Carr Bros.

[everyone shut up]

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

I suppose that may be true if applied universally for even minor offenses, but I think a rape & execution for a rape & execution would not leave the whole world raped & executed. Agreed? So I feel pretty good about some Old Testament justice in this scenario.

I'm more of a New Testament guy myself. You know, "judge not lest ye be judged," "turn the other cheek," "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," "If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink," etc. The stuff that Christianity is based upon . . .

so we should forgive them and let them out of prison?  maybe the lone survivor of their brutal rape/torture/execution style killings should be the one who opens the jail cell.

How did you draw that conclusion?

"turn the other cheek,"
let them out so their next victims can just let them go on back to killing. you know, just take it.

[michigancat]

One perspective I'm surprised the constitutionalists haven't brought up is the idea that giving someone a last meal, strapping them to a table and filling them with drugs that kill them while their friends and family watch is rough ridin' cruel and unusual. I mean, we've got some sick sadistic fucks out there.

[everyone shut up]

in fact, im surprised the police even pursued. our legal system is man made. surely they'll be judged by god one day. society just needs to turn their collective cheeks.

[steve dave]

in fact, im surprised the police even pursued. our legal system is man made. surely they'll be judged by god one day. society just needs to turn their collective cheeks.

you are really kicking the crap out of that strawman

[everyone shut up]

you are really kicking the crap out of that strawman

[Rage Against the McKee]

DNR most of this but I'm against the death penalty solely on the possibility of someone being not guilty. there have been enough instances of people on death row being exonerated that I think the best option is to take it off the table completely.

After watching the wire, I can see why there is always a review of the case. Because sometimes police just need to put someone away, police sometimes coerce confessions from the accused or collaborators, or accused are  just straight up catching a body for the boss.   But this might be a case where putting them in gen pop will do the "justice".

yeah, I'd like to know the general counsel of the NRA's views on the death penalty

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/07/robert-dowlut-nra-murder-mystery

This guy went on a killing spree and seems to have rehabilitated himself nicely.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

I suppose that may be true if applied universally for even minor offenses, but I think a rape & execution for a rape & execution would not leave the whole world raped & executed. Agreed? So I feel pretty good about some Old Testament justice in this scenario.

I'm more of a New Testament guy myself. You know, "judge not lest ye be judged," "turn the other cheek," "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," "If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink," etc. The stuff that Christianity is based upon . . .

Respectfully, I don't think you have a very good understanding of Christianity, which is based on both the Old Testament and New. It is not at all clear, by the way, that Jesus would be opposed to the death penalty. Jesus is purported to have said, several times in the Gospels, that he did not renounce God's laws set forth in the Old Testament. See, for example, this quote from his Sermon on the Mount: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them; For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." Matthew 5:17-18. Indeed, it would be awfully strange for Jesus to renounce God's Law, since Jesus is both the Son of God and God Himself (the whole "Holy Trinity" thing).

Of course, the Old Testament is replete with express endorsement of the death penalty. See:
- Genesis 9:6: "Whoever sheds human blood, by humans shall their blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made mankind."
- Exodus 21:12: "Anyone who strikes a person with a fatal blow is to be put to death."
- Leviticus 24:17: "Anyone who takes the life of a human being is to be put to death."
- Numbers 35:31: "Do not accept a ransom for the life of a murderer, who deserves to die. They are to be put to death."

But back to the New Testament, Jesus isn't the only one who held to the Old Testament laws. There is express endorsement of the death penalty in the New Testament, too. For example, the Apostle Paul said: "For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer." Romans 13:4.

[steve dave]

NOT FUNDAMENTALIST CHRISTIANITY!

I was way out in front of that post 

[Rage Against the McKee]

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

I suppose that may be true if applied universally for even minor offenses, but I think a rape & execution for a rape & execution would not leave the whole world raped & executed. Agreed? So I feel pretty good about some Old Testament justice in this scenario.

I'm more of a New Testament guy myself. You know, "judge not lest ye be judged," "turn the other cheek," "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," "If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink," etc. The stuff that Christianity is based upon . . .

Respectfully, I don't think you have a very good understanding of Christianity, which is based on both the Old Testament and New. It is not at all clear, by the way, that Jesus would be opposed to the death penalty. Jesus is purported to have said, several times in the Gospels, that he did not renounce God's laws set forth in the Old Testament. See, for example, this quote from his Sermon on the Mount: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them; For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." Matthew 5:17-18. Indeed, it would be awfully strange for Jesus to renounce God's Law, since Jesus is both the Son of God and God Himself (the whole "Holy Trinity" thing).

Of course, the Old Testament is replete with express endorsement of the death penalty. See:
- Genesis 9:6: "Whoever sheds human blood, by humans shall their blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made mankind."
- Exodus 21:12: "Anyone who strikes a person with a fatal blow is to be put to death."
- Leviticus 24:17: "Anyone who takes the life of a human being is to be put to death."
- Numbers 35:31: "Do not accept a ransom for the life of a murderer, who deserves to die. They are to be put to death."

But back to the New Testament, Jesus isn't the only one who held to the Old Testament laws. There is express endorsement of the death penalty in the New Testament, too. For example, the Apostle Paul said: "For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer." Romans 13:4.

Why stop there? The Old Testament also says rape victims, adulterers, homosexuals, idolaters, blasphemers, people who work on Sunday, kids who curse or strike their parents, and stubborn sons should be put to death. These are clearly God's laws, right?

[michigancat]

NOT FUNDAMENTALIST CHRISTIANITY!

I was way out in front of that post 

[CNS]

Bible quotes 

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

I suppose that may be true if applied universally for even minor offenses, but I think a rape & execution for a rape & execution would not leave the whole world raped & executed. Agreed? So I feel pretty good about some Old Testament justice in this scenario.

I'm more of a New Testament guy myself. You know, "judge not lest ye be judged," "turn the other cheek," "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," "If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink," etc. The stuff that Christianity is based upon . . .

Respectfully, I don't think you have a very good understanding of Christianity, which is based on both the Old Testament and New. It is not at all clear, by the way, that Jesus would be opposed to the death penalty. Jesus is purported to have said, several times in the Gospels, that he did not renounce God's laws set forth in the Old Testament. See, for example, this quote from his Sermon on the Mount: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them; For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." Matthew 5:17-18. Indeed, it would be awfully strange for Jesus to renounce God's Law, since Jesus is both the Son of God and God Himself (the whole "Holy Trinity" thing).

Of course, the Old Testament is replete with express endorsement of the death penalty. See:
- Genesis 9:6: "Whoever sheds human blood, by humans shall their blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made mankind."
- Exodus 21:12: "Anyone who strikes a person with a fatal blow is to be put to death."
- Leviticus 24:17: "Anyone who takes the life of a human being is to be put to death."
- Numbers 35:31: "Do not accept a ransom for the life of a murderer, who deserves to die. They are to be put to death."

But back to the New Testament, Jesus isn't the only one who held to the Old Testament laws. There is express endorsement of the death penalty in the New Testament, too. For example, the Apostle Paul said: "For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer." Romans 13:4.

Why stop there? The Old Testament also says rape victims, adulterers, homosexuals, idolaters, blasphemers, people who work on Sunday, kids who curse or strike their parents, and stubborn sons should be put to death. These are clearly God's laws, right?

Not sure on all of those, but you can take them up with God. I'm just pointing out that the "I'm against the death penalty 'cause Jesus" is a pretty flimsy argument.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

One perspective I'm surprised the constitutionalists haven't brought up is the idea that giving someone a last meal, strapping them to a table and filling them with drugs that kill them while their friends and family watch is rough ridin' cruel and unusual. I mean, we've got some sick sadistic fucks out there.

I don't think the death penalty is cruel and unusual. Neither does the Supreme Court.

[michigancat]

One perspective I'm surprised the constitutionalists haven't brought up is the idea that giving someone a last meal, strapping them to a table and filling them with drugs that kill them while their friends and family watch is rough ridin' cruel and unusual. I mean, we've got some sick sadistic fucks out there.

I don't think the death penalty is cruel and unusual. Neither does the Supreme Court.

Like I said, lots of sick fucks out there

[Rage Against the McKee]

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

I suppose that may be true if applied universally for even minor offenses, but I think a rape & execution for a rape & execution would not leave the whole world raped & executed. Agreed? So I feel pretty good about some Old Testament justice in this scenario.

I'm more of a New Testament guy myself. You know, "judge not lest ye be judged," "turn the other cheek," "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," "If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink," etc. The stuff that Christianity is based upon . . .

Respectfully, I don't think you have a very good understanding of Christianity, which is based on both the Old Testament and New. It is not at all clear, by the way, that Jesus would be opposed to the death penalty. Jesus is purported to have said, several times in the Gospels, that he did not renounce God's laws set forth in the Old Testament. See, for example, this quote from his Sermon on the Mount: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them; For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." Matthew 5:17-18. Indeed, it would be awfully strange for Jesus to renounce God's Law, since Jesus is both the Son of God and God Himself (the whole "Holy Trinity" thing).

Of course, the Old Testament is replete with express endorsement of the death penalty. See:
- Genesis 9:6: "Whoever sheds human blood, by humans shall their blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made mankind."
- Exodus 21:12: "Anyone who strikes a person with a fatal blow is to be put to death."
- Leviticus 24:17: "Anyone who takes the life of a human being is to be put to death."
- Numbers 35:31: "Do not accept a ransom for the life of a murderer, who deserves to die. They are to be put to death."

But back to the New Testament, Jesus isn't the only one who held to the Old Testament laws. There is express endorsement of the death penalty in the New Testament, too. For example, the Apostle Paul said: "For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer." Romans 13:4.

Why stop there? The Old Testament also says rape victims, adulterers, homosexuals, idolaters, blasphemers, people who work on Sunday, kids who curse or strike their parents, and stubborn sons should be put to death. These are clearly God's laws, right?

Not sure on all of those, but you can take them up with God. I'm just pointing out that the "I'm against the death penalty 'cause Jesus" is a pretty flimsy argument.

So you are a hypocrite, then?

[michigancat]

I'm fine with saying I have better morals than Jesus.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I'm fine with saying I have better morals than Jesus.

Your morals and his seem to be the same. At least in this thread they do.

[steve dave]

I can see rus hanging out with prostitutes and unemployed dudes all day just shooting the breeze and pounding miracle wine

[Cartierfor3]

The arguments ITT are really weak. Basically, as a society we give a governing force the ability to punish criminals. Some of us think that there ought to be restraint on the type of punishment allowed to be put upon those people. I'm of the belief that even the worst of us deserve dignity, and deserve life. Lock them up, sure, but can we do our best to treat them like people? This idea of mob vengeance is not justice, it is revenge.

 

DNR most of this but I'm against the death penalty solely on the possibility of someone being not guilty. there have been enough instances of people on death row being exonerated that I think the best option is to take it off the table completely.

I agree with this. I don't trust judges, lawyers, cops, and jurys enough to let them kill people.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I can see rus hanging out with prostitutes and unemployed dudes all day just shooting the breeze and pounding miracle wine

Sounds a lot more fun than sitting in Church for half a day on Sunday, that's for sure.

[OK_Cat]

Jesus would hang out with the carr bros

[OK_Cat]

Cause they are all black

[OK_Cat]

(Not racist)

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.

I suppose that may be true if applied universally for even minor offenses, but I think a rape & execution for a rape & execution would not leave the whole world raped & executed. Agreed? So I feel pretty good about some Old Testament justice in this scenario.

I'm more of a New Testament guy myself. You know, "judge not lest ye be judged," "turn the other cheek," "let he who is without sin cast the first stone," "If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink," etc. The stuff that Christianity is based upon . . .

Respectfully, I don't think you have a very good understanding of Christianity, which is based on both the Old Testament and New. It is not at all clear, by the way, that Jesus would be opposed to the death penalty. Jesus is purported to have said, several times in the Gospels, that he did not renounce God's laws set forth in the Old Testament. See, for example, this quote from his Sermon on the Mount: "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them; For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished." Matthew 5:17-18. Indeed, it would be awfully strange for Jesus to renounce God's Law, since Jesus is both the Son of God and God Himself (the whole "Holy Trinity" thing).

Of course, the Old Testament is replete with express endorsement of the death penalty. See:
- Genesis 9:6: "Whoever sheds human blood, by humans shall their blood be shed; for in the image of God has God made mankind."
- Exodus 21:12: "Anyone who strikes a person with a fatal blow is to be put to death."
- Leviticus 24:17: "Anyone who takes the life of a human being is to be put to death."
- Numbers 35:31: "Do not accept a ransom for the life of a murderer, who deserves to die. They are to be put to death."

But back to the New Testament, Jesus isn't the only one who held to the Old Testament laws. There is express endorsement of the death penalty in the New Testament, too. For example, the Apostle Paul said: "For the one in authority is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God's servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer." Romans 13:4.

Why stop there? The Old Testament also says rape victims, adulterers, homosexuals, idolaters, blasphemers, people who work on Sunday, kids who curse or strike their parents, and stubborn sons should be put to death. These are clearly God's laws, right?

Not sure on all of those, but you can take them up with God. I'm just pointing out that the "I'm against the death penalty 'cause Jesus" is a pretty flimsy argument.

So you are a hypocrite, then?

I'm sure I probably am in some ways - we probably all are - but I don't think I'm being hypocritical here. I don't base my support for the dealth penalty on the Bible. As I said before, punative justice is a benchmark of civilization regardless of religion, and the death penalty is hardly unique to the Bible.

[Dugout DickStone]

 

I can see rus hanging out with prostitutes and unemployed dudes all day just shooting the breeze and pounding miracle wine

Yeah, by going to Oakland this weekend