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Offline ednksu

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O'Bannon v NCAA
« on: May 04, 2013, 08:13:18 AM »
How Ed O'Bannon's Lawsuit Would Dismantle The NCAA
Originally published in Bloomberg View.

The storm that’s slowly rolling toward Indianapolis quietly gained strength this week with the filing of several devastating documents in a federal court in California. If it stays on course, it’s going to hit with biblical force, reducing the National Collegiate Athletic Association to a heap of rubble.

This storm is also known as O’Bannon v. NCAA. It’s an antitrust lawsuit filed in 2009 by former UCLA All-American basketball player Ed O’Bannon and a handful of other ex-college athletes, who don’t think the NCAA should be profiting from their names and images without sharing the royalty payments.

In their latest filing, O’Bannon’s lawyers argue that the case deserves class-action status. If their request is granted, the NCAA would be liable for claims brought not just by the plaintiffs but also by all former athletes. Anyone who has ever played a Division I college sport would instantly be suing for damages for every instance in which his or her image was used in a video game, highlight reel, broadcast or rebroadcast.

That could get pretty expensive for the NCAA. But if the case were just about a few billion dollars, the association would have settled by now. It hasn’t because O’Bannon and his lawyers are also asking for something else: They want all current and future college athletes to be able to make licensing deals of their own. It’s short yardage from there to the NCAA’s doomsday scenario: schools bidding for the services of student-athletes.

The NCAA’s lawyers, of course, are trying everything they can think of to stop the case from earning class-action status. They’re so desperate that they’re resorted to idle threats, enlisting Big Ten commissioner Jim Delany to file a declaration stating that if the O’Bannon case were to result in student-athletes getting paid, his conference’s schools would probably opt out and move down to Division III. (Early line on the upcoming Amherst-Ohio State game: Buckeyes by 117 1/2.)

Delany’s statement says pretty much everything you need to know about the NCAA’s legal strategy. It’s called—and this not a legal term—fear-mongering.

The world of college sports would be radically different, the NCAA says—in ways we can’t even begin to predict!—if those responsible for making it a multibillion-dollar business (that is, the athletes) were entitled to receive some monetary compensation for their efforts. This is the same sort of doomsaying that Major League Baseball engaged in during its battle against free agency in 1970, when it warned that without the reserve clause, “professional baseball would simply cease to exist.” For that matter, every time an amateur sports event “goes pro”—whether it’s the Olympics, or golf and tennis’s majors—it has been preceded by predictions of disaster.

O’Bannon’s response to the NCAA may be the most powerful case ever assembled against the association’s propaganda machine. Among other things, it systematically dismantles the NCAA’s argument that the vast majority of its members lose money on sports. In fact, most Division I schools are not caught in an expensive arms race for coaches and athletic facilities. They have simply obscured the profitability of their football and basketball programs with accounting tricks, such as shifting revenue from sports concessions to the food service budget.

The NCAA advances these false claims of poverty so it can argue that its member schools can’t possibly afford to spend more money on sports, much less pay their athletes. O’Bannon’s lawyers put the lie to this, too, invoking foundational truths of economics dating to Adam Smith and David Ricardo: “Redistributing rents does not change true economic costs. It simply takes money from one person or group and shifts it to another.” Translation: Paying athletes wouldn’t result in schools spending additional money on sports. They would just spend less of it on coaches and facilities and more on students.

In truth, if the NCAA’s cartel were finally broken, the college-sports world of tomorrow would look…well, it would look a lot like the college-sports world of today. More student-athletes might decide to stay in school rather than gambling on the draft (a bad thing?). Maybe some second-tier schools would take a run at joining the first tier—not by shelling out $100 million for a new field house, but by spending a lot less on a few five-star recruits.

And that’s about the extent of it. The same schools that invest heavily in their sports teams now would continue to do so, much as the top recruits would continue to gravitate toward the biggest, richest programs. Most of all, fans would continue to watch the games.

The NCAA’s lawyers have one final chance to respond to O’Bannon’s request that the case be certified as a class action before the judge rules in June. Whatever happens from here, the O’Bannon case has already performed a valuable service: It has exposed a system whose sole purpose is to deny the value of talented athletes. That system and its overlord—the NCAA—both deserve to die.

Jonathan Mahler is a sports columnist for Bloomberg View. A long-time contributor to The New York Times Magazine, he is the author of the best-selling Ladies and Gentlemen, the Bronx Is Burning, The Challenge, and Death Comes to Happy Valley. He's @jonathanmahleron Twitter.
http://deadspin.com/how-ed-obannons-lawsuit-would-dismantle-the-ncaa-489241635


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Offline Pete

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O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2013, 08:57:56 AM »
Despite my obvious huge personal investment in college sports, I do acknowledge that sport really doesn't DESERVE a place in public education.

"Clubs" should play that role and schools should spend their money on education.

But, I do enjoy the current state of things quite a bit.

Offline sonofdaxjones

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2013, 12:02:33 PM »
I've mentioned it, others on here have mentioned it, but college athletics unending arms/financial/salary race was only going to keep tossing logs on the fire for a vocal minority, who as Pete said don't believe colleges should have these multi-multi million dollar athletic programs.   

 


Offline CNS

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2013, 12:28:13 PM »
The absolute best bbs'n could result

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Offline ednksu

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2013, 11:38:03 PM »
I've mentioned it, others on here have mentioned it, but college athletics unending arms/financial/salary race was only going to keep tossing logs on the fire for a vocal minority, who as Pete said don't believe colleges should have these multi-multi million dollar athletic programs.
I thought this pieces comments on the arms race being a shell game were interesting.
Quote from: OregonHawk
KU is right on par with Notre Dame ... when it comes to adding additional conference revenue

Quote from: Kim Carnes
Beer pro tip: never drink anything other than BL, coors, pbr, maybe a few others that I'm forgetting

Offline Skipper44

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2013, 04:22:10 PM »
While I sympathize with the players getting nothing while the coaches and admins are becoming multi millionaires, the fact they play for the universities is a huge factor in the players popularity. 

I am sure the average D league team is better than Louisville but nobody cares.  Minor league baseball has some good players but they all play in 10,000 seat or less stadiums for a reason. 


Offline wetwillie

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2013, 05:07:09 PM »
While I sympathize with the players getting nothing while the coaches and admins are becoming multi millionaires, the fact they play for the universities is a huge factor in the players popularity. 

I am sure the average D league team is better than Louisville but nobody cares.  Minor league baseball has some good players but they all play in 10,000 seat or less stadiums for a reason. 



The players get nothing?
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Offline jtksu

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2013, 05:15:03 PM »
I feel like the universities get far more in return than their investments in athletic programs. Obviously they make actual profits but also exposure. I know WSU's president stated that he expected their Final Four to bring much more in notoriety than actual money.

Offline Skipper44

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2013, 12:53:35 PM »
While I sympathize with the players getting nothing while the coaches and admins are becoming multi millionaires, the fact they play for the universities is a huge factor in the players popularity. 

I am sure the average D league team is better than Louisville but nobody cares.  Minor league baseball has some good players but they all play in 10,000 seat or less stadiums for a reason. 



The players get nothing?
nothing is definitely some hyperbole on my part but the $50k or less per year the athletic scholarship is still a small fraction of the millions coaches and now ADs are now making.

Offline jtksu

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #9 on: May 07, 2013, 01:29:09 PM »
While I sympathize with the players getting nothing while the coaches and admins are becoming multi millionaires, the fact they play for the universities is a huge factor in the players popularity. 

I am sure the average D league team is better than Louisville but nobody cares.  Minor league baseball has some good players but they all play in 10,000 seat or less stadiums for a reason. 



The players get nothing?
nothing is definitely some hyperbole on my part but the $50k or less per year the athletic scholarship is still a small fraction of the millions coaches and now ADs are now making.

Also, the scholarships will be worth a pretty significant amount of future earnings.  But I do agree it's pretty whack to make millions off these kids and give them a relative pittance in return.

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2013, 02:22:37 PM »
While I sympathize with the players getting nothing while the coaches and admins are becoming multi millionaires, the fact they play for the universities is a huge factor in the players popularity. 

I am sure the average D league team is better than Louisville but nobody cares.  Minor league baseball has some good players but they all play in 10,000 seat or less stadiums for a reason. 



The players get nothing?
nothing is definitely some hyperbole on my part but the $50k or less per year the athletic scholarship is still a small fraction of the millions coaches and now ADs are now making.

Also, the scholarships will be worth a pretty significant amount of future earnings.  But I do agree it's pretty whack to make millions off these kids and give them a relative pittance in return.

A lot of athletes get pass-through degrees. It's not like we're setting these kids up to climb the corporate ladder.

Offline CNS

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2013, 02:30:49 PM »
Don't even care if unis pay them or not., but vid games and things like that should pay those whose likenesses they are using.


Maybe allow players to opt in or out of the scholarship and those opting out can earn money off their name.

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2013, 02:39:33 PM »
Don't even care if unis pay them or not., but vid games and things like that should pay those whose likenesses they are using.


Maybe allow players to opt in or out of the scholarship and those opting out can earn money off their name.

I'm the opposite. The video game "likenesses" are different enough that they'll get away with that. But if you go into Varney's and buy a #22 K-State basketball jersey, you're buying that because it's Rodney McGruder's jersey. The schools are making millions on licensing for these jerseys.  If K-State sees you using their likeness, they send a C&D (see _FAN), but Rodney McGruder and Collin Klein see these places selling their jersey and their image, and they won't see a dime of it.

Offline CNS

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2013, 03:09:35 PM »
Don't even care if unis pay them or not., but vid games and things like that should pay those whose likenesses they are using.


Maybe allow players to opt in or out of the scholarship and those opting out can earn money off their name.

I'm the opposite. The video game "likenesses" are different enough that they'll get away with that. But if you go into Varney's and buy a #22 K-State basketball jersey, you're buying that because it's Rodney McGruder's jersey. The schools are making millions on licensing for these jerseys.  If K-State sees you using their likeness, they send a C&D (see _FAN), but Rodney McGruder and Collin Klein see these places selling their jersey and their image, and they won't see a dime of it.

I see the jersey as a tougher call since most of them don't have names on the back.  I get why #22 is popular, etc, but it is still KState on the front and there have been other #22's.

As for the games, the programmers create players to match attributes of individuals, look like individuals, etc.  That is Rodney, not just a number.


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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2013, 03:14:31 PM »
While I sympathize with the players getting nothing while the coaches and admins are becoming multi millionaires, the fact they play for the universities is a huge factor in the players popularity. 

I am sure the average D league team is better than Louisville but nobody cares.  Minor league baseball has some good players but they all play in 10,000 seat or less stadiums for a reason. 



The players get nothing?
nothing is definitely some hyperbole on my part but the $50k or less per year the athletic scholarship is still a small fraction of the millions coaches and now ADs are now making.

Also, the scholarships will be worth a pretty significant amount of future earnings.  But I do agree it's pretty whack to make millions off these kids and give them a relative pittance in return.

A lot of athletes get pass-through degrees. It's not like we're setting these kids up to climb the corporate ladder.

That's true for a certain percentage of athletes but I know quite a few personally who actually received legit degrees and went pro in something other than sports.

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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2013, 03:38:38 PM »
That system and its overlord—the NCAA—both deserve to die.

This seems excessive.




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Re: O'Bannon v NCAA
« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2013, 04:35:12 PM »
Don't even care if unis pay them or not., but vid games and things like that should pay those whose likenesses they are using.


Maybe allow players to opt in or out of the scholarship and those opting out can earn money off their name.

I'm the opposite. The video game "likenesses" are different enough that they'll get away with that. But if you go into Varney's and buy a #22 K-State basketball jersey, you're buying that because it's Rodney McGruder's jersey. The schools are making millions on licensing for these jerseys.  If K-State sees you using their likeness, they send a C&D (see _FAN), but Rodney McGruder and Collin Klein see these places selling their jersey and their image, and they won't see a dime of it.

I see the jersey as a tougher call since most of them don't have names on the back.  I get why #22 is popular, etc, but it is still KState on the front and there have been other #22's.

As for the games, the programmers create players to match attributes of individuals, look like individuals, etc.  That is Rodney, not just a number.

For the De'anthony Thomas' and Johnny Manziel's they do, but they pretty much randomize hometowns and physical characteristics other than skin color. If that were every contested, they'd pull out a team like UTEP and show that most of the players are randomized.  With the jerseys, there is a reason that they produce #22 basketball jerseys and #7 football jerseys, and not Vulture and Jared Loomis.  It's because they can capitalize on the popularity of McGruder and Klein and make boatloads of money.  I could definitely see them having to change those jerseys to a standard #1 jersey or some number that isn't in use.