Author Topic: KU at KSU 2019  (Read 5394 times)

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Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #100 on: February 06, 2019, 08:19:20 PM »
Lol at self resorting to a gimmick defense

Ku hanging in thanks to a banked 3 and a 2-21 guy making one from NBA range


Wait, explain how going to an extremely successful zone defense that stymied our field goals for nine consecutive minutes counts as somehow being a “gimmick.”
« Last Edit: February 06, 2019, 10:30:07 PM by SkinnyBenny »
"walking around mhk and crying in the rain because of love lost is the absolute purest and best thing in the world.  i hope i fall in love during the next few weeks and get my heart broken and it starts raining just to experience it one last time."   --Dlew12

Offline brandochav

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #101 on: February 06, 2019, 08:45:10 PM »
:billdance:
Lol at self resorting to a gimmick defense

Ku hanging in thanks to a banked 3 and a 2-21 guy making one from NBA range


Wait, explain how going to an extremely successful zone defense that stymied our field goals for nine consecutive minutes counts as somehow being a “gimmick.”
Predominant coaching thought is it's a junk defense, or "gimmick". Something you need every blue moon but shouldn't be out with your main tools. Where does that thing always go? The junk drawer. A gimmick is a trick to use as needed.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2019, 08:53:41 PM by brandochav »

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #102 on: February 06, 2019, 09:12:34 PM »
:billdance:
Lol at self resorting to a gimmick defense

Ku hanging in thanks to a banked 3 and a 2-21 guy making one from NBA range


Wait, explain how going to an extremely successful zone defense that stymied our field goals for nine consecutive minutes counts as somehow being a “gimmick.”
Predominant coaching thought is it's a junk defense, or "gimmick". Something you need every blue moon but shouldn't be out with your main tools. Where does that thing always go? The junk drawer. A gimmick is a trick to use as needed.

LOL, nah, there is no circumstance in any non professional league would a 2-3 zone but considered a gimmick.

Man K-State fans have really shown their asses this last 36 hours when it comes to zone defenses.

Offline brandochav

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #103 on: February 06, 2019, 09:22:24 PM »
:billdance:
Lol at self resorting to a gimmick defense

Ku hanging in thanks to a banked 3 and a 2-21 guy making one from NBA range


Wait, explain how going to an extremely successful zone defense that stymied our field goals for nine consecutive minutes counts as somehow being a “gimmick.”
Predominant coaching thought is it's a junk defense, or "gimmick". Something you need every blue moon but shouldn't be out with your main tools. Where does that thing always go? The junk drawer. A gimmick is a trick to use as needed.

LOL, nah, there is no circumstance in any non professional league would a 2-3 zone but considered a gimmick.

Man K-State fans have really shown their asses this last 36 hours when it comes to zone defenses.
You're not wrong...it's not a combo, but a purist still says "that there is a junk defense".

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Offline pissclams

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #104 on: February 06, 2019, 09:23:52 PM »
growing up a syracuse fan, i love a well coached, well executed match-up zone defense and would definitely run one in my program if i found myself coaching a p5 blue blood.

brandochav is right though in that a lot of coaches don't view it as a "real" defense compared to straight up man.   the problem is that you need a certain athlete to primarily run zone vs man and at the college level, that's a big commitment. 


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Online chum1

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #105 on: February 06, 2019, 09:29:27 PM »
Box and 1 is the main one people call a gimmick or junk defense.

Remember the UNLV ameoba defense? They were like the only team talented enough to pull it off.

Offline pissclams

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #106 on: February 06, 2019, 09:53:12 PM »
bill self has run a triangle and two against us and also kentucky


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Offline Skipper44

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #107 on: February 06, 2019, 09:56:18 PM »
Box and 1 is the main one people call a gimmick or junk defense.

Remember the UNLV ameoba defense? They were like the only team talented enough to pull it off.
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Online chum1

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #108 on: February 06, 2019, 09:58:10 PM »
bill self has ran a triangle and two against us and also kentucky

With Walker and Beasley?

Online schreds21

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #109 on: February 06, 2019, 10:00:01 PM »
Ran it successfully against our 2012 E8 team

Offline Skipper44

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #110 on: February 06, 2019, 10:02:30 PM »
Yes- Self used the 8 - 5 in Lawrenfuckingtucky and then got his ass kicked in mhk when Mike & Bill we’re here - Jake & Deni had to play against Self junky triangle & 2

Offline Steffy08

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #111 on: February 06, 2019, 10:15:46 PM »
:billdance:
Lol at self resorting to a gimmick defense

Ku hanging in thanks to a banked 3 and a 2-21 guy making one from NBA range


Wait, explain how going to an extremely successful zone defense that stymied our field goals for nine consecutive minutes counts as somehow being a “gimmick.”
Predominant coaching thought is it's a junk defense, or "gimmick". Something you need every blue moon but shouldn't be out with your main tools. Where does that thing always go? The junk drawer. A gimmick is a trick to use as needed.

LOL, nah, there is no circumstance in any non professional league would a 2-3 zone but considered a gimmick.

Man K-State fans have really shown their asses this last 36 hours when it comes to zone defenses.
You're not wrong...it's not a combo, but a purist still says "that there is a junk defense".

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

The point isn’t whether zone is “junk,” the point is that Self was forced to use a defense he doesn’t like to use.  A man to man is macho, and the defense has much more control as to whether the offense has success.  For Self, playing a zone is basically an acknowledgement that they can’t stop us, and they have to hope we miss shots against a zone.  Weber feels the same way.  Both of them are very good defensive coaches, and both don’t like to play zone.

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #112 on: February 06, 2019, 10:21:16 PM »
Maybe, but I still don't see anything that works as being a gimmick. It may be something they don't often use, or something that isn't seen as "manly," but eff...it worked. And therefore it was absolutely a valid defense and a smart coaching move. It's kind of similar to how I don't understand why some people see air raid offenses or trick plays in football as gimmicky: usually they're extremely clever plays that require tons of offensive know-how and superb talent to execute. There's a risk to them, and if it pays out in a reward then it was a smart coaching move and absolutely the right one. Sorry it wasn't straight up manly smashmouth football where you plunge a running back into the pile every down. :dunno:
"walking around mhk and crying in the rain because of love lost is the absolute purest and best thing in the world.  i hope i fall in love during the next few weeks and get my heart broken and it starts raining just to experience it one last time."   --Dlew12

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #113 on: February 06, 2019, 10:31:10 PM »
man I'm getting p. butthurt about someone calling a zone defense gimmicky.
"walking around mhk and crying in the rain because of love lost is the absolute purest and best thing in the world.  i hope i fall in love during the next few weeks and get my heart broken and it starts raining just to experience it one last time."   --Dlew12

Online mocat

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #114 on: February 06, 2019, 10:59:43 PM »
Ran it successfully against our 2012 E8 team
2010

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #115 on: February 06, 2019, 11:16:13 PM »
Box and 1 is the main one people call a gimmick or junk defense.

Remember the UNLV ameoba defense? They were like the only team talented enough to pull it off.

YES! It was a hybrid matchup zone and diamond and 1. We also ran this on my high school team because we were small but much more athletic than anyone we played at the 3, 4, and 5. It was awesome back then but in this era of spread floors and every team having 3-5 jump shooters, that defense would get completely shredded, it's just too much floor to cover.

Offline stunted

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #116 on: February 07, 2019, 02:29:38 AM »
Yea let's stand in one spot and barely move and take advantage of the fact that the basketball court is too small and everyone is big  :jerk:

If the basketball court was a yard wider it would be the end of the zone defense.

Offline wetwillie

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #117 on: February 07, 2019, 06:18:45 AM »
Yea let's stand in one spot and barely move and take advantage of the fact that the basketball court is too small and everyone is big  :jerk:

If the basketball court was a yard wider it would be the end of the zone defense.

This sounds strikingly similar to the “three point line is ruining the game of basketball”
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Offline Cire

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #118 on: February 07, 2019, 06:44:19 AM »
Ku buddy "they've got to do something about all the charges"


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Offline stunted

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #119 on: February 07, 2019, 07:48:09 AM »
I love the 3 cause the stupid zone can't defend it.

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #120 on: February 07, 2019, 12:20:13 PM »
Yea let's stand in one spot and barely move and take advantage of the fact that the basketball court is too small and everyone is big  :jerk:

If the basketball court was a yard wider it would be the end of the zone defense.

This sounds strikingly similar to the “three point line is ruining the game of basketball”

"The forward pass is ruining the game of football."
"walking around mhk and crying in the rain because of love lost is the absolute purest and best thing in the world.  i hope i fall in love during the next few weeks and get my heart broken and it starts raining just to experience it one last time."   --Dlew12

Offline stunted

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #121 on: February 07, 2019, 12:35:56 PM »
earth to skinnybenny, nobody loved the jake waters long bombs more than i did

beautiful, entertaining, modern basketball is a mix of 3 bombs, ball movement, and sick iso moves. all of which requires space. not this rough ridin' 6th grade stand around with your hands up garbage, let's pass the ball around the top and maybe pass into the middle once in a while. it's not even that effective, oscar crushed ku's zone so hard they had to switch back.

Online Rage Against the McKee

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #122 on: February 07, 2019, 01:06:40 PM »
I don't see how a bigger court would make zone less effective.

Online WackyCat08

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #123 on: February 07, 2019, 01:09:46 PM »
Uh, more spacing?

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Re: KU at KSU 2019
« Reply #124 on: February 07, 2019, 01:31:34 PM »
If anything, wouldn't the extra spacing make man to man more difficult?