Author Topic: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition  (Read 41562 times)

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Online steve dave

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #125 on: June 25, 2016, 01:53:51 PM »

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #126 on: June 25, 2016, 01:57:50 PM »
So KK when is the UK going to invade Europe?

The UK is not the concern, other than Northern Ireland reprising the troubles.


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Hey KK, NATO and the US are already doing a great job of ensuring another war in Europe.

I think a US driven NATO is less likely to spark a conflict among European countries than a bunch of unallied re-militarized European countries.  Russia picking off eastern bloc countries and ultimately sparking a conflict is more or less likely with NATO or without NATO?

Online wetwillie

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #127 on: June 25, 2016, 02:14:58 PM »
http://www.perc.org.uk/project_posts/thoughts-on-the-sociology-of-brexit/

good read but there is too much conjecture imo

How is your Canadian friends European based company reacting to the vote?
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Online steve dave

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #128 on: June 25, 2016, 02:17:05 PM »
http://www.perc.org.uk/project_posts/thoughts-on-the-sociology-of-brexit/

good read but there is too much conjecture imo

How is your Canadian friends European based company reacting to the vote?

neutral'y

Offline sys

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #129 on: June 25, 2016, 02:22:01 PM »
i heard some guy on the radio speculating about the uk joining nafta, which would be awesome, imo.
"experienced commanders will simply be smeared and will actually go to the meat."

Online steve dave

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #130 on: June 25, 2016, 02:28:50 PM »
i heard some guy on the radio speculating about the uk joining nafta, which would be awesome, imo.

yes

Online steve dave

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #131 on: June 25, 2016, 03:14:21 PM »
i heard some guy on the radio speculating about the uk joining nafta, which would be awesome, imo.

Is he Chip Brownish or does this have legs?

I don't know who it was but I'm almost 100% certain it's West Virginia twitter person'ish

Offline sys

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #132 on: June 25, 2016, 03:24:11 PM »
it was some economist type on cnbc or bloomberg.  just a like "there's no reason this couldn't happen" thing not a "i'm hearing this could happen" thing.
"experienced commanders will simply be smeared and will actually go to the meat."

Offline sonofdaxjones

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #133 on: June 25, 2016, 03:49:49 PM »
So KK when is the UK going to invade Europe?

The UK is not the concern, other than Northern Ireland reprising the troubles.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hey KK, NATO and the US are already doing a great job of ensuring another war in Europe.

I think a US driven NATO is less likely to spark a conflict among European countries than a bunch of unallied re-militarized European countries.  Russia picking off eastern bloc countries and ultimately sparking a conflict is more or less likely with NATO or without NATO?

So NATO is disbanding?  Re-militarized?  Lotta high tech tanks, planes, artillery pieces, and troop carriers already in the hands of EU nations. 

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #134 on: June 25, 2016, 04:04:11 PM »
So KK when is the UK going to invade Europe?

The UK is not the concern, other than Northern Ireland reprising the troubles.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hey KK, NATO and the US are already doing a great job of ensuring another war in Europe.

I think a US driven NATO is less likely to spark a conflict among European countries than a bunch of unallied re-militarized European countries.  Russia picking off eastern bloc countries and ultimately sparking a conflict is more or less likely with NATO or without NATO?

So NATO is disbanding?  Re-militarized?  Lotta high tech tanks, planes, artillery pieces, and troop carriers already in the hands of EU nations.

I have no idea what is going to happen.  But the "United States of Europe" may or may not be breaking up.  Seems like that could be bad for peace.


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Online Dugout DickStone

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #135 on: June 25, 2016, 04:35:40 PM »
i heard some guy on the radio speculating about the uk joining nafta, which would be awesome, imo.

Is he Chip Brownish or does this have legs?

I don't know who it was but I'm almost 100% certain it's West Virginia twitter person'ish

Would D-stone go all in on @thedudeofUK?  eff yes he would

Offline john "teach me how to" dougie

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #136 on: June 25, 2016, 09:11:48 PM »
I wish those losers hadn't cratered the Dow

Total emotionally driven crater. It's like when obama talks about the markets and they crash.

Offline Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #137 on: June 25, 2016, 09:59:34 PM »
I'm surprised  (not really) there aren't more micro level economic analysis (maybe there are and nobody cares to report). All you ever read is that first world countries are supposed to take it in the ass for the greater good of the world. Meanwhile everyone ignores all the Bullshit third world economic policy and the nonsense spain, Italy and similar  countries are engaged in.

Shut the eff up and send me a link to back up your statement you lush

Links  :curse:

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #138 on: June 25, 2016, 10:25:14 PM »
The EU defunding Nato is so EU. The organization no longer does anything it was intended to do.
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Offline renocat

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #139 on: June 25, 2016, 11:40:10 PM »
Good.  I would be upset by all of Syrian refugees invading my country and trying to change the koo koo.  I would like to see a Union of English Speaking nation.

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #140 on: June 25, 2016, 11:49:09 PM »
dax, fsd etc.  what do you think will happen with brexit?  UK just immediately being awesome?  UK dissolves in to independent countries and everyone is better off?

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #141 on: June 26, 2016, 08:19:27 AM »
The EU defunding Nato is so EU. The organization no longer does anything it was intended to do.

I had to check if it even existed anymore.

Offline Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #142 on: June 26, 2016, 09:41:43 AM »
dax, fsd etc.  what do you think will happen with brexit?  UK just immediately being awesome?  UK dissolves in to independent countries and everyone is better off?
In a nutshell:

Economically speaking, virtually nothing.

Domestically speaking, dont care, but the UK gets its identity and sovereignty back.

Politically speaking, European (i.e., California) bullshit is symbolically and substantively knocked a few steps back.

I don't think it will lead to a war that wouldn't have happened anyways.
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Offline Kat Kid

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #143 on: June 26, 2016, 10:04:02 AM »
I think most of what you said is certainly possible.  I don't know how you square 1 with 2 tho, either the EU was important or it wasn't--> there is either a bunch of economic fallout and UK reclaims its "sovereignty" or there is very little disruption substantively to the trade agreements.

I am more concerned with the fracturing of nation states as currently organized...Do you think Scotland breaks away?  To what effect?  Do you think the EU starts to break away?  To what effect?

My biggest fear is that European separatists start to fracture all the nation states at the same time that the international institutions fail and that it starts with the UK (Scotland, Northern Ireland) then spreads to Spain (Catalonia, Gibraltar, basque) then to Italy (North/South) etc.


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Offline Dr Rick Daris

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #144 on: June 26, 2016, 11:54:32 AM »
When nafta started, a Canadian (real person) told me that it stood for not another rough ridin' trade agreement.

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #145 on: June 26, 2016, 12:31:37 PM »
I think most of what you said is certainly possible.  I don't know how you square 1 with 2 tho, either the EU was important or it wasn't--> there is either a bunch of economic fallout and UK reclaims its "sovereignty" or there is very little disruption substantively to the trade agreements.

i mean, it really just depends entirely on what agreements replace it.  i kinda agree with fsd that the new structures will pretty much keep almost all of the trade continuity and probably also most of the movement of labor/exchange of social services.

My biggest fear is that European separatists start to fracture all the nation states at the same time that the international institutions fail and that it starts with the UK (Scotland, Northern Ireland) then spreads to Spain (Catalonia, Gibraltar, basque) then to Italy (North/South) etc.

i think your fear confuses cause and effect.  i would also conjecture that scotland would only leave the uk if they are guaranteed entry into the eu, so that would actually strengthen the eu.  i think your other proposed fractures would also strengthen the eu (small states need the common market more than large states. really, the idea of splitting off these little micro nationalities into states is only viable within a framework like the eu).

best case scenario, the uk moves to eu lite by another name, the continental members remain and the eu becomes more responsive to member states complaints.  it's not hard to see this being a net positive long-term.
"experienced commanders will simply be smeared and will actually go to the meat."

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #146 on: June 26, 2016, 01:01:16 PM »
I have no idea what will happen. Kind of exciting
Hyperbolic partisan duplicitous hypocrite

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #147 on: June 26, 2016, 01:09:53 PM »
It may have been the right decision but it was made for the wrong reasons
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Offline treysolid

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #148 on: June 26, 2016, 01:13:10 PM »
I think most of what you said is certainly possible.  I don't know how you square 1 with 2 tho, either the EU was important or it wasn't--> there is either a bunch of economic fallout and UK reclaims its "sovereignty" or there is very little disruption substantively to the trade agreements.

i mean, it really just depends entirely on what agreements replace it.  i kinda agree with fsd that the new structures will pretty much keep almost all of the trade continuity and probably also most of the movement of labor/exchange of social services.

My biggest fear is that European separatists start to fracture all the nation states at the same time that the international institutions fail and that it starts with the UK (Scotland, Northern Ireland) then spreads to Spain (Catalonia, Gibraltar, basque) then to Italy (North/South) etc.

i think your fear confuses cause and effect.  i would also conjecture that scotland would only leave the uk if they are guaranteed entry into the eu, so that would actually strengthen the eu.  i think your other proposed fractures would also strengthen the eu (small states need the common market more than large states. really, the idea of splitting off these little micro nationalities into states is only viable within a framework like the eu).

best case scenario, the uk moves to eu lite by another name, the continental members remain and the eu becomes more responsive to member states complaints.  it's not hard to see this being a net positive long-term.

i think it's a much more scary situation than that. right-wing leaders in Finland, Austria, the Netherlands, France and Hungary are already calling on in/out referendums in those countries. the EU was set up to stop Europe from tearing itself apart after WWII by linking them economically, considering that the power vacuums that existed after WWI lead directly to the next great war. if the stronger, more populous and more prosperous countries leave the EU, it has two really negative consequences in my mind. The first is that it exacerbates the Syrian refugee crisis by leaving countries that are wholly ill-equipped to handle it all alone. The second is that it will more than likely embolden Russia to become more aggressive towards EU countries in general and the Baltic states specifically, and there is a high likelihood that Russia will do to those countries what it's been doing to Ukraine for the past 3 years.

Offline chum1

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Re: smoke your cigars...european realignment edition
« Reply #149 on: June 26, 2016, 01:52:08 PM »
It would be most appropriate and fitting if this ends up costing tons of money without resulting in any measurable change beyond how it makes some old people feel about what kind of political ideology they believe their country has.