Hey Terry Pierce...

[elkwc]

There is a reason why Mangino won "coach" of the year last year and it wasn't because his team was talented. If you listened to broadcasts of their games during the '07 season neutral observers with lots of experience watching great teams never said anything about how talented the jayhawks were. They always said how well coached and disciplined they were and mentioned how their offensive scheme provided great balance that made it difficult to stop. You can't list numbers and accolades and say it was because of talent and then ignore any of the coaching factors that played a part in them.

I've always said Mangino learned from the best and is a good coach. After saying that if it was the coaching and not the talent why the drop off this year after a few graduated and left early for the NFL? Is it the defensive coach who left? If so then the success had nothing to do with Mangino. If not the coach must of had something to do with talent as I see it. Only a Beaker can spin things where they make no sense.

[Oklahoma_Cat]

I would like to stop the back-and-forth nonsense of this thread and propose a bet to Ben.

If uk beats KSU next year, then I give mjrod permission to ban my ip.

BUT

when KSU beats uk, Ben gets banned.

 

[FBWillie]

bans are for pussies; a gamble of humility is the only answer.

[Meatbag]

How dumb are you, BMW?  Can't you just go back to studying for History 101, especially considering Mr. Pierce's credentials. Starting LB multiple years @ KSU, along with NFL experience, makes him hands down more knowledgeable then anyone on this board.

Please stop now.  You are making a fool of yourself. 

Terry:  Is there a chance that you can snag a position on Snyder's staff???

[catsdo]

I think it's pretty obvious that BMW has mental problems.  He has emotional breakdowns at least once a month.  The guy is insane.  Pretty much everyone on ksufans and phog.net can tell.

[Oklahoma_Cat]

Please stop now.  You are making a fool of yourself. 

Terry:  Is there a chance that you can snag a position on Snyder's staff???

 

[Meatbag]

BMW is a dipcrap for coming on your message board and CALLING TERRY PIERCE OUT on his knowledge of football..

Go study, look for a job or try and get laid..

Jesus H already.

[BMWJhawk]

Like I said BmW...To me this discussion is over. The only and best response you have is Kerry Meier's Talent? Kerry knows the offense in and out. He survives by settling into zones in your spread offense. If you knew anything about Football you would know this for sure. Kerry isn't very slow he plays pretty fast actually, because he knows where he is going and it allows him to use all of his speed. But, he is not talented. He is a QB that moved to WR which a lot of QBs have success with because they know the offense and what the qb should be thinking. With that they have lot of trust from QB and he HC, that they will know where they need to be. This is especially important in a spread. You must be a complete retard, because you are still talking about Big12 rankings as a barometer for measuring talent. Still after the entire board has told you that doesnt measure talent. But I guess I'm the complete moron...

As if it doesn't get any worse, you add a P.S. stating that 2007 wasn't the worst year in the North Division. The same year perennial North leaders KSU, Neb, CU were all down. HOw do you think Mizzou and ku ended in the top. At the same time MU gets there ass blown out by OU in the championship, one of the least competitive ever. And you guys go and beat the ACC champion, in the worst season of that Conference in the Orange Bowl. Then you wonder why you dont repeat this year... BMW you are hilarious! And last thing. It's not called wearing your heart on your sleeve when you come to a rival teams message board and bash your team. It called being a bandwagoner...Except the bandwagon you jumped on had a bad wheel

Nice try, but again, finding holes in the zone isn't the only thing Meier has.  He has better hands, better natural instincts, better overall football skills.  I don't know why you can't admit that, but then again, you're a blind K-State homer who actually thinks last year was the worst year ever for the Big 12 North because K-State wasn't at the top of the division.  News flash:  K-State hasn't done sh*t in the North division since '03, and your school is a traditional loser.  Your school was the first program to reach 500 losses.  You have no tradition outside of a 10-year span.  Aside from that, look at the Big 12 North in '04-'06.  The North winner didn't go 7-1 in conference, let alone finish top 5 in the country.  Let alone have two teams competing for a spot in the BCS National Championship.

As for calling me a bandwagoner, there's another good laugh.  I actually like many posters on this site, and I came here to vent after my Jayhawks lost back-to-back games to Nebraska and Texas.  I still believe Mangino is slightly overpaid.  However, I will never stop cheering for ku.  I will never cheer against my 'hawks.  You have a very twisted view of reality, and I think it's sad that you can't see things from someone else's perspective.

Look, later I will go and highlight each and every reason why ku is more talented.  I will use statistics, detailed examples, and recruiting info.  If you still can't see where I'm coming from after that, then nothing will open your eyes.

[Meatbag]

Look, later I will go and highlight each and every reason why ku is more talented.  I will use statistics, detailed examples, and recruiting info.  If you still can't see where I'm coming from after that, then nothing will open your eyes.

Go to class you putz.  I am sure Mangino appreciates you defending his team to the core. 

[cyclist]

Like I said BmW...To me this discussion is over. The only and best response you have is Kerry Meier's Talent? Kerry knows the offense in and out. He survives by settling into zones in your spread offense. If you knew anything about Football you would know this for sure. Kerry isn't very slow he plays pretty fast actually, because he knows where he is going and it allows him to use all of his speed. But, he is not talented. He is a QB that moved to WR which a lot of QBs have success with because they know the offense and what the qb should be thinking. With that they have lot of trust from QB and he HC, that they will know where they need to be. This is especially important in a spread. You must be a complete retard, because you are still talking about Big12 rankings as a barometer for measuring talent. Still after the entire board has told you that doesnt measure talent. But I guess I'm the complete moron...

As if it doesn't get any worse, you add a P.S. stating that 2007 wasn't the worst year in the North Division. The same year perennial North leaders KSU, Neb, CU were all down. HOw do you think Mizzou and ku ended in the top. At the same time MU gets there ass blown out by OU in the championship, one of the least competitive ever. And you guys go and beat the ACC champion, in the worst season of that Conference in the Orange Bowl. Then you wonder why you dont repeat this year... BMW you are hilarious! And last thing. It's not called wearing your heart on your sleeve when you come to a rival teams message board and bash your team. It called being a bandwagoner...Except the bandwagon you jumped on had a bad wheel

Nice try, but again, finding holes in the zone isn't the only thing Meier has.  He has better hands, better natural instincts, better overall football skills.  I don't know why you can't admit that, but then again, you're a blind K-State homer who actually thinks last year was the worst year ever for the Big 12 North because K-State wasn't at the top of the division.  News flash:  K-State hasn't done sh*t in the North division since '03, and your school is a traditional loser.  Your school was the first program to reach 500 losses.  You have no tradition outside of a 10-year span.  Aside from that, look at the Big 12 North in '04-'06.  The North winner didn't go 7-1 in conference, let alone finish top 5 in the country.  Let alone have two teams competing for a spot in the BCS National Championship.

As for calling me a bandwagoner, there's another good laugh.  I actually like many posters on this site, and I came here to vent after my Jayhawks lost back-to-back games to Nebraska and Texas.  I still believe Mangino is slightly overpaid.  However, I will never stop cheering for ku.  I will never cheer against my 'hawks.  You have a very twisted view of reality, and I think it's sad that you can't see things from someone else's perspective.

Look, later I will go and highlight each and every reason why ku is more talented.  I will use statistics, detailed examples, and recruiting info.  If you still can't see where I'm coming from after that, then nothing will open your eyes.

I am seriously considering 'mercy' banning old Benny for his own protection.  Ben you call out Terry, he pwns you everytime he posts a reply to your inane posts and yet you come back for more !

Seek help !  I'm serious.  Seek help !

BTW,  on the mercy banning, I'm too classless to to stop you from making even more of an ass of yourself in this thread or elsewhere on these boards...

   <---Ben is the smiley face and TP is the cue stick.

[BMWJhawk]

Like I said BmW...To me this discussion is over. The only and best response you have is Kerry Meier's Talent? Kerry knows the offense in and out. He survives by settling into zones in your spread offense. If you knew anything about Football you would know this for sure. Kerry isn't very slow he plays pretty fast actually, because he knows where he is going and it allows him to use all of his speed. But, he is not talented. He is a QB that moved to WR which a lot of QBs have success with because they know the offense and what the qb should be thinking. With that they have lot of trust from QB and he HC, that they will know where they need to be. This is especially important in a spread. You must be a complete retard, because you are still talking about Big12 rankings as a barometer for measuring talent. Still after the entire board has told you that doesnt measure talent. But I guess I'm the complete moron...

As if it doesn't get any worse, you add a P.S. stating that 2007 wasn't the worst year in the North Division. The same year perennial North leaders KSU, Neb, CU were all down. HOw do you think Mizzou and ku ended in the top. At the same time MU gets there ass blown out by OU in the championship, one of the least competitive ever. And you guys go and beat the ACC champion, in the worst season of that Conference in the Orange Bowl. Then you wonder why you dont repeat this year... BMW you are hilarious! And last thing. It's not called wearing your heart on your sleeve when you come to a rival teams message board and bash your team. It called being a bandwagoner...Except the bandwagon you jumped on had a bad wheel

Nice try, but again, finding holes in the zone isn't the only thing Meier has.  He has better hands, better natural instincts, better overall football skills.  I don't know why you can't admit that, but then again, you're a blind K-State homer who actually thinks last year was the worst year ever for the Big 12 North because K-State wasn't at the top of the division.  News flash:  K-State hasn't done sh*t in the North division since '03, and your school is a traditional loser.  Your school was the first program to reach 500 losses.  You have no tradition outside of a 10-year span.  Aside from that, look at the Big 12 North in '04-'06.  The North winner didn't go 7-1 in conference, let alone finish top 5 in the country.  Let alone have two teams competing for a spot in the BCS National Championship.

As for calling me a bandwagoner, there's another good laugh.  I actually like many posters on this site, and I came here to vent after my Jayhawks lost back-to-back games to Nebraska and Texas.  I still believe Mangino is slightly overpaid.  However, I will never stop cheering for ku.  I will never cheer against my 'hawks.  You have a very twisted view of reality, and I think it's sad that you can't see things from someone else's perspective.

Look, later I will go and highlight each and every reason why ku is more talented.  I will use statistics, detailed examples, and recruiting info.  If you still can't see where I'm coming from after that, then nothing will open your eyes.

I am seriously considering 'mercy' banning old Benny for his own protection.  Ben you call out Terry, he pwns you everytime he posts a reply to your inane posts and yet you come back for more !

Seek help !  I'm serious.  Seek help !

BTW,  on the mercy banning, I'm too classless to to stop you from making even more of an ass of yourself in this thread or elsewhere on these boards...

   <---Ben is the smiley face and TP is the cue stick.

It's really surprising that you hang from TP's nut sack like that, but once again, I'm right.  You guys are wrong.  52-21.

[cyclist]

Like I said BmW...To me this discussion is over. The only and best response you have is Kerry Meier's Talent? Kerry knows the offense in and out. He survives by settling into zones in your spread offense. If you knew anything about Football you would know this for sure. Kerry isn't very slow he plays pretty fast actually, because he knows where he is going and it allows him to use all of his speed. But, he is not talented. He is a QB that moved to WR which a lot of QBs have success with because they know the offense and what the qb should be thinking. With that they have lot of trust from QB and he HC, that they will know where they need to be. This is especially important in a spread. You must be a complete retard, because you are still talking about Big12 rankings as a barometer for measuring talent. Still after the entire board has told you that doesnt measure talent. But I guess I'm the complete moron...

As if it doesn't get any worse, you add a P.S. stating that 2007 wasn't the worst year in the North Division. The same year perennial North leaders KSU, Neb, CU were all down. HOw do you think Mizzou and ku ended in the top. At the same time MU gets there ass blown out by OU in the championship, one of the least competitive ever. And you guys go and beat the ACC champion, in the worst season of that Conference in the Orange Bowl. Then you wonder why you dont repeat this year... BMW you are hilarious! And last thing. It's not called wearing your heart on your sleeve when you come to a rival teams message board and bash your team. It called being a bandwagoner...Except the bandwagon you jumped on had a bad wheel

Nice try, but again, finding holes in the zone isn't the only thing Meier has.  He has better hands, better natural instincts, better overall football skills.  I don't know why you can't admit that, but then again, you're a blind K-State homer who actually thinks last year was the worst year ever for the Big 12 North because K-State wasn't at the top of the division.  News flash:  K-State hasn't done sh*t in the North division since '03, and your school is a traditional loser.  Your school was the first program to reach 500 losses.  You have no tradition outside of a 10-year span.  Aside from that, look at the Big 12 North in '04-'06.  The North winner didn't go 7-1 in conference, let alone finish top 5 in the country.  Let alone have two teams competing for a spot in the BCS National Championship.

As for calling me a bandwagoner, there's another good laugh.  I actually like many posters on this site, and I came here to vent after my Jayhawks lost back-to-back games to Nebraska and Texas.  I still believe Mangino is slightly overpaid.  However, I will never stop cheering for ku.  I will never cheer against my 'hawks.  You have a very twisted view of reality, and I think it's sad that you can't see things from someone else's perspective.

Look, later I will go and highlight each and every reason why ku is more talented.  I will use statistics, detailed examples, and recruiting info.  If you still can't see where I'm coming from after that, then nothing will open your eyes.

I am seriously considering 'mercy' banning old Benny for his own protection.  Ben you call out Terry, he pwns you everytime he posts a reply to your inane posts and yet you come back for more !

Seek help !  I'm serious.  Seek help !

BTW,  on the mercy banning, I'm too classless to to stop you from making even more of an ass of yourself in this thread or elsewhere on these boards...

   <---Ben is the smiley face and TP is the cue stick.

It's really surprising that you hang from TP's nut sack like that, but once again, I'm right.  You guys are wrong.  52-21.

I'm sorry if the truth hurts, Ben.  You'll be a better person for accepting it.

[Saulbadguy]

Like I said BmW...To me this discussion is over. The only and best response you have is Kerry Meier's Talent? Kerry knows the offense in and out. He survives by settling into zones in your spread offense. If you knew anything about Football you would know this for sure. Kerry isn't very slow he plays pretty fast actually, because he knows where he is going and it allows him to use all of his speed. But, he is not talented. He is a QB that moved to WR which a lot of QBs have success with because they know the offense and what the qb should be thinking. With that they have lot of trust from QB and he HC, that they will know where they need to be. This is especially important in a spread. You must be a complete retard, because you are still talking about Big12 rankings as a barometer for measuring talent. Still after the entire board has told you that doesnt measure talent. But I guess I'm the complete moron...

As if it doesn't get any worse, you add a P.S. stating that 2007 wasn't the worst year in the North Division. The same year perennial North leaders KSU, Neb, CU were all down. HOw do you think Mizzou and ku ended in the top. At the same time MU gets there ass blown out by OU in the championship, one of the least competitive ever. And you guys go and beat the ACC champion, in the worst season of that Conference in the Orange Bowl. Then you wonder why you dont repeat this year... BMW you are hilarious! And last thing. It's not called wearing your heart on your sleeve when you come to a rival teams message board and bash your team. It called being a bandwagoner...Except the bandwagon you jumped on had a bad wheel

Nice try, but again, finding holes in the zone isn't the only thing Meier has.  He has better hands, better natural instincts, better overall football skills.  I don't know why you can't admit that, but then again, you're a blind K-State homer who actually thinks last year was the worst year ever for the Big 12 North because K-State wasn't at the top of the division.  News flash:  K-State hasn't done sh*t in the North division since '03, and your school is a traditional loser.  Your school was the first program to reach 500 losses.  You have no tradition outside of a 10-year span.  Aside from that, look at the Big 12 North in '04-'06.  The North winner didn't go 7-1 in conference, let alone finish top 5 in the country.  Let alone have two teams competing for a spot in the BCS National Championship.

As for calling me a bandwagoner, there's another good laugh.  I actually like many posters on this site, and I came here to vent after my Jayhawks lost back-to-back games to Nebraska and Texas.  I still believe Mangino is slightly overpaid.  However, I will never stop cheering for ku.  I will never cheer against my 'hawks.  You have a very twisted view of reality, and I think it's sad that you can't see things from someone else's perspective.

Look, later I will go and highlight each and every reason why ku is more talented.  I will use statistics, detailed examples, and recruiting info.  If you still can't see where I'm coming from after that, then nothing will open your eyes.

I am seriously considering 'mercy' banning old Benny for his own protection.  Ben you call out Terry, he pwns you everytime he posts a reply to your inane posts and yet you come back for more !

Seek help !  I'm serious.  Seek help !

BTW,  on the mercy banning, I'm too classless to to stop you from making even more of an ass of yourself in this thread or elsewhere on these boards...

   <---Ben is the smiley face and TP is the cue stick.

It's really surprising that you hang from TP's nut sack like that, but once again, I'm right.  You guys are wrong.  52-21.

It's not like he actually played the game or anything. 

[sonofdaxjones]

I just want to sit back and admire this.

On one side; a ku frat boy pissant.   On the other side; a former D1 football player, the Big 12 Defensive Freshman of the Year, an Academic All Big 12 team member,  and a 2nd round NFL draft pick.

[fbc4lif]

Mr. Pierce, you are beyond delusional. 


 How many 12-win seasons did you guys have?  ku's '07 team would have wiped the field with you guys, especially in '03.

You do realize BMW that it used to be an 11 game regular season....or do you honestly believe that given an extra cream puff opponent (like ku's 07  non-con) KSU teams in 97, 98, 99 wouldn't have won an extra game pushing their win total to 12.  What a ridiculously stupid comment.

And for the record.....you can NEVER.....EVER....try and compare a ku 07 team that wasn't good enough to win its own division outright to teams that either won their division or won their conference.  You lost to the only big 12 team you played with a pulse last year.  You did not have the opportunity to play for your own conference title....yet you want to compare that team to KSU teams in 98, 2000, and 2003 that earned that right and in one case was the best the conference had to offer.  You want to compare ku 07 to a team that wiped the floor with an OU squad that the computers and voters placed in the national title game.  You want to compare ku 07 to a 98 KSU team that actually did win all of their games in the regular season...that got it done on the field...that earned the right to play for their conference championship.  You want to compare ku 07 to a 2002 KSU squad that soundly beat an Orange Bowl winning USC squad....with a heisman trophy qb.  That USC team's "talent" would run circles around the product Va. Tech put on the field last January.  

Seriously BMW.  Your posts are getting more and more ridiculous.  I personally agree with you that ku 08 has more "talent" than KSU 08...but your posts about how great your 07 squad was are just terrible.  

  

[PittsburgJayhawk]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

[pissclams]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

I think you make a good point- wtf kind of talent are people arguing about here? But if you read between the not so narrow lines, it's obvious that TP thinks a lot of ku's success last year comes from a weak schedule and players who are benefitting from their individual roles in Mangino's system.  Indirectly, he's complimenting ku's coaching staff, by attributing your player's and team's success with Mangino.  What would you rather have, a 2 year talented pothead like Talib, or a staff that can turn above average athletes like Meier into winners of college football games year in and year out?  Meier won't succeed at the NFL level, even your most crimson colored glasses should allow you to see that, but he sure played a big role in beating MU last Saturday. 

And FWIW, no one here is above being questioned, and BMW should feel free to fire away at TP without fear of being banned.  Some of you posters are on TP's nuts like ants on candy, which is understandable in an EMAW type of way, but because of his connection to K-State he undoubtably carries more homerism that a lot of us.

[PittsburgJayhawk]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

  Meier won't succeed at the NFL level, even your most crimson colored glasses should allow you to see that, but he sure played a big role in beating MU last Saturday. 

Obvious set-up aside, what, exactly, makes you so sure of this? I'm not saying he's a lock for NFL stardom or anything, but a 6'3", 220 lb. athlete of his caliber, with his hands, will get a long, hard look.

Derek Fine has started a couple of games at TE this year for the Bills, as a rookie, and he's doing exceedingly well. I'm not sure there were many folks who thought he was capable of playing in the league either.

Kerry's injury history could keep him out, but I think an absolute "He won't succeed at the NFL level" is silly.

[pissclams]

Forum bet:  1,000 ksufans.com points on the line-   Meier and Nick Reid share drive thru window duties at the Hays Wendy's within  2 years.

[pissclams]

added- props on defending golden boy 2 and ignoring the rest of the post.  i'd do the same thing after last weekend.   

[BMWJhawk]

I just want to sit back and admire this.

On one side; a ku frat boy pissant.   On the other side; a former D1 football player, the Big 12 Defensive Freshman of the Year, an Academic All Big 12 team member,  and a 2nd round NFL draft pick.

That's the beauty of message boards.  I can argue with a guy who I greatly respect as far as his football talent and as a human being, but who I fundamentally disagree with on certain issues.  Mike Leach never played college football, but he's a hell of a football coach.  Just because I wasn't out there making tackles doesn't mean I can't have an opinion or be right about certain things.  

Reverse the roles, 'Pad... imagine a ku fan tryin to convince K-State fans that after losing 52-21, ku was just as talented.  That ku fan would be crucified and called moron.  There's a double standard at play here, and instead of K-State fans using their own common sense, you're resorting to personal attacks and blind homerism.

[TheCatsMeow]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

  Meier won't succeed at the NFL level, even your most crimson colored glasses should allow you to see that, but he sure played a big role in beating MU last Saturday. 

Obvious set-up aside, what, exactly, makes you so sure of this? I'm not saying he's a lock for NFL stardom or anything, but a 6'3", 220 lb. athlete of his caliber, with his hands, will get a long, hard look.

Derek Fine has started a couple of games at TE this year for the Bills, as a rookie, and he's doing exceedingly well. I'm not sure there were many folks who thought he was capable of playing in the league either.

Kerry's injury history could keep him out, but I think an absolute "He won't succeed at the NFL level" is silly.

I dont know Kerry's speed but I can tell you that GM's are going to pass on him just because he has only been there for two years now.  There are more talented (here we go again) then Kerry Meier out there for NFL gm's to draft.  Now thats not saying he wont get a shot but what role would he play, dont think he is tough enough to be a Dallas Clark.  He defenitly isnt a number one type reciever, and the only role I can see him in is something like Gonzalez from OSU.  He will defenitly get a shot just like Pat White will but I dont think either will make it.  I hope they prove me wrong.

[BMWJhawk]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

  Meier won't succeed at the NFL level, even your most crimson colored glasses should allow you to see that, but he sure played a big role in beating MU last Saturday. 

Obvious set-up aside, what, exactly, makes you so sure of this? I'm not saying he's a lock for NFL stardom or anything, but a 6'3", 220 lb. athlete of his caliber, with his hands, will get a long, hard look.

Derek Fine has started a couple of games at TE this year for the Bills, as a rookie, and he's doing exceedingly well. I'm not sure there were many folks who thought he was capable of playing in the league either.

Kerry's injury history could keep him out, but I think an absolute "He won't succeed at the NFL level" is silly.

I dont know Kerry's speed but I can tell you that GM's are going to pass on him just because he has only been there for two years now.  There are more talented (here we go again) then Kerry Meier out there for NFL gm's to draft.  Now thats not saying he wont get a shot but what role would he play, dont think he is tough enough to be a Dallas Clark.  He defenitly isnt a number one type reciever, and the only role I can see him in is something like Gonzalez from OSU.  He will defenitly get a shot just like Pat White will but I dont think either will make it.  I hope they prove me wrong.

Meier's only a reshirt-junior.  He has another season to improve and gain more experience at the position.  He'll definitely get a shot in the NFL.

[PittsburgJayhawk]

added- props on defending golden boy 2 and ignoring the rest of the post.  i'd do the same thing after last weekend.   

The rest of your post contained nothing of interest to me, clams.  Sorry. 

[TheCatsMeow]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

  Meier won't succeed at the NFL level, even your most crimson colored glasses should allow you to see that, but he sure played a big role in beating MU last Saturday. 

Obvious set-up aside, what, exactly, makes you so sure of this? I'm not saying he's a lock for NFL stardom or anything, but a 6'3", 220 lb. athlete of his caliber, with his hands, will get a long, hard look.

Derek Fine has started a couple of games at TE this year for the Bills, as a rookie, and he's doing exceedingly well. I'm not sure there were many folks who thought he was capable of playing in the league either.

Kerry's injury history could keep him out, but I think an absolute "He won't succeed at the NFL level" is silly.

I dont know Kerry's speed but I can tell you that GM's are going to pass on him just because he has only been there for two years now.  There are more talented (here we go again) then Kerry Meier out there for NFL gm's to draft.  Now thats not saying he wont get a shot but what role would he play, dont think he is tough enough to be a Dallas Clark.  He defenitly isnt a number one type reciever, and the only role I can see him in is something like Gonzalez from OSU.  He will defenitly get a shot just like Pat White will but I dont think either will make it.  I hope they prove me wrong.

Meier's only a reshirt-junior.  He has another season to improve and gain more experience at the position.  He'll definitely get a shot in the NFL.

Sooooooooooooooo.... you just took what I said and added a sentence??    READ THE POST, I said he would get a shot.  Lets be honest he isnt an NFL athlete, sorry!

[PittsburgJayhawk]

NFLDraftScout.com has him listed currently as the #17 WR in the 2010 NFL Draft, FWIW. 

His career may not be more productive than Nick Reid's, but I don't get the point of speaking in absolutes. He's going to get a shot, and not as a UFA.

[TheCatsMeow]

NFLDraftScout.com has him listed currently as the #17 WR in the 2010 NFL Draft, FWIW. 

His career may not be more productive than Nick Reid's, but I don't get the point of speaking in absolutes. He's going to get a shot, and not as a UFA.

I was never bashing Meier, I just dont think he is going to be a good reciever in the NFL.  I HOPE HE GETS A GREAT CHANCE!   

[BMWJhawk]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

  Meier won't succeed at the NFL level, even your most crimson colored glasses should allow you to see that, but he sure played a big role in beating MU last Saturday. 

Obvious set-up aside, what, exactly, makes you so sure of this? I'm not saying he's a lock for NFL stardom or anything, but a 6'3", 220 lb. athlete of his caliber, with his hands, will get a long, hard look.

Derek Fine has started a couple of games at TE this year for the Bills, as a rookie, and he's doing exceedingly well. I'm not sure there were many folks who thought he was capable of playing in the league either.

Kerry's injury history could keep him out, but I think an absolute "He won't succeed at the NFL level" is silly.

I dont know Kerry's speed but I can tell you that GM's are going to pass on him just because he has only been there for two years now.  There are more talented (here we go again) then Kerry Meier out there for NFL gm's to draft.  Now thats not saying he wont get a shot but what role would he play, dont think he is tough enough to be a Dallas Clark.  He defenitly isnt a number one type reciever, and the only role I can see him in is something like Gonzalez from OSU.  He will defenitly get a shot just like Pat White will but I dont think either will make it.  I hope they prove me wrong.

Meier's only a reshirt-junior.  He has another season to improve and gain more experience at the position.  He'll definitely get a shot in the NFL.

Sooooooooooooooo.... you just took what I said and added a sentence??    READ THE POST, I said he would get a shot.  Lets be honest he isnt an NFL athlete, sorry!

First of all, you said Meier had only played the position two years, implying this was his last season.  Next, you haven't been watching much ku football if you don't think Meier is a good athlete.  He's got good speed and good size for an NFL tight end/possession receiver.  Derek Fine is playing a lot for the Buffalo Bills, and Meier is both faster and more athletic than Fine.

Once again, K-State fans are letting their bias get in the way of common sense.

[PittsburgJayhawk]

NFLDraftScout.com has him listed currently as the #17 WR in the 2010 NFL Draft, FWIW. 

His career may not be more productive than Nick Reid's, but I don't get the point of speaking in absolutes. He's going to get a shot, and not as a UFA.

I was never bashing Meier, I just dont think he is going to be a good reciever in the NFL.  I HOPE HE GETS A GREAT CHANCE!   

Wasn't responding to you directly. Just putting a little more information out there.

[yoga-lika_abana]

I still don't understand what constitutes "talent," as it pertains to this discussion. Kerry Meier isn't talented? By what measure? He's big, a great overall athlete, and has outstanding hands – to say nothing of his natural understanding of the game of football.  He's a likely NFL draft pick after next season.  Does the NFL draft kids that don't have talent?

  Meier won't succeed at the NFL level, even your most crimson colored glasses should allow you to see that, but he sure played a big role in beating MU last Saturday. 

Obvious set-up aside, what, exactly, makes you so sure of this? I'm not saying he's a lock for NFL stardom or anything, but a 6'3", 220 lb. athlete of his caliber, with his hands, will get a long, hard look.

Derek Fine has started a couple of games at TE this year for the Bills, as a rookie, and he's doing exceedingly well. I'm not sure there were many folks who thought he was capable of playing in the league either.

Kerry's injury history could keep him out, but I think an absolute "He won't succeed at the NFL level" is silly.

I dont know Kerry's speed but I can tell you that GM's are going to pass on him just because he has only been there for two years now.  There are more talented (here we go again) then Kerry Meier out there for NFL gm's to draft.  Now thats not saying he wont get a shot but what role would he play, dont think he is tough enough to be a Dallas Clark.  He defenitly isnt a number one type reciever, and the only role I can see him in is something like Gonzalez from OSU.  He will defenitly get a shot just like Pat White will but I dont think either will make it.  I hope they prove me wrong.

Meier's only a reshirt-junior.  He has another season to improve and gain more experience at the position.  He'll definitely get a shot in the NFL.

Sooooooooooooooo.... you just took what I said and added a sentence??    READ THE POST, I said he would get a shot.  Lets be honest he isnt an NFL athlete, sorry!

First of all, you said Meier had only played the position two years, implying this was his last season.  Next, you haven't been watching much ku football if you don't think Meier is a good athlete.  He's got good speed and good size for an NFL tight end/possession receiver.  Derek Fine is playing a lot for the Buffalo Bills, and Meier is both faster and more athletic than Fine.

Once again, K-State fans are letting their bias get in the way of common sense.