to the already over 10 million retired vets receiving benefits. :cheers:
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So 38 million people of that (1/3) is social security retirement. Is paying them a problem? They paid into it...
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I think a good step toward sustainability would be to eliminate many of the different aid programs and just give cash to those that need it. You could eliminate crazy amounts of bureaucracy that way.
Also fix the public education system in poor communities. Not real sure the best way to do this.
What are your ideas?
It might help answer the "how to fix public education system in poor communities" question if you state the problem. Why can't these poor kids be taught and retain information?
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Ever declining labor participation rate too tho
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I think a good step toward sustainability would be to eliminate many of the different aid programs and just give cash to those that need it. You could eliminate crazy amounts of bureaucracy that way.
Also fix the public education system in poor communities. Not real sure the best way to do this.
What are your ideas?
It might help answer the "how to fix public education system in poor communities" question if you state the problem. Why can't these poor kids be taught and retain information?
"State the problem"? I think there are tons of problems and it's an extremely complex, but overall our school system completely fails at preparing our poorest people for success in life. Do you disagree?
However, if you want to go into detail, here's a specific example of a "problem":
And in recent years, black boys have been about as likely to be shot to death as they are to graduate from high school college-ready.
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/how-oaklands-public-schools-are-fighting-save-black-boys
I don't know the solution, and have claim to know the solution. I do know that the teachers in poor districts are severely underpaid, and most of the best ones want to move to more affluent districts for better pay and perhaps an easier job. Maybe a start would be paying teachers in the Oakland school district, for example, double what they make now? (At least).
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Someone needs to tell wallstreet about this before my account overflows.
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I think a good step toward sustainability would be to eliminate many of the different aid programs and just give cash to those that need it. You could eliminate crazy amounts of bureaucracy that way.
Also fix the public education system in poor communities. Not real sure the best way to do this.
What are your ideas?
It might help answer the "how to fix public education system in poor communities" question if you state the problem. Why can't these poor kids be taught and retain information?
From talking with teachers that have taught in KCMO and KCK districts the biggest problem for a lot of kids is lack of support at home. I think one way to address that is smaller class sizes, meaning more teachers. Get the class size down to 10 or 12 kids giving teachers more time and opportunity with each student.
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I think a good step toward sustainability would be to eliminate many of the different aid programs and just give cash to those that need it. You could eliminate crazy amounts of bureaucracy that way.
Also fix the public education system in poor communities. Not real sure the best way to do this.
What are your ideas?
It might help answer the "how to fix public education system in poor communities" question if you state the problem. Why can't these poor kids be taught and retain information?
From talking with teachers that have taught in KCMO and KCK districts the biggest problem for a lot of kids is lack of support at home. I think one way to address that is smaller class sizes, meaning more teachers. Get the class size down to 10 or 12 kids giving teachers more time and opportunity with each student.
2. Smaller class sizes do not necessarily create an environment that’s more conducive to learning.
According to David and Goliath, 77% of Americans believe that it makes more sense to use taxpayer money to lower class sizes than to raise teachers’ salaries. Class size is such a galvanizing social issue that after the governor of California announced plans to reduce the state’s class size, his popularity doubled within three weeks. While larger class sizes are obviously an issue, Gladwell points out that we have become “obsessed with what is good about small classrooms and oblivious of what can also be good about large classes.” A classroom containing 18–24 students appears to be the ideal number. Anything less and you lose the unique excitement that comes from a critical mass of engaged students.
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/blog/5-more-incredibly-counterintuitive-statements-from-malcolm-gladwells-david-and-goliath/
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That book is a good read
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Unique excitement isn't really the phrase that comes to mind when I consider the majority of my fellow scholars in high school.
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That book is a good read
His worst effort, in my opinion.
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That book is a good read
His worst effort, in my opinion.
Yes but still
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I don't really trust anything Gladwell writes as fact. So many of the assertions he's presented in his books have been identified as bogus.
Although I do think it's more important to significantly increase teachers' salaries to make it a more enticing profession.
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I don't really trust anything Gladwell writes as fact. So many of the assertions he's presented in his books have been identified as bogus.
Although I do think it's more important to significantly increase teachers' salaries to make it a more enticing profession.
sure but i think there is something to this. all the rich countries just think lower class size but it isn't that easy and the money, like you said, would be better spent somewhere else.
i also think that people with non teaching degrees should be able to take a test and pass and then teach. we are severely limiting our pool of possible "good" teachers by saying they have to have a teaching degree.
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CA class sizes are approaching 40 tho aren't they? Cutting them in half would seem to hit the sweet spot
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i also think that people with non teaching degrees should be able to take a test and pass and then teach. we are severely limited our pool of possible "good" teachers by saying they have to have a teaching degree.
This.
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I don't really trust anything Gladwell writes as fact. So many of the assertions he's presented in his books have been identified as bogus.
Although I do think it's more important to significantly increase teachers' salaries to make it a more enticing profession.
sure but i think there is something to this. all the rich countries just think lower class size but it isn't that easy and the money, like you said, would be better spent somewhere else.
i also think that people with non teaching degrees should be able to take a test and pass and then teach. we are severely limited our pool of possible "good" teachers by saying they have to have a teaching degree.
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
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I don't really trust anything Gladwell writes as fact. So many of the assertions he's presented in his books have been identified as bogus.
Although I do think it's more important to significantly increase teachers' salaries to make it a more enticing profession.
sure but i think there is something to this. all the rich countries just think lower class size but it isn't that easy and the money, like you said, would be better spent somewhere else.
i also think that people with non teaching degrees should be able to take a test and pass and then teach. we are severely limited our pool of possible "good" teachers by saying they have to have a teaching degree.
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
Lol at you teaching in Kansas. You'd be fired for teaching evolution
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CA class sizes are approaching 40 tho aren't they? Cutting them in half would seem to hit the sweet spot
20 is probably ideal for older kids in districts that have somewhere close to a majority of students with supportive families. The schools full of young kids that are being sent school hungry in the same clothes day after day are in need of the smallest class sizes.
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I don't really trust anything Gladwell writes as fact. So many of the assertions he's presented in his books have been identified as bogus.
Although I do think it's more important to significantly increase teachers' salaries to make it a more enticing profession.
sure but i think there is something to this. all the rich countries just think lower class size but it isn't that easy and the money, like you said, would be better spent somewhere else.
i also think that people with non teaching degrees should be able to take a test and pass and then teach. we are severely limited our pool of possible "good" teachers by saying they have to have a teaching degree.
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
Kansas has this
http://www.ksde.org/Agency/DivisionofLearningServices/TeacherLicensureandAccreditation/Postsecondary/EducatorPreparation/RestrictedTeachingLicenseAlternativePathway.aspx (http://www.ksde.org/Agency/DivisionofLearningServices/TeacherLicensureandAccreditation/Postsecondary/EducatorPreparation/RestrictedTeachingLicenseAlternativePathway.aspx)
IIRC you have an engineering degree, so I think you would have zero issues becoming a math teacher
Eligibility-(Must meet all eligibility requirements)
A Bachelor’s degree or higher from a regionally accredited university,
The degree or equivalent coursework must be in a regular education content area you want to teach, OR be a heritage language speaker,
A GPA of 2.75 from the last 60 semester credits hours of college coursework completed,
A passing score for the Praxis II content assessment in the content area, AND
A supervised practical training experience must be completed under the collaboration of the supporting institution and hiring school district before restricted teaching license can be issued.
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I don't really trust anything Gladwell writes as fact. So many of the assertions he's presented in his books have been identified as bogus.
Although I do think it's more important to significantly increase teachers' salaries to make it a more enticing profession.
sure but i think there is something to this. all the rich countries just think lower class size but it isn't that easy and the money, like you said, would be better spent somewhere else.
i also think that people with non teaching degrees should be able to take a test and pass and then teach. we are severely limited our pool of possible "good" teachers by saying they have to have a teaching degree.
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
Kansas has this
http://www.ksde.org/Agency/DivisionofLearningServices/TeacherLicensureandAccreditation/Postsecondary/EducatorPreparation/RestrictedTeachingLicenseAlternativePathway.aspx (http://www.ksde.org/Agency/DivisionofLearningServices/TeacherLicensureandAccreditation/Postsecondary/EducatorPreparation/RestrictedTeachingLicenseAlternativePathway.aspx)
IIRC you have an engineering degree, so I think you would have zero issues becoming a math teacher
Eligibility-(Must meet all eligibility requirements)
A Bachelor’s degree or higher from a regionally accredited university,
The degree or equivalent coursework must be in a regular education content area you want to teach, OR be a heritage language speaker,
A GPA of 2.75 from the last 60 semester credits hours of college coursework completed,
A passing score for the Praxis II content assessment in the content area, AND
A supervised practical training experience must be completed under the collaboration of the supporting institution and hiring school district before restricted teaching license can be issued.
still the salary thing
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I don't really trust anything Gladwell writes as fact. So many of the assertions he's presented in his books have been identified as bogus.
Although I do think it's more important to significantly increase teachers' salaries to make it a more enticing profession.
sure but i think there is something to this. all the rich countries just think lower class size but it isn't that easy and the money, like you said, would be better spent somewhere else.
i also think that people with non teaching degrees should be able to take a test and pass and then teach. we are severely limited our pool of possible "good" teachers by saying they have to have a teaching degree.
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
Kansas has this
http://www.ksde.org/Agency/DivisionofLearningServices/TeacherLicensureandAccreditation/Postsecondary/EducatorPreparation/RestrictedTeachingLicenseAlternativePathway.aspx (http://www.ksde.org/Agency/DivisionofLearningServices/TeacherLicensureandAccreditation/Postsecondary/EducatorPreparation/RestrictedTeachingLicenseAlternativePathway.aspx)
IIRC you have an engineering degree, so I think you would have zero issues becoming a math teacher
Eligibility-(Must meet all eligibility requirements)
A Bachelor’s degree or higher from a regionally accredited university,
The degree or equivalent coursework must be in a regular education content area you want to teach, OR be a heritage language speaker,
A GPA of 2.75 from the last 60 semester credits hours of college coursework completed,
A passing score for the Praxis II content assessment in the content area, AND
A supervised practical training experience must be completed under the collaboration of the supporting institution and hiring school district before restricted teaching license can be issued.
still the salary thing
Don't you live in San Francisco? Need to adjust for the CoL between SF and KS, imho.
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man i can just picture kk and michigan carpooling to work swapping stories about planning hours and that johnson kid who told the asst principle to screw off during assembly last week. :love:
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good thing obama as actively working to decrease the size of our military. that will help to not add to the already over 10 million retired vets receiving benefits. :cheers:
I'm all for that, our military is way to big and the fear mongering about being unable to sustain a two front war (which still exists even after all these years) is absurd. One only need to watch the military channel for awhile and see on the various shows that our military industrial complex spending is ridiculous, with every sort of customized system for every branch of the military to meet every single contingency. Many of those contingencies are one's that we shouldn't even be in to begin with.
It's unnerving to me that four of the five wealthiest per capita counties in the US are the one's surrounding our nations capital. There's too many people living large off government largess and many of those people are in the military-industrial-intelligence complex.
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Don't you live in San Francisco? Need to adjust for the CoL between SF and KS, imho.
did you read my post you dweeb?
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
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Don't you live in San Francisco? Need to adjust better for the CoL between SF and KS, imho.
did you read my post you dweeb?
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
I think your numbers are off is what I'm saying.
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Don't you live in San Francisco? Need to adjust better for the CoL between SF and KS, imho.
did you read my post you dweeb?
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
I think your numbers are off is what I'm saying.
I was pretty friggin close for not calculating or looking anything up.
http://www.infoplease.com/business/economy/cost-living-index-us-cities.html
91.8 for wichita, 164.0 for SF. So instead of 50% vs. 80% a blind KS demand should be 45%. Given the weather and other advantages CA has I think my 50% demand was generous.
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Teaching would be a fun job. I would want to work summers, though.
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Don't you live in San Francisco? Need to adjust better for the CoL between SF and KS, imho.
did you read my post you dweeb?
If I could make even 80% of my current salary and not need a new degree to teach I would quit my job tomorrow.
Heck, for 50% of my salary, I'd quit and move to Kansas to teach.
I think your numbers are off is what I'm saying.
I was pretty friggin close for not calculating or looking anything up.
http://www.infoplease.com/business/economy/cost-living-index-us-cities.html
91.8 for wichita, 164.0 for SF. So instead of 50% vs. 80% a blind KS demand should be 45%. Given the weather and other advantages CA has I think my 50% demand was generous.
Do you even like K-State?
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Teaching would be a fun job. I would want to work summers, though.
I would work on a farm!
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Teaching would be a fun job. I would want to work summers, though.
I would work on a farm!
Oh, look at you. You have a farm you can go work on.
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Teaching would be a fun job. I would want to work summers, though.
I would work on a farm!
Oh, look at you. You have a farm you can go work on.
I'm very fortunate, for sure.
Although I do know lots of farmers struggle to find good reliable help, so who knows!
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I would like to see the results of a test study with at risk kids, where the only control was class sizes of 1 and see if it makes any difference.
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What does the average teacher in Oakland make? $30 an hour plus bennies?
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What does the average teacher in Oakland make? $30 an hour plus bennies?
That's actually pretty close, but it's lower than other districts in the region, which is a factor in teachers getting early experience in Oakland until they can get a job in a "better" district. IMO Oakland teachers should make at least 50% more than teachers in Piedmont and Alameda.
The report also found that Oakland teachers are paid too little. Starting salary is just over $39,000, about $8,000 lower than San Francisco and $3,000 below Alameda, while Oakland's top salary of $71,000 is well below a cap of $82,000 in San Francisco and $89,000 in Piedmont.
http://www.sfgate.com/education/article/Report-stirs-debate-on-Oakland-teachers-4368818.php
Here's the full report, notice the graph showing all the teachers leaving in their first five years to other districts (page 13):
http://www.goleadershipcenter.org/NCTQ%20Oakland%20Report.pdf
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Looks like some of you need to go start a thread to discuss your fear of pursuing your true calling.
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Looks like some of you need to go start a thread to discuss your fear of pursuing your true calling.
Do you not like the direction your thread took? I asked for your solutions to reducing entitlements, and this is what you give us? C'mon, dax!
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Looks like some of you need to go start a thread to discuss your fear of pursuing your true calling.
Do you not like the direction your thread took? I asked for your solutions to reducing entitlements, and this is what you give us? C'mon, dax!
I live in a state that has pretty strident follow-up on those getting unemployment benefits, what about Cali cRusty?
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Looks like some of you need to go start a thread to discuss your fear of pursuing your true calling.
Do you not like the direction your thread took? I asked for your solutions to reducing entitlements, and this is what you give us? C'mon, dax!
I live in a state that has pretty strident follow-up on those getting unemployment benefits, what about Cali cRusty?
that's your solution? How do the rates of people collecting unemployment benefits in California compare to North Carolina?
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Teachers in joco making what teachers in sf do doesn't seem right
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teachers get paid plenty. their job isn't difficult, they don't work many hours, and they get summers off.
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Looks like some of you need to go start a thread to discuss your fear of pursuing your true calling.
Do you not like the direction your thread took? I asked for your solutions to reducing entitlements, and this is what you give us? C'mon, dax!
I live in a state that has pretty strident follow-up on those getting unemployment benefits, what about Cali cRusty?
that's your solution? How do the rates of people collecting unemployment benefits in California compare to North Carolina?
I don't know cRusty, I believe in NC you only get 18 weeks. What about Cali?
Also, should people who just show up at the border immediately be placed on the government dole?
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dax, it's impossible to have a serious discussion with you. At least I gave it a shot.
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dax, it's impossible to have a serious discussion with you. At least I gave it a shot.
It's pretty much impossible to have an intelligent conversation with you cRusty. The very first thing you attempted to do in this thread was change the subject entirely.
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dax, it's impossible to have a serious discussion with you. At least I gave it a shot.
says the guy who thinks raising teacher's salaries will somehow fix our education system. paying teachers more won't make kids care about education.
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dax, it's impossible to have a serious discussion with you. At least I gave it a shot.
says the guy who thinks raising teacher's salaries will somehow fix our education system. paying teachers more won't make kids care about education.
It would make the teachers care more and attract better teachers.
But I don't think it would "fix" the education system. But it would be a positive step.
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dax, it's impossible to have a serious discussion with you. At least I gave it a shot.
says the guy who thinks raising teacher's salaries will somehow fix our education system. paying teachers more won't make kids care about education.
It would make the teachers care more and attract better teachers.
most poor kids DGAF about school, that is the problem. it's not the teachers. you went to some podunk school in western kansas so you don't understand.
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Protip, its not the kids, its the parents. Giving AF is something that is learned.
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Oh and I have numerous education clients. All very good, very nice, hard working people. I have the chance to talk to many of them one-on-one and of course you hear about money this and money that all the time. Yet, I'll often hear stories about how basically non-essential positions that are paid six figure salaries are created all the time for people who don't deliver anything to the bottom line of educating kids, but they do plenty of things like travel around on the district dime to conferences, and conventions getting "ideas".
Also, don't even get me started on school boards, and parents, both the helicopter and the absent.
I also see plenty of pet projects in our education system, resume builders. Lots of money spent on a niche and ever so worthless classroom technology that never gets used (one example), while core infrastructure that can drive real educational content into the classroom and hands of the students is neglected.
I've seen interviews with so called educators when they're asked about how much money per student would make their school systems better (they already spend a lot) and their response was in essence saying they pretty much wanted a blank check. :To mean that screams no accountability.
I am also in plenty of schools in the region and I see first hand how their run. I can tell you story after story about schools where there's discipline and accountability, but somebody gets a burr up their a$$ about the principal at the school and the school board runs them out, only to replace them with a dumba$$ that either the board, senior administration or parents can control, and the place goes to hell.
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Protip, its not the kids, its the parents. Giving AF is something that is learned.
It's not just the parents, it's everything that goes along with poverty. Parents have to work multiple jobs, nutrition is worse, there's less access to technology, crime is higher in the neighborhood, etc.
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Oh and I have numerous education clients. All very good, very nice, hard working people. I have the chance to talk to many of them one-on-one and of course you hear about money this and money that all the time. Yet, I'll often hear stories about how basically non-essential positions that are paid six figure salaries are created all the time for people who don't deliver anything to the bottom line of educating kids, but they do plenty of things like travel around on the district dime to conferences, and conventions getting "ideas".
Also, don't even get me started on school boards, and parents, both the helicopter and the absent.
I also see plenty of pet projects in our education system, resume builders. Lots of money spent on a niche and ever so worthless classroom technology that never gets used (one example), while core infrastructure that can drive real educational content into the classroom and hands of the students is neglected.
I've seen interviews with so called educators when they're asked about how much money per student would make their school systems better (they already spend a lot) and their response was in essence saying they pretty wanted a blank check.
I am also in plenty of schools in the region and I see first hand how their run. I can tell you story after story about schools where there's discipline and accountability, but somebody gets a burr up their a$$ about the principal at the school and the school board runs them out, only to replace them with a dumba$$ that either the board, senior administration or parents can control, and the place goes to hell.
Yes, all that should be changed.
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Oh and I have numerous education clients. All very good, very nice, hard working people. I have the chance to talk to many of them one-on-one and of course you hear about money this and money that all the time. Yet, I'll often hear stories about how basically non-essential positions that are paid six figure salaries are created all the time for people who don't deliver anything to the bottom line of educating kids, but they do plenty of things like travel around on the district dime to conferences, and conventions getting "ideas".
Also, don't even get me started on school boards, and parents, both the helicopter and the absent.
I also see plenty of pet projects in our education system, resume builders. Lots of money spent on a niche and ever so worthless classroom technology that never gets used (one example), while core infrastructure that can drive real educational content into the classroom and hands of the students is neglected.
I've seen interviews with so called educators when they're asked about how much money per student would make their school systems better (they already spend a lot) and their response was in essence saying they pretty much wanted a blank check. :To mean that screams no accountability.
I am also in plenty of schools in the region and I see first hand how their run. I can tell you story after story about schools where there's discipline and accountability, but somebody gets a burr up their a$$ about the principal at the school and the school board runs them out, only to replace them with a dumba$$ that either the board, senior administration or parents can control, and the place goes to hell.
Yes to all this.
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Protip, its not the kids, its the parents. Giving AF is something that is learned.
It's not just the parents, it's everything that goes along with poverty. Parents have to work multiple jobs, nutrition is worse, there's less access to technology, crime is higher in the neighborhood, etc.
I get that, and multiple jobs takes time from parenting, but crime and tech don't have anything to do with parents teaching kids to care, try hard, etc.
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Everything libs try to fix, they make worse. It would be comical if it were not so sad. Can anybody think of a societal problem of the last 40 years that
these retards have fixed without causing more probs in return.
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Protip, its not the kids, its the parents. Giving AF is something that is learned.
It's not just the parents, it's everything that goes along with poverty. Parents have to work multiple jobs, nutrition is worse, there's less access to technology, crime is higher in the neighborhood, etc.
I get that, and multiple jobs takes time from parenting, but crime and tech don't have anything to do with parents teaching kids to care, try hard, etc.
They definitely affect a child's chance of success in school. Simply saying the "parents don't teach the kids hard work" isn't a feasible solution, but things like free summer camps with wealthier children, access to better nutrition, free organized sports at a young age, free internet access for families with kids in school etc., could have a positive impact. (In addition to having less wealthy districts hiring and retaining better teachers.)
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Everything libs try to fix, they make worse. It would be comical if it were not so sad. Can anybody think of a societal problem of the last 40 years that
these retards have fixed without causing more probs in return.
These assholes turned my typewriter into an iPad :shakesfist:
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I am all for reform in lower economic areas, but it has to start with the parents. No matter what is given to the kids, if the process isn't supported and encouraged at home, it will not work on a large scale
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If the primary problem with poor districts is the parents, would you consider sending your kids to the lowest rated KCMO public school? I mean, you would be a good hard working parent, do you think your kids would be just fine in that scenario?
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If the primary problem with poor districts is the parents, would you consider sending your kids to the lowest rated KCMO public school? I mean, you would be a good hard working parent, do you think your kids would be just fine in that scenario?
Is the only problem at that low rated school academics?
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And if you want to start with the parents, they should be given MORE public assistance so they can maybe work just one job or pay for their own education or move to a nicer neighborhood.
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If the primary problem with poor districts is the parents, would you consider sending your kids to the lowest rated KCMO public school? I mean, you would be a good hard working parent, do you think your kids would be just fine in that scenario?
Is the only problem at that low rated school academics?
Maybe not, maybe it's just a tough environment for anyone to succeed in.
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No. The reason being that the student culture effects classroom and peer performance heavily through what is accepted as common or popular outlook on the process. If most of the kids in any given class have parents that don't provide the right environment, structure, emphasis, and follow up with their kids, then the culture of that classroom and/or peer group would not be a good environment for learning and have a neg effect on any given kids ability to maximize their learnng.
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If the primary problem with poor districts is the parents, would you consider sending your kids to the lowest rated KCMO public school? I mean, you would be a good hard working parent, do you think your kids would be just fine in that scenario?
And if you want to start with the parents, they should be given MORE public assistance so they can maybe work just one job or pay for their own education or move to a nicer neighborhood.
I feel like this would be a better investment than pretty much any other social assistance.
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If the primary problem with poor districts is the parents, would you consider sending your kids to the lowest rated KCMO public school? I mean, you would be a good hard working parent, do you think your kids would be just fine in that scenario?
And if you want to start with the parents, they should be given MORE public assistance so they can maybe work just one job or pay for their own education or move to a nicer neighborhood.
I feel like this would be a better investment than pretty much any other social assistance.
Kind of ties into my original suggestion about replacing benefit programs with straight cash.
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If I was to give a kid two pieces of advice that if implemented would guarantee nearly everybody a reasonable level of happiness and success they would be
1. get involved with your local church and use the bible as your guide
2. give 100% effort to your endeavors.
Show me anyone who has executed these two things and has a trainwreck for a life. (they don't cost any money either)
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I don't do either of those and am doing quite well.
I am not a believer and half ass things on occasion.
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If the primary problem with poor districts is the parents, would you consider sending your kids to the lowest rated KCMO public school? I mean, you would be a good hard working parent, do you think your kids would be just fine in that scenario?
1. If bad parents, then low-rated schools.
2. If low-rated schools, then poor education.
Inference: if bad parents, then poor education.
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For the purpose of your argument, you seem to have accepted the two premises as true, in which case the inference must be true.
Your argument is (logically) not necessarily true, as you seem to be guilty of conflating the sufficient and necessary conditions of these statements. Even when we consider the contrapositives, this argument tells us nothing about what must occur if the parents are good (I.e. "Not bad"). Therefore, the position you've taken is neither sound nor cogent.
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I don't do either of those and am doing quite well.
I am not a believer and half ass things on occasion.
not saying you have to, just that if your back is up against the wall with failure all around your family and your neighborhood, this will work in a pinch.
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I don't do either of those and am doing quite well.
I am not a believer and half ass things on occasion.
not saying you have to, just that if your back is up against the wall with failure all around your family and your neighborhood, this will work in a pinch.
Not if you don't have adequate opportunity. The bible isn't a magic lamp.
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If I was to give a kid two pieces of advice that if implemented would guarantee nearly everybody a reasonable level of happiness and success they would be
1. get involved with your local church and use the bible as your guide
2. give 100% effort to your endeavors.
Show me anyone who has executed these two things and has a trainwreck for a life. (they don't cost any money either)
Did your good ole uncle Tannoudji teach you that?
:shakesfist:
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I don't do either of those and am doing quite well.
I am not a believer and half ass things on occasion.
not saying you have to, just that if your back is up against the wall with failure all around your family and your neighborhood, this will work in a pinch.
Not if you don't have adequate opportunity. The bible isn't a magic lamp.
this is the land of opportunity pro. people bend over backwards to help people doing the right things.
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Interesting if true
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It would make the teachers care more and attract better teachers.
Not as long as the teachers union exists. There is zero incentive to improve until the threat of unemployment is restored for every teacher regardless of seniority.
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It would make the teachers care more and attract better teachers.
Not as long as the teachers union exists. There is zero incentive to improve until the threat of unemployment is restored for every teacher regardless of seniority.
You could definitely attract better candidates to become teachers. I'm assuming you aren't arguing that.
I disagree that better paid teachers wouldn't have more incentive to perform across the board. I definitely wouldn't work as hard at my job if I was paid what a teacher makes. I'm sure what you're saying applies to many teachers, but definitely not all.
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If I was to give a kid two pieces of advice that if implemented would guarantee nearly everybody a reasonable level of happiness and success they would be
1. get involved with your local church and use the bible as your guide
2. give 100% effort to your endeavors.
Show me anyone who has executed these two things and has a trainwreck for a life. (they don't cost any money either)
Did your good ole uncle Tannoudji teach you that?
:shakesfist:
Why don't you try to make a cogent post and then pop-off.
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Fyi, saying the bible is going to solve all this isn't exactly productive either.
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If I was to give a kid two pieces of advice that if implemented would guarantee nearly everybody a reasonable level of happiness and success they would be
1. get involved with your local church and use the bible as your guide
2. give 100% effort to your endeavors.
Show me anyone who has executed these two things and has a trainwreck for a life. (they don't cost any money either)
Did your good ole uncle Tannoudji teach you that?
:shakesfist:
Why don't you try to make a cogent post and then pop-off.
You start with rely on church and the bible and then ask others to make cogent posts. Hilarious.
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Fyi, saying the bible is going to solve all this isn't exactly productive either.
Made it very easy for me to disregard every one of their posts from here on. Pretty productive if you ask me
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Fyi, saying the bible is going to solve all this isn't exactly productive either.
Made it very easy for me to disregard every one of their posts from here on. Pretty productive if you ask me
A couple days ago he actually stumped for segregation, if not secession, but the bible thingy is what got you there?
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If I was to give a kid two pieces of advice that if implemented would guarantee nearly everybody a reasonable level of happiness and success they would be
1. get involved with your local church and use the bible as your guide
2. give 100% effort to your endeavors.
Show me anyone who has executed these two things and has a trainwreck for a life. (they don't cost any money either)
1. Which parts of the Bible, because the Bible tells you to do some pretty ridiculous and awful stuff
2. that falls into the "no crap" category
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Fyi, saying the bible is going to solve all this isn't exactly productive either.
Made it very easy for me to disregard every one of their posts from here on. Pretty productive if you ask me
A couple days ago he actually stumped for segregation, if not secession, but the bible thingy is what got you there
To be fair, I still can't tell if it's a parody account or not
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Fyi, saying the bible is going to solve all this isn't exactly productive either.
Made it very easy for me to disregard every one of their posts from here on. Pretty productive if you ask me
A couple days ago he actually stumped for segregation, if not secession, but the bible thingy is what got you there
To be fair, I still can't tell if it's a parody account or not
I mean his name's TUBESOCK
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It would make the teachers care more and attract better teachers.
Not as long as the teachers union exists. There is zero incentive to improve until the threat of unemployment is restored for every teacher regardless of seniority.
Which has actually never been a real issue and is 100% the invention of the radical right to attack one of the largest unions. Because its not like all contracts don't have provisions to get shitty teachers out if administrators would just do their jobs.
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It would make the teachers care more and attract better teachers.
Not as long as the teachers union exists. There is zero incentive to improve until the threat of unemployment is restored for every teacher regardless of seniority.
Which has actually never been a real issue and is 100% the invention of the radical right to attack one of the largest unions. Because its not like all contracts don't have provisions to get shitty teachers out if administrators would just do their jobs.
It may not be as big an issue in some states, but in CA, they literally rule the state's legislators.
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/may/18/opinion/la-oe-senik-california-teachers-association-20120518 (http://articles.latimes.com/2012/may/18/opinion/la-oe-senik-california-teachers-association-20120518)
One outcome of the CTA's generosity to the Democrats who control California's Legislature, combined with its hard-ball negotiating style, is that teachers in California — even terrible ones — are virtually never fired. A tiny 0.03% of California teachers are dismissed after three or more years on the job. In the last decade, the L.A. Unified School District, home to 33,000 teachers, has fired only four. Even when teachers are fired, it's seldom because of their classroom performance: A 2009 expose by this newspaper found that only 20% of successful dismissals in the state had anything to do with teaching ability. Most involved teachers behaving either obscenely or criminally.
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.
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Fyi, saying the bible is going to solve all this isn't exactly productive either.
Made it very easy for me to disregard every one of their posts from here on. Pretty productive if you ask me
A couple days ago he actually stumped for segregation, if not secession, but the bible thingy is what got you there
To be fair, I still can't tell if it's a parody account or not
I mean his name's TUBESOCK
Yeah, this is why I laid off for so long.
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teachers get paid plenty. their job isn't difficult, they don't work many hours, and they get summers off.
:ROFL:
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teachers get paid plenty. their job isn't difficult, they don't work many hours, and they get summers off.
:ROFL:
which part of that statement do you disagree with? b/c all of it is true so i'm just curious.
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teachers get paid plenty. their job isn't difficult, they don't work many hours, and they get summers off.
:ROFL:
which part of that statement do you disagree with? b/c all of it is true so i'm just curious.
All of it. Summers off...true. How many hours do most professionals work in a day? What basis do you have for the claim that our jobs aren't difficult?
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teachers get paid plenty. their job isn't difficult, they don't work many hours, and they get summers off.
:ROFL:
which part of that statement do you disagree with? b/c all of it is true so i'm just curious.
All of it. Summers off...true. How many hours do most professionals work in a day? What basis do you have for the claim that our jobs aren't difficult?
I would think disrespectful kids are what make it difficult.
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Grade school is probably pud as hell, but high school would suck and Jr high probably the absolute worst. You're working with developmentally insane people all day
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Grade school is probably pud as hell, but high school would suck and Jr high probably the absolute worst. You're working with developmentally insane people all day
Ah, yes. Grade school is a piece of cake! Crazy amounts of differentiation in each classroom, developmental delays, keeping children focused for more than 10 minutes at a time, planning and teaching multiple subjects, inability to think abstractly, varying levels of independence, helicopter parents, uninvolved parents, etc. Easy peasy.
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I have a friend that was a high school teacher ($90k a year by the way) that quit to go to work teaching at one of the local prisons as a teacher. She could not be happier with her decision even with the longer drive and less money. She said she feels safer and the inmates have to respect her or they are taken out of class by the guard outside the door.
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teachers get paid plenty. their job isn't difficult, they don't work many hours, and they get summers off.
:ROFL:
which part of that statement do you disagree with? b/c all of it is true so i'm just curious.
All of it. Summers off...true. How many hours do most professionals work in a day? What basis do you have for the claim that our jobs aren't difficult?
Even the summers off isn't true since many teachers have continuing ed and pro development. Also look at work per yearly average instead of dividing it up based on the school year.
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I have a friend that was a high school teacher ($90k a year by the way) that quit to go to work teaching at one of the local prisons as a teacher. She could not be happier with her decision even with the longer drive and less money. She said she feels safer and the inmates have to respect her or they are taken out of class by the guard outside the door.
Teachers in my wife's dist max out around $55k-$60k with a doctorate and a couple decades of senority. Where is this $90k teaching position? Asking for a Canadian friends wife.
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I have a friend that was a high school teacher ($90k a year by the way) that quit to go to work teaching at one of the local prisons as a teacher. She could not be happier with her decision even with the longer drive and less money. She said she feels safer and the inmates have to respect her or they are taken out of class by the guard outside the door.
Teachers in my wife's dist max out around $55k-$60k with a doctorate and a couple decades of senority. Where is this $90k teaching position? Asking for a Canadian friends wife.
where else but California!
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Grade school is probably pud as hell, but high school would suck and Jr high probably the absolute worst. You're working with developmentally insane people all day
Ah, yes. Grade school is a piece of cake! Crazy amounts of differentiation in each classroom, developmental delays, keeping children focused for more than 10 minutes at a time, planning and teaching multiple subjects, inability to think abstractly, varying levels of independence, helicopter parents, uninvolved parents, etc. Easy peasy.
About what I thought, fairly pud
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Grade school is probably pud as hell, but high school would suck and Jr high probably the absolute worst. You're working with developmentally insane people all day
Ah, yes. Grade school is a piece of cake! Crazy amounts of differentiation in each classroom, developmental delays, keeping children focused for more than 10 minutes at a time, planning and teaching multiple subjects, inability to think abstractly, varying levels of independence, helicopter parents, uninvolved parents, etc. Easy peasy.
About what I thought, fairly pud
Yeah, god forbid a job have a few challenges
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I had teachers that used the same lesson plans and tests for years.
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I had teachers that used the same lesson plans and tests for years.
How many grades did you have to repeat?
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I had teachers that used the same lesson plans and tests for years.
How many grades did you have to repeat?
:eek:
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Ed swooping in let john doug avoid telling me I was right. :frown:
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I have a friend that was a high school teacher ($90k a year by the way) that quit to go to work teaching at one of the local prisons as a teacher. She could not be happier with her decision even with the longer drive and less money. She said she feels safer and the inmates have to respect her or they are taken out of class by the guard outside the door.
Teachers in my wife's dist max out around $55k-$60k with a doctorate and a couple decades of senority. Where is this $90k teaching position? Asking for a Canadian friends wife.
where else but California!
public employees in california mostly get paid ridiculously well.
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Grade school is probably pud as hell, but high school would suck and Jr high probably the absolute worst. You're working with developmentally insane people all day
Ah, yes. Grade school is a piece of cake! Crazy amounts of differentiation in each classroom, developmental delays, keeping children focused for more than 10 minutes at a time, planning and teaching multiple subjects, inability to think abstractly, varying levels of independence, helicopter parents, uninvolved parents, etc. Easy peasy.
About what I thought, fairly pud
Yeah, god forbid a job have a few challenges
I wasn't complaining about how tough it is. I was challenging the "pud" comment. I'm sure that you could walk right in and do the job with one hand tied behind your back, right?
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I have a friend that was a high school teacher ($90k a year by the way) that quit to go to work teaching at one of the local prisons as a teacher. She could not be happier with her decision even with the longer drive and less money. She said she feels safer and the inmates have to respect her or they are taken out of class by the guard outside the door.
Teachers in my wife's dist max out around $55k-$60k with a doctorate and a couple decades of senority. Where is this $90k teaching position? Asking for a Canadian friends wife.
where else but California!
public employees in california mostly get paid ridiculously well.
private employees, too
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public employees in california mostly get paid ridiculously well.
private employees, too
many do. but there are also many that are paid very little. maybe something you don't see as much of where you live.
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public employees in california mostly get paid ridiculously well.
private employees, too
many do. but there are also many that are paid very little. maybe something you don't see as much of where you live.
true, I wonder how the indices compare to peers elsewhere in the country.
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So, $90k...I mean there are prob engineers and the like that don't get that unil a few yrs into their field, right? Where, in ks, I started right out of college making what my wife makes now, her 13th year teaching.
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So, $90k...I mean there are prob engineers and the like that don't get that unil a few yrs into their field, right? Where, in ks, I started right out of college making what my wife makes now, her 13th year teaching.
It would take a long time to get to 90k at most districts, even in California. The link about Oakland schools has info
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my aunt is a teacher in california and makes like 32k
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my aunt is a teacher in california and makes like 32k
she was going to move to kansas to get a pay raise and COL decrease :surprised:
(ended up not tho)
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my aunt is a teacher in california and makes like 32k
Good god. Private school? That's a rough ridin' crime
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my aunt is a teacher in california and makes like 32k
Good god. Private school? That's a rough ridin' crime
public. special ed teacher. it's also like the coffeyville of california i'm pretty sure, the whole town is so depressing
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Yeah, teachers in Oakland max out at $70k
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actually she just moved the the attendance secretary position or whatever cause it was at like 41k
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Yeah, teachers in Oakland max out at $70k
In KS money that's gotta be like $43-$45k, right?
That is super shitty to max out at that. There are many union simple labor jobs that top that.
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Yeah, teachers in Oakland max out at $70k
In KS money that's gotta be like $43-$45k, right?
That is super shitty to max out at that. There are many union simple labor jobs that top that.
Yeah
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libliblibliblib, you aunt should become a police officer or fireperson.
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libliblibliblib, you aunt should become a police officer or fireperson.
she's very lazy
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she's very lazy
libliblibliblib, you aunt should become a police officer or fireperson.
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she's very lazy
libliblibliblib, you aunt should become a police officer or fireperson.
i'll mention it to her i guess
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I'm in my 14th year, Master's degree plus 12 hours, and make $50,000. I started at $34,000 in 1997. (didn't teach from 2010 until this year) If I didn't have my Master's, I would be making $43,000.
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I'm in my 14th year, Master's degree plus 12 hours, and make $50,000. I started at $34,000 in 1997. (didn't teach from 2010 until this year) If I didn't have my Master's, I would be making $43,000.
Way aren't you administrating by now ?
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Because I would rather jab a fork in my eye than be a principal.
My Master's is in counseling.
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Good friend of mine is a principal. He loves his job. Also money in the bank shawty whatchu thank.
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She was about 15 years in with a masters and was teaching at risk kids. It was their last stop before jail, so she made a little more than average. Going to the prison system didn't change the type of students that much, but she has the ultimate leverage available to keep the class focused.
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I have a friend who is a principle and likes it but he tallied his hours and he's making marginally more because of the hours. Likes it misses coaching
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If we could put guards in the class room, that just may solve it all, guys. Or maybe put all kids in prison? Prolly work either way.
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I think the story of a teacher making $90k who would rather work in a prison is a perfect anecdote supporting the idea that most teaching positions should pay waaaaaaaaay more than they currently do.
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A huge problem is that teachers need a lot of school. And let's face it, the teachers aren't the ones getting full roses. They graduate and make 35k with a 300 dollar a month bill.
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A huge problem is that teachers need a lot of school. And let's face it, the teachers aren't the ones getting full roses. They graduate and make 35k with a 300 dollar a month bill.
Don't they just need the 4 years everyone else needs?
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my wife graduated kstate in 3.5 years with a 25k bill.
kstate is dirt cheap.
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A huge problem is that teachers need a lot of school. And let's face it, the teachers aren't the ones getting full roses. They graduate and make 35k with a 300 dollar a month bill.
Don't they just need the 4 years everyone else needs?
I think everyone else makes more than 35k though.
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A huge problem is that teachers need a lot of school. And let's face it, the teachers aren't the ones getting full roses. They graduate and make 35k with a 300 dollar a month bill.
Don't they just need the 4 years everyone else needs?
The only way to get raises is to continue your education. Almost everyone making a career of it has at least a Master's degree.
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why are you guys even discussing this? we're not going to start paying teachers more because we don't need to and it won't help. if you want to make a lot of money then you need to work in an industry that involves making profit. if you don't want to teach, don't. case closed. end of story.
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
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A huge problem is that teachers need a lot of school. And let's face it, the teachers aren't the ones getting full roses. They graduate and make 35k with a 300 dollar a month bill.
Don't they just need the 4 years everyone else needs?
The only way to get raises is to continue your education. Almost everyone making a career of it has at least a Master's degree.
A new"thing" is to scrap schedules and pay per market and evaluation. A district in Colorado is doing it and word in Olathe is that the superintendent and the board are holding out to do something similar
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
We should just work them 11 months and adjust their salary accordingly.
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
We should just work them 11 months and adjust their salary accordingly.
Why? What would they do?
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
We should just work them 11 months and adjust their salary accordingly.
Why? What would they do?
year round school with more short breaks for kids. summers off is antiquated.
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
We should just work them 11 months and adjust their salary accordingly.
Why? What would they do?
Teach for 11 months instead of 9, sort of like teachers in other countries with better schools than ours do it.
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
We should just work them 11 months and adjust their salary accordingly.
Why? What would they do?
year round school with more short breaks for kids. summers off is antiquated.
So still only ~190 days of work?
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
We should just work them 11 months and adjust their salary accordingly.
Why? What would they do?
year round school with more short breaks for kids. summers off is antiquated.
So still only ~190 days of work?
Maybe 225 or so. :dunno:
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Getting paid $45K for 9 months of work doesn't sound that bad. Plus, you can do a second job in the summer. :dunno:
We should just work them 11 months and adjust their salary accordingly.
Why? What would they do?
Teach for 11 months instead of 9, sort of like teachers in other countries with better schools than ours do it.
I haven't really checked sources on this article specifically, but other countries that go for more days aren't necessarily spending more time in class
http://www.centerforpubliceducation.org/Main-Menu/Organizing-a-school/Time-in-school-How-does-the-US-compare
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More spread out with breaks less than two weeks equates to less knowledge loss ove break and equates to less time spent going over crap learnd last year. Retention studies basically blame summer farming breaks for kids losing like a third of what they learned last year. If thr first month or more of every year wasn't spent re-engaging kids or catching them back up to where they left last may, then the class would progress much faster. Now multiply that by twelve years in school.