Is it really that hard to recruit to Manhattan?

[Saulbadguy]

I always disagree with people who say this, and with the tone that Manhattan is some barren wasteland.  I've always felt that location is closer to the bottom of the list when it comes to importance to recruits, with things like state of the program, coaches, and coaching philosphy above it. 

I also say bring up how the football program has brought in good talent, to which I get the reply "Well, that's because the football program was good".  Well, no crap. 

No matter what I say I get the same  (mainly from ku fans, who think Lawrence is the cultural center of the Midwest), kinda irritates me.  What say you, KSUFans posters?

[michigancat]

My short answer:

http://www.ksufans.com/forums/index.php?topic=45.0


My serious answer:

Usually when someone tells me it's "Tough to recruit to Manhattan" I ask them if they've ever been to Lubbock.  To Stillwater.  To Norman.  To Ames. To Waco.  That's the type of city we're up against, primarily, and we stack up pretty well with most, IMO.

It obviously has some challenges.  I think much of the perception is based on what middle-aged white suburban men think young black urban teens want from a college experience.  However, as I've said about Huggins, sometimes perception is half of reality.  That's especially true in recruiting.

The drive from KCI to Manhattan is a LONG one, and it really feels like Manhattan is isolated, which it is.  That's definitely a disadvantage.  To me, though, that's also part of what makes Manhattan special.  People go to the "city" a lot less than they would in a place like Lawrence, Norman, or College Station.  Most students stays in town to party most of the time.

When you get right down to it, though, Manhattan has pretty much everything any other Big XII city has, save Austin and Boulder (which is very overrated IMO, that's another discussion).  Players like Marques, Dez, Cartier, etc. proved that you can get decent basketball recruits to Manhattan.


Also, KSU fans have a huge inferiority complex.  That doesn't help the perception.

[Saulbadguy]

My short answer:

http://www.ksufans.com/forums/index.php?topic=45.0

Nice.

My serious answer:

Usually when someone tells me it's "Tough to recruit to Manhattan" I ask them if they've ever been to Lubbock.  To Stillwater.  To Norman.  To Ames. To Waco.  That's the type of city we're up against, primarily, and we stack up pretty well with most, IMO.

Most of them have never even been to Manhattan.  Lubbock, Stillwater, Ames, and Iowa City are pretty good comparisons IMO.  I could bring up Storrs, CT too but they would have no clue what i'm talking about.

It obviously has some challenges.  I think much of the perception is based on what middle-aged white suburban men think young black urban teens want from a college experience.  However, as I've said about Huggins, sometimes perception is half of reality.  That's especially true in recruiting.

I kind of feel if thats what they want from college, i'd almost rather not have them here.  Go elsewhere to "club it up".

Also, KSU fans have a huge inferiority complex.  That doesn't help the perception.

Very true. Why is that?

[ksu_FAN]

The perception is a condition brought on by years of not being very good.

I think Wooly has proven you can get some pretty good HS talent to Manhattan.  There is immediate needs.  Kelvin Sampson at OU has proven you can recruit to a program that is overshadowed by FB and he is a master at mixing HS and JUCO kids.  Its not like he's getting Cheeseburger AAs all the time.

Stillwater, Waco, and especially Lubbuck are great examples.

[michigancat]

Most of them have never even been to Manhattan.  Lubbock, Stillwater, Ames, and Iowa City are pretty good comparisons IMO.  I could bring up Storrs, CT too but they would have no clue what i'm talking about.

Lou Holtz had a great quote about Storrs, something of the effect of, "They shouldn't call it Storrs until they get a second one."  I think a lot of people that talk crap on Manhattan haven't spent a significant amount of time there.  I can see how someone could get a bad impression of Manhattan just driving to and from the stadium.  Heck, you can't even really see campus without walking through it...I wonder how many people that consider campus "ugly" have actually gone for a walk from Haymaker to the Union.

I kind of feel if thats what they want from college, i'd almost rather not have them here.  Go elsewhere to "club it up".

I agree, to a certain extent.

Very true. Why is that?

Maybe because farmers are generally humble people?  I really don't know.


I think the perception exists for football, too.  That guy from the Sporting News said KSU was one of the toughest public universities to recruit to in the country.

[ksu_FAN]

Rusty, has Rick moved to #1?

[Dan Rydell]

If you're looking for a total college experience, then Manhattan is as good as it gets.  Great bar district.  Great people.  Easy to get around town.  Lots of support for sporting events.  Good speakers and events on campus. 

[michigancat]

Rusty, has Rick moved to #1?

Yep.

[Saulbadguy]

I'd really like to move to Manhattan.  Fiancee, after spending 4 years there, wants some greener grass for now.  I'll convince her, some day.

[michigancat]

I had a great job in Manhattan and left.  Definitely one of the biggest mistakes I've ever made.

[ksu_FAN]

We agree.  I'd take Majerus in a heartbeat.

I've lived in Manhattan for 13 years now, including 5 in college.  Great place to live.

[Saulbadguy]

Topeka really sucks.  It's outrageous that to do anything, I have to travel an hour either way.

[Dan Rydell]

Topeka really sucks.  It's outrageous that to do anything, I have to travel an hour either way.

Word.  When I got my job here, I didn't even consider living here...I knew I was staying in Lawrence.

[KS4KSU]

If you guys hate Topeka so much, don't let the door hit you in the A$$. I admit it is a hard place to buy heroine or find an attractive prostitute, but to raise a family and make great lifelong friends, it is wonderful. You think Staters have an inferiority complex? Try Topekans. It has not stopped Bob Chipman from dominating the MIAA since it began.

[Saulbadguy]

If you guys hate Topeka so much, don't let the door hit you in the A$$. I admit it is a hard place to buy heroine or find an attractive prostitute, but to raise a family and make great lifelong friends, it is wonderful. You think Staters have an inferiority complex? Try Topekans. It has not stopped Bob Chipman from dominating the MIAA since it began.

I've lived here all my life.  It is just not a very progressive town, and i'm not talking about liberalism/conservatism at all.  I'm just waiting to see how they screw up the College Hill redevelopment plan. 

Oh..and Bob Chipman isn't dominating the MIAA this year. 

[Dan Rydell]

If you guys hate Topeka so much, don't let the door hit you in the A$$. I admit it is a hard place to buy heroine or find an attractive prostitute, but to raise a family and make great lifelong friends, it is wonderful.

Oh, it's a good place to make money, but it's a b*tch to drive around.  I love the Capitol, and Washburn has a nice campus, but the rest of Topeka really isn't much to look at.  If you're young, single, and just out of school, Lawrence blows Topeka out of the water in terms of things to do.

[KS4KSU]

No doubt Lawrence is a fun town.  So is Manhattan. Sorry if I sounded harsh,  I just get sick of people dogging Topeka. It has the same problems most cities this size have. As far as the College Hill deal, we should be happy that someone is putting money into the inner city instead of the Wanamaker corridor or northern suburbs. I know I've had plenty of fun in all three towns, and the beer tasted the same.

[kougar24]

I f*cking hate Topeka with a passion. I'm trying my damndest to get my girlfriend to get the hell outta Washburn.

[michigancat]

I f*cking hate Topeka with a passion. I'm trying my damndest to get my girlfriend to get the hell outta Washburn.

You're from salina?

[kougar24]

I f*cking hate Topeka with a passion. I'm trying my damndest to get my girlfriend to get the hell outta Washburn.

You're from salina?

Yeah. A) I never said I liked Salina, and B) Topeka is crapty and unsafe.

[fatty fat fat]

Salina is a powerhouse.

[michigancat]

I f*cking hate Topeka with a passion. I'm trying my damndest to get my girlfriend to get the hell outta Washburn.

You're from salina?

Yeah. A) I never said I liked Salina, and B) Topeka is crapty and unsafe.

A)  I never said you said you liked Salina.   B) You're from Salina?

[kougar24]

Salina is a powerhouse.

Can't argue with that.

[Saulbadguy]

I f*cking hate Topeka with a passion. I'm trying my damndest to get my girlfriend to get the hell outta Washburn.

You're from salina?

Yeah. A) I never said I liked Salina, and B) Topeka is crapty and unsafe.

Unsafe..meh.  Only if you hang out on the eastside.

[mjrod]

Having been all over the world, and lived in couple big cities, each type of city offers it's own appeal.

Manhattan, by far, is not exactly paradise.   But it's not a bad place either.  You like the small town atmosphere, great, but unlike other small towns, having a major university within the city limits gives it some pizazz.

Having grown up in the Little Apple, and having returned about once a year, I have come to realize how different the world really is.   I could not live in Manhattan again.  Kansas City, maybe, but never in a small town.   I lived in Berlin Germany when I left Manhattan, and talk about a BIG TOWN, it was about 110 miles across at it's most widest points.   I lived in Manhattan NY, for about 3 months on a job there and while it's got the same bustle as Berlin, and as many people, it really wasn't much different, other than I could understand the obnoxious people.    Living in the Phoenix Area, I have grown accustomed to the wider expanse that Berlin carries, except out here, it's like pretty new.   Who'd a thought that having a block wall fence around all the properties was a cool thing?   

Big Cities offer more opportunities for me for what I do, and so I have shedded the small town community lifestyle. Manhappiness will always be a quaint little town because there are enough people of influence there that want to keep it that way.   That's not to say it couldn't be better, just that one of the business reasons Manhattan is such a bad place is the political nature of the Manhattan Chamber of Commerce.  The old "big fish in the little pond" is what makes it unattractive for any real growth and opportunity.   My Dad owns a furniture store there, and he still has lots of trouble trying to make his business go.   Success requires a lot of external assistance, unless you can get a business that everyone will want to be part of.

For a recruit, it's the best place if you're serious about getting a good education.  For a family, it has great appeal for a good and decent community, if you can find a job that will support you.   For people like me that seek more out of life, then it's not the place to be.

[Saulbadguy]

Good post, it's really about what you seek out of life.

Me..i'd be happy sitting on my ass watching some sort of K-State sporting event (from Womens volleyball to Pingball) every night.

[kougar24]

Hey MJ, nice work with the new site. Did you ever make it down to Prague while you were in Germany?

[mjrod]

Thanks Kougar.. glad to see you over here giving Rusty and the gang grief.   

Yep, been to Prague, on a military exchange visit.   Prague was in the middle of a major redevelopment and many western stores were buying up shops in the business district at the time.

Most of my time was spent in Germany, Italy, and Belgium, but I did do some traveling.   Visited Poland and the many crystal vendors, Budapest, and was in Macedonia for a short while.

French people are pretty nice, but most Europeans smell on warm days.   But the beer was always good.

[kougar24]

Thanks Kougar.. glad to see you over here giving Rusty and the gang grief.   

Yep, been to Prague, on a military exchange visit.   Prague was in the middle of a major redevelopment and many western stores were buying up shops in the business district at the time.

Most of my time was spent in Germany, Italy, and Belgium, but I did do some traveling.   Visited Poland and the many crystal vendors, Budapest, and was in Macedonia for a short while.

French people are pretty nice, but most Europeans smell on warm days.   But the beer was always good.

This must be a reflection of the difference in times we were over there, but we found the French to be assholes in general. Prague's revitalization as far as tourism and Western culture is in full swing, but thankfully it still manages to keep its Eastern heritage and landscape intact.

Budapest was sweet; did you get to spend an afternoon in an ancient Roman bathhouse? Glorious, I tell ya. Where all in Italy did you get to?

Oh, and I'm not here to give those guys grief. I'm here because it's a K-State board, and I can never have too much of that. 

[fatty fat fat]

Kougs, when does Hoag head off to Japan?