Author Topic: 8th  (Read 14819 times)

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Offline Kat Kid

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8th
« on: December 02, 2013, 10:43:13 PM »
1. KU  (0-2)
2. oSu (0-2)

3. ISU  (1-1?)
4. BU  (1-1?)

5-7: 
UT  (1-1?)
OU  (1-1?)
WVU (1-1?)

8. KSU

9. TTU  (1-1?)
10. TCU (2-0)

I have watched all of the teams ahead of us at least once and optimistically I can see 8-10 as an upward bound with 4-14 as a distinct possibility. 

The Elites:

KU
oSu

We are nowhere near the class of the league.  We will get swept by both.  We are a poor shooting team without a standout player.  It is impossible to think of us upsetting either of them unless the OOD (non #, pre-fOOD John Currie appropriation) wills the team to victory which is also impossible to imagine at this point in time.

The Tourney locks:
BU
ISU

It disgusts me to put ISU here, but there they are.  They have basically taken our spot.  They hired a solid coach.  They recruit in to an exciting system of offensive basketball.  Hilton Magic is an actual thing again.  Ugh.  Brutal.

As for Baylor, I am expecting them to beat UK and lock down an NCAA bid with the rest of their solid non-con showing and their 12-14 wins in the big 12.

Searching for ID:
UT
OU
WVU

None of these teams is all that good.  Any bubble teams?  Maybe.  But from what I've seen, these teams are better than K-State.  Which makes this extra depressing.

I'm already wary of OU, but they do not have much competition remaining in their non-con so it will be a bit tough to tell.  WVU v. MU will be a very good indicator of where we are headed.  I just watched MU look disinterested in Vegas and beat two bad majors with relative ease.  They are athletic and they have a few scorers in Clarkson, Ross and Brown.  The freshman Williams III is tough too.  If WVU can play with or beat MU (a top 3-4 SEC and tourney team) then KSU is in big troubs.  UT just beat Vandy looking slightly better than worthless.

The doormats:
TT
TCU

These teams suck.

Which group does K-State have more in common with?  The teams searching for an ID or the doormats?  That answer will remain to be seen, but the debate is certainly sobering here in Titletown, USA.


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Offline 0.42

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Re: 8th
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2013, 10:57:52 PM »
"They have basically taken our spot," they said.

Offline BostonPancake

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Re: 8th
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2013, 11:06:47 PM »
crap.  We're going to have to play on a Wednesday in the b12 tornament.  A rough ridin' Wednesday!

  :frown:

Offline pissclams

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Re: 8th
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2013, 07:27:18 AM »
hoiberg is a stud.  took a chance on questionable transfers (like frank) and lets them play a fun style of basketball.  coaching basketball doesn't have to be hard, i'm not sure why so many coaches make it that way.

my prediction for the q'@'s is 8th or 9th.

t-2) KU
t-2) OSU
3) ISU
4) BU
5) OU
6) UT
7) WVU
8) TCU
9) q'@'s
10) TT

pathetic. 


Cheesy Mustache QB might make an appearance.

New warning: Don't get in a fight with someone who doesn't even need to bother to buy ink.

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: 8th
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2013, 08:20:30 AM »
This sounds reasonable based on what I've seen. Last year's keys were 3PT shooting, Oboarding, and TO differential. This year's team doesn't look like it can shoot and turns it over on 1/5 of our possessions and boarding is a big question mark, so yeah.

Offline TownieCat

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Re: 8th
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2013, 08:29:43 AM »
I'm going to wait until after the Ole Miss game to make a decision. They're a bubble team. A win vs them ( :pray:) would change a lot of fans' attitude about the team.

Having Gip back into form the last couple of games has made a big difference too. There was no inside presence on offense the first handful of games. Despite rumors on this board, I do think he got KTFO during practice and had to sit out for about two weeks...

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: 8th
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2013, 09:57:40 AM »
Likely to break:
Streak of 7 years of winning conference record.
Streak of 7 years with a win over top 25 opponent.

Possibilities:
10 years without an overall losing record.
Million year home winning record streak.

Offline CNS

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Re: 8th
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2013, 10:21:40 AM »
What is the reasonable threshold here? 

Success immediately followed by near immediate extreme swing to failure.  How many chances does someone get with such a swing?

You could say that any coach could be caught in a situation where all the talent is there day one but in such a state that it is gone immediately and so quickly that the coach hasn't had a chance to prepare for that through recruiting. 

Is it not fair to say that a good coach wouldn't be caught in such a situation?  Is it not fair to say that a good coach would limit the depth of the fall off?  Is it fair to say that an average/mediocre coach would not only experience the fall, but have a very hard time climbing back out? 


Offline scottwildcat

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Re: 8th
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2013, 10:23:56 AM »
Likely to break:
Streak of 7 years of winning conference record.
Streak of 7 years with a win over top 25 opponent.

Possibilities:
10 years without an overall losing record.
Million year home winning record streak.

these make me sad  :frown:

Offline CNS

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Re: 8th
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2013, 10:24:45 AM »
Likely to break:
Streak of 7 years of winning conference record.
Streak of 7 years with a win over top 25 opponent.

Possibilities:
10 years without an overall losing record.
Million year home winning record streak.

these make me sad  :frown:

Should make you mad.

Offline michigancat

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Re: 8th
« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2013, 10:24:58 AM »
hoiberg is a stud.  took a chance on questionable transfers (like frank) and lets them play a fun style of basketball.  coaching basketball doesn't have to be hard, i'm not sure why so many coaches make it that way.

yep

Offline scottwildcat

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Re: 8th
« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2013, 10:25:12 AM »
Likely to break:
Streak of 7 years of winning conference record.
Streak of 7 years with a win over top 25 opponent.

Possibilities:
10 years without an overall losing record.
Million year home winning record streak.

these make me sad  :frown:

Should make you mad.

these make me mad  :curse:

Offline Skipper44

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Re: 8th
« Reply #12 on: December 03, 2013, 10:40:44 AM »
Haven't seen UT but it looks like their young bigs are playing pretty well - prolly an 0-2 just that match up alone. 

Offline CNS

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Re: 8th
« Reply #13 on: December 03, 2013, 10:46:13 AM »
If Jevon is absolutely amazing, we could win 8 games.  If he is the normal frosh who is skilled but slightly out of control, a little sloppy with the ball, not up to strength on defense, or if his natural tempo is drastically different than what our current team plays, then we could easily be a 4-6 win conf team.  Easily. 

Offline Mr Bread

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Re: 8th
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2013, 10:48:48 AM »
Haven't seen UT but it looks like their young bigs are playing pretty well - prolly an 0-2 just that match up alone.

oscar won't lose to them at home.  No way, no how is my predicto on that.  They aren't that talented and they are very young and also likely mentally weak on account of young and Barnes.  Definitely not salty enough to win one at the BrAM.  Also the qatz will have JT and Texas' guards aren't very good. 
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 10:53:57 AM by Mr Bread »
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Offline Mr Bread

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Re: 8th
« Reply #15 on: December 03, 2013, 10:53:36 AM »
If Jevon is absolutely amazing, we could win 8 games.  If he is the normal frosh who is skilled but slightly out of control, a little sloppy with the ball, not up to strength on defense, or if his natural tempo is drastically different than what our current team plays, then we could easily be a 4-6 win conf team.  Easily.

My gut says he is better than Nigel in every way except three-point shooting.  Faster, stronger, better dribbler, better disher and better driver.  So you basically swap them out and bump up JT's minutes with everybody else staying healthy and I say it's 8-10 to 9-9 lock.  This is all gut here.  I don't know it, I just feel it.  oscar will pull some upsets.  He always does, even in his worst years.  He's already cashed in some of his standard head scratching stinkers.  These things follow a pattern. 

It would be different if I thought he was losing this team, but I don't.  Again just feelings. 
My prescience is fully engorged.  It throbs with righteous accuracy.  I am sated.

Offline Kat Kid

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Re: 8th
« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2013, 11:04:00 AM »
If Jevon is absolutely amazing, we could win 8 games.  If he is the normal frosh who is skilled but slightly out of control, a little sloppy with the ball, not up to strength on defense, or if his natural tempo is drastically different than what our current team plays, then we could easily be a 4-6 win conf team.  Easily.

My gut says he is better than Nigel in every way except three-point shooting.  Faster, stronger, better dribbler, better disher and better driver.  So you basically swap them out and bump up JT's minutes with everybody else staying healthy and I say it's 8-10 to 9-9 lock.  This is all gut here.  I don't know it, I just feel it.  oscar will pull some upsets.  He always does, even in his worst years.  He's already cashed in some of his standard head scratching stinkers.  These things follow a pattern. 

It would be different if I thought he was losing this team, but I don't.  Again just feelings.

I don't know how we rebound or score enough points to have it make a difference.  Unless Shane turns in to Rodney McGruder we are screwed because our bigs our undersized and underskilled and our swings and guards are not good at distribution (besides Shane) or shooting (besides Shane and Foster).

I mean it is possible that Foster and Jevon somehow just relentlessly drive to the rim and will us to a victory, but that seems unlikely.

Offline michigancat

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Re: 8th
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2013, 11:08:16 AM »
Foster would have been an absolutely dreamy Frank Martin player.

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: 8th
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2013, 11:19:49 AM »
My gut says he is better than Nigel in every way except three-point shooting.  Faster, stronger, better dribbler, better disher and better driver.  So you basically swap them out and bump up JT's minutes with everybody else staying healthy and I say it's 8-10 to 9-9 lock.  This is all gut here.  I don't know it, I just feel it.  oscar will pull some upsets.  He always does, even in his worst years.  He's already cashed in some of his standard head scratching stinkers.  These things follow a pattern. 

It would be different if I thought he was losing this team, but I don't.  Again just feelings. 

Mr. Bread, this is my feel too. oscar is a good enough coach to wins some games we shouldn't, especially when some 3s fall. But he's bad enough to lose to Northern Colorado, etc. too.

Offline 8manpick

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Re: 8th
« Reply #19 on: December 03, 2013, 11:30:22 AM »
Quote from: The one and only ksu_FENCE
oscar is a good enough coach and a bad enough one
:adios:

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: 8th
« Reply #20 on: December 03, 2013, 11:45:46 AM »
Quote from: The one and only ksu_FENCE
oscar is a good enough coach and a bad enough one

 :eye:

Offline Skipper44

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Re: 8th
« Reply #21 on: December 03, 2013, 11:46:15 AM »
If Jevon is absolutely amazing, we could win 8 games.  If he is the normal frosh who is skilled but slightly out of control, a little sloppy with the ball, not up to strength on defense, or if his natural tempo is drastically different than what our current team plays, then we could easily be a 4-6 win conf team.  Easily.

My gut says he is better than Nigel in every way except three-point shooting.  Faster, stronger, better dribbler, better disher and better driver.  So you basically swap them out and bump up JT's minutes with everybody else staying healthy and I say it's 8-10 to 9-9 lock.  This is all gut here.  I don't know it, I just feel it.  oscar will pull some upsets.  He always does, even in his worst years.  He's already cashed in some of his standard head scratching stinkers.  These things follow a pattern. 

It would be different if I thought he was losing this team, but I don't.  Again just feelings.
I think the potential to lose this team is pretty high.  The early conference schedule is very tough
01/04/14    vs. Oklahoma State TV    Bramlage Coliseum    3:00 PM CT
01/07/14    at TCU TV    Fort Worth, Texas    7:00 PM CT
01/11/14    at Kansas TV    Lawrence, Kan.    1:00 PM CT
01/14/14    vs. Oklahoma TV    Bramlage Coliseum    6:00 PM CT
01/18/14    vs. West Virginia TV    Bramlage Coliseum    12:30 PM CT
01/21/14    at Texas TV    Austin, Texas    6:00 PM CT
01/25/14    at Iowa State TV    Ames, Iowa    12:30 PM CT
2-5 is close to best case and TCU's resume is almost identical to ours -  if oscar doesn't win in Ft. Worth that OU home game is nothing but tucks there to see Lonnie.

Offline Mr Bread

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Re: 8th
« Reply #22 on: December 03, 2013, 11:48:33 AM »
If Jevon is absolutely amazing, we could win 8 games.  If he is the normal frosh who is skilled but slightly out of control, a little sloppy with the ball, not up to strength on defense, or if his natural tempo is drastically different than what our current team plays, then we could easily be a 4-6 win conf team.  Easily.

My gut says he is better than Nigel in every way except three-point shooting.  Faster, stronger, better dribbler, better disher and better driver.  So you basically swap them out and bump up JT's minutes with everybody else staying healthy and I say it's 8-10 to 9-9 lock.  This is all gut here.  I don't know it, I just feel it.  oscar will pull some upsets.  He always does, even in his worst years.  He's already cashed in some of his standard head scratching stinkers.  These things follow a pattern. 

It would be different if I thought he was losing this team, but I don't.  Again just feelings.

I don't know how we rebound or score enough points to have it make a difference.  Unless Shane turns in to Rodney McGruder we are screwed because our bigs our undersized and underskilled and our swings and guards are not good at distribution (besides Shane) or shooting (besides Shane and Foster).

I mean it is possible that Foster and Jevon somehow just relentlessly drive to the rim and will us to a victory, but that seems unlikely.

Good rebounding isn't really a necessary ingredient for oscar teams to win, at least it was never my perception that it was.  He has been good at getting his guards and wings to crash the boards to make up for less than stellar post rebounding.  It would be my expectation that's what he'll do again. 

Scoring will be an issue.  My guess is they'll slow the pace way down come conference play and hope to limit scoring oppies for the other side and try to win ugly. 

I think this team will improve on defense.  If they get to 8 or 9 wins, it'll be because they get after it defensively, they rebound just enough to get by as a group and they force other teams to play slow and ugly.  A real grind, scrappy as all get out.  The outside shooting will also pick up.  They'll get over 30% which will make a significant difference. 

I don't expect it'll be fun for anyone to watch.  I get the feeling oscar and co. are succeeding at getting this team to buy into having a chip on its shoulder.  Whether he can maintain that if they get their dicks kicked off in the coming weeks is the key between 8 or 9 wins in conference vs. a complete cum bath.  If he loses the upperclassmen by getting humiliated again a la Georgetown in the noncon then he's mumped. 

The real difference at this point is that he's got a guy or guys on his staff that are actually tough.  Chester walked the walk when he played.  That may be the difference.  Jay rough ridin' Price wasn't firing anybody up. 
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 12:00:16 PM by Mr Bread »
My prescience is fully engorged.  It throbs with righteous accuracy.  I am sated.

Offline kso_FAN

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Re: 8th
« Reply #23 on: December 03, 2013, 11:50:45 AM »
Good rebounding isn't really a necessary ingredient for oscar teams to win, at least it was never my perception that it was.  He has been good at getting his guards and wings to crash the boards to make up for less than stellar post rebounding.  It would be my expectation that's what he'll do again. 

Scoring will be an issue.  My guess is they'll slow the pace way down come conference play and hope to limit scoring oppies for the other side and try to win ugly. 

I think this team will improve on defense.  If they get to 8 or 9 wins, it'll be because they get after it defensively, they rebound just enough to get by as a group and they force other teams to play slow and ugly.  A real grind, scrappy as all get out.  The outside shooting will also pick up.  They'll get over 30% which will make a significant difference. 

I don't expect it'll be fun for anyone to watch.  I get the feeling oscar and co. are succeeding at getting this team to buy into having a chip on its shoulder.  Wheter he can maintain that if they get their dicks kicked off in the coming weeks is the key between 8 or 9 wins in conference vs. a complete cum bath.  If he loses the upperclassmen by getting humiliated again a la Georgetown in the noncon then he's mumped. 

The real difference at this point is that he's got a guy or guys on his staff that are actually tough.  Chester walked the walk when he played.  That may be the difference.  Jay rough ridin' Price wasn't firing anybody up. 

Mr. Bread, I really enjoy your presence on this board.

I'm going to have to fire up some more Big 10/Breads ADV stats charts for you this year.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2013, 12:02:26 PM by ksu_FENCE »

Offline Mr Bread

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Re: 8th
« Reply #24 on: December 03, 2013, 11:58:02 AM »
If Jevon is absolutely amazing, we could win 8 games.  If he is the normal frosh who is skilled but slightly out of control, a little sloppy with the ball, not up to strength on defense, or if his natural tempo is drastically different than what our current team plays, then we could easily be a 4-6 win conf team.  Easily.

My gut says he is better than Nigel in every way except three-point shooting.  Faster, stronger, better dribbler, better disher and better driver.  So you basically swap them out and bump up JT's minutes with everybody else staying healthy and I say it's 8-10 to 9-9 lock.  This is all gut here.  I don't know it, I just feel it.  oscar will pull some upsets.  He always does, even in his worst years.  He's already cashed in some of his standard head scratching stinkers.  These things follow a pattern. 

It would be different if I thought he was losing this team, but I don't.  Again just feelings.
I think the potential to lose this team is pretty high.  The early conference schedule is very tough
01/04/14    vs. Oklahoma State TV    Bramlage Coliseum    3:00 PM CT
01/07/14    at TCU TV    Fort Worth, Texas    7:00 PM CT
01/11/14    at Kansas TV    Lawrence, Kan.    1:00 PM CT
01/14/14    vs. Oklahoma TV    Bramlage Coliseum    6:00 PM CT
01/18/14    vs. West Virginia TV    Bramlage Coliseum    12:30 PM CT
01/21/14    at Texas TV    Austin, Texas    6:00 PM CT
01/25/14    at Iowa State TV    Ames, Iowa    12:30 PM CT
2-5 is close to best case and TCU's resume is almost identical to ours -  if oscar doesn't win in Ft. Worth that OU home game is nothing but tucks there to see Lonnie.

Yes, but whether or not this stretch breaks them is also directly related to how they finish the noncon.  If they say went 2-1 in sys' matchups then the staff could keep it together by selling them on just weathering that initial storm and making it up later.  More us vs. them stuff.  The schedule mumped us, everybody's against us, rah rah.  Hell even if they go 1-2 or 0-3, but they're all very close he could still keep it together.  If they lose all three and they aren't close, I don't see anyway oscar can keep it together this year.  Even if that comes to pass he'll beat KU or OSU.  He always does crap like that.  A bone for the tucks to gnaw on.  Just when you think you've got him, then you don't.  It's complicated. 
My prescience is fully engorged.  It throbs with righteous accuracy.  I am sated.