Author Topic: Why coaching matters  (Read 21220 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline econocat

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 203
  • The father of Economics
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #25 on: March 08, 2010, 04:25:36 PM »
This thread will probably set a new bar for poster intimidation!   :popcorn:
"Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone." — John Maynard Keynes

Offline Johnny Wichita

  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 2141
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #26 on: March 08, 2010, 04:25:47 PM »
5 RULES OF BAKSETBALL

1.  Spacing
2.  Pivoting
3.  Pace
4.  Hands Up
5.  Score more points than the other team.  

Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #27 on: March 08, 2010, 04:34:24 PM »
I'll take the bait ... Which players are you talking about specifically?  The one player that sees significant minutes that I think has consistent serious problems on the defensive end is Curtis.  He tends to hedge too far when his man screens a guard near the top of the key, leaving his man either open or matched up on the block with Pullen or Clemente guarding them.  However, he is a necessary evil because he is such a talented scoring threat on the block.

Yes, #24 is a defensive liability.  He always leaves his feet and is in bad position to defend the paint.  What should be troubling all of you is that his problems (and most others) are all easily correctable.  Denny Clemente is a huge waste on defense, he is always reaching and caught with his feet under his hips.  He looks lost most of the time, which is unacceptable in a senior.  I would be crazy to deny the athletic talent we put on the court, but they are ill used and prepared.  I don't know why we never run any offensive sets other than the most basic pick plays at the top of the key.  Lots of standing around watching #21 dribble.

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline EMAWzified

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 4244
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #28 on: March 08, 2010, 04:35:11 PM »
I never thought Tannoudji was for real. Still don't. Somewhat inspired satire.
IPB leadership principles.  :lol:

Offline sonofdaxjones

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 59462
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #29 on: March 08, 2010, 04:36:31 PM »
Great post . . . true in many aspects.

You left out Frank's clear hate for good shooters.   

Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #30 on: March 08, 2010, 04:47:32 PM »
all i can say, tann, is bullshit, which is about all i can say.
Bad language will get you no where in life.  It sounds like you admire Frank Martin too much in that regard.
Quote
you see, tann, what separates us from other programs such as ku, nu, ut, ou, etc... isn't coaching, or baseline defense or whatever.  it's about something else.

there's no way to know what the future holds, but from frank martin's video comments, it seems that he truly gets it!  we already know that coach LHC Bill Snyder gets it.  what sets kstate apart is that while we value winning and success, we almost equally value the virtues of loyalty, integrity, humility, family, hard work, honest effort, respect, etc...
If Frank Martin "got it" we wouldn't have had this drawn contract negotiation.  If Frank Martin "got it" he wouldn't bring in the kind of element he brings to Manhattan.  If Frank Martin "got it" he wouldn't continually embarrass our University.  To put him in the same sentence as LHC Bill Snyder is laughable.  Laughable.  Wake me up when Frank Martin beats KU for 14 straight years.  Wake me up when Frank Martin actually wins something.
Quote
other programs are different because they are all about being the biggest or the best or winning at any and all costs.  then when they win, they gain their joy by pointing out to any and all who will listen that they won!  they seek to use the power (real or perceived) they have gained as leverage to intimidate or gain an advantage in any way possible.  they demand that everyone recognize their accomplishments and "bow at their altar."  we've all witnessed arrogance, condescension and braggadocio from our b12 counterparts.

i believe kstate stands for something different and is motivated differently.  i believe that kstate loves kstate and wants it to do well and succede, to the best of its abilities.  the fans love the teams, and typically the teams love the fans.  sure we have healthy rivalries, but beyond that, we wish our counterparts well as well.  we complain when we see that we are not being shown respect for our accomplishments or when someone else is being shown favoritism and is benefiting unfairly from it.

coach LHC Bill Snyder set the standard.  what a tremendous individual.  who would not have loved to hire this man away for their own program???  how many national championships could he have had if he'd had the unlimited budget or superpower recruiting status enjoyed by other programs?  yet, he remained loyal.  god bless LHC Bill Snyder.
Yes HC Snyder did set the standard.  And yet even all he gave to this State and University wasn't enough to keep the social experimenters at bay.  If you see what Bill did, then you know that Frank Martin is a Prince in ill-fitting suit.
Quote
as for basketball... i thought, as many did, that we had our perfect hire in lon kruger.  wow.  not only was that not perfect, but his claim that there was "no place i'd rather be than kstate" right before he shot out the door set us on the basketball death spiral from which we are only now recovering.  i thought he, of all people, would get it.  sadly, he did not.  i don't mind that he left, i just wish he'd been honest and not left the program in a lurch in the process.  loyalty.  dignity.  integrity.  character.

but now... frank martin.  what an unlikely marriage of heartland american university and south florida coach.  yet, somehow...a perfect fit.  let me just say to you, frank martin:  "you are home!"  you are a perfect embodiment of what kansas state university stands for.  i hope your future, at least a significant portion of it, includes tremendous success and kansas state university.  i believe, as impossible as it may seem, that we share many of the same core values.  i hope you are as impressed with our school, community, state etc... as we have been with you.  i wish you nothing but the very best, and will be devoted to helping you achieve success.

you see, i love kansas state university.  i don't want it to succeed so i can pound my chest and rub it in (ok, maybe to the irritating ku fans who have done so to me for 20 years ) to everyone around me.  i want it to succeed because i love it.  similarly, and it is with utmost respect and appreciation that i say this, a piece of me dies each time we lose as well.  i know i am not alone... nor, coach martin, are you.

every man a wildcat

god bless, coach martin
If Frank Martin wants to represent this University with a tenth of the class of LHC Bill Snyder then he need to talk to LHC Bill Snyder and accept his advice.  Ron Prince decided to do it his way and look where that got us.  He had the resources of the greatest coach in school history at his fingertips and never made that call.  Frank Martin is doing the same.

Also, if Frank wants to be a K-Stater then he needs to drop the hyphen-American stuff.  Either he's an American or he's not.

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #31 on: March 08, 2010, 04:50:15 PM »
Great post . . . true in many aspects.

You left out Frank's clear hate for good shooters.   
You don't need great shooters to win.  You need average shooters and good passing to win.  You can have your team of great shooters and shoot 45% from outside.  I'll take my team of average one's with great passers and shoot 95% layups all night long.

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline weird roberts foam finger

  • Combo-Fan
  • **
  • Posts: 409
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #32 on: March 08, 2010, 04:51:56 PM »
This thread is like a warm blanket.  I want to hug it.
"It could be best for his family for Cole to come back." -- Bill Self, NBA career killer

Offline dobbie4ksu

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 245
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2010, 04:53:09 PM »
Well the worst passer on the team will be gone after this year, so thats uber improvment right there
Maybe you folks aren't so bad...

Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #34 on: March 08, 2010, 04:53:33 PM »
Since your post was rather long, I didn't catch if you mentioned how everyone always leaves their man to stop ball, because certain players can't defend for $hit leaving good shooters wide open out on the perimeter.   (Fantastic parody posting BTW)

I ask again, why in the hell are we so worried about stopping the ball on drives and leaving people wide open on the perimeter when we supposedly have a cadre of shot blockers on the inside . . . until that stops, drive and kick, drive and kick all day long.  

BTW does anyone know who attempts to "coach" our bigs??
I didn't mention it because it's irrelevant.  Let them have the outside, I'll take the inside.

Why would you rather take a jump shot than a layup?  

I will always give them a jumper to not give an inside shot.  This is basic basketball here.

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #35 on: March 08, 2010, 04:55:07 PM »
Well the worst passer on the team will be gone after this year, so thats uber improvment right there

Its a great fool who thinks that an apple tree will suddenly start bearing oranges.

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline theswo

  • Combo-Fan
  • **
  • Posts: 482
  • Keep shooting, Gilbert
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #36 on: March 08, 2010, 04:55:58 PM »
Well the worst passer on the team will be gone after this year, so thats uber improvment right there

Its a great fool who thinks that an apple tree will suddenly start bearing oranges.
Best Sock/Parody Poster EVER

Offline Belvis Noland

  • Katpak'r
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ***
  • Posts: 3964
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #37 on: March 08, 2010, 04:56:37 PM »

I think my team would have beat ISU at home.


Would your team have gone 11-5 in conference with 6 road wins?  

The ISU debacle was f'n humiliating.  And a pisspoor way to end the season.  No argument there.  

But, look at the body of work.  Aside from the ISU abiration, this season has been wildly successful.   Each of our 5 losses were to NCAA tourny teams.  


I'll gladly suffer through Frank's abysmal coacing and LBBIQ if it results in 24-45 Ws per year and consistent NCAA appearances.  

Offline Trim

  • Global Moderator
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *****
  • Posts: 42621
  • Pfizer PLUS Moderna and now Pfizer Bivalent
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #38 on: March 08, 2010, 05:00:15 PM »
2.  I do not drink anymore.

I'd love to hear your method/reasoning for quitting.  Thinking it could be time myself to get on the wagon.  Advice?

Offline sonofdaxjones

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 59462
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #39 on: March 08, 2010, 05:01:26 PM »
You don't need to worry about 6-1 guards going to the rack if you've got big guys who can defend the goal inside . . .  you don't need everyone running to stop the ball leaving good shooters wide open on the perimeter if you've got good inside defenders and shot blockers.

Basketball 101 . . . try it on for size Tan.


Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #40 on: March 08, 2010, 05:02:09 PM »

I think my team would have beat ISU at home.


Would your team have gone 11-5 in conference with 6 road wins?  

The ISU debacle was f'n humiliating.  And a pisspoor way to end the season.  No argument there.  

But, look at the body of work.  Aside from the ISU abiration, this season has been wildly successful.   Each of our 5 losses were to NCAA tourny teams.  


I'll gladly suffer through Frank's abysmal coacing and LBBIQ if it results in 24-45 Ws per year and consistent NCAA appearances.  

We can play what-ifs wall night.  The facts are:

Frank Martin has lost to Iowa State AND Oklahoma State (both unranked) at home because he is either too stubborn or too stupid to teach good basketball.


Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #41 on: March 08, 2010, 05:02:57 PM »
2.  I do not drink anymore.

I'd love to hear your method/reasoning for quitting.  Thinking it could be time myself to get on the wagon.  Advice?
I quit because it made me covet.

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #42 on: March 08, 2010, 05:06:03 PM »
You don't need to worry about 6-1 guards going to the rack if you've got big guys who can defend the goal inside . . .  you don't need everyone running to stop the ball leaving good shooters wide open on the perimeter if you've got good inside defenders and shot blockers.

Basketball 101 . . . try it on for size Tan.


I bet the last time you were on a basketball court must have been around the last time your could see your shoes.

Layup = ~100% (worth 2 points)

Jump shot =~40% at best (worth 2 points)

I bet you think Bill should pass on every down too.

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo

Offline ben ji

  • Senior Moderator
  • PCKK7DC Survivor
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *******
  • Posts: 12294
  • Alot of people dont hit on an 18
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #43 on: March 08, 2010, 05:06:07 PM »
Well the worst passer on the team will be gone after this year, so thats uber improvment right there

Its a great fool who thinks that an apple tree will suddenly start bearing oranges.
Best Sock/Parody Poster EVER

You beat me to it.

Doobs + Tann = Trainwreck that I cant stop watching

Offline sonofdaxjones

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 59462
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #44 on: March 08, 2010, 05:10:45 PM »
You don't need to worry about 6-1 guards going to the rack if you've got big guys who can defend the goal inside . . .  you don't need everyone running to stop the ball leaving good shooters wide open on the perimeter if you've got good inside defenders and shot blockers.

Basketball 101 . . . try it on for size Tan.


I bet the last time you were on a basketball court must have been around the last time your could see your shoes.

Layup = ~100% (worth 2 points)

Jump shot =~40% at best (worth 2 points)

I bet you think Bill should pass on every down too.

You're not understanding the whole concept of having big guys who can block shots . . . blocked shot 0 points, 0%.   Spot up, feet Set  . . . 3 pointer . . . 40 plus % in multiple games against K-State . . . oh, and 3 points.  

Nice effort though Tan . . . and again, nice parody posting.

I bet when Wooly hit us with that whole "fools gold" line, you had a biblical jizzing of the pants event.




Offline dobbie4ksu

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 245
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #45 on: March 08, 2010, 05:11:50 PM »
I still don't know who I am a sock of?
Maybe you folks aren't so bad...

Offline ben ji

  • Senior Moderator
  • PCKK7DC Survivor
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *******
  • Posts: 12294
  • Alot of people dont hit on an 18
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #46 on: March 08, 2010, 05:12:45 PM »
I still don't know who I am a sock of?

Just be yourself doobs, just be yourself.

Offline dobbie4ksu

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 245
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #47 on: March 08, 2010, 05:13:20 PM »
sonuvabitch
Maybe you folks aren't so bad...

Offline Belvis Noland

  • Katpak'r
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ***
  • Posts: 3964
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #48 on: March 08, 2010, 05:16:29 PM »

We can play what-ifs wall night.  The facts are:

Frank Martin has lost to Iowa State AND Oklahoma State (both unranked) at home because he is either too stubborn or too stupid to teach good basketball.  Frank Martin is the Big XII COY. 


Offline Tannoudji

  • Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 86
  • Rev 14:9
    • View Profile
Re: Why coaching matters
« Reply #49 on: March 08, 2010, 05:17:34 PM »
You don't need to worry about 6-1 guards going to the rack if you've got big guys who can defend the goal inside . . .  you don't need everyone running to stop the ball leaving good shooters wide open on the perimeter if you've got good inside defenders and shot blockers.

Basketball 101 . . . try it on for size Tan.


I bet the last time you were on a basketball court must have been around the last time your could see your shoes.

Layup = ~100% (worth 2 points)

Jump shot =~40% at best (worth 2 points)

I bet you think Bill should pass on every down too.

You're not understanding the whole concept of having big guys who can block shots . . . blocked shot 0 points, 0%.   Spot up, feet Set  . . . 3 pointer . . . 40 plus % in multiple games against K-State . . . oh, and 3 points.  

Nice effort though Tan . . . and again, nice parody posting.

I bet when Wooly hit us with that whole "fools gold" line, you had a biblical jizzing of the pants event.

Oh I see.  You want our players to try to block more shots, so we can get more fouls called on us.  Brilliant.

A great passing team doesn't get shots blocked because they make GREAT PASSES!  I know this is hard for you to understand after watching years of Frank Martin basketball, but you pass the ball more than once inside.  You pass the ball inside until you get an open shot.  This whole time we are comparing OPEN SHOTS.

40 < 100

Tyrannis Seditio, Obsequium Deo