Author Topic: Hiring Process Discussion with CC  (Read 111720 times)

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Offline 8manpick

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #275 on: April 03, 2012, 01:09:56 PM »
The message boad switched out s h i t with hullabaloo.  Now that is some funny s h i t.

Turn off your filter rough rider.
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Offline AzCat

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #276 on: April 03, 2012, 01:25:03 PM »
I've said it before and I'll both repeat and expand on it here: Currie has done a fanstastic job on the fundraising & facilities side.  In those respects he's almost certainly been the most successful AD in KSU history.  We get that. We know that the AD's primary functions are to make it rain & to build lasting facilities and that everything else he does should, ideally, be designed to serve those ends.  He deserves an enormous amount of credit for the west side stadium upgrade and for the basketball practice facility.  It's impossible to overstate the magnitude of those achievements, particularly as viewed in the context of the history of KSU Athletics. 

These should have been heady times in the KSU Athletic Department.  The most successful rainmaker in the department's history at the helm, a legend defying the odds in the primary revenue sport by recreating success the smart money said could not be duplicated in an improbable second act and a legend in the making behind the LMD of the other primary revenue sport.  One of these folks is clearly the best KSU has ever had at his position and the other two arguably are as well, at least by some measures. 

Currie holding Jamar out of the Syracuse game is a big deal for KSU in that the perception of that event from the outside looking in is that of an overeager and hyper-anal young AD picking a fight with a coach he disliked at the expense of both the men's basketball program and a senior player looking forward to playing the biggest game of his career.  The damning perception in the media seems to have been that Jamar probably didn't do anything wrong, that's an ENORMOUS problem for KSU that Currie has exacerbated by being a weasel and modifying his story post hoc. 

But suppose Jamar was clearly in the wrong and he played against Syracuse, what's the REASONABLE worst case outcome?  A slap on the wrist & forfeiture of that game and others he might have participated in going forward had KSU won?  Big deal.  It's very difficult from a fan's perspective to view this as anything other than John Currie protecting John Currie's resume at the expense of Jamar Samuels, the KSU men's basketball program and Kansas State University.  That perception, again, is an ENORMOUS problem for KSU and it's one purely of Currie's making.

Given the nature of Currie's recent actions towards the basketball program it's completely unsurprising that he had no real options when Frank walked.  The national perception at that point was that our resume polishing AD had just run off the most initially successful coach in the history of KSU basketball in a feud over what seemed to many to be a non-issue.  Couple that with Frank's all-American rags-to-riches life story and his present status as something of a media darling and it seems fair to say that Currie created a toxic atmosphere at KSU.  Right or wrong that's how KSU looks to America right now and the best the athletic department can do to combat that perception is to spew forth a few weak rumors about a potential disaster had Frank stayed. 

High level assistants & top shelf mid-major HCs have many options and needn't troll through the toxic slums of the college basketball world for their next gigs.  The risk of being screwed by an out of control AD and destroying one's career before reaching the highest levels is very real; thus, given Currie's recent actions, it's safe to assume that none of these guys were coming.   And make no mistake: so long as John Currie occupies the AD's chair KSU will continue to be a toxic slum so far as quality prospective HCs are concerned.  For them the status quo is quite good and changing it requires reasonable certainty that they'll improve their situations and will have success and a high probability that their future success won't be sabotaged by their next employer.  With Currie at the helm KSU does not offer those things to prospective HCs.

The process was frustrating to watch because I've run precisely the same process, in precisely the same manner on an acquisition a good fraction of the size of a DI hoops coach hire: my critera were put in place post-hoc to justify my desired outcome which was predetermined.  Currie is doing the same thing here.  He clearly got his guy and he's backfilling, not particularly successfully I might add, in an attempt to make it appear that Weber was the best & inevitible result of a well considered process that quite obviously didn't actually exist. 

It strikes me as rather odd that previous experience as a BCS level HC was considered at all given that the last time a coach with those credentials was hired by, and had success at, Kansas State (absent very serious extenuating circumstances) in either major revenue sport Woodrow Wilson was President of the United States and the Roaring 20s were not yet underway.  And since no one who had experience as, simultaneously, a basketball, football & baseball HC at one BCS institution and, also simultaneously, a baseball & basketball HC and athletic director at another, prior to their coming to KSU, we can safely dismiss the lateral hire of undamaged goods as an option.  It has never happened at KSU.

Bob Huggins represents the only instance in KSU history in either major sport that something that was approximately a lateral hire occurred and resulted in significant success.  But there KSU took a chance on someone with serious baggage and was rewarded with an instant revival of a dead program, THAT is the prototype lateral hire who has had success at Kansas State.  If Currie needed high major experience the only person in the market who fits what has worked in the past at Kansas State was oscar Pearl.  Pearl would have: won, won immediately, set sail in a few years for greener pastures & left the program with a longer sustained legacy of success and better players than those present when he arrived.  In doing so he would have continued the positive momentum the program had until last week and, perhaps more importantly, he would have continued to dissolve the old saws that you can't win in & recruit to Manhattan, KS.

While I wasn't entirely on the DG bandwagon he would have brought something to the table that KSU desperately needs, particularly in light of Currie's recent and rather extraordinarily damaging actions: enormous positive media attention.  If the top 50 donors to KSU's athletic program gave their entire collective net worth to KSU tomorrow the university, quite literally, could not buy the positive publicity that would have resulted from a DG hire that would have effectively converted ESPN's college hoops coverage into a KSU infomercial for the next few years.  This hire would have been the media equivalent of the west side stadium expansion & hoops practice facility multiplied by some factor greater than one.  Because he doesn't appear to be a complete idiot he could've taken the returning team to the NCAA tournament with the question marks being whether or not he could run the program & sustain that success thereafter.

It's instructive also to look across the field to Vanier and recognize what it took to bring success to the other major sport.  There it took promises of facilities upgrades the department couldn't afford and contractually ceding complete control of the program to a little known but promising assistant to lure in anyone with a pulse.  The reward has been vast but the risk was extreme.  Again, there has NEVER been a successful lateral hire at KSU, not in footbal and not in basketball; to succeed here requires the calculated assumption of great risk and that's the one thing a resume polishing short timer will never do.

Weber brings a proven track record of mediocrity & underperformance, a history of leaving programs with worse rosters than those he inherits & his hire, judged solely by the reaction of the national media, has already resulted in setting the image of KSU athletics back 10-20 years.  Rushing out to compete with CoC & SMU is bad enough, hiring proven mediocrity with little upside is worse and doing so in a manner that brings back from the grave the old mantras about it being impossible to win in and recruit to Manhattan, KS is disasterous.  Doing it right after rough ridin' a senior player and a coach who one of the best popular embodiments of the American Dream right up the ass in a very public manner is death, no one worth a damn will come here now. 

The outcome is awful for everyone except John Currie.  Currie bought himself a couple of years in which to shop for a better gig while preserving his own personal worst case scenario, a lateral move, by virtue of putting a poor performing but known commodity in the driver's seat of one of KSU's major programs so as to not so much win but not lose too badly too quickly.  In doing so he made both major sports dead men walking.  Enjoy the next couple of years 'Cat fans, they're as good as it's going to get any time soon. 

Offline captaincrap

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #277 on: April 03, 2012, 01:33:52 PM »
Currie holding Jamar out of the Syracuse game is a big deal for KSU in that the perception of that event from the outside looking in is that of an overeager and hyper-anal young AD picking a fight with a coach he disliked at the expense of both the men's basketball program and a senior player looking forward to playing the biggest game of his career.  The damning perception in the media seems to have been that Jamar probably didn't do anything wrong, that's an ENORMOUS problem for KSU that Currie has exacerbated by being a weasel and modifying his story post hoc. 

But suppose Jamar was clearly in the wrong and he played against Syracuse, what's the REASONABLE worst case outcome?  A slap on the wrist & forfeiture of that game and others he might have participated in going forward had KSU won?  Big deal.  It's very difficult from a fan's perspective to view this as anything other than John Currie protecting John Currie's resume at the expense of Jamar Samuels, the KSU men's basketball program and Kansas State University.  That perception, again, is an ENORMOUS problem for KSU and it's one purely of Currie's making.

Given the nature of Currie's recent actions towards the basketball program it's completely unsurprising that he had no real options when Frank walked.  The national perception at that point was that our resume polishing AD had just run off the most initially successful coach in the history of KSU basketball in a feud over what seemed to many to be a non-issue.  Couple that with Frank's all-American rags-to-riches life story and his present status as something of a media darling and it seems fair to say that Currie created a toxic atmosphere at KSU.  Right or wrong that's how KSU looks to America right now and the best the athletic department can do to combat that perception is to spew forth a few weak rumors about a potential disaster had Frank stayed.

Stopped reading here. This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

And Currie's rep nationally in Athletics is not toxic. Some national writers who are close with Frank have written some negative stuff. Do not believe it impacted available candidates.

Offline wazucat

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #278 on: April 03, 2012, 01:39:50 PM »
Our pres was the only person that could have kept this train wreck from happening and it appears to me he is fully behind the guilty conductor.

Offline fr@ck me

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #279 on: April 03, 2012, 01:40:12 PM »
Currie holding Jamar out of the Syracuse game is a big deal for KSU in that the perception of that event from the outside looking in is that of an overeager and hyper-anal young AD picking a fight with a coach he disliked at the expense of both the men's basketball program and a senior player looking forward to playing the biggest game of his career.  The damning perception in the media seems to have been that Jamar probably didn't do anything wrong, that's an ENORMOUS problem for KSU that Currie has exacerbated by being a weasel and modifying his story post hoc. 

But suppose Jamar was clearly in the wrong and he played against Syracuse, what's the REASONABLE worst case outcome?  A slap on the wrist & forfeiture of that game and others he might have participated in going forward had KSU won?  Big deal.  It's very difficult from a fan's perspective to view this as anything other than John Currie protecting John Currie's resume at the expense of Jamar Samuels, the KSU men's basketball program and Kansas State University.  That perception, again, is an ENORMOUS problem for KSU and it's one purely of Currie's making.

Given the nature of Currie's recent actions towards the basketball program it's completely unsurprising that he had no real options when Frank walked.  The national perception at that point was that our resume polishing AD had just run off the most initially successful coach in the history of KSU basketball in a feud over what seemed to many to be a non-issue.  Couple that with Frank's all-American rags-to-riches life story and his present status as something of a media darling and it seems fair to say that Currie created a toxic atmosphere at KSU.  Right or wrong that's how KSU looks to America right now and the best the athletic department can do to combat that perception is to spew forth a few weak rumors about a potential disaster had Frank stayed.

Stopped reading here. This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

And Currie's rep nationally in Athletics is not toxic. Some national writers who are close with Frank have written some negative stuff. Do not believe it impacted available candidates.

I'm impressed you are still reading!   :thumbsup:  don't you feel like you are  :bang: by now? 

Offline Ira Hayes

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #280 on: April 03, 2012, 01:49:42 PM »
I've said it before and I'll both repeat and expand on it here: Currie has done a fanstastic job on the fundraising & facilities side.  In those respects he's almost certainly been the most successful AD in KSU history.  We get that. We know that the AD's primary functions are to make it rain & to build lasting facilities and that everything else he does should, ideally, be designed to serve those ends.  He deserves an enormous amount of credit for the west side stadium upgrade and for the basketball practice facility.  It's impossible to overstate the magnitude of those achievements, particularly as viewed in the context of the history of KSU Athletics. 

These should have been heady times in the KSU Athletic Department.  The most successful rainmaker in the department's history at the helm, a legend defying the odds in the primary revenue sport by recreating success the smart money said could not be duplicated in an improbable second act and a legend in the making behind the LMD of the other primary revenue sport.  One of these folks is clearly the best KSU has ever had at his position and the other two arguably are as well, at least by some measures. 

Who has been doing the fundraising? It's easier to fire a guy if Shulz knows who the next guy is going to be.

Offline AzCat

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #281 on: April 03, 2012, 01:56:57 PM »
Stopped reading here. This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

And Currie's rep nationally in Athletics is not toxic. Some national writers who are close with Frank have written some negative stuff. Do not believe it impacted available candidates.

Perception is reality.  Here's ESPN:
Quote
Samuels was suspended for Saturday's game against Syracuse by his university's athletic director -- presumably as a pre-emptive strike -- for taking $200 from his old AAU coach.

MSN:
Quote
After the university's compliance office was made aware of the apparent $200 wire transfer to Samuels from his former Washington, D.C., AAU coach, Currie suspended the senior from the team's third-round loss to Syracuse in the NCAA tournament.

If indeed it was the NCAA that deemed Jamar ineligible then Currie needed to state that very clearly and very explicitly at the time he enforced the suspension and announced it to the media.  I mean how hard is it to say, "This isn't my choice nor is it my doing.  The NCAA has informed me that Jamar is ineligible for today's game."  Either Currie is a fool, which I don't believe, or the decision was his.

And you should, perhaps, look into a reading comprehension course: I didn't say Currie was toxit I said he'd make Kansas State toxic.  Currie's proven fundraising ability guarantees his abilty to move laterally until he really fucks something up at Kansas State.  Weber fits perfectly with Currie's long-term plans for himself but he'll be a disaster for KSU, already has been in terms of media perception no matter how far into the sand you choose to stuff your head. 

Offline fr@ck me

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #282 on: April 03, 2012, 02:00:34 PM »
Stopped reading here. This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

And Currie's rep nationally in Athletics is not toxic. Some national writers who are close with Frank have written some negative stuff. Do not believe it impacted available candidates.

Perception is reality.  Here's ESPN:
Quote
Samuels was suspended for Saturday's game against Syracuse by his university's athletic director -- presumably as a pre-emptive strike -- for taking $200 from his old AAU coach.

MSN:
Quote
After the university's compliance office was made aware of the apparent $200 wire transfer to Samuels from his former Washington, D.C., AAU coach, Currie suspended the senior from the team's third-round loss to Syracuse in the NCAA tournament.

If indeed it was the NCAA that deemed Jamar ineligible then Currie needed to state that very clearly and very explicitly at the time he enforced the suspension and announced it to the media.  I mean how hard is it to say, "This isn't my choice nor is it my doing.  The NCAA has informed me that Jamar is ineligible for today's game."  Either Currie is a fool, which I don't believe, or the decision was his.

And you should, perhaps, look into a reading comprehension course: I didn't say Currie was toxit I said he'd make Kansas State toxic.  Currie's proven fundraising ability guarantees his abilty to move laterally until he really fucks something up at Kansas State.  Weber fits perfectly with Currie's long-term plans for himself but he'll be a disaster for KSU, already has been in terms of media perception no matter how far into the sand you choose to stuff your head.

Ok I'm going out on a limb here and saying that I was the only one on this board that saw the NCAA President the next weekend say that if we had played Jamar the NCAA would have come down hard on us... I mean, I did see some people upset because he mad dumb ass comments about kids not needing more money, but apparently I was the only one who heard him say that he would have come down hard on us...   :confused:

Offline Ira Hayes

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #283 on: April 03, 2012, 02:08:29 PM »
Stopped reading here. This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

And Currie's rep nationally in Athletics is not toxic. Some national writers who are close with Frank have written some negative stuff. Do not believe it impacted available candidates.

Perception is reality.  Here's ESPN:
Quote
Samuels was suspended for Saturday's game against Syracuse by his university's athletic director -- presumably as a pre-emptive strike -- for taking $200 from his old AAU coach.

MSN:
Quote
After the university's compliance office was made aware of the apparent $200 wire transfer to Samuels from his former Washington, D.C., AAU coach, Currie suspended the senior from the team's third-round loss to Syracuse in the NCAA tournament.

If indeed it was the NCAA that deemed Jamar ineligible then Currie needed to state that very clearly and very explicitly at the time he enforced the suspension and announced it to the media.  I mean how hard is it to say, "This isn't my choice nor is it my doing.  The NCAA has informed me that Jamar is ineligible for today's game."  Either Currie is a fool, which I don't believe, or the decision was his.

And you should, perhaps, look into a reading comprehension course: I didn't say Currie was toxit I said he'd make Kansas State toxic.  Currie's proven fundraising ability guarantees his abilty to move laterally until he really fucks something up at Kansas State.  Weber fits perfectly with Currie's long-term plans for himself but he'll be a disaster for KSU, already has been in terms of media perception no matter how far into the sand you choose to stuff your head. 

Why doesn't Currie ask ESPN and MSN for a correction?  It defames Currie and leads AzCat and I to believe that he might be lying.  They printed it as fact.  Currie's potential future employers are certainly going to read articles about the whole debacle.

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #284 on: April 03, 2012, 02:09:35 PM »
Currie was never clear on whether he or the NCAA suspended Jamar.

Offline AzCat

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #285 on: April 03, 2012, 02:12:36 PM »
Ok I'm going out on a limb here and saying that I was the only one on this board that saw the NCAA President the next weekend say that if we had played Jamar the NCAA would have come down hard on us... I mean, I did see some people upset because he mad dumb ass comments about kids not needing more money, but apparently I was the only one who heard him say that he would have come down hard on us...   :confused:

Yes, you're obviously confused.  We're talking about John Currie's bungling of the media circus, not the events themselves or the actual facts surrounding them.  We're talking about the PERCEPTION created by John Currie that he allowed his feud with Frank to impact Jamar & the program.  There may be no basis in fact to that perception but it is, and has been, a dominant narrative in coverage of the affair.  That's no one's fault but Currie's.  He screwed the pooch in his handling of Frank, screwed the pooch in his handling of Jamar's suspension, he screwed the pooch again in his handling of Frank's departure & screwed the pooch one more time in the public perception of his handling of the Weber hire.  That's an awful lot of pooch screwing in a very short amount of time.  But it's classic KSU media relations, it's what I've come to expect over the years. 

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #286 on: April 03, 2012, 02:17:01 PM »
Currie was never clear on whether he or the NCAA suspended Jamar.

Exactly. 

If it was the NCAA the entirety of Currie's announcement prior to the Syracuse game should have been, "Jamar Samuels has been suspended for today's game by the NCAA.  Neither I, Frank Martin nor anyone affiliated with the Kansas State Univeristy Athletic Department had any choice in this matter.  I have no further comment, please direct all questions to __________________ at the NCAA who can be reached at (XXX) XXX-XXXX.  Thank you."

As it stands I can't quite imagine any reasonably possible way in which Currie could have handled things in such a way as to create a worse perception of KSU than that he actually created.

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #287 on: April 03, 2012, 02:29:11 PM »
I sent this email to Currie and cc'd Shultz yesterday before I read this thread...seems like it fits here.  I may never get good seats again, but I couldn't help myself.

John,

I have defended you on the message boards for the past 2 years (mainly because of your incredible fundraising) but I’m through.  I could not be more disappointed with the past few weeks events.  And now word that Brad Underwood is moving on.  You have really crap in your bed now John.  I can’t remember a BCS coach that was hired, immediately after being fired, by another BCS school…and at a higher salary no less.  And I don’t give a crap what Gene Keady says…yes he’s a great KStater, but he is also a good friend of oscar Weber and is absolutely not objective.  I have no idea what happened with Frank and I’m not going to blame you for running him off (although this may be the case) but your hire of oscar Weber is absolutely disgusting.  His comments about Manhattan being a “difficult place to recruit to” is also very telling…set those expectations plenty low oscar.  It may be difficult to recruit to Manhattan but you sure as hell don’t say it publicly…oscar likely tells his wife she looks fat when she asks.  Now I’m ranting.  I’m so pissed off right now I could just cry.  I doubt you’ll be around in a few years when oscar has run this program into the ground exactly like he did at Illinois (what the hell made you think he would succeed at KSU when he couldn’t at what is arguably a MUCH easier/better job?).  Anyway, I’ll always love KSU and I will always support it, but I will not support you.  And I know what the response will be….”don’t judge the hire yet, give oscar time, yada yada yada”.  Well that’s bullshit.  I’m not going to wait 4 years to tell you how stupid this hire was, you won’t be around to hear it.



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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #289 on: April 03, 2012, 02:44:34 PM »
This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

This is yet another example of Currie losing the PR battle.  You say he explained several times that it wasn't his decision.  I've never seen that.  Where are those quotes?  Why didn't he make that CRYSTAL rough ridin' CLEAR from the beginning?  If this is true, he should've gone out of his way to repeatedly emphasize that this was NOT his decision and that NCAA ruled him ineligible and he was doing everything he could to get that overturned.  There's no excuse for EVERYONE I talked to being of the understanding that it was his decision to hold Jamar out.  There's no excuse for the AD of a BCS school to be so incompetent in the PR department.
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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #290 on: April 03, 2012, 02:47:04 PM »
I sent this email to Currie and cc'd Shultz yesterday before I read this thread...seems like it fits here.  I may never get good seats again, but I couldn't help myself.

John,

I have defended you on the message boards for the past 2 years (mainly because of your incredible fundraising) but I’m through.  I could not be more disappointed with the past few weeks events.  And now word that Brad Underwood is moving on.  You have really crap in your bed now John.  I can’t remember a BCS coach that was hired, immediately after being fired, by another BCS school…and at a higher salary no less.  And I don’t give a crap what Gene Keady says…yes he’s a great KStater, but he is also a good friend of oscar Weber and is absolutely not objective.  I have no idea what happened with Frank and I’m not going to blame you for running him off (although this may be the case) but your hire of oscar Weber is absolutely disgusting.  His comments about Manhattan being a “difficult place to recruit to” is also very telling…set those expectations plenty low oscar.  It may be difficult to recruit to Manhattan but you sure as hell don’t say it publicly…oscar likely tells his wife she looks fat when she asks.  Now I’m ranting.  I’m so pissed off right now I could just cry.  I doubt you’ll be around in a few years when oscar has run this program into the ground exactly like he did at Illinois (what the hell made you think he would succeed at KSU when he couldn’t at what is arguably a MUCH easier/better job?).  Anyway, I’ll always love KSU and I will always support it, but I will not support you.  And I know what the response will be….”don’t judge the hire yet, give oscar time, yada yada yada”.  Well that’s bullshit.  I’m not going to wait 4 years to tell you how stupid this hire was, you won’t be around to hear it.

wOw fuktard you really let him have it  :sdeek:

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #291 on: April 03, 2012, 02:48:10 PM »
I sent this email to Currie and cc'd Shultz yesterday before I read this thread...seems like it fits here.  I may never get good seats again, but I couldn't help myself.

John,

I have defended you on the message boards for the past 2 years (mainly because of your incredible fundraising) but I’m through.  I could not be more disappointed with the past few weeks events.  And now word that Brad Underwood is moving on.  You have really crap in your bed now John.  I can’t remember a BCS coach that was hired, immediately after being fired, by another BCS school…and at a higher salary no less.  And I don’t give a crap what Gene Keady says…yes he’s a great KStater, but he is also a good friend of oscar Weber and is absolutely not objective.  I have no idea what happened with Frank and I’m not going to blame you for running him off (although this may be the case) but your hire of oscar Weber is absolutely disgusting.  His comments about Manhattan being a “difficult place to recruit to” is also very telling…set those expectations plenty low oscar.  It may be difficult to recruit to Manhattan but you sure as hell don’t say it publicly…oscar likely tells his wife she looks fat when she asks.  Now I’m ranting.  I’m so pissed off right now I could just cry.  I doubt you’ll be around in a few years when oscar has run this program into the ground exactly like he did at Illinois (what the hell made you think he would succeed at KSU when he couldn’t at what is arguably a MUCH easier/better job?).  Anyway, I’ll always love KSU and I will always support it, but I will not support you.  And I know what the response will be….”don’t judge the hire yet, give oscar time, yada yada yada”.  Well that’s bullshit.  I’m not going to wait 4 years to tell you how stupid this hire was, you won’t be around to hear it.


just a quick point of clarification- gene keady is not a great kstater and people need to stop saying that. he went to kstate yeah and was a good football player while he was there, but the guy does not care about kstate. that much i can promise you.

« Last Edit: April 03, 2012, 02:52:05 PM by rick daris »

Offline AzCat

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #292 on: April 03, 2012, 02:52:41 PM »
This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

This is yet another example of Currie losing the PR battle.  You say he explained several times that it wasn't his decision.  I've never seen that.  Where are those quotes?  Why didn't he make that CRYSTAL rough ridin' CLEAR from the beginning?  If this is true, he should've gone out of his way to repeatedly emphasize that this was NOT his decision and that NCAA ruled him ineligible and he was doing everything he could to get that overturned.  There's no excuse for EVERYONE I talked to being of the understanding that it was his decision to hold Jamar out.  There's no excuse for the AD of a BCS school to be so incompetent in the PR department.

I'm not sure which is worse: the awful handling of the events of the last couple of weeks by Currie or the fact that, as demonstrated clearly by CC's replies here, the athletic department remains completely oblivous to the self-inflicted PR damage. 

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #293 on: April 03, 2012, 02:54:23 PM »
This is just completely off base, and I've addressed it here several times and JC has explained it several times. Currie didn't hold Jamar out, the NCAA did. And once they did, if we played him, it would have been more than a slap on the wrist. Get over it, Jamar screwed up.

This is yet another example of Currie losing the PR battle.  You say he explained several times that it wasn't his decision.  I've never seen that.  Where are those quotes?  Why didn't he make that CRYSTAL rough ridin' CLEAR from the beginning?  If this is true, he should've gone out of his way to repeatedly emphasize that this was NOT his decision and that NCAA ruled him ineligible and he was doing everything he could to get that overturned.  There's no excuse for EVERYONE I talked to being of the understanding that it was his decision to hold Jamar out.  There's no excuse for the AD of a BCS school to be so incompetent in the PR department.

I'm not sure which is worse: the awful handling of the events of the last couple of weeks by Currie or the fact that, as demonstrated clearly by CC's replies here, the athletic department remains completely oblivous to the self-inflicted PR damage.

It's the latter.  I figured at least Schulz could/would pull the plug once it got out of hand, but they've all proven to be completely out of touch.  Nothing anyone says or does will influence them.

Offline Cartierfor3

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #294 on: April 03, 2012, 02:57:08 PM »
I sent this email to Currie and cc'd Shultz yesterday before I read this thread...seems like it fits here.  I may never get good seats again, but I couldn't help myself.

John,

I have defended you on the message boards for the past 2 years (mainly because of your incredible fundraising) but I’m through.  I could not be more disappointed with the past few weeks events.  And now word that Brad Underwood is moving on.  You have really crap in your bed now John.  I can’t remember a BCS coach that was hired, immediately after being fired, by another BCS school…and at a higher salary no less.  And I don’t give a crap what Gene Keady says…yes he’s a great KStater, but he is also a good friend of oscar Weber and is absolutely not objective.  I have no idea what happened with Frank and I’m not going to blame you for running him off (although this may be the case) but your hire of oscar Weber is absolutely disgusting.  His comments about Manhattan being a “difficult place to recruit to” is also very telling…set those expectations plenty low oscar.  It may be difficult to recruit to Manhattan but you sure as hell don’t say it publicly…oscar likely tells his wife she looks fat when she asks.  Now I’m ranting.  I’m so pissed off right now I could just cry.  I doubt you’ll be around in a few years when oscar has run this program into the ground exactly like he did at Illinois (what the hell made you think he would succeed at KSU when he couldn’t at what is arguably a MUCH easier/better job?).  Anyway, I’ll always love KSU and I will always support it, but I will not support you.  And I know what the response will be….”don’t judge the hire yet, give oscar time, yada yada yada”.  Well that’s bullshit.  I’m not going to wait 4 years to tell you how stupid this hire was, you won’t be around to hear it.


just a quick point of clarification- gene keady is not a great kstater and people need to stop saying that. he went to kstate yeah and was a good football player while he was there, but the guy does not care about kstate. that much i can promise you.

It's like saying LHC Bill Snyder is a great William Jeweler.

Offline captaincrap

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #295 on: April 03, 2012, 03:04:05 PM »
Nothing anyone says or does will influence them.

I find this ironic.

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #296 on: April 03, 2012, 05:08:46 PM »
Nothing anyone says or does will influence them.

I find this ironic.

True.  The philosophical differences are just too deep.  If a star player gets a questionable money transfer on a Monday and Currie can't keep him eligible for 5 more days he is incompetent. There is just no way we can compete against Kansas.  The last time KU self-reported, it was for stuff that was 5 or so years old.  Then they went and won another NCAA championship. A couple more Final Fours.  This ain't the NAIA.

This minor violation essentially turned into:

1. Forfeit to Syracuse aka...A one year post-season ban
2. The permanent end of Jamar's career
3. Termination of the coach and his staff

That is a worse penalty than KU basketball got for lack of institutional control.

So when Currie gives us this "Boy, WE would have really gotten hammered if I had accidentally forgotten to charge my phone" explanation, he is completely full of crap.

« Last Edit: April 03, 2012, 05:10:50 PM by Ira Hayes »

Offline captaincrap

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #297 on: April 03, 2012, 05:15:58 PM »
If a star player gets a questionable money transfer on a Monday and Currie can't keep him eligible for 5 more days he is incompetent. There is just no way we can compete against Kansas.  The last time KU self-reported, it was for stuff that was 5 or so years old.  Then they went and won another NCAA championship. A couple more Final Fours.  This ain't the NAIA.

This minor violation essentially turned into:

1. Forfeit to Syracuse aka...A one year post-season ban
2. The permanent end of Jamar's career
3. Termination of the coach and his staff

Sorry, you are incorrect.

Offline Ira Hayes

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #298 on: April 03, 2012, 05:24:31 PM »
I'll assume you think I am correct about the parts of my post that you didn't quote.  ;)

Offline AbeFroman

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Re: Hiring Process Discussion with CC
« Reply #299 on: April 03, 2012, 05:28:48 PM »
Both sides have valid points, but Currie is terrible at PR and PC's so he makes everything he has done in this debacle look that much worse. He just cannot be trusted when he talks.