Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....

[wazucat]

If Texas or Alabama only lose one game it is a "slip up" or a "stumble"

If KSU loses one game we are "exposed"

And the people who assign those labels will be the same people who pick the teams that get to participate in a four team playoff.

The essence , the brevity, the poetry of this quote is beautiful, color me butt hurt if you will but Ira has captured the crux of this railroad job well in advance of its fruition.

[michigancat]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

So, under your system, when will K-State be eligible to win a national title?  Will another 10 win season in 2012 set us up for a chance in 2013?  Or do we need to wait for 2014?

It's not my system, it's reality. Kansas State would be eligible to play for a national title if they went undefeated next year. hth

[Lucas Scoopsalot]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

So, under your system, when will K-State be eligible to win a national title?  Will another 10 win season in 2012 set us up for a chance in 2013?  Or do we need to wait for 2014?

It's not my system, it's reality. Kansas State would be eligible to play for a national title if they went undefeated next year. hth

This is so true. Anyone remember when Bishop about took us to the title game, but slipped up in the conference championship? No national title. Oklahoma slips up in 2003 and they still get to compete for the national title.

It will always be that way. We can't afford slip-ups. Everyone would rather see a 1 or 2 loss Alabama team in the title than a 1 or 2 loss Kansas State.

[michigancat]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

So, under your system, when will K-State be eligible to win a national title?  Will another 10 win season in 2012 set us up for a chance in 2013?  Or do we need to wait for 2014?

It's not my system, it's reality. Kansas State would be eligible to play for a national title if they went undefeated next year. hth

This is so true. Anyone remember when Bishop about took us to the title game, but slipped up in the conference championship? No national title. Oklahoma slips up in 2003 and they still get to compete for the national title.

It will always be that way. We can't afford slip-ups. Everyone would rather see a 1 or 2 loss Alabama team in the title than a 1 or 2 loss Kansas State.

While you are correct that everyone would rather watch Alabama or OU instead of ksu, that's not why they went to the title and we didn't. They played a far tougher schedule and was #1 for the entire season (iirc) because they had been a top 5 team for several years.

[Ira Hayes]

It's about a team winning their conference division.  And then winning their conference championship game.  And then beating the SEC champion in the Champions Bowl.

That team deserves to play for the national title.  I don't care how many times they lost in September.  And I don't care how many dollars or TV viewers the "experts" think they will bring to the national championship game.  That team earned it.  It could be KU.  It could be Iowa State. It could be Notre Dame. I don't care. 

That is what I want.

[Fuktard]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

So, under your system, when will K-State be eligible to win a national title?  Will another 10 win season in 2012 set us up for a chance in 2013?  Or do we need to wait for 2014?

It's not my system, it's reality. Kansas State would be eligible to play for a national title if they went undefeated next year. hth

This is so true. Anyone remember when Bishop about took us to the title game, but slipped up in the conference championship? No national title. Oklahoma slips up in 2003 and they still get to compete for the national title.

It will always be that way. We can't afford slip-ups. Everyone would rather see a 1 or 2 loss Alabama team in the title than a 1 or 2 loss Kansas State.

While you are correct that everyone would rather watch Alabama or OU instead of ksu, that's not why they went to the title and we didn't. They played a far tougher schedule and was #1 for the entire season (iirc) because they had been a top 5 team for several years.

this is such a stupid rough ridin' argument I have to think Rusty has had a stroke.  I don't give a eff what someone has done for the past 10, 20, 30 or 50 years....I want the two BEST teams in any GIVEN year to play for the NC.  If that means it's Iowa State or Oregon State or some other "no name" because they happened to gel as a team that year and then so be it.  Why the eff would it make sense to penalize that team because they haven't been a perennial power? 

[Lucas Scoopsalot]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

So, under your system, when will K-State be eligible to win a national title?  Will another 10 win season in 2012 set us up for a chance in 2013?  Or do we need to wait for 2014?

It's not my system, it's reality. Kansas State would be eligible to play for a national title if they went undefeated next year. hth

This is so true. Anyone remember when Bishop about took us to the title game, but slipped up in the conference championship? No national title. Oklahoma slips up in 2003 and they still get to compete for the national title.

It will always be that way. We can't afford slip-ups. Everyone would rather see a 1 or 2 loss Alabama team in the title than a 1 or 2 loss Kansas State.

While you are correct that everyone would rather watch Alabama or OU instead of ksu, that's not why they went to the title and we didn't. They played a far tougher schedule and was #1 for the entire season (iirc) because they had been a top 5 team for several years.

this is such a stupid rough ridin' argument I have to think Rusty has had a stroke.  I don't give a eff what someone has done for the past 10, 20, 30 or 50 years....I want the two BEST teams in any GIVEN year to play for the NC.  If that means it's Iowa State or Oregon State or some other "no name" because they happened to gel as a team that year and then so be it.  Why the eff would it make sense to penalize that team because they haven't been a perennial power?

Don't we all want it to be that way? The problem is all those effers up there are greedy right? They want their money and if it means keeping a Boise State or some other small school out of the championship, they are going to do it. The BCS is a joke. Thank god there is going to be some sort of playoff system coming soon.

[Dr Rick Daris]

the way it's prob gonna go is great for kstate. we will play a crappy non-con and maybe still could win the big12 with one loss and be one of the four. just look at osu last year if you want proof. no conference champ game is also great. one less game you have to win to be a part. everybody needs to just shut up about this imo. we are in a pretty good place.

[michigancat]

Can KSU ever benefit from this as the 2nd team from12 taken? No. And I could easily see a scenario where KSU gets skipped while winning the conference.

This.

Anything less than undefeated and we're out.

Unless we have several years of sustained success and can start seasons in the top 10. Just like everyone.

So, under your system, when will K-State be eligible to win a national title?  Will another 10 win season in 2012 set us up for a chance in 2013?  Or do we need to wait for 2014?

It's not my system, it's reality. Kansas State would be eligible to play for a national title if they went undefeated next year. hth

This is so true. Anyone remember when Bishop about took us to the title game, but slipped up in the conference championship? No national title. Oklahoma slips up in 2003 and they still get to compete for the national title.

It will always be that way. We can't afford slip-ups. Everyone would rather see a 1 or 2 loss Alabama team in the title than a 1 or 2 loss Kansas State.

While you are correct that everyone would rather watch Alabama or OU instead of ksu, that's not why they went to the title and we didn't. They played a far tougher schedule and was #1 for the entire season (iirc) because they had been a top 5 team for several years.

this is such a stupid rough ridin' argument I have to think Rusty has had a stroke.  I don't give a eff what someone has done for the past 10, 20, 30 or 50 years....I want the two BEST teams in any GIVEN year to play for the NC.  If that means it's Iowa State or Oregon State or some other "no name" because they happened to gel as a team that year and then so be it.  Why the eff would it make sense to penalize that team because they haven't been a perennial power? 

I'm not making an argument, I'm explaining reality. How do you know who the two best teams are?

(note: you can make yourself a perennial power, and I'm not talking about being elite 10+ years ago)

[Ira Hayes]

If conference championships are not a prerequisite to winning a national title, then conferences don't matter. 

That is the heart of the whole freaking argument.

And if conferences don't matter, then Kansas State is mumped.

That is the bottom line.

Period.

Done.

Toast.

Everyone here is smart enough to understand that, right?

[Dr Rick Daris]

If conference championships are not a prerequisite to winning a national title, then conferences don't matter. 

That is the heart of the whole freaking argument.

And if conferences don't matter, then Kansas State is mumped.

That is the bottom line.

Period.

Done.

Toast.

Everyone here is smart enough to understand that, right?

conferences don't have to be a pre req to matter. this is where you are wrong.

[Ira Hayes]

If conference championships are not a prerequisite to winning a national title, then conferences don't matter. 

That is the heart of the whole freaking argument.

And if conferences don't matter, then Kansas State is mumped.

That is the bottom line.

Period.

Done.

Toast.

Everyone here is smart enough to understand that, right?

conferences don't have to be a pre req to matter. this is where you are wrong.

So what do we offer Texas?  Why would they want to be in a conference? 

[michigancat]

I don't even know what Ira's talking about now.

[Ira Hayes]

I don't even know what Ira's talking about now.

Why does Texas want to be in a conference with us? Especially if they don't need to win a conference championship to get into the 4 team playoff? I'm not trying to be clever.

[michigancat]

I don't even know what Ira's talking about now.

Why does Texas want to be in a conference with us? Especially if they don't need to win a conference championship to get into the 4 team playoff? I'm not trying to be clever.

why did they before now?

[SkinnyBenny]

the way it's prob gonna go is great for kstate. we will play a crappy non-con and maybe still could win the big12 with one loss and be one of the four. just look at osu last year if you want proof. no conference champ game is also great. one less game you have to win to be a part. everybody needs to just shut up about this imo. we are in a pretty good place.

No, denied. If there's any possible way in which K-State can get leapfrogged, we will. The only way we get into anything is with iron-clad, unbreakable crap like a 3 best champions + 1 at-large format. Anything else and we will get mumped.

We will get mumped. And it is going to hurt so goddamn bad.

[steve dave]

Ira, have you considered a system that guarantees KState a spot in the NC every year? Seems like that would be better for KState and equally likely.

[wabash909]

That is bullshit.  The crapassed players we had 2 or 3 years ago should not taint the accomplishments of Collin Klein or Arthur Brown or anybody else we have now.

It really isn't. As long as there are 110+ division 1 teams and 12 game schedules, it's going to happen. Even with a playoff. There simply isn't a good way to differentiate between 1-loss teams with so few interconnected games.

Oh, but there is a good way.  You take the four best conferences and let their champions play it out.  And then if you want to vote for Boise State, go ahead.

I agree with Ira.

Take out the human element and let this be settled on the field.

And if a 2003 scenario unfolds and 3 loss K-State team upsets a greatest team in history undefeated OU and wins the Big XII, and makes it into the 4 team playoff for the National Title, so be it.

A selection committee is still going to rely on some sort of BCS type aggregate computer and will be ridiculously scrutinized for preferential treatment.

It also continues to give Notre Dame a seat at the table.

Make the Cnference Championship game a play in, kill off the ACC and make four superconferences and let's get this on.

[steve dave]

 

any proposed system that would allow our garbage 2003 team to qualify for a 4 team playoff is mumped worse than the current BCS.  hey, why don't we allow some terrible 3 loss Wisconsin team in instead of Alabama!  more fair for the little guy! (not the REALLY little guy, medium little like us)

[KITNfury]

any proposed system that would allow our garbage 2003 team qualify for a 4 team playoff is mumped worse than the current BCS

Then you're really whining about how conferences choose their champion, not the system's way of selecting. 

[Trim]

What a weird thing to get fired up about.

[steve dave]

any proposed system that would allow our garbage 2003 team qualify for a 4 team playoff is mumped worse than the current BCS

Then you're really whining about how conferences choose their champion, not the system's way of selecting.

bullshit, I'm telling you that being a conference champion is a stupid way to choose the best teams in the country. 

[KITNfury]

any proposed system that would allow our garbage 2003 team qualify for a 4 team playoff is mumped worse than the current BCS

Then you're really whining about how conferences choose their champion, not the system's way of selecting.

bullshit, I'm telling you that being a conference champion is a stupid way to choose the best teams in the country.

In your scenario, would OU have been in the playoffs in '03?

[AppleJack]

College Football is my favorite sport.  Thank you.

[steve dave]

any proposed system that would allow our garbage 2003 team qualify for a 4 team playoff is mumped worse than the current BCS

Then you're really whining about how conferences choose their champion, not the system's way of selecting.

bullshit, I'm telling you that being a conference champion is a stupid way to choose the best teams in the country.

In your scenario, would OU have been in the playoffs in '03?

Yep, OSU, LSU, USC, Boise would have been my picks.  Would Wisconsin have been in yours this year?  Would Alabama?