Author Topic: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....  (Read 3980108 times)

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Offline Panjandrum

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24150 on: February 27, 2013, 01:42:39 PM »
The point is that those local broadcasts pay next to nothing and then they have to split the payouts from ABC/ESPN with those teams that aren't even good enough to play on those networks. I just don't see how a program like Ohio State benefits from being in the Big 10, especially considering the programs they are adding.

They benefit if the Big Ten's expansion platform keeps them relevant in the long term.

The Big Ten is in trouble because their footprint is leaking population.  They need to expand to places where the people are.  If they stay where they are, they'll decrease in relevance because A) the current product is pretty bad and B) the people watching the product are getting smaller and smaller.

Hell, our game against Texas outdrew the Big Ten title game on TV.

OSU is relevant when they go 6-6.

Wasn't that the whole point of adding Rutgers and Maryland?

"They" is the Big Ten, which protects the OSU brand by proxy.

I should have been more clear.

Offline CyberToothCat

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24151 on: February 27, 2013, 05:48:31 PM »
They benefit if the Big Ten's expansion platform keeps them relevant in the long term.

The Big Ten is in trouble because their footprint is leaking population.  They need to expand to places where the people are.  If they stay where they are, they'll decrease in relevance because A) the current product is pretty bad and B) the people watching the product are getting smaller and smaller.

Hell, our game against Texas outdrew the Big Ten title game on TV.

To be fair to the Big Ten, they're not really leaking population.  Michigan is the only state in their footprint that has lost population (from 9,938,444 in 2000, to 9,883,360 in 2012).  Every other state in the Big Ten footprint has increased during that timespan, including increases of at least 5% for Wisc, Indiana, Iowa and Minn.

The Big Ten's real problem is that the country as a whole had an increase in population of 11.3%.  None of the Big Ten states grew in population by a rate that high.  The closest was Minnesota with a growth rate of 9.3%.

The Big Ten states (except Michigan, which is essentially unchanged) are all growing, they're just growing at a slower pace than other parts of the country.  Some of them much slower, like Ohio (1.7%), Illinois (3.7%) and Pennsylvania (3.9%).



Because I've been playing with the numbers, I figured I would go ahead and list these.  If anyone hasn't figured it out already, this info makes it blatantly obvious why the Big Ten is looking to add teams along the eastern seaboard, specifically UVA, UNC, GT and possibly FSU.

Growth rate from 2000 census to July 2012:
Florida 21%
Georgia 21%
North Carolina 21%
Virginia 15%

Offline MadCat

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24152 on: February 27, 2013, 08:49:18 PM »
They benefit if the Big Ten's expansion platform keeps them relevant in the long term.

The Big Ten is in trouble because their footprint is leaking population.  They need to expand to places where the people are.  If they stay where they are, they'll decrease in relevance because A) the current product is pretty bad and B) the people watching the product are getting smaller and smaller.

Hell, our game against Texas outdrew the Big Ten title game on TV.

To be fair to the Big Ten, they're not really leaking population.  Michigan is the only state in their footprint that has lost population (from 9,938,444 in 2000, to 9,883,360 in 2012).  Every other state in the Big Ten footprint has increased during that timespan, including increases of at least 5% for Wisc, Indiana, Iowa and Minn.

The Big Ten's real problem is that the country as a whole had an increase in population of 11.3%.  None of the Big Ten states grew in population by a rate that high.  The closest was Minnesota with a growth rate of 9.3%.

The Big Ten states (except Michigan, which is essentially unchanged) are all growing, they're just growing at a slower pace than other parts of the country.  Some of them much slower, like Ohio (1.7%), Illinois (3.7%) and Pennsylvania (3.9%).



Because I've been playing with the numbers, I figured I would go ahead and list these.  If anyone hasn't figured it out already, this info makes it blatantly obvious why the Big Ten is looking to add teams along the eastern seaboard, specifically UVA, UNC, GT and possibly FSU.

Growth rate from 2000 census to July 2012:
Florida 21%
Georgia 21%
North Carolina 21%
Virginia 15%

I would see that as leaking population since you attribute some population growth to births.  If these states are below the average, then those above the average are either getting some from the below average states, having a LOT more births per capita than the below average, or experiencing an immigration surplus.  I guess the other possibility is more people dying in the big 10 states.

Offline 0.42

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24153 on: February 27, 2013, 09:03:20 PM »
Keep an eye on the cablevision vs. Viacom court case that's going on. If Cablevision gets their way then you could see a la carte channel options open up to potential subscribers and that could have an indirect effect on sports tv contracts and possibly realignment as a result.

Offline wetwillie

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24154 on: February 27, 2013, 09:06:22 PM »
Keep an eye on the cablevision vs. Viacom court case that's going on. If Cablevision gets their way then you could see a la carte channel options open up to potential subscribers and that could have an indirect effect on sports tv contracts and possibly realignment as a result.

That's shameless MIR baiting right there sports fans.
When the bullets are flying, that's when I'm at my best

Offline 0.42

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24155 on: February 27, 2013, 10:08:13 PM »
I must know the backstory to this.

Offline Pittcat

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24156 on: February 28, 2013, 10:11:03 AM »
Keep an eye on the cablevision vs. Viacom court case that's going on. If Cablevision gets their way then you could see a la carte channel options open up to potential subscribers and that could have an indirect effect on sports tv contracts and possibly realignment as a result.

That's shameless MIR baiting right there sports fans.

This.  Chumming the waters and may not even realize it.
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Offline MakeItRain

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24157 on: March 01, 2013, 05:44:56 PM »
Keep an eye on the cablevision vs. Viacom court case that's going on. If Cablevision gets their way then you could see a la carte channel options open up to potential subscribers and that could have an indirect effect on sports tv contracts and possibly realignment as a result.

no it won't, sorry

Offline ednksu

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24158 on: March 01, 2013, 07:46:46 PM »
I would kill a small baby seal for ala cart options. 
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Offline 0.42

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24159 on: March 01, 2013, 08:01:48 PM »
Keep an eye on the cablevision vs. Viacom court case that's going on. If Cablevision gets their way then you could see a la carte channel options open up to potential subscribers and that could have an indirect effect on sports tv contracts and possibly realignment as a result.

no it won't, sorry

k

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24160 on: March 02, 2013, 03:33:34 AM »
Keep an eye on the cablevision vs. Viacom court case that's going on. If Cablevision gets their way then you could see a la carte channel options open up to potential subscribers and that could have an indirect effect on sports tv contracts and possibly realignment as a result.

no it won't, sorry

k

Advertisers clamor for smaller audiences. If I'm Pepsi nothing would want me want to spend more money than my potential reach being cut by 25%.

Also ESPN is relying heavily on having every cable and satellite provider pay them $2 per subscriber every month. If any percentage of that is lost including any lost advertising money that will be passed along in a very heavy handed way to a la carte subscribers. Sports programming is very unique from the stuff that people like edn doesn't like to watch and pay for because in addition to paying production cost and paying talent sports networks also have to pay rights fees measured in billions. Lifetime doesn't have to pay rights fees for The Client List and Army Wives. TV like everything else is far more economical in bulk. A la carte is bad for the sports consumer. Subscribers are paying a hell of a lot more for Sportscenter than they are for reruns on Nick At Night.

I'm not saying that they're won't be some form of a la carte programming, there are already some of those options on a limited basis. I just don't think it will be widespread enough to effect college conferences. If so it would not only be horrible news for the sports consumer but for most if not all leagues and conferences.

Offline Houstoncat93

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24161 on: March 02, 2013, 07:17:48 AM »
I think the point of that lawsuit is more to give the cable companies the ability to make "a la carte" type choice on what they carry, not for the consumer to have those same options.  They don't want to be strong armed by Disney to have to carry "Lifetime Real Women" just because they want to carry ESPN.

Offline 0.42

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24162 on: March 02, 2013, 01:04:29 PM »
Keep an eye on the cablevision vs. Viacom court case that's going on. If Cablevision gets their way then you could see a la carte channel options open up to potential subscribers and that could have an indirect effect on sports tv contracts and possibly realignment as a result.

no it won't, sorry

k

Advertisers clamor for smaller audiences. If I'm Pepsi nothing would want me want to spend more money than my potential reach being cut by 25%.

Also ESPN is relying heavily on having every cable and satellite provider pay them $2 per subscriber every month. If any percentage of that is lost including any lost advertising money that will be passed along in a very heavy handed way to a la carte subscribers. Sports programming is very unique from the stuff that people like edn doesn't like to watch and pay for because in addition to paying production cost and paying talent sports networks also have to pay rights fees measured in billions. Lifetime doesn't have to pay rights fees for The Client List and Army Wives. TV like everything else is far more economical in bulk. A la carte is bad for the sports consumer. Subscribers are paying a hell of a lot more for Sportscenter than they are for reruns on Nick At Night.

I'm not saying that they're won't be some form of a la carte programming, there are already some of those options on a limited basis. I just don't think it will be widespread enough to effect college conferences. If so it would not only be horrible news for the sports consumer but for most if not all leagues and conferences.

Good to know, thanks.

Offline WildCatzPhreak

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24163 on: March 05, 2013, 04:53:24 PM »


That's pretty f'n awesome.

Can you make the proposed Certificate of Acheivement in the "Dear Kirk & John..." thread?
love too.  need more amazing quotes though.  dax gave me gold.

Need poopy hair guy quote.

Yeah, once this thread fizzles out, the card should be updated with a true "best of" selection of quotes and it could be the picture to a goEMAW blog entry recapping the entire emawgeddon. 
seriously guys, im never going to get the card updated at this rate.

Offline Katpappy

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24164 on: March 06, 2013, 01:02:55 PM »
Kansas State University's College of Engineering announces our Spring 2013 Eyestone Lecture

Dr. G. P. "Bud" Peterson
President, Georgia Institute of Technology
Tuesday, March 26 10:30 am
Fiedler Auditorium

Could this be the beginning of our new friendship with the 11th member of the Big XII?
Hot time in Kat town tonight.

Offline eastcat

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24165 on: March 06, 2013, 02:27:31 PM »
Kansas State University's College of Engineering announces our Spring 2013 Eyestone Lecture

Dr. G. P. "Bud" Peterson
President, Georgia Institute of Technology
Tuesday, March 26 10:30 am
Fiedler Auditorium

Could this be the beginning of our new friendship with the 11th member of the Big XII?

He is a KSU alum.

so... no

Offline Katpappy

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24166 on: March 06, 2013, 07:13:47 PM »
Kansas State University's College of Engineering announces our Spring 2013 Eyestone Lecture

Dr. G. P. "Bud" Peterson
President, Georgia Institute of Technology
Tuesday, March 26 10:30 am
Fiedler Auditorium

Could this be the beginning of our new friendship with the 11th member of the Big XII?

He is a KSU alum.

so... no
Oh Sweet, the Animal and him are going to talk about the great friendship our schools are embarking on.
Hot time in Kat town tonight.

Offline Panjandrum

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24167 on: March 07, 2013, 12:59:34 PM »
I think people are either not discussing or missing the boat as to how important the Fox Sports 1 news is to this whole process/thread.

Fox only has access to Pac-12, Big 12, and C-USA games.  They need 1-2 games per week for Fox between the Big 12/Pac 12, 3-4 games per week between those three conferences for FS1 (which will most likely be all Big 12/Pac-12, a game for FX (presumably), and games for FSN.  To complicate matters, Fox has to give some of these games (at least 3-4 per week) to ESPN.

During the late part of the conference season, in the current state, the Pac-12 and Big 12 have 11 total games to give every week.  ESPN/ABC is going to carve off 3-4 of those games.  So, even if ESPN takes just 3, that leaves 8 games between Network Fox, FS1, FX, and FSN.

There's not enough games to go around if you need 2 for the network, 3-4 for the flagship cable network, 1 for FX, and games to put on the regional networks.  The math doesn't work.

The SEC and ACC are locked in almost exclusive ESPN contracts, so there's not wiggle room there.  The Big Ten only has Tier 1 to give, and considering that Fox has almost controlling interest in the BTN, they aren't going to cut their nose to spite their face.  We are Midwest/West Cost heavy in our conferences; we don't have attractive options for Noon EST games for the early games on FS1.

If you do the math, I think you'll see that Fox is most likely going to incentivise us to move East, regardless of how the ACC thing shakes out.  Unless they can get primary, controlling interest in Big Ten T1 games in about three years (which is going to cost an arm and a leg with ESPN/ABC and NBC overbidding), it means we're their only option to add content in that direction.  That may mean Cincy and UConn, but it's something to keep an eye on.

On a side note, if I'm ESPN, I'm making large concessions to the ACC by telling them they can keep their total payout if they ditch Pitt and Louisville and give them to us.  I think it would solve a numbers problem for nearly everybody, but what do I know?




Offline CyberToothCat

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24168 on: March 07, 2013, 06:02:32 PM »
A couple of thoughts:

My assumption has been that the creation of FS1 (and eventually FS2) will include moving all sporting events away from FX.  All the games that were on FX last year will now be on FS1, along with any other contest FS1 can get.

I don't see Pitt or Lville being interested in leaving (or not joining) the ACC in favor of the Big 12.  Prior to Bowen opening his mouth about not being a wallflower, the rumors were that Pitt was looking into the Big 12.  As we all know, Pitt eventually ended up picking the ACC.  I don't think that would change if Pitt had the option to make the choice again.  And I think Louisville is perfectly happy in the ACC, so I'm not convinced they would choose to reneg on their decision the way TCU did.

I think that the only way the Big 12 expands is if we have the opportunity to add a couple of high profile ACC teams (FSU/Miami, FSU/Clem, or FSU/anyone).  There are some rumors out there about the pair of USF/UCF, but that doesn't strike me as likely.  That would be like the PAC taking Houston and UTEP and claiming that gives them a share of the Texas market.  There have long been message board discussions about Cincy, but the Big 12 obviously has zero interest in them.  UConn is so far away from everyone.  Who else is there?  It really seems to me that we'll expand only if the right schools are available, and the right schools are all in the ACC.  Until and unless the ACC crumbles, I don't see the Big 12 expanding.  With it starting to look more and more likely that Notre Dame will join the ACC this summer, I think the odds of the ACC crumbling continues to dwindle.  Basically, I think the Big 12 is stuck at 10 with the present members.

In about 8-10 years when the GOR is winding down, I think the Big 12 will have some very interesting/stressful times.  Hopefully WVU doesn't prove to be too much of a squeaky wheel and UT/OU continue to be happy.

Offline Panjandrum

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24169 on: March 07, 2013, 08:04:05 PM »
There are some rumors out there about the pair of USF/UCF, but that doesn't strike me as likely.

It's not likely because it's coming from the retards at the WVU Scout site.

And the ACC is living on borrowed time.  Once they start looking at the financials for the Big Ten, Big 12, and SEC in a few years, the ACC teams are going to be rough ridin' pissed.

Offline p1k3

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24170 on: March 07, 2013, 08:11:58 PM »
goEMAW should throw a kegger when this thread hits 1000


THE ROAD TO 1000

Offline MadCat

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24171 on: March 07, 2013, 09:14:29 PM »
goEMAW should throw a kegger when this thread hits 1000


THE ROAD TO 1000
this is about when someone would jack up the posts per page so we would be back at about 229 pages

Offline HerrSonntag

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24172 on: March 07, 2013, 10:01:56 PM »
i think we should pick up nebraska and colorado

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24173 on: March 07, 2013, 10:24:26 PM »
With it starting to look more and more likely that Notre Dame will join the ACC this summer, I think the odds of the ACC crumbling continues to dwindle.
Do you mean as a full member in football?  Where/what are you seeing to come to this conclusion?

Offline Panjandrum

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Re: Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....
« Reply #24174 on: March 08, 2013, 12:10:11 AM »
With it starting to look more and more likely that Notre Dame will join the ACC this summer, I think the odds of the ACC crumbling continues to dwindle.
Do you mean as a full member in football?  Where/what are you seeing to come to this conclusion?

No.  Same agreement for non-football, but they would just join the ACC in 2013 as opposed to 2014 since the Catholic 7 is looking to break away sooner than later.