Who is the worst in-game coach in the Big 12?

[Stevesie60]

I guess I don't think making the tournament is the best way to measure success. Barnes makes the tournament, but when was the last time he was a threat to make the Final 4? Hell, with Durant they didn't make the Sweet 16. Calipari and Roy have both missed the tournament recently, but when they make it they always have the potential to make the Final 4, even if they're an 8 seed.

So yeah, if you want consistency and the ability to go into every season knowing you won't get embarrassed or really accomplish anything, Barnes is your guy. If you want someone riskier, who may not make the tournament, but may actually get a 1-3 seed every few years, there's more than 15 guys out there for you to choose from.

[michigancat]

I'm not sure I'd quite put him top 15 after the last 7 years. Probably top 25 though.

How many other coaches have made the tournament 6 out of the last 7 years?

You could make an argument against Barnes if you value deep runs or a conference title over consistency. But I can tell you that in the Big 12 you've got:

Big 12: Self
Pac 12: No one
ACC: K, Roy, Pitino, Boeheim
Big 10: Izzo, Ryan, Matta
Big East: Wright
Big West: Few, Dave Rose
MWC: Fisher
SEC: Cal
A10: Smart

Now, you can add in coaches like Donovan and Sean Miller and maybe put him outside the top 15.  (You could also argue he belongs ahead of guys like Fisher and Dave Rose, perhaps.)

I may be missing some.

[michigancat]

Also, FAN didn't pick 7 years randomly. Texas won the Big 12 and was a 2 seed in 2008.

[TownieCat]

Has anyone suggested Kruger yet? His team is way too talented to have lost that many games this season, especially all of the close ones.

Also, go look at his career resume. Not nearly as good as you'd think. A lot of 1st round exits in the tourney and only one conference title.

[steve dave]

yeah the "anybody can win at texas" thing is pretty LOL

it gets me really excited to argue the case of stud coaches Mack and Rick because I know it's coming. it's so easy to crush walk off homers off of this low/medium talking point. like, people should know better but here they come! and I'm like the slugger on rookie of the year wagging my tongue at the floater but instead of whiffing on it I crush one into the street over dead center.

[Cartierfor3]

SD do you like rookie of the year or little big league better? I like little big league but they're both great.

[steve dave]

SD do you like rookie of the year or little big league better? I like little big league but they're both great.

rookie of the year

[CNS]

Rick is just glad that little kid got a chance to realize his dream and play professional ball.  He's a fantastic guy, that Rick.

[Cartierfor3]

SD do you like rookie of the year or little big league better? I like little big league but they're both great.

rookie of the year

I like it but there are some things that always bothered me about it. Remember the scene with the hidden ball trick? Illegal. Ball doesn't become live again after a timeout until pitcher touches the rubber.

[kso_FAN]

Also, FAN didn't pick 7 years randomly. Texas won the Big 12 and was a 2 seed in 2008.

Yeah, my argument is not that Barnes is a bad coach. I'm just saying he's dropped a level from the previous 7 years when he was winning conference titles and making Sweet 16s, Elite 8s, and a Final 4. That's all.

[kso_FAN]

I think K-State should make the NCAA every year.   My perspective, however flawed on that is based on the fact that IMO K-State is around 3rd in the Big 12 in terms of actually caring about basketball and arguably has the 2nd best overall b-ball tradition in the Big 12.   I just don't think its asking all that much to be good enough to make the NCAA tourney every year, particularly in era where the Big 12 is thriving on perception that IMO doesn't match reality.

Tradition doesn't really mean much IMO. As far as most people are concerned our tradition goes back to when Huggins came. Lon's run is very old and our Final Fours happened in another era.

[kst8cat]

Do you even remember GRCOAT? Was anyone calling for Huggins' head when we missed the NCAA?

Well technically GRCOAT applied to the year after Huggins left.  The Huggins year we were loaded with a bunch of veteran players.  The top 5 scorers were all Wooldridge guys (Martin, Hoskins, Harris, Stewart, and Wright).  Huggins turned them into a 10-6 team in conference after having gone 6-10 under Wooldridge. 

[Clevey 2 Times]

I'm not sure I'd quite put him top 15 after the last 7 years. Probably top 25 though.

How many other coaches have made the tournament 6 out of the last 7 years?

You could make an argument against Barnes if you value deep runs or a conference title over consistency. But I can tell you that in the Big 12 you've got:

Big 12: Self
Pac 12: No one
ACC: K, Roy, Pitino, Boeheim
Big 10: Izzo, Ryan, Matta
Big East: Wright
Big West: Few, Dave Rose
MWC: Fisher
SEC: Cal
A10: Smart

Now, you can add in coaches like Donovan and Sean Miller and maybe put him outside the top 15.  (You could also argue he belongs ahead of guys like Fisher and Dave Rose, perhaps.)

I may be missing some.

I would rather have any of those guys on the 6 of 7 tourney years list instead of Barnes. As for power conference guys not making the tourney in six of the last seven years that are better than Barnes, here's guys that at least have an argument:

Donovan, Sean Miller, Hoiberg, Kruger, Huggins, Mike Brey, Kevin Ollie, Mick Cronin, Larry Brown, Fran Dunphy, Jamie Dixon, Tony Bennett, Steve Lavin, Mark Turgeon, John Beilein, Dana Altman, Mike Anderson, Frank Martin

I'd definitely rather have Donovan, Miller, Kruger, Brey, Ollie, or Bennett over Barnes.

The relevant comparison here is how would another coach do at Texas -- Big 12 version (which is why the Tom Penders conversation is irrelevant).

[michigancat]

I'm not sure I'd quite put him top 15 after the last 7 years. Probably top 25 though.

How many other coaches have made the tournament 6 out of the last 7 years?

You could make an argument against Barnes if you value deep runs or a conference title over consistency. But I can tell you that in the Big 12 you've got:

Big 12: Self
Pac 12: No one
ACC: K, Roy, Pitino, Boeheim
Big 10: Izzo, Ryan, Matta
Big East: Wright
Big West: Few, Dave Rose
MWC: Fisher
SEC: Cal
A10: Smart

Now, you can add in coaches like Donovan and Sean Miller and maybe put him outside the top 15.  (You could also argue he belongs ahead of guys like Fisher and Dave Rose, perhaps.)

I may be missing some.

I would rather have any of those guys on the 6 of 7 tourney years list instead of Barnes. As for power conference guys not making the tourney in six of the last seven years that are better than Barnes, here's guys that at least have an argument:

Donovan, Sean Miller, Hoiberg, Kruger, Huggins, Mike Brey, Kevin Ollie, Mick Cronin, Larry Brown, Fran Dunphy, Jamie Dixon, Tony Bennett, Steve Lavin, Mark Turgeon, John Beilein, Dana Altman, Mike Anderson, Frank Martin

I'd definitely rather have Donovan, Miller, Kruger, Brey, Ollie, or Bennett over Barnes.

The relevant comparison here is how would another coach do at Texas -- Big 12 version (which is why the Tom Penders conversation is irrelevant).

I'd agree with Miller, Donovan, Bennett, and maybe Beilein, but that's it.

[Cartierfor3]

SD do you like rookie of the year or little big league better? I like little big league but they're both great.

rookie of the year

I like it but there are some things that always bothered me about it. Remember the scene with the hidden ball trick? Illegal. Ball doesn't become live again after a timeout until pitcher touches the rubber.

Also, there's a one game playoff with the Mets to make the World Series. At that time both were in the NL East, and a 1 game playoff would've just put them in the NLCS vs. the Western division champ. That always bothered me.

[Clevey 2 Times]

I'm not sure I'd quite put him top 15 after the last 7 years. Probably top 25 though.

How many other coaches have made the tournament 6 out of the last 7 years?

You could make an argument against Barnes if you value deep runs or a conference title over consistency. But I can tell you that in the Big 12 you've got:

Big 12: Self
Pac 12: No one
ACC: K, Roy, Pitino, Boeheim
Big 10: Izzo, Ryan, Matta
Big East: Wright
Big West: Few, Dave Rose
MWC: Fisher
SEC: Cal
A10: Smart

Now, you can add in coaches like Donovan and Sean Miller and maybe put him outside the top 15.  (You could also argue he belongs ahead of guys like Fisher and Dave Rose, perhaps.)

I may be missing some.

I would rather have any of those guys on the 6 of 7 tourney years list instead of Barnes. As for power conference guys not making the tourney in six of the last seven years that are better than Barnes, here's guys that at least have an argument:

Donovan, Sean Miller, Hoiberg, Kruger, Huggins, Mike Brey, Kevin Ollie, Mick Cronin, Larry Brown, Fran Dunphy, Jamie Dixon, Tony Bennett, Steve Lavin, Mark Turgeon, John Beilein, Dana Altman, Mike Anderson, Frank Martin

I'd definitely rather have Donovan, Miller, Kruger, Brey, Ollie, or Bennett over Barnes.

The relevant comparison here is how would another coach do at Texas -- Big 12 version (which is why the Tom Penders conversation is irrelevant).

I'd agree with Miller, Donovan, Bennett, and maybe Beilein, but that's it.

Those are pretty clear. I also think Brey is about a billion times better than Barnes.

[Mr Bread]

I'm not sure I'd quite put him top 15 after the last 7 years. Probably top 25 though.

How many other coaches have made the tournament 6 out of the last 7 years?

You could make an argument against Barnes if you value deep runs or a conference title over consistency. But I can tell you that in the Big 12 you've got:

Big 12: Self
Pac 12: No one
ACC: K, Roy, Pitino, Boeheim
Big 10: Izzo, Ryan, Matta
Big East: Wright
Big West: Few, Dave Rose
MWC: Fisher
SEC: Cal
A10: Smart

Now, you can add in coaches like Donovan and Sean Miller and maybe put him outside the top 15.  (You could also argue he belongs ahead of guys like Fisher and Dave Rose, perhaps.)

I may be missing some.

Dave Rose? That's probs why he's the only only person only your list with a first and last name.

Neither Rose nor Fisher have made it out of the sweet 16 at their current schools, and they're playing in mid-major conferences.  Whoopty rough ridin' doo winning the mountain west or wcw. 

Donovan (final 4 last year, 3 elite 8s right before that and three firsts in the four years prior) and Beilein (runner-up and elite 8 the two years prior, two firsts in the three prior) clearly belong on the list over both of them.  Miller too.  Two elite 8s in the four years prior and three firsts in the last five.

[Mr Bread]

I'm not sure I'd quite put him top 15 after the last 7 years. Probably top 25 though.

How many other coaches have made the tournament 6 out of the last 7 years?

You could make an argument against Barnes if you value deep runs or a conference title over consistency. But I can tell you that in the Big 12 you've got:

Big 12: Self
Pac 12: No one
ACC: K, Roy, Pitino, Boeheim
Big 10: Izzo, Ryan, Matta
Big East: Wright
Big West: Few, Dave Rose
MWC: Fisher
SEC: Cal
A10: Smart

Now, you can add in coaches like Donovan and Sean Miller and maybe put him outside the top 15.  (You could also argue he belongs ahead of guys like Fisher and Dave Rose, perhaps.)

I may be missing some.

I would rather have any of those guys on the 6 of 7 tourney years list instead of Barnes. As for power conference guys not making the tourney in six of the last seven years that are better than Barnes, here's guys that at least have an argument:

Donovan, Sean Miller, Hoiberg, Kruger, Huggins, Mike Brey, Kevin Ollie, Mick Cronin, Larry Brown, Fran Dunphy, Jamie Dixon, Tony Bennett, Steve Lavin, Mark Turgeon, John Beilein, Dana Altman, Mike Anderson, Frank Martin

I'd definitely rather have Donovan, Miller, Kruger, Brey, Ollie, or Bennett over Barnes.

The relevant comparison here is how would another coach do at Texas -- Big 12 version (which is why the Tom Penders conversation is irrelevant).

I'd agree with Miller, Donovan, Bennett, and maybe Beilein, but that's it.

Those are pretty clear. I also think Brey is about a billion times better than Barnes.

That's incredibly rough ridin' stupid.  He has one sweet 16 in his entire 20 year D1 career, twelve rough ridin' years ago.  He's missed the NCAAs five out of 15 seasons at ND.  He had an overall losing season just last year.  eff that.  oscar is better than he is.  ND just doesn't give a crap about basketball. 

[Clevey 2 Times]

I'm not sure I'd quite put him top 15 after the last 7 years. Probably top 25 though.

How many other coaches have made the tournament 6 out of the last 7 years?

You could make an argument against Barnes if you value deep runs or a conference title over consistency. But I can tell you that in the Big 12 you've got:

Big 12: Self
Pac 12: No one
ACC: K, Roy, Pitino, Boeheim
Big 10: Izzo, Ryan, Matta
Big East: Wright
Big West: Few, Dave Rose
MWC: Fisher
SEC: Cal
A10: Smart

Now, you can add in coaches like Donovan and Sean Miller and maybe put him outside the top 15.  (You could also argue he belongs ahead of guys like Fisher and Dave Rose, perhaps.)

I may be missing some.

I would rather have any of those guys on the 6 of 7 tourney years list instead of Barnes. As for power conference guys not making the tourney in six of the last seven years that are better than Barnes, here's guys that at least have an argument:

Donovan, Sean Miller, Hoiberg, Kruger, Huggins, Mike Brey, Kevin Ollie, Mick Cronin, Larry Brown, Fran Dunphy, Jamie Dixon, Tony Bennett, Steve Lavin, Mark Turgeon, John Beilein, Dana Altman, Mike Anderson, Frank Martin

I'd definitely rather have Donovan, Miller, Kruger, Brey, Ollie, or Bennett over Barnes.

The relevant comparison here is how would another coach do at Texas -- Big 12 version (which is why the Tom Penders conversation is irrelevant).

I'd agree with Miller, Donovan, Bennett, and maybe Beilein, but that's it.

Those are pretty clear. I also think Brey is about a billion times better than Barnes.

That's incredibly rough ridin' stupid.  He has one sweet 16 in his entire 20 year D1 career, twelve rough ridin' years ago.  He's missed the NCAAs five out of 15 seasons at ND.  He had an overall losing season just last year.  eff that.  oscar is better than he is.  ND just doesn't give a crap about basketball.

oscar is better than Mike Brey? Good luck with that one. But hey, that's just one mans opinion.

To emphasize for the dense headed -- the relevant comparison is how these guys would do at Big 12 Texas.

EDIT: Although, my dense head just took Texas to the Sweet 16, with a Barnes victory over Brey. Their talent is just too alluring!

[Mr Bread]

Mike Brey would not do better at Texas than Rick Barnes you dumbfuck.  He has one particularly good season this year and shitbrains come out of the woodwork saying what a great coach he is.  He's a rough ridin' less accomplished oscar that didn't get fired is what he is.

His name wouldn't have been dribbling out of your fat rough ridin' mouth after 15-17 last season and that says it all about old Brey and your dumbfuckery. 

[michigancat]

I don't know why people think Texas has some sort of huge advantage in basketball over schools like Notre Dame, Ohio State, Florida, Michigan, Louisville, UConn, etc.

[ChiComCat]

I don't know why people think Texas has some sort of huge advantage in basketball over schools like Notre Dame, Ohio State, Florida, Michigan, Louisville, UConn, etc.

People in Texas think they have an advantage over everyone in everything.  No idea about the people outside of Texas

[Stevesie60]

There's just no way you can put Barnes in the top 15. Off the top of my head:

Coach K, Cal, Donovan, Pitino, Self, Marshall, Belein, Izzo, Roy, Bennet, Miller, Ryan, Boeheim, Brown, Few, Wright, Hoiberg.

There are a couple more that you could argue as well, and you could even argue a couple of those. I think Barnes is a borderline top 25 coach.

[michigancat]

There's just no way you can put Barnes in the top 15. Off the top of my head:

Coach K, Cal, Donovan, Pitino, Self, Marshall, Belein, Izzo, Roy, Bennet, Miller, Ryan, Boeheim, Brown, Few, Wright, Hoiberg.

There are a couple more that you could argue as well, and you could even argue a couple of those. I think Barnes is a borderline top 25 coach.

Gregg Marshall? Larry Brown? Hoiberg?

eh

And Few's seen what happens to Gonzaga coaches when they leave, too.

[Stevesie60]

You are being especially stubborn, michigancat. Even for goEMAW.