KSUFans Archives
Sports => Frank Martin's OOD sponsored by the "Angriest Fans in America" => Topic started by: michigancat on January 28, 2008, 11:49:19 AM
-
I shouldn't expect Grapes to recognize good coaching when they see it. It's one thing to call set situational plays. It's quite another to know how to motivate a team, get it to play together and rely on each other. Martin hasn't shown me anything yet - which doesn't mean he can't, but I haven't seen it.
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=172#s=172&f=2481&t=1929692
-
GUARDS
-
We're clearly not better from the beginning of the season, Michael beasley just ball hogs it and shoots until it goes in.
-
Players don't get along. NOBODY on the team likes Mike. Criminals run the asylum. Frank has lost control. Low level AAU coach with only AAU experience.
-
Point A: A good coach would be undefeated at this point since we have so much talent on this team. We would most likely end up in the Final 4 with only a few losses (ku).
Point B: Beasley is only slightly better than Derrick Coleman, and Walker is just another Kenny Gregory.
:confused:
-
Did you see the players goofing off after practice on the local news?! NO CONTROL.
-
This is just wishful thinking by the ku fans. Frank Martin can coach.
I used to think that Mangino couldn't coach too. I don't think that any more.
-
A) Most have probably watched us play very little.
B) Many wouldn't know "well coached" outside their only little sphere of Williams/Self basketball anyway.
-
I used to think that Mangino couldn't coach too.
This accurately sums up the point of view currently being held by ku fans. To opponents, Martin is easy to hate and to make fun of. They will only respect him when he beats them 3 out of the next 4.
-
Point A: A good coach would be undefeated at this point since we have so much talent on this team. We would most likely end up in the Final 4 with only a few losses (ku).
Point B: Beasley is only slightly better than Derrick Coleman, and Walker is just another Kenny Gregory.
:confused:
IN the same thread? That absolute .... genius.
-
"They call him Frank". If that's not out of control.... what is?
-
Urinating on the court. If a coach can't potty train his players, how good can he possibly be?
-
Urinating on the court. If a coach can't potty train his players, how good can he possibly be?
QFT. You never saw Kenny Gregory peeing on the jayhawk.
-
I like the Mangino analogy. We all used to think he was an idiot. Now that he's successful, we claim him as a credit to Snyder's coaching tree.
-
Nothing. He has done a better job than I imagined he could have putting together the puzzle of this team. I thought he would have problems finding a spot for so many similar players and a superstar in Beasley.
Walker's improvement (playing to original expectations) and Beasley's phenomenal year has made Frank's job easier, but it still could have imploded with the other guys not seeing the ball as much. Also he has been able to get these amazing players to actually play defense; I also thought he would struggle with that.
I am willing to say he is a better coach and far exceeded expectations I had for him thus far...
BUT....
I think we can all agree getting players like Beasley and Walker to Manhattan is an anomaly. I reserve right to judgment on his capability until we see a more realistic amount of talent in Manhattan. I could see this whole thing imploding in 2-3 years. I could also see him having a reasonable amount of success with slightly less talent.
I would grade his coaching ability as - "Too Soon to Tell; but looks promising" which is a huge upgrade from - "What a joke they hired that guy."
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
Those 2009 recruits are better than anyone in the North not named Kansas is getting commitments from.
OK, they're better than ku's current commits, too.
-
I have to admit, I was damn impressed with Frank Martin's coaching job in that Xavier game. To keep it within 26 was a testament to how well-coached and fundamentally sound K-State's team is.
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
I have no problem with above...(well I don't think you will get top 20 guys) but eitherway, top 100 guys is a HUGE difference from top 1 or 2 players in the country.
For instance Mizzou has 3 or 4 top 100 guys...if you give Frank Martin that team would he have a better record than Mike Anderson?
-
I have to admit, I was damn impressed with Frank Martin's coaching job in that Xavier game. To keep it within 26 was a testament to how well-coached and fundamentally sound K-State's team is.
Your ablility to cut right to the heart of the matter is what makes you that much more of a BB genious and man than any of us could ever hope to be. I cower in your shadow. Thanks for being you, BMWJhawk....MWMHjwalk.........BMOVEMENT......BMWJsquawk......Oh screw it.
:bootyshake: :bootyshake: :bootyshake: :bootyshake: :bootyshake: :bootyshake: :bootyshake: :bootyshake: :bootyshake:
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
I have no problem with above...(well I don't think you will get top 20 guys) but eitherway, top 100 guys is a HUGE difference from top 1 or 2 players in the country.
For instance Mizzou has 3 or 4 top 100 guys...if you give Frank Martin that team would he have a better record than Mike Anderson?
100% without question - YES.
-
I have to admit, I was damn impressed with Frank Martin's coaching job in that Xavier game. To keep it within 26 was a testament to how well-coached and fundamentally sound K-State's team is.
Great use of P.NTP#3.
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
I have no problem with above...(well I don't think you will get top 20 guys) but eitherway, top 100 guys is a HUGE difference from top 1 or 2 players in the country.
For instance Mizzou has 3 or 4 top 100 guys...if you give Frank Martin that team would he have a better record than Mike Anderson?
Did I miss something? Has Mike Anderson signed a top 100 player?
-
I said, on the mizzou roster. I was guessing...I will look it up now.
I'll use RSCI because it combines all rankings.
Jason Horton was ranked 45 in 2004
Marshall Brown was ranked 47 in 2004
Leo Lyons (Criswell) was ranked 66 in 2005
and
Stefhon Hannah was ranked top 25 JUCO player in 2006.
-
I said, on the mizzou roster. I was guessing...I will look it up now.
I'll use RSCI because it combines all rankings.
Jason Horton was ranked 45 in 2004
Marshall Brown was ranked 47 in 2004
Leo Lyons (Criswell) was ranked 66 in 2005
and
Stefhon Hannah was ranked top 25 JUCO player in 2006.
Wow, Anderson sucks.
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
I have no problem with above...(well I don't think you will get top 20 guys) but eitherway, top 100 guys is a HUGE difference from top 1 or 2 players in the country.
For instance Mizzou has 3 or 4 top 100 guys...if you give Frank Martin that team would he have a better record than Mike Anderson?
I understand that there is a big difference, but it's better than 85% of D1 teams can claim. Yes I do think Martin would do better with Missouri's roster, but that's not saying much. I think Anderson is terrible. Between him and Sean Sutton, nobody has done less with more. Both teams had much more talent than K-State last year, but we had the better season. (I know that was Huggins)
As for the top 20 thing...remains to be seen, but we might already have one. Wally Judge is the type of player who could end up in the top 20 by the time he gets here. (Currently #26 on Rivals) We are also listed with three other guys in the 09 top twenty, and made the final 2 for an 08 top 20 player (Kadji). It's not a stretch.
-
I said, on the mizzou roster. I was guessing...I will look it up now.
I'll use RSCI because it combines all rankings.
Jason Horton was ranked 45 in 2004
Marshall Brown was ranked 47 in 2004
Leo Lyons (Criswell) was ranked 66 in 2005
and
Stefhon Hannah was ranked top 25 JUCO player in 2006.
Wow, Anderson sucks.
I think that Quinn had even more talent one year, I think in 04 or 05 scout had mizzou's overall talent at the top of the big 12.
-
anderson's nephew was a ~ 150ish recruit out of hs.
probably ~ 100 level as a transfer, he exceeded expectations at vanderbilt.
http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=15426&sport=2
-
anderson's nephew was a ~ 150ish recruit out of hs.
probably ~ 100 level as a transfer, he exceeded expectations at vanderbilt.
http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=15426&sport=2
OMG! LIKE, HE CAN'T RELY ON NEPHEWS FOR RECRUITS FOR EVER.
-
I have to admit, I was damn impressed with Frank Martin's coaching job in that Xavier game. To keep it within 26 was a testament to how well-coached and fundamentally sound K-State's team is.
I have been equally impressed by the way Self can take talent loaded teams and constantly lose to inferior opposition in the tourney. The man is a genius.
-
I have to admit, I was damn impressed with Frank Martin's Bill Self's coaching job in that Xavier Villanova game. To keep it within 26 21 was a testament to how well-coached and fundamentally sound K-State's ku's team is.
FYP.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=250220222 (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=250220222)
-
I noticed the Top 3 winning coaches since 1999 were all guys who usually get favorable treatment by officials within conference play . . . once they get to the tourney though, they have a propensity to get bounced despite their supposed "superstar" talent. Those 3 guys have combined for a whole 2 national titles since 1999, and one walked into the best talent he's ever had. The other, hasn't made the Final Four yet.
-
I can't believe no one has hit on this yet, he's Cuban or Puerto Rican or something. When was the last time they did anything in the Olympics?
-
I'll say in the first 4 games of the conference season Frank has done a good job of just rolling the ball out there and letting them play. It's been great to see the guys come up with their own offensive sets, call their own defense . . . when Beasley called those half court chase/trips against ISU and CU, and put on the token full court pressure to change the pace of the game . . . pure genius.
If Mike gets hurt, he could coach D1 almost immediately.
Frank has excelled at letting the guys run the show.
-
BUT....
I think we can all agree getting players like Beasley and Walker to Manhattan is an anomaly. I reserve right to judgment on his capability until we see a more realistic amount of talent in Manhattan. I could see this whole thing imploding in 2-3 years. I could also see him having a reasonable amount of success with slightly less talent.
So in order to prove himself, Martin has to go get inferior talent and then coach it up to to being superior talent.
Hell, I'd love to see a LOT of coaches do that.
-
Nothing. He has done a better job than I imagined he could have putting together the puzzle of this team. I thought he would have problems finding a spot for so many similar players and a superstar in Beasley.
Walker's improvement (playing to original expectations) and Beasley's phenomenal year has made Frank's job easier, but it still could have imploded with the other guys not seeing the ball as much. Also he has been able to get these amazing players to actually play defense; I also thought he would struggle with that.
I am willing to say he is a better coach and far exceeded expectations I had for him thus far...
BUT....
I think we can all agree getting players like Beasley and Walker to Manhattan is an anomaly. I reserve right to judgment on his capability until we see a more realistic amount of talent in Manhattan. I could see this whole thing imploding in 2-3 years. I could also see him having a reasonable amount of success with slightly less talent.
I would grade his coaching ability as - "Too Soon to Tell; but looks promising" which is a huge upgrade from - "What a joke they hired that guy."
Way to go out on a limb there. Martin will either be a good coach or he will suck. What a bold analysis.
-
I'll say in the first 4 games of the conference season Frank has done a good job of just rolling the ball out there and letting them play. It's been great to see the guys come up with their own offensive sets, call their own defense . . . when Beasley called those half court chase/trips against ISU and CU, and put on the token full court pressure to change the pace of the game . . . pure genius.
If Mike gets hurt, he could coach D1 almost immediately.
Frank has excelled at letting the guys run the show.
If K-State went 13-3 in the Big 12 this year (with a team dominated by underclassmen) and won the Big 12 Tournament would Frank Martin be considered a good coach?
-
I'd have to say "Yes".
-
OMG! HE SCREAMS AND HE CURSES!
-
If K-State went 13-3 in the Big 12 this year (with a team dominated by underclassmen) and won the Big 12 Tournament would Frank Martin be considered a good coach?
martin would. self wouldn't. which is fair.
-
The reason I think that Frank Martin can coach is that we have seen consistent improvement in the players from the beginning of the season. We have a lot of freshmen, and they are all playing much much better than at the beginning of the year. That's to be expected, but even returning players have improved over the season. Just look at Darren Kent or Stewart as my prime examples. Granted some players like Colon haven't improved much, but improvement over the season and year to year is something that we didn't see much of under people like Woolridge. Under him, you were roughly as good as a senior as you were a freshman. Maybe a little improvement, but not much.
-
I have to admit, I was damn impressed with Frank Martin's coaching job in that Xavier game. To keep it within 26 was a testament to how well-coached and fundamentally sound K-State's team is.
I have been equally impressed by the way Self can take talent loaded teams and constantly lose to inferior opposition in the tourney. The man is a genius.
"we're ku and everyone gives us their 'A' game. etc. etc. etc. blah blah blah rock chalk."
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
Clemente RSCI#95
Sutton RSCI #81
Kelly RSCI #30
Judge RSCI #40 (top 20 rivals)
McGruder top 100 ESPN, Rivals (top 150 in other RSCI ratings)
Pullen top 100 ESPN (top 150 scout)
Hererra top 100 Scout
7 deep w/ top 100s (and counting) within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. I underestimated Frank. Jus sayin'.
-
frank offers boyd and he'll sign imo
-
I agree that we aren't likely to see many top 10 guys in the future, but we have two other top 100 guys in Sutton and Clemente with 2 committed for the 09 team. It wouldn't be a stretch at all to say we'll have a starting line-up of all top 100 players within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. With that kind of base talent, it might not be impossible to get another top 20 player here or there in the future.
Clemente RSCI#95
Sutton RSCI #81
Kelly RSCI #30
Judge RSCI #40 (top 20 rivals)
McGruder top 100 ESPN, Rivals (top 150 in other RSCI ratings)
Pullen top 100 ESPN (top 150 scout)
Hererra top 100 Scout
7 deep w/ top 100s (and counting) within a year after Beasley and Walker are gone. I underestimated Frank. Jus sayin'.
you slut. I was reading this thread from the beginning (knowing full well it was old) and when I passed by your post I was like, "Damn. Yosh nailed that"
:ksu:
btw, wish we'd get that rusty back. :'(
-
frank offers boyd and he'll sign imo
i think boyd claims we have offered.
-
frank offers boyd and he'll sign imo
i think boyd claims we have offered.
i heard different but if we have and he didn't commit then me ---> :'(
-
The 6-5, 225-pound shooting guard claims offers from Oklahoma State, Kansas State, Marquette, Kentucky, Pittsburgh, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Illinois, Baylor, Western Kentucky and UConn among others.
http://newsok.com/recruiting-notebook/article/3260250/?tm=1214017489 (http://newsok.com/recruiting-notebook/article/3260250/?tm=1214017489)
-
The 6-5, 225-pound shooting guard claims offers from Oklahoma State, Kansas State, Marquette, Kentucky, Pittsburgh, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Illinois, Baylor, Western Kentucky and UConn among others.
http://newsok.com/recruiting-notebook/article/3260250/?tm=1214017489 (http://newsok.com/recruiting-notebook/article/3260250/?tm=1214017489)
-
I noticed that he drinks a lot of diet pepsi while coaching. Personally, I think he should drink Diet Pepsi MAX, he's too laid back while coaching IMO.
-
The 6-5, 225-pound shooting guard claims offers from Oklahoma State, Kansas State, Marquette, Kentucky, Pittsburgh, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Illinois, Baylor, Western Kentucky and UConn among others.
http://newsok.com/recruiting-notebook/article/3260250/?tm=1214017489 (http://newsok.com/recruiting-notebook/article/3260250/?tm=1214017489)
you calling terrence a liar? :runaway:
-
Yes. Tyree had an offer from Tennessee. :rolleyes:
-
Yes. Tyree had an offer from Tennessee. :rolleyes:
my post was facetious. see original post.
frank offers boyd and he'll sign imo
i think boyd claims we have offered.
-
I have to admit, I was damn impressed with Frank Martin's coaching job in that Xavier game. To keep it within 26 was a testament to how well-coached and fundamentally sound K-State's team is.
I have been equally impressed by the way Self can take talent loaded teams and constantly lose to inferior opposition in the tourney. The man is a genius.
(http://media.kansan.com/img/photos/2008/04/09/Rains_bill_Self.jpg)
-
(http://media.kansan.com/img/photos/2008/04/09/Rains_bill_Self.jpg)
Well played. Really no answer for that.
-
the streamers on the left of that picture remind me of a tie that Roy Williams once wore to every game