Somedays I want to punch retards square in the face.

[wabash909]

Patterson knew he had a good thing going at TCU. He had a damn good roster and a better QB (Dalton) than he'd be able to recruit to K-State. Bill himself said the program was "in flux" when he took over. Surely Patterson was smart enough to see that.

If he wasn't, then he could at least see that the athletic department was in shambles.

K-State needed Patterson. Patterson didn't need K-State.

He has a Rose Bowl ring to prove it.

He didn't at the time.  He was coaching a fringe Top 10 team in a mid-major conference, playing on Versus, and competing for a Poisetta Bowl year in and year out.

There were plenty of incentives for him to jump to the Big XII and coach his alma mater.

[steve dave]

John Wefald did (is still doing?) everything in his power to destroy Kansas State University for his own gain.  I mean, there is a lot to hate about the old bastard....and all this before getting into his race fetish.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I can't wait to read Wefald's book (no way I pay for it) just so I can see him completely tear apart Bob Krause after all Bob did for him.

[j rake]

He didn't at the time.  He was coaching a fringe Top 10 team in a mid-major conference, playing on Versus, and competing for a Poisetta Bowl year in and year out.

There were plenty of incentives for him to jump to the Big XII and coach his alma mater.

Give me one example of a coach who spent a decade at a school, achieved high levels of success, and then left for a job—alma mater or no alma mater—that was worse than where he was previously.

Coaching at your alma mater isn't as thrilling as everybody makes it out to be, particularly if your alma mater is Kansas State. Patterson, because of his outrageous success at TCU, earned a step up to an elite school if he wanted it. He worked his ass off to turn TCU into what it has become.

Why on earth would he want to take on another rebuilding project in the middle of nowhere?

[wabash909]

Here’s the umm 1997 Fiest Bowl ring, Tim.  I want you to have it.  But, scratch my name off of it...no traceable evidence, you know.  Lol.  Thanks for all of your service, and oh yeah, thanks for promoting my “History According to Jon” book I’m writing about myself and for doing your little part as a respected, impartial member of the media in helping me restore by tarnished image that has been unfairly drug through the mud because of that goddamn scoundrel Bob Krause for the last three years.  What’s a little cash or jewelry on the side between ol pals…

[Dr Rick Daris]

He didn't at the time.  He was coaching a fringe Top 10 team in a mid-major conference, playing on Versus, and competing for a Poisetta Bowl year in and year out.

There were plenty of incentives for him to jump to the Big XII and coach his alma mater.

Give me one example of a coach who spent a decade at a school, achieved high levels of success, and then left for a job—alma mater or no alma mater—that was worse than where he was previously.

Coaching at your alma mater isn't as thrilling as everybody makes it out to be, particularly if your alma mater is Kansas State. Patterson, because of his outrageous success at TCU, earned a step up to an elite school if he wanted it. He worked his ass off to turn TCU into what it has become.

Why on earth would he want to take on another rebuilding project in the middle of nowhere?

people make life decisions everyday that would conflict with what other people would do/think they would do. three years ago i turned down a job in a town to subsequently take a similar job in the same town three months later that paid quite a bit less. great decision for me. i just want to know what fitz got in return for sinking the patterson ship at wefalds request. i mean, he basically just came right out and said he did it.

[Rage Against the McKee]

He didn't at the time.  He was coaching a fringe Top 10 team in a mid-major conference, playing on Versus, and competing for a Poisetta Bowl year in and year out.

There were plenty of incentives for him to jump to the Big XII and coach his alma mater.

Give me one example of a coach who spent a decade at a school, achieved high levels of success, and then left for a job—alma mater or no alma mater—that was worse than where he was previously.

Coaching at your alma mater isn't as thrilling as everybody makes it out to be, particularly if your alma mater is Kansas State. Patterson, because of his outrageous success at TCU, earned a step up to an elite school if he wanted it. He worked his ass off to turn TCU into what it has become.

Why on earth would he want to take on another rebuilding project in the middle of nowhere?

You're being way too hard on K-State here and way too easy on TCU. From a fan support and facilities perspective, as well as being in a BCS conference, K-State was a much better job than TCU at the time Prince was fired. Now that TCU is in the Big East, it's debatable. Still, If K-State and TCU were both looking for a coach, I would be pretty disappointed in Currie if TCU hired a coach that we really wanted.

[Skipper44]

Patterson knew he had a good thing going at TCU. He had a damn good roster and a better QB (Dalton) than he'd be able to recruit to K-State. Bill himself said the program was "in flux" when he took over. Surely Patterson was smart enough to see that.

If he wasn't, then he could at least see that the athletic department was in shambles.

K-State needed Patterson. Patterson didn't need K-State.

He has a Rose Bowl ring to prove it.

He didn't at the time.  He was coaching a fringe Top 10 team in a mid-major conference, playing on Versus, and competing for a Poisetta Bowl year in and year out.

There were plenty of incentives for him to jump to the Big XII and coach his alma mater.

Yes, TCU had just lost at Utah the night before, playing what was the biggest game in school's history in the modern era on Versus on a Thursday night.  Patterson was staring at a 10-2 season with the losses to two BCS teams and was headed to the Poinsettia Bowl.  

Now what came after with continued success of two BCS bowls and TCU jumping to an AQ conf all but shuts this door forever but he was absolutely a viable option at that time.  

Fitz was a pawn in this deal, his source said something like "GPat is done deal, only sticking point is he wants to coach the bowl game if they go BCS" and when they lost to TCU Fitz ran with what he thought was rock solid.  I think this may be one time Krause was actually acting on his own to secure Patterson and Wefald/OB stepped in at the 11th hour.  

Did Patterson waking up to the news of "Its Patterson" piss him off?  Sure he as red assed as any coach in the country but I do not think it was part of a masterplan to sabotage a deal.

[Cire]

I don't think that Fitz is smart enough to realize he was sinking it.  I think he was told information in confidence by someone that knew his lazy greedy ass would post it on the front page of his website.

[wabash909]

He didn't at the time.  He was coaching a fringe Top 10 team in a mid-major conference, playing on Versus, and competing for a Poisetta Bowl year in and year out.

There were plenty of incentives for him to jump to the Big XII and coach his alma mater.

Give me one example of a coach who spent a decade at a school, achieved high levels of success, and then left for a job—alma mater or no alma mater—that was worse than where he was previously.

Coaching at your alma mater isn't as thrilling as everybody makes it out to be, particularly if your alma mater is Kansas State. Patterson, because of his outrageous success at TCU, earned a step up to an elite school if he wanted it. He worked his ass off to turn TCU into what it has become.

Why on earth would he want to take on another rebuilding project in the middle of nowhere?

Depends on what you consider by worse?  I don't think it was a cut and dried as you are stating.

K-State, at the time, offered him the opportunity to elevate himself to a BCS level coaching position in one of the top BCS conferences in the country, the opporunity to legitimately play for a national title game, bigger national tv exposure, and much better reward for a one, two, or three loss season culminatind in the New Years day bowl with the Big XII bowl tie ins, and yes, the ability to come home and coach his alma mater.

Yeah, he was successful at TCU, but like I mentioned, he was racking up some gaudy win totals in a second rate, mid major conference in the Mountain West.  Had no shot at playing in the national title game with an undefeated season.  Played all of their games in media obscurity.  Had terrible bowl game tie-ins.  And basically gained little to no national respect for all of their accomplishments because of their reputation as the big fish in the shittly little pond.

Again, that all has changed now that he won the Rose Bowl and is moving to a BCS conference, but at the time, those elements were not in place.

[Dr Rick Daris]

I don't think that Fitz is smart enough to realize he was sinking it.  I think he was told information in confidence by someone that knew his lazy greedy ass would post it on the front page of his website.

did you see tim fitgerald's post the other day on the website he owns bragging about how the day after he reported the patterson hiring was the best or second best financial day for him/his website ever? what a selfish, greedy loser. the guy costs kansas state university, their fans and the town one of the best coaches in all of college football and a full two years later he's still bragging about how much money he made from it. what an bad person. 

[felix rex]

I've been beating this drum since day 1.  Apparently it's just more fun to blame Fitz...even though it's completely unrealistic.

Whatever.  What the eff do I care. 

Look at you, beating your little drum.

Still enjoying this one.

[kougar24]

Felix, you were a lit major? Want to take a crack at the Weefdom book?

[j rake]

people make life decisions everyday that would conflict with what other people would do/think they would do. three years ago i turned down a job in a town to subsequently take a similar job in the same town three months later that paid quite a bit less. great decision for me. i just want to know what fitz got in return for sinking the patterson ship at wefalds request. i mean, he basically just came right out and said he did it.

I hear what you are saying. But most in the coaching profession are climbers. It's the nature of the job. From grad assistant to position coach to coordinator to head coach at an awful school, to head coach at a better school, to, if you're lucky enough, head coach at an elite school.

Some coaches, like Chris Petersen and LHC Bill Snyder and, apparently, Gary Patterson, are incredibly loyal to their school. Many others would jump at the first chance to take the "big-time gig."

RARELY, if ever, do coaches take a step down. But I guess we are disagreeing on whether or not K-State was a step up or a step down at the time of the coaching search.

You're being way too hard on K-State here and way too easy on TCU. From a fan support and facilities perspective, as well as being in a BCS conference, K-State was a much better job than TCU at the time Prince was fired.

Fair enough. Good points.

Depends on what you consider by worse?  I don't think it was a cut and dried as you are stating.

K-State, at the time, offered him the opportunity to elevate himself to a BCS level coaching position in one of the top BCS conferences in the country, the opporunity to legitimately play for a national title game, bigger national tv exposure, and much better reward for a one, two, or three loss season culminatind in the New Years day bowl with the Big XII bowl tie ins, and yes, the ability to come home and coach his alma mater.

I guess my point was that Patterson likely could have had several other BCS opportunities at schools much better than K-State. You can make the alma mater argument, that's fine, but fans care more about that stuff (it seems) than coaches do.

Just ask Michigan.

[Dr Rick Daris]

so if... "patterson likely could have had several other bcs opportunities at schools much better than kstate" and "most in the coaching profession are climbers. It's the nature of the job. From grad assistant to position coach to coordinator to head coach at an awful school, to head coach at a better school, to, if you're lucky enough, head coach at an elite school."



why is he still at tcu?

[j rake]

I think you missed this part:

Some coaches, like Chris Petersen and LHC Bill Snyder and, apparently, Gary Patterson, are incredibly loyal to their school.

Seems he is just a loyal guy. 

[Dr Rick Daris]

I think you missed this part:

Some coaches, like Chris Petersen and LHC Bill Snyder and, apparently, Gary Patterson, are incredibly loyal to their school.

Seems he is just a loyal guy. 

so all the "tcu was a better job anyway, why would he want to come to ksu which was a worse job" talk earlier in this thread was just talk and patterson just stayed because he is loyal. gotcha. you really wasted a lot of typing energy for no reason though it seems. should've just pulled out the "patterson is super loyal" card immediately. also, what if kansas state was gary patterson's "school"? 

[Rams]

I've been beating this drum since day 1.  Apparently it's just more fun to blame Fitz...even though it's completely unrealistic.

Whatever.  What the eff do I care. 

Look at you, beating your little drum.

Still enjoying this one.

Me too.  Then again, I'm the one beating my little drum. 

[j rake]

I think you missed this part:

Some coaches, like Chris Petersen and LHC Bill Snyder and, apparently, Gary Patterson, are incredibly loyal to their school.

Seems he is just a loyal guy.  

so all "tcu was a better job anyway, why would he want to come to ksu which was a worse job" talk earlier in this thread was just talk and patterson just stayed because he is loyal. gotcha. you really wasted a lot of typing energy for no reason though it seems. should've just pulled out the "patterson is super loyal" card immediately. also, what if kansas state was gary patterson's "school"?  

I didn't have the "loyalty card" on me at the time of those other posts.

It just sort of came to me and I thought I'd use it.

[kso_FAN]

I think you missed this part:

Some coaches, like Chris Petersen and LHC Bill Snyder and, apparently, Gary Patterson, are incredibly loyal to their school.

Seems he is just a loyal guy.  

j_rake, I think you're pretty accurate on the whole Patterson thing.

And good D1 coaches, almost all of them with massive egos and extreme paranoia, make decisions based on all kinds of weird stuff.  Its the nature of the beast.  Many times you can pinpoint one or two things that they base their decisions on, but more often than not its more than that.  Money and the school you are at (or want to be at) are important, but there are other things factored in.  

[felix rex]

Felix, you were a lit major? Want to take a crack at the Weefdom book?

Sure. The first step is always determining whether or not you're dealing with a narrador fidedigno.

[Dr Rick Daris]

I think you missed this part:

Some coaches, like Chris Petersen and LHC Bill Snyder and, apparently, Gary Patterson, are incredibly loyal to their school.

Seems he is just a loyal guy.  

so all "tcu was a better job anyway, why would he want to come to ksu which was a worse job" talk earlier in this thread was just talk and patterson just stayed because he is loyal. gotcha. you really wasted a lot of typing energy for no reason though it seems. should've just pulled out the "patterson is super loyal" card immediately. also, what if kansas state was gary patterson's "school"?  

I didn't have the "loyalty card" on me at the time of those other posts.

It just sort of came to me and I thought I'd use it.

what if patterson has a robot computer type chip embedded in him that does not allow him to leave the dfw metroplex for more than 127 hours at a time or he explodes? that might even trump your loyalty card scenario. i'd scrap it too. jmo.

[wabash909]

I don't think that Fitz is smart enough to realize he was sinking it.  I think he was told information in confidence by someone that knew his lazy greedy ass would post it on the front page of his website.

did you see tim fitgerald's post the other day on the website he owns bragging about how the day after he reported the patterson hiring was the best or second best financial day for him/his website ever? what a selfish, greedy loser. the guy costs kansas state university, their fans and the town one of the best coaches in all of college football and a full two years later he's still bragging about how much money he made from it. what an bad person.  

Saw that.

And that basically affirms exactly my position all along.  For FITZ, breaking "It's Patterson", was about his own self serving, opportunistic motives to be the first to break the story.  This was his shot.  He gambled, he lost, and ultimately in the end, he put some short term gain and noteriety ahead of the long term viability of his cash cow, K-State football.

I still believe there was a contract, a deal in place and terms had been agreed to by Patterson.  I've spoken with multiple people that have confirmed it to not believe otherwise.  Hell, FITZ outlined specific contract details in his initial report.  He outlined contract details!  They weren't vague terms.  This stuff wasn't just concocted BS.

The only issue in my mind is what the true catalyst was behind the deal collapsing.

My suspicion is that the deal was struck by Krause and he acted independently without Wefald on the contract.  Krause, being the idiot that he is, in a victory celebration threw a bone to his buddy and leaked the contract details.  The story breaks prematurely, hell breaks loose in the President’s office because Wefald wants his guy Snyder to take the reigns, and Patterson is furious because he hadn’t been given the opportunity to notify his people on his terms and on his timeline.  I ultimately think there were multiple people to blame, FITZ set it in action impulsively with his self-interests in breaking the story and Wefald swooped in and ultimately killed the deal for Snyder.

[Dr Rick Daris]

I think you missed this part:

Some coaches, like Chris Petersen and LHC Bill Snyder and, apparently, Gary Patterson, are incredibly loyal to their school.

Seems he is just a loyal guy.  

And good D1 coaches, almost all of them with massive egos and extreme paranoia, make decisions based on all kinds of weird stuff.  Its the nature of the beast.  Many times you can pinpoint one or two things that they base their decisions on, but more often than not its more than that.  Money and the school you are at (or want to be at) are important, but there are other things factored in.  

so coaches (humans) take or sometimes don't take jobs based on mulitple reasons, which may happen to include some that are not easily understood by people who are not them. really fantastic stuff here. tell me more.

[kso_FAN]

so coaches (humans) take or sometimes don't take jobs based on mulitple reasons, which may happen to include some that are not easily understood by people who are not them. really fantastic stuff here. tell me more.

It seems to me many of the posters (also humans) make this a black and white issue on why coaches don't take jobs. That's all I was responding to. And head coaches are much more paranoid and have much larger egos than your average human.