Author Topic: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?  (Read 12690 times)

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Offline Ptolemy

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How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« on: March 23, 2016, 01:06:39 AM »
I thought Al Bohl set the standard for Athletic Director incompetence with his "crush me like a dove" presser in his driveway.

But John Currie topped that without uttering a word.

When Jack Hartman ran KState basketball, we were equal with KU. The two programs were about even. They threw hot dogs. We threw bananas. Then came Larry Brown/Roy Williams vs. Tom Asbury/Jim Wooldridge. A dark time for KSU basketball.

We were lost, for a long time, until Tim Weiser stepped up and hired Bob Huggins who took Jack Hartman student Brad Underwood under his tutelage.

Huggs went home after year 1 but left us Frank Martin, who kept Underwood on the staff. It proved to be a valued team. When Frank's offense suffered, Brad stepped up and fixed it.  KState saw consistent NCAA tournaments and an Elite 8.

Then came Currie.

Frank soon departed for more supportive environs, Brad underwing, and Currie hired oscar Weber, who was just fired from Illinois. Can't tell you why.

Underwood moved from South Carolina to Texas, finally a chance to run his own program. That program went to 4 straight conference championships and multiple NCAA tourney berths which was unprecedented for the program.

After a close loss in 2016 to nationally ranked Notre Dame, Underwood finds himself so close, but so far away to the program that his mentor, Jack, prepared him long ago to lead.

Would that call come?

It would not.

A call did come. It was from rival Big 12 school, and Jack Hartman's alma mater, Oklahoma State.  They were interested in hiring Jack Hartman's pupil.

Kansas State and their AD John Currie never made a call, not even to inquire about interest.

go kstate



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Offline That_Guy

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2016, 07:46:13 AM »

I thought Al Bohl set the standard for Athletic Director incompetence with his "crush me like a dove" presser in his driveway.

But John Currie topped that without uttering a word.

When Jack Hartman ran KState basketball, we were equal with KU. The two programs were about even. They threw hot dogs. We threw bananas. Then came Larry Brown/Roy Williams vs. Tom Asbury/Jim Wooldridge. A dark time for KSU basketball.

We were lost, for a long time, until Tim Weiser stepped up and hired Bob Huggins who took Jack Hartman student Brad Underwood under his tutelage.

Huggs went home after year 1 but left us Frank Martin, who kept Underwood on the staff. It proved to be a valued team. When Frank's offense suffered, Brad stepped up and fixed it.  KState saw consistent NCAA tournaments and an Elite 8.

Then came Currie.

Frank soon departed for more supportive environs, Brad underwing, and Currie hired oscar Weber, who was just fired from Illinois. Can't tell you why.

Underwood moved from South Carolina to Texas, finally a chance to run his own program. That program went to 4 straight conference championships and multiple NCAA tourney berths which was unprecedented for the program.

After a close loss in 2016 to nationally ranked Notre Dame, Underwood finds himself so close, but so far away to the program that his mentor, Jack, prepared him long ago to lead.

Would that call come?

It would not.

A call did come. It was from rival Big 12 school, and Jack Hartman's alma mater, Oklahoma State.  They were interested in hiring Jack Hartman's pupil.

Kansas State and their AD John Currie never made a call, not even to inquire about interest.

go kstate

Thanks.... I guess?




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Offline 8manpick

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2016, 07:50:08 AM »

:adios:

Offline kso_FWN

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2016, 07:54:00 AM »
Its simple.

Currie stuck with his hire. I think there is the "safe hire" aspect to all this that has been discussed plenty here, but I also believe Currie truly thinks his best option (short and long term) is oscar Weber as his basketball coach. He believes in the young team mantra and is giving him a 2nd year after he rebuilt his roster. Currie's reputation as an AD will take a major hit if or when oscar continues to fail, but it probably isn't enough to get him fired. That said, Currie's peak time to leave for a different (or better) AD job (at least to a school that values high level basketball) is quickly slipping away, so this still has to have some importance to them.

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2016, 08:21:21 AM »
Its simple.

Currie stuck with his hire. I think there is the "safe hire" aspect to all this that has been discussed plenty here, but I also believe Currie truly thinks his best option (short and long term) is oscar Weber as his basketball coach. He believes in the young team mantra and is giving him a 2nd year after he rebuilt his roster. Currie's reputation as an AD will take a major hit if or when oscar continues to fail, but it probably isn't enough to get him fired. That said, Currie's peak time to leave for a different (or better) AD job (at least to a school that values high level basketball) is quickly slipping away, so this still has to have some importance to them.

Yes. This is why Currie needs to be fired.

Offline pissclams

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2016, 09:10:34 AM »
Its simple.

Currie stuck with his hire. I think there is the "safe hire" aspect to all this that has been discussed plenty here, but I also believe Currie truly thinks his best option (short and long term) is oscar Weber as his basketball coach. He believes in the young team mantra and is giving him a 2nd year after he rebuilt his roster. Currie's reputation as an AD will take a major hit if or when oscar continues to fail, but it probably isn't enough to get him fired. That said, Currie's peak time to leave for a different (or better) AD job (at least to a school that values high level basketball) is quickly slipping away, so this still has to have some importance to them.

currie knows that oscar is his best option in the short term and hopes that he is the best option for the long term. 
currie is smart enough to know that he can't fire a coach that's gotten his team into the ncaa 2/4 years and won the conference champ.  because if he did, currie's rep as an AD would take a hit.  because he'd look like an idiot.  it doesn't matter that brad underwood became a hot name in coaching, makes no difference to the situation we're in at k-state.

currie doesn't want to fire anyone.  doing so makes his job much harder.  currie hopes that oscar works out here, he hired the guy. but we have no reason to believe he won't act on oscar if oscar doesn't produce. the best way for currie to protect his job is to be successful in what he does.  whether or not people here want to admit it, he has been.   


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Offline kso_FWN

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2016, 09:13:15 AM »
currie knows that oscar is his best option in the short term and hopes that he is the best option for the long term. 
currie is smart enough to know that he can't fire a coach that's gotten his team into the ncaa 2/4 years and won the conference champ.  because if he did, currie's rep as an AD would take a hit.  because he'd look like an idiot.  it doesn't matter that brad underwood became a hot name in coaching, makes no difference to the situation we're in at k-state.

currie doesn't want to fire anyone.  doing so makes his job much harder.  currie hopes that oscar works out here, he hired the guy. but we have no reason to believe he won't act on oscar if oscar doesn't produce. the best way for currie to protect his job is to be successful in what he does.  whether or not people here want to admit it, he has been.   

Reasonable.

But I assume you still hate oscar. You've indicated that and that people should not attend games in the past.

Also, oscar must produce in the short term.

Offline Emo EMAW

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2016, 09:22:28 AM »
How can Currie market himself to the next school with the two dumpster fires we have for coaching staffs in the only two sports that matter?

Offline pissclams

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2016, 09:23:38 AM »
currie knows that oscar is his best option in the short term and hopes that he is the best option for the long term. 
currie is smart enough to know that he can't fire a coach that's gotten his team into the ncaa 2/4 years and won the conference champ.  because if he did, currie's rep as an AD would take a hit.  because he'd look like an idiot.  it doesn't matter that brad underwood became a hot name in coaching, makes no difference to the situation we're in at k-state.

currie doesn't want to fire anyone.  doing so makes his job much harder.  currie hopes that oscar works out here, he hired the guy. but we have no reason to believe he won't act on oscar if oscar doesn't produce. the best way for currie to protect his job is to be successful in what he does.  whether or not people here want to admit it, he has been.   

Reasonable.

But I assume you still hate oscar. You've indicated that and that people should not attend games in the past.

Also, oscar must produce in the short term.

i do hate oscar.  my personal feelings for him have nothing to do with the very real idea of whether or not he deserves to be fired.  because ultimately, yes, oscar has to produce.  short term and long. that determines his fate. i happen to think he will produce in the short term (next year).  i don't think he will produce in the long term, at least not to my expectations. thankfully, for him, his future isn't being determined by a bunch of hyper emotional message board fans.

i think he will eventually be canned.  i don't support him and don't think others should either, so i advocate that people don't go to games.  the easiest way for all of us to get our point across to currie is financially.  but again, skipping games/support is just one facet to it all because despite my silent protest, if this team were to win 25 games next season, a lot of the same vocal posters here will be back on the bandwagon.


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Offline kso_FWN

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2016, 09:27:45 AM »
i do hate oscar.  my personal feelings for him have nothing to do with the very real idea of whether or not he deserves to be fired.  because ultimately, yes, oscar has to produce.  short term and long. that determines his fate. i happen to think he will produce in the short term (next year).  i don't think he will produce in the long term, at least not to my expectations. thankfully, for him, his future isn't being determined by a bunch of hyper emotional message board fans.

i think he will eventually be canned.  i don't support him and don't think others should either, so i advocate that people don't go to games.  the easiest way for all of us to get our point across to currie is financially.  but again, skipping games/support is just one facet to it all because despite my silent protest, if this team were to win 25 games next season, a lot of the same vocal posters here will be back on the bandwagon.

Fair enough.

I won't lie, if we finish in the upper half of the league, safely make it into the NCAA tournament, and win a game there next year I will be relatively on board. I will never fully buy into oscar, but he can still win back some support from me.

Offline pissclams

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2016, 09:33:24 AM »
i think rick daris said it best when he said that it's impossible to buy into oscar, but when he wins, all his annoying crap becomes just barely tolerable. when he loses, it's like an electron microscope was flipped on and every stupid thing he's done is magnified. 

the same can be said about all coaches, but all coaches don't do as much annoying crap as oscar.


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Offline kso_FWN

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2016, 09:38:13 AM »
Very accurate. With high amounts of success he could possibly "our lovable weird coach", but that's his ceiling. Going back and watching his motivational pregame videos is painful, especially considering in one of them he's coaching a team playing in the national title game. Its impossible to get past stuff like that.


Offline HerrSonntag

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2016, 09:38:52 AM »
As much as i'm a proponent of voting with your feet in most aspects of life, _fan's chart pointed out that the message, at least in recent KState history, would fall on deaf ears.

http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=37424.msg1540546#msg1540546

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2016, 09:45:24 AM »
How can Currie market himself to the next school with the two dumpster fires we have for coaching staffs in the only two sports that matter?
Well, he has nothing to do with one of them. So that's first for starters.

Offline CNS

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2016, 09:46:40 AM »
One doesn't look dumpster fire'ey to most people.

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Offline kso_FWN

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2016, 09:48:06 AM »
How can Currie market himself to the next school with the two dumpster fires we have for coaching staffs in the only two sports that matter?
Well, he has nothing to do with one of them. So that's first for starters.

And if he's implying football, its another matter all together. The coach is a HOF legend who has won a conference title within the last 5 seasons and finished in the top 20 just 2 years ago. If that's a dumpster fire program I'm not sure you can ever be happy as a K-State fan.

Offline ednksu

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2016, 09:49:19 AM »
i do hate oscar.  my personal feelings for him have nothing to do with the very real idea of whether or not he deserves to be fired.  because ultimately, yes, oscar has to produce.  short term and long. that determines his fate. i happen to think he will produce in the short term (next year).  i don't think he will produce in the long term, at least not to my expectations. thankfully, for him, his future isn't being determined by a bunch of hyper emotional message board fans.

i think he will eventually be canned.  i don't support him and don't think others should either, so i advocate that people don't go to games.  the easiest way for all of us to get our point across to currie is financially.  but again, skipping games/support is just one facet to it all because despite my silent protest, if this team were to win 25 games next season, a lot of the same vocal posters here will be back on the bandwagon.

Fair enough.

I won't lie, if we finish in the upper half of the league, safely make it into the NCAA tournament, and win a game there next year I will be relatively on board. I will never fully buy into oscar, but he can still win back some support from me.

You are a smart fan than that.  You and I know damn well that oscar will be in the top half, maybe top 3rd simply because of being in a lucky situation with rest of the league losing a crap load of talent, most of our valuable players coming back with more experience, and new coaches at 2 spots (its going to take Undie and Dixon a year or two just to rebuild a la Tubby's job at Tech).  oscar would have to majorly eff up in order to miss out on a "successful" season and that is what is most dangerous.  He is going to do well enough that people will give him another 3ish years and we'll see mediocre results.
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Offline kso_FWN

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2016, 09:50:01 AM »
Also, basketball trajectory is possibly heading that way, but we haven't reached dumpster fire status yet. Years 4-6 of Wooly were hitting dumpster fire status for K-State basketball.

Granted, no one should be happy with where we are at, but defining either program as being a dumpster fire is silly. Rutgers basketball is dumpster fire. KU football is dumpster fire.

Offline Cartierfor3

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2016, 09:50:27 AM »
Yeah Captain Crap has made the point that we were in the top 10 as recently as 2014 in football. The program needs to improve again but its no dumpster fire

Offline Thecatwhisperer

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2016, 09:51:09 AM »
This is why. Currie wasn't paying attention because he didn't think he had to and others were. I wonder if Currie even watched the Notre Dame game?

http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/osusportsextra/t--boone-pickens-supports-osu-s-brad-underwood-hiring-and-says-dou/article_b587a52d-ac72-5ce4-898e-83af12cd661d.html

Offline CNS

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2016, 09:52:49 AM »
I bet he did and he knows exactly how many times Pastrana stood up and that directly effected his decision.

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Offline pissclams

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2016, 09:53:19 AM »
i do hate oscar.  my personal feelings for him have nothing to do with the very real idea of whether or not he deserves to be fired.  because ultimately, yes, oscar has to produce.  short term and long. that determines his fate. i happen to think he will produce in the short term (next year).  i don't think he will produce in the long term, at least not to my expectations. thankfully, for him, his future isn't being determined by a bunch of hyper emotional message board fans.

i think he will eventually be canned.  i don't support him and don't think others should either, so i advocate that people don't go to games.  the easiest way for all of us to get our point across to currie is financially.  but again, skipping games/support is just one facet to it all because despite my silent protest, if this team were to win 25 games next season, a lot of the same vocal posters here will be back on the bandwagon.

Fair enough.

I won't lie, if we finish in the upper half of the league, safely make it into the NCAA tournament, and win a game there next year I will be relatively on board. I will never fully buy into oscar, but he can still win back some support from me.

You are a smart fan than that.  You and I know damn well that oscar will be in the top half, maybe top 3rd simply because of being in a lucky situation with rest of the league losing a crap load of talent, most of our valuable players coming back with more experience, and new coaches at 2 spots (its going to take Undie and Dixon a year or two just to rebuild a la Tubby's job at Tech).  oscar would have to majorly eff up in order to miss out on a "successful" season and that is what is most dangerous.  He is going to do well enough that people will give him another 3ish years and we'll see mediocre results.


MAYBE!


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Offline ChiComCat

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2016, 09:53:41 AM »
The part that really frustrated me was the response from Kirk about attendance/money and the lack of any reasonable response from Currie.  I laid none of this at Kirk's doorstep until his tone deaf comments.  Pretty annoying for him to tell the fanbase to eff off on twitter while he fields complaints about Waters 221 being too warm for a student.  Maybe I was being naive, but it just shows how patronizing his whole charade is.  Currie needed to at least say something about the season being disappointing or an expectation for improvement, but he refuses to.  Given his past ability to admit mistakes, this is not surprising.

As I'm sure Kirk and Currie know, looking purely at attendance is a bullshit metric.  Although ticket sales may have only slipped slightly, there is no way that the basketball games bring in near the revenue when factoring in the price of the seat, much less concessions that require people to show up.  There was no need for bargain bin promotions during Frank's tenure.

Offline Thecatwhisperer

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2016, 09:55:47 AM »
I do have to laugh at the arrogance of Gottlieb thinking he deserves a shot at coaching a P5 school without any coaching experience.  This also shows that he would have just used K-State as a quick stepping stone to get to OSU if he had any success here. 

Offline CNS

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Re: How In The Hell Did We Let Brad Underwood Get Away?
« Reply #24 on: March 23, 2016, 09:57:31 AM »
Yeah, if he was serious he would have looked into an assistant job somewhere after we turned him down.  I don't think he will ever headcoach P5 for that reason.

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