Date: 23/07/25 - 14:23 PM   48060 Topics and 694399 Posts

Author Topic: We really need another jump shooter on this team.  (Read 1871 times)

July 06, 2007, 10:22:52 AM
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michigancat

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Our SG position is scaring me.

So much so, I'm already missing Lance Harris.   

 :frown:

July 06, 2007, 10:29:52 AM
Reply #1

fatty fat fat

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    The very best.
It is a tragedy because now, we have at least an extra month without Cat football until next year. I hate wasting my life away but I can hardly wait until next year.

July 06, 2007, 10:30:33 AM
Reply #2

WavetheWheat

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Rusty how do you see the starting line-up?

Does Colon start or come off the bench?

How many guys do you think will play significant minutes?

Thanks in advance - Your roster changed so much all I really know are Walker, Beas, Hoskins, and Sutton.

July 06, 2007, 10:34:09 AM
Reply #3

chum1

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I love it when assertions are made with absolutely no DATA to support them.  You could at least make a chart that shows exactly how scared you are.

July 06, 2007, 10:37:43 AM
Reply #4

asava

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a delicious pie chart would do.  :lick:


bold and daring

July 06, 2007, 10:39:38 AM
Reply #5

WavetheWheat

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I love it when assertions are made with absolutely no DATA to support them.  You could at least make a chart that shows exactly how scared you are.

So you see Hoskins coming off the bench?  Interesting.

July 06, 2007, 10:40:21 AM
Reply #6

michigancat

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I really, really, really want that J-Mart Tyree article.

I'm about to go ballistic.

July 06, 2007, 10:45:58 AM
Reply #7

WildCatzPhreak

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I was hoping either Jake or Fred could fulfill our shooting needs while Clent and Blake switch off at the point.

July 06, 2007, 10:47:31 AM
Reply #8

michigancat

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The following is a list of players on the KSU roster that I would trade for Tyree Evans:

Luis Colon
Darren Kent
Clent Stewart
Jacob Pullen
Fred Brown
David Hoskins (YES, I SAID DAVID HOSKINS)
Jamar Samuels
James Franklin
Brady Johnson
Dominique Sutton
Chris Merriewether
Ryan Patzwald
Andre Gilbert
Blake Young
Denis Clemente
« Last Edit: July 06, 2007, 10:49:31 AM by Rusty »

July 06, 2007, 10:52:10 AM
Reply #9

yosh

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The following is a list of players on the KSU roster that I would trade for Tyree Evans:

Luis Colon
Darren Kent
Clent Stewart
Jacob Pullen
Fred Brown
David Hoskins (YES, I SAID DAVID HOSKINS)
Jamar Samuels
James Franklin
Brady Johnson
Dominique Sutton
Chris Merriewether
Ryan Patzwald
Andre Gilbert
Blake Young
Denis Clemente

lol  Why not Walker?

BTW

http://kansasstate.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?Sport=2&pr_key=69593

Ready for another year of Evans drama?
Cada hombre un gato salvaje!

July 06, 2007, 10:56:35 AM
Reply #10

WildCatzPhreak

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You're way too in love with Tyree.  I wanted him too, but not nearly as badly as you do.

July 06, 2007, 11:10:29 AM
Reply #11

michigancat

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lol  Why not Walker?

BTW

http://kansasstate.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?Sport=2&pr_key=69593

Ready for another year of Evans drama?

YES!

I want him now, though.  :-[

I wanted him too, but not nearly as badly as you do.

Good for you.

July 06, 2007, 11:12:50 AM
Reply #12

catzacker

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Is Clent going to get shoved over to SG where he belongs?  Frank can't run a more "up tempo" offense with Clent running the show. 

July 06, 2007, 11:16:54 AM
Reply #13

KSU4ME

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I would rather sacrifice some tempo on offense than try to break in a brand new PG.  We know that unless a summer miracle happened, Blake isn't the answer at PG.

Clent is a pretty good outside shooter, if Brown/Pullen can knock down threes in the upper 30% range, that should be enough to keep defenses honest. 

Sutton/Beasley/Walker/Hoskins don't need a bunch of Dan Majerles running around the perimeter, they just need guys good enough to keep the opposing defense honest.  I'd love to have a couple dead-eyes, but it's not needed.
"Mel Kiper, THE TURD"

July 06, 2007, 11:19:13 AM
Reply #14

geesiskryst

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Quote

lol  Why not Walker?

BTW

http://kansasstate.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?Sport=2&pr_key=69593

Ready for another year of Evans drama?

He's listed as a small forward now? WTF? a 6'3" small forward? that would work in middle school.

July 06, 2007, 11:21:37 AM
Reply #15

WildCatzPhreak

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Is Clent going to get shoved over to SG where he belongs?  Frank can't run a more "up tempo" offense with Clent running the show. 
Heh, that's a good point.

I think Clent would make a good SG.  He can shoot it, and he's been pretty clutch in the past.  That would allow Blake to bring the ball up the court, which he can do at a much faster tempo.

The only problem with that is Blake gets wreckless when he brings it up too fast.  And it leaves big question marks about Jake and Fred, who absolutely must be a part of the rotation at the guard positions if we're going to have any sort of success come Big XII play.


I kind of gave up on Tyree.  It's been so long since he's played organized basketball now, especially against any decent competition, that I don't think he'd come even close to meeting the expectations most people have of him.

July 06, 2007, 11:25:16 AM
Reply #16

ds43fan

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I would rather sacrifice some tempo on offense than try to break in a brand new PG.  We know that unless a summer miracle happened, Blake isn't the answer at PG.

Clent is a pretty good outside shooter, if Brown/Pullen can knock down threes in the upper 30% range, that should be enough to keep defenses honest. 

Sutton/Beasley/Walker/Hoskins don't need a bunch of Dan Majerles running around the perimeter, they just need guys good enough to keep the opposing defense honest.  I'd love to have a couple dead-eyes, but it's not needed.
QFT, his single best post

July 06, 2007, 11:32:24 AM
Reply #17

michigancat

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Is Clent going to get shoved over to SG where he belongs?  Frank can't run a more "up tempo" offense with Clent running the show. 

For my stats page, I'm tracking pace while a player is on the court.  I think it will take several games of data to draw any conclusions, though.

http://kstatestats.awardspace.com/PARSE_live_stats.php

"Poss" is possessions/40 minutes.

Clent is a pretty good outside shooter, if Brown/Pullen can knock down threes in the upper 30% range, that should be enough to keep defenses honest. 

Sutton/Beasley/Walker/Hoskins don't need a bunch of Dan Majerles running around the perimeter, they just need guys good enough to keep the opposing defense honest.  I'd love to have a couple dead-eyes, but it's not needed.

Upper 30's is close enough to "dead-eye" for me, too.  I'm just concerned that they won't be able to do it.

July 06, 2007, 11:35:06 AM
Reply #18

yosh

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Is Clent going to get shoved over to SG where he belongs?  Frank can't run a more "up tempo" offense with Clent running the show. 

That's been my assumption, but I kinda look at Blake and Clent as "combo" guards that will be in the line-up together.  Both will be able to take on either guard roll. If Young is back to the form we saw before his knee injury then I see it this way:

1. Young - Pullen - Clemente**
2. Stewart - Sutton* - Brown
3. Walker - Sutton* - Gilbert
3 1/2. Hoskins - Samuels - Kent
4. Beasley - Colon - Samuels

*Sixth man getting starter minutes a la Martin from last season.

**true answer to playing uptempo, but won't see him for another season.
Cada hombre un gato salvaje!

July 06, 2007, 11:40:36 AM
Reply #19

KSU4ME

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You can have two guys that are able to play PG on the court, but you can only have one guy playing PG on the court.

The fact that so many KSU fans just don't get this floors me.

Randomly switching which guy is running the point isn't a good idea.  Substitute for stretches of time?  Yes.  Leave players guessing which guard is running the point?  No.

If you want any sense of rhythm or flow, you'll have one guy be your primary PG, and another guy that spells him during the game.  But you don't switch back and forth randomly.  Make switches during timeouts, or deadball periods when it can be communicated to the team.
"Mel Kiper, THE TURD"

July 06, 2007, 11:48:04 AM
Reply #20

michigancat

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You can have two guys that are able to play PG on the court, but you can only have one guy playing PG on the court.

The fact that so many KSU fans just don't get this floors me.

Randomly switching which guy is running the point isn't a good idea.  Substitute for stretches of time?  Yes.  Leave players guessing which guard is running the point?  No.

If you want any sense of rhythm or flow, you'll have one guy be your primary PG, and another guy that spells him during the game.  But you don't switch back and forth randomly.  Make switches during timeouts, or deadball periods when it can be communicated to the team.

If you want to run transition, (which it appears Frank wants to do) it makes a ton of sense to have co-point guards.  You want the rebounders to make the outlet pass to a specific spot on the floor - not a specific player.  If you have two PG's, the closest one can just go to the outlet area and start the possession sooner instead of having the rebounder look around for Clent all day.

"Rythm" and "flow" are just buzzwords that media idiots of the world use.

July 06, 2007, 11:55:35 AM
Reply #21

rundown87

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if we really need another guy who can knock down the 3. . .I guess I'll do it.  When does practice start?

July 06, 2007, 12:17:00 PM
Reply #22

steve dave

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Didn't we have this thread, like, 5 times already  :confused:
<---------Click the ball

July 06, 2007, 12:19:13 PM
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ds43fan

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July 06, 2007, 12:19:49 PM
Reply #24

SUPERKSUFAN

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Is Clent going to get shoved over to SG where he belongs?  Frank can't run a more "up tempo" offense with Clent running the show. 

that's what I am hoping.  Clent is better at 3 pointers than Harris was anyhow.  Pullen at point and Clent at SG....that would make me happy.


July 06, 2007, 12:20:16 PM
Reply #25

Saulbadguy

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Our frontcourt will be so awesome, it won't matter.

July 06, 2007, 12:20:36 PM
Reply #26

steve dave

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<---------Click the ball

July 06, 2007, 12:37:03 PM
Reply #27

bigdeal

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Wow, where to start.  I think Stewart will get most of the early ball-handling duties, not Young.  Stew doesn't do a good enough job pushing pace but having two ball handlers on the floor does make for a better running game, as explained on the outlet passes.  However, when the O sets up, Stew will likely be designated as the point.  The more interesting part of that will be how they handle it when the other team scores.  If Stew comes back around to get the ball each time, then we won't have much ability to put the other team back on their heels.  You can run an O with two PG type players, but one is usually designated as the point to set up the offense in the front court and call out the plays.  I think to be really good, we need 3 guys who can consistently hit 3's for a good percentage.  They don't all need to be able to light it up, just be consistent threats.  Problem is, we don't want Beasley to move away from the basket very often to do that...except maybe when Colon is in the game.  Rusty,  I also would like to have had Tyree...but I would not trade Hoskins or Sutton for him....and maybe not Clemente, Pullen or Samuels...and maybe not Colon.  We are going to need him to provide some quality minutes this year.   

July 06, 2007, 12:49:45 PM
Reply #28

rundown87

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I hit 17-25 at a 3 point competition.  However, I'm slow, I have no ups, i'm 6', and have limited ball skills.  So, the only way I'd be good at college level is if no one were guarding me.

July 06, 2007, 12:55:44 PM
Reply #29

michigancat

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Wow, where to start.  I think Stewart will get most of the early ball-handling duties, not Young.  Stew doesn't do a good enough job pushing pace but having two ball handlers on the floor does make for a better running game, as explained on the outlet passes.  However, when the O sets up, Stew will likely be designated as the point.  The more interesting part of that will be how they handle it when the other team scores.  If Stew comes back around to get the ball each time, then we won't have much ability to put the other team back on their heels.  You can run an O with two PG type players, but one is usually designated as the point to set up the offense in the front court and call out the plays. 

If the team is serious about playing at a higher tempo, they should have a semi-organized transition offense.

The transition offense should flow smoothly into the half-court offense.

Therefore, you shouldn't need anyone to "set up" the offense if you don't get a quick transition bucket, and having two points really shouldn't make a difference.

After made baskets, get it to whoever's closer and go.