Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....

[KITNfury]

The only way KSU gets into a four team playoff is if we're undefeated.

[michigancat]

Elite's will get preferential treatment to the KSU's of the world because of their higher preseason rankings earned by prior year performance. It will always be that way no matter what. The solution is to be consistently good for a long time and becoming one of the elites.

[Ira Hayes]

That is bullshit.  The crapassed players we had 2 or 3 years ago should not taint the accomplishments of Collin Klein or Arthur Brown or anybody else we have now.

[Ira Hayes]

That's like telling the Royals: "Hey, great job for winning the AL Central.  If you can win it for a couple more years and prove that you aren't as shitty as you've been for the last 25 years, we may give you a chance to play your way into the World Series."

Maybe.  Unless the Yankees are good.  Then it may be the next year.  Unless the Yankees are good that year.  But eventually, as long as you are good, some day...you will get in. Because it's a playoff.  With the best four teams.  Selected by experts.

[sonofdaxjones]

Man Ira . . . can you share a portal into that fantasy land you live in with us? 

It appears to be fantastic.

[michigancat]

That is bullshit.  The crapassed players we had 2 or 3 years ago should not taint the accomplishments of Collin Klein or Arthur Brown or anybody else we have now.

It really isn't. As long as there are 110+ division 1 teams and 12 game schedules, it's going to happen. Even with a playoff. There simply isn't a good way to differentiate between 1-loss teams with so few interconnected games.

[Ira Hayes]

That is bullshit.  The crapassed players we had 2 or 3 years ago should not taint the accomplishments of Collin Klein or Arthur Brown or anybody else we have now.

It really isn't. As long as there are 110+ division 1 teams and 12 game schedules, it's going to happen. Even with a playoff. There simply isn't a good way to differentiate between 1-loss teams with so few interconnected games.

Oh, but there is a good way.  You take the four best conferences and let their champions play it out.  And then if you want to vote for Boise State, go ahead.

[Ira Hayes]

Man Ira . . . can you share a portal into that fantasy land you live in with us? 

It appears to be fantastic.

It's the fantasy land where teams win titles by winning games and don't have to worry about what "experts" think.

You can get a glimpse of it if you watch high school football...or the NFL...or every single sport other and D-1A college football, gymnastics, boxing, and figure skating.  Maybe you've seen one of those?

[Katpappy]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

[Fuktard]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

[KITNfury]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

He isn't. I'm sure there's plenty here who will try to PI the crap out of him, but they are dipshits. KSU getting into the playoff requires an undefeated season. It's human nature to be biased and big name schools will always get the nod over small name schools if a committee of humans making the decision. It's not small man syndrome, its fact 97.3% of the time.

[mcmwcat]

it's irrelevant

[KITNfury]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

The best summation of the argument I heard was some dude on 810. What he said was basically this (paraphrasing) "why should someone be crowned champion of the whole when they weren't even champion of the part of the whole". He's spot on.

[Katpappy]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

The best summation of the argument I heard was some dude on 810. What he said was basically this (paraphrasing) "why should someone be crowned champion of the whole when they weren't even champion of the part of the whole". He's spot on.

Please why are we arguing about this.  It's so rough ridin' obvious if it were a snake it would have bit you right on the puss.  It's all about money.  Small unknown schools don't stand a chance in hell; look at Utah a few years ago.  They played in the Sugar bowl, should have been playing for the MNC.  The networks won't let a small team play the MNC, due to the amount of money invested.  Plain and simple in my book.

[michigancat]

That is bullshit.  The crapassed players we had 2 or 3 years ago should not taint the accomplishments of Collin Klein or Arthur Brown or anybody else we have now.

It really isn't. As long as there are 110+ division 1 teams and 12 game schedules, it's going to happen. Even with a playoff. There simply isn't a good way to differentiate between 1-loss teams with so few interconnected games.

Oh, but there is a good way.  You take the four best conferences and let their champions play it out.  And then if you want to vote for Boise State, go ahead.

who decides which four conferences are the best?

[wes mantooth]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

The best summation of the argument I heard was some dude on 810. What he said was basically this (paraphrasing) "why should someone be crowned champion of the whole when they weren't even champion of the part of the whole". He's spot on.

Please why are we arguing about this.  It's so rough ridin' obvious if it were a snake it would have bit you right on the puss.  It's all about money.  Small unknown schools don't stand a chance in hell; look at Utah a few years ago.  They played in the Sugar bowl, should have been playing for the MNC.  The networks won't let a small team play the MNC, due to the amount of money invested.  Plain and simple in my book.

Your argument is Utah?   

[Katpappy]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

The best summation of the argument I heard was some dude on 810. What he said was basically this (paraphrasing) "why should someone be crowned champion of the whole when they weren't even champion of the part of the whole". He's spot on.

Please why are we arguing about this.  It's so rough ridin' obvious if it were a snake it would have bit you right on the puss.  It's all about money.  Small unknown schools don't stand a chance in hell; look at Utah a few years ago.  They played in the Sugar bowl, should have been playing for the MNC.  The networks won't let a small team play the MNC, due to the amount of money invested.  Plain and simple in my book.

Your argument is Utah?   

Can you read.

[Ira Hayes]

I don't mind admitting that I am biased.  I am biased toward what is best for Kansas State.  If the top four football conferences were the PAC12, big 10, SEC, and ACC then I would be all over the "best 4 teams" scenario.  It would be our only chance to get in.

But the Big XII is ahead of the ACC.  Them is the facts.  I'm conference champs all the way.

[Ira Hayes]

That is bullshit.  The crapassed players we had 2 or 3 years ago should not taint the accomplishments of Collin Klein or Arthur Brown or anybody else we have now.

It really isn't. As long as there are 110+ division 1 teams and 12 game schedules, it's going to happen. Even with a playoff. There simply isn't a good way to differentiate between 1-loss teams with so few interconnected games.

Oh, but there is a good way.  You take the four best conferences and let their champions play it out.  And then if you want to vote for Boise State, go ahead.

who decides which four conferences are the best?

The commissioners of the conferences that play in the Rose Bowl and the Champions Bowl have decided.

He who brings the most TV sets wins.

[KITNfury]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

The best summation of the argument I heard was some dude on 810. What he said was basically this (paraphrasing) "why should someone be crowned champion of the whole when they weren't even champion of the part of the whole". He's spot on.

Please why are we arguing about this.  It's so rough ridin' obvious if it were a snake it would have bit you right on the puss.  It's all about money.  Small unknown schools don't stand a chance in hell; look at Utah a few years ago.  They played in the Sugar bowl, should have been playing for the MNC.  The networks won't let a small team play the MNC, due to the amount of money invested.  Plain and simple in my book.

I'm not even sure what point you're making, so let me make mine clear. I want a conference champion model because its pretty much a guarantee that the Big 12 will always have a participant under this model. If not, then yes, rough ridin' obviously comes down to money and if there are any big name teams within a earshot BEHIND ksu, then we'll get leap frogged. Take the human element out as much as possible as that below KSU. Can the big 12 get 2 in under a "top 4" model? Yes. Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

[wes mantooth]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

The best summation of the argument I heard was some dude on 810. What he said was basically this (paraphrasing) "why should someone be crowned champion of the whole when they weren't even champion of the part of the whole". He's spot on.

Please why are we arguing about this.  It's so rough ridin' obvious if it were a snake it would have bit you right on the puss.  It's all about money.  Small unknown schools don't stand a chance in hell; look at Utah a few years ago.  They played in the Sugar bowl, should have been playing for the MNC.  The networks won't let a small team play the MNC, due to the amount of money invested.  Plain and simple in my book.

Your argument is Utah?   

Can you read.

 

[Ira Hayes]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

[michigancat]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

[Ira Hayes]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

So, under your system, when will K-State be eligible to win a national title?  Will another 10 win season in 2012 set us up for a chance in 2013?  Or do we need to wait for 2014?

[Katpappy]

Ira is a clown suit salesman, and today they're half off. Everyone is getting one!

Are sure he isn't the one wearing one. 

Not sure why everyone is on Ira's ass...what he is saying is exactly right.  In basketball if you win your conference, you have a chance to win the NC.  What is wrong with that.  If it was only 4 teams voted on by "experts", basically the same 4 teams would play every year, exactly like what will happen in football.  I enjoy watching March madness simply to root for some of the "unknown" conference champions.  On the flip side, I didn't watchmore than a few minutes of LSU_ALA last year.  Why is this so hard to understand?  Or maybe it's just fun to give Ira crap.

The best summation of the argument I heard was some dude on 810. What he said was basically this (paraphrasing) "why should someone be crowned champion of the whole when they weren't even champion of the part of the whole". He's spot on.

Please why are we arguing about this.  It's so rough ridin' obvious if it were a snake it would have bit you right on the puss.  It's all about money.  Small unknown schools don't stand a chance in hell; look at Utah a few years ago.  They played in the Sugar bowl, should have been playing for the MNC.  The networks won't let a small team play the MNC, due to the amount of money invested.  Plain and simple in my book.

I'm not even sure what point you're making, so let me make mine clear. I want a conference champion model because its pretty much a guarantee that the Big 12 will always have a participant under this model. If not, then yes, rough ridin' obviously comes down to money and if there are any big name teams within a earshot BEHIND ksu, then we'll get leap frogged. Take the human element out as much as possible as that below KSU. Can the big 12 get 2 in under a "top 4" model? Yes. Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

I am agreeing with some, including you.  We are not the type of school that would get in without some help.  '98 is a great example.  If we would have won the CC that year and UCLA didn't lose; would we have been picked to play the MNC.  Don't think so. 
I'm also saying we would not make the money the networks want to make in a MNC.  So if another school which is a large well known school is close or tied, they get picked before us.