OL Depth Chart

[michigancat]

LT    78 Alesana Alesana    6-3    299    Jr.-JC
     72 Kaleb Drinkgern    6-6    260    Fr.-HS
 LG    76 Brock unruh    6-5    301    So.-1L
     68 Brad Rooker    6-6    291    Jr.-2L
 C    54 Trevor Viers    6-5    270     So.-SQ
     59 Zach Kendall    6-3    285    Fr.-RS
 RG    73 Gerard Spexarth    6-6    280    Jr.-2L
     65 Logan Robinson    6-8    318    Sr.-1L
 RT    63 Penisini Liu    6-5    308     Jr.-JC
     64 Nick Stringer    6-6    270     So.-1L

Viers listed as #1 center ( )...has Dringern always been on the f*cking two-deep?  What about Aufner?

[ksuno1stunner]

LT    78 Alesana Alesana    6-3    299    Jr.-JC
     72 Kaleb Drinkgern    6-6    260    Fr.-HS
 LG    76 Brock unruh    6-5    301    So.-1L
     68 Brad Rooker    6-6    291    Jr.-2L
 C    54 Trevor Viers    6-5    270     So.-SQ
     59 Zach Kendall    6-3    285    Fr.-RS
 RG    73 Gerard Spexarth    6-6    280    Jr.-2L
     65 Logan Robinson    6-8    318    Sr.-1L
 RT    63 Penisini Liu    6-5    308     Jr.-JC
     64 Nick Stringer    6-6    270     So.-1L

Viers listed as #1 center ( )...has Dringern always been on the f*cking two-deep?  What about Aufner?

I've always thought he was there for LOL purposes.

Who knows what happened to Aufner.

[cireksu]

I doubt any of them would start on another big 12 team.

[ksu_FAN]

LT    78 Alesana Alesana    6-3    299    Jr.-JC
     72 Kaleb Drinkgern    6-6    260    Fr.-HS
 LG    76 Brock unruh    6-5    301    So.-1L
     68 Brad Rooker    6-6    291    Jr.-2L
 C    54 Trevor Viers    6-5    270     So.-SQ
     59 Zach Kendall    6-3    285    Fr.-RS
 RG    73 Gerard Spexarth    6-6    280    Jr.-2L
     65 Logan Robinson    6-8    318    Sr.-1L
 RT    63 Penisini Liu    6-5    308     Jr.-JC
     64 Nick Stringer    6-6    270     So.-1L

Viers listed as #1 center ( )...has Dringern always been on the f*cking two-deep?  What about Aufner?

Looks like Bedore must be out.  Hopefully Viers will make improvements with a week of practice with the 1s. 

Only 1 SR (including Bedore) and he's not a starter. 

[catzacker]

If that OL isn't good/above average next year (barring major injuries), I think we should begin to question what the hell Ron is doing. 

[michigancat]

If that OL isn't good/above average next year (barring major injuries), I think we should begin to question what the hell Ron is doing. 

Unless we go to another bowl.  I really don't give a flip how the OL looks if we're going to bowls every year.  (Yes, I know OL is very critical to success).

[ksu_FAN]

If that OL isn't good/above average next year (barring major injuries), I think we should begin to question what the hell Ron is doing. 

QFT.  No doubt that is the area with the most significant change/biggest adjustment to the previous staff, but by year 3 there should be significant progress.  I expect progress to be shown by the end of this season.

[michigancat]

I think the OL is already better this year compared to last.

People forget how bad our offense looked at this time last year (9 points vs. UL and BU, 6 of them flukey).

[ksu_FAN]

I think the OL is already better this year compared to last.

People forget how bad our offense looked at this time last year (9 points vs. UL and BU, 6 of them flukey).

And how bad we were in the 1st quarter last year...

Yeah, I agree we're better, the disappointment of saturday just has people making broad and rediculous statements about this team right now.

[fatty fat fat]

We are running the ball much worsier this year, and Patton has sucked.

Why? I don't know. I am very upset about it though. (two patton vids look stupid now)

 Maybe we aren't trying enough. Maybe we miss Wafford and Frieson a bunch.

[michigancat]

We are running the ball much worsier this year, and Patton has sucked.

I don't think so, at least early in the year.  We couldn't run AT ALL until Oklahoma State last year (pasties included).

Most of Patton's yards came late in the season, and Johnson has improved a ton.

[catzacker]

I think the OL is already better this year compared to last.

People forget how bad our offense looked at this time last year (9 points vs. UL and BU, 6 of them flukey).

And how bad we were in the 1st quarter last year...

Yeah, I agree we're better, the disappointment of saturday just has people making broad and rediculous statements about this team right now.

Our scripted plays on our first drives are pretty f'ing good/effecient.  Maybe we should script the entire game. 

[ksuno1stunner]

I think the OL is already better this year compared to last.

People forget how bad our offense looked at this time last year (9 points vs. UL and BU, 6 of them flukey).

And how bad we were in the 1st quarter last year...

Yeah, I agree we're better, the disappointment of saturday just has people making broad and rediculous statements about this team right now.

Our scripted plays on our first drives are pretty f'ing good/effecient.  Maybe we should script the entire game. 

Maybe we are, which leads to our adjustment problems.

[ksu_FAN]

We are running the ball much worsier this year, and Patton has sucked.

Why? I don't know. I am very upset about it though. (two patton vids look stupid now)

 Maybe we aren't trying enough. Maybe we miss Wafford and Frieson a bunch.

Patton got himself behind in the spring.  Being dinged, then in the doghouse didn't help him.  And Johnson with a legit D1 year under his belt is simply better.  We'll see how it shakes out, but we are still over 4 YPC (not by much) which is the standard to judge a decent running team by.  We were over 4 YPC against ku as well until Bedore went down.  I still see this as a better unit running the football, but we do still have a long way to go.

As for the script, it works b/c we scheme people well going into games.  I'm sure we go back to a lot of those plays later, teams just adjust.  And I don't think our counters to those adjustments work nearly as well b/c of our issues running the ball and b/c we have some depth/experience issues at WR.

[fatty fat fat]

Patton got himself behind in the spring.  Being dinged, then in the doghouse didn't help him.  And Johnson with a legit D1 year under his belt is simply better.  We'll see how it shakes out, but we are still over 4 YPC (not by much) which is the standard to judge a decent running team by.

Yards against SJSU and Mizz St. simply don't count.

We were over 4 YPC against ku as well until Bedore went down.

If losing one player has that kind of effect on us, we haven't improved in the ground game.
 

[michigancat]

Yards against SJSU and Mizz St. simply don't count.

Compare UT this year vs. UT last year and the ypc. vs. 1st half ku vs. ypc last year.

If losing one player has that kind of effect on us, we haven't improved in the ground game.

Just means we haven't built adequate depth.  Snyder killed us.

[PittsburgJayhawk]

Yards against SJSU and Mizz St. simply don't count.

Compare UT this year vs. UT last year and the ypc. vs. 1st half ku vs. ypc last year.

If losing one player has that kind of effect on us, we haven't improved in the ground game.

Just means we haven't built adequate depth.  Snyder killed us.

This is interesting to me.  Keep in mind that I'm not saying it's untrue, but Hatter's infamous sig line indicated that the O-Line was going to be extremely solid into the future.

You guys obviously know better than myself, but would the line be better off with guys like Matt Boss still around?  Were their problems with Prince, or were they simply not going to pan out as players under any coach?

[ksu_FAN]

Yards against SJSU and Mizz St. simply don't count.

Compare UT this year vs. UT last year and the ypc. vs. 1st half ku vs. ypc last year.

If losing one player has that kind of effect on us, we haven't improved in the ground game.

Just means we haven't built adequate depth.  Snyder killed us.

This is interesting to me.  Keep in mind that I'm not saying it's untrue, but Hatter's infamous sig line indicated that the O-Line was going to be extremely solid into the future.

You guys obviously know better than myself, but would the line be better off with guys like Matt Boss still around?  Were their problems with Prince, or were they simply not going to pan out as players under any coach?

Prince's style of offensive football is completely different than Snyder's when it comes to offensive line play.  Many of those guys simply didn't/haven't adjusted well.  Of all the positions on the field, oline has had the biggest transition under Prince IMO.  And frankly, some of those guys were probably busts.

[michigancat]

This is interesting to me.  Keep in mind that I'm not saying it's untrue, but Hatter's infamous sig line indicated that the O-Line was going to be extremely solid into the future.

You guys obviously know better than myself, but would the line be better off with guys like Matt Boss still around?  Were their problems with Prince, or were they simply not going to pan out as players under any coach?

I'm being a little dramatic, for sure.  Schmidt is the guy Prince ran off that truly hurt.  Boss left football, we'll see about Hafferty at WVU.

And please, don't act like I'm hurt if a Hatter sig from 3 or 4 years ago comes back to bite him in the ass.  He has a flair for the dramatic.

[PittsburgJayhawk]

This is interesting to me.  Keep in mind that I'm not saying it's untrue, but Hatter's infamous sig line indicated that the O-Line was going to be extremely solid into the future.

You guys obviously know better than myself, but would the line be better off with guys like Matt Boss still around?  Were their problems with Prince, or were they simply not going to pan out as players under any coach?

I'm being a little dramatic, for sure.  Schmidt is the guy Prince ran off that truly hurt.  Boss left football, we'll see about Hafferty at WVU.

And please, don't act like I'm hurt if a Hatter sig from 3 or 4 years ago comes back to bite him in the ass.  He has a flair for the dramatic.

That's why he's the "best in the biz," right? 

[michigancat]

YES!

[AzCat]

Many of those guys simply didn't/haven't adjusted well.  Of all the positions on the field, oline has had the biggest transition under Prince IMO.  And frankly, some of those guys were probably busts.

Yes, yes, and yes.  Further OL in a depleted program OL is going to be the slowest squad to devlop, it almost always is.  Couple that with the fact that Prince seems inclined to recruit a lot of project OLs and you're looking at *another* 3-4 years before we can reasonably expect to see a "good" OL on the field.  Figure it'll take an average of 3-ish years for most of these kids to really be physically ready, throw out the 1st year recruiting class, and add a year or two for the impact of coaching churm, players leaving, etc. and I think you can reasonably expect building a solid OL to take 5-ish seasons. 

Snyder's teams couldn't consistently run the ball, even against the cupcake OOC opponents, until the mid 90s.  And they didn't fare well routinely against solid teams until the late 90s.  That's 10-ish years it took Snyder to build a really solid OL.  Let's not crucify Prince a season and a half into his tenure if his work-in-progress OL isn't yet up to par.

[michigancat]

Snyder's teams couldn't consistently run the ball, even against the cupcake OOC opponents, until the mid 90s.  And they didn't fare well routinely against solid teams until the late 90s.  That's 10-ish years it took Snyder to build a really solid OL.  Let's not crucify Prince a season and a half into his tenure if his work-in-progress OL isn't yet up to par.

Heh, I just looked it up, and KSU averaged 3.9 ypc in 1999.

http://www.kstatesports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=3063&SPID=212&DB_OEM_ID=400&ATCLID=26715

[AzCat]

Fact is that the OL flat sucked ass until the mid 90s then got better.  It takes a lot of time to develop those positions.

[catzacker]

For comparison purposes:

Year  O PPG  OYPC  DPPG    DYPC     record
1992   17.7   2.65   21.2   3.13   5-6
1993   26.2   2.86   19.1   3.87   9-2-1
1994   27.7   3.44   14.2   3.90   9-3
1995   36.5   3.70   13.2   3.10   10-2
1996   29.5   3.49   15.6   3.59   9-3
2006   22.8   4.02   23.8   4.08   7-6
2007   34.6   4.00   19.6   2.70   3-2

[AzCat]

Uh huh ... and the backs those years were: a) significantly better than Johnson & Patton; b) significantly worse than Johnson and Patton.