in light of the Gabbert commit can a Nebraska fan...

[The Manhatter]

explain to me how this Auburn line up beat the #1 and #3 teams in Florida and LSU(both LOADED w/ 4 and 5 star players) let alone beat Nebraska?  I'm not looking for an argument I just want to hear an explanation.  A simple explanation for how this could happen would be suffice.  I mean all of the "rivals 100", "ESPN says greatest QB ever", "5 star OL coming out of our...", "KSU can't compete w/ this hot, hot, hot recruits...ooh Callahan's hot!".

Again, not starting an argument just looking for a simple answer how this Auburn team beat rivals100 clubs AND has gone 33-5 the past 3 years.  Thanks.


Auburn

POS  ## OFFENSE
QB   12 Brandon Cox - 4 stars in 2002
RB   23 Kenny Irons - did not see on commit list
WR   25 Lee Guess - 2 stars in 2002
C    50 Joe Cope - "(barely-->)6-foot nuttin' a hundred and nuttin'" Rudy style walk-on
G    69 Ben Grubbs - 3 stars in 2002
G    76 Tim Duckworth - 4 stars in 2003 (not drafted while 3 stars Grubbs goes in 1st round to Baltimore..interesting)
T    77 King Dunlap - 3 stars in 2003
T    79 Jonathan Palmer - 3 stars in 2002
WR   80 R. Smith - Did not find in database
WR   86 Courtney Taylor - 3 stars in 2002
TE   87 Cole Bennett - 3 stars in 2003

POS  ## DEFENSE
DB   2  Aairon Savage - 3 stars in 2005
DB   4  David Irons - 3 stars in 2003
LB   21 Karibi Dede - 3 stars in 2002
DB   24 J. Wilhite - 3 stars in 2005
SS   33 Eric Brock - 3 stars in 2003
LB   35 Will Herring - 3 stars in 2002
DE   48 Marquies Gunn - 2 stars in 2003
DE   54 Quentin Groves - 4 stars in 2003
LB   55 Merrill Johnson - 2 stars in 2004
DT   94 S. Marks - 2 stars in 2005
NG   97 Josh Thompson - 3 stars in 2003


Toodles.

 

[ksuno1stunner]

No explanation from NU concerning Auburn's success with 2-3 star recruits in the nation's best conference?

[ksuno1stunner]

BTW,

QB - Josh Freeman - 4 stars
RB - James Johnson - 3 stars out of high school, 4 stars out of juco
WR - Jordy Nelson - walk-on
WR - Cedric Wilson - 3 stars out of high school, 2 stars out of juco
WR - LaMark Brown - 4 stars
TE  - Rashaad Norwood - 3 stars
OL - Logan Robinson - 3 stars
OL - Alesana Alesana - 3 stars
OL - Jordan Bedore - 2 stars
OL - Derek Meyer - 2 stars
OL - Nick Stringer - 3 stars

DE - Rob Jackson - 3 stars
DT - Jr. Moran - 3 stars
DE - Mike Abana - 3 stars
LB - Ian Campbell - walk-on
LB - Smoke Patterson - 5 stars out of high school, 4 stars out of juco
LB - Reggie Walker - 3 stars
LB - Justin Roland - 3 stars
CB - Josh Moore - 2 stars
CB - Bryan Baldwin - 3 stars
SS - Gary Chandler - 2 stars out of high school, 4 stars out of juco
FS - Marcus Watts - 2 stars

[BMWJhawk]

Football is all about coaching and player development. 

The skill positions (QB, WR, RB) are really the only positions where rankings make a big difference. 

[fatty fat fat]

(QB, WR, RB)

I wouldn't mind seeing some data on that.

[The Manhatter]

stunner, Lamark is 4 stars you blasphemous pig.

[fatty fat fat]

So, if we do land Arthur that's three straight years of having a higher rated recruit than any sker' recruit.

[waks]

Well at the three skill positions you list.. We have three four stars (Johnson, Freeman and Lamark) and another phenomenal receiver (Jordy). So I'd say we are off to a decent start then..

[ksuno1stunner]

stunner, Lamark is 4 stars you blasphemous pig.

[BMWJhawk]

Three of K-State's best players (Josh Moore, Marcus Watts, and Ian Campbell) were either 2-stars or unranked coming out of high school.  I think that says a lot about the value of rankings and player development.  

[waks]

Three of K-State's best players (Josh Moore, Marcus Watts, and Ian Campbell) were either 2-stars or unranked coming out of high school.  I think that says a lot about the value of rankings and player development. 

That's what Hatter's original point was. You forgot Jordy Nelson in there as well.

[Maxell]

Auburn was incredibly talented and experienced on the OL and in the secondary, which I think led to a lot of their success last year. I believe they had 4 or 5 senior starters on the OL, including 1st rounder Ben Grubbs (who coincidently got his lunch eaten against Nebraska). Their DBs just manhandled our wide receivers so I imagine they did the same to LSU and Florida. Most physical secondary I've seen in years of watching college football.

On a side note, the NU and Auburn staff's became really good friends after the game. The coaching staffs each spent time at each other's school during the winter/spring trading ideas. I think Nebraska was taking some defensive schemes and Auburn was taking some practice tips in exchange.

[waks]

How experienced were they the two years before? Hatter said that they have a record of 33-5 in the past three years. His point is that stars don't necessarily indicate anything about a team.

[The Manhatter]

..and another phenomenal receiver (Jordy)

I wouldnt' call Jordy "phenomenal" unless I was on hornfans.com. (that one is for you fatty)

good point by BMW.  Did I just say that?  But I will say that Crabby said rivals just screwed up on Moore.  He was supposed to be ranked higher when they did their final florida rankings but somehow he was forgotten and left out.  And he said that not too long after signing day so it isn't like he tried to come up w/ something after he started playing.  His problem was that he was going to be a late qualifier.

I still love you stunner, even if you are a blasphemous pig for missing Lamar's 4th star.  Poet Warrior and a baseball bat would like a word w/ you.

[ksuno1stunner]

..and another phenomenal receiver (Jordy)

I wouldnt' call Jordy "phenomenal" unless I was on hornfans.com. (that one is for you fatty)

good point by BMW.  Did I just say that?  But I will say that Crabby said rivals just screwed up on Moore.  He was supposed to be ranked higher when they did their final florida rankings but somehow he was forgotten and left out.  And he said that not too long after signing day so it isn't like he tried to come up w/ something after he started playing.  His problem was that he was going to be a late qualifier.

I still love you stunner, even if you are a blasphemous pig for missing Lamar's 4th star.  Poet Warrior and a baseball bat would like a word w/ you.

It will never happen again, I promise!

[The Manhatter]

Auburn was incredibly talented and experienced on the OL and in the secondary

Maxell, I appreciate your attempting to answer the question but your "incredibly talented" lines fly in the face of what Nebraska fans are telling us.  You say we aren't getting any talent due to rankings yet Auburn is incredibly talented when their starters will basically have same rankings as KSU.  I was hoping you could explain THAT aspect of it.

Also they must not have been that incrediby talented on the OL as seniors Cope, Duckworth, and Palmer went undrafted. 

On a side note, the NU and Auburn staff's became really good friends after the game. The coaching staffs each spent time at each other's school during the winter/spring trading ideas. I think Nebraska was taking some defensive schemes and Auburn was taking some practice tips in exchange.

 

[ds43fan]

so when we were all bitchin about recruiting last year and dax said stars had nothing to do with it he was right?

[Maxell]

I think talent can be offset by either a coaching staff that develops and coaches up their players, a unique system, or an experience laden team. So no talent is not the end all be all-you never know what you're going to get from an 18, 19 or 20 year old kid from week to week. I will say its going to be interesting to see what happens at Nebraska the next few years with the group of players that will be on the roster. I feel we have the best strength coach in the country and when you give him elite athletes to mold and develop, put them in a system developed around competition, you have a recipe for success. I like where Nebraska is at now.

[The Manhatter]

I think talent can be offset by either a coaching staff that develops and coaches up their players, a unique system, or an experience laden team. So no talent is not the end all be all-you never know what you're going to get from an 18, 19 or 20 year old kid from week to week. I will say its going to be interesting to see what happens at Nebraska the next few years with the group of players that will be on the roster. I feel we have the best strength coach in the country and when you give him elite athletes to mold and develop, put them in a system developed around competition, you have a recipe for success. I like where Nebraska is at now.

so are you saying KSU has maybe a 1 in a 1,000, 000 chance against NU's 5 stars?

 

[catinthehat]

I really don't understand the point of this thread manhatter.  if the point of it is to show that you rattle off at the mouth without doing research, congrats.  mission accomplished.  you rattle on about how auburn beat this team and that team and yet doesn't recruit at a high level but you would be very wrong.  In 02 their class ranking was 6.  in 03 it was 11.  to get those kind of rankings, it takes a hell of alot of talent.  infact, between 02 and 03 they brought in a pair of 5 star players, 16, 4 star players and 32, 3 star players.  that is a hell of alot of talent by anyones standards.  and you would expect any team that brings in that talent to do exactly what auburn has done, which is operate at a high level.

[The Manhatter]

I really don't understand the point of this thread manhatter.  if the point of it is to show that you rattle off at the mouth without doing research, congrats.  mission accomplished.  you rattle on about how auburn beat this team and that team and yet doesn't recruit at a high level but you would be very wrong.  In 02 their class ranking was 6.  in 03 it was 11.  to get those kind of rankings, it takes a hell of alot of talent.  infact, between 02 and 03 they brought in a pair of 5 star players, 16, 4 star players and 32, 3 star players.  that is a hell of alot of talent by anyones standards.  and you would expect any team that brings in that talent to do exactly what auburn has done, which is operate at a high level.

I didn't research it?  Why are you talking about recruiting classes when I LISTED the starters who actually PLAYED and posted their rankings!!  I don't give a sh*t if Auburn had a 6th rated class or whatever..point is all of their starters were 2 and 3 stars.  The facts are the facts.  Don't post Class rankings as they didn't play...the actual players who played and their rankings are posted. 

FYI, according to you a Matt Boss and Nick Patton would bump our recruiting class...too bad they don't effect the play on the field.  See how that works?  If I were you and did my "research" I would know that Boss and Patton factor into KSU's team but that isn't the case and neither is it w/ Auburn's.

[Maxell]

I think you better get Nebraska in 2008 in Manhattan or its going to be a while before you get another chance. Prince's wagon is clearly hitched to Freeman in a 3-4 year project and he will need to get it done next year. That game will feature an experienced K State team going against a Nebraska team losing a bunch of experience so that's your shot.

Also a short answer to your above question-I think if a team wants to be consistently good from year to year you've got to get it done in recruiting each season. You might have an experienced team that gets it done once every couple of years but if you've recruited average players, when the experience graduates, you're going back to a valley. Nebraska will have a dropoff in 2008 but it will be minimal compared to a team that's not had four consecutive top 15 recruiting classes.

[waks]

You're wrong. Jordy is phenomenal.

[catinthehat]

"point is all of their starters were 2 and 3 stars.  "

but on your list you have some 4 stars.  plus, irons was a 4-5 star. 

[info]

Auburn recruits. The star rankings may be similar to KSU's, but when you compare who offered Auburn's 2006 starting lineup vs the KSU lineup you will find your answer.

[S. Parker]

I don't know what provoked this thread, but if it's about some of our fans going onto other boards and bragging I apologize.

I don't really care how much talent Auburn had, they just fielded a better team than us that day and won. They have good coaches, and their results show it.

That said, I think KSU has a great shot to win that game. I don't see Auburn's offense being that great really. Their defense should be pretty stout though. I think KSU has a lot of talent on defense so they should be able to keep the game close, and if the offense is clicking then KSU can definitely win.

The KSU offense is the big x factor in that game, IMO. It was so up-and-down last year, so I don't know what to expect from Freeman and company at all.

[waks]

You are way more optimistic than me.

[mjrod]

Unless KSU's offensive line figures out how to GEL anytime soon, I'm not looking for KSU to beat Auburn.  I think KSU can beat Auburn, but our O-Line had better figure out how to become more solid.

[S. Parker]

You are way more optimistic than me.

Auburn's defense is just brutal. Their offense isn't going to blow anyone off the field though. Our secondary sucked last year and they were one of the only teams we played that couldn't exploit it, and they tried all game.

[waks]

We couldn't either.