Author Topic: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation  (Read 7949 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Ira Hayes

  • Created #RayRayForAD
  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 1985
  • The Marine that went to war.
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2011, 08:44:38 PM »
CU won an NC in 1990.  That's gotta be "better than average" right?  OU went 44-23-2 from 90-95.  KU was ranked in the top-10 when we whipped them in 95.  Oh, and we were the worst program in history when Snyds took over the first time.  We were a bowl team last year.  Not a great team but a far cry from the WOAT.  You really don't know much about Big 8 football, do you?

KSU didn't beat CU until 1997.  CU had a 5-6 record in 1997.  That's below average.  Before CU sank to that level of mediocrity they beat Snyder's team every single time.

KSU did not beat OU in 90, 91, or 92.  But in the five years from 93-98 when KSU swept OU their combined record was 27-30-1.  Again, below average.

KU in '95 was way overrated and everyone in purple was expecting that.  But it was a nice win.

Oh, and our WOAT program was almost as good as KU in the late 80's.  KU improved much quicker under Glen Mason than KSU did under Snyder but Mason was looking to bail out and Snyder sustained it. 

These are facts.

Offline hemmy

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 6676
  • RIP The After Party
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2011, 09:08:22 PM »
CU won an NC in 1990.  That's gotta be "better than average" right?  OU went 44-23-2 from 90-95.  KU was ranked in the top-10 when we whipped them in 95.  Oh, and we were the worst program in history when Snyds took over the first time.  We were a bowl team last year.  Not a great team but a far cry from the WOAT.  You really don't know much about Big 8 football, do you?

KSU didn't beat CU until 1997.  CU had a 5-6 record in 1997.  That's below average.  Before CU sank to that level of mediocrity they beat Snyder's team every single time.

KSU did not beat OU in 90, 91, or 92.  But in the five years from 93-98 when KSU swept OU their combined record was 27-30-1.  Again, below average.

KU in '95 was way overrated and everyone in purple was expecting that.  But it was a nice win.

Oh, and our WOAT program was almost as good as KU in the late 80's.  KU improved much quicker under Glen Mason than KSU did under Snyder but Mason was looking to bail out and Snyder sustained it.  

These are facts.


Actually we tied CU once...

Also, that Glen Mason crap is not a fact, his first 5 years were quite comparable to Snyder, but Snyder had a better record.

Offline Kat Kid

  • Global Moderator
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *****
  • Posts: 20533
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2011, 10:50:24 PM »
CU won an NC in 1990.  That's gotta be "better than average" right?  OU went 44-23-2 from 90-95.  KU was ranked in the top-10 when we whipped them in 95.  Oh, and we were the worst program in history when Snyds took over the first time.  We were a bowl team last year.  Not a great team but a far cry from the WOAT.  You really don't know much about Big 8 football, do you?

KSU didn't beat CU until 1997.  CU had a 5-6 record in 1997.  That's below average.  Before CU sank to that level of mediocrity they beat Snyder's team every single time.

KSU did not beat OU in 90, 91, or 92.  But in the five years from 93-98 when KSU swept OU their combined record was 27-30-1.  Again, below average.

KU in '95 was way overrated and everyone in purple was expecting that.  But it was a nice win.

Oh, and our WOAT program was almost as good as KU in the late 80's.  KU improved much quicker under Glen Mason than KSU did under Snyder but Mason was looking to bail out and Snyder sustained it.  

These are facts.


Actually we tied CU once...

Also, that Glen Mason crap is not a fact, his first 5 years were quite comparable to Snyder, but Snyder had a better record.

beat means win.

Offline TheHamburglar

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 5740
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2011, 11:02:35 PM »
CU won an NC in 1990.  That's gotta be "better than average" right?  OU went 44-23-2 from 90-95.  KU was ranked in the top-10 when we whipped them in 95.  Oh, and we were the worst program in history when Snyds took over the first time.  We were a bowl team last year.  Not a great team but a far cry from the WOAT.  You really don't know much about Big 8 football, do you?

KSU didn't beat CU until 1997.  CU had a 5-6 record in 1997.  That's below average.  Before CU sank to that level of mediocrity they beat Snyder's team every single time.

KSU did not beat OU in 90, 91, or 92.  But in the five years from 93-98 when KSU swept OU their combined record was 27-30-1.  Again, below average.

KU in '95 was way overrated and everyone in purple was expecting that.  But it was a nice win.

Oh, and our WOAT program was almost as good as KU in the late 80's.  KU improved much quicker under Glen Mason than KSU did under Snyder but Mason was looking to bail out and Snyder sustained it.  

These are facts.


Actually we tied CU once...

Also, that Glen Mason crap is not a fact, his first 5 years were quite comparable to Snyder, but Snyder had a better record.

beat means win.

See the statement in bold.  Thats the statement he's responding to, he has a valid point.
I got a guy on the other line about some white walls

Offline Ira Hayes

  • Created #RayRayForAD
  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 1985
  • The Marine that went to war.
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2011, 11:03:30 PM »
Yeah, I forgot about that tie with CU.  And that was more surprising than the 95 win over KU.

But what Stubblefield and Gilbert did to KSU was embarrassing.  And then they went and won the Aloha bowl.  KSU was behind at that point.

Offline jtksu

  • definitely not a racist piece of shit
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 3673
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #30 on: June 06, 2011, 12:19:28 AM »
We were behind a team that we beat by 28 pts?

Offline MichiganisGood

  • Maize and Blue'r
  • Combo-Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 317
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #31 on: June 06, 2011, 03:44:25 AM »
More long posts about Jim Tressel being a cheating slime bag please !!  :crossfingers:

Offline The Manhatter

  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 1100
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #32 on: June 06, 2011, 11:26:46 AM »
need to take note of what we see happening with LHCBS 2.0. Love listening to the nay sayers go into their same rhetoric (were they really RP supporters who still haven't come to their senses?) about the 2 and 3 star recruits.

If you go back and look at my post history you will see I am no purple glasses guy but I have to tell you that I see the sea starting to part again. Lets look at our big weaknesses from last year. Dline and QB. Clearly the bodies are either being brought in or moved to the right position to start to address the issues that kept our D from being able to stop even the Little Sisters of the Poor. Bill unlike RP understands how to get the most out of his roster. Moving Allred is a great one IMO and indicative of two things. 1)the Oline is in better shape in Bill's opinion than most think on this board and 2)(captain obvious)the Dline needs depth and quality upgrade. Simply getting the two returners plenty of rest to keep the quality of the snaps they do take up is huge but as Hatter has already noted, competition really does improve kids. Nothing like knowing the coaches have targeted your position with player moves and heavy recruiting to make most kids hit the offseason workouts harder to keep their position. I expect to see a better Kibble/Guidry next year. They showed periods of decent play but seemed to wear out by year end. Not surprising as minor injuries really start to wear on interior guys especially if they don't have good depth to keep their snap count down.

Looking at some of the new recruits at DE and DT the possibilities for seeing some quality depth emerge is exciting. Watching us collapse in the last half of the season to me really rotated around not having enough depth at Dline to let us play a straight up D all game. For example when Kirk was at DT the LBs were having to deal with OLine getting to the second level and you end up trying to overcompensate with either D play calling and/or players start 'reaching' outside their assignments. I can see some of the young DE types moving to DT if they aren't quick enough for D1 play in the open field. 20-30 Lbs addes to Seau and Hunter for example and we all of a sudden have big athletic DTs in the future. Would be great if they were D1 DEs but they have upside either way. I know a bit about Hunter and I am optimisitic that kid leaves KSU in five years as one outstanding DT. I look for him to RS and get bigger. Kid is the right type mentally for Bill's system. We may find by his senior year that we look back and say he was the gem in this class.

The QB situation is almost as good. Klein is smart and a worker. Bill has a track record with these type of kids. Think Brian Cavanaugh with much better wheels. Tuggle IMO will make huge strides this summer. What little I get from the inside ----most of my sources have dried up with minor exceptions---says that he is determined to be ready to beat out Klein by the fall. I fall in the camp on Sams that think he makes the field this year but not at QB. Bill knows he needs another bowl season to continue the growth and he will give up a RS if he thinks a kid will give us enough plays for an additional win. He is far more careful than RP however I will say RP was correct that recruiting is helped when kids know they can play ASAP. What little I hear on the recruiting pitch is that KSU is now talking that way to kids with some exceptions---mostly Olineman.

All in all if you aren't optimistic now you are simply someone who looks at the glass as half empty---each to his own but regardless the process is taking place and at least this year when you watch us take the field we are beginning to look like a team that belongs. I had a long time D1 coach tell me that if you really wanted to know where a program was at look at the 2nd and 3rd stringers. If you see some kids who could play D1 at some level (instead of D2) not getting on the field you had a roster that was ready to compete. The walk on level has clearly picked up. No more signing a Juco Defense intact ala the NEO signing LOL.


Snyder's at his best when he has 4 things, IMO... 1) a vertical passing game or at least a serious threat of it, 2) quality players/depth at the DL, 3) solid corners, 4) solid depth everywhere.

I think he's much closer this year than when he started at #'s 2 and 4.  Number 3 may occur this season and it would be aided if Darious Thomas returns (there is still a possibility that may occur IMO).  I think the vertical passing threat for this team is just not there.

Defensively, if it doesn't improve significantly this season then I'm completely assured Cosh needs to get out.  I gave him a half-hearted pass last season due to lack of depth, experience, and some playmaking ability.  He'll have enough this year to make significant strides..if that doesn't take place he needs to go some place far away or at the bottom of tuttle creek.  He has some good players coming into the program and, of course, Arthur Brown has the capability of being a major playmaker.  It should NOT be a piss poor defense this year.

Overall, Snyder was in a non-stop great mood this spring.  It's obvious to see he really likes the direction of his program at the moment.
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline wetwillie

  • goEMAW Poster of the WEEK
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *****
  • Posts: 30582
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #33 on: June 06, 2011, 11:30:10 AM »
need to take note of what we see happening with LHCBS 2.0. Love listening to the nay sayers go into their same rhetoric (were they really RP supporters who still haven't come to their senses?) about the 2 and 3 star recruits.

If you go back and look at my post history you will see I am no purple glasses guy but I have to tell you that I see the sea starting to part again. Lets look at our big weaknesses from last year. Dline and QB. Clearly the bodies are either being brought in or moved to the right position to start to address the issues that kept our D from being able to stop even the Little Sisters of the Poor. Bill unlike RP understands how to get the most out of his roster. Moving Allred is a great one IMO and indicative of two things. 1)the Oline is in better shape in Bill's opinion than most think on this board and 2)(captain obvious)the Dline needs depth and quality upgrade. Simply getting the two returners plenty of rest to keep the quality of the snaps they do take up is huge but as Hatter has already noted, competition really does improve kids. Nothing like knowing the coaches have targeted your position with player moves and heavy recruiting to make most kids hit the offseason workouts harder to keep their position. I expect to see a better Kibble/Guidry next year. They showed periods of decent play but seemed to wear out by year end. Not surprising as minor injuries really start to wear on interior guys especially if they don't have good depth to keep their snap count down.

Looking at some of the new recruits at DE and DT the possibilities for seeing some quality depth emerge is exciting. Watching us collapse in the last half of the season to me really rotated around not having enough depth at Dline to let us play a straight up D all game. For example when Kirk was at DT the LBs were having to deal with OLine getting to the second level and you end up trying to overcompensate with either D play calling and/or players start 'reaching' outside their assignments. I can see some of the young DE types moving to DT if they aren't quick enough for D1 play in the open field. 20-30 Lbs addes to Seau and Hunter for example and we all of a sudden have big athletic DTs in the future. Would be great if they were D1 DEs but they have upside either way. I know a bit about Hunter and I am optimisitic that kid leaves KSU in five years as one outstanding DT. I look for him to RS and get bigger. Kid is the right type mentally for Bill's system. We may find by his senior year that we look back and say he was the gem in this class.

The QB situation is almost as good. Klein is smart and a worker. Bill has a track record with these type of kids. Think Brian Cavanaugh with much better wheels. Tuggle IMO will make huge strides this summer. What little I get from the inside ----most of my sources have dried up with minor exceptions---says that he is determined to be ready to beat out Klein by the fall. I fall in the camp on Sams that think he makes the field this year but not at QB. Bill knows he needs another bowl season to continue the growth and he will give up a RS if he thinks a kid will give us enough plays for an additional win. He is far more careful than RP however I will say RP was correct that recruiting is helped when kids know they can play ASAP. What little I hear on the recruiting pitch is that KSU is now talking that way to kids with some exceptions---mostly Olineman.

All in all if you aren't optimistic now you are simply someone who looks at the glass as half empty---each to his own but regardless the process is taking place and at least this year when you watch us take the field we are beginning to look like a team that belongs. I had a long time D1 coach tell me that if you really wanted to know where a program was at look at the 2nd and 3rd stringers. If you see some kids who could play D1 at some level (instead of D2) not getting on the field you had a roster that was ready to compete. The walk on level has clearly picked up. No more signing a Juco Defense intact ala the NEO signing LOL.


Snyder's at his best when he has 4 things, IMO... 1) a vertical passing game or at least a serious threat of it, 2) quality players/depth at the DL, 3) solid corners, 4) solid depth everywhere.

I think he's much closer this year than when he started at #'s 2 and 4.  Number 3 may occur this season and it would be aided if Darious Thomas returns (there is still a possibility that may occur IMO).  I think the vertical passing threat for this team is just not there.

Defensively, if it doesn't improve significantly this season then I'm completely assured Cosh needs to get out.  I gave him a half-hearted pass last season due to lack of depth, experience, and some playmaking ability.  He'll have enough this year to make significant strides..if that doesn't take place he needs to go some place far away or at the bottom of tuttle creek.  He has some good players coming into the program and, of course, Arthur Brown has the capability of being a major playmaker.  It should NOT be a piss poor defense this year.

Overall, Snyder was in a non-stop great mood this spring.  It's obvious to see he really likes the direction of his program at the moment.

The Chamber feels differently about our vertical passing game
When the bullets are flying, that's when I'm at my best

Offline The Manhatter

  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 1100
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #34 on: June 06, 2011, 11:30:33 AM »
sd, one more thing.

Your comment on Sams.  All you need to do is look at the highlights on youtube of Salmen's other QB.  There are some plays by Sams shown on his highlight vid that are not included on Sams' vid.  Not sure why.  Anyway...if you watch that you are left w/ no question that he gets on the field THIS season as a wide receiver or somebody in Vanier has a hole in their head.  Seriously, some of the grabs he makes using the sideline boundary and a middle screen he converts to six (nabs it one handed)...he has playmaking potential at that position YESTERDAY.  Use it!
Academics is a stupid word.

Academic schools are synonymous for being rich, powerful and exclusive, three things Kansas State is not.

So when people throw the word "academics" around, that's really what they are referencing.

Offline Panjandrum

  • 5 o'clock Shadow Enthusiast
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 11221
  • Amateur magician and certified locksmith.
    • View Profile
    • Bring on the Cats [An SB Nation Blog]
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #35 on: June 06, 2011, 12:38:50 PM »
Snyder's at his best when he has 4 things, IMO... 1) a vertical passing game or at least a serious threat of it, 2) quality players/depth at the DL, 3) solid corners, 4) solid depth everywhere.

I would think that most coaches are at their best when they have all four of these things.  It's not exactly the Colonel's secret recipe of eleven herbs and spices, if you're pickin' up what I'm puttin' down.

Offline WillieWatanabe

  • PCKK7DC Survivor
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *******
  • Posts: 19316
  • We'll always have Salt Lake
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #36 on: June 06, 2011, 01:27:01 PM »
The Manhatter

 :thumbs:
Sometimes I think of the Book of Job and how God likes to really eff with people.
- chunkles

Offline MadCat

  • TIME's Person Of The Year - 2006
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 13773
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #37 on: June 06, 2011, 01:47:14 PM »
He's better than his best when he has the following:
5.) His son waiting in the wings ready to coach some heads off
6.) His grandson ready to earn his scholarship by bashing in some heads that have not been coached off already (non-flagrantly of course)
7.) Christopher Aberforth Effinghammer Cosh
8.) The LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium Family of Non-related Relatives cheering him on.  :lynchmob:

Offline Dugout DickStone

  • Global Moderator
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *****
  • Posts: 51718
  • BSPAC
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #38 on: June 06, 2011, 01:55:32 PM »
He's better than his best when he has the following:
5.) His son waiting in the wings ready to coach some heads off
6.) His grandson ready to earn his scholarship by bashing in some heads that have not been coached off already (non-flagrantly of course)
7.) Christopher Aberforth Effinghammer Cosh
8.) The LHC Bill Snyder Family Stadium Family of Non-related Relatives cheering him on.  :lynchmob:

 :lynchmob:

Offline kougar24

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 5380
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #39 on: June 06, 2011, 01:58:19 PM »
need to take note of what we see happening with LHCBS 2.0. Love listening to the nay sayers go into their same rhetoric (were they really RP supporters who still haven't come to their senses?) about the 2 and 3 star recruits.

If you go back and look at my post history you will see I am no purple glasses guy but I have to tell you that I see the sea starting to part again. Lets look at our big weaknesses from last year. Dline and QB. Clearly the bodies are either being brought in or moved to the right position to start to address the issues that kept our D from being able to stop even the Little Sisters of the Poor. Bill unlike RP understands how to get the most out of his roster. Moving Allred is a great one IMO and indicative of two things. 1)the Oline is in better shape in Bill's opinion than most think on this board and 2)(captain obvious)the Dline needs depth and quality upgrade. Simply getting the two returners plenty of rest to keep the quality of the snaps they do take up is huge but as Hatter has already noted, competition really does improve kids. Nothing like knowing the coaches have targeted your position with player moves and heavy recruiting to make most kids hit the offseason workouts harder to keep their position. I expect to see a better Kibble/Guidry next year. They showed periods of decent play but seemed to wear out by year end. Not surprising as minor injuries really start to wear on interior guys especially if they don't have good depth to keep their snap count down.

Looking at some of the new recruits at DE and DT the possibilities for seeing some quality depth emerge is exciting. Watching us collapse in the last half of the season to me really rotated around not having enough depth at Dline to let us play a straight up D all game. For example when Kirk was at DT the LBs were having to deal with OLine getting to the second level and you end up trying to overcompensate with either D play calling and/or players start 'reaching' outside their assignments. I can see some of the young DE types moving to DT if they aren't quick enough for D1 play in the open field. 20-30 Lbs addes to Seau and Hunter for example and we all of a sudden have big athletic DTs in the future. Would be great if they were D1 DEs but they have upside either way. I know a bit about Hunter and I am optimisitic that kid leaves KSU in five years as one outstanding DT. I look for him to RS and get bigger. Kid is the right type mentally for Bill's system. We may find by his senior year that we look back and say he was the gem in this class.

The QB situation is almost as good. Klein is smart and a worker. Bill has a track record with these type of kids. Think Brian Cavanaugh with much better wheels. Tuggle IMO will make huge strides this summer. What little I get from the inside ----most of my sources have dried up with minor exceptions---says that he is determined to be ready to beat out Klein by the fall. I fall in the camp on Sams that think he makes the field this year but not at QB. Bill knows he needs another bowl season to continue the growth and he will give up a RS if he thinks a kid will give us enough plays for an additional win. He is far more careful than RP however I will say RP was correct that recruiting is helped when kids know they can play ASAP. What little I hear on the recruiting pitch is that KSU is now talking that way to kids with some exceptions---mostly Olineman.

All in all if you aren't optimistic now you are simply someone who looks at the glass as half empty---each to his own but regardless the process is taking place and at least this year when you watch us take the field we are beginning to look like a team that belongs. I had a long time D1 coach tell me that if you really wanted to know where a program was at look at the 2nd and 3rd stringers. If you see some kids who could play D1 at some level (instead of D2) not getting on the field you had a roster that was ready to compete. The walk on level has clearly picked up. No more signing a Juco Defense intact ala the NEO signing LOL.


Offline Branson Bound

  • Good Christian Fan
  • Combo-Fan
  • **
  • Posts: 254
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #40 on: June 06, 2011, 04:40:00 PM »
Steve Dave seems pretty smart. I'm going to start listening to some of the things he has to say.
GET WELL SOON RANDY!


Offline MichiganisGood

  • Maize and Blue'r
  • Combo-Fan
  • *
  • Posts: 317
    • View Profile
Re: Folks who missed seeing the last Miracle as it built to summation
« Reply #41 on: June 06, 2011, 11:25:25 PM »
Steve Dave seems pretty smart. I'm going to start listening to some of the things he has to say.

Read his post on Tressel  :thumbsup: