This is going to get bad real soon.

[sonofdaxjones]

I am speaking of their credentials in general.

In addition, Morris is assisted by a coach with over 20 years of D1 Experience, and another coach who has been a D1 coordinator. 

Plus you banter about the word "extensive" way to much ... Brent Venables had no where CLOSE to "extensive" D1 experience prior to being named Co-Coordinator by DEFAULT.

Think about it; when Leavitt and Bobby Stoops left ... instead of promoting Mike Stoops and Brent  Venables ... Snyder went out and re-hired Bob Cope.

My point is ... if you look at the makeup of Snyder's early staff, from an experience, youthfulness and enthusiasm standpoint, the current KSU staff of assistants is very similar ... very similar.   

If they suck, I'll say they suck, but I am not going to say all is lost and they suck before one single freakin game has been played.

Anybody who doesn't think KSU football recruiting needed a paradigm shift is livingin la-la land ... it was quite clear things needed to change.  I'll take a freakin 2 star high school kid with the build, the upside and the coachability long before I want to see KSU running around in late January begging for JC kids, or some JC kid out of California that's going to spend a whole 10 days in camp.

[Andy]

Admit it Dax, you'd take the manginosaur over prince any day of the week and twice on sundays.

Are you serious?

Mangino was a very good assistant.  Horrible head coach, he is taking advantage of Snyder's brilliant scheduling shannanigans and consistently losing conference games.  It is fool's gold.

Mangino has lead a once very poor jayhawk football team to a bowl game and increased expectations every year. He isn't a perfect head coach but he's far from horrible.

Prince has no recruiting ties in the big 12 region, no head coaching experience, and his first start in recruiting leaves a lot to be desired. He was left with a 5-6 team and must implement an entirely new system. He was never even part of the 'kstate family' while Mangino was at least involved with Ksu and snyder before Ou.

You'd honestly want Prince at your situation?

I'll ask that question again after this season. 

part of the great con going on in lawrence under mangino.  lets face it, if terry allen had played the same non-con mangino has, he'd still be coaching at ku.  i can't even name another big 12 school that has used I-AA wins to qualify for a bowl...let alone twice in 3 years.  whats even worse for ku is despite a north that is nowhere near where it was when allen was coach, mangino has only managed to get to 3 big 12 wins in a season, and 1 on the road in his career.  mangino also still has yet to have one of his own recruits drafted. 

basically mangino has a job for 3 reasons:
1. he beat the worst kstate team in 15 years and manages to clown the worst big 12 coach (pinkle) every year.
2. he used I-AA teams to qualify for bowl games twice (a rule that used to only be allowed once every 4 years)
3. ku has really stepped up their marketing/money spent on football to get the fans out

i hope he is there forever.

[ds43fan]

http://kansasstate.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?Sport=1&pr_key=40542
we'll be fine

[purplecobra]

I don't understand that.  we will be fine why?  cause you posted a profile of a current player?

[mjrod]

I don't understand that.  we will be fine why?  cause you posted a profile of a current player?

Because the current player had no stars when he was recruited.

[purplecobra]

and, for all those thinking that the 4 stars and higher are gonna fall out of the sky.  as of now, we have offered 23 players with 4-5 star rankings.  of those 23 15 are left.  I don't know the 15 and their interest in ksu but I do know that one of these recruits is a full fledged idiot.  Plus, one thing he said bothered me about our coaches.  Anyway, he recently took a visit to KSU and didn't realize that Bill Snyder wasn't coaching anymore.  What kind of person visits a school and doesn't even know who the heck the coach is?  anyway, here comes the bothersome quote.

"I'm not a morning person, and the head coach said he doesn't believe in morning practices," Burns said with a laugh.


ummm... really motivated  

[mjrod]

No, all 23 are still up for grabs.

This recruiting thing seems lost on you guys.  Early commits can change because things change throughout the process.   This is nothing new.  We are at the beginning of the process.

[purplecobra]

"Because the current player had no stars when he was recruited"

and?   

[mjrod]

"Because the current player had no stars when he was recruited"

and?   

You can ask Jon McGraw that question when you're up to.   Stars have little meaning because it doesn't matter what happens when they go into a program, it matters what they are when they leave.

[purplecobra]

stars have little meaning?  recite last years top ten and tell me that again, with a straight face

plus, it aint so much the stars.  I like to look at the list of offers.  our commits don't have impressive offers, alot of them have no offers

[mjrod]

stars have little meaning?  recite last years top ten and tell me that again, with a straight face

plus, it aint so much the stars.  I like to look at the list of offers.  our commits don't have impressive offers, alot of them have no offers

What you wanted to say was that stars have SOME meaning and that OFFERS have SOME meaning. You also want to exclude things like COACHING and ABILITY of the athletes to stay focused in school, personal issues.

Stars don't guarantee anything, and certainly not spots on 2-deepl.  For every example you have of a five star being a national name, there are as many, if not more that fizzled out with the same star count.  Do I want the best talent on our team?  Yes.  Is it realistic?  No.  Do I think our coaching staff is capable of bringing in a great class?  Yes, but, recruiting isn't over.  It's over in February.   Trying to evaluate the current class, as it is, is premature.

[purplecobra]

stars only have some meaning because the people who award the stars take into account who offers the players.  If a player has 20 offers and 2 stars I ignore the stars and look at the offers.

[chum1]

I'll take our current assistant coaches over Snyder's most recent assistant coaches for one reason.  Snyder's most recent assistant coaches have proven that they cannot get the job done.  You can't say the same thing about our current assistant coaches.

[waks]

stars have little meaning?  recite last years top ten and tell me that again, with a straight face

plus, it aint so much the stars.  I like to look at the list of offers.  our commits don't have impressive offers, alot of them have no offers

dude, stop referring to kstate as us and we (and any other phrases of the two) you are not a wildcat! you do not like kansas state. you have way too much time on  your hands, get on your husker board and talk to ppl who might like you.. mj is it ok if i call this guy a &@#%ING tool?

[purplecobra]

"I'll take our current assistant coaches over Snyder's most recent assistant coaches for one reason.  Snyder's most recent assistant coaches have proven that they cannot get the job done."

I have to disagree.  The problem we've had recently has been talent, not coaching.  If Snyder has proven one thing over his carrear it's that he has an eye for great assistant coaches.  maybe your saying that Snyder woke up one day and forgot  how in the heck to hire a coach, I don't believe that.  Snyder has worked with some of the best and hired some of the best.  Snyder seemed to have the Midas touch when it came to surrounding himself with great ac's.  I doubt he forgot how to do that.  Also, as a fan I wanted to vomit at the spring game when I saw our DC acting like a 13 year old.  I know our coaches are young and some extra energy is expected but it's time to start being a role model and an authority figure not a friend to the players

[chum1]

"I'll take our current assistant coaches over Snyder's most recent assistant coaches for one reason. Snyder's most recent assistant coaches have proven that they cannot get the job done."

I have to disagree. The problem we've had recently has been talent, not coaching.

'Talent' is such a BS word.  Typically, it is more liberally attributed ex post facto to teams that were good, and not to teams that were bad.  All you're telling me is that Snyder's better teams were better.

I'll take a guess that you're talking about some sort of function of recruting rankings.  The truth is that Snyder's recruiting rankings have essentially remained constant for quite a while.  It is other things that have changed.  One of those things is the assistant coaches.

If Snyder's most recent assistants are as good as his past assistants, we will see them in head coaching positions in the future.  I don't see that happening, do you?

So, how good do you think the Huskers will be this year?

[FBWillie]

as a fan I wanted to vomit at the spring game when I saw our DC acting like a 13 year old.  I know our coaches are young and some extra energy is expected but it's time to start being a role model and an authority figure not a friend to the players

I think it's great.  I have more respect for coach Snyder than anyone; but honestly, nearly every past football player I talked to said that a lot of the guys didn't like him and didn't respect him.  You could attribute that to his inability to relate to any of his players and didn't have any personal connection to them.  If these guys are having fun and they like them as friends; they will  respect the coaching staff as long as the Coaches have any kind of backbone.

[waks]

once again purple cobra you have proven your lack of kansas state knowlege to me. go back to HI.

[purplecobra]

"If Snyder's most recent assistants are as good as his past assistants, we will see them in head coaching positions in the future.  I don't see that happening, do you?"

I don't know.  you have to give them time.  They didn't really have alot of time at KSU to get known, but who knows what will happen to these guys in a couple years.  one thing we do know is that Snyder has a track record of taking ac's and then making them into good coaches at other schools, that is a fact that is proven by history.

[purplecobra]

"nearly every past football player I talked to said that a lot of the guys didn't like him and didn't respect him"

coaches aren't there to make friends.  This aint highschool.  college coaches have millions and millions of bucks riding on their decisions, to say nothing about the weldare of their family and their assistants and all of their carrears.  Most coaches I see at the higher levels don't dance and give piggyback rides during games, even spring games.  Do you think all of bob Stoops players like him?  how about bobby Bowden or Phil fulmer?  I can understand not liking Bill because he could be a hard arse but i doubt he wasn't respected.  He did more for our program than any coach has ever done or ever will.  if they didn't respect him then maybe they need to look in the dictionary to see what respect means.  I mean really, he is only going to be in the college football hall of fame.  whats to respect about that?

as for whats going on right now.  I can tell you for a fact that there are many ex players and 2 coaches that can't beleive what they are seeing now in Manhattan.  more specifically how loose the program is being run.  practices are dosprganized and their isn't much direction.  All this nicety nice, lets be friends BS goes right out the window when your down by 21 points nad the players look to the coaches for an answer and the coaches shrug their shoulders

[mjrod]

Anyone else feel this dribble is getting out of hand?

[ksuno1stunner]

purplecobra, you are amazing, i agree with everything you've said so far

GBR!!!

[ksuno1stunner]

oh god.  no excuse for that.  that's terrible.  ksu recruits over the years tend to have higher stars than they should because of crabtree.  this is going worse than i thought.

here's how i think the class will finish out
bell-3
cuba-2
drinkgern-2
matthews-2
mullins-2
reed-3
rohleder-3
sonier-3
thomas-2
walls-3
whitmore-2
woods-2

&*$@!ing embarassing

i'm right so far

although i have my doubts on rohleder...he may be a 2

[waks]

"nearly every past football player I talked to said that a lot of the guys didn't like him and didn't respect him"

coaches aren't there to make friends.  This aint highschool.  college coaches have millions and millions of bucks riding on their decisions, to say nothing about the weldare of their family and their assistants and all of their carrears.  Most coaches I see at the higher levels don't dance and give piggyback rides during games, even spring games.  Do you think all of bob Stoops players like him?  how about bobby Bowden or Phil fulmer?  I can understand not liking Bill because he could be a hard arse but i doubt he wasn't respected.  He did more for our program than any coach has ever done or ever will.  if they didn't respect him then maybe they need to look in the dictionary to see what respect means.  I mean really, he is only going to be in the college football hall of fame.  whats to respect about that?

as for whats going on right now.  I can tell you for a fact that there are many ex players and 2 coaches that can't beleive what they are seeing now in Manhattan.  more specifically how loose the program is being run.  practices are dosprganized and their isn't much direction.  All this nicety nice, lets be friends BS goes right out the window when your down by 21 points nad the players look to the coaches for an answer and the coaches shrug their shoulders

[purplecobra]

well stunner it's nice to see a fellow cat fan who doesn't recite, word for word the company line he has been forced to memorize inorder to be considered a good ksu fan.  Some on this board think that loading up on players that nobody else in the nation wants in june and july is a good thing, i don't see it as a good thing and neitehr do most division 1a coaches because if they did think it was a good thing, Prince wouldn't be the only one doing it.

[waks]

cobra you are an idiot. he was being sarcastic. he was calling you a husker. because you are a husker. sarcasm fails on stupid people i guess..

[sonofdaxjones]

well stunner it's nice to see a fellow cat fan who doesn't recite, word for word the company line he has been forced to memorize inorder to be considered a good ksu fan.  Some on this board think that loading up on players that nobody else in the nation wants in june and july is a good thing, i don't see it as a good thing and neitehr do most division 1a coaches because if they did think it was a good thing, Prince wouldn't be the only one doing it.

Jahsus Mary and Joseph .... are we gonna have to see the Last Train to Tardsville roll by on this board 40 times a day??

[purplecobra]

he wasn't being sarcastic.  cause he he points out in another thread he remembers me from posting on another ksu site a while back.  like I siad, stick to speaking for yourself only, now your made to look the fool in 2 threads.

[waks]

cobra you are the fool. i talked to him in a private session and he said he was being sarcastic. GBR is for huskers. he is talking about how you like the huskers. i was going to lay off of you but don't try and insult me. i know that i am smarter than you (really this shows because you are a husker and i am a WILDCAT  ). just stop making so many husker references, stop complaining about mj making fun of a dead guy, and everything will be cool.

[FBWillie]

"nearly every past football player I talked to said that a lot of the guys didn't like him and didn't respect him"

coaches aren't there to make friends.  This aint highschool.  college coaches have millions and millions of bucks riding on their decisions, to say nothing about the weldare of their family and their assistants and all of their carrears.  Most coaches I see at the higher levels don't dance and give piggyback rides during games, even spring games.  Do you think all of bob Stoops players like him?  how about bobby Bowden or Phil fulmer?  I can understand not liking Bill because he could be a hard arse but i doubt he wasn't respected.  He did more for our program than any coach has ever done or ever will.  if they didn't respect him then maybe they need to look in the dictionary to see what respect means.  I mean really, he is only going to be in the college football hall of fame.  whats to respect about that?

as for whats going on right now.  I can tell you for a fact that there are many ex players and 2 coaches that can't beleive what they are seeing now in Manhattan.  more specifically how loose the program is being run.  practices are dosprganized and their isn't much direction.  All this nicety nice, lets be friends BS goes right out the window when your down by 21 points nad the players look to the coaches for an answer and the coaches shrug their shoulders

You missed the entire point to my argument... I agree the coaches shouldn't be liked.  But without the players respect, they have no drive to play for that coach.  Everyone has a different way to make people respect them, and I don't care what you say, Being a hall of fame coach, although earns my and everyone on this boards respect, doesn't earn the respect of kids.  Especially not when things start going down the crapper and since it's not the hall of fame coach’s fault... it's the talent level of the players... I.E. YOU the player. 

It was spring ball, who cares if the assistants and the players were jumping around talk'n smack and piggy back'n each other.  They were building relationships; they were having fun.  If you can't understand that, then you clearly have never been on team sport, or at least a team that played together.   The truth is you have no idea what goes on at every practice, what we saw on the field was coaches and players having a good time doing what they love to do.  Does that mean that every workout is going to be a zoo? 

Bottom Line, Don't worry, this coaching staff will have plenty of time to make their players hate them; but as long as they are still having fun and winning games... They'll still be respected.