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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Football => Topic started by: The Manhatter on October 03, 2011, 12:02:52 AM
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first, don't ride the tide. No reason to get too :runaway: with nice wins or losses.
This KSU team is very confident and seemingly has a bunch of different guys capable of making some crucial plays to beat people.
Mizzou is a dangerous team in that they get a lot of snaps offensively and they're balanced from the standpt that they have a lot of intent to use a two pronged rushing attack w/ their QB and RB.
But like Baylor, they really don't have a running back who scares anyone. (I don't care what Josey's done with his numbers...he's a beauty queen in a scheme...system kid). I thought the key going into the Baylor game was containing RG3 (make him throw from the pocket) and shut down the running game. You knew RG3 was going to get his...I figured around 27-28 pts...he was even better than that. But we contained him to the pocket and shut down the running game.
Baylor's had very solid OL play since Briles showed up so our containment, shutting down the run, and even getting more pressure than I saw coming is a very good sign for how we play in the front 7. Mizzou is not a more physical team than the one we saw Saturday though, as stated earlier, they have more intent in their running game.
I still see Kibble (who is 1st team all-Big 12 caliber), Brown, and our "stop the run 1st" defensive ends shutting down or severely limiting what Mizzou has become accustomed to on the ground. Mizzou's 530 yards vs. OU didn't bother me...we're better than OU up the middle of the defense and Mizzou did next to nothing on 9 straight drives in the heart of that OU game. They notched 170 yards in the final 8 minutes and got half their points...by that time OU had several 2s working in with the 1s to gain experience. That leaves Franklin in the pocket where you really can't compare a gamer and experienced (and insanely talented vet) like RG3. Franklin isn't going to beat a whole lot of people with pocket passing if his run game is limited. They do not stretch you vertically like Baylor nor do they possess that consistent big play capability in the passing game. It's more of a methodical attack but they are having breakdowns with it this year. They're still very formidable this year offensively but not the type that strikes fear in you like the one we saw last week or what they've had in the recent past.
To this point in the season I have not been impressed with Mizzou's LBs or secondary. Their DL matches up well with us but there is this "scheme doctor" roaming our sidelines who has the antecdote for what ails.
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Lets face it, Pinkel will put a clown suit on Snyder just like the past 2 years.
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Lets face it, Pinkel will put a clown suit on Snyder just like the past 2 years.
Nah, mizzou had nfl talent at wr and lb those years. We had a terrible defense last year and a mediocre one before that. Order restored etc. Etc.
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Lets face it, Pinkel will put a clown suit on Snyder just like the past 2 years.
:facepalm: and a JFC to boot. (astonished)
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Mizzou has a nice little streak on us.
Time to rough ridin' end that.
:lynchmob:
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I still see Kibble (who is 1st team all-Big 12 caliber), Brown, and our "stop the run 1st" defensive ends shutting down or severely limiting what Mizzou has become accustomed to on the ground. Mizzou's 530 yards vs. OU didn't bother me...we're better than OU up the middle of the defense and Mizzou did next to nothing on 9 straight drives in the heart of that OU game. They notched 170 yards in the final 8 minutes and got half their points...by that time OU had several 2s working in with the 1s to gain experience. That leaves Franklin in the pocket where you really can't compare a gamer and experienced (and insanely talented vet) like RG3. Franklin isn't going to beat a whole lot of people with pocket passing if his run game is limited. They do not stretch you vertically like Baylor nor do they possess that consistent big play capability in the passing game. It's more of a methodical attack but they are having breakdowns with it this year. They're still very formidable this year offensively but not the type that strikes fear in you like the one we saw last week or what they've had in the recent past.
:surprised: :love:
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Lets face it, Pinkel will put a clown suit on Snyder just like the past 2 years.
:facepalm: and a JFC to boot. (astonished)
yeah when queso almost comes back on ya, its not a clown suiting
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Lets face it, Pinkel will put a clown suit on Snyder just like the past 2 years.
He's had 2 weeks to meet with the tailor...measure twice & cut once for that perfect fit. :frown:
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It's 38-12 in MHK (2009) that scares me. the way they just clowned our run game.
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It's 38-12 in MHK (2009) that scares me. the way they just clowned our run game.
Yea, I'm really scared we won't be able to run at all.
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It's 38-12 in MHK (2009) that scares me. the way they just clowned our run game.
Remember how exciting it was right until Banks fumbled at the goal line early? :frown:
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They are going to mash our faces in. Good thing pinks doesn't run it up.
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They are going to mash our faces in. Good thing pinks doesn't run it up.
Is this your new way to keep those walls up, now that you can't keep predicting losses to KU? Let em back in, cire. They've changed. They know they've made some mistakes and hurt us in the past, and they mean it when they say they're sorry this time. They've had a lot of time to think. A lot of time to grow up and reevaluate.
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I understand where hemmy and cire are coming from....but this year is different...and they are just effing with us. So. kudos.
I bet you were a hit at the postgame tailgate Saturday.
"Well, we shoulda lost but we didn't". GTFO.
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worst mizzou team in years should give us a chance. :emawkid:
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I want to win this game very badly, I mean like really really badly.
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I'm pretty sure Bill is tired of getting clowned by Pinkel (and he has the last 2 years). It helps that Missouri is a solid team, but not a great one. I am certain they are not better than Baylor.
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Love a good Hatter thread like this.
First of all, Hatter, your 27-28 prediction probably had a good chance of standing had Griffin and Wright not had that one sick TD where Griffin threw of his back foot and Wright ended up diving and catching that ball. That was unreal. Had they not hit that, you would have been dead on in your prediction. So, all in all, I'll give you credit for it.
Second, yes, you're dead on about Mizzou and their running game. The key is keeping Franklin in the pocket. If we keep him isolated in there, and shut down his run game, my guess is that he throws a minimum of two picks.
I haven't had a chance to dive into the numbers yet, but just a gut feeling is that we see a Mizzou team get around 380-400 yards of total offense with 300-330 in the air. Franklin will end up throwing at least 35 times. At least. We'll probably go up 7-10 points in the first half, and Pinkel will end up abandoning the run because it's ineffective somewhere in the third. At that point, if we have a lead and Franklin has to play catch up, he'll start throwing picks, and we'll just run and wear down their defense and kill clock.
I'll end up saying that I think this game ends up something like 27-17 KSU or something like that. Grant Whatshisname will end up missing some FG, so it probably should be closer than the final score will indicate.
We'll win TOP by at least five minutes.
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Love a good Hatter thread like this.
First of all, Hatter, your 27-28 prediction probably had a good chance of standing had Griffin and Wright not had that one sick TD where Griffin threw of his back foot and Wright ended up diving and catching that ball. That was unreal. Had they not hit that, you would have been dead on in your prediction. So, all in all, I'll give you credit for it.
Second, yes, you're dead on about Mizzou and their running game. The key is keeping Franklin in the pocket. If we keep him isolated in there, and shut down his run game, my guess is that he throws a minimum of two picks.
I haven't had a chance to dive into the numbers yet, but just a gut feeling is that we see a Mizzou team get around 380-400 yards of total offense with 300-330 in the air. Franklin will end up throwing at least 35 times. At least. We'll probably go up 7-10 points in the first half, and Pinkel will end up abandoning the run because it's ineffective somewhere in the third. At that point, if we have a lead and Franklin has to play catch up, he'll start throwing picks, and we'll just run and wear down their defense and kill clock.
I'll end up saying that I think this game ends up something like 27-17 KSU or something like that. Grant Whatshisname will end up missing some FG, so it probably should be closer than the final score will indicate.
We'll win TOP by at least five minutes.
Good thoughts. Franklin is solid, but he is no Griffin. There are differences, but MU's running game is similar to Baylor's; lots of stretch zone, zone read, and stretch read. I thought we handled it very well last week and I expect us to again. The biggest worry is getting bad match-ups like we did last week with MU recievers isolated on Hartman. Its easy to throw Hartman under the bus on those, but Davies was right on the telecast, the nickel DB has to jam the WR to give Hartman a chance. Even with a 15 yard cushion, its hard to adjust and stay with an elite WR running a vertical route right at you. I also agree that we can force Franklin into making some mistakes.
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Hatter and Pan make me feel better.
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Missouri's run D is a legitimate concern, they are pretty good: http://www.cfbstats.com/2011/team/434/rushing/defense/gamelog.html
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Franklin doesn't scare me one bit
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Love a good Hatter thread like this.
First of all, Hatter, your 27-28 prediction probably had a good chance of standing had Griffin and Wright not had that one sick TD where Griffin threw of his back foot and Wright ended up diving and catching that ball. That was unreal. Had they not hit that, you would have been dead on in your prediction. So, all in all, I'll give you credit for it.
Second, yes, you're dead on about Mizzou and their running game. The key is keeping Franklin in the pocket. If we keep him isolated in there, and shut down his run game, my guess is that he throws a minimum of two picks.
I haven't had a chance to dive into the numbers yet, but just a gut feeling is that we see a Mizzou team get around 380-400 yards of total offense with 300-330 in the air. Franklin will end up throwing at least 35 times. At least. We'll probably go up 7-10 points in the first half, and Pinkel will end up abandoning the run because it's ineffective somewhere in the third. At that point, if we have a lead and Franklin has to play catch up, he'll start throwing picks, and we'll just run and wear down their defense and kill clock.
I'll end up saying that I think this game ends up something like 27-17 KSU or something like that. Grant Whatshisname will end up missing some FG, so it probably should be closer than the final score will indicate.
We'll win TOP by at least five minutes.
Good thoughts. Franklin is solid, but he is no Griffin. There are differences, but MU's running game is similar to Baylor's; lots of stretch zone, zone read, and stretch read. I thought we handled it very well last week and I expect us to again. The biggest worry is getting bad match-ups like we did last week with MU recievers isolated on Hartman. Its easy to throw Hartman under the bus on those, but Davies was right on the telecast, the nickel DB has to jam the WR to give Hartman a chance. Even with a 15 yard cushion, its hard to adjust and stay with an elite WR running a vertical route right at you. I also agree that we can force Franklin into making some mistakes.
Moe is the only thing that really scares me right now. A good slot receiver that's adept at finding holes in the zone, especially post second level, concerns me with this defense. My hope is that we put enough pressure on Franklin that he can't spend all day looking for him.
Honestly, with as good as we've been up the middle, I'm not opposed to moving Garrett to linebacker this week and letting him play on the slot during a lot of series. Malone and Chapman can hold their own with Mizzou on the edge. I'd like to see us keep Garrett on Moe most of the day if we can.
Of course, I wouldn't normally suggest this, but Garrett is such a great tackler that we can get away with it.
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Love a good Hatter thread like this.
First of all, Hatter, your 27-28 prediction probably had a good chance of standing had Griffin and Wright not had that one sick TD where Griffin threw of his back foot and Wright ended up diving and catching that ball. That was unreal. Had they not hit that, you would have been dead on in your prediction. So, all in all, I'll give you credit for it.
Second, yes, you're dead on about Mizzou and their running game. The key is keeping Franklin in the pocket. If we keep him isolated in there, and shut down his run game, my guess is that he throws a minimum of two picks.
I haven't had a chance to dive into the numbers yet, but just a gut feeling is that we see a Mizzou team get around 380-400 yards of total offense with 300-330 in the air. Franklin will end up throwing at least 35 times. At least. We'll probably go up 7-10 points in the first half, and Pinkel will end up abandoning the run because it's ineffective somewhere in the third. At that point, if we have a lead and Franklin has to play catch up, he'll start throwing picks, and we'll just run and wear down their defense and kill clock.
I'll end up saying that I think this game ends up something like 27-17 KSU or something like that. Grant Whatshisname will end up missing some FG, so it probably should be closer than the final score will indicate.
We'll win TOP by at least five minutes.
Good thoughts. Franklin is solid, but he is no Griffin. There are differences, but MU's running game is similar to Baylor's; lots of stretch zone, zone read, and stretch read. I thought we handled it very well last week and I expect us to again. The biggest worry is getting bad match-ups like we did last week with MU recievers isolated on Hartman. Its easy to throw Hartman under the bus on those, but Davies was right on the telecast, the nickel DB has to jam the WR to give Hartman a chance. Even with a 15 yard cushion, its hard to adjust and stay with an elite WR running a vertical route right at you. I also agree that we can force Franklin into making some mistakes.
No Mizzou scares me isolated on Hartman like Wright does...but let me clarify in saying that every receiver scares me isolated on Hartman...just wright it scarier.
I remember when Wright was coming out of high school...Prince recruited him for the duration of a cup of coffee. He is one of those examples where it was rather obvious to me that rivals truly doesn't know how to evaluate talent. Looked explosive and very talented on his video yet just a 5.6 3 star (even though he had offers from schools like OU). Dynamic player and no receiver on Mizzou's roster has his capabilities. But they have a lot of solid receivers.
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Missouri's run D is a legitimate concern, they are pretty good: http://www.cfbstats.com/2011/team/434/rushing/defense/gamelog.html
They are, but this is a situation where I think they'll end up selling out a lot on the run, and Snyder will take a chance and go vertical a few times and spend a lot of time out on the edge like he did against Miami.
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I'm pretty sure Bill is tired of getting clowned by Pinkel (and he has the last 2 years). It helps that Missouri is a solid team, but not a great one. I am certain they are not better than Baylor.
I'll respectfully disagree. MU’s offense is more balanced. You have to actually worry about their QB being used in the run game, we didn’t necessarily have to do that with Baylor. Their defense is ranked 16th’ nationally against the run (Baylor’s is now 76th). The “mu hasn’t faced teams that want to run” argument is a valid point. What gives me hope is that we ran for over 4ypc last year (though only 187 total) and turned it over 4 times in Columbia (against a better defense) and managed to keep it within 10. But our special teams continues to be a joke and our safeties are going to get bad matchups (again) this week.
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Missouri's run D is a legitimate concern, they are pretty good: http://www.cfbstats.com/2011/team/434/rushing/defense/gamelog.html
Statistically, yes, they're a pretty good run defense. I really don't see any good rushing offenses they've played though. I don't count OU as a really solid rushing offense and Arizona State is reasonable at best.
They will still give us difficulties running it because they have so much experience up front, size, and depth.
The problem for them is their back 7 may be the worst in the Big 12 (not named Kansas). Gatchkar was a big loss in pass defense from the LB spot and they lost two corners with something like 60 career starts between them to graduation.
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Missouri's run D is a legitimate concern, they are pretty good: http://www.cfbstats.com/2011/team/434/rushing/defense/gamelog.html
They are, but this is a situation where I think they'll end up selling out a lot on the run, and Snyder will take a chance and go vertical a few times and spend a lot of time out on the edge like he did against Miami.
True. I'm still in the process of breaking down last week's offense and we threw some interesting looks at Baylor. Just in the first half we used a ton of trips looks and some unbalanced formations which I'll talk about this week in _FANalysis.
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I'm pretty sure Bill is tired of getting clowned by Pinkel (and he has the last 2 years). It helps that Missouri is a solid team, but not a great one. I am certain they are not better than Baylor.
I'll respectfully disagree. MU’s offense is more balanced. You have to actually worry about their QB being used in the run game, we didn’t necessarily have to do that with Baylor. Their defense is ranked 16th’ nationally against the run (Baylor’s is now 76th). The “mu hasn’t faced teams that want to run” argument is a valid point. What gives me hope is that we ran for over 4ypc last year (though only 187 total) and turned it over 4 times in Columbia (against a better defense) and managed to keep it within 10. But our special teams continues to be a joke and our safeties are going to get bad matchups (again) this week.
I tend to agree with you but the one thing I'll point out is that Baylor has actually run the ball pretty well against everybody the past two years with the exception of Texas Tech and TCU in 2010 and KSU last week. I really don't get how Tech did so well in 2010 but I suspect it had to do with Tech getting a big lead and Baylor being forced to pass non stop. But Baylor has run the ball well on everybody else. They actually averaged over 200 rushing last year and were averaging over that again this year.
Having said that, I think it has more to do w/ safeties not employing help to defend their explosive pass plays and Griffin's ability to improvise.
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Having said that, I think it has more to do w/ safeties not employing help to defend their explosive pass plays and Griffin's ability to improvise.
This is definitely true. Granted, I only watched MU in their first half against OU, but they don't put the same type of pressure on the safeties that Baylor does. Baylors bubble screens, slants, and quick outs put a ton of pressure on the safeties to defend sideline to sideline and that is very tough. I really think we can do some things to confuse Franklin and force mistakes that we couldn't do against Baylor. I do understand the concern with Missouri's running game and agree they'll seek more balance than Baylor, but I am glad we won't have to deal with the sideline to sideline passing game. Nor does Missouri try to play at the same ridiculous pace that Baylor does.
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I'm pretty sure Bill is tired of getting clowned by Pinkel (and he has the last 2 years). It helps that Missouri is a solid team, but not a great one. I am certain they are not better than Baylor.
I'll respectfully disagree. MU’s offense is more balanced. You have to actually worry about their QB being used in the run game, we didn’t necessarily have to do that with Baylor. Their defense is ranked 16th’ nationally against the run (Baylor’s is now 76th). The “mu hasn’t faced teams that want to run” argument is a valid point. What gives me hope is that we ran for over 4ypc last year (though only 187 total) and turned it over 4 times in Columbia (against a better defense) and managed to keep it within 10. But our special teams continues to be a joke and our safeties are going to get bad matchups (again) this week.
I tend to agree with you but the one thing I'll point out is that Baylor has actually run the ball pretty well against everybody the past two years with the exception of Texas Tech and TCU in 2010 and KSU last week. I really don't get how Tech did so well in 2010 but I suspect it had to do with Tech getting a big lead and Baylor being forced to pass non stop. But Baylor has run the ball well on everybody else. They actually averaged over 200 rushing last year and were averaging over that again this year.
Having said that, I think it has more to do w/ safeties not employing help to defend their explosive pass plays and Griffin's ability to improvise.
And the fact that Griffin throws the best looking deep ball I've seen at the collegiate level since, I don't know, Peyton Manning or Ryan Leaf?
(Not kidding.)
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Our safeties, specifically Tyson, are just not fast/quick/whatever you want to call it enough. Tyson is just miserable. I mean either he can’t get out of his back pedal quick enough or he just doesn’t understand routes, because he got two facials and all the receiver (granted it was wright) did was just flat run by him even with a 15 yard cushion. Even the amazing catch wright had was an overthrow, Tyson was beat badly. MU doesn’t have Alexander to just run down the field and facial Tyson, but TJ Moe will certainly have no trouble working against him.
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We must do everything we can to ensure the Hartman aka Burnt Toast is not isolated in the passing game. He couldn't cover an ant hill.
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Having said that, I think it has more to do w/ safeties not employing help to defend their explosive pass plays and Griffin's ability to improvise.
I really think we can do some things to confuse Franklin and force mistakes that we couldn't do against Baylor. I do understand the concern with Missouri's running game and agree they'll seek more balance than Baylor....Nor does Missouri try to play at the same ridiculous pace that Baylor does.
this.
The difference between our defense right now and our elite defenses in the late 90s-early 2000s is 1) our ability to play man coverage with our safeties (or, at the very least, free safety. And that includes being able to pressure near the LOS with those safeties) and 2) tremendous pressure from our defensive ends. That is really the only difference...we're as good as we were nearly everywhere else. This is a pretty good defense. Baylor's personnel and skill still make it difficult for us to defend despite our ability to defend. They match up better with us than Mizzou.
Thing we got to remember...Franklin doesn't possess near RG3's experience nor his dramatic flair for big play capabilities. And I don't think Mizzou's OL is more physical than Baylor's. Baylor's got pretty good line play with Briles and it's a different philosophy not exclusive to the line splits.
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I predict mu is going to eat the zone read alive . . . must be able to throw the football.
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I predict mu is going to eat the zone read alive . . . must be able to throw the football.
Yes, and to add to that, get rid of it in a timely manner.
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I predict mu is going to eat the zone read alive . . . must be able to throw the football.
we'll get ours. It's much the same personnel that The Chamber ate up in Columbia running the ball last year. The major difference between Mizzou last year and this year is that they had a much better pass defense in 2010 and an elite pass rusher.
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That had more to do with the changing of the QB's . . . you probably won't recall but teams that changed QB's that had athletes gave Snyder's best teams fits, I can rattle off numerous games where that was the case during the DOD.
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That had more to do with the changing of the QB's . . . you probably won't recall but teams that changed QB's that had athletes gave Snyder's best teams fits, I can rattle off numerous games where that was the case during the DOD.
I'm hoping that an increase in the Wildcat formation run with Pease will have a similar effect.
I was encouraged that we saw that more during Mizzou. My guess is that in this four game stretch we'll see it a lot more, if for no other reason than to keep Klein alive.
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That had more to do with the changing of the QB's . . . you probably won't recall but teams that changed QB's that had athletes gave Snyder's best teams fits, I can rattle off numerous games where that was the case during the DOD.
I'm hoping that an increase in the Wildcat formation run with Pease will have a similar effect.
I was encouraged that we saw that more during Mizzou. My guess is that in this four game stretch we'll see it a lot more, if for no other reason than to keep Klein alive.
And Pease being healthy.
Honestly, with the way he ran the ball Saturday, I'd like to see more Pease in the regular package; both in spread gun and 2 back formations. I think Pease hitting the edge on the stretch read could lead to some bigger plays, especially if MU gameplans like Baylor to force Klein to give.
I'm hopeful Pease has only been limited so far because he missed time with injury and we'll see him for more than just Wildcat play calls.
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What about that weird reverse play they kept doing? We couldn't stop it!! We need to scheme up a way to stop it or Mizzou will do it too I think.
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What about that weird reverse play they kept doing? We couldn't stop it!! We need to scheme up a way to stop it or Mizzou will do it too I think.
we're not worried about reverses. We're savvy at both corner spots, having LBs who can run, Defensive ends that don't get up field too hard, and experienced safeties. We're not overly pre-occupied w/ that fluff stuff.
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Well, they had like 4 big plays on them. So...I'm right.
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Well, they had like 4 big plays on them. So...I'm right.
ok.
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what if Baylor is just that effin' good on offense and our D is better than the points and yards we gave up? I'd like to think so.
THe score is going to be lower against MU because MU will have a slower offensive pace....and we have the SchemeDoc.
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what if Baylor is just that effin' good on offense and our D is better than the points and yards we gave up? I'd like to think so.
THe score is going to be lower against MU because MU will have a slower offensive pace....and we have the SchemeDoc.
Plus I think we'll play better offensively, I don't think we played really well on offense vs Baylor. Part of that was Baylor, but we made plenty of mistakes too.
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That had more to do with the changing of the QB's . . . you probably won't recall but teams that changed QB's that had athletes gave Snyder's best teams fits, I can rattle off numerous games where that was the case during the DOD.
I'm hoping that an increase in the Wildcat formation run with Pease will have a similar effect.
I was encouraged that we saw that more during Mizzou. My guess is that in this four game stretch we'll see it a lot more, if for no other reason than to keep Klein alive.
And Pease being healthy.
Honestly, with the way he ran the ball Saturday, I'd like to see more Pease in the regular package; both in spread gun and 2 back formations. I think Pease hitting the edge on the stretch read could lead to some bigger plays, especially if MU gameplans like Baylor to force Klein to give.
I'm hopeful Pease has only been limited so far because he missed time with injury and we'll see him for more than just Wildcat play calls.
For the most part, Baylor did an excellent job of playing the zone read inside out, knowing that Hubert wasn't going to consistently get the edge for more than a few yards. I almost wanted Thompson or Lockett to line up in the backfield on one of those plays just to see what would happen if we ran that with some elite speed.
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What a great thread. :love: (ftp://:love:) Makes me feel like kind of a dumb-dumb though. :cry: (ftp://:cry:)
Why does Vegas say we lose?
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Missouri's run D is a legitimate concern, they are pretty good: http://www.cfbstats.com/2011/team/434/rushing/defense/gamelog.html
They are, but luckily their pass defense is atrocious. I wouldn't doubt we see The Chamber's first 200 yd game, and we will need it because I think MU will stack for the run. I think we finally connect on a deep ball or two, most likely in the second half. I wouldn't doubt we see LHCBS pound the rock all first half, especially if we have the lead or are within a fg or so, then going to the air in the 3rd for the big play.
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what if Baylor is just that effin' good on offense and our D is better than the points and yards we gave up? I'd like to think so.
THe score is going to be lower against MU because MU will have a slower offensive pace....and we have the SchemeDoc.
Plus I think we'll play better offensively, I don't think we played really well on offense vs Baylor. Part of that was Baylor, but we made plenty of mistakes too.
Braden's hold. :shakesfist:
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For the most part, Baylor did an excellent job of playing the zone read inside out, knowing that Hubert wasn't going to consistently get the edge for more than a few yards. I almost wanted Thompson or Lockett to line up in the backfield on one of those plays just to see what would happen if we ran that with some elite speed.
Baylor forced the give almost everytime by having the DE play Klein, which eventually was going to happen. And to be fair to Hubert there is a level of skill involved by the RB in running stretch read; you have to get to the mesh with the QB running laterally, squeeze the football enough so you can take it on the give, yet not so much you cause a fumble if the QB keeps it. All the while you need to be near full speed by the time you get the ball if it is a give because the run action is a sweep. Its tougher than it looks and takes multiple reps in practice. I just hope Pease can get into the mix there because he is a bigger back and has just as much if not more explosion as Hubert does. I gues all I am saying is give Pease a chance.
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For the most part, Baylor did an excellent job of playing the zone read inside out, knowing that Hubert wasn't going to consistently get the edge for more than a few yards. I almost wanted Thompson or Lockett to line up in the backfield on one of those plays just to see what would happen if we ran that with some elite speed.
Baylor forced the give almost everytime by having the DE play Klein, which eventually was going to happen. And to be fair to Hubert there is a level of skill involved by the RB in running stretch read; you have to get to the mesh with the QB running laterally, squeeze the football enough so you can take it on the give, yet not so much you cause a fumble if the QB keeps it. All the while you need to be near full speed by the time you get the ball if it is a give because the run action is a sweep. Its tougher than it looks and takes multiple reps in practice. I just hope Pease can get into the mix there because he is a bigger back and has just as much if not more explosion as Hubert does. I gues all I am saying is give Pease a chance.
Oh, I've been pleasantly surprised by both Hubert and Pease, and think they can both do the job. I was simply saying it would have been nice to take a shot with the stretch read with a true speedster since Baylor was going to give us the edge. It wouldn't have been a true read in that Kline is going to give the ball on it every time.
And maybe Hubert is faster than I'm giving him credit for and Baylor's defense was just good enough to stretch out the play long enough to limit his effectiveness. :dunno:
Was just tossing it out there as a wrinkle to the stretch read package. Will be interested to see how many other DEs can be as disciplined as Baylor's were Saturday.
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For the most part, Baylor did an excellent job of playing the zone read inside out, knowing that Hubert wasn't going to consistently get the edge for more than a few yards. I almost wanted Thompson or Lockett to line up in the backfield on one of those plays just to see what would happen if we ran that with some elite speed.
Baylor forced the give almost everytime by having the DE play Klein, which eventually was going to happen. And to be fair to Hubert there is a level of skill involved by the RB in running stretch read; you have to get to the mesh with the QB running laterally, squeeze the football enough so you can take it on the give, yet not so much you cause a fumble if the QB keeps it. All the while you need to be near full speed by the time you get the ball if it is a give because the run action is a sweep. Its tougher than it looks and takes multiple reps in practice. I just hope Pease can get into the mix there because he is a bigger back and has just as much if not more explosion as Hubert does. I gues all I am saying is give Pease a chance.
Oh, I've been pleasantly surprised by both Hubert and Pease, and think they can both do the job. I was simply saying it would have been nice to take a shot with the stretch read with a true speedster since Baylor was going to give us the edge. It wouldn't have been a true read in that Kline is going to give the ball on it every time.
And maybe Hubert is faster than I'm giving him credit for and Baylor's defense was just good enough to stretch out the play long enough to limit his effectiveness. :dunno:
Was just tossing it out there as a wrinkle to the stretch read package. Will be interested to see how many other DEs can be as disciplined as Baylor's were Saturday.
Seemed like they were waiting longer to commit to either Hubert or CK, and the play was getting stretched out horizontally, and before too long there was no room for Hubert to turn the corner.
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Oh, I've been pleasantly surprised by both Hubert and Pease, and think they can both do the job. I was simply saying it would have been nice to take a shot with the stretch read with a true speedster since Baylor was going to give us the edge. It wouldn't have been a true read in that Kline is going to give the ball on it every time.
And maybe Hubert is faster than I'm giving him credit for and Baylor's defense was just good enough to stretch out the play long enough to limit his effectiveness. :dunno:
Was just tossing it out there as a wrinkle to the stretch read package. Will be interested to see how many other DEs can be as disciplined as Baylor's were Saturday.
I agree we'll need some wrinkles in the running game, particularly our option package. I won't be surprised to see us start blocking the DE and reading the ILB on stretch read.
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I gues all I am saying is give Pease a chance.
:love:
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Does anyone else feel pretty comfortable with The Chamber to Harper? Nope, just me? :dunno: Well okay then. :frown:
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what if Baylor is just that effin' good on offense and our D is better than the points and yards we gave up? I'd like to think so.
THe score is going to be lower against MU because MU will have a slower offensive pace....and we have the SchemeDoc.
Plus I think we'll play better offensively, I don't think we played really well on offense vs Baylor. Part of that was Baylor, but we made plenty of mistakes too.
Braden's hold. :shakesfist:
:shakesfist:
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what if Baylor is just that effin' good on offense and our D is better than the points and yards we gave up? I'd like to think so.
THe score is going to be lower against MU because MU will have a slower offensive pace....and we have the SchemeDoc.
Plus I think we'll play better offensively, I don't think we played really well on offense vs Baylor. Part of that was Baylor, but we made plenty of mistakes too.
Braden's hold. :shakesfist:
:shakesfist:
It was terrible, and I don't think he needed to do it, especially on one of Hubert's better runs of the day. Then after the INT I was 85% sure the game was over.
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Does anyone else feel pretty comfortable with The Chamber to Harper? Nope, just me? :dunno: Well okay then. :frown:
It's not awful I guess, although I told my breath and go like this (https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fphotos2.fotosearch.com%2Fbthumb%2FDSN%2FDSN014%2F1790532.jpg&hash=3c52de729f26b12d57bb06a94687ef6ac65095e3) every time CK drops back to pass
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what if Baylor is just that effin' good on offense and our D is better than the points and yards we gave up? I'd like to think so.
THe score is going to be lower against MU because MU will have a slower offensive pace....and we have the SchemeDoc.
Plus I think we'll play better offensively, I don't think we played really well on offense vs Baylor. Part of that was Baylor, but we made plenty of mistakes too.
Mistakes like incomplete passes? I'd agree with that, and I didn't think we played all that well, but for the most part we don't go backwards and we get very few penalties. Three yards and a cloud of dust can work if you don't shoot yourself in the foot.
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Will be interested to see how many other DEs can be as disciplined as Baylor's were Saturday.
Most of them will be until we prove we have a passing attack.
That should happen this weekend.