Another One For Our Guy Daniel

[CNS]

This whole episode has me thinking that not even Freeman would have been able to stand in Bill's war path.

Do you guys remember how Carson Coffman started over Klein that one year? 

[#LIFE]

Lot of gingers from Iowa being outed in this thread

[ShocksNPlow216]

I remember being frustrated as eff by young Beasley's and Roberson's.  Sams was easily better than both as a young player.  Sams was, at one point, on a trajectory to be the best QB this university has ever seen.

GMAFB with this nonsense.  He couldn't even win the position outright.  Just like he didn't in high school.

Neither did Beasley or Ell as sophs. And I'll take losing out to Waters over sharing snaps with Helm and Dunn. "Best ever" potential may be hyperbolic, but not that far-fetched when looking at most soph KSU qbs.

[michigancat]

My meltdown happened a long ass time ago. Like, during the season when Sams never got to play.

[XocolateThundarr]

[Rage Against the McKee]

This whole episode has me thinking that not even Freeman would have been able to stand in Bill's war path.

Do you guys remember how Carson Coffman started over Klein that one year?

Coffman would have been the starter again in 2011 if he had any eligibility left. Klein couldn't throw.

[Skipper44]

I said this before last season at the beginning of the Sams/Waters debate that I was afraid that Dimel and Miller were going to take us back to the early 90's pass first system that worked when the league was full of teams recruiting to stop NU, OU and CU option football and our DITR QBs and WRs could exploit at that time.  Of course, now the league is full of teams recruiting to stop the spread offenses and we had great success as the only power running team but with Sams leaving that advantage appears to be gone. 

The Delton commitment does give me hope this will be only a one year move away from the dual threat system that is really has a chance at great success due the the incredible talent of Lockett and I will be surprised if we don't have a cold hard glimpse of the future when Lockett misses a conference game like he has each of his first 3 seasons.

[0.42]

My meltdown happened a long ass time ago. Like, during the season when Sams never got to play.

I'm convinced the "never question Snyder" people took a nap through the Texas game.

[michigancat]

I said this before last season at the beginning of the Sams/Waters debate that I was afraid that Dimel and Miller were going to take us back to the early 90's pass first system that worked when the league was full of teams recruiting to stop NU, OU and CU option football and our DITR QBs and WRs could exploit at that time.  Of course, now the league is full of teams recruiting to stop the spread offenses and we had great success as the only power running team but with Sams leaving that advantage appears to be gone. 

The Delton commitment does give me hope this will be only a one year move away from the dual threat system that is really has a chance at great success due the the incredible talent of Lockett and I will be surprised if we don't have a cold hard glimpse of the future when Lockett misses a conference game like he has each of his first 3 seasons.

oh they will try to use jake as a "dual threat" I guaranfuckingtee it.

[ydarg2012]

It all depends. 

Saying Sams was lazy and didn't put in much effort is pretty dumb.  If nothing else, a good coach should find a way to take a kid that has more effort to give and yet is still really good and motivate/manipulate him into additional effort. 

A great coach would have taken prime talent and made it work, especially if the kid was constantly wanting it to work.

Prime talent? The kid runs a 4.6 and has awkward strides. He's fun and passionate but we're not losing a JFF type impact player. I love daniel for what he is but why is it so hard for you guys to grasp that he just didn't put forth the effort to get the nod over another quality player that happens to work a bit harder. If two players have similar skill levels but one busts his butt and the other doesn't rise to that effort level, the guy who works harder will get the nod.

I remember seeing a QB subbed in at such a rate that there was rarely an opportunity for any flow to be gained, yet he scored TD's on something like 50% of his carries early on and ran completely bananas over many defenses.    Same QB would be put in, gain good drives, then mysteriously be subbed out for a 3 and out superstar never to see the field again in games.

I don't know what his 40 time is or what Jake's is.  I just know that most of last year was extra frustrating and basically everyone except the blind Bill followers saw it.

I'll never feel comfortable with the two quarterback thing.  So I agree that it was frustrating.  What people seem to be ignoring was Sams interceptions. Are you postulating that had he had more playing time the costly interceptions would have gone away? That defenses wouldn't have capitalized on his preference to use his legs and not his arm?

yeah, it's hard to believe that a guy with that much talent would improve given more playing time.  super easy to come into a game when the "starting" qb has already put us at a disadvantage and your only hope is to chunk some long bombs in hope for a miracle.  rough ridin' dumbass.

I seem to recall Sams being brought into games where he couldn't run at all.  And I don't remember them bringing Sams in when we needed to pass.

[kostakio]

I remember being frustrated as eff by young Beasley's and Roberson's.  Sams was easily better than both as a young player.  Sams was, at one point, on a trajectory to be the best QB this university has ever seen.

GMAFB with this nonsense.  He couldn't even win the position outright.  Just like he didn't in high school.

El didn't win the position outright until several games into his redshirt junior season and his competition wasn't as good as Jake Waters.  Beasley didn't have much competition to beat out and was still pulled and replaced with a walk on in several games during his junior season. 

If you compare Sams as a sophomore to the other sophomore Snyder Qb's we've had he was the best we've seen and there is no debating that. 

[kso_FAN]

My meltdown happened a long ass time ago. Like, during the season when Sams never got to play.

I'm convinced the "never question Snyder" people took a nap through the Texas game.

That might be true, but I still contend 2 things that influenced last season greatly came from that game.

 a) The Texas game built the case (for the coaches) to play Waters more (not less) because it proved his connection with Lockett. I put together a blog post breaking down the diverse combination of things we did in the passing game that day that helped lead to Lockett's huge day. I think (largely) the decision to go with Waters was made after that game, but Lockett's injury changed what would happen the next several weeks.

b) As a result, Lockett's injury led to Sams playing more (not less) against OSU and BU because that connection (and Waters' strength in this offense) was lost. I don't believe the coaches ever thought Sams could run the same package or have quite the same connection with Lockett in the passing game that Waters did (and the playcalling run/pass percentages confirm that). Again, Snyder and his staff have always shown they'll do what's necessary to win, and running Sams a bunch vs OSU and BU was our only shot. However, I don't think the coaches thought that plan was sustainable for an entire season and that led to going back to Waters more and more once Lockett got healthy again.

[Ghost of Stan Parrish]

Huh.  This doesn't improve our team, but I don't get that Snyder is a big 'ol racist, as many are implying/saying here.

[michigancat]

b) As a result, Lockett's injury led to Sams playing more (not less) against OSU and BU because that connection (and Waters' strength in this offense) was lost. I don't believe the coaches ever thought Sams could run the same package or have quite the same connection with Lockett in the passing game that Waters did (and the playcalling run/pass percentages confirm that). Again, Snyder and his staff have always shown they'll do what's necessary to win, and running Sams a bunch vs OSU and BU was our only shot. However, I don't think the coaches thought that plan was sustainable for an entire season and that led to going back to Waters more and more once Lockett got healthy again.

How many passes to Lockett was Sams allowed to attempt all season?

[michigancat]

Huh.  This doesn't improve our team, but I don't get that Snyder is a big 'ol racist, as many of you are implying/saying here.

People are implying the "Sams was lazy" crowd is racist.

[EllRobersonisInnocent]

Jeff Schwinn rough ridin' LIVED in Vanier but everyone knew we were better w/ Ell.

[Rage Against the McKee]

b) As a result, Lockett's injury led to Sams playing more (not less) against OSU and BU because that connection (and Waters' strength in this offense) was lost. I don't believe the coaches ever thought Sams could run the same package or have quite the same connection with Lockett in the passing game that Waters did (and the playcalling run/pass percentages confirm that). Again, Snyder and his staff have always shown they'll do what's necessary to win, and running Sams a bunch vs OSU and BU was our only shot. However, I don't think the coaches thought that plan was sustainable for an entire season and that led to going back to Waters more and more once Lockett got healthy again.

How many passes to Lockett was Sams allowed to attempt all season?

He threw that bomb in the bowl game.

[Emo EMAW]

No one is saying Snyder is a racist.  They are saying he's at least partly to blame, maybe out of stupidity or stubbornness or some other factor that is certainly not racism.

[ydarg2012]

b) As a result, Lockett's injury led to Sams playing more (not less) against OSU and BU because that connection (and Waters' strength in this offense) was lost. I don't believe the coaches ever thought Sams could run the same package or have quite the same connection with Lockett in the passing game that Waters did (and the playcalling run/pass percentages confirm that). Again, Snyder and his staff have always shown they'll do what's necessary to win, and running Sams a bunch vs OSU and BU was our only shot. However, I don't think the coaches thought that plan was sustainable for an entire season and that led to going back to Waters more and more once Lockett got healthy again.

How many passes to Lockett was Sams allowed to attempt all season?

Every time he passed and Lockett was on the field? 

[asava]

Jeff Schwinn rough ridin' LIVED in Vanier but everyone knew we were better w/ Ell.

very good point, imo.

[ydarg2012]

My meltdown happened a long ass time ago. Like, during the season when Sams never got to play.

I'm convinced the "never question Snyder" people took a nap through the Texas game.

That might be true, but I still contend 2 things that influenced last season greatly came from that game.

 a) The Texas game built the case (for the coaches) to play Waters more (not less) because it proved his connection with Lockett. I put together a blog post breaking down the diverse combination of things we did in the passing game that day that helped lead to Lockett's huge day. I think (largely) the decision to go with Waters was made after that game, but Lockett's injury changed what would happen the next several weeks.

b) As a result, Lockett's injury led to Sams playing more (not less) against OSU and BU because that connection (and Waters' strength in this offense) was lost. I don't believe the coaches ever thought Sams could run the same package or have quite the same connection with Lockett in the passing game that Waters did (and the playcalling run/pass percentages confirm that). Again, Snyder and his staff have always shown they'll do what's necessary to win, and running Sams a bunch vs OSU and BU was our only shot. However, I don't think the coaches thought that plan was sustainable for an entire season and that led to going back to Waters more and more once Lockett got healthy again.

100% This. ^

[kostakio]

My meltdown happened a long ass time ago. Like, during the season when Sams never got to play.

I'm convinced the "never question Snyder" people took a nap through the Texas game.

That might be true, but I still contend 2 things that influenced last season greatly came from that game.

 a) The Texas game built the case (for the coaches) to play Waters more (not less) because it proved his connection with Lockett. I put together a blog post breaking down the diverse combination of things we did in the passing game that day that helped lead to Lockett's huge day. I think (largely) the decision to go with Waters was made after that game, but Lockett's injury changed what would happen the next several weeks.

b) As a result, Lockett's injury led to Sams playing more (not less) against OSU and BU because that connection (and Waters' strength in this offense) was lost. I don't believe the coaches ever thought Sams could run the same package or have quite the same connection with Lockett in the passing game that Waters did (and the playcalling run/pass percentages confirm that). Again, Snyder and his staff have always shown they'll do what's necessary to win, and running Sams a bunch vs OSU and BU was our only shot. However, I don't think the coaches thought that plan was sustainable for an entire season and that led to going back to Waters more and more once Lockett got healthy again.

I think you're right about this and I remember you pointing out the promise of the Waters to Lockett connection after the Texas game.  Some on here may see this as an insult but I think your mind more closely resembles the coaches' minds than anybody else on this board or anyone on any KSU message board I've seen.   

So I think this is pretty much it in a nutshell.  Snyder tends to look at each year and figure out what his best offensive threat is.  Once he identifies that he builds everything to take advantage of that threat.   He probably does this because we are K-State and don't normally have an abundance of offensive playmakers.  A few years ago it was Daniel Thomas, after that it was Klein and his QB run game.  With this team our advantage was and is Lockett and Waters does the best job of allowing us to exploit that advantage.   

[michigancat]

b) As a result, Lockett's injury led to Sams playing more (not less) against OSU and BU because that connection (and Waters' strength in this offense) was lost. I don't believe the coaches ever thought Sams could run the same package or have quite the same connection with Lockett in the passing game that Waters did (and the playcalling run/pass percentages confirm that). Again, Snyder and his staff have always shown they'll do what's necessary to win, and running Sams a bunch vs OSU and BU was our only shot. However, I don't think the coaches thought that plan was sustainable for an entire season and that led to going back to Waters more and more once Lockett got healthy again.

How many passes to Lockett was Sams allowed to attempt all season?

Every time he passed and Lockett was on the field? 

How many was that? I know Sams had a TD pass to Lockett against WV (which obviously was not indicative of a mystical "connection" that Jake and Tyler shared), but 28 of his 53 attempts were against OSU and Baylor, obviously without Lockett.

[GoodForAnother]

the thing that really annoys me is that we're the only successful bcs school that loses talented players to transfers for stupid reasons.  I mean that never happens anywhere else.  stupid coaching staff!

[Ghost of Stan Parrish]

How many passes to Lockett was Sams allowed to attempt all season?

Every time he passed and Lockett was on the field? 

How many was that? I know Sams had a TD pass to Lockett against WV (which obviously was not indicative of a mystical "connection" that Jake and Tyler shared), but 28 of his 53 attempts were against OSU and Baylor, obviously without Lockett.

Michigan, dropped TD pass.  Woof.