Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 07, 2015, 09:08:30 PM
Post by: SdK on November 07, 2015, 09:14:34 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 07, 2015, 09:15:08 PM
Ok, just read that to get caught up. Maybe this thread shouldn't be on the football board, mods, mod as needed.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 07, 2015, 09:15:21 PM
Did you ask google?
yes. reading now.
Post by: scottwildcat on November 07, 2015, 09:15:28 PM
Post by: SdK on November 07, 2015, 09:15:49 PM
Me too.Did you ask google?
yes. reading now.
Post by: SdK on November 07, 2015, 09:16:15 PM
i've been trying to figure out what exactly happened, but from what i have picked up the Mizzou University President is a racist, sexist, POS.That's what I'm reading. Go Mizzou!
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 07, 2015, 09:20:11 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 07, 2015, 09:28:24 PM
Post by: wetwillie on November 07, 2015, 09:49:50 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 07, 2015, 11:11:14 PM
I guess they weren't mad enough to go on strike until after their game on Thursday night.
I think you need to familiarize yourself with the time frame here before being glib. I've read quite a bit about this and I still can't wrap my hands around it.
I'd also be very careful about calling the president racist and sexist, it seems as if he is guilty of inaction and ineffectiveness. The stuff about planned parenthood, stem cell research and allowing politicians to govern campus policy is really important in this situation as well but it will get lost in the racial component.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 07, 2015, 11:21:51 PM
warning: do not, I repeat, do not listen to BITB Monday at 2 PM.Can't wait!
Post by: MakeItRain on November 07, 2015, 11:28:05 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 07, 2015, 11:46:10 PM
I guess they weren't mad enough to go on strike until after their game on Thursday night.
I think you need to familiarize yourself with the time frame here before being glib. I've read quite a bit about this and I still can't wrap my hands around it.
I'd also be very careful about calling the president racist and sexist, it seems as if he is guilty of inaction and ineffectiveness. The stuff about planned parenthood, stem cell research and allowing politicians to govern campus policy is really important in this situation as well but it will get lost in the racial component.
i'm glad you posted this.
and just to ask the question because i have not heard anything about this until tonight, what action do people feel the president should have taken? besides issuing statements that say "this was wrong", i'm not sure he has any power over the situation. perhaps i'm wrong though.
Post by: Spracne on November 08, 2015, 12:29:50 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 01:52:04 AM
I understand his frustration, but I disagree with his strategy. He is certainly bringing a lot of attention on himself, but perhaps to the detriment of his cause.
Quite obviously it isn't to the detriment of his cause, people around the country have been talking about it, it's on this board because a sports component was just added but this has been discussed elsewhere. Also the president literally did or said nothing until this man was days into his hunger strike. Also saying he's bringing attention to himself seems incredibly dismissive. He is literally starving himself to death, he isn't standing on the presidents lawn with a boom box over his head, it clearly isn't about him. I don't know of anything I care anough about to starve myself and I have kids. I'd give my life for my kids but I couldn't starve myself, thats a sense of dedication that an elite few can muster up about anything.
Here are some articles that discuss some of the layers of this and shows timeframes:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/11/06/black-grad-student-on-hunger-strike-in-mo-after-swastika-drawn-with-human-feces/
http://www.columbiamissourian.com/news/higher_education/racial-climate-at-mu-a-timeline-of-incidents-to-date/article_0c96f986-84c6-11e5-a38f-2bd0aab0bf74.html
http://www.kansascity.com/opinion/opn-columns-blogs/barbara-shelly/article43274403.html
Post by: stunted on November 08, 2015, 05:00:03 AM
there's other minority groups that faced a lot of hardship and racism. but they didn't complain, worked hard, and shock - they created a better life for themselves and future generations.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 08:56:01 AM
Post by: Functianalyst on November 08, 2015, 09:21:09 AM
Post by: CNS on November 08, 2015, 09:24:44 AM
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Post by: The Big Train on November 08, 2015, 09:44:39 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 09:47:51 AM
Post by: BackPayne on November 08, 2015, 09:48:39 AM
What the eff is wrong with you
I 2nd this.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 08, 2015, 09:54:01 AM
:love:
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 09:59:33 AM
(https://www.themizzoustore.com/images/Product/medium/195747.jpg)
Post by: CNS on November 08, 2015, 10:00:02 AM
Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 10:01:30 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 10:11:56 AM
This may be only the beginning. I am hopeful that black players and people of color, across the nation including pro sports show their solidarity in stopping the sill racism in this country once and for all. Personally I would like to see a season where there was no black participation in all level of sports, to give the US an idea of where we would be without black athletes and black people. Sorry for the rant.
lol, were you attempting to be clever? Nothing is forcing you to watch, seems like you need to be entertained by black people a hell of a lot more than black people need you; you certainly won't be missed.
Post by: mocat on November 08, 2015, 10:19:35 AM
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 10:21:23 AM
Wait two random dudes said the n word, so everybody goes after the missouri system president? What did I miss?it's more complicated than that. read MIR's stories.
Post by: Functianalyst on November 08, 2015, 10:53:27 AM
You idiot it's not about watching black players, it's about watching your team compete. If you think that K-State can compete without black players, post that for all to see.This may be only the beginning. I am hopeful that black players and people of color, across the nation including pro sports show their solidarity in stopping the sill racism in this country once and for all. Personally I would like to see a season where there was no black participation in all level of sports, to give the US an idea of where we would be without black athletes and black people. Sorry for the rant.
lol, were you attempting to be clever? Nothing is forcing you to watch, seems like you need to be entertained by black people a hell of a lot more than black people need you; you certainly won't be missed.
Post by: chum1 on November 08, 2015, 11:09:03 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 11:13:50 AM
Wait two random dudes said the n word, so everybody goes after the missouri system president? What did I miss?it's more complicated than that. read MIR's stories.
It's also worth noting that this issue apparently isn't new and seems to be systematic, this is just apparently the last straw and there are people around that refuse to accept the status quo. David Ubben, he's a Mizzou grad, and Kim English's twitter feeds are :sdeek: with stories of the stuff that has been happening there.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 11:17:36 AM
The students don't really have a clear message out, so their efforts sort of come across as silly - like the gravely significant issue at hand is being able to have a pleasant campus experience. But, you know, they're students.
Ummmm, seems clear to me, they did have a list of eight demands. Did you read those articles and couldn't figure out that their issue is that the administration has been silent on historical and systematic racism and now the solution is the removal of said administration?
Post by: Kat Kid on November 08, 2015, 11:24:15 AM
good way to get a lot of attention, feel like they're changing the world, etc.
there's other minority groups that faced a lot of hardship and racism. but they didn't complain, worked hard, and shock - they created a better life for themselves and future generations.
Yep, lots of other groups in the United States that were enslaved, subject to overt discrimination for the next 100 years specifically designed to keep them poor, socially subservient and educationally inferior.
What are you even talking about?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 11:29:23 AM
This is just another extension of the epidemic of ridiculous, over the top PC outrage gripping college campuses. The only way to stop it is to denounce it. Instead we pander to it with fawning media coverage.
Finally, a swastika made out of human crap? It's certainly possible that this could be a genuine "hate crime," but how many fake ones is it going to take before we treat these with skepticism?
Post by: chum1 on November 08, 2015, 11:32:20 AM
The students don't really have a clear message out, so their efforts sort of come across as silly - like the gravely significant issue at hand is being able to have a pleasant campus experience. But, you know, they're students.
Ummmm, seems clear to me, they did have a list of eight demands. Did you read those articles and couldn't figure out that their issue is that the administration has been silent on historical and systematic racism and now the solution is the removal of said administration?
So, the gravely significant issue at hand is having an administration that says things the students think it should say?
Post by: chum1 on November 08, 2015, 11:52:00 AM
:rolleyes:The students don't really have a clear message out, so their efforts sort of come across as silly - like the gravely significant issue at hand is being able to have a pleasant campus experience. But, you know, they're students.
Ummmm, seems clear to me, they did have a list of eight demands. Did you read those articles and couldn't figure out that their issue is that the administration has been silent on historical and systematic racism and now the solution is the removal of said administration?
So, the gravely significant issue at hand is having an administration that says things the students think it should say?
Care to take a stab at clearly stating why they're pissed? It isn't easy.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 11:52:41 AM
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 11:56:05 AM
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 11:56:41 AM
It takes ever heightend levels of outrage to get attention in Outraged Nation. So much so that real issues are just getting drowned out.What are the "real issues" getting drowned out?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 11:58:21 AM
Care to take a stab at clearly stating why they're pissed? It isn't easy.
It seems to just be the normal list of BLM grievances. I saw specific reference to Michael Brown / Ferguson. That's your first warning flag. If you're still holding to the belief that Michael Brown was an innocent person trying to surrender, gunned down for being black, despite all evidence to the contrary, you're a nut.
Also, I appreciate that chum is demonstrating some scepticism ITT. :cheers:
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 11:58:43 AM
https://twitter.com/GaryPinkel/status/663410502370856960
Post by: Kat Kid on November 08, 2015, 11:59:41 AM
Wait, Pinkel supporting this? Wow.
https://twitter.com/GaryPinkel/status/663410502370856960
Doesn't he have a weekly segment on Kietz's show? How amazing will that be?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 12:01:45 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 12:03:34 PM
cRusty, this publicity stunt will get days upon days worth of play in every news outlet in the country, while one human tragedy after another caused by actual real issues will get ignored.
I asked what you consider to be the "real issues"
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 12:05:16 PM
Care to take a stab at clearly stating why they're pissed? It isn't easy.
It seems to just be the normal list of BLM grievances. I saw specific reference to Michael Brown / Ferguson. That's your first warning flag. If you're still holding to the belief that Michael Brown was an innocent person trying to surrender, gunned down for being black, despite all evidence to the contrary, you're a nut.
Also, I appreciate that chum is demonstrating some scepticism ITT. :cheers:
There was no reference to Ferguson in their demands.
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 12:06:43 PM
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 08, 2015, 12:10:46 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 12:18:58 PM
The students don't really have a clear message out, so their efforts sort of come across as silly - like the gravely significant issue at hand is being able to have a pleasant campus experience. But, you know, they're students.
Ummmm, seems clear to me, they did have a list of eight demands. Did you read those articles and couldn't figure out that their issue is that the administration has been silent on historical and systematic racism and now the solution is the removal of said administration?
So, the gravely significant issue at hand is having an administration that says things the students think it should say?
They didn't say anything though, it took a guy starving himself to death to even get boilerplate
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 12:22:10 PM
Care to take a stab at clearly stating why they're pissed? It isn't easy.
It seems to just be the normal list of BLM grievances. I saw specific reference to Michael Brown / Ferguson. That's your first warning flag. If you're still holding to the belief that Michael Brown was an innocent person trying to surrender, gunned down for being black, despite all evidence to the contrary, you're a nut.
Also, I appreciate that chum is demonstrating some scepticism ITT. :cheers:
There was no reference to Ferguson in their demands.
I was talking about hunger strike loon. He says his activism started with Ferguson and he is upset the university didn't "do more."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/11/06/black-grad-student-on-hunger-strike-in-mo-after-swastika-drawn-with-human-feces/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/11/06/black-grad-student-on-hunger-strike-in-mo-after-swastika-drawn-with-human-feces/)
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 12:24:11 PM
Mizzou's game against BYU next week at arrowhead is a "whiteout."
(https://www.themizzoustore.com/images/Product/medium/195747.jpg)
my dear lord...
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 12:25:21 PM
:rolleyes:The students don't really have a clear message out, so their efforts sort of come across as silly - like the gravely significant issue at hand is being able to have a pleasant campus experience. But, you know, they're students.
Ummmm, seems clear to me, they did have a list of eight demands. Did you read those articles and couldn't figure out that their issue is that the administration has been silent on historical and systematic racism and now the solution is the removal of said administration?
So, the gravely significant issue at hand is having an administration that says things the students think it should say?
Care to take a stab at clearly stating why they're pissed? It isn't easy.
You're right, it's complicated, I said that with my first post. Again, reading stuff from Missouri and people associated with Mizzou they seem to have a firm grasp of what their issues are. If they are sincere with this issue, and it seems clear that they are, it isn't important for them to make this issue clear with people hundreds of miles away who haven't been on that campus and see things through your eyes. Just because it isn't clear to you and me doesn't make it less important to them. This isn't for or about us.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 12:28:22 PM
Wait, Pinkel supporting this? Wow.
https://twitter.com/GaryPinkel/status/663410502370856960
What does that say about Missouri's administration? I assume there is a division within.
The KC Star link indicates that there are issues within the administration with this and other issues. Kim English's twitter timeline also indicates that there has been trouble going back to the hiring of R. Bowen Loftin.
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 12:30:38 PM
Just because it isn't clear to you and me doesn't make it less important to them. This isn't for or about us.Well, i mean, some of it is. The football team going on strike is, at least in part, an attempt to garner broader attention to the issue (and a very successful one at that!). Now that they have the nation's attention, I think "wait what exactly is the problem?" is a fair response.
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 08, 2015, 12:31:06 PM
Post by: Kat Kid on November 08, 2015, 12:33:06 PM
Just because it isn't clear to you and me doesn't make it less important to them. This isn't for or about us.Well, i mean, some of it is. The football team going on strike is, at least in part, an attempt to garner broader attention to the issue (and a very successful one at that!). Now that they have the nation's attention, I think "wait what exactly is the problem?" is a fair response.
The have listed demands. You can find those if you are interested. I think understanding the context and the campus climate is difficult to do as not much media attention has really yet been created. I think you will have good reporting soon that will make that more clear.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 12:33:46 PM
Care to take a stab at clearly stating why they're pissed? It isn't easy.
It seems to just be the normal list of BLM grievances. I saw specific reference to Michael Brown / Ferguson. That's your first warning flag. If you're still holding to the belief that Michael Brown was an innocent person trying to surrender, gunned down for being black, despite all evidence to the contrary, you're a nut.
Also, I appreciate that chum is demonstrating some scepticism ITT. :cheers:
There was no reference to Ferguson in their demands.
I was talking about hunger strike loon. He says his activism started with Ferguson and he is upset the university didn't "do more."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/11/06/black-grad-student-on-hunger-strike-in-mo-after-swastika-drawn-with-human-feces/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/11/06/black-grad-student-on-hunger-strike-in-mo-after-swastika-drawn-with-human-feces/)
Why is he a loon? Are you so blind and intolerant of the thoughts and views of others that you can't appreciate the desperation of this man and the extreme length he feels like he needs to go so that he can be heard?
Also I'm guessing chum isn't counting you as an ally, his questions are far different from your proclamations.
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 12:36:30 PM
Right but the listed demands don't really give any context.Just because it isn't clear to you and me doesn't make it less important to them. This isn't for or about us.Well, i mean, some of it is. The football team going on strike is, at least in part, an attempt to garner broader attention to the issue (and a very successful one at that!). Now that they have the nation's attention, I think "wait what exactly is the problem?" is a fair response.
The have listed demands. You can find those if you are interested. I think understanding the context and the campus climate is difficult to do as not much media attention has really yet been created. I think you will have good reporting soon that will make that more clear.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 12:37:30 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 08, 2015, 12:39:19 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 12:40:46 PM
Just because it isn't clear to you and me doesn't make it less important to them. This isn't for or about us.Well, i mean, some of it is. The football team going on strike is, at least in part, an attempt to garner broader attention to the issue (and a very successful one at that!). Now that they have the nation's attention, I think "wait what exactly is the problem?" is a fair response.
No one ask those football players to join the protest, they were going to protest the football game which is a direct protest against the football game. I don't think anyone is in the position to judge their motives other than what they described they were, they're also tired and they want to support their peers. Just because they got media attention doesn't mean they sought it out.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 12:44:04 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 12:45:15 PM
No one ask those football players to join the protest, they were going to protest the football game which is a direct protest against the football game. I don't think anyone is in the position to judge their motives other than what they described they were, they're also tired and they want to support their peers. Just because they got media attention doesn't mean they sought it out.That's a fair point, I guess.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 12:45:39 PM
Right but the listed demands don't really give any context.Just because it isn't clear to you and me doesn't make it less important to them. This isn't for or about us.Well, i mean, some of it is. The football team going on strike is, at least in part, an attempt to garner broader attention to the issue (and a very successful one at that!). Now that they have the nation's attention, I think "wait what exactly is the problem?" is a fair response.
The have listed demands. You can find those if you are interested. I think understanding the context and the campus climate is difficult to do as not much media attention has really yet been created. I think you will have good reporting soon that will make that more clear.
The context is the swastika and the two incidents of people being called niggers in the open on campus followed by inaction by the administration. Again worth noting that things like this aren't new to that campus.
Maybe sorta related but did anyone see anonymous' list of doxxed kkk members? It was very Missouri heavy.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 12:48:24 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 12:48:58 PM
Ok I read the demands. I cannot fully empathize with the students, since I'm not a minority, but it seems to me the demands are going to be hard to meet, and they seem a bit misguided. I don't see how they can just increase the staff of the university to 10% African American? How will that happen? Also, what's the percentage now? If its 9.5% that's one thing but what if its 3%? I don't get how that will work. Also, the demand is an apology, an admintance of his white male privalege, and then for the guy to get fired? Why would he do number 1 if he was going to get fired anyway?I'm guessing that if he gave an apology and put a reasonable plan in place to increase minority hiring most the football strike would end.
Post by: The Big Train on November 08, 2015, 12:49:29 PM
Maybe sorta related but did anyone see anonymous' list of doxxed kkk members? It was very Missouri heavy.
i was very happy when they started taking over those twitter accounts and outing those POS people
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 12:57:31 PM
Ok I read the demands. I cannot fully empathize with the students, since I'm not a minority, but it seems to me the demands are going to be hard to meet, and they seem a bit misguided. I don't see how they can just increase the staff of the university to 10% African American? How will that happen? Also, what's the percentage now? If its 9.5% that's one thing but what if its 3%? I don't get how that will work. Also, the demand is an apology, an admintance of his white male privalege, and then for the guy to get fired? Why would he do number 1 if he was going to get fired anyway?
The demands aren't hard to meet IMO, the time frame was questionable but that's why they negotiated, the negotiation resulted in the system president saying no to everything, that's inexcusable, there are some things on that list that can be enacted today.
BTW, as of fall of 2014 African Americans make up 11% of the state's population, 7% of the students on campus, but only 3% of the school's full time faculty.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 01:00:07 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 01:03:07 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 01:03:49 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
should they do that with football scholarships too?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 01:04:49 PM
https://twitter.com/bomani_jones/status/663186744876007426
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 01:08:41 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
should they do that with football scholarships too?
That's a ridiculous false equivalency, but do white football players have a historic and systematic difficulty getting football scholarships?
I could interpret your viewpoint on this as you believing that the university can't find enough qualified teachers to have a representative percentage of black faculty, but I won't do that.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 01:12:10 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 08, 2015, 01:13:32 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
should they do that with football scholarships too?
That's a ridiculous false equivalency, but do white football players have a historic and systematic difficulty getting football scholarships?
I could interpret your viewpoint on this as you believing that the university can't find enough qualified teachers to have a representative percentage of black faculty, but I won't do that.
you could also make an argument that if its as bad there as we are all hearing, that minorities in general wouldnt want to work there. i mean if you cant even walk across campus without running in to that, why would you want to work there?
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 01:16:53 PM
That's a pretty stupid argument. But I suppose you can make it if you want to.And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
should they do that with football scholarships too?
That's a ridiculous false equivalency, but do white football players have a historic and systematic difficulty getting football scholarships?
I could interpret your viewpoint on this as you believing that the university can't find enough qualified teachers to have a representative percentage of black faculty, but I won't do that.
you could also make an argument that if its as bad there as we are all hearing, that minorities in general wouldnt want to work there. i mean if you cant even walk across campus without running in to that, why would you want to work there?
Post by: The Big Train on November 08, 2015, 01:18:12 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 01:18:52 PM
Post by: CNS on November 08, 2015, 01:28:20 PM
i just dont understand why everyone cant be friends, like, it would solve a bunch of problems if everyone was just buds with one anotherOr at very least not actively being assholes to ppl you dont want to associate with.
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Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 01:32:56 PM
Post by: CNS on November 08, 2015, 01:35:19 PM
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Post by: CNS on November 08, 2015, 01:39:01 PM
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Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 01:39:27 PM
That's a pretty stupid argument. But I suppose you can make it if you want to.And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
should they do that with football scholarships too?
That's a ridiculous false equivalency, but do white football players have a historic and systematic difficulty getting football scholarships?
I could interpret your viewpoint on this as you believing that the university can't find enough qualified teachers to have a representative percentage of black faculty, but I won't do that.
you could also make an argument that if its as bad there as we are all hearing, that minorities in general wouldnt want to work there. i mean if you cant even walk across campus without running in to that, why would you want to work there?
I actually agree with tbt. A perceived hostile work environment would absolutely cut into the number of qualified minority applicants they get. That burden falls on the administration to fix, it isn't the fault of the minority candidates.
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 01:45:37 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 01:46:02 PM
My point is if there's an opening for an English teacher, they should take applications and then hire someone. I'm sure there's plenty of quailfied people out there for those jobs, black white or other. To mandate a percentage is not something I'd do.
Cartier, people get jobs all of the time not based on merit. This is a college campus they graduate qualified minority applicants for these jobs every semester. Hiring percentages are asked for because it has been proven time and time again that without them minority candidates won't be given a fair shot. Add to that Missouri's history and the fact that minorities are also underrepresented in the decision making of the hiring process, you are out of your mind if you think that the process it's fair and at least some qualified minority candidates are given equal opportunity.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 01:47:18 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
Or they could just focus on hiring the most qualified people.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 01:48:53 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 01:49:37 PM
Yeah I thought he was making the argument to say the conditions really weren't all that bad if people of color wanted to work there
I hope he wasn't saying that, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt. If he were I'd use his point and cartiers to springboard into inferior opportunities minorities are forced to take to even get a chance.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 08, 2015, 01:50:38 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 01:50:55 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
Or they could just focus on hiring the most qualified people.
Man, that'd be nice wouldn't it?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 01:56:01 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
Or they could just focus on hiring the most qualified people.
Man, that'd be nice wouldn't it?
Says the guy who favors hiring quotas based on skin pigmentation.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 08, 2015, 01:56:52 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 08, 2015, 01:57:39 PM
Yeah I thought he was making the argument to say the conditions really weren't all that bad if people of color wanted to work there
I hope he wasn't saying that, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt. If he were I'd use his point and cartiers to springboard into inferior opportunities minorities are forced to take to even get a chance.
you understood my point, mich didnt
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 02:00:02 PM
My point is if there's an opening for an English teacher, they should take applications and then hire someone. I'm sure there's plenty of quailfied people out there for those jobs, black white or other. To mandate a percentage is not something I'd do.
Cartier, people get jobs all of the time not based on merit. This is a college campus they graduate qualified minority applicants for these jobs every semester. Hiring percentages are asked for because it has been proven time and time again that without them minority candidates won't be given a fair shot. Add to that Missouri's history and the fact that minorities are also underrepresented in the decision making of the hiring process, you are out of your mind if you think that the process it's fair and at least some qualified minority candidates are given equal opportunity.
ok
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 02:03:12 PM
Yep, my mistake!Yeah I thought he was making the argument to say the conditions really weren't all that bad if people of color wanted to work there
I hope he wasn't saying that, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt. If he were I'd use his point and cartiers to springboard into inferior opportunities minorities are forced to take to even get a chance.
you understood my point, mich didnt
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 02:05:09 PM
I suppose it could be argued that college students were always this juvenile, only it's now being memorialized forever online. But I think the kids are getting worse. It's a toxic mixture of entitlement and immaturity, and the colleges are just enabling it. They are not doing these children a service.
Post by: chum1 on November 08, 2015, 02:11:07 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 08, 2015, 02:11:40 PM
Post by: CNS on November 08, 2015, 02:13:49 PM
Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 02:15:22 PM
Yeah, not wanting crap swastikas and being called a n-word on campus is very entitled and immature.I'd bet that Wolfe also opposes crap swastikas and racial epithets.
Post by: CNS on November 08, 2015, 02:16:26 PM
Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk
Post by: star seed 7 on November 08, 2015, 02:17:21 PM
Yeah, not wanting crap swastikas and being called a n-word on campus is very entitled and immature.I'd bet that Wolfe also opposes crap swastikas and racial epithets.
I suspect you're correct
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 02:19:31 PM
And population percentages should be equally reflected in a university's staff? I don't agree with that.It seems reasonable for a public institution to at least make an effort to achieve that goal.
Or they could just focus on hiring the most qualified people.
Man, that'd be nice wouldn't it?
Says the guy who favors hiring quotas based on skin pigmentation.
I said that?
Post by: chum1 on November 08, 2015, 02:25:08 PM
Post by: wetwillie on November 08, 2015, 02:30:17 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 03:06:35 PM
So I have always been of the opinion that in some ways I have got to experience some form of white privilege because of where I grew up. I mean I had to deal with things like my girlfriend's parents once calling me to their house to have dinner and to tell us about how miserable our lives are going to be because they have friends and neighbors that would kill their daughter's boyfriend if he were black and that no one wants zebra babies and I will never be able to be able to support a family because no one in Kansas will hire a black to do anything but manual labor. But because I didn't grow up around black people, other than my family of course, I learned to assimilate with the people around me, it wasn't even assimilating but it is just all I knew. So when I got older and I was around white people I didn't feel terribly uncomfortable because that was and has been my life. I grew up in Kansas and as an adult I lived in Carrollton, TX, Maine, Boston, New Hampshire, an rural Iowa. So when I meet black people who have to interact with a majority of white people when they haven't to this point in their lives I feel a twinge of guilt.
So there were two times in my life, obviously there have been more, but these two times I am going to talk about were times when white privilege slapped me in the face and both were job related. The first concurred when I was in high school, it was the summer before my junior year and I had a job but I wanted another one because I wanted to save up to buy a car. At the time there were five black boys at Garden City High School out of nearly 2000 students, I was good friends with two of them. Me and one of the other black guys, who also had a job but was looking for another one at the time decided to apply for a job at Meyers Ice, I think they are still around. Anyway they advertised that they were looking for high schoolers for seasonal help. Me and my friend that went in to apply, we didn't go in together, had both had work experience. I had a job non stop from the time I was 12 until now, and he had the same job for three years before we applied. Well the gentleman hiring at Meyers Ice didn't hire either of us, he ended up hiring three white kids, two of which were good friends of mine, none of them had ever had a job before, two of them were physically significantly smaller than us which is odd for a job that required you to move blocks and bags of ice all day. As if there were any doubt that we weren't hired because we were black, all doubt was removed when the guys were told that some niggers tried to get that job.
Some of you may know that I am a camp director. I have worked in this field for 15 years. I used to work in New England, for those of you that don't know the camping field, working at private camps in New England is like coaching football in the SEC, it's undoubtedly the best of the best. I spent 7 years working at a coed camp with tuition of $10,000 a summer. I was the head counselor which at this camp is essentially the offensive line or quarterbacks coach. When you work in private for-profit camping a lot of your time in the offseason is spent with recruiting campers, again very similar to coaching football. After seven years at this camp I got the opportunity to go to a similar camp, but all boys to be the assistant director; essentially the offensive coordinator. I happily took the position as it put me one step closer to becoming a director. After about six months on the job it was very obvious that although I was the offensive coordinator, one of the people working under me, 10 years my junior in age and experience, was essentially the director in waiting. Now this person was the current owner/director's daughter so I wasn't completely pissed but I couldn't stay at a position that I had no chance of advancing in. After two years I decided to start looking for a director's job. I was point blank told that as a black man I didn't stand much of a chance of getting a job in the liberal northeast because it would be tough for parents and referral agents to send their kids to me. I also failed to mention that I was also told by one of these directors that I was the "whitest black guy they have ever met," this happened in a professional setting. I had great references and recommendations from some of the most well thought of people in this industry yet I couldn't get an owner of a private camp to believe in me, all because of the color of my skin. Now I am the director of a non for profit agency camp in Iowa which is the equivalency of being the head coach of a division three school.
The point of all of this is that white privilege absolutely exists no matter how some people want to deny it's existence. Look at college and pro sports coaches, these are the most public of jobs you can have in this country. Look at the opportunities black coaches get, look at what happens when they fail then compare that with white coaches that fail. There simply isn't the same opportunities afforded minority coaches and the same amount of rope given to succeed, this isn't even in doubt. So if it is this way with the very public hiring and firing of sports team coaches, how do you think it is in the private sector where there is no attention, no scrutiny? There is simply no way it can be better.
Thanks for listening.
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 03:12:40 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2015, 03:20:28 PM
But yeah, I enjoyed that post.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 08, 2015, 04:08:53 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 04:10:56 PM
My wife and I both work at jobs with black coworkers and black managers, some of whom outrank us. They're doing just fine. So are we. Race is not an issue. People are just living their lives, doing their jobs.
At my company, the owners son is drawing a paycheck to basically do nothing and one day he'll be on the board. Who the eff cares? Good for him. I'll live my life and he can live his.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 08, 2015, 04:25:02 PM
Wow MIR, sounds like you've had some shitty experiences. But it sounds like you kinda just lived your life and went about finding a job where you didn't have to put up with that crap. Good for you. You know what probably wouldn't have helped? Going on hunger strike until your demands were met, like the resignation of some white camp owner you probably never even met. Why can't people just live their lives and ignore all the real and not so real unfairness? Life's not fair. Bitching about it gets you nowhere.
My wife and I both work at jobs with black coworkers and black managers, some of whom outrank us. They're doing just fine. So are we. Race is not an issue. People are just living their lives, doing their jobs.
At my company, the owners son is drawing a paycheck to basically do nothing and one day he'll be on the board. Who the eff cares? Good for him. I'll live my life and he can live his.
Is it your opinion that collective action to protest injustice has never been successful?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 04:33:37 PM
Wow MIR, sounds like you've had some shitty experiences. But it sounds like you kinda just lived your life and went about finding a job where you didn't have to put up with that crap. Good for you. You know what probably wouldn't have helped? Going on hunger strike until your demands were met, like the resignation of some white camp owner you probably never even met. Why can't people just live their lives and ignore all the real and not so real unfairness? Life's not fair. Bitching about it gets you nowhere.
My wife and I both work at jobs with black coworkers and black managers, some of whom outrank us. They're doing just fine. So are we. Race is not an issue. People are just living their lives, doing their jobs.
At my company, the owners son is drawing a paycheck to basically do nothing and one day he'll be on the board. Who the eff cares? Good for him. I'll live my life and he can live his.
You missed the point, every point it seems. Should I just be happy that I have a job far beneath my skill and my accomplishments, because I'm not. I wish I had the conviction to go on a hunger strike for injustice and inequality because I certainly would. I have kids and I want things to be better for them that it was for me. I have no idea why you went to the comparison of "some white camp owner I have never met" the gentleman having a hunger strike has met the system president, more than once. Clearly the hunger strike has had some affect, the country is talking about this and the administration is feeling pressure.
Also your little life is not fair rant is trite and insulting. I also never insisted that african americans aren't managers and decision makers so I'm not sure why your story about blacks who "outrank" you is relevant. I'm in charge, I make the rules, I hire and fire; none of that has a damn thing to do with equal opportunity I have no idea how you can't see that.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 08, 2015, 04:57:03 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 08, 2015, 04:58:54 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 06:00:43 PM
So, if the Missouri football team forfeits the rest of their season, how pissed is the SEC going to be? There's a lot of money in the television contracts.
That money is already distributed. I wonder if the SEC would make the university reimburse gate revenue for any road games that would be cancelled. Likewise I wonder if camarohead would try to recoup money for missed revenue from this weekend's game.
Post by: TownieCat on November 08, 2015, 06:04:57 PM
Also, where is the MU chancellor in all of this? Seems weird that only Wolfe is being singled out here.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 08, 2015, 06:15:10 PM
Wow MIR, sounds like you've had some shitty experiences. But it sounds like you kinda just lived your life and went about finding a job where you didn't have to put up with that crap. Good for you. You know what probably wouldn't have helped? Going on hunger strike until your demands were met, like the resignation of some white camp owner you probably never even met. Why can't people just live their lives and ignore all the real and not so real unfairness? Life's not fair. Bitching about it gets you nowhere.
My wife and I both work at jobs with black coworkers and black managers, some of whom outrank us. They're doing just fine. So are we. Race is not an issue. People are just living their lives, doing their jobs.
At my company, the owners son is drawing a paycheck to basically do nothing and one day he'll be on the board. Who the eff cares? Good for him. I'll live my life and he can live his.
You missed the point, every point it seems. Should I just be happy that I have a job far beneath my skill and my accomplishments, because I'm not. I wish I had the conviction to go on a hunger strike for injustice and inequality because I certainly would. I have kids and I want things to be better for them that it was for me. I have no idea why you went to the comparison of "some white camp owner I have never met" the gentleman having a hunger strike has met the system president, more than once. Clearly the hunger strike has had some affect, the country is talking about this and the administration is feeling pressure.
Also your little life is not fair rant is trite and insulting. I also never insisted that african americans aren't managers and decision makers so I'm not sure why your story about blacks who "outrank" you is relevant. I'm in charge, I make the rules, I hire and fire; none of that has a damn thing to do with equal opportunity I have no idea how you can't see that.
Look bub, you either like your job or you don't. If you feel it's beneath your skill level and accomplishments as a camp counselor, get a new job. Or don't. But don't bitch about how raaaaacism and white privilege are holding you back. JFC. Quit whining.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 08, 2015, 06:19:19 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 06:22:30 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 06:26:19 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 06:37:12 PM
Wow MIR, sounds like you've had some shitty experiences. But it sounds like you kinda just lived your life and went about finding a job where you didn't have to put up with that crap. Good for you. You know what probably wouldn't have helped? Going on hunger strike until your demands were met, like the resignation of some white camp owner you probably never even met. Why can't people just live their lives and ignore all the real and not so real unfairness? Life's not fair. Bitching about it gets you nowhere.
My wife and I both work at jobs with black coworkers and black managers, some of whom outrank us. They're doing just fine. So are we. Race is not an issue. People are just living their lives, doing their jobs.
At my company, the owners son is drawing a paycheck to basically do nothing and one day he'll be on the board. Who the eff cares? Good for him. I'll live my life and he can live his.
You missed the point, every point it seems. Should I just be happy that I have a job far beneath my skill and my accomplishments, because I'm not. I wish I had the conviction to go on a hunger strike for injustice and inequality because I certainly would. I have kids and I want things to be better for them that it was for me. I have no idea why you went to the comparison of "some white camp owner I have never met" the gentleman having a hunger strike has met the system president, more than once. Clearly the hunger strike has had some affect, the country is talking about this and the administration is feeling pressure.
Also your little life is not fair rant is trite and insulting. I also never insisted that african americans aren't managers and decision makers so I'm not sure why your story about blacks who "outrank" you is relevant. I'm in charge, I make the rules, I hire and fire; none of that has a damn thing to do with equal opportunity I have no idea how you can't see that.
Look bub, you either like your job or you don't. If you feel it's beneath your skill level and accomplishments as a camp counselor, get a new job. Or don't. But don't bitch about how raaaaacism and white privilege are holding you back. JFC. Quit whining.
KSUW, do you consider yourself racist? Do you think racism exists? What do you think racism is?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 06:41:00 PM
Looks like a lot of first world problems...everybody grab a latte and talk this one out. Nike gear and unlimited meal pass optional.
Yeah bud, dealing with racial equality is absolutely a first world problem. Equality generally isn't an issue when you're surrounded by people that look like you and you all are wondering where you're going to get some clean water from. What's your point?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 06:42:31 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 07:05:04 PM
I am failing to see where the racial inequality is at. The actions of a few or singular dumb people/person, defiling a wall, doesn't equal racial inequality.
How many times do you need to be told that these incidents in the fall and the succeeding inaction by the administration was not the starting point but the tipping point?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 07:28:59 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 07:35:19 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 07:41:42 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 08, 2015, 07:47:43 PM
Post by: sunny_cat on November 08, 2015, 07:49:06 PM
Wow MIR, sounds like you've had some shitty experiences. But it sounds like you kinda just lived your life and went about finding a job where you didn't have to put up with that crap. Good for you. You know what probably wouldn't have helped? Going on hunger strike until your demands were met, like the resignation of some white camp owner you probably never even met. Why can't people just live their lives and ignore all the real and not so real unfairness? Life's not fair. Bitching about it gets you nowhere.
My wife and I both work at jobs with black coworkers and black managers, some of whom outrank us. They're doing just fine. So are we. Race is not an issue. People are just living their lives, doing their jobs.
At my company, the owners son is drawing a paycheck to basically do nothing and one day he'll be on the board. Who the eff cares? Good for him. I'll live my life and he can live his.
You missed the point, every point it seems. Should I just be happy that I have a job far beneath my skill and my accomplishments, because I'm not. I wish I had the conviction to go on a hunger strike for injustice and inequality because I certainly would. I have kids and I want things to be better for them that it was for me. I have no idea why you went to the comparison of "some white camp owner I have never met" the gentleman having a hunger strike has met the system president, more than once. Clearly the hunger strike has had some affect, the country is talking about this and the administration is feeling pressure.
Also your little life is not fair rant is trite and insulting. I also never insisted that african americans aren't managers and decision makers so I'm not sure why your story about blacks who "outrank" you is relevant. I'm in charge, I make the rules, I hire and fire; none of that has a damn thing to do with equal opportunity I have no idea how you can't see that.
Look bub, you either like your job or you don't. If you feel it's beneath your skill level and accomplishments as a camp counselor, get a new job. Or don't. But don't bitch about how raaaaacism and white privilege are holding you back. JFC. Quit whining.
christ
:'bye cruel world:
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 08, 2015, 07:51:14 PM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 08, 2015, 07:52:39 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 07:55:46 PM
Post by: Kat Kid on November 08, 2015, 08:00:32 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 08, 2015, 08:04:51 PM
Administrators must resign because they didn't hit the outrage meter high enough when unknown person or persons participated in a racist act.
The arbitrary world of PC jackboots is scary.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 08, 2015, 08:32:39 PM
Post by: chum1 on November 08, 2015, 08:57:33 PM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 08, 2015, 09:04:43 PM
If the rando would have just smeared crap into a Jesus face, instead of a swastika, we'd still be on the safe side of the race/pc fulcrum, some guy wouldn't be on a pretend hunger strike and a bunch old ladies would be having a very smelly vigil.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 09:19:37 PM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 08, 2015, 09:22:04 PM
Post by: wetwillie on November 08, 2015, 09:22:54 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 09:27:10 PM
No, draw a Jesus face with the crap
I think people would laud the creativity, some may even pray to it like Jesus toast. I may be wrong but I don't think that Jesus' face is an international sign of hate and intolerance like a swastika. Weird comparo FSD, why do you hate the son of God?
Post by: OK_Cat on November 08, 2015, 09:36:08 PM
Holy crap
Lol
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 08, 2015, 10:11:49 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 10:26:32 PM
Post by: stunted on November 08, 2015, 10:38:19 PM
Yep, lots of other groups in the United States that were enslaved, subject to overt discrimination for the next 100 years specifically designed to keep them poor, socially subservient and educationally inferior.
What are you even talking about?
Quote
...a race of people whom nature has marked as inferior, and who are incapable of progress or intellectual development beyond a certain point, as their history has shown; differing in language, opinions, color, and physical conformation; between whom and ourselves nature has placed an impassable difference" and as such had no right " to swear away the life of a citizen" or participate" with us in administering the affairs of our Government
guess the race (hint, not black)
every group of immigrants has faced hardship (even the white ones). some more than others. but the successful ones didn't sit around and complain.
take mir's story. it's terrible what he faced, there's no doubt about it. people are assholes. but i still see blaming others for his problems. and if he's qualified to be the head coach of his profession, he would have found a way to make it happen. then again, he wouldn't go on a hunger strike for his kids.
my grandmother grew up dirt poor in a farm village, had 4 kids, husband died young, half deaf, back problems, had to work 2 manual labor crap jobs just to put her kids in college. then all 4 learned from that work ethic and found success. when you grow up hearing stories about all that, it is easy to recognize how ridiculous all this black lives matter/white-blaming bullshit is. it's all a bunch of excuses (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YN-l6WtB71g).
Post by: sunny_cat on November 08, 2015, 10:53:02 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 11:31:54 PM
take mir's story. it's terrible what he faced, there's no doubt about it. people are assholes. but i still see blaming others for his problems. and if he's qualified to be the head coach of his profession, he would have found a way to make it happen. then again, he wouldn't go on a hunger strike for his kids.
my grandmother grew up dirt poor in a farm village, had 4 kids, husband died young, half deaf, back problems, had to work 2 manual labor crap jobs just to put her kids in college. then all 4 learned from that work ethic and found success. when you grow up hearing stories about all that, it is easy to recognize how ridiculous all this black lives matter/white-blaming bullshit is. it's all a bunch of excuses (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YN-l6WtB71g).
Unsurprisingly, you didn't read carefully enough, don't even bother.
I don't understand your point about your grandmother. Both of my grandparents graduated from college including my maternal grandmother being the 2nd black undergrad admitted at Oklahoma A&M. Both of my parents are college grads, I'm a college grad. When I'm being discriminated against or marginalized none of that matters.
I had a Laotian friend who tried to kill himself, in his letter me mentioned being called a gook. Clearly only the negroes feel the burden of racism.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2015, 11:46:03 PM
Hey guys, can racism exist and people also have other really tough problems and trials about their lives :Wha:
Nope not possible, racism is a zero sum game. All minorities have to be in constant fear of being enslaved or lynched for racism to exist.
Post by: jaa1025 on November 09, 2015, 12:24:31 AM
I hope they pull the scholarships of those that refuse to practice/play or at least the leaders of this protest. I hope Pinkel gets fired. I hope they play the football game with a bunch of walkons and get destroyed.
While I don't condone racism at all from any side, I think the damage they are doing to themselves is far worse than a racial slur or poop-stica painted on a wall. I'm in my mid 30's and I've never seen a racial divide among certain factions of all races in this country. I blame Obama.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 12:27:42 AM
If you want to question a university administrator you should be asking why Schulz is currently wining and dining in Saudi Arabia, a country with an abysmal human rights record, religious oppression, near indentured servitude of foreign workers, killers of gay people and oppressive towards women.
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 01:03:04 AM
No one has said racism doesn't exist. But there is absolutely no reason why the head of the MU system should resign.
If you want to question a university administrator you should be asking why Schulz is currently wining and dining in Saudi Arabia, a country with an abysmal human rights record, religious oppression, near indentured servitude of foreign workers, killers of gay people and oppressive towards women.
I think the mizzou football team chose to focus on their president instead of ours in this case. But yes, Schulz probably deserves to be questioned for that.
Post by: chum1 on November 09, 2015, 06:11:54 AM
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/R._Bowen_Loftin
Post by: Kat Kid on November 09, 2015, 08:00:37 AM
Yep, lots of other groups in the United States that were enslaved, subject to overt discrimination for the next 100 years specifically designed to keep them poor, socially subservient and educationally inferior.
What are you even talking about?Quote...a race of people whom nature has marked as inferior, and who are incapable of progress or intellectual development beyond a certain point, as their history has shown; differing in language, opinions, color, and physical conformation; between whom and ourselves nature has placed an impassable difference" and as such had no right " to swear away the life of a citizen" or participate" with us in administering the affairs of our Government
guess the race (hint, not black)
every group of immigrants has faced hardship (even the white ones). some more than others. but the successful ones didn't sit around and complain.
take mir's story. it's terrible what he faced, there's no doubt about it. people are assholes. but i still see blaming others for his problems. and if he's qualified to be the head coach of his profession, he would have found a way to make it happen. then again, he wouldn't go on a hunger strike for his kids.
my grandmother grew up dirt poor in a farm village, had 4 kids, husband died young, half deaf, back problems, had to work 2 manual labor crap jobs just to put her kids in college. then all 4 learned from that work ethic and found success. when you grow up hearing stories about all that, it is easy to recognize how ridiculous all this black lives matter/white-blaming bullshit is. it's all a bunch of excuses (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YN-l6WtB71g).
1. No one is saying racism is solely conducted against one group
2. The history of African-Americans in the US is absolutely unique, unparalleled and insidious in its discrimination. Yes the Chinese Exclusion Act was bad, yes Japanese internment was bad, yes treatment of Native Americans was awful. Interesting to note that two of the three groups received large reparations. But no, sorry, your 20th century college educated immigrant story is not comparable to the African American experience in the US, for too many reasons to list.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 09, 2015, 08:02:28 AM
No one has said racism doesn't exist. But there is absolutely no reason why the head of the MU system should resign.
If you want to question a university administrator you should be asking why Schulz is currently wining and dining in Saudi Arabia, a country with an abysmal human rights record, religious oppression, near indentured servitude of foreign workers, killers of gay people and oppressive towards women.
He is there because they can give KSU money. That is the answer.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 09:23:26 AM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 09, 2015, 09:28:27 AM
Ugg. More grievance mongering on campus run amok. And the usual suspects just lap it up. When are you fools going to realize that we should expect more of college students than to behave like perpetual petulant adolescents? So some self-absorbed, melodramatic, zealot with a likely mental disorder is starving himself because his feelings are hurt. Do you not see how deranged his solution and demands are?
This is just another extension of the epidemic of ridiculous, over the top PC outrage gripping college campuses. The only way to stop it is to denounce it. Instead we pander to it with fawning media coverage.
Finally, a swastika made out of human crap? It's certainly possible that this could be a genuine "hate crime," but how many fake ones is it going to take before we treat these with skepticism?
What should we be skeptical about?
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 09:29:55 AM
Post by: Cire on November 09, 2015, 09:33:56 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 09:50:13 AM
bear grylls said like 30-40 days on waterThis really isn't the day of age to bluff your hunger. We know you got time. :lol: JK, tho. This is really sad. Good grief, wtf is going on at Mizzou?
Post by: Karlen on November 09, 2015, 10:00:25 AM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 10:02:36 AM
Obviously there was a crap-stika (not sure how this is racist against blacks). Maybe a slur(s) from cars. A guy fasting. Now the football team quit.
All of the anger/outrage/blame is directed at the president and/or chancellor. Why exactly? Is this one of those "systemic" "institutional" type arguments?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 10:23:44 AM
What a potential slippery slope. A university forced to resign because of alleged racial incidents perpetrated by individuals of unknown identity??
Post by: The Big Train on November 09, 2015, 10:24:30 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 10:28:36 AM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 09, 2015, 10:58:56 AM
Post by: kstate16 on November 09, 2015, 11:00:47 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:06:42 AM
Reading more into it, seems like this wasn't even close to being an only race issue. Their administration has been alienating their students for years. However, I fail to see how their chancellor is getting off scott free.
I mean I said that from the start but our resident dumbfucks just couldn't lay off of the race dog whistle.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 11:09:57 AM
Step 1: Allege racial slurs from unknown individuals on campus or from unknown individuals in passing automobiles
Step 2: Have a racial incident perpetrated on campus by individuals of unknown affiliation/race etc. etc.
Step 3: Protest and force resignations
On the topic of college administration alienation of the student body. You could almost force the resignation of nearly every college administration based on the perception of some or many on various campuses.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 11:10:11 AM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 11:10:27 AM
Post by: Kat Kid on November 09, 2015, 11:12:24 AM
It apparently doesn't take much to force resignation in the MU System.
Step 1: Allege racial slurs from unknown individuals on campus or from unknown individuals in passing automobiles
Step 2: Have a racial incident perpetrated on campus by individuals of unknown affiliation/race etc. etc.
Step 3: Protest and force resignations
On the topic of college administration alienation of the student body. You could almost force the resignation of nearly every college administration based on the perception of some or many on various campuses.
customer is always right
free market
etc. etc.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 11:13:05 AM
It apparently doesn't take much to force resignation in the MU System.
Step 1: Allege racial slurs from unknown individuals on campus or from unknown individuals in passing automobiles
Step 2: Have a racial incident perpetrated on campus by individuals of unknown affiliation/race etc. etc.
Step 3: Protest and force resignations
On the topic of college administration alienation of the student body. You could almost force the resignation of nearly every college administration based on the perception of some or many on various campuses.
customer is always right
free market
etc. etc.
Nice strawman
Post by: chum1 on November 09, 2015, 11:13:20 AM
Quote
When he was appointed MU system president on Feb. 15, 2012, curators hailed him as a hometown hero who could run the university like a tech company.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/11/09/with-1-million-at-stake-u-of-missouris-president-now-taking-protests-seriously/
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 11:16:04 AM
Ugg. More grievance mongering on campus run amok. And the usual suspects just lap it up. When are you fools going to realize that we should expect more of college students than to behave like perpetual petulant adolescents? So some self-absorbed, melodramatic, zealot with a likely mental disorder is starving himself because his feelings are hurt. Do you not see how deranged his solution and demands are?
This is just another extension of the epidemic of ridiculous, over the top PC outrage gripping college campuses. The only way to stop it is to denounce it. Instead we pander to it with fawning media coverage.
Finally, a swastika made out of human crap? It's certainly possible that this could be a genuine "hate crime," but how many fake ones is it going to take before we treat these with skepticism?
What should we be skeptical about?
You should be skeptical about the motivations behind painting a swastika on the wall out of human crap. Sounds like a hoax, as opposed to something genuinely motivated by anti-black (or anti-semitic?) racism. It's the sort of thing a crazy person would do, not unlike going on hunger strike to oust a college president because he wasn't sypatheitc enough to the riots in Ferguson.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 11:17:13 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 11:17:33 AM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 11:18:45 AM
my hunch is that he thought he was too powerful to be taken down by mere "students" and acted like he was above them. good for the students. life is far to short to deal with incompetent assholes like that guy. if he was just one or the other, he'd probably still be fine and employed. but both? nope. goodbye.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 11:18:57 AM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 09, 2015, 11:19:57 AM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 11:21:22 AM
this guy got the boot because of his complete inability to handle the situation that was unfolding in front of him. kind of like how the only doctors that get sued are the ones who show no empathy and talk down to the patients who they've caused medical problems for.
my hunch is that he thought he was too powerful to be taken down by mere "students" and acted like he was above them. good for the students. life is far to short to deal with incompetent assholes like that guy. if he was just one or the other, he'd probably still be fine and employed, but both? nope. goodbye.
Ok, specifically, what should he have done to "handle the situation"? I really want to know. Should he have sent out an e-mail about "white privilege" as the BLM nut-jobs were demanding?
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 11:21:51 AM
This is a victory for all people who just want to live their lives without having to look at a crap swastika on the wall.
PC run amok
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 11:21:59 AM
This is a victory for all people who just want to live their lives without having to look at a crap swastika on the wall.
Right - because I'm sure the president did that, or failed in some way to prevent that.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 09, 2015, 11:22:10 AM
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 11:23:59 AM
BTW this is the president addressing students on Friday night.
https://twitter.com/bomani_jones/status/663186744876007426
I mean, based on this 30 second video posted without context, I wouldn't be surprised if he mishandled several incidents leading up to the poop swastika.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 09, 2015, 11:25:31 AM
this guy got the boot because of his complete inability to handle the situation that was unfolding in front of him. kind of like how the only doctors that get sued are the ones who show no empathy and talk down to the patients who they've caused medical problems for.
my hunch is that he thought he was too powerful to be taken down by mere "students" and acted like he was above them. good for the students. life is far to short to deal with incompetent assholes like that guy. if he was just one or the other, he'd probably still be fine and employed, but both? nope. goodbye.
Ok, specifically, what should he have done to "handle the situation"? I really want to know. Should he have sent out an e-mail about "white privilege" as the BLM nut-jobs were demanding?
Well, in hindsight, maybe not allowing the driver of a car in a parade to menace and bump protesters without saying anything during or for a month after the protest?
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 11:32:45 AM
This is a victory for all people who just want to live their lives without having to look at a crap swastika on the wall.
Right - because I'm sure the president did that, or failed in some way to prevent that.
[I don't read the pit very often, so somebody else insert posts from other threads where the residents are mad at obama for something going on in america]
And obviously, the mizzou pres wasn't under fire for there being a swastishit, but for his indifferent attitude towards what black students at his biggest school were dealing with for months (years?).
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 11:34:58 AM
https://twitter.com/ellisenichol/status/663758264539090944
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 11:37:23 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 11:39:02 AM
huh?Weird. Mizzou is known for journalism and now they don't want it?
https://twitter.com/ellisenichol/status/663758264539090944
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 11:41:14 AM
this guy got the boot because of his complete inability to handle the situation that was unfolding in front of him. kind of like how the only doctors that get sued are the ones who show no empathy and talk down to the patients who they've caused medical problems for.
my hunch is that he thought he was too powerful to be taken down by mere "students" and acted like he was above them. good for the students. life is far to short to deal with incompetent assholes like that guy. if he was just one or the other, he'd probably still be fine and employed. but both? nope. goodbye.
great post as always. Good for the students for driving change. They should be proud.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:50:34 AM
This is a victory for all people who just want to live their lives without having to look at a crap swastika on the wall.
Right - because I'm sure the president did that, or failed in some way to prevent that.
[I don't read the pit very often, so somebody else insert posts from other threads where the residents are mad at obama for something going on in america]
And obviously, the mizzou pres wasn't under fire for there being a swastishit, but for his indifferent attitude towards what black students at his biggest school were dealing with for months (years?).
Your boy dax and ksuw have been told this several times but they don't care. Putting PC libtards who have run amok in their place is much more important than dealing with issues that people would like addressed, because the majority is always infallible.
Enjoy scheme pak, hopefully you guys don't run into any negroes that could make things uncomfortable with their feelings and crap.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 11:55:40 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 12:01:13 PM
huh?Weird. Mizzou is known for journalism and now they don't want it?
https://twitter.com/ellisenichol/status/663758264539090944
Missouri students have done an amazing job of not media grandstanding with this issue. My greatest frustration with the reaction to this is people questioning their motives as attention seeking or "just about a poop swastika." They didn't ask the media to show up and they haven't been talking to them since this became a story last week. This active protest has been going on for weeks without fanfare. The football players joining in made this story explode and with that came many hot takes from people who has no early clue as to what the hell they are talking about.
Post by: lopakman on November 09, 2015, 12:04:33 PM
Hey guys, can racism exist and people also have other really tough problems and trials about their lives :Wha:
Nope not possible, racism is a zero sum game. All minorities have to be in constant fear of being enslaved or lynched for racism to exist.
:horrorsurprise: I read that and at first was like is mir actually serious? Then I was like nah pay more attention lopak
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 12:07:11 PM
Good to knowhuh?Weird. Mizzou is known for journalism and now they don't want it?
https://twitter.com/ellisenichol/status/663758264539090944
Missouri students have done an amazing job of not media grandstanding with this issue. My greatest frustration with the reaction to this is people questioning their motives as attention seeking or "just about a poop swastika." They didn't ask the media to show up and they haven't been talking to them since this became a story last week. This active protest has been going on for weeks without fanfare. The football players joining in made this story explode and with that came many hot takes from people who has no early clue as to what the hell they are talking about.
Post by: nicname on November 09, 2015, 12:08:45 PM
I saw the demand sheet and I definitely get the demands for more black faculty and more money/effort to help marginalized students. I also respect the outrage at racial slurs and actions. While I can see how there can be steps taken to address the former, what can you really do to address the latter?
People have a right to be racist assholes. Unpopular, even hateful, opinions and words aren't illegal.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 12:09:48 PM
but I disagree with his strategy. He is certainly bringing a lot of attention on himself, but perhaps to the detriment of his cause.
Nope
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 12:19:08 PM
It's still odd they don't want the media there. Regardless of how and when the media decided the story was worth pursuing, history has proven the media is often protesters' best friend.
I saw the demand sheet and I definitely get the demands for more black faculty and more money/effort to help marginalized students. I also respect the outrage at racial slurs and actions. While I can see how there can be steps taken to address the former, what can you really do to address the latter?
People have a right to be racist assholes. Unpopular, even hateful, opinions and words aren't illegal.
Media for the most part brings in the need to provide 24 hour news in soundbite form and this issue is a lot more nuanced than that. The mass media for the most part has no interest in what the issues there actually are. I'm sure there are nothing there but people asking about poop swastika's, football, and "the n word."
You read the article that listed the demands yet somehow think that this is a first amendment issue? How is that even possible, that list addressed systemic issues?
Post by: skycat on November 09, 2015, 12:35:22 PM
I do wonder if the poop swastika was merely the product of a troll looking to get a reaction of disgust and outrage from a few people in his wing on his floor of his residence hall. If so, that troll must be giddy about the national reaction and the local consequences. Not to say the activists got trolled -- their outrage was well earned, even without the shitstika, which was at best merely the straw that broke the camel's back.
Post by: nicname on November 09, 2015, 12:43:41 PM
It's still odd they don't want the media there. Regardless of how and when the media decided the story was worth pursuing, history has proven the media is often protesters' best friend.
I saw the demand sheet and I definitely get the demands for more black faculty and more money/effort to help marginalized students. I also respect the outrage at racial slurs and actions. While I can see how there can be steps taken to address the former, what can you really do to address the latter?
People have a right to be racist assholes. Unpopular, even hateful, opinions and words aren't illegal.
Media for the most part brings in the need to provide 24 hour news in soundbite form and this issue is a lot more nuanced than that. The mass media for the most part has no interest in what the issues there actually are. I'm sure there are nothing there but people asking about poop swastika's, football, and "the n word."
You read the article that listed the demands yet somehow think that this is a first amendment issue? How is that even possible, that list addressed systemic issues?
I didn't read an article. I just read the list of demands. Those can be addressed, and are what reporters should (and I would assume the good ones are) be asking about. I agree that racial slurs and poop swastika's are the lesser matter even though they will get a lot of the cable news "run." I do think the racial slurs (sans poop) are a first amendment issue, but like you said, they aren't the real issue here.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 12:46:00 PM
I guess if I was a psuedo-intellectual progressive lapdog with a humanities degree, I probably wouldn't see anything wrong with that.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 12:55:45 PM
KSUW- you never answered my question on whether you believe collective action is ineffective and forcing change.
Sorry, yes, I believe collective action is effective at forcing change. That was never the issue. The issue is whether such change actually does any good.
I've asked before and I'll ask again. What, specifically, should this president have done differently? Issue some e-mails condemning some alleged racist heckling? What, exactly, would that have accomplished? This seems to be less about achieving actual results and more about just saying words to make people feel better (a common theme with liberal actions). In other words, just more PC bullshit. University administrators should expect college students to behave like adults - not a mob of adolescent middle-schoolers with hurt feelings. Grow the eff up.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 12:57:15 PM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 12:58:53 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 01:00:06 PM
Post by: nicname on November 09, 2015, 01:00:19 PM
KSUW- you never answered my question on whether you believe collective action is ineffective and forcing change.
Sorry, yes, I believe collective action is effective at forcing change. That was never the issue. The issue is whether such change actually does any good.
I've asked before and I'll ask again. What, specifically, should this president have done differently? Issue some e-mails condemning some alleged racist heckling? What, exactly, would that have accomplished? This seems to be less about achieving actual results and more about just saying words to make people feel better (a common theme with liberal actions). In other words, just more PC bullshit. University administrators should expect college students to behave like adults - not a mob of adolescent middle-schoolers with hurt feelings. Grow the eff up.
There are very real things that could be accomplished regarding hiring of minority staff, supporting/expanding programs to aid marginalized students, etc. Agree with you on the words tho.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 01:01:13 PM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 01:02:43 PM
KSUW- you never answered my question on whether you believe collective action is ineffective and forcing change.
Sorry, yes, I believe collective action is effective at forcing change. That was never the issue. The issue is whether such change actually does any good.
I've asked before and I'll ask again. What, specifically, should this president have done differently? Issue some e-mails condemning some alleged racist heckling? What, exactly, would that have accomplished? This seems to be less about achieving actual results and more about just saying words to make people feel better (a common theme with liberal actions). In other words, just more PC bullshit. University administrators should expect college students to behave like adults - not a mob of adolescent middle-schoolers with hurt feelings. Grow the eff up.
seems to me like the president of a university should somewhat listen to the students paying/choosing to go there. this guy not only didn't listen, but he was an bad person about it so they forced him to quit in an attempt to bring in someone more competent. it all seems pretty reasonable to me and the take home lesson here for any adults on the board is that if you're going to be bad at your job, you should at least be polite.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 01:06:11 PM
KSUW- you never answered my question on whether you believe collective action is ineffective and forcing change.
Sorry, yes, I believe collective action is effective at forcing change. That was never the issue. The issue is whether such change actually does any good.
I've asked before and I'll ask again. What, specifically, should this president have done differently? Issue some e-mails condemning some alleged racist heckling? What, exactly, would that have accomplished? This seems to be less about achieving actual results and more about just saying words to make people feel better (a common theme with liberal actions). In other words, just more PC bullshit. University administrators should expect college students to behave like adults - not a mob of adolescent middle-schoolers with hurt feelings. Grow the eff up.
seems to me like the president of a university should somewhat listen to the students paying/choosing to go there. this guy not only didn't listen, but he was an bad person about it so they forced him to quit in an attempt to bring in someone more competent. it all seems pretty reasonable to me and the take home lesson here for any adults on the board is that if you're going to be bad at your job, you should at least be polite.
I asked for specific things the president should have done, and so far I've got (1) he should have "somewhat listened" and (2) he shouldn't have been "an bad person."
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 01:06:39 PM
https://twitter.com/BKSportsTalk/status/663782321716228096
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 01:09:16 PM
KSUW- you never answered my question on whether you believe collective action is ineffective and forcing change.
Sorry, yes, I believe collective action is effective at forcing change. That was never the issue. The issue is whether such change actually does any good.
I've asked before and I'll ask again. What, specifically, should this president have done differently? Issue some e-mails condemning some alleged racist heckling? What, exactly, would that have accomplished? This seems to be less about achieving actual results and more about just saying words to make people feel better (a common theme with liberal actions). In other words, just more PC bullshit. University administrators should expect college students to behave like adults - not a mob of adolescent middle-schoolers with hurt feelings. Grow the eff up.
seems to me like the president of a university should somewhat listen to the students paying/choosing to go there. this guy not only didn't listen, but he was an bad person about it so they forced him to quit in an attempt to bring in someone more competent. it all seems pretty reasonable to me and the take home lesson here for any adults on the board is that if you're going to be bad at your job, you should at least be polite.
I asked for specific things the president should have done, and so far I've got (1) he should have "somewhat listened" and (2) he shouldn't have been "an bad person."
and I just gave you two pretty specific ones. if you need more, maybe you should say so. I'm not a mind reader.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 01:09:29 PM
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/06/yales-president-tells-black-students-we-failed-you/?wpmm=1&wpisrc=nl_evening (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/06/yales-president-tells-black-students-we-failed-you/?wpmm=1&wpisrc=nl_evening)
Quote
NEW HAVEN, CONN. — In a closed-door meeting Thursday night, Yale University’s president apologized to a large group of minority students for the school’s failure to make them feel safe on campus.
“We failed you,” Peter Salovey, a psychologist, told more than 40 students gathered in the ornate room where the Yale Corporation meets, on the top floor of the president’s office.
“I think we have to be a better university. I think we have to do a better job,” he said, according to several students in the room who were taking notes. The four-hour meeting concluded a dramatic day on this Ivy League campus, as students confronted administrators about a series of recent events that have laid bare long-simmering racial tensions at the elite school.
The tensions briefly flared up in September over names and symbols around campus that seemed to reference slavery. But they exploded at the center of campus on Thursday afternoon, when hundreds of students encircled Jonathan Holloway, the first black dean of Yale College, outside of the main library and demanded to know why he had not communicated with the college community about allegations within the past week that a university fraternity chapter had turned away black women from a party the week before.
They denounced, too, the university’s handling of a controversy involving an e-mail from the associate master of Silliman College, one of Yale’s 12 undergraduate residential communities, that urged students not to take offense at insensitive Halloween costumes. That message came in response to a college-wide notice asking students to think about the way their costumes might be perceived by others and to avoid offensive cultural depictions, such as “blackface” and “feathered headdresses.”
This is what we've come to in American universities. They have so coddled these entitled little babies that they're now apologizing for suggesting that they not lose their collective crap over an offensive Halloween costume.
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 01:10:31 PM
KSUW- you never answered my question on whether you believe collective action is ineffective and forcing change.
Sorry, yes, I believe collective action is effective at forcing change. That was never the issue. The issue is whether such change actually does any good.
I've asked before and I'll ask again. What, specifically, should this president have done differently? Issue some e-mails condemning some alleged racist heckling? What, exactly, would that have accomplished? This seems to be less about achieving actual results and more about just saying words to make people feel better (a common theme with liberal actions). In other words, just more PC bullshit. University administrators should expect college students to behave like adults - not a mob of adolescent middle-schoolers with hurt feelings. Grow the eff up.
seems to me like the president of a university should somewhat listen to the students paying/choosing to go there. this guy not only didn't listen, but he was an bad person about it so they forced him to quit in an attempt to bring in someone more competent. it all seems pretty reasonable to me and the take home lesson here for any adults on the board is that if you're going to be bad at your job, you should at least be polite.
I asked for specific things the president should have done, and so far I've got (1) he should have "somewhat listened" and (2) he shouldn't have been "an bad person."
Amazingly, even that minimal of an effort, and even if he was #acting while doing so, would've been a relatively good start.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 01:11:02 PM
A man just lost his job, be excited for change and move on, but this crap...
https://twitter.com/BKSportsTalk/status/663782321716228096
College students, mind you.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 01:13:31 PM
KSUW- you never answered my question on whether you believe collective action is ineffective and forcing change.
Sorry, yes, I believe collective action is effective at forcing change. That was never the issue. The issue is whether such change actually does any good.
I've asked before and I'll ask again. What, specifically, should this president have done differently? Issue some e-mails condemning some alleged racist heckling? What, exactly, would that have accomplished? This seems to be less about achieving actual results and more about just saying words to make people feel better (a common theme with liberal actions). In other words, just more PC bullshit. University administrators should expect college students to behave like adults - not a mob of adolescent middle-schoolers with hurt feelings. Grow the eff up.
seems to me like the president of a university should somewhat listen to the students paying/choosing to go there. this guy not only didn't listen, but he was an bad person about it so they forced him to quit in an attempt to bring in someone more competent. it all seems pretty reasonable to me and the take home lesson here for any adults on the board is that if you're going to be bad at your job, you should at least be polite.
I asked for specific things the president should have done, and so far I've got (1) he should have "somewhat listened" and (2) he shouldn't have been "an bad person."
Amazingly, even that minimal of an effort, and even if he was #acting while doing so, would've been a relatively good start.
And would have accomplished exactly nothing, but it would have made the zealots feel better. These universities are not helping their students by coddling them. They need to help them grow up. The real world (if they ever make it there) is going to kick them in the face.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 09, 2015, 01:15:12 PM
I guess the MU prez should have taken a page from the Yale prez, who just bent the knee.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/06/yales-president-tells-black-students-we-failed-you/?wpmm=1&wpisrc=nl_evening (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/06/yales-president-tells-black-students-we-failed-you/?wpmm=1&wpisrc=nl_evening)QuoteNEW HAVEN, CONN. — In a closed-door meeting Thursday night, Yale University’s president apologized to a large group of minority students for the school’s failure to make them feel safe on campus.
“We failed you,” Peter Salovey, a psychologist, told more than 40 students gathered in the ornate room where the Yale Corporation meets, on the top floor of the president’s office.
“I think we have to be a better university. I think we have to do a better job,” he said, according to several students in the room who were taking notes. The four-hour meeting concluded a dramatic day on this Ivy League campus, as students confronted administrators about a series of recent events that have laid bare long-simmering racial tensions at the elite school.
The tensions briefly flared up in September over names and symbols around campus that seemed to reference slavery. But they exploded at the center of campus on Thursday afternoon, when hundreds of students encircled Jonathan Holloway, the first black dean of Yale College, outside of the main library and demanded to know why he had not communicated with the college community about allegations within the past week that a university fraternity chapter had turned away black women from a party the week before.
They denounced, too, the university’s handling of a controversy involving an e-mail from the associate master of Silliman College, one of Yale’s 12 undergraduate residential communities, that urged students not to take offense at insensitive Halloween costumes. That message came in response to a college-wide notice asking students to think about the way their costumes might be perceived by others and to avoid offensive cultural depictions, such as “blackface” and “feathered headdresses.”
This is what we've come to in American universities. They have so coddled these entitled little babies that they're now apologizing for suggesting that they not lose their collective crap over an offensive Halloween costume.
It won't be long until the department stores can't even tell us "Happy Halloween" anymore. JFC, this country is godless and it sucks.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 01:17:18 PM
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 01:17:34 PM
Amazingly, even that minimal of an effort, and even if he was #acting while doing so, would've been a relatively good start.
And would have accomplished exactly nothing, but it would have made the zealots feel better. These universities are not helping their students by coddling them. They need to help them grow up. The real world (if they ever make it there) is going to kick them in the face.
Sorry, "start" is Trimspeak for the beginning of a set of things. My bad. Should've made that more clear.
Post by: MixBerryCrunch on November 09, 2015, 01:19:02 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 01:20:24 PM
So weird considering higher public education is a fortress of ProgLib political leanings.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 01:20:39 PM
I think what we've learned is that if you're a minority in America you now have a right to never be offended. May as well right it into the Constitution.
Clearly
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 01:23:21 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
I don't get this line of thinking. Is the assumption there is no course of action that will accomplish any positive result?
Course of action by whom?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 01:24:28 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 09, 2015, 01:26:04 PM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 09, 2015, 01:28:56 PM
Ugg. More grievance mongering on campus run amok. And the usual suspects just lap it up. When are you fools going to realize that we should expect more of college students than to behave like perpetual petulant adolescents? So some self-absorbed, melodramatic, zealot with a likely mental disorder is starving himself because his feelings are hurt. Do you not see how deranged his solution and demands are?
This is just another extension of the epidemic of ridiculous, over the top PC outrage gripping college campuses. The only way to stop it is to denounce it. Instead we pander to it with fawning media coverage.
Finally, a swastika made out of human crap? It's certainly possible that this could be a genuine "hate crime," but how many fake ones is it going to take before we treat these with skepticism?
What should we be skeptical about?
You should be skeptical about the motivations behind painting a swastika on the wall out of human crap. Sounds like a hoax, as opposed to something genuinely motivated by anti-black (or anti-semitic?) racism. It's the sort of thing a crazy person would do, not unlike going on hunger strike to oust a college president because he wasn't sypatheitc enough to the riots in Ferguson.
You really shouldn't be. Some racist from backwoods Missouri pooped into his own hand and drew a swastika on the wall. The simplest answer is usually correct.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 01:30:00 PM
A man just lost his job, be excited for change and move on, but this crap...
https://twitter.com/BKSportsTalk/status/663782321716228096
Shame on those 18-22 years olds for being excited about starting a grassroots movement that had some success. Do you not get excited about garnering success in something you are passionate about? Royals probably should have been more considerate for the Mets feelings and just went home and had wine with their wives.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 01:31:05 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 01:33:30 PM
I mean, I agree, but it's kind of different. However, it is what it is. I don't want to argue about this. I wasn't engaged in it enough, to really know what i'm talking about.A man just lost his job, be excited for change and move on, but this crap...
https://twitter.com/BKSportsTalk/status/663782321716228096
Shame on those 18-22 years olds for being excited about starting a grassroots movement that had some success. Do you not get excited about garnering success in something you are passionate about? Royals probably should have been more considerate for the Mets feelings and just went home and had wine with their wives.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 01:36:07 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 01:37:38 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
I don't get this line of thinking. Is the assumption there is no course of action that will accomplish any positive result?
Course of action by whom?
Read Dugout's posts re managers. Clients are looking for some sort of response to problems and be included in that process. Apparently he did a poor job of this. I mean do you want me to be super specific so you can shoot down everything I write? I don't know the situation that well.
No one can qualify or quantify what the response should have been to predominately alleged incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
A strongly worded statement? Campus thought police patrols? Doubling down on existing discrimination policies? What would have satisfied the Jackboots?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 01:39:23 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
That is such unmitigated and disgusting bull$hit, but not the least bit surprising coming from you.
LOL
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 01:39:59 PM
I mean, I agree, but it's kind of different. However, it is what it is. I don't want to argue about this. I wasn't engaged in it enough, to really know what i'm talking about.A man just lost his job, be excited for change and move on, but this crap...
https://twitter.com/BKSportsTalk/status/663782321716228096
Shame on those 18-22 years olds for being excited about starting a grassroots movement that had some success. Do you not get excited about garnering success in something you are passionate about? Royals probably should have been more considerate for the Mets feelings and just went home and had wine with their wives.
stop talking about it wacks.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 01:41:31 PM
I think what we've learned is that if you're a minority in America you now have a right to never be offended. May as well write it into the Constitution.
crap I wish. We can put a lot of stupid mother fuckers in jail, take away voting rights, all kind of fun stuff. It's too bad that you miss the good ol days when you could call people beaners, retards, faggots, etc. without repercussion. I can assure you that you can absolutely still do all of those things. You can even call a whole nation of people rapists and drug dealers and and be a leading candidate for president and host Saturday Night Live! What a country!
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 09, 2015, 01:43:44 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
:Wha:
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 01:45:08 PM
A man just lost his job, be excited for change and move on, but this crap...
https://twitter.com/BKSportsTalk/status/663782321716228096
omg when it pans to the right at about :11 the guy with the flannel and the tan ball cap :lol:
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 01:47:02 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
I don't get this line of thinking. Is the assumption there is no course of action that will accomplish any positive result?
Course of action by whom?
Read Dugout's posts re managers. Clients are looking for some sort of response to problems and be included in that process. Apparently he did a poor job of this. I mean do you want me to be super specific so you can shoot down everything I write? I don't know the situation that well.
No one can qualify or quantify what the response should have been to predominately alleged incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
A strongly worded statement? Campus thought police patrols? Doubling down on existing discrimination policies? What would have satisfied the Jackboots?
There were several actionable items in the list of demands that could have been taken care of previously. I don't know the entire history, but I'm sure there's plenty of other things he could have done to address students' concerns.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 01:50:26 PM
Oh, resign
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 01:51:19 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
That is such unmitigated and disgusting bull$hit, but not the least bit surprising coming from you.
LOL
I'm pretty comfortable with how I have characterized you, thank you for making it easy to do so. Your continually parroting of this intentionally dumbed down talking point to minimize the message and messengers makes your intent clear. If you don't understand what's happening you could either state that you don't get it, or just shut the eff up and read and listen. I haven't made any definitive statements about the protesters or the nature of their protests because I said in my very first post in this thread "I still can't wrap my hands around it." You made the choice to place value judgements on why there people protested without actually knowing why they protested; live with the consequences, own who you are.
Post by: Porkchop on November 09, 2015, 01:51:57 PM
What if it was a hullabaloo Rebel flag? Who would that offend? I'm guessing it would offend those who fly the Rebel flag the most, not African Americans. The fact that it was made with hullabaloo implies non support or rejection.
It's all a matter of perspective.
Post by: MixBerryCrunch on November 09, 2015, 01:54:07 PM
I think what we've learned is that if you're a minority in America you now have a right to never be offended. May as well write it into the Constitution.
crap I wish. We can put a lot of stupid mother fuckers in jail, take away voting rights, all kind of fun stuff. It's too bad that you miss the good ol days when you could call people beaners, retards, faggots, etc. without repercussion. I can assure you that you can absolutely still do all of those things. You can even call a whole nation of people rapists and drug dealers and and be a leading candidate for president and host Saturday Night Live! What a country!
Calling me a racist has no affect on me. I know I'm not one. PC bullying only works on the weak minded. There's no doubt in my mind that you're a racist though.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 01:54:40 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 01:56:40 PM
I think what we've learned is that if you're a minority in America you now have a right to never be offended. May as well write it into the Constitution.
crap I wish. We can put a lot of stupid mother fuckers in jail, take away voting rights, all kind of fun stuff. It's too bad that you miss the good ol days when you could call people beaners, retards, faggots, etc. without repercussion. I can assure you that you can absolutely still do all of those things. You can even call a whole nation of people rapists and drug dealers and and be a leading candidate for president and host Saturday Night Live! What a country!
Calling me a racist has no affect on me. I know I'm not one. PC bullying only works on the weak minded. There's no doubt in my mind that you're a racist though.
Where in here did I call you a racist? Hit dog gonna holler!
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 01:57:05 PM
What should the actions have been? cRusty.
Oh, resign
well, I'm guessing if he had made steps to meet any of the six demands not related to Wolfe apologizing/resigning, he would still be president.
Quote
I. we demand that the University of Missouri system president, Tim Wolfe, writes a handwritten apology for the Concerned Students 1–9 – 5–0 demonstrators and holds a press conference in the Mizzou Student Center reading the letter. In the letter and at the press conference, Tim Wolfe must acknowledge his white male privilege, recognize that systems of oppression exist, and provide a verbal commitment to fulfilling Concerned Student 1–9 – 5–0 demands. We want Tim Wolfe to admit to his gross negligence, allowing his driver to hit one of the demonstrators, consenting to the physical violence of bystanders, and Leslie refusing to intervene when Columbia Police Department use excessive force with demonstrators.
II. We demand the immediate removal of Tim Wolfe as UM system president. After his removal a new amendment to the UM system policies must be established to have all future UM president and Chancellor positions be selected by collective of students, staff, and faculty of diverse backgrounds.
III. We demand that the University of Missouri meets the Legion of Black Collegians' demands that were presented in 1969 for the betterment of the black community.
IV. We demand that by the academic year 2017–2018, the University of Missouri increases the percentage of black faculty and staff campus wide to 10%.
V. We demand that the University of Missouri compose a strategic 10 year plan by May 1, 2016 that will increase retention rates for marginalize students, sustain diversity curriculum and training, and promote a more safe and inclusive campus.
VII. We demand that the University of Missouri increases funding for resources for the University of Missouri Counseling Center for the purpose of hiring additional mental health professionals; particularly those of color, boosting the mental health outreach and programming across campus, increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility of the counseling center, and reducing lengthy wait times for prospective clients.
VII. We demand at the University of Missouri increases funding, resources, and personnel for the social justices center on campus for the purpose of hiring additional professionals, particularly those of color, boosting out reach and programming across campus, and increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 09, 2015, 01:58:09 PM
What group does a hullabaloo swastika offend the most? Shouldn't Jews be offended more?
What if it was a hullabaloo Rebel flag? Who would that offend? I'm guessing it would offend those who fly the Rebel flag the most, not African Americans. The fact that it was made with hullabaloo implies non support or rejection.
It's all a matter of perspective.
If you aren't offended by a crap swastika being wiped onto the wall of the building that you live in, regardless of what race you are, then there is something wrong with you.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 01:59:00 PM
I think what we've learned is that if you're a minority in America you now have a right to never be offended. May as well write it into the Constitution.
crap I wish. We can put a lot of stupid mother fuckers in jail, take away voting rights, all kind of fun stuff. It's too bad that you miss the good ol days when you could call people beaners, retards, faggots, etc. without repercussion. I can assure you that you can absolutely still do all of those things. You can even call a whole nation of people rapists and drug dealers and and be a leading candidate for president and host Saturday Night Live! What a country!
Calling me a racist has no affect on me. I know I'm not one. PC bullying only works on the weak minded. There's no doubt in my mind that you're a racist though.
Where in here did I call you a racist? Hit dog gonna holler!
Lol
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 01:59:29 PM
What group does a hullabaloo swastika offend the most? Shouldn't Jews be offended more?
What if it was a hullabaloo Rebel flag? Who would that offend? I'm guessing it would offend those who fly the Rebel flag the most, not African Americans. The fact that it was made with hullabaloo implies non support or rejection.
It's all a matter of perspective.
Focusing on the swastika is the surest sign of someone who has either not read anything about what is happening or have no real interest on discussing the issues; which are you?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 02:00:57 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
That is such unmitigated and disgusting bull$hit, but not the least bit surprising coming from you.
LOL
I'm pretty comfortable with how I have characterized you, thank you for making it easy to do so. Your continually parroting of this intentionally dumbed down talking point to minimize the message and messengers makes your intent clear. If you don't understand what's happening you could either state that you don't get it, or just shut the eff up and read and listen. I haven't made any definitive statements about the protesters or the nature of their protests because I said in my very first post in this thread "I still can't wrap my hands around it." You made the choice to place value judgements on why there people protested without actually knowing why they protested; live with the consequences, own who you are.
I disagree with you therefore you imply very strongly I'm a racist.
That's your effed up world view.
Not once have I said they should do nothing.
Post by: Cire on November 09, 2015, 02:01:51 PM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: kstate16 on November 09, 2015, 02:03:20 PM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 09, 2015, 02:04:32 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 02:06:55 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 02:09:45 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 02:10:48 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
That is such unmitigated and disgusting bull$hit, but not the least bit surprising coming from you.
LOL
I'm pretty comfortable with how I have characterized you, thank you for making it easy to do so. Your continually parroting of this intentionally dumbed down talking point to minimize the message and messengers makes your intent clear. If you don't understand what's happening you could either state that you don't get it, or just shut the eff up and read and listen. I haven't made any definitive statements about the protesters or the nature of their protests because I said in my very first post in this thread "I still can't wrap my hands around it." You made the choice to place value judgements on why there people protested without actually knowing why they protested; live with the consequences, own who you are.
I disagree with you therefore you imply very strongly I'm a racist.
That's your effed up world view.
Not once have I said they should do nothing.
Nice try dax. What opinion of mine as it relates to this issue do you disagree with me on?
You minimized the protesters and what they should be protesting. It's not about me, you showed your ass, don't run away now.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 02:13:01 PM
everyone's at least a little racisty
Nails on a chalkboard, the Avenue Q song is catchy though.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 02:15:39 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 02:16:56 PM
The best post in the entire thread was where wacky said Mizzou definitely belongs in the SEC.:blush: I thought a lot of ppl overlooked that.
Post by: Porkchop on November 09, 2015, 02:17:21 PM
What group does a hullabaloo swastika offend the most? Shouldn't Jews be offended more?
What if it was a hullabaloo Rebel flag? Who would that offend? I'm guessing it would offend those who fly the Rebel flag the most, not African Americans. The fact that it was made with hullabaloo implies non support or rejection.
It's all a matter of perspective.
If you aren't offended by a crap swastika being wiped onto the wall of the building that you live in, regardless of what race you are, then there is something wrong with you.
It's clearly offensive & disgusting, but is it racist? There must be bigger issues at Mizzou & within the state of Missouri.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 02:19:20 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
That is such unmitigated and disgusting bull$hit, but not the least bit surprising coming from you.
LOL
I'm pretty comfortable with how I have characterized you, thank you for making it easy to do so. Your continually parroting of this intentionally dumbed down talking point to minimize the message and messengers makes your intent clear. If you don't understand what's happening you could either state that you don't get it, or just shut the eff up and read and listen. I haven't made any definitive statements about the protesters or the nature of their protests because I said in my very first post in this thread "I still can't wrap my hands around it." You made the choice to place value judgements on why there people protested without actually knowing why they protested; live with the consequences, own who you are.
I disagree with you therefore you imply very strongly I'm a racist.
That's your effed up world view.
Not once have I said they should do nothing.
Nice try dax. What opinion of mine as it relates to this issue do you disagree with me on?
You minimized the protesters and what they should be protesting. It's not about me, you showed your ass, don't run away now.
Lol, when have I run away, just acknowledge that you strongly implied (well pretty much said I'm a racist) don't try to hide behind redirection, deflection and obfuscation now MIR.
I'll minimize any group making massive demands when their armed with allegations, no names, and no clearly defined information that the so called perpetrators are even affiliated with MU outside of being on or near the campus.
At this point we need more resignations, Lofton and Noel English head of the Chancellors Equity program, clearly ineffective people.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 02:23:00 PM
Bitb actually being a decent person :surprised:
Well that didn't last long :lol:
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 09, 2015, 02:24:01 PM
What group does a hullabaloo swastika offend the most? Shouldn't Jews be offended more?
What if it was a hullabaloo Rebel flag? Who would that offend? I'm guessing it would offend those who fly the Rebel flag the most, not African Americans. The fact that it was made with hullabaloo implies non support or rejection.
It's all a matter of perspective.
If you aren't offended by a crap swastika being wiped onto the wall of the building that you live in, regardless of what race you are, then there is something wrong with you.
It's clearly offensive & disgusting, but is it racist? There must be bigger issues at Mizzou & within the state of Missouri.
Yes, it's also racist.
Post by: kso_FAN on November 09, 2015, 02:24:47 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 02:28:47 PM
They should all resign.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 02:29:10 PM
Bitb actually being a decent person :surprised:
Yeah, you spoke too soon. I knew this was going to be wrapped around his ongoing rant about the cost of living allotment. "The athletes are the rich kids, they are now the one percenters." I also love how he keeps lying about the Shabazz Napier soundbite as it relates to the start of the cost of living allowance.
Putting post-it notes on the Thomas Jefferson status is apparently vandalism.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 02:30:33 PM
https://twitter.com/313_massey/status/663812773269274624
:sdeek: :sdeek: :sdeek:
Why does he keep betting on Mizzou?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 02:37:36 PM
MIR and the rest of the resident PC jackboots cheer a guy getting fired for not showing enough outrage over mainly alleged racial incidents and other incidents perpetrated by unknown person or persons.
LOL you can't help yourself, can you? You can't accept the coons trying to find their voice so you just keep repeating yourself no matter how many times you've been proven incorrect. Enjoy the pizza, Scheme is owned by white people and the blacks in Salina generally don't venture to that part of town so you don't have to be forced to listen to their whining about wanting to be equal and crap. You should be able to watch them bounce that ball on TV without having to think about the circus monkeys wanting to feel human.
That is such unmitigated and disgusting bull$hit, but not the least bit surprising coming from you.
LOL
I'm pretty comfortable with how I have characterized you, thank you for making it easy to do so. Your continually parroting of this intentionally dumbed down talking point to minimize the message and messengers makes your intent clear. If you don't understand what's happening you could either state that you don't get it, or just shut the eff up and read and listen. I haven't made any definitive statements about the protesters or the nature of their protests because I said in my very first post in this thread "I still can't wrap my hands around it." You made the choice to place value judgements on why there people protested without actually knowing why they protested; live with the consequences, own who you are.
I disagree with you therefore you imply very strongly I'm a racist.
That's your effed up world view.
Not once have I said they should do nothing.
Nice try dax. What opinion of mine as it relates to this issue do you disagree with me on?
You minimized the protesters and what they should be protesting. It's not about me, you showed your ass, don't run away now.
Lol, when have I run away, just acknowledge that you strongly implied (well pretty much said I'm a racist) don't try to hide behind redirection, deflection and obfuscation now MIR.
I'll minimize any group making massive demands when their armed with allegations, no names, and no clearly defined information that the so called perpetrators are even affiliated with MU outside of being on or near the campus.
At this point we need more resignations, Lofton and Noel English head of the Chancellors Equity program, clearly ineffective people.
I'm not hiding behind anything, your stance here is racist and I can't separate this from who I think you are. Again you made the choice to minimize how these people feel without knowing what they are saying. Your words speak for themselves. I see you're couching things a bit now, nice try I guess.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 02:39:10 PM
Bitb actually being a decent person :surprised:
Yeah, you spoke too soon. I knew this was going to be wrapped around his ongoing rant about the cost of living allotment. "The athletes are the rich kids, they are now the one percenters." I also love how he keeps lying about the Shabazz Napier soundbite as it relates to the start of the cost of living allowance.
Putting post-it notes on the Thomas Jefferson status is apparently vandalism.
Yup :lol:
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 09, 2015, 02:40:38 PM
https://twitter.com/313_massey/status/663812773269274624
:sdeek: :sdeek: :sdeek:
Why does he keep betting on Mizzou?
I think we found the crap graffiti artist
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 02:41:50 PM
I see the MU Chancellors diversity office is staffed with 9 people with credentialism out the wazoo. Were these people not aware? If they were was the Chancellor stopping them from taking action?
They should all resign.
So another definitive statement without knowing what the eff you're talking about. You do you.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 02:42:34 PM
Not one thing worthy of forcing a resignation, change sure, but not resignation.
But please keep trying to minimize what you said, it's hilarious.
Post by: OK_Cat on November 09, 2015, 02:44:48 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 02:48:17 PM
I see the MU Chancellors diversity office is staffed with 9 people with credentialism out the wazoo. Were these people not aware? If they were was the Chancellor stopping them from taking action?
They should all resign.
So another definitive statement without knowing what the eff you're talking about. You do you.
I've read the demands. If that group of highly credentialed and well paid university employees weren't already fast tracking most of the things demanded. Then they should all resign.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 02:49:44 PM
Bitb actually being a decent person :surprised:
Well that didn't last long :lol:
listening on a delay and yeah it didn't take long. kevin is a bad person.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 02:49:59 PM
Leave Dax alone, he's not racist. He has a black dog and at least one black friend.
That's pretty good OK. HUR HUR HUR.
But I have two black dogs.
Post by: Fedor on November 09, 2015, 02:58:20 PM
Was waiting for someone else to make this observation. I came in late, what did bitb say? From 2:24 on I have not heard anything too terrible.Bitb actually being a decent person :surprised:
Well that didn't last long :lol:
listening on a delay and yeah it didn't take long. kevin is a bad person.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 03:03:34 PM
Post by: Fedor on November 09, 2015, 03:07:17 PM
These 90 yr old callers :lol:Jesus, so cringeworthy. BITB is getting them off the show as fast as possible.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 03:08:08 PM
I've read all the stories and listened to one talking head after another on local radio this morning and not one clear and succinct proclamation and identification of any individual or group. Nothing but allegation and anecdotal stories.
Not one thing worthy of forcing a resignation, change sure, but not resignation.
But please keep trying to minimize what you said, it's hilarious.
Oh, so because people not involved at the protest at the University of Missouri don't understand the protests at the University of Missouri invalidates them. Make perfect sense.
Also why do you keep saying that I'm minimizing calling you racist? You clearly don't see black people as equals capable of being taken seriously, you're racist.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 03:12:34 PM
Bitb actually being a decent person :surprised:
Well that didn't last long :lol:
listening on a delay and yeah it didn't take long. kevin is a bad person.
He's the exact opposite steven st John, who is the best
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 03:14:07 PM
I've read all the stories and listened to one talking head after another on local radio this morning and not one clear and succinct proclamation and identification of any individual or group. Nothing but allegation and anecdotal stories.
Not one thing worthy of forcing a resignation, change sure, but not resignation.
But please keep trying to minimize what you said, it's hilarious.
Oh, so because people not involved at the protest at the University of Missouri don't understand the protests at the University of Missouri invalidates them. Make perfect sense.
Also why do you keep saying that I'm minimizing calling you racist? You clearly don't see black people as equals capable of being taken seriously, you're racist.
I don't even know WTF you're talking about in the first paragraph.
When have I said that anyone should not be taken seriously? I have clearly stated that I don't think the chancellor should have been forced to resign. That is not at all saying that this should not be taken seriously. Only a totally one sided monolithic thinker would ascertain or construe that.
You're absurd.
Post by: 'taterblast on November 09, 2015, 03:17:30 PM
Post by: ksupamplemousse on November 09, 2015, 03:27:32 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 03:29:03 PM
https://twitter.com/kctacoparty/status/663824989104115713That's rough ridin' stupid. Two of them are Hispanic.
Post by: mocat on November 09, 2015, 03:30:17 PM
https://twitter.com/kctacoparty/status/663824989104115713
holy crap, tj carpenter is dreamy af
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 03:35:02 PM
There is a large segment of our population that has eliminated from consideration anything outside of their own experiences, reasoning, and environment. All feelings, thoughts, grievances, and action coming from a place other than that particular worldview will be subject to a vehement attempt to invalidate, even to the point of purposefully dehumanizing the victim(s). I guess social change never comes easily, but man, lots of ugly pushback against a very organic and seemingly authentic protest. If you don't agree with the message or methods...so rough ridin' what? You're not the one who's experiencing a problem, so quit telling the people who are in that situation which ways they're allowed to stand up for themselves and which ways they're not.
This is amazing and I love you.
Post by: CNS on November 09, 2015, 03:38:26 PM
https://twitter.com/kctacoparty/status/663824989104115713That's rough ridin' stupid. Two of them are Hispanic.
So, two hispanic 40 yr olds should provide a bunch of 40 yr old white guys an understanding of what is happening to black college students?
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 03:42:36 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 03:45:10 PM
Post by: CNS on November 09, 2015, 03:47:24 PM
Post by: mocat on November 09, 2015, 03:48:38 PM
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 03:51:27 PM
Post by: mocat on November 09, 2015, 03:53:00 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 03:53:31 PM
Is mizzou just like ku and ksu as far as basically being 13th-16th grade of public school? Like, if you graduated from a missouri high school and don't have the resources to travel to and go out-of-state or somewhere private, you're pretty much going to mizzou if you want to go to a 4-year school?
For instate students it's pretty easy to get into MU. But not as easy as instate KU and KSU.
Post by: lopakman on November 09, 2015, 03:55:50 PM
Post by: 'taterblast on November 09, 2015, 03:56:56 PM
holy crap, tj carpenter is dreamy af
yeah he is, and he knows it. he's a little crap head, but i think we would be pretty good buds IRL.
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 04:00:29 PM
nwmsu, cmsu, msu tho
Is one of those the one in springfield? I know that one's pretty racist.
And I meant as far as wanting to have the big school experience. Yeah, kansas has wsu and fhsu and stuff, but nobody wants to go there for a real "college experience."
If I thought ksu could even offer that different of a situation from that at mizzou, I'd suggest ksu implement whatever it would take for those sick of what they're getting at mizzou to transfer over - scholarships, travel/housing discounts, assistance in getting courses to transfer, etc.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 04:02:07 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 04:11:14 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 04:16:32 PM
I wasn't aware of it before yesterday but K-State has done a very good job with inclusivity initatives. I was attempting to find information on minority faculty when I found a page laying it all out, wish I would have posted it.
Not the least bit surprising you were utterly unaware of an initiative started during the Wefald administration.
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 04:18:06 PM
How badly would currie eff this up?
I'm talking about regular students, like j_rake.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 04:24:07 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 04:27:45 PM
What should the actions have been? cRusty.
Oh, resign
well, I'm guessing if he had made steps to meet any of the six demands not related to Wolfe apologizing/resigning, he would still be president.QuoteI. we demand that the University of Missouri system president, Tim Wolfe, writes a handwritten apology for the Concerned Students 1–9 – 5–0 demonstrators and holds a press conference in the Mizzou Student Center reading the letter. In the letter and at the press conference, Tim Wolfe must acknowledge his white male privilege, recognize that systems of oppression exist, and provide a verbal commitment to fulfilling Concerned Student 1–9 – 5–0 demands. We want Tim Wolfe to admit to his gross negligence, allowing his driver to hit one of the demonstrators, consenting to the physical violence of bystanders, and Leslie refusing to intervene when Columbia Police Department use excessive force with demonstrators.
II. We demand the immediate removal of Tim Wolfe as UM system president. After his removal a new amendment to the UM system policies must be established to have all future UM president and Chancellor positions be selected by collective of students, staff, and faculty of diverse backgrounds.
III. We demand that the University of Missouri meets the Legion of Black Collegians' demands that were presented in 1969 for the betterment of the black community.
IV. We demand that by the academic year 2017–2018, the University of Missouri increases the percentage of black faculty and staff campus wide to 10%.
V. We demand that the University of Missouri compose a strategic 10 year plan by May 1, 2016 that will increase retention rates for marginalize students, sustain diversity curriculum and training, and promote a more safe and inclusive campus.
VII. We demand that the University of Missouri increases funding for resources for the University of Missouri Counseling Center for the purpose of hiring additional mental health professionals; particularly those of color, boosting the mental health outreach and programming across campus, increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility of the counseling center, and reducing lengthy wait times for prospective clients.
VII. We demand at the University of Missouri increases funding, resources, and personnel for the social justices center on campus for the purpose of hiring additional professionals, particularly those of color, boosting out reach and programming across campus, and increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility.
That is too rough ridin' crazy to be real. If it is, it rightfully belonged in the trash. Academia is becoming so worthless.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 04:28:20 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 04:30:15 PM
Don't you think that belittles the while situation just a little too much?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 04:30:38 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
I am particularly enjoying the protesters attempts to thwart the media which is a de facto attack on freedom of the press.
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 09, 2015, 04:32:31 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 04:36:46 PM
holy crap, tj carpenter is dreamy af
yeah he is, and he knows it. he's a little crap head, but i think we would be pretty good buds IRL.
He is the worst person on KC sports radio by a million miles
Post by: 8manpick on November 09, 2015, 04:36:56 PM
What should the actions have been? cRusty.
Oh, resign
well, I'm guessing if he had made steps to meet any of the six demands not related to Wolfe apologizing/resigning, he would still be president.
That is too rough ridin' crazy to be real. If it is, it rightfully belonged in the trash. Academia is becoming so worthless.
No idea what III is, V-VII seem like good ideas, but the others seem sort of outrageous.
Post by: mocat on November 09, 2015, 04:41:27 PM
nwmsu, cmsu, msu tho
Is one of those the one in springfield? I know that one's pretty racist.
And I meant as far as wanting to have the big school experience. Yeah, kansas has wsu and fhsu and stuff, but nobody wants to go there for a real "college experience."
yeah you are probably right. missouri state (in springfield) has 24k undergrad though, but i still don't think it applies to what you are referring to
Post by: Cire on November 09, 2015, 05:24:09 PM
Basically a commuter school
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 05:37:02 PM
What should the actions have been? cRusty.
Oh, resign
well, I'm guessing if he had made steps to meet any of the six demands not related to Wolfe apologizing/resigning, he would still be president.
That is too rough ridin' crazy to be real. If it is, it rightfully belonged in the trash. Academia is becoming so worthless.
No idea what III is, V-VII seem like good ideas, but the others seem sort of outrageous.
IV-VII sound expensive, arbitrary and unlikely to do anything other than foster equivalent crusades.
Agreed the others seem absurd.
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 05:38:43 PM
Quote
No graduate students employees be paid below the individual poverty line.
All graduate student employees receive full tuition waivers.
A health care plan for the full term of all graduate students’ employment.
“Immediate action” from the university to aid international students affected by the loss of health insurance.
More graduate student housing that is also affordable.
A reinstatement of on-campus, university-sponsored childcare facilities the graduate students could use.
A waiver of “supplemental fees” charged to graduate student employees.
http://www.themaneater.com/stories/2015/11/4/mizzou-fails-fully-meet-demands/
Also, here were the 1969 demands (demand III in the current list):
Quote
The LBC issues a letter to Chancellor Schwada demanding campus changes that included an increase in Black faculty, the implementation of a Black Studies program, the establishment of a Black culture center, the dedicating of a campus building to a Black leader, periodically promoting Black service staff and employees, actively recruiting Black students, setting aside scholarships and implementing tutoring for Black students, having an annual "Black Week," increasing the number of Black cheerleaders and pom pom girls, and creating an office for the LBC.
Post by: chum1 on November 09, 2015, 05:42:09 PM
Quote
The nine deans met on Oct. 9 and on Oct. 13 met with Wolfe, Loftin and Provost Garnett Stokes to express their concerns, according to the letter.
“The issues we raised in those meetings have continued to deteriorate into a campus crisis that demands immediate and decisive action,” they wrote. “It is the Chancellor’s responsibility as the Chief Executive Officer of the campus to effectively address these campus issues.”
http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/article43827399.html
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 05:56:02 PM
How opportunistic.QuoteThe nine deans met on Oct. 9 and on Oct. 13 met with Wolfe, Loftin and Provost Garnett Stokes to express their concerns, according to the letter.
“The issues we raised in those meetings have continued to deteriorate into a campus crisis that demands immediate and decisive action,” they wrote. “It is the Chancellor’s responsibility as the Chief Executive Officer of the campus to effectively address these campus issues.”
http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/article43827399.html
What were the 9 admin and staffers with Jurist Doctorates and other walls full of degrees and certifications in the Chancellor Created Office of Equity doing?
I just watched a disgusting video from Yale where student protesters determined that only their speech was to be free, anyone else who disagreed with them was not entitled to their viewpoint, was not entitled to their freedom of speech and in fact must . . . resign if they were on the faculty and had the audacity to point out that if such censure and ominous demands at every perceived slight were to be met with resignations and firings that it was indeed a very slippery slope. Part of it was brought about by what? Another allegation that had not been verified as fact in any way. Mob rule.
Post by: chuckjames on November 09, 2015, 06:13:28 PM
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 06:39:02 PM
Sister went to mo st. Can confirm full of rednecks and st Louis kids.
Basically a commuter school
This guy I worked with during a summer in kc invited Reggie and I to come pak there, and then later told me I'd have to figure out a way to not bring Reggie because he was black and it wouldn't go well for him there.
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 06:40:31 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 06:40:55 PM
I can't figure out the "no media" part of all this. What is the beef?
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 06:41:25 PM
which yale thing are we talking about? I think someone mentioned it but maybe it deserves a separate thread.
SAE white girls only party?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 06:42:07 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
When your "bosses" are adolescents throwing temper tantrums, that argument kinda goes out the window.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 06:44:45 PM
Quote
In “The Coddling of the American Mind,” Greg Lukianoff and Jonathan Haidt argued that too many college students engage in “catastrophizing,” which is to say, turning common events into nightmarish trials or claiming that easily bearable events are too awful to bear. After citing examples, they concluded, “smart people do, in fact, overreact to innocuous speech, make mountains out of molehills, and seek punishment for anyone whose words make anyone else feel uncomfortable.”
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/the-new-intolerance-of-student-activism-at-yale/414810/
Quote
According to the Washington Post, “several students in Silliman said they cannot bear to live in the college anymore.” These are young people who live in safe, heated buildings with two Steinway grand pianos, an indoor basketball court, a courtyard with hammocks and picnic tables, a computer lab, a dance studio, a gym, a movie theater, a film editing lab, billiard tables, an art gallery, and four music practice rooms. But they can’t bear this setting that millions of people would risk their lives to inhabit because one woman wrote an email that hurt their feelings?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 06:50:38 PM
Quote
Some recent campus actions border on the surreal. In April, at Brandeis University, the Asian American student association sought to raise awareness of microaggressions against Asians through an installation on the steps of an academic hall. The installation gave examples of microaggressions such as “Aren’t you supposed to be good at math?” and “I’m colorblind! I don’t see race.” But a backlash arose among other Asian American students, who felt that the display itself was a microaggression. The association removed the installation, and its president wrote an e-mail to the entire student body apologizing to anyone who was “triggered or hurt by the content of the microaggressions.”
Quote
This new climate is slowly being institutionalized, and is affecting what can be said in the classroom, even as a basis for discussion. During the 2014–15 school year, for instance, the deans and department chairs at the 10 University of California system schools were presented by administrators at faculty leader-training sessions with examples of microaggressions. The list of offensive statements included: “America is the land of opportunity” and “I believe the most qualified person should get the job.”
Quote
But vindictive protectiveness teaches students to think in a very different way. It prepares them poorly for professional life, which often demands intellectual engagement with people and ideas one might find uncongenial or wrong. The harm may be more immediate, too. A campus culture devoted to policing speech and punishing speakers is likely to engender patterns of thought that are surprisingly similar to those long identified by cognitive behavioral therapists as causes of depression and anxiety. The new protectiveness may be teaching students to think pathologically.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 07:21:03 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
When your "bosses" are adolescents throwing temper tantrums, that argument kinda goes out the window.
His bosses are the governor and the board of curators and he resigned ten minutes after his meeting with them. You can do the math on that. I would say that they obviously weren't impressed with the job he's been doing.
Seems like you think people should have lifetime contracts but sorry bub, that's not how the real world works. In the real world people have to perform or run the risk of losing their job. This guy sucked, he got fired/resigned.
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 07:22:51 PM
QuoteIn “The Coddling of the American Mind,” Greg Lukianoff and Jonathan Haidt argued that too many college students engage in “catastrophizing,” which is to say, turning common events into nightmarish trials or claiming that easily bearable events are too awful to bear. After citing examples, they concluded, “smart people do, in fact, overreact to innocuous speech, make mountains out of molehills, and seek punishment for anyone whose words make anyone else feel uncomfortable.”
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/the-new-intolerance-of-student-activism-at-yale/414810/QuoteAccording to the Washington Post, “several students in Silliman said they cannot bear to live in the college anymore.” These are young people who live in safe, heated buildings with two Steinway grand pianos, an indoor basketball court, a courtyard with hammocks and picnic tables, a computer lab, a dance studio, a gym, a movie theater, a film editing lab, billiard tables, an art gallery, and four music practice rooms. But they can’t bear this setting that millions of people would risk their lives to inhabit because one woman wrote an email that hurt their feelings?
I like Conor's opinions. I don't think this is very comparable to what is happening at Mizzou though.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 07:25:44 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
When your "bosses" are adolescents throwing temper tantrums, that argument kinda goes out the window.
His bosses are the governor and the board of curators and he resigned ten minutes after his meeting with them. You can do the math on that. I would say that they obviously weren't impressed with the job he's been doing.
Seems like you think people should have lifetime contracts but sorry bub, that's not how the real world works. In the real world people have to perform or run the risk of losing their job. This guy sucked, he got fired/resigned.
Or they recognized that someone was going to have to fall on the sword. It happens you know . . . out there in the "real world".
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 07:27:42 PM
QuoteIn “The Coddling of the American Mind,” Greg Lukianoff and Jonathan Haidt argued that too many college students engage in “catastrophizing,” which is to say, turning common events into nightmarish trials or claiming that easily bearable events are too awful to bear. After citing examples, they concluded, “smart people do, in fact, overreact to innocuous speech, make mountains out of molehills, and seek punishment for anyone whose words make anyone else feel uncomfortable.”
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/the-new-intolerance-of-student-activism-at-yale/414810/QuoteAccording to the Washington Post, “several students in Silliman said they cannot bear to live in the college anymore.” These are young people who live in safe, heated buildings with two Steinway grand pianos, an indoor basketball court, a courtyard with hammocks and picnic tables, a computer lab, a dance studio, a gym, a movie theater, a film editing lab, billiard tables, an art gallery, and four music practice rooms. But they can’t bear this setting that millions of people would risk their lives to inhabit because one woman wrote an email that hurt their feelings?
I like Conor's opinions. I don't think this is very comparable to what is happening at Mizzou though.
“catastrophizing", walks hand in hand with the unsubstantiated allegations which make up the backbone of the claims at MU.
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 09, 2015, 07:28:29 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
When your "bosses" are adolescents throwing temper tantrums, that argument kinda goes out the window.
His bosses are the governor and the board of curators and he resigned ten minutes after his meeting with them. You can do the math on that. I would say that they obviously weren't impressed with the job he's been doing.
Seems like you think people should have lifetime contracts but sorry bub, that's not how the real world works. In the real world people have to perform or run the risk of losing their job. This guy sucked, he got fired/resigned.
Is this really the way you see it?
Post by: The Big Train on November 09, 2015, 07:28:52 PM
Post by: CHONGS on November 09, 2015, 07:39:04 PM
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 09, 2015, 07:40:06 PM
CEOs have to resign for all kinds of stuff. He wanted to run Mizzou like a business and the shareholders realized he was a lot cheaper to replace than to buyout the BYU game.
3 times as cheap
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 07:44:57 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 07:45:54 PM
I think dax still thinks this whole thing at mizzou is about the poop swastika
i don't think he cares to delve any further
Post by: sys on November 09, 2015, 07:57:41 PM
I like Conor's opinions. I don't think this is very comparable to what is happening at Mizzou though.
“catastrophizing", walks hand in hand with the unsubstantiated allegations which make up the backbone of the claims at MU.
this part is also a fairly clear parallel.
Quote
But many of the students believe that his responsibility is to hear their demands for an apology and to issue it. They see anything short of a confession of wrongdoing as unacceptable. In their view, one respects students by validating their subjective feelings.
Post by: sys on November 09, 2015, 07:59:41 PM
Quote
Some Yalies are defending their broken activist culture by seizing on more defensible reasons for being upset. “The protests are not really about Halloween costumes or a frat party,” Yale senior Aaron Lewis writes. “They’re about a mismatch between the Yale we find in admissions brochures and the Yale we experience every day. They’re about real experiences with racism on this campus that have gone unacknowledged for far too long. The university sells itself as a welcoming and inclusive place for people of all backgrounds. Unfortunately, it often isn’t.”
Post by: The Big Train on November 09, 2015, 08:16:43 PM
Post by: OK_Cat on November 09, 2015, 08:27:40 PM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 08:30:41 PM
The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
When your "bosses" are adolescents throwing temper tantrums, that argument kinda goes out the window.
His bosses are the governor and the board of curators and he resigned ten minutes after his meeting with them. You can do the math on that. I would say that they obviously weren't impressed with the job he's been doing.
Seems like you think people should have lifetime contracts but sorry bub, that's not how the real world works. In the real world people have to perform or run the risk of losing their job. This guy sucked, he got fired/resigned.
Is this really the way you see it?
some other people apparently do/did as well...
Rep. Steve Cookson, a Republican from Poplar Bluff who chairs the House Higher Education Committee, joined Jones later in the day with a statement calling for Wolfe to either resign or be fired, even hinting at some sort of legislative action if Wolfe is allowed to remain.
“It has become clear that the MU system leadership can no longer effectively lead and should step aside,” Cookson said. “Failing that the University of Missouri system board of curators should force a change in leadership. Failing this common sense approach it will be incumbent for the governor and the General Assembly to take the appropriate steps to protect this important public asset.”
Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/the-buzz/article43682574.html#storylink=cpy
Post by: chum1 on November 09, 2015, 08:35:18 PM
http://gawker.com/professor-of-mass-media-seen-calling-for-muscle-to-bl-1741597776
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 09, 2015, 08:44:56 PM
Interesting, I think he got fired because the board believes that firing him will appease the Mob, even though the board knows the mob has unreasonable demands. The mob has developed effective economic leverage. I have little respect for this type of strong-arm tactic, seems kinda rainbow-pushy to me. :dunno:The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
When your "bosses" are adolescents throwing temper tantrums, that argument kinda goes out the window.
His bosses are the governor and the board of curators and he resigned ten minutes after his meeting with them. You can do the math on that. I would say that they obviously weren't impressed with the job he's been doing.
Seems like you think people should have lifetime contracts but sorry bub, that's not how the real world works. In the real world people have to perform or run the risk of losing their job. This guy sucked, he got fired/resigned.
Is this really the way you see it?
some other people apparently do/did as well...
Rep. Steve Cookson, a Republican from Poplar Bluff who chairs the House Higher Education Committee, joined Jones later in the day with a statement calling for Wolfe to either resign or be fired, even hinting at some sort of legislative action if Wolfe is allowed to remain.
“It has become clear that the MU system leadership can no longer effectively lead and should step aside,” Cookson said. “Failing that the University of Missouri system board of curators should force a change in leadership. Failing this common sense approach it will be incumbent for the governor and the General Assembly to take the appropriate steps to protect this important public asset.”
Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/the-buzz/article43682574.html#storylink=cpy
Post by: OK_Cat on November 09, 2015, 08:45:55 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 09, 2015, 08:47:09 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 08:48:41 PM
You are correct (at least with your second quote). If that is the case, I think it's wrong to focus on the response to the costume email.I like Conor's opinions. I don't think this is very comparable to what is happening at Mizzou though.
“catastrophizing", walks hand in hand with the unsubstantiated allegations which make up the backbone of the claims at MU.
this part is also a fairly clear parallel.QuoteBut many of the students believe that his responsibility is to hear their demands for an apology and to issue it. They see anything short of a confession of wrongdoing as unacceptable. In their view, one respects students by validating their subjective feelings.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 08:49:44 PM
Interesting, I think he got fired because the board believes that firing him will appease the Mob, even though the board knows the mob has unreasonable demands. The mob has developed effective economic leverage. I have little respect for this type of strong-arm tactic, seems kinda rainbow-pushy to me. :dunno:The funniest/saddest thing about the "collective" attacks against "institutional" or "systemic" racism or prejudice is that the people advocating against it want the masses to understand and agree with "the movement" while being simultaneously told they cannot actually understand what "the movement" is or is about. It's rampant in this thread.
Yay, completely making crap up! Same script, different topic.
It is an observation and self evident in this thread and others in the pit. The entire sensitivity movement, which entails per se slander and libel against a targeted public figure, is premised upon perceived and unquantifiable injustices caused by institutions under the control of numerous people (e.g., government, corporations or universities). Nobody can ever know what the standard is or should be, because it is forever defined as "not that".
I cannot believe that the people targeted have almost universally decided to back down and quit, rather than stand up for themselves. I know you think this is progress, and it may very well be, but the method used to achieve this result is fundamentally immoral and ripe for abuse, which is terrifying from a societal standpoint.
he quit because he did a bad job and his bosses told him to quit. that's pretty simple. you seem to think that underperforming people in this country should just be allowed to work with no repercussions which is, sad really.
When your "bosses" are adolescents throwing temper tantrums, that argument kinda goes out the window.
His bosses are the governor and the board of curators and he resigned ten minutes after his meeting with them. You can do the math on that. I would say that they obviously weren't impressed with the job he's been doing.
Seems like you think people should have lifetime contracts but sorry bub, that's not how the real world works. In the real world people have to perform or run the risk of losing their job. This guy sucked, he got fired/resigned.
Is this really the way you see it?
some other people apparently do/did as well...
Rep. Steve Cookson, a Republican from Poplar Bluff who chairs the House Higher Education Committee, joined Jones later in the day with a statement calling for Wolfe to either resign or be fired, even hinting at some sort of legislative action if Wolfe is allowed to remain.
“It has become clear that the MU system leadership can no longer effectively lead and should step aside,” Cookson said. “Failing that the University of Missouri system board of curators should force a change in leadership. Failing this common sense approach it will be incumbent for the governor and the General Assembly to take the appropriate steps to protect this important public asset.”
Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/the-buzz/article43682574.html#storylink=cpy
there wouldn't be a mob if the guy wasn't horrible at his job
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 09, 2015, 08:53:32 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 09, 2015, 08:54:21 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 08:57:25 PM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 09, 2015, 09:02:20 PM
I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
They don't want you to understand, just approve; and if you aren't busy, join the mob
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:02:32 PM
I think dax still thinks this whole thing at mizzou is about the poop swastika
Nope, wrong. Still waiting on that list of what the chancellor should have done.
Still wondering what that appointed and created (by the chancellor) equity office was up to.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:04:36 PM
Just inexplicably oblivious.
http://gawker.com/professor-of-mass-media-seen-calling-for-muscle-to-bl-1741597776
The Brownshirts are jealous.
Post by: wetwillie on November 09, 2015, 09:06:53 PM
Post by: sys on November 09, 2015, 09:07:01 PM
I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
they want to control their own narrative and they are suspicious of the media as being an arm of the establishment. they aren't wrong on either front. just wrong about having the legal and ethical right to dictate the actions of other individuals peaceably occupying public space.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:11:09 PM
I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
they want to control their own narrative and they are suspicious of the media as being an arm of the establishment. they aren't wrong on either front. just wrong about having the legal and ethical right to dictate the actions of other individuals peaceably occupying public space.
As we are finding out over and over these people have no interest in free speech or dissenting opinions.
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 09:12:55 PM
That makes sense. See the "swag surfin'" tweet wacky shared. I can see why they wouldn't want jerky media guys around if that's the portrayal they get. But yeah, not much they can really do about it.I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
they want to control their own narrative and they are suspicious of the media as being an arm of the establishment. they aren't wrong on either front. just wrong about having the legal and ethical right to dictate the actions of other individuals peaceably occupying public space.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:13:41 PM
That makes sense. See the "swag surfin'" tweet wacky shared. I can see why they wouldn't want jerky media guys around if that's the portrayal they get. But yeah, not much they can really do about it.I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
they want to control their own narrative and they are suspicious of the media as being an arm of the establishment. they aren't wrong on either front. just wrong about having the legal and ethical right to dictate the actions of other individuals peaceably occupying public space.
Yeah MEDIA!!
But if MEDIA is there to capture the targeted administrator then MEDIA!!! Is awesome and ya know, non jerky and stuff.
Post by: chum1 on November 09, 2015, 09:15:53 PM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 09:17:45 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 09, 2015, 09:18:41 PM
https://twitter.com/dennisdoddcbs/status/663900683960119296Poor kid. What a bunch of assholes those people were.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 09:21:26 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:23:24 PM
hundreds of students have issues with the school that they are paying money to attend and attempt to talk to the president about them for months. the president refuses to listen and then acts like he's done nothing wrong, so they complain loud and long enough that they get him fired and hopefully replaced with a president that will listen. 50 year old white men from ten states away cry foul. film at 11.
So when he created that office of equity occupied by highly paid admins and staffers, that was "doing nothing"? So what was he to do about a "drunk college student" and "people or persons driving in a pickup"?
Not 10 states away either.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 09:25:57 PM
"ok what's your story"
"HEY I NEED SOME MUSCLE OVER HERE TO MOVE THIS REPORTER OFF OF THE MIDDLE OF CAMPUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 09, 2015, 09:27:13 PM
Loftin's decision came after nine deans from nine different departments called for his dismissal in a letter sent Monday to Wolfe and the school's Board of Curators. The Columbia Tribune reports that the calls for Loftin's removal stemmed from problems before the recent protests over racial inequality:
"The deans said Loftin has shown failed leadership through a number of instances, including the elimination and eventual reinstatement of graduate assistant health insurance and the elimination of the vice chancellor for health sciences position. The deans claim Loftin created a 'toxic environment through threat, fear and intimidation.'
"'It is imperative to take immediate action to begin the process of resolving the issues and improving the environment,' they wrote."
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/11/09/455324174/amid-controversy-university-of-missouri-system-president-resigns?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=202609
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:30:14 PM
yep. just a couple of overreacting coddled 18 year olds that cost this great president and chancellor their jobs...
Loftin's decision came after nine deans from nine different departments called for his dismissal in a letter sent Monday to Wolfe and the school's Board of Curators. The Columbia Tribune reports that the calls for Loftin's removal stemmed from problems before the recent protests over racial inequality:
"The deans said Loftin has shown failed leadership through a number of instances, including the elimination and eventual reinstatement of graduate assistant health insurance and the elimination of the vice chancellor for health sciences position. The deans claim Loftin created a 'toxic environment through threat, fear and intimidation.'
"'It is imperative to take immediate action to begin the process of resolving the issues and improving the environment,' they wrote."
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/11/09/455324174/amid-controversy-university-of-missouri-system-president-resigns?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=202609
Oh gosh, highly paid academics upset that the status quo was upset by the new guy in charge. A first in
Academia!!
Post by: Trim on November 09, 2015, 09:32:35 PM
I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
they want to control their own narrative and they are suspicious of the media as being an arm of the establishment. they aren't wrong on either front. just wrong about having the legal and ethical right to dictate the actions of other individuals peaceably occupying public space.
https://twitter.com/CS_1950/status/663871149080604672
https://twitter.com/CS_1950/status/663871600488378368
https://twitter.com/CS_1950/status/663872027879538689
https://twitter.com/CS_1950/status/663872136667267073
https://twitter.com/CS_1950/status/663873372187525122
https://twitter.com/CS_1950/status/663873763033788416
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 09:34:20 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:35:26 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 09, 2015, 09:35:58 PM
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 09, 2015, 09:41:12 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 09:43:29 PM
Are all these liberal democrat college presidents racist?
lots of them are, absolutely.
And thanks for those tweets, trim. I still don't feel like I'm getting the full explanation of what's going on.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 09, 2015, 09:44:25 PM
Post by: cfbandyman on November 09, 2015, 09:44:55 PM
https://twitter.com/dennisdoddcbs/status/663900683960119296
While I don't really like that they are shutting down the the media. I get their angst from the sense that the media has been pretty crappy for a long time. Mostly this sort of video to me proves once again that media, and really all of us, aren't really ready for the internet. Such videos like this didn't exist 10 years and more ago cause technology wasn't there. Nowadays everyone has a smartphone, everyone has a "personal scoop" on something and we're getting to see events covered from so many angles that was just never even remotely possible before. Before where it was just a few reporters embedded with troops describing massive amounts of action in a few concise sentences on a page, or reporting on a protest happening on the other side of the country through print or a few snippets of videos/pictures from a select few it becomes easy to distill a complex event into a concise narrative, making it easy to follow.
Now we have this amalgam of multiple narratives happening all at once in real time, making it super muddled, super confusing, and so easy to have this story (once again thanks to technology to have a platform to do this with) to be dissected and split into a zillion different opinions and really getting everyone even more riled up than necessary. I assert such crap we're seeing this in video, as with so many other videos out there from other events has happened all the time and in all places. The difference between someone getting all up in the media's business in the 60's and being able to tell their story without having a go between was zilch vs today where a simple quick vid shows both the best and worst of every event, real, raw, and laid bare. Sure, the media has all the right to be there. Sure the protesters should respect the reporter who has a job to do, but also sure is it completely possible that the story those reporters were going to write was going to be the complete and asinine drivel that most of the media has descended to over the years.
Personally, I'm glad that the Mizzou's students organized together to get what they thought was right done, and did it without having to need to have the entire country descend upon them to get it accomplished (well, until the football team really blew it open). If the President didn't do what he's put there to do, be a leader and protect his students from voiced opinions by punting the issues and kicking the can down the road, than he shouldn't be President.
Post by: DQ12 on November 09, 2015, 09:54:13 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 09, 2015, 09:55:16 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 10:10:25 PM
Yeah, the no media crap is absolutely ridiculous. You don't get to protest in a public space and then bully people who try to report on the public spectacle you've created.
Are some of you finally starting to realize how thuggish, crazy, and extreme these people are?
Your first hint was that they wanted to fire the university president - not because he actually did something racist, but because he wasn't responsive enough to things like the Ferguson riots and a few reports of racist heckling. No word on exactly how he should have responded, but it seems to have something to do with confessing white guilt and privilege.
In a way though, it's perfectly just. Liberal university faculty created these PC whack jobs, and now they reap what they sow. And they still refuse to learn. As the prez stepped down today, he apologized to the mob. Maybe he meant it, maybe he's just protecting his pension, but the appeasement is the same.
Post by: DQ12 on November 09, 2015, 10:14:30 PM
you can screw off, buster.Yeah, the no media crap is absolutely ridiculous. You don't get to protest in a public space and then bully people who try to report on the public spectacle you've created.
Are some of you finally starting to realize how thuggish, crazy, and extreme these people are?
Post by: star seed 7 on November 09, 2015, 10:15:19 PM
Yeah, the no media crap is absolutely ridiculous. You don't get to protest in a public space and then bully people who try to report on the public spectacle you've created.
Are some of you finally starting to realize how thuggish, crazy, and extreme these people are?
Your first hint was that they wanted to fire the university president - not because he actually did something racist, but because he wasn't responsive enough to things like the Ferguson riots and a few reports of racist heckling. No word on exactly how he should have responded, but it seems to have something to do with confessing white guilt and privilege.
In a way though, it's perfectly just. Liberal university faculty created these PC whack jobs, and now they reap what they sow. And they still refuse to learn. As the prez stepped down today, he apologized to the mob. Maybe he meant it, maybe he's just protecting his pension, but the appeasement is the same.
Lol
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 10:23:53 PM
Reap. Sow.
Post by: OK_Cat on November 09, 2015, 10:25:58 PM
Post by: OK_Cat on November 09, 2015, 10:26:31 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 10:31:47 PM
Luked, but worth revisiting. Vox: I'm a Liberal Professor, and My Liberal Students Terrify Me (http://www.vox.com/2015/6/3/8706323/college-professor-afraid).
Reap. Sow.
seems like professors and grad students should organize and fight back.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 09, 2015, 10:32:46 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 10:33:21 PM
Post by: OK_Cat on November 09, 2015, 10:37:49 PM
And right on cue, okiecat tossed in a racism jab. Hey bad person - the PC mob is composed of all races.
You should be more like Dax and just own up to who you are
Post by: sys on November 09, 2015, 10:38:28 PM
That makes sense. See the "swag surfin'" tweet wacky shared. I can see why they wouldn't want jerky media guys around if that's the portrayal they get.
they retweeted a tweet celebrating the swag surf, so i don't think they objected to that portrayal.
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2015, 10:45:59 PM
That makes sense. See the "swag surfin'" tweet wacky shared. I can see why they wouldn't want jerky media guys around if that's the portrayal they get.
they retweeted a tweet celebrating the swag surf, so i don't think they objected to that portrayal.
yeah, I noticed that after my post. I really don't know.
Post by: sys on November 09, 2015, 10:55:50 PM
I noticed that after my post. I really don't know.
you're a sorta liberal engineer and missouri's possibly liberal students confuse you.
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 09, 2015, 11:05:15 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:13:27 PM
I wasn't aware of it before yesterday but K-State has done a very good job with inclusivity initatives. I was attempting to find information on minority faculty when I found a page laying it all out, wish I would have posted it.
Not the least bit surprising you were utterly unaware of an initiative started during the Wefald administration.
:lol: it was actually within K-State 2025, but thank you for talking out of your ass again
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:23:57 PM
I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
they want to control their own narrative and they are suspicious of the media as being an arm of the establishment. they aren't wrong on either front. just wrong about having the legal and ethical right to dictate the actions of other individuals peaceably occupying public space.
Second best post in the thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:27:53 PM
https://twitter.com/dennisdoddcbs/status/663900683960119296
While I don't really like that they are shutting down the the media. I get their angst from the sense that the media has been pretty crappy for a long time. Mostly this sort of video to me proves once again that media, and really all of us, aren't really ready for the internet. Such videos like this didn't exist 10 years and more ago cause technology wasn't there. Nowadays everyone has a smartphone, everyone has a "personal scoop" on something and we're getting to see events covered from so many angles that was just never even remotely possible before. Before where it was just a few reporters embedded with troops describing massive amounts of action in a few concise sentences on a page, or reporting on a protest happening on the other side of the country through print or a few snippets of videos/pictures from a select few it becomes easy to distill a complex event into a concise narrative, making it easy to follow.
Now we have this amalgam of multiple narratives happening all at once in real time, making it super muddled, super confusing, and so easy to have this story (once again thanks to technology to have a platform to do this with) to be dissected and split into a zillion different opinions and really getting everyone even more riled up than necessary. I assert such crap we're seeing this in video, as with so many other videos out there from other events has happened all the time and in all places. The difference between someone getting all up in the media's business in the 60's and being able to tell their story without having a go between was zilch vs today where a simple quick vid shows both the best and worst of every event, real, raw, and laid bare. Sure, the media has all the right to be there. Sure the protesters should respect the reporter who has a job to do, but also sure is it completely possible that the story those reporters were going to write was going to be the complete and asinine drivel that most of the media has descended to over the years.
Personally, I'm glad that the Mizzou's students organized together to get what they thought was right done, and did it without having to need to have the entire country descend upon them to get it accomplished (well, until the football team really blew it open). If the President didn't do what he's put there to do, be a leader and protect his students from voiced opinions by punting the issues and kicking the can down the road, than he shouldn't be President.
Man, this is fantastic.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:31:42 PM
The no media thing is extremely dumb, especially as they tweet out stuff on social media, and take away their student journalist from the interaction of this schools "successful event". However, good for them and stuff, it's still a little weird. "Be heard, on our own agenda!"
It's flawed logic for sure, it really isn't any more cynical than that. This is emotional and people acting on emotion don't always do everything right.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 09, 2015, 11:33:29 PM
Good point.The no media thing is extremely dumb, especially as they tweet out stuff on social media, and take away their student journalist from the interaction of this schools "successful event". However, good for them and stuff, it's still a little weird. "Be heard, on our own agenda!"
It's flawed logic for sure, it really isn't any more cynical than that. This is emotional and people acting on emotion don't always do everything right.
Post by: DQ12 on November 09, 2015, 11:39:52 PM
I also think some good movements sometimes get coopted by some really dumb/bad people like the "we need some muscle over here" professor.The no media thing is extremely dumb, especially as they tweet out stuff on social media, and take away their student journalist from the interaction of this schools "successful event". However, good for them and stuff, it's still a little weird. "Be heard, on our own agenda!"
It's flawed logic for sure, it really isn't any more cynical than that. This is emotional and people acting on emotion don't always do everything right.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:45:30 PM
I thought the professor's reaction was stupid and I don't at all agree with it. I also understand the student's issue with her having that opinion when she and her husband essentially oversee housing and student life for that group or whatever. Where I depart is the students trying to stifle thoughts and opinion, also their claims that they don't feel safe with those people staying in their roles is absurd.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2015, 11:52:10 PM
I wasn't aware of it before yesterday but K-State has done a very good job with inclusivity initatives. I was attempting to find information on minority faculty when I found a page laying it all out, wish I would have posted it.
Not the least bit surprising you were utterly unaware of an initiative started during the Wefald administration.
:lol: it was actually within K-State 2025, but thank you for talking out of your ass again
Found it
http://www.k-state.edu/today/announcement.php?id=17336
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 01:11:11 AM
I wasn't aware of it before yesterday but K-State has done a very good job with inclusivity initatives. I was attempting to find information on minority faculty when I found a page laying it all out, wish I would have posted it.
Not the least bit surprising you were utterly unaware of an initiative started during the Wefald administration.
:lol: it was actually within K-State 2025, but thank you for talking out of your ass again
Wefald started the trend and the emphasis, totally lifted from his initiatives. But if you want to think its all Kirk Schulz's idea go ahead :rolleyes
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 01:13:14 AM
I also think some good movements sometimes get coopted by some really dumb/bad people like the "we need some muscle over here" professor.
you're scapegoating. the professor was adhering to exactly the same message as the rest of the group. a message that was coordinated enough that it was expressed by the group's twitter account and on signs planted in the ground.
the only real difference is that the professor articulated an implicit threat of violence that the earlier group left unspoken. kind of ironic, since her willingness to articulate such a threat would almost certainly fall under the category of "white privilege" (such a stupid term). although it should really also considered female privilege, since most white males would be self-aware enough to not escalate a confrontation with a similar threat.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 01:14:41 AM
And right on cue, okiecat tossed in a racism jab. Hey bad person - the PC mob is composed of all races.
You should be more like Dax and just own up to who you are
Yeah, I owned up to disagreeing with some things.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 07:41:48 AM
Maybe so. But I think it's especially shameful when a college professor engages in or endorses juvenile bullying tactics like that. She should really know better.I also think some good movements sometimes get coopted by some really dumb/bad people like the "we need some muscle over here" professor.
you're scapegoating. the professor was adhering to exactly the same message as the rest of the group. a message that was coordinated enough that it was expressed by the group's twitter account and on signs planted in the ground.
the only real difference is that the professor articulated an implicit threat of violence that the earlier group left unspoken. kind of ironic, since her willingness to articulate such a threat would almost certainly fall under the category of "white privilege" (such a stupid term). although it should really also considered female privilege, since most white males would be self-aware enough to not escalate a confrontation with a similar threat.
Post by: lopakman on November 10, 2015, 08:09:15 AM
Part of this is ridiculous. So the president is supposed to just get up and say "hey guys sorry for being white and for all the privilege's it's brought me. I totally go to where I am because of my skin color and not hard work"
Also asking him to recognize what we know exists 'systems of oppression' at some level in every college is stupid. What's next every white university is supposed to apologize for their 'white male privilege? There's other demands that are poorly worded too, this one just stands out the most.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 08:16:16 AM
When you're a college professor of communications, it's the dumbest thing you could do! She gone!Maybe so. But I think it's especially shameful when a college professor engages in or endorses juvenile bullying tactics like that. She should really know better.I also think some good movements sometimes get coopted by some really dumb/bad people like the "we need some muscle over here" professor.
you're scapegoating. the professor was adhering to exactly the same message as the rest of the group. a message that was coordinated enough that it was expressed by the group's twitter account and on signs planted in the ground.
the only real difference is that the professor articulated an implicit threat of violence that the earlier group left unspoken. kind of ironic, since her willingness to articulate such a threat would almost certainly fall under the category of "white privilege" (such a stupid term). although it should really also considered female privilege, since most white males would be self-aware enough to not escalate a confrontation with a similar threat.
Post by: chum1 on November 10, 2015, 08:35:23 AM
Post by: Pete on November 10, 2015, 08:43:00 AM
Mizzou's game against BYU next week at arrowhead is a "whiteout."
(https://www.themizzoustore.com/images/Product/medium/195747.jpg)
What are the odds? Wow.
Post by: Pete on November 10, 2015, 08:46:47 AM
It's a very real possibility that the only reason Wolfe actually resigned is that he did not want to acknowledge his white male privilege.
Frankly, it was probably a wake up call that he was squandering it.
I mean eff, if you are a former software exec, do you want a relatively low paying, high pain in the ass job like that? No way Jose. You go get on some boards (at $200K+ a pop) that meet once a quarter and you volunteer at a few PGA events and you enjoy what the socioeconomic lottery gave you!
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 08:47:33 AM
Post by: kso_FAN on November 10, 2015, 08:48:59 AM
Post by: chum1 on November 10, 2015, 08:49:49 AM
I don't understand the anti-media thing at all.
they want to control their own narrative and they are suspicious of the media as being an arm of the establishment. they aren't wrong on either front. just wrong about having the legal and ethical right to dictate the actions of other individuals peaceably occupying public space.
When you posted that did you realize that the media were disrespecting a black space?
https://twitter.com/CS_1950/status/663863466713714688
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 08:51:18 AM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 08:56:15 AM
Since we are assigning political parties to people involved here, can we get a confirmation from the right that the people shouting n-word at the student body president are probably republican leaning?
Yes, confirmed.
Post by: Pete on November 10, 2015, 08:57:46 AM
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 09:01:28 AM
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 09:18:20 AM
It's good that there's finally an issue in this whole saga for media types to be passionate about.Particularly the sportswriters. They love a chance to be sanctimonious.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 09:18:51 AM
Rich old white men slumming it in academia is offensive. Squandering gifts from God. Get out there and maximize your privilege! It's like Len Bias doing coke. What a waste.Ha!
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 09:20:14 AM
It's good that there's finally an issue in this whole saga for media types to be passionate about.Particularly the sportswriters. They love a chance to be sanctimonious.
:party:
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 09:22:49 AM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 09:24:52 AM
I mean, Clay Travis went OFFYes. That article was a little hamfisted.
http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/outkick-the-coverage/mizzou-protest-is-total-charade-110915 (http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/outkick-the-coverage/mizzou-protest-is-total-charade-110915)
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 09:32:14 AM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 09:37:01 AM
Nothing riles up semi-successful white males quite like hearing the phrase "white male privilege" :lol:Agreed -- but I'm not sure people need to acknowledge every advantage they benefit from. It seems a little demeaning.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 09:38:40 AM
They even have a method to report "bias" on line. (hopefully anyone accused of that won't be subjected to a 250 day secret investigation that yielded comical findings like the prof out in California was subjected to, but I digress).
On the flip side, I'd hazard to say given all the various programs initiated by the Chancellor like the Office of Equity (with investigators) and the Chancellor's Diversity Initiative that they were fighting an uphill battle, after all, Missouri is gonna Missouri.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 09:42:52 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 09:48:18 AM
Nothing riles up semi-successful white males quite like hearing the phrase "white male privilege" :lol:Agreed -- but I'm not sure people need to acknowledge every advantage they benefit from. It seems a little demeaning.
Is anyone (seriously) asking that? Seems the president was only asked to acknowledge that after months of brushing aside the concerns of his minority students. Asking someone in power to acknowledge their own advantages seems like step one in getting that person to work towards closing the privilege gap
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 09:53:08 AM
Nothing riles up semi-successful white males quite like hearing the phrase "white male privilege" :lol:Agreed -- but I'm not sure people need to acknowledge every advantage they benefit from. It seems a little demeaning.
Is anyone (seriously) asking that? Seems the president was only asked to acknowledge that after months of brushing aside the concerns of his minority students. Asking someone in power to acknowledge their own advantages seems like step one in getting that person to work towards closing the privilege gap
https://equity.missouri.edu/bias-reporting/
It would appear that the availability of that portal wasn't well known??
Or that: Noel Ann English J.D. and here investigatory team were ineffective . . . or were their efforts being thwarted by the Chancellor's office? It would seem strange that the Chancellor of the entire Missouri system would be involved in such granular day-to-day detail considering that they fell under the purview of what appear to be well credentialed and fairly to highly compensated administrators and staff.
Possibly these people need to resign as well?
Post by: 8manpick on November 10, 2015, 09:56:21 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 09:56:49 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 09:59:10 AM
Asking anyone to publicly affirm their white privilege is rough ridin' asinine
I tend to agree, but I understand why they put that provision in
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 09:59:51 AM
I have no idea dax, I'm not a MU student or board member
Oh okay, then I'll just say that it appears there were a number of departments that either weren't utilized by the students with the grievances and/or the people in those departments were highly ineffective at their jobs and//or somehow those departments were being kept from doing their job.
Has there been any information come out to say that the Chancellor wasn't allowing these people to do their job?
Post by: 8manpick on November 10, 2015, 09:59:56 AM
Asking anyone to publicly affirm their white privilege is rough ridin' asinine
I tend to agree, but I understand why they put that provision in
So you agree it is stupid but understand why they put it in? That sounds stupid
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:01:41 AM
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:02:32 AM
Asking anyone to publicly affirm their white privilege is rough ridin' asinineWhy?
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:04:33 AM
Well, in this case in particular. It would be pretty crazy to do that to random Joe's walking down the street.Asking anyone to publicly affirm their white privilege is rough ridin' asinineWhy?
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 10:05:54 AM
Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?Those aren't public places. MU's quad is.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:06:33 AM
A stadium isn't a public place?Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?Those aren't public places. MU's quad is.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 10:06:45 AM
I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
I'm sure the legality is on the presses side, but common decency to not photograph people who don't want to be photographed should have some weight. I doubt many people would be outraged if some creep was blocked from taking pictures of children in swimsuits
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 10:07:18 AM
I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
It's not that tricky. Public space is open to the public, and anyone with a camera is free to photograph or film anything that takes place there.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:08:33 AM
He could still take photos and say whatever he wanted. They just were blocking him from going wherever he wanted.I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
It's not that tricky. Public space is open to the public, and anyone with a camera is free to photograph or film anything that takes place there.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 10:08:59 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 10:09:23 AM
I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
While one could argue that on a college campus a football stadium is a public space, there are also provisions that keep unauthorized people off the field and it's highly likely when the press agrees to accept their credentials to be on the sidelines they agree to abide by certain rules and standards. In the case of K-State, the gameday operations come under the jurisdiction of K-State Athletics Incorporated who of course yield to law enforcement in regards to certain issues. I think one could reasonably say that K-State Athletics is allowed by charter (for lack of better words) to operate game days as they see fit and control access as they see fit. In the case of injuries I suspect K-State (or any other school) has HIPPA on their side as well.
I don't think the commons sections of main college (public) campuses falls under the same oversight, and in particular it's certainly not something that students or protesters can enforce by their own choosing. At least I don't think so . . . the administration on the other hand probably has a litany of laws on their side if they chose to do so. Not saying it's right or wrong, just saying.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 10:10:02 AM
The field/sideline isn't.A stadium isn't a public place?Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?Those aren't public places. MU's quad is.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 10:10:25 AM
He could still take photos and say whatever he wanted. They just were blocking him from going wherever he wanted.I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
It's not that tricky. Public space is open to the public, and anyone with a camera is free to photograph or film anything that takes place there.
Yeah, oddly you are allowed to photograph people in public places, but you aren't allowed to assault them.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:10:26 AM
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:12:15 AM
He could still take photos and say whatever he wanted. They just were blocking him from going wherever he wanted.I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
It's not that tricky. Public space is open to the public, and anyone with a camera is free to photograph or film anything that takes place there.
Yeah, oddly you are allowed to photograph people in public places, but you aren't allowed to assault them.
That was assault?
Post by: Skipper44 on November 10, 2015, 10:13:13 AM
IDK Pete, you are selling the bennies of being a UP short. I mean, suites at all games and flying the U jet or at the very least the team charter to roadies.It's a very real possibility that the only reason Wolfe actually resigned is that he did not want to acknowledge his white male privilege.
Frankly, it was probably a wake up call that he was squandering it.
I mean eff, if you are a former software exec, do you want a relatively low paying, high pain in the ass job like that? No way Jose. You go get on some boards (at $200K+ a pop) that meet once a quarter and you volunteer at a few PGA events and you enjoy what the socioeconomic lottery gave you!
I will say this shack of a President's House is a joke, no wonder they rent it out for similar rates to the typical subdivision clubhouse
(https://www.umsystem.edu/media/images/providence_point_header.jpg)
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 10:14:07 AM
He could still take photos and say whatever he wanted. They just were blocking him from going wherever he wanted.I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
It's not that tricky. Public space is open to the public, and anyone with a camera is free to photograph or film anything that takes place there.
Yeah, oddly you are allowed to photograph people in public places, but you aren't allowed to assault them.
That was assault?
He was pushed several times, and the professor asking for muscle also grabbed the video camera. You can't just lay your hands on other people in a threatening way. It's assault.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 10:14:37 AM
Would HIPPA apply to someone on a hunger strike?
If they were under medical care, sure.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 10:15:57 AM
If the crowd had just formed a human chain blocking access and the lady wouldn't have grabbed the camera, would it have been assault? (I really don't know)He could still take photos and say whatever he wanted. They just were blocking him from going wherever he wanted.I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
It's not that tricky. Public space is open to the public, and anyone with a camera is free to photograph or film anything that takes place there.
Yeah, oddly you are allowed to photograph people in public places, but you aren't allowed to assault them.
That was assault?
He was pushed several times, and the professor asking for muscle also grabbed the video camera. You can't just lay your hands on other people in a threatening way. It's assault.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 10:17:55 AM
If the crowd had just formed a human chain blocking access and the lady wouldn't have grabbed the camera, would it have been assault? (I really don't know)He could still take photos and say whatever he wanted. They just were blocking him from going wherever he wanted.I've been thinking about blocking reporters. Is this really a first amendment issue? Are athletic trainers that block cameras with towels while an injured player is being treated violating the first amendment?
The use of public space issue is tricky. What is the precedence for things like keeping simultaneous opposing protests separate? I honestly don't know.
It's not that tricky. Public space is open to the public, and anyone with a camera is free to photograph or film anything that takes place there.
Yeah, oddly you are allowed to photograph people in public places, but you aren't allowed to assault them.
That was assault?
He was pushed several times, and the professor asking for muscle also grabbed the video camera. You can't just lay your hands on other people in a threatening way. It's assault.
Not unless they were verbally threatening him, or walking the chain forward and pushing him back.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 10, 2015, 10:21:50 AM
http://ethicalnag.org/2010/10/15/why-doctors-get-sued/
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 10:23:35 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 10:25:00 AM
seriously though. that president is out of a job for the same reason that doctors get sued. he didn't actively listen or engage the students, brushed them off, passed them on, showed no empathy, etc. it looks like he maybe realized it at the end but who knows.
http://ethicalnag.org/2010/10/15/why-doctors-get-sued/
It appears, at least on the surface there was an entire infrastructure put in place for the students to take their grievances to, did the students not do that, or did those people not do their job?
If they didn't do their job, it looks like a lot of money has been expended on people to fulfill a role in creating a better environment on campus, and they failed, miserably. Or, did they?
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 10, 2015, 10:45:13 AM
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 10:52:00 AM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 11:05:00 AM
FREEDOM OF THE PRESS BEING TRAMPLED.i mean, yeah! who cares about that! if he had a problem with it, he should've just gone somewhere else!
Post by: AppleJack on November 10, 2015, 11:11:38 AM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:12:44 AM
so what's going on here?
I started a thread and it got to 19 pages!!!!
Post by: AppleJack on November 10, 2015, 11:15:01 AM
so what's going on here?
I started a thread and it got to 19 pages!!!!
is it gonna catch my Royals thread? :ohno:
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:15:29 AM
so what's going on here?
I started a thread and it got to 19 pages!!!!
is it gonna catch my Royals thread? :ohno:
if it does, i'll get some muscle and shut it down
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 11:19:51 AM
I. we demand that the University of Missouri system president, Tim Wolfe, writes a handwritten apology for the Concerned Students 1–9 – 5–0 demonstrators and holds a press conference in the Mizzou Student Center reading the letter. In the letter and at the press conference, Tim Wolfe must acknowledge his white male privilege, recognize that systems of oppression exist, and provide a verbal commitment to fulfilling Concerned Student 1–9 – 5–0 demands. We want Tim Wolfe to admit to his gross negligence, allowing his driver to hit one of the demonstrators, consenting to the physical violence of bystanders, and Leslie refusing to intervene when Columbia Police Department use excessive force with demonstrators.
Part of this is ridiculous. So the president is supposed to just get up and say "hey guys sorry for being white and for all the privilege's it's brought me. I totally go to where I am because of my skin color and not hard work"
Also asking him to recognize what we know exists 'systems of oppression' at some level in every college is stupid. What's next every white university is supposed to apologize for their 'white male privilege? There's other demands that are poorly worded too, this one just stands out the most.
Those terms were supposed to be negotiated, he didn't have to agree to do that to appease the group.
Also I completely disagree with the bolded part for a couple of reasons. One saying that this exists at some level at every college is a cop out, and frankly isn't relevant to the situation at Missouri. What do you want them to say, "oh well this happens everywhere so we shouldn't force someone to acknowledge the problems we're having here." Secondly, it is important for the president to acknowledge that these things exist so that people can acknowledge that the issue exists. The white president vocally acknowledging these issues carries much more weight than black students talking about it. People tend to marginalize the viewpoints of black people talking about what they are experiencing. It's amazing how some people are experts on others experienced.
Post by: Fedor on November 10, 2015, 11:20:45 AM
Post by: OK_Cat on November 10, 2015, 11:23:44 AM
https://twitter.com/LibertyUSA1776/status/664085707003031553
I hope you were posting this to make fun of it, fanning. What a garbage letter.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 11:24:39 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 11:25:10 AM
At KSU purple cats university, 2.3% of faculty and staff are identified as "black". :surprised:
And?
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 11:25:21 AM
FREEDOM OF THE PRESS BEING TRAMPLED.i mean, yeah! who cares about that! if he had a problem with it, he should've just gone somewhere else!
Undercover.
Post by: Fedor on November 10, 2015, 11:26:52 AM
I was surprised it was that low. It is lower than known racist institution MIZ-ZOU. Your thoughts?At KSU purple cats university, 2.3% of faculty and staff are identified as "black". :surprised:
And?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 11:28:05 AM
In other news MU Purchasing just received a large purchase req from MUPD . . . Boots/Black/Leather/Just Below Knee
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 11:30:47 AM
Quote
It was doubtful that the University of Missouri would stand up to a left-wing pressure campaign targeting its president, but when the football team joined the campaign, it was all over.
Missouri is an SEC school, where even a mediocre football program — Mizzou is 1-5 against the rest of the conference — has formidable financial and cultural power.
If anyone running the university had any guts, the school would have told the team, “Come back and talk to us when you can beat sad-sack Vanderbilt, or at least score more than three points against them.” Given the team’s performance, the proper rejoinder to its threatened boycott should have been, “How would anyone notice?”
Instead, Tim Wolfe, the president of the University of Missouri system, is out in one of the most parodic PC meltdowns on a college campus to date. The Missouri episode shows how the political climate on campus falls somewhere between a Tom Wolfe novel, a Monty Python skit, and the French Terror.
A reasonable person will find it difficult to identify what Tim Wolfe stood accused of. The fact of the matter is that Missouri’s social-justice warriors forced him out simply because they could.
There were a few alleged racial incidents on campus, all involving racial slurs or symbols, including one where a drunken student verbally harassed a group of black students (he has been removed from campus, pending disciplinary procedures). Even if Missouri had a president straight out of an episode of Portlandia — the show lampooning exquisite progressive sensibilities — it would be beyond his power to prevent all rudeness on campus, especially drunken rudeness.
Nonetheless, the administration in general and Tim Wolfe in particular were held responsible. The list of supposed offenses was long (and very vague).
The Missouri Student Association complained that there wasn’t enough hand-holding after Michael Brown was shot and killed in Ferguson (when he attacked a police officer, but that’s always left out). “In the following months,” a statement whined, “our students were left stranded, forced to face an increase in tension and inequality with no systemic support.”
To read the association’s indictment, you’d think that the University of Missouri exists in a small enclave of Klan-dominated, Reconstruction-era Mississippi: “The academic careers of our students are suffering. The mental health of our campus is under constant attack. Our students are being ignored. We have asked the University to create spaces of healing and it failed to do so.”
This is the insatiable voice of children who object at the insufficiency of their coddling. In another outrage, no one powders the bottoms of Mizzou students after they go potty.
Once the grievance machinery got going, there was no right way for Tim Wolfe to respond. When he ignored protesters at the school’s homecoming parade, he had to grovel and ask for forgiveness: “I am sorry, and my apology is long overdue.” When he tried to engage protesters at another event, they asked him what “systematic oppression” means and, when he ventured an answer, screeched at him that he was blaming blacks for their own oppression.
An activist group came up with a list of demands. The first was that Wolfe write “a handwritten apology” to be read aloud at a press conference, and that it “must acknowledge his white male privilege.” The second demand was that he be fired. So they were merely demanding a rote confession of guilt before execution, a nice totalitarian touch.
Wolfe is lucky he got away with merely quitting, without having to agree to go through an arduous program of re-education. After decades of mockery, political correctness is stronger than ever on campus and has to strike fear into the hearts of every professor and administrator, who are potential victims no matter how much they kowtow to the children. It is an ongoing cultural revolution, and common sense and rationality are its natural enemies.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:33:42 AM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 11:36:34 AM
So does anyone at mizzou have like class or a job or anything
Class was cancelled.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 11:36:53 AM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:37:13 AM
.So does anyone at mizzou have like class or a job or anything
Class was cancelled.
oh
Post by: mocat on November 10, 2015, 11:37:24 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 11:38:10 AM
Post by: OK_Cat on November 10, 2015, 11:38:47 AM
Is this a fox thing? Or rush or something?
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:39:20 AM
"an open letter to..." is right up there with mommybloggers, in terms of hey who the F do you think you are man?
i'm fine with them if you sign them. anonymous is the worst
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 11:39:29 AM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Most people don't know what white male privilege is, and that makes it hard to acknowledge.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 11:40:31 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 11:41:38 AM
A lot of people don't a) believe white male privilege exists, and b) understand what it even is
Because most people don't believe they've lived a life of privilege and outside of the 1%, haven't.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 11:42:42 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 11:43:28 AM
See dax as an example of someone who is confused about what white privilege is
Not confused in the least.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 11:43:37 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 11:44:30 AM
I was surprised it was that low. It is lower than known racist institution MIZ-ZOU. Your thoughts?At KSU purple cats university, 2.3% of faculty and staff are identified as "black". :surprised:
And?
Kansas State does not have a history of institutionalized racism and as already discussed have been progressive with these types of issues.
Next.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 11:45:28 AM
See dax as an example of someone who is confused about what white privilege is
Not confused in the least.
Willfully ignorant?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 11:46:26 AM
See dax as an example of someone who is confused about what white privilege is
Not confused in the least.
Willfully ignorant?
Not interested in a game of semantics and opinions.
Post by: OK_Cat on November 10, 2015, 11:47:05 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 11:47:21 AM
White ppl definitely have advantages and are privileged, but I don't know why he had to admit it, everyone knows it. Doesn't mean our lives are handed on a silver platter tho. After it's admitted, what does it solve? I guess that's my question?
Everyone doesn't know it, I am absolutely telling you that most people think that true equality exists in this country. I'd be willing to bet that more people think that minorities have more rights than the majority than people that acknowledge the existence of white male privilege.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 11:47:59 AM
See dax as an example of someone who is confused about what white privilege is
Not confused in the least.
Willfully ignorant?
Not interested in a game of semantics and opinions.
Deliberately misrepresenting?
Post by: OK_Cat on November 10, 2015, 11:48:44 AM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:49:17 AM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
I'm happy to admit I've been blessed in life by things that I had no control over. Solid parents, access to education, safe home environment, lack of oppression because of race or religion. I'll admit being a WASP in the midwest eliminates a lot of barriers others have faced, and getting to go to the schools I went to gave me a head start in life. White male privilege? Sure.
I don't like being made to feel guilty about it.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 10, 2015, 11:49:36 AM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
I think life can be hard (work, bills, kids, keeping a marriage together, etc) and most people end up failing in some way or the other or have personal shortcomings in certain ways and failing even when the deck is stacked in your favor is not something that most would want to admit or even really spend time trying to think about. it's like a double fail.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 11:51:01 AM
Well that's absolutely rough ridin' stupid and i'm sorry you have to deal with these dolts.White ppl definitely have advantages and are privileged, but I don't know why he had to admit it, everyone knows it. Doesn't mean our lives are handed on a silver platter tho. After it's admitted, what does it solve? I guess that's my question?
Everyone doesn't know it, I am absolutely telling you that most people think that true equality exists in this country. I'd be willing to bet that more people think that minorities have more rights than the majority than people that acknowledge the existence of white male privilege.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 11:51:21 AM
White ppl definitely have advantages and are privileged, but I don't know why he had to admit it, everyone knows it. Doesn't mean our lives are handed on a silver platter tho. After it's admitted, what does it solve? I guess that's my question?
Everyone doesn't know it, I am absolutely telling you that most people think that true equality exists in this country. I'd be willing to bet that more people think that minorities have more rights than the majority than people that acknowledge the existence of white male privilege.
No, most people understand that equality doesn't exist, and most people actually understand that it's working both ways more-so then ever in this day and age. There are also minority groups in this country who went through the process and the struggle who are quite pissed off about the privilege being heaped on certain groups of minorities who did not have to, as they would say, walk in their shoes.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 11:51:57 AM
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Post by: lopakman on November 10, 2015, 11:52:07 AM
I. we demand that the University of Missouri system president, Tim Wolfe, writes a handwritten apology for the Concerned Students 1–9 – 5–0 demonstrators and holds a press conference in the Mizzou Student Center reading the letter. In the letter and at the press conference, Tim Wolfe must acknowledge his white male privilege, recognize that systems of oppression exist, and provide a verbal commitment to fulfilling Concerned Student 1–9 – 5–0 demands. We want Tim Wolfe to admit to his gross negligence, allowing his driver to hit one of the demonstrators, consenting to the physical violence of bystanders, and Leslie refusing to intervene when Columbia Police Department use excessive force with demonstrators.
Part of this is ridiculous. So the president is supposed to just get up and say "hey guys sorry for being white and for all the privilege's it's brought me. I totally go to where I am because of my skin color and not hard work"
Also asking him to recognize what we know exists 'systems of oppression' at some level in every college is stupid. What's next every white university is supposed to apologize for their 'white male privilege? There's other demands that are poorly worded too, this one just stands out the most.
Those terms were supposed to be negotiated, he didn't have to agree to do that to appease the group.
Also I completely disagree with the bolded part for a couple of reasons. One saying that this exists at some level at every college is a cop out, and frankly isn't relevant to the situation at Missouri. What do you want them to say, "oh well this happens everywhere so we shouldn't force someone to acknowledge the problems we're having here." Secondly, it is important for the president to acknowledge that these things exist so that people can acknowledge that the issue exists. The white president vocally acknowledging these issues carries much more weight than black students talking about it. People tend to marginalize the viewpoints of black people talking about what they are experiencing. It's amazing how some people are experts on others experienced.
I read and thought about your post and I don't think it's a cop out because it's true. And I'm trying to look at the bigger picture, so even though it isn't relevant to Missouri it's relevant to society. I'm pretty sure everyone already knows it exists too so the president's acknowledgement of the obvious isn't necessary. It also could potentially open a floodgate of protests at universities across the country demanding the same of their president.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 11:53:01 AM
Unaware white people love to play the victim
Where have I played the victim?
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 11:58:03 AM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.I have a problem with the phrase because I think it's a little demeaning in the same way that I don't think black students should have to publicly acknowledge the privileges they receive in different admissions criteria. That's probably apples to oranges, but I think requesting that someone admit to receiving a benefit that they had really no control over, as a means to undercut certain things they've achieved, is insulting.
Post by: lopakman on November 10, 2015, 12:06:00 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Because it's complete bullshit and it's a cop out for deeper underlying issues which should be of greater focus. I can also provide a million examples of it not existing and white people overcoming obstacles to achieve success, such as my dad who was born in a one pump gas station that my grandparents owned in a small rural town because they couldn't afford to go to the hospital.
Asian-Americans earn more money and have a lower unemployment rate then any other demographic group. So do you believe there is an asian privilege in America?
Post by: Reboulet on November 10, 2015, 12:16:09 PM
I was surprised it was that low. It is lower than known racist institution MIZ-ZOU. Your thoughts?At KSU purple cats university, 2.3% of faculty and staff are identified as "black". :surprised:
And?
Kansas State does not have a history of institutionalized racism and as already discussed have been progressive with these types of issues.
Next.
For me, this is the issue to focus on: Mizzou is the only major university in a racist state. If a minority student wants the P5 experience, there is only one in-state school to choose. Once they arrive on campus, they shouldn't be subjected to epithets. For F's sake, if there's one place in that entire backwards state where they should feel welcome and wanted, it's the flagship university of Missouri.
The school president failed to do that, as did every school president before him. Hopefully the next person can drag that school toward racial equality, and hopefully that helps move the needle on the rest of Missouri as well.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 10, 2015, 12:19:41 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 12:20:27 PM
I was surprised it was that low. It is lower than known racist institution MIZ-ZOU. Your thoughts?At KSU purple cats university, 2.3% of faculty and staff are identified as "black". :surprised:
And?
Kansas State does not have a history of institutionalized racism and as already discussed have been progressive with these types of issues.
Next.
For me, this is the issue to focus on: Mizzou is the only major university in a racist state. If a minority student wants the P5 experience, there is only one in-state school to choose. Once they arrive on campus, they shouldn't be subjected to epithets. For F's sake, if there's one place in that entire backwards state where they should feel welcome and wanted, it's the flagship university of Missouri.
The school president failed to do that, as did every school president before him. Hopefully the next person can drag that school toward racial equality, and hopefully that helps move the needle on the rest of Missouri as well.
Sure they shouldn't be subjected to epithets. I believe the one "drunk college student" was caught and was suspended pending a disciplinary hearing. In all the other incidents they don't know who the perps were. What would you suggest? Campus lockdown? Campus re-education? No pickup trucks? PC speech police (oh wait, MUPD is taking care of that)?
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 12:24:23 PM
Post by: 8manpick on November 10, 2015, 12:25:28 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.I have a problem with the phrase because I think it's a little demeaning in the same way that I don't think black students should have to publicly acknowledge the privileges they receive in different admissions criteria. That's probably apples to oranges, but I think requesting that someone admit to receiving a benefit that they had really no control over, as a means to undercut certain things they've achieved, is insulting.
Dlew and Cartier did a pretty good job of explaining a couple of my issues with the phrase, but my main issue is that "white privilege" isn't at or near the top of the list of privileges that I've been granted for being born as me. There are several I would trade my skin color privilege for.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 12:27:09 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
I'm happy to admit I've been blessed in life by things that I had no control over. Solid parents, access to education, safe home environment, lack of oppression because of race or religion. I'll admit being a WASP in the midwest eliminates a lot of barriers others have faced, and getting to go to the schools I went to gave me a head start in life. White male privilege? Sure.
I don't like being made to feel guilty about it.
You can acknowledge the privilege without feeling the guilt, that's all yours. No one can make you feel guilty.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 12:27:30 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 12:28:14 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 12:29:34 PM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 12:30:46 PM
Is Eudora the suburbs? Seems pretty small townyIt kinda counts. I mean, I moved around a lot, so technically i'm from Manhattan, but went to school in trash Eudora. If Desoto/mill valley counts, Eudora counts.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 12:32:18 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 12:33:16 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
I think life can be hard (work, bills, kids, keeping a marriage together, etc) and most people end up failing in some way or the other or have personal shortcomings in certain ways and failing even when the deck is stacked in your favor is not something that most would want to admit or even really spend time trying to think about. it's like a double fail.
Thank you. I'm certainly not speaking for all black people but for me acknowledgment of white privilege is a matter of empathy.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 10, 2015, 12:37:22 PM
would I have gone to college if I grew up in Abilene? maybe, but the odds would have been smaller.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 12:38:32 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.I have a problem with the phrase because I think it's a little demeaning in the same way that I don't think black students should have to publicly acknowledge the privileges they receive in different admissions criteria. That's probably apples to oranges, but I think requesting that someone admit to receiving a benefit that they had really no control over, as a means to undercut certain things they've achieved, is insulting.
What universities are black students getting privilege with admissions criteria? It certainly isn't at Mizzou or K-State.
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 12:39:09 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
i haven't read further in the thread yet, so hopefully i'm not being irrelevant.
it's stupid because the supposed "privilege" is mostly that American society functions more or less as it should for white people (i kinda reject the male part as irrelevant and/or misleading, or at a minimum different in nature) and less well for many non-white people. the construct of society functioning properly as a privilege is backwards. society should function for everyone. what is identified as privilege is not privilege, it is the baseline. groups deprived of this level of function are being repressed.
there are other elements of caught up in the construct of "white privilege" that are really separate (correlated, but nonetheless separate) issues. the privileges of inherited wealth, class, etc.
another reason it's stupid, or at least useless, is that it is a conversation that leads nowhere. "acknowledge your white privilege". "i've been very fortunate, thanks." - yay, issue resolved?
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 10, 2015, 12:40:11 PM
I cant believe this hate and anger is being pushed/pimped in public universities, ironically by people who are clamoring for equality and a society blind to color, creed, gender, etc.
It's encouraging that these people appear to be eating their own, and the effects are largely confined to campus. I would imagine constituencies will continue to exercise their economic power and elect people who will direct resources away from these institutions.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 12:41:30 PM
admitting and acknowledging it does not undercut any personal accomplishes you've obtained in your life. those are still your accomplishments and you should still be proud of them (if they give you pride). it also doesn't have to be the most significant privilege for it to be a privilege. one of my biggest privileges was being born and raised in a college town where students were expected to go to college.I think it undercuts things to some degree. The way I perceive it is, "yes i accomplished these things, but one of the reasons i did was because i had a bit of an advantage over some other people." Granted, that's probably true in a lot of situations (and absolutely true for me personally), but I can understand why people may not want to state that -- i think it could be embarrassing for some people -- especially for the reasons you mentioned in your prior post.
would I have gone to college if I grew up in Abilene? maybe, but the odds would have been smaller.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 12:43:22 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 12:44:57 PM
I can only speak for my experience, but at least with law school admissions, it is well known that "underrepresented minorities" get into schools with worse credentials than those who aren't "URMs." Mind you, i have no problem with the preferential treatment, as i think it's important for underrepresented minority races to have members of their race attend law school and be able to shape the policies of tomorrow, but that advantage absolutely exists.Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.I have a problem with the phrase because I think it's a little demeaning in the same way that I don't think black students should have to publicly acknowledge the privileges they receive in different admissions criteria. That's probably apples to oranges, but I think requesting that someone admit to receiving a benefit that they had really no control over, as a means to undercut certain things they've achieved, is insulting.
What universities are black students getting privilege with admissions criteria? It certainly isn't at Mizzou or K-State.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 10, 2015, 12:45:27 PM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 10, 2015, 12:48:20 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 12:48:44 PM
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 12:49:38 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
i haven't read further in the thread yet, so hopefully i'm not being irrelevant.
it's stupid because the supposed "privilege" is mostly that American society functions more or less as it should for white people (i kinda reject the male part as irrelevant and/or misleading, or at a minimum different in nature) and less well for many non-white people. the construct of society functioning properly as a privilege is backwards. society should function for everyone. what is identified as privilege is not privilege, it is the baseline. groups deprived of this level of function are being repressed.
there are other elements of caught up in the construct of "white privilege" that are really separate (correlated, but nonetheless separate) issues. the privileges of inherited wealth, class, etc.
another reason it's stupid, or at least useless, is that it is a conversation that leads nowhere. "acknowledge your white privilege". "i've been very fortunate, thanks." - yay, issue resolved?
Regardless of the misuse of the word "privilege" for the concept, acknowledging that the concept is a reality could make those for whom society isn't functioning properly at least feel like they're not talking to a wall, and would then get the meaningful communication going to get society functioning properly for everyone.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 10, 2015, 12:52:14 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
i haven't read further in the thread yet, so hopefully i'm not being irrelevant.
it's stupid because the supposed "privilege" is mostly that American society functions more or less as it should for white people (i kinda reject the male part as irrelevant and/or misleading, or at a minimum different in nature) and less well for many non-white people. the construct of society functioning properly as a privilege is backwards. society should function for everyone. what is identified as privilege is not privilege, it is the baseline. groups deprived of this level of function are being repressed.
there are other elements of caught up in the construct of "white privilege" that are really separate (correlated, but nonetheless separate) issues. the privileges of inherited wealth, class, etc.
another reason it's stupid, or at least useless, is that it is a conversation that leads nowhere. "acknowledge your white privilege". "i've been very fortunate, thanks." - yay, issue resolved?
Regardless of the misuse of the word "privilege" for the concept, acknowledging that the concept is a reality could make those for whom society isn't functioning properly at least feel like they're not talking to a wall, and would then get the meaningful communication going to get society functioning properly for everyone.
Interesting premise considering the subject matter of the thread.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 12:55:45 PM
http://www.scribd.com/doc/287396022/Defense-Submitted-by-R-O-Lopez-on-June-17-2015-in-matter-of-discrimination-charges
Post by: Fedor on November 10, 2015, 01:02:49 PM
I was going to make this same point. It is not privilege, it is existing in society with barriers due to gender and race removed.Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
i haven't read further in the thread yet, so hopefully i'm not being irrelevant.
it's stupid because the supposed "privilege" is mostly that American society functions more or less as it should for white people (i kinda reject the male part as irrelevant and/or misleading, or at a minimum different in nature) and less well for many non-white people. the construct of society functioning properly as a privilege is backwards. society should function for everyone. what is identified as privilege is not privilege, it is the baseline. groups deprived of this level of function are being repressed.
there are other elements of caught up in the construct of "white privilege" that are really separate (correlated, but nonetheless separate) issues. the privileges of inherited wealth, class, etc.
another reason it's stupid, or at least useless, is that it is a conversation that leads nowhere. "acknowledge your white privilege". "i've been very fortunate, thanks." - yay, issue resolved?
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 01:03:40 PM
Regardless of the misuse of the word "privilege" for the concept, acknowledging that the concept is a reality could make those for whom society isn't functioning properly at least feel like they're not talking to a wall, and would then get the meaningful communication going to get society functioning properly for everyone.
the idea that black americans, as well as many other american minority groups have been denied access to equally participate in american society is pretty well accepted and understood by almost all americans. there is a fair bit of disagreement on how much that inequality continues into the present day and the extent that government bodies participate in perpetuating inequality and if and how they should attempt to counteract that inequality. i don't see how redefining lack of persecution as privilege alters the latter.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 01:04:06 PM
FWIW, I saw that CS1950 released a pamphlet today urging protestors to treat media with respect. good on them for that.
Ya kudos for telling people to respect people, as if they weren't supposed to do that anyway.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 01:04:16 PM
I. we demand that the University of Missouri system president, Tim Wolfe, writes a handwritten apology for the Concerned Students 1–9 – 5–0 demonstrators and holds a press conference in the Mizzou Student Center reading the letter. In the letter and at the press conference, Tim Wolfe must acknowledge his white male privilege, recognize that systems of oppression exist, and provide a verbal commitment to fulfilling Concerned Student 1–9 – 5–0 demands. We want Tim Wolfe to admit to his gross negligence, allowing his driver to hit one of the demonstrators, consenting to the physical violence of bystanders, and Leslie refusing to intervene when Columbia Police Department use excessive force with demonstrators.
Part of this is ridiculous. So the president is supposed to just get up and say "hey guys sorry for being white and for all the privilege's it's brought me. I totally go to where I am because of my skin color and not hard work"
Also asking him to recognize what we know exists 'systems of oppression' at some level in every college is stupid. What's next every white university is supposed to apologize for their 'white male privilege? There's other demands that are poorly worded too, this one just stands out the most.
Those terms were supposed to be negotiated, he didn't have to agree to do that to appease the group.
Also I completely disagree with the bolded part for a couple of reasons. One saying that this exists at some level at every college is a cop out, and frankly isn't relevant to the situation at Missouri. What do you want them to say, "oh well this happens everywhere so we shouldn't force someone to acknowledge the problems we're having here." Secondly, it is important for the president to acknowledge that these things exist so that people can acknowledge that the issue exists. The white president vocally acknowledging these issues carries much more weight than black students talking about it. People tend to marginalize the viewpoints of black people talking about what they are experiencing. It's amazing how some people are experts on others experienced.
I read and thought about your post and I don't think it's a cop out because it's true. And I'm trying to look at the bigger picture, so even though it isn't relevant to Missouri it's relevant to society. I'm pretty sure everyone already knows it exists too so the president's acknowledgement of the obvious isn't necessary. It also could potentially open a floodgate of protests at universities across the country demanding the same of their president.
I'm telling you that not "everyone knows it exists." I'm also certain that this wouldn't lead to a flood of protests because institutional racism isn't a problem everywhere.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 01:16:48 PM
https://twitter.com/ClayTravisBGID/status/664118606490275840
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 01:17:39 PM
Regardless of the misuse of the word "privilege" for the concept, acknowledging that the concept is a reality could make those for whom society isn't functioning properly at least feel like they're not talking to a wall, and would then get the meaningful communication going to get society functioning properly for everyone.
the idea that black americans, as well as many other american minority groups have been denied access to equally participate in american society is pretty well accepted and understood by almost all americans. there is a fair bit of disagreement on how much that inequality continues into the present day and the extent that government bodies participate in perpetuating inequality and if and how they should attempt to counteract that inequality. i don't see how redefining lack of persecution as privilege alters the latter.
I agree that privilege is the wrong word for being treated properly in society.
Clearly, black students at mizzou got the impression that the system president was one of the outliers from all americans that understand that they have been and/or are treated unequally. Being just a little more empathetic than he was was when presented with their concerns (pre-hunger strike, campouts, pinkel, etc.) would've prevented them from getting that vibe.
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 01:22:41 PM
Clearly, black students at mizzou got the impression that the system president was one of the outliers from all americans that understand that they have been and/or are treated unequally. Being just a little more empathetic than he was was when presented with their concerns (pre-hunger strike, campouts, pinkel, etc.) would've prevented them from getting that vibe.
yeah, maybe. who knows.
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 01:26:24 PM
Clearly, black students at mizzou got the impression that the system president was one of the outliers from all americans that understand that they have been and/or are treated unequally. Being just a little more empathetic than he was was when presented with their concerns (pre-hunger strike, campouts, pinkel, etc.) would've prevented them from getting that vibe.
yeah, maybe. who knows.
Regardless, check out the football board.
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 01:30:51 PM
Regardless, check out the football board.
:surprised:
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 01:32:16 PM
Regardless of the misuse of the word "privilege" for the concept, acknowledging that the concept is a reality could make those for whom society isn't functioning properly at least feel like they're not talking to a wall, and would then get the meaningful communication going to get society functioning properly for everyone.
the idea that black americans, as well as many other american minority groups have been denied access to equally participate in american society is pretty well accepted and understood by almost all americans.
However, the fact that systematic disadvantages still exist is not well accepted and understood.
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 01:34:31 PM
However, the fact that systematic disadvantages still exist is not well accepted and understood.
i think i said that. in the sentence following the one you quoted.
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 10, 2015, 01:35:09 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 01:36:57 PM
Quote
ROAD RULES
If protesters arrive at a funeral, riders are instructed not to interact with them. Instead, they form a physical barrier around the protesters with American flags so grieving families won’t see any offensive signs.
If the protesters get too loud, the bikers sing patriotic songs or rev parked motorcycles to mask demonstrators’ shouts.
While part of Phelps’ legacy is abrasive rhetoric, his interpretation of the First Amendment also set legal precedents for nonviolent protests and demonstrations.
In 2006, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled 8-1 in favor of Westboro after the father of a Marine killed in Iraq sued the church for protesting at the funeral. The court ruled that even “hurtful” speech is protected by the First Amendment. As a parallel, the Patriot Guard Riders use the same freedom of speech clause to rev their engines.
“To be fair, it’s true we grew out in response of a protest group. However that was back in 2005,” Smart says.
The Patriot Guard “quickly learned,” Smart says, “there is something really powerful in the gathering of Americans who simply stand and hold flags and let the family know they are not alone.”
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/patriot-608433-guard-riders.html
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 01:37:55 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
:lol: Why's it hurt you to just admit it?! Well it doesn't necessarily exist for all whites or all males for starters, and it's also pretty biggoted to focus only on "white" and "male" and "white male" privilege when all sorts of other privileges abound. But more importantly, can "you black people" tell me why it's so important to you for "white male privilege" to be acknowledged? How does that help you in any way than to help ratchet up that chip on your shoulder a few more notches?
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 01:38:43 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
:lol: Why's it hurt you to just admit it?! Well it doesn't necessarily exist for all whites or all males for starters, and it's also pretty biggoted to focus only on "white" and "male" and "white male" privilege when all sorts of other privileges abound. But more importantly, can "you black people" tell me why it's so important to you for "white male privilege" to be acknowledged? How does that help you in any way than to help ratchet up that chip on your shoulder a few more notches?
jeez luiz, this guy
Post by: Tobias on November 10, 2015, 01:39:24 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 01:40:12 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 01:40:39 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
I'm happy to admit I've been blessed in life by things that I had no control over. Solid parents, access to education, safe home environment
All of these "privileges" are a hell of a lot more important than being white, btw.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 01:42:16 PM
jeez luiz, this guy
:sdeek:
Good grief
An excellent and succinct sample of intellectually bankrupt responses. "Shut up, he explained."
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 01:42:41 PM
Are Patriot riders violating the first amendment?QuoteROAD RULES
If protesters arrive at a funeral, riders are instructed not to interact with them. Instead, they form a physical barrier around the protesters with American flags so grieving families won’t see any offensive signs.
If the protesters get too loud, the bikers sing patriotic songs or rev parked motorcycles to mask demonstrators’ shouts.
While part of Phelps’ legacy is abrasive rhetoric, his interpretation of the First Amendment also set legal precedents for nonviolent protests and demonstrations.
In 2006, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled 8-1 in favor of Westboro after the father of a Marine killed in Iraq sued the church for protesting at the funeral. The court ruled that even “hurtful” speech is protected by the First Amendment. As a parallel, the Patriot Guard Riders use the same freedom of speech clause to rev their engines.
“To be fair, it’s true we grew out in response of a protest group. However that was back in 2005,” Smart says.
The Patriot Guard “quickly learned,” Smart says, “there is something really powerful in the gathering of Americans who simply stand and hold flags and let the family know they are not alone.”
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/patriot-608433-guard-riders.html
How would they be violating the first amendment?
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 01:43:29 PM
Are Patriot riders violating the first amendment?QuoteROAD RULES
If protesters arrive at a funeral, riders are instructed not to interact with them. Instead, they form a physical barrier around the protesters with American flags so grieving families won’t see any offensive signs.
If the protesters get too loud, the bikers sing patriotic songs or rev parked motorcycles to mask demonstrators’ shouts.
While part of Phelps’ legacy is abrasive rhetoric, his interpretation of the First Amendment also set legal precedents for nonviolent protests and demonstrations.
In 2006, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled 8-1 in favor of Westboro after the father of a Marine killed in Iraq sued the church for protesting at the funeral. The court ruled that even “hurtful” speech is protected by the First Amendment. As a parallel, the Patriot Guard Riders use the same freedom of speech clause to rev their engines.
“To be fair, it’s true we grew out in response of a protest group. However that was back in 2005,” Smart says.
The Patriot Guard “quickly learned,” Smart says, “there is something really powerful in the gathering of Americans who simply stand and hold flags and let the family know they are not alone.”
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/patriot-608433-guard-riders.html
How would they be violating the first amendment?
denying phelps access to public property
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 01:43:46 PM
For about the fifth time, what were these people doing, besides apparently just collecting a pay check??
https://equity.missouri.edu/about/staff.php
http://cdi.missouri.edu/staff/
I guess I'm still at a complete loss as to what an administration at a school is supposed to do when they're dealing with allegations against unknown people.
So basically fired for appearing to be insensitive, appearing to lack outrage? So in essence reaffirming the takeover at institutions of higher learning of the required, no, demanded pathological emotional response, rather then the effective thinking and process response?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 01:45:08 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Because it's complete bullshit and it's a cop out for deeper underlying issues which should be of greater focus. I can also provide a million examples of it not existing and white people overcoming obstacles to achieve success, such as my dad who was born in a one pump gas station that my grandparents owned in a small rural town because they couldn't afford to go to the hospital.
Asian-Americans earn more money and have a lower unemployment rate then any other demographic group. So do you believe there is an asian privilege in America?
I didn't see this before as I wading through pages of bullshit. But yes, this.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 01:47:44 PM
Are Patriot riders violating the first amendment?QuoteROAD RULES
If protesters arrive at a funeral, riders are instructed not to interact with them. Instead, they form a physical barrier around the protesters with American flags so grieving families won’t see any offensive signs.
If the protesters get too loud, the bikers sing patriotic songs or rev parked motorcycles to mask demonstrators’ shouts.
While part of Phelps’ legacy is abrasive rhetoric, his interpretation of the First Amendment also set legal precedents for nonviolent protests and demonstrations.
In 2006, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled 8-1 in favor of Westboro after the father of a Marine killed in Iraq sued the church for protesting at the funeral. The court ruled that even “hurtful” speech is protected by the First Amendment. As a parallel, the Patriot Guard Riders use the same freedom of speech clause to rev their engines.
“To be fair, it’s true we grew out in response of a protest group. However that was back in 2005,” Smart says.
The Patriot Guard “quickly learned,” Smart says, “there is something really powerful in the gathering of Americans who simply stand and hold flags and let the family know they are not alone.”
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/patriot-608433-guard-riders.html
How would they be violating the first amendment?
denying phelps access to public property
Phelps still has access. They still show up and protest.
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 01:49:24 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Because it's complete bullshit and it's a cop out for deeper underlying issues which should be of greater focus. I can also provide a million examples of it not existing and white people overcoming obstacles to achieve success, such as my dad who was born in a one pump gas station that my grandparents owned in a small rural town because they couldn't afford to go to the hospital.
Asian-Americans earn more money and have a lower unemployment rate then any other demographic group. So do you believe there is an asian privilege in America?
I didn't see this before as I wading through pages of bullshit. But yes, this.
Both of you honestly believe it's not easier to be white in the country than black? Also LOL at the cliche story about coming from nothing. Since the middle class wasn't really developed until the middle of the 20th century most people came from what in today's standards were very poor roots.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 01:51:13 PM
Are Patriot riders violating the first amendment?QuoteROAD RULES
If protesters arrive at a funeral, riders are instructed not to interact with them. Instead, they form a physical barrier around the protesters with American flags so grieving families won’t see any offensive signs.
If the protesters get too loud, the bikers sing patriotic songs or rev parked motorcycles to mask demonstrators’ shouts.
While part of Phelps’ legacy is abrasive rhetoric, his interpretation of the First Amendment also set legal precedents for nonviolent protests and demonstrations.
In 2006, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled 8-1 in favor of Westboro after the father of a Marine killed in Iraq sued the church for protesting at the funeral. The court ruled that even “hurtful” speech is protected by the First Amendment. As a parallel, the Patriot Guard Riders use the same freedom of speech clause to rev their engines.
“To be fair, it’s true we grew out in response of a protest group. However that was back in 2005,” Smart says.
The Patriot Guard “quickly learned,” Smart says, “there is something really powerful in the gathering of Americans who simply stand and hold flags and let the family know they are not alone.”
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/patriot-608433-guard-riders.html
How would they be violating the first amendment?
denying phelps access to public property
I think it would be assault if the bikers removed them from the premises or touched them. But forming a stationary barrier is okay. The students assaulted the journalist by moving into him.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 01:52:18 PM
I guess I'm still at a complete loss as to what an administration at a school is supposed to do when they're dealing with allegations against unknown people.
One word: EMPATHY. I think this means group hugs, "dialoguing" (but be careful not to offend), "safe spaces," holding a few of those rallies where people wiggle their fingers in the air to encourage silence, and similar moon-battery. At least, that's what I've gleaned so far. I've asked several times ITT thread what, exactly, the prez should have done and I haven't gotten anything specific except "hire more black people."
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 01:55:45 PM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 01:57:25 PM
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 01:58:41 PM
I guess I'm still at a complete loss as to what an administration at a school is supposed to do when they're dealing with allegations against unknown people.
One word: EMPATHY. I think this means group hugs, "dialoguing" (but be careful not to offend), "safe spaces," holding a few of those rallies where people wiggle their fingers in the air to encourage silence, and similar moon-battery. At least, that's what I've gleaned so far. I've asked several times ITT thread what, exactly, the prez should have done and I haven't gotten anything specific except "hire more black people."
that's not what empathy means. people should be more precise with language. and people should try to understand what words mean.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 02:00:09 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Because it's complete bullshit and it's a cop out for deeper underlying issues which should be of greater focus. I can also provide a million examples of it not existing and white people overcoming obstacles to achieve success, such as my dad who was born in a one pump gas station that my grandparents owned in a small rural town because they couldn't afford to go to the hospital.
Asian-Americans earn more money and have a lower unemployment rate then any other demographic group. So do you believe there is an asian privilege in America?
I didn't see this before as I wading through pages of bullshit. But yes, this.
Both of you honestly believe it's not easier to be white in the country than black? Also LOL at the cliche story about coming from nothing. Since the middle class wasn't really developed until the middle of the 20th century most people came from what in today's standards were very poor roots.
I was going to remind people that there will be no boot strapping anecdotalism from (white) people in this thread.
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 02:03:06 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Maybe. But to act like all Blacks had to do was have their grandparents work harder like my grandparents and they would be better off is false and revisionist history.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 02:03:52 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Depsite your clear engagement in microagression . . . setting that aside, I would tend to find merit in this theory.
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 02:05:15 PM
Since the middle class wasn't really developed until the middle of the 20th century most people came from what in today's standards were very poor roots.
acknowledge your descendant of mid-20th century american parents privilege.
Post by: chum1 on November 10, 2015, 02:07:13 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 02:07:48 PM
Chingon may have doubted for a second his decision to immediately move this thread to the pit, but had extremely high confidence that it would ultimately prove correct.amazing foresight by the man.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 02:08:03 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Probably not exponentially. A problem with this theory is we likely won't see an explosion in economic growth we experienced in the middle of the twentieth century (that blacks were largely excluded from) again in our lifetimes.
Post by: kstate16 on November 10, 2015, 02:08:31 PM
Still trying to fully grasp what he's trying to get across. Black athletes getting special treatment over regular black students?
Post by: 'taterblast on November 10, 2015, 02:12:06 PM
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 02:16:34 PM
Gary Pinkel on BITB right now. :D
Bc what he world needed was middle aged white sports media guy interviewing middle aged white football coach about race relations. Wish GP would have been interviewed by CDot. Alas gotta stay in that "safe zone".
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 02:18:34 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 02:18:51 PM
Gary Pinkel on BITB right now. :D
Bc what he world needed was middle aged white sports media guy interviewing middle aged white football coach about race relations. Wish GP would have been interviewed by CDot. Alas gotta stay in that "safe zone".
keitz is the least likely to softball Qs to pinkel of anyone on the radio
Post by: Cire on November 10, 2015, 02:21:30 PM
Fact is, that place is so racist that he didn't think he needed to.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 02:23:31 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Probably not exponentially. A problem with this theory is we likely won't see an explosion in economic growth we experienced in the middle of the twentieth century (that blacks were largely excluded from) again in our lifetimes.
So like, assuming I was white, my kids and their kids shall bear the burden of this same privilege?
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 02:24:27 PM
Burden of privilege? Good grief.Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Probably not exponentially. A problem with this theory is we likely won't see an explosion in economic growth we experienced in the middle of the twentieth century (that blacks were largely excluded from) again in our lifetimes.
So like, assuming I was white, my kids and their kids shall bear the burden of this same privilege?
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 02:24:46 PM
Gary Pinkel on BITB right now. :D
Bc what he world needed was middle aged white sports media guy interviewing middle aged white football coach about race relations. Wish GP would have been interviewed by CDot. Alas gotta stay in that "safe zone".
keitz is the least likely to softball Qs to pinkel of anyone on the radio
I think Cdot wouldn't have backed down and asked good questions. Alas we will never know. It's more just the visual it brings. Probably overreacting to it. It's not that big of a deal.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 02:25:30 PM
Post by: meow meow on November 10, 2015, 02:26:27 PM
Post by: mocat on November 10, 2015, 02:30:43 PM
pretty sure Pinkel is on 610 every week also, at least he was last year.
yeah he is. right before bitb actually
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 02:32:36 PM
pretty sure Pinkel is on 610 every week also, at least he was last year.
yeah he is. right before bitb actually
So did he cancel his 610 interview? I have very low KC Sports Radio IQ.
Post by: lopakman on November 10, 2015, 02:35:05 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Because it's complete bullshit and it's a cop out for deeper underlying issues which should be of greater focus. I can also provide a million examples of it not existing and white people overcoming obstacles to achieve success, such as my dad who was born in a one pump gas station that my grandparents owned in a small rural town because they couldn't afford to go to the hospital.
Asian-Americans earn more money and have a lower unemployment rate then any other demographic group. So do you believe there is an asian privilege in America?
I didn't see this before as I wading through pages of bullshit. But yes, this.
Both of you honestly believe it's not easier to be white in the country than black? Also LOL at the cliche story about coming from nothing. Since the middle class wasn't really developed until the middle of the 20th century most people came from what in today's standards were very poor roots.
I didn't say that you jackass. I said white privilege is bullshit. I'm not doubting black people have a harder time succeeding in society, but it's not primarily due to skin color. Also, I don't think you know the definition of cliche, because it's not a cliche if it actually happened. Go be a dumbass somewhere else.
Post by: lopakman on November 10, 2015, 02:36:21 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 02:39:19 PM
I said white privilege is bullshit. I'm not doubting black people have a harder time succeeding in society
:shy:
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 02:45:13 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Because it's complete bullshit and it's a cop out for deeper underlying issues which should be of greater focus. I can also provide a million examples of it not existing and white people overcoming obstacles to achieve success, such as my dad who was born in a one pump gas station that my grandparents owned in a small rural town because they couldn't afford to go to the hospital.
Asian-Americans earn more money and have a lower unemployment rate then any other demographic group. So do you believe there is an asian privilege in America?
I didn't see this before as I wading through pages of bullshit. But yes, this.
Both of you honestly believe it's not easier to be white in the country than black? Also LOL at the cliche story about coming from nothing. Since the middle class wasn't really developed until the middle of the 20th century most people came from what in today's standards were very poor roots.
I didn't say that you jackass. I said white privilege is bullshit. I'm not doubting black people have a harder time succeeding in society, but it's not primarily due to skin color. Also, I don't think you know the definition of cliche, because it's not a cliche if it actually happened. Go be a dumbass somewhere else.
I misused the word cliche, the word I was looking for was anecdote, alas my point still stands. But please expand on African Americans missing out on the greatest economic growth in our country's history is not the main reason for their struggle to find the same kind of success white's enjoy today.
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 02:46:11 PM
I said white privilege is bullshit. I'm not doubting black people have a harder time succeeding in society
:shy:
This seems counter intuitive.
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 02:48:31 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 02:50:20 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 02:51:10 PM
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 02:51:28 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 02:53:15 PM
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 02:53:27 PM
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 02:53:50 PM
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 02:54:24 PM
cliche seems like a fine description. there's no rule that a cliche can't be based in truth.
yeah, lopakman was wrong. don't take grammar or style advice from lopakman, chuckjames.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 02:54:56 PM
looking at your sentence, it probably was cliche. you just used it wrong, you needed to use it as an adjective. cliched story.
relevant
http://throwgrammarfromthetrain.blogspot.com/2011/09/thats-so-cliched.html
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 02:55:52 PM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 02:56:42 PM
have we talked about how you're supposed to call the cops on hurtful speech now at mizzou?
Is that a real thing or was that just something Clay Travis said?
Post by: Cire on November 10, 2015, 02:57:45 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 02:58:14 PM
have we talked about how you're supposed to call the cops on hurtful speech now at mizzou?
Is that a real thing or was that just something Clay Travis said?
it is a real thing
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 02:58:41 PM
relevant
http://throwgrammarfromthetrain.blogspot.com/2011/09/thats-so-cliched.html
i like cliched much better, even if it looks a little odd without the accent mark. you're an english word now, cliche, start acting like it.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 02:59:50 PM
cliched story fits his post better than anecdote or anecdotal story (the latter is kinda redundant).well "anecdote story" is also redundant.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 03:01:02 PM
relevant
http://throwgrammarfromthetrain.blogspot.com/2011/09/thats-so-cliched.html
i like cliched much better, even if it looks a little odd without the accent mark. you're an english word now, cliche, start acting like it.
it's because you're so old.
Also, re: hurtful speech:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/11/10/missouri-u-police-call-us-about-harmful-or-hurtful-speech/
Post by: steve dave on November 10, 2015, 03:02:36 PM
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 03:03:10 PM
cliched story fits his post better than anecdote or anecdotal story (the latter is kinda redundant).well "anecdote story" is also redundant.
you wouldn't say anecdote story though, you'd replace story with anecdote (that's why "story" follows "cliched" and "anecdotal", but not "anecdote" in my post).
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 03:03:25 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 03:04:30 PM
ugh no -- the word he was unsure about immediately preceded "story."cliched story fits his post better than anecdote or anecdotal story (the latter is kinda redundant).well "anecdote story" is also redundant.
you wouldn't say anecdote story though, you'd replace story with anecdote (that's why "story" follows "cliched" and "anecdotal", but not "anecdote" in my post).
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 03:05:20 PM
Also, re: hurtful speech:i like Eugene Volokh a lot.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/11/10/missouri-u-police-call-us-about-harmful-or-hurtful-speech/
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 03:05:32 PM
That hurtful speech thing is pretty ridiculous.
This whole thing is pretty ridiculous. Don't you understand that this is all part and parcel of the same lunatic movement?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 03:06:25 PM
Also, re: hurtful speech:i like Eugene Volokh a lot.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/11/10/missouri-u-police-call-us-about-harmful-or-hurtful-speech/
Yes, he's brilliant. And he nails it:
Quote
But here there’s not even any claim that they’re just trying to find evidence of crimes, or trying to answer speech with more speech. Here a university is urging students to call the police whenever they hear “hurtful speech,” precisely so the university “can take disciplinary action” against the speakers. This is the new face of the modern university.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 03:07:15 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 03:09:17 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 03:10:34 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.
what in the world
Post by: sys on November 10, 2015, 03:10:59 PM
ugh no -- the word he was unsure about immediately preceded "story."cliched story fits his post better than anecdote or anecdotal story (the latter is kinda redundant).well "anecdote story" is also redundant.
you wouldn't say anecdote story though, you'd replace story with anecdote (that's why "story" follows "cliched" and "anecdotal", but not "anecdote" in my post).
right. i evaluated three ways to fix his sentence, indicating my preference for the first option (and ignoring michigancat's ridiculous notion about using cliche as an adjective).
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 03:11:46 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 03:13:13 PM
Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 03:17:54 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
Because it's complete bullshit and it's a cop out for deeper underlying issues which should be of greater focus. I can also provide a million examples of it not existing and white people overcoming obstacles to achieve success, such as my dad who was born in a one pump gas station that my grandparents owned in a small rural town because they couldn't afford to go to the hospital.
Asian-Americans earn more money and have a lower unemployment rate then any other demographic group. So do you believe there is an asian privilege in America?
I think we have different definitions of what privilege is, privilege to me had little to nothing to do with how much money Asians make. There are several pretty obvious factors that effect that number. I bet the number of Asians in supervisory, CEO type roles don't look anything like the average salary chart looks. Native Americans are at the bottom of the pay scale followed by African Americans, look at the history of our country as it relates to those three groups and you tell me why you think there is such a disparity between the three, it's pretty obvious.
Also white privilege has nothing at all to do with all white people being successful. Do you really think that there's people out there that don't think there are white people that struggle?
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 03:21:02 PM
Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Every school has its own handbook, but I'm sure they are in many cases. OU expelled a bunch of fraternity members for hate speech just last year.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 03:23:07 PM
I believe black people who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
That's really stupid, trim. People not at Mizzou have a much better grasp of what people at Mizzou are going through.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 03:23:56 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
Well, they already have taken action by disciplining a drunk student who heckled a group of black students with a racial slur, and he may even be kicked out.
Again though, the this just wasn't enough. The prez had to go. I guess because he "didn't convene a conference" on the issue (besides the two meetings he had with activists).
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 03:25:43 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
They should be forced to watch John Singleton's "Higher Learning" starring Omar Epps, Kristy Swanson, and (my personal favorite) Michael Rapaport.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 03:27:00 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
Well, they already have taken action by disciplining a drunk student who heckled a group of black students with a racial slur, and he may even be kicked out.
Again though, the this just wasn't enough.
Obviously
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 10, 2015, 03:28:42 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.
The SAE chapter at MU has to be nervous AF
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 03:34:24 PM
The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.
The SAE chapter at MU has to be nervous AF
At least all the liberal women are uggo, tho. Hopefully this will have them keeping their distance.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 03:35:49 PM
Every school has its own handbook, but I'm sure they are in many cases. OU expelled a bunch of fraternity members for hate speech just last year.I'm not saying Mizzou couldn't practically expell the students. I'm saying that if they did, it would be illegal -- just as the expulsion of those racist SAEs at OU would likely be found illegal if said racists ever filed suit.
These kinds of speech codes are bizarre and shouldn't be tolerated. The student group suppressing speech is one thing, but the university is "the state" and concerning on a whole other level.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 03:37:41 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
i haven't read further in the thread yet, so hopefully i'm not being irrelevant.
it's stupid because the supposed "privilege" is mostly that American society functions more or less as it should for white people (i kinda reject the male part as irrelevant and/or misleading, or at a minimum different in nature) and less well for many non-white people. the construct of society functioning properly as a privilege is backwards. society should function for everyone. what is identified as privilege is not privilege, it is the baseline. groups deprived of this level of function are being repressed.
there are other elements of caught up in the construct of "white privilege" that are really separate (correlated, but nonetheless separate) issues. the privileges of inherited wealth, class, etc.
another reason it's stupid, or at least useless, is that it is a conversation that leads nowhere. "acknowledge your white privilege". "i've been very fortunate, thanks." - yay, issue resolved?
Thanks sys. I would say that this is an issue of semantics, the issues you bring up are legit issues. I think that if this issue is one that is consumed by the masses though your approach is a bit too nuanced to be properly discussed without getting into the weeds; white privilege is a very simple way to package this particular issue, not saying that's right but that's what it is.
I've addressed why I think it is important for powerful white people to acknowledge white privilege or as you put it why the basic functions of society are deceived for some, so I won't repeat myself.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 03:42:08 PM
Every school has its own handbook, but I'm sure they are in many cases. OU expelled a bunch of fraternity members for hate speech just last year.I'm not saying Mizzou couldn't practically expell the students. I'm saying that if they did, it would be illegal -- just as the expulsion of those racist SAEs at OU would likely be found illegal if said racists ever filed suit.
These kinds of speech codes are bizarre and shouldn't be tolerated. The student group suppressing speech is one thing, but the university is "the state" and concerning on a whole other level.
The university is obligated to provide a safe learning environment for all of its students. I don't think a university expelling a student for expressing hateful speech is a violation of that student's constitutional right any more than an employer firing an employee. The student wouldn't be facing criminal charges. He would just be getting told that he can no longer attend the University of Missouri, which plenty of other people are told for various reasons every year.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 03:49:11 PM
I can only speak for my experience, but at least with law school admissions, it is well known that "underrepresented minorities" get into schools with worse credentials than those who aren't "URMs." Mind you, i have no problem with the preferential treatment, as i think it's important for underrepresented minority races to have members of their race attend law school and be able to shape the policies of tomorrow, but that advantage absolutely exists.Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.I have a problem with the phrase because I think it's a little demeaning in the same way that I don't think black students should have to publicly acknowledge the privileges they receive in different admissions criteria. That's probably apples to oranges, but I think requesting that someone admit to receiving a benefit that they had really no control over, as a means to undercut certain things they've achieved, is insulting.
What universities are black students getting privilege with admissions criteria? It certainly isn't at Mizzou or K-State.
I mean do you have evidence of this or is it just a colloquial anecdote that gets retold a lot like illegal aliens vote for democrats in droves? Even if it were true doesn't the need to artificially tip the scales show that there are built in historical, systematic advantages for the majority?
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 03:54:53 PM
I can only speak for my experience, but at least with law school admissions, it is well known that "underrepresented minorities" get into schools with worse credentials than those who aren't "URMs." Mind you, i have no problem with the preferential treatment, as i think it's important for underrepresented minority races to have members of their race attend law school and be able to shape the policies of tomorrow, but that advantage absolutely exists.Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.I have a problem with the phrase because I think it's a little demeaning in the same way that I don't think black students should have to publicly acknowledge the privileges they receive in different admissions criteria. That's probably apples to oranges, but I think requesting that someone admit to receiving a benefit that they had really no control over, as a means to undercut certain things they've achieved, is insulting.
What universities are black students getting privilege with admissions criteria? It certainly isn't at Mizzou or K-State.
I mean do you have evidence of this or is it just a colloquial anecdote that gets retold a lot like illegal aliens vote for democrats in droves? Even if it were true doesn't the need to artificially tip the scales show that there are built in historical, systematic advantages for the majority?
God job MIR for using anecdote the right way. :cheers:
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 03:56:10 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:02:38 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
:lol: Why's it hurt you to just admit it?! Well it doesn't necessarily exist for all whites or all males for starters, and it's also pretty biggoted to focus only on "white" and "male" and "white male" privilege when all sorts of other privileges abound. But more importantly, can "you black people" tell me why it's so important to you for "white male privilege" to be acknowledged? How does that help you in any way than to help ratchet up that chip on your shoulder a few more notches?
There are a few people who I've stopped reading itt simply because the number of replies are nearly impossible to keep up with; I felt compelled to read after seeing the responses to your post. Your reply to the reactions are total horse crap because is obvious with your tone in this wholly unnecessary reply that you have no interest in talking about this honestly, so don't rough ridin' act do superior when you make an intentionally inflammatory post that only gets emojis for responses.
Now to your post itself. Why do you think I have some chip on my shoulder? It's especially curious given the question you posted this in response to. Does my chip manifest itself when I have the gall to ask what is in the mind of the mighty white man?
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 04:05:29 PM
I mean do you have evidence of this or is it just a colloquial anecdote that gets retold a lot like illegal aliens vote for democrats in droves?Yeah, it's absolutely a thing. The following is from the Law School Admission Council's website.
http://www.lsac.org/jd/diversity-in-law-school/racial-ethnic-minority-applicants (http://www.lsac.org/jd/diversity-in-law-school/racial-ethnic-minority-applicants)
To see this policy in action, check out the following, which is a link to Cornell Law's admissions from last year -- note how the outliers are (self-identified) URMs.
http://cornell.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1415 (http://cornell.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1415)
I picked Cornell randomly, but feel free to look at some other schools and I promise you'd find the same thing.
Again, I hold no ill-will towards the practice. Maybe it's a little unfair, but I get why it exists. I also get why it might piss off some applicants. But I would think it'd be pretty impolite for one of those miffed applicants to demand that a black law student admit her admissions advantage in public.
Quote
Even if it were true doesn't the need to artificially tip the scales show that there are built in historical, systematic advantages for the majority?Absolutely. All I'm saying is that I just wonder if demanding people publicly acknowledge their white male privilege is a worthwhile exercise.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:06:20 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Of course man but most of the relevant movement to this point has been through legislation. I have serious doubts as to how much more that line can move though.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:11:53 PM
have we talked about how you're supposed to call the cops on hurtful speech now at mizzou?
Who cares man, don't get lost in the weeds
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 04:12:34 PM
That probably deserves its own thread.have we talked about how you're supposed to call the cops on hurtful speech now at mizzou?
Who cares man, don't get lost in the weeds
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 04:13:09 PM
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 04:13:29 PM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 10, 2015, 04:13:51 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Of course man but most of the relevant movement to this point has been through legislation. I have serious doubts as to how much more that line can move though.
Do you think it's worthwhile to create legislation that makes things more difficult for white men, and therefore more advantageous for minorities, until the line is moved to where you think it should be?
And once the line gets there, are those legislative actions repealed and all is forgiven?
I'm not trying to be obtuse, I just am curious of the end-game. I would really hate it if we as a society were still talking about this crap in a hundred years (as in I wish it weren't an issue).
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 04:15:39 PM
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 04:15:55 PM
I believe black people who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
That's really stupid, trim. People not at Mizzou have a much better grasp of what people at Mizzou are going through.
Just realized I should've been more clear in that I believe black people who've been or are at mizzou who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 04:16:24 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 04:17:11 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Of course man but most of the relevant movement to this point has been through legislation. I have serious doubts as to how much more that line can move though.
Do you think it's worthwhile to create legislation that makes things more difficult for white men, and therefore more advantageous for minorities, until the line is moved to where you think it should be?
And once the line gets there, are those legislative actions repealed and all is forgiven?
I'm not trying to be obtuse, I just am curious of the end-game. I would really hate it if we as a society were still talking about this crap in a hundred years (as in I wish it weren't an issue).
Oh sure, I mean lets just get a big bonfire and a pile of wood and a tanker truck full of jet fuel and then light it with the constitution and the bill of rights, that's where you're at.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:17:53 PM
Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if Claws was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 04:18:55 PM
I mean do you have evidence of this or is it just a colloquial anecdote that gets retold a lot like illegal aliens vote for democrats in droves?Yeah, it's absolutely a thing. The following is from the Law School Admission Council's website.
http://www.lsac.org/jd/diversity-in-law-school/racial-ethnic-minority-applicants (http://www.lsac.org/jd/diversity-in-law-school/racial-ethnic-minority-applicants)
To see this policy in action, check out the following, which is a link to Cornell Law's admissions from last year -- note how the outliers are (self-identified) URMs.
http://cornell.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1415 (http://cornell.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1415)
I picked Cornell randomly, but feel free to look at some other schools and I promise you'd find the same thing.
Again, I hold no ill-will towards the practice. Maybe it's a little unfair, but I get why it exists. I also get why it might piss off some applicants. But I would think it'd be pretty impolite for one of those miffed applicants to demand that a black law student admit her admissions advantage in public.QuoteEven if it were true doesn't the need to artificially tip the scales show that there are built in historical, systematic advantages for the majority?Absolutely. All I'm saying is that I just wonder if demanding people publicly acknowledge their white male privilege is a worthwhile exercise.
A little off topic but I read something the other day that admissions like this were actually harmful to the recipient. According to this study, the number of students accepted with "lowered" standards that dropped out was extremely high and the conclusion was that placing these students in a more score appropriate school had much higher chances of success.
It was an interesting read
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 04:19:35 PM
I think you mistyped -- Who is class?Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if class was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:21:49 PM
I'm waiting for sys to pounce on his use of "deceived."
Where did I do that at? I'm on my phone and I may have gotten "swyped" wherever it is does the word "perceived" fit better?
Post by: Fedor on November 10, 2015, 04:22:29 PM
"They want a utopia in Columbia where no one is mean, Christian and Jew and Islam."Hunger strike guy's family is loaded and apparently that makes a big difference.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:22:52 PM
I mean do you have evidence of this or is it just a colloquial anecdote that gets retold a lot like illegal aliens vote for democrats in droves?Yeah, it's absolutely a thing. The following is from the Law School Admission Council's website.
http://www.lsac.org/jd/diversity-in-law-school/racial-ethnic-minority-applicants (http://www.lsac.org/jd/diversity-in-law-school/racial-ethnic-minority-applicants)
To see this policy in action, check out the following, which is a link to Cornell Law's admissions from last year -- note how the outliers are (self-identified) URMs.
http://cornell.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1415 (http://cornell.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1415)
I picked Cornell randomly, but feel free to look at some other schools and I promise you'd find the same thing.
Again, I hold no ill-will towards the practice. Maybe it's a little unfair, but I get why it exists. I also get why it might piss off some applicants. But I would think it'd be pretty impolite for one of those miffed applicants to demand that a black law student admit her admissions advantage in public.QuoteEven if it were true doesn't the need to artificially tip the scales show that there are built in historical, systematic advantages for the majority?Absolutely. All I'm saying is that I just wonder if demanding people publicly acknowledge their white male privilege is a worthwhile exercise.
Thank you
Post by: cfbandyman on November 10, 2015, 04:23:14 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
i haven't read further in the thread yet, so hopefully i'm not being irrelevant.
it's stupid because the supposed "privilege" is mostly that American society functions more or less as it should for white people (i kinda reject the male part as irrelevant and/or misleading, or at a minimum different in nature) and less well for many non-white people. the construct of society functioning properly as a privilege is backwards. society should function for everyone. what is identified as privilege is not privilege, it is the baseline. groups deprived of this level of function are being repressed.
there are other elements of caught up in the construct of "white privilege" that are really separate (correlated, but nonetheless separate) issues. the privileges of inherited wealth, class, etc.
another reason it's stupid, or at least useless, is that it is a conversation that leads nowhere. "acknowledge your white privilege". "i've been very fortunate, thanks." - yay, issue resolved?
Thanks sys. I would say that this is an issue of semantics, the issues you bring up are legit issues. I think that if this issue is one that is consumed by the masses though your approach is a bit too nuanced to be properly discussed without getting into the weeds; white privilege is a very simple way to package this particular issue, not saying that's right but that's what it is.
I've addressed why I think it is important for powerful white people to acknowledge white privilege or as you put it why the basic functions of society are deceived for some, so I won't repeat myself.
Isn't that kinda the root of this whole issue (not just the white privilege talk but what's going on at Mizzou, and maybe even Yale) in general? The overgeneralization of a few people and applying overgeneralization to a larger audience because it's easier to understand and digest?
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 10, 2015, 04:23:55 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:27:29 PM
That probably deserves its own thread.have we talked about how you're supposed to call the cops on hurtful speech now at mizzou?
Who cares man, don't get lost in the weeds
No it doesn't. It's a stupid policy, observation, whatever. Do we even know who dictated this mandate? It sounds like someone pissed off at what is happening here and they are going to an extreme to prove a point. You ever have an argument with your SO and she says something to the effect of "I wish you would have talked to me first" and then you reply with "fine, I'll ask you when I have to go the bathroom and when I get a drink of water," this seems like it's like that.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 04:29:06 PM
That probably deserves its own thread.have we talked about how you're supposed to call the cops on hurtful speech now at mizzou?
Who cares man, don't get lost in the weeds
No it doesn't. It's a stupid policy, observation, whatever. Do we even know who dictated this mandate? It sounds like someone pissed off at what is happening here and they are going to an extreme to prove a point. You ever have an argument with your SO and she says something to the effect of "I wish you would have talked to me first" and then you reply with "fine, I'll ask you when I have to go the bathroom and when I get a drink of water," this seems like it's like that.
Apparently the university police emailed the student body telling them to call the police to report any incidents, and they will investigate.
Post by: chuckjames on November 10, 2015, 04:29:45 PM
Holy crap Keitz lost his damn mind. Incredible.
it was like when an older athlete is getting up in years and isn't as good, but he finds that magic again one time and it was as good as anything he did in his prime.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 04:30:48 PM
"They want a utopia in Columbia where no one is mean, Christian and Jew and Islam."Hunger strike guy's family is loaded and apparently that makes a big difference.
"Gandhi's parents were rich!"
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 04:31:30 PM
Holy crap Keitz lost his damn mind. Incredible.
Probably the best radio in years.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 04:32:29 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:33:25 PM
Is the magnitude of white privilege subject to exponential decay over time?
Of course man but most of the relevant movement to this point has been through legislation. I have serious doubts as to how much more that line can move though.
Do you think it's worthwhile to create legislation that makes things more difficult for white men, and therefore more advantageous for minorities, until the line is moved to where you think it should be?
And once the line gets there, are those legislative actions repealed and all is forgiven?
I'm not trying to be obtuse, I just am curious of the end-game. I would really hate it if we as a society were still talking about this crap in a hundred years (as in I wish it weren't an issue).
As far as race goes, no I don't see any need for further legislation. The legislation that got us to this point provided us with basic rights that white American males had upon the founding of this country, that minorities and women have just gotten in some of you people's lifetimes. Law has gotten us to a point, it is up to society to tow the rope the rest of the way.
Now ask me about the need for legislation for people of all sex, gender, and sexual identity; we aren't way off there.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 04:34:44 PM
I hope he shares it! I will listen!
He even worked the planned parenthood angle in to it and handled a female caller pushing back about access to contraceptives!
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:35:20 PM
I believe black people who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
That's really stupid, trim. People not at Mizzou have a much better grasp of what people at Mizzou are going through.
Just realized I should've been more clear in that I believe black people who've been or are at mizzou who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
Not acceptable trim, sorry bud
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:37:07 PM
I think you mistyped -- Who is class?Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if Claws was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
Damnit "swyped" that should have read Claws, read again.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 04:39:05 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 04:39:56 PM
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/how-campus-activists-are-weaponizing-the-safe-space/415080/
The modern college student . . . only their rights matter.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 04:40:18 PM
i don't know who Claws is either? is he a student at missouri?
He's #32.
http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=36341.0
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 04:42:10 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:44:29 PM
Can you white people tell me why there's such an issue with acknowledging white male privilege or why some of you have a problem with the phrase? I mean the privilege comes with no repercussions of acknowledging it. I mean I can give a million examples of it existing so that can't be the issue.
i haven't read further in the thread yet, so hopefully i'm not being irrelevant.
it's stupid because the supposed "privilege" is mostly that American society functions more or less as it should for white people (i kinda reject the male part as irrelevant and/or misleading, or at a minimum different in nature) and less well for many non-white people. the construct of society functioning properly as a privilege is backwards. society should function for everyone. what is identified as privilege is not privilege, it is the baseline. groups deprived of this level of function are being repressed.
there are other elements of caught up in the construct of "white privilege" that are really separate (correlated, but nonetheless separate) issues. the privileges of inherited wealth, class, etc.
another reason it's stupid, or at least useless, is that it is a conversation that leads nowhere. "acknowledge your white privilege". "i've been very fortunate, thanks." - yay, issue resolved?
Thanks sys. I would say that this is an issue of semantics, the issues you bring up are legit issues. I think that if this issue is one that is consumed by the masses though your approach is a bit too nuanced to be properly discussed without getting into the weeds; white privilege is a very simple way to package this particular issue, not saying that's right but that's what it is.
I've addressed why I think it is important for powerful white people to acknowledge white privilege or as you put it why the basic functions of society are deceived for some, so I won't repeat myself.
Isn't that kinda the root of this whole issue (not just the white privilege talk but what's going on at Mizzou, and maybe even Yale) in general? The overgeneralization of a few people and applying overgeneralization to a larger audience because it's easier to understand and digest?
I don't think so. The Yale thing is stupid so I am not even going to speak to that. At Mizzou my best guess is that the root frustration is the lack of acknowledgement and action of any issue at all. It's not even at the point yet where the packaging is important, I think that's why the demands were so crudely simplistic. Again this is all conjecture on my part based on what my frustrations on race are and pretty much every conversation on race I've personally had with other black people.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 04:45:36 PM
Quote
By then, the mask has fallen.“Who wants to help me get this reporter out of here?” an unusually frank protestor yells. “I need some muscle over here!”
The woman calling for muscle? An assistant professor of mass media at the University of Missouri ... who had previously asked the campus for help attracting media attention.
This is grounds or should be grounds for immediate termination of employment. For too many reasons to even list.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 04:46:39 PM
i don't know who Claws is either? is he a student at missouri?
:sdeek: omg dlew, you're the worst
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 04:48:54 PM
QuoteBy then, the mask has fallen.“Who wants to help me get this reporter out of here?” an unusually frank protestor yells. “I need some muscle over here!”
The woman calling for muscle? An assistant professor of mass media at the University of Missouri ... who had previously asked the campus for help attracting media attention.
This is grounds or should be grounds for immediate termination of employment. For too many reasons to even list.
You're going to be dissapointed
That's a given.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 04:50:03 PM
QuoteBy then, the mask has fallen.“Who wants to help me get this reporter out of here?” an unusually frank protestor yells. “I need some muscle over here!”
The woman calling for muscle? An assistant professor of mass media at the University of Missouri ... who had previously asked the campus for help attracting media attention.
This is grounds or should be grounds for immediate termination of employment. For too many reasons to even list.
Absolutely. The school should probably have a talk with some of the students who were bullying the reporter, too.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 04:53:15 PM
QuoteBy then, the mask has fallen.“Who wants to help me get this reporter out of here?” an unusually frank protestor yells. “I need some muscle over here!”
The woman calling for muscle? An assistant professor of mass media at the University of Missouri ... who had previously asked the campus for help attracting media attention.
This is grounds or should be grounds for immediate termination of employment. For too many reasons to even list.
You're going to be dissapointed
That's a given.
http://journalism.missouri.edu/2015/11/dean-david-kurpius-comments-on-students-coverage-of-protest-on-carnahan-quad/
Also, for clarification, Assistant Professor Melissa Click, featured in several videos confronting journalists, is not a faculty member in the Missouri School of Journalism.
She is a member of the MU Department of Communication in the College of Arts and Science. In that capacity she holds a courtesy appointment with the School of Journalism. Journalism School faculty members are taking immediate action to review that appointment.
Inciting violence and provoking a physical altercation on a public space.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 04:53:44 PM
lol oh. that's why i didn't know.i don't know who Claws is either? is he a student at missouri?
He's #32.
http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=36341.0
And that's an interesting question. I'm really not sure what would happen if a student said that there. I don't think he could be expelled, but I wonder if he could have his scholarship revoked or kicked off the team. Maybe not!
Anyhow that's a little different than the situation at issue regarding "speech codes" at universities and expelling students for violations regarding "hate speech" (however that's defined). I could link you to some cases and scholarship if you'd be interested in learning about the legality of limiting student speech on campuses.
But the point is, universities (i.e. "the state") can't expel you ("punish you") based on the content of your protected speech. That's not a contentious thing to say.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 05:00:51 PM
lol oh. that's why i didn't know.i don't know who Claws is either? is he a student at missouri?
He's #32.
http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=36341.0
And that's an interesting question. I'm really not sure what would happen if a student said that there. I don't think he could be expelled, but I wonder if he could have his scholarship revoked or kicked off the team. Maybe not!
Anyhow that's a little different than the situation at issue regarding "speech codes" at universities and expelling students for violations regarding "hate speech" (however that's defined). I could link you to some cases and scholarship if you'd be interested in learning about the legality of limiting student speech on campuses.
I think he would be expelled.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 05:07:41 PM
I think you would be surprised to learn about the speech rights afforded to students in university settings.lol oh. that's why i didn't know.i don't know who Claws is either? is he a student at missouri?
He's #32.
http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=36341.0
And that's an interesting question. I'm really not sure what would happen if a student said that there. I don't think he could be expelled, but I wonder if he could have his scholarship revoked or kicked off the team. Maybe not!
Anyhow that's a little different than the situation at issue regarding "speech codes" at universities and expelling students for violations regarding "hate speech" (however that's defined). I could link you to some cases and scholarship if you'd be interested in learning about the legality of limiting student speech on campuses.
I think he would be expelled.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 05:08:45 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 05:09:05 PM
Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if Claws was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
He'd be punished by the team, but hopefully no one would call people who carry guns and cuffs to shut him up. He'd just lose the privilege of playing football, not be punished by a government (yes, cops are the government).
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 05:13:01 PM
Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if Claws was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
He'd be punished by the team, but hopefully no one would call people who carry guns and cuffs to shut him up. He'd just lose the privilege of playing football, not be punished by a government (yes, cops are the government).
He also would lose the privilege of being a student at KSU. That also is not punishment by the government.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 05:14:54 PM
Are you asserting that it's not "punishment" or that KSU isn't "the government." Disirregardlessly it doesn't matter because you'd be wrong on both accounts.Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if Claws was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
He'd be punished by the team, but hopefully no one would call people who carry guns and cuffs to shut him up. He'd just lose the privilege of playing football, not be punished by a government (yes, cops are the government).
He also would lose the privilege of being a student at KSU. That also is not punishment by the government.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 05:16:05 PM
For on point story about how unhinged and utterly unaware this group is, it absolutely screams privilege in its own right:
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/how-campus-activists-are-weaponizing-the-safe-space/415080/
The modern college student . . . only their rights matter.
its hypocrisy. corner Tim Wolfe outside Kauffman Center, video him struggling to answer a question, use that to further your cause, but when the media turns the cameras on the protesters, its threatening.
Also this:
“We ask for no media in the parameters so the place where people live, fellowship, and sleep can be protected from twisted insincere narratives,”
The quad isn't your house, church, or dorm room.
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 10, 2015, 05:20:37 PM
Post by: Trim on November 10, 2015, 05:23:15 PM
I believe black people who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
That's really stupid, trim. People not at Mizzou have a much better grasp of what people at Mizzou are going through.
Just realized I should've been more clear in that I believe black people who've been or are at mizzou who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
Not acceptable trim, sorry bud
You telling me that hunger striker got over on me and it's really fine for black people at mizzou?
Post by: 8manpick on November 10, 2015, 05:28:27 PM
Hunger striker is like a multi millionaire?stud!
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 05:29:30 PM
Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if Claws was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
He'd be punished by the team, but hopefully no one would call people who carry guns and cuffs to shut him up. He'd just lose the privilege of playing football, not be punished by a government (yes, cops are the government).
You still talking about that call the cops thing? Man you just want to be mad.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 05:33:25 PM
Are you asserting that it's not "punishment" or that KSU isn't "the government." Disirregardlessly it doesn't matter because you'd be wrong on both accounts.Are other violations of the student handbook constitutionally protected (even/especially) on college campuses?The school absolutely should take action against students who are caught using hateful speech with other students, but using their police to go find them is a step too far.what kind of action are you suggesting state schools should take against students who use "hate speech"?
The same sort of action they take against other students who violate the student handbook. Probation, maybe community service, maybe expulsion.
Are you kidding? What do you think would happen if Claws was interviewed in the postgame and he said "the crowd was good but I saw a bunch of faggots and bull dikes in section 24 and I wish they would stay home with the other fairies?" Please tell me you're not getting confused about what free speech is.
He'd be punished by the team, but hopefully no one would call people who carry guns and cuffs to shut him up. He'd just lose the privilege of playing football, not be punished by a government (yes, cops are the government).
He also would lose the privilege of being a student at KSU. That also is not punishment by the government.
https://www.eab.com/daily-briefing/2015/03/11/can-schools-expel-students-for-racial-slurs-experts-are-divided
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 05:34:57 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 05:35:56 PM
I believe black people who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
That's really stupid, trim. People not at Mizzou have a much better grasp of what people at Mizzou are going through.
Just realized I should've been more clear in that I believe black people who've been or are at mizzou who say it's mumped up for black people at mizzou.
Not acceptable trim, sorry bud
You telling me that hunger striker got over on me and it's really fine for black people at mizzou?
Now you're getting it. He didn't eat for a week because he was mad at the media.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 05:38:45 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 05:42:05 PM
MIR, I'm sorry but this is a very complicated, large issue, that is bigger than Mizzou, and I think its ok if we discuss all aspects of it. I've been extremely respectful of your posting and vulnerability in this thread, please don't paint me as "just wanting to be mad" because that's not fair to me, and I don't think I've really expressed that much anger. I'm not angry, but I think that the free speech issue is a big issue to this situation.
I'm dubious to your intentions because you took a tweet with no context and you have more than once tried to give it a grander role within the framework of this story. The cops sent a tweet out saying that you should call them if someone says something mean and that was the extent of it. No one asked for that, no one has responded with "oh that's the perfect solution, thanks for that." I haven't seen a single tweet, post, or column advocating for what the pd did with that tweet so forgive me for being annoyed at you caring so much about it and throwing it into a larger context.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 05:44:57 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 05:47:43 PM
MIR, I'm a little confused-- do you think that link you posted refuted my point at all?
Uh no. Wouldn't that mean I didn't even read the subheadline and lede?
Post by: 8manpick on November 10, 2015, 05:48:33 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 05:49:36 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 05:50:17 PM
FTR, the police thing was a university-wide email, according to the Volokh article.
Right but it was sent by the mizzou pd
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 05:51:29 PM
Well, I just think its noteworthy that cops are now asking students to call them because of speech. I don't agree with that, and that is the police abusing their authority IMO. Police should protect students, protect students rights, enforce laws, and that's about it. I've said what I'll say on that, and you guys are free to take this thread a different direction.
NO ONE AGREES WITH IT, CARTIER. mercy.
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 05:52:33 PM
Well given what you said earlier ("are you kidding..."), and the portion of the article where the guy tried to frame it as a school regulation issue and not a first amendment issue, I wasn't expecting the quick 180.MIR, I'm a little confused-- do you think that link you posted refuted my point at all?
Uh no. Wouldn't that mean I didn't even read the subheadline and lede?
Right, but a little more than just a tweet.FTR, the police thing was a university-wide email, according to the Volokh article.
Right but it was sent by the mizzou pd
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 05:52:58 PM
Well, I just think its noteworthy that cops are now asking students to call them because of speech. I don't agree with that, and that is the police abusing their authority IMO. Police should protect students, protect students rights, enforce laws, and that's about it. I've said what I'll say on that, and you guys are free to take this thread a different direction.
NO ONE AGREES WITH IT, CARTIER. mercy.
that's good! :cheers:
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 10, 2015, 06:01:44 PM
I think you would be surprised to learn about the speech rights afforded to students in university settings.lol oh. that's why i didn't know.i don't know who Claws is either? is he a student at missouri?
He's #32.
http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=36341.0
And that's an interesting question. I'm really not sure what would happen if a student said that there. I don't think he could be expelled, but I wonder if he could have his scholarship revoked or kicked off the team. Maybe not!
Anyhow that's a little different than the situation at issue regarding "speech codes" at universities and expelling students for violations regarding "hate speech" (however that's defined). I could link you to some cases and scholarship if you'd be interested in learning about the legality of limiting student speech on campuses.
I think he would be expelled.
He might sue and he might win, but the lawsuit would be cheaper than the fallout that would come about from keeping somebody on campus after that. There is no way somebody who says that on television while wearing a "K-State" jersey doesn't get kicked out of school.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 06:05:19 PM
Well given what you said earlier ("are you kidding..."), and the portion of the article where the guy tried to frame it as a school regulation issue and not a first amendment issue, I wasn't expecting the quick 180.MIR, I'm a little confused-- do you think that link you posted refuted my point at all?
Uh no. Wouldn't that mean I didn't even read the subheadline and lede?Right, but a little more than just a tweet.FTR, the police thing was a university-wide email, according to the Volokh article.
Right but it was sent by the mizzou pd
I read that article after but I certainly view it as a 180 at all. I was showing that this issue has ambiguity. I wholeheartedly disagree with your assessment that a student couldn't be expelled for hate speech, I mean it's already happened.
http://college.usatoday.com/2015/03/20/not-only-was-the-sae-student-expulsion-legal-it-was-right/
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 10, 2015, 06:07:20 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 10, 2015, 06:21:38 PM
These type of arguments are exhausting.
Yeah, but I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy watching MIR flail away as these campus radicals become increasingly fascist. :popcorn:
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 06:29:40 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 06:34:44 PM
The notion that a university where the climate is such that a gay African American male can be elected student body president inherently engages in INSTITUTIONALIZED racism is patently abused on every conceivable level. To think such literally renders the precept of institutionalized racism to the lowest and most impotent level of impact possible.
yeah I mean the US elected a black president and people are crazy enough to think racism exists there too!
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 06:36:48 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 06:39:31 PM
The notion that a university where the climate is such that a gay African American male can be elected student body president inherently engages in INSTITUTIONALIZED racism is patently abused on every conceivable level. To think such literally renders the precept of institutionalized racism to the lowest and most impotent level of impact possible.
yeah I mean the US elected a black president and people are crazy enough to think racism exists there too!
This isn't about racism in a population of 350 million people spread across 50 states on a continent, it's about the ridiculous claim of "institutionalized racism" based on allegations (of which the university took immediate action when the perp was known), and policies that were very likely driven by budgetary constraints. Where's the picture of the rabbit with the pancake on its head?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 10, 2015, 06:40:18 PM
dax got a some new bullet points from kietz today :thumbs:
Didn't listen to one second of Keitzman today and rarely ever do anymore. But thanks for the update..
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 06:48:49 PM
I wholeheartedly disagree with your assessment that a student couldn't be expelled for hate speech, I mean it's already happened.I really don't know what to tell you. The article you linked was written by two undergrads and doesn't cite a single bit of legal authority to support their conclusion that expelling the students was legal. Frankly, it's a ridiculous article and I'm surprised USA Today even published it. And just because OU got away with it doesn't mean much -- there have been countless instances of unchallenged constitutional violations throughout history. Just because the "victim" doesn't challenge it in court doesn't make it legal or right.
http://college.usatoday.com/2015/03/20/not-only-was-the-sae-student-expulsion-legal-it-was-right/
I pulled the following cases from a footnote in this article (http://scholarship.law.wm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1035&context=wmborj (http://scholarship.law.wm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1035&context=wmborj)) which is written by one of the country's leading constitutional scholars. I'd invite you to read a few of these cases though, if you're genuinely interested:
http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/FSupp/774/1163/1425792/ (http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/FSupp/774/1163/1425792/)(holding that university rule imposing punishment on students who took part in hate speech was unconstitutional)
http://cehdclass.gmu.edu/jkozlows/gmu1ay.htm (http://cehdclass.gmu.edu/jkozlows/gmu1ay.htm)(holding that discipline of fraternity by university for racial and sexual stereotypes at a social event was a violation of students' First Amendment rights)
http://www.bc.edu/bc_org/avp/cas/comm/free_speech/doe.html (http://www.bc.edu/bc_org/avp/cas/comm/free_speech/doe.html)(holding that university policy against "stigmatizing or victimizing" individuals based on race, ethnicity, religion, etc., included within its scope speech protected by the First Amendment)
The fraternity one is the shortest and probably the most interesting.
Post by: CHONGS on November 10, 2015, 07:00:22 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 07:03:56 PM
To Devil's Advocate this, in a tense environment, police intervention could be seen as preventative. No one said someone would be arrested, but I can imagine if a group of drunk idiots decided it they had enough with this "nonsense" and wanted to go to tell "those niggers to go home" it would be good if you overhead them on their way to a confrontation to tip off the cops. Of course I could be completely wrong about this motivation, but I suspect it has its roots in trying head off further escalation in an already tense situation.
yeah, this is my feeling as well. i couldn't quite formulate it fully though.
Post by: everyone shut up on November 10, 2015, 07:09:16 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 07:17:53 PM
how often do the caucasians on this blog acknowledge their privilege? i stick with a breakfast/lunch/dinner routine so i don't forget. sometimes i get thrown off if i have a mid morning snack, but i suppose there's no harm in extra acknowledgement.I think about it every time I have to pee in public and waltz into a nice hotel lobby and no one gives me a second look.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 10, 2015, 07:19:44 PM
how often do the caucasians on this blog acknowledge their privilege? i stick with a breakfast/lunch/dinner routine so i don't forget. sometimes i get thrown off if i have a mid morning snack, but i suppose there's no harm in extra acknowledgement.I think about it every time I have to pee in public and waltz into a nice hotel lobby and no one gives me a second look.
i dress like a newly homeless person, so this privilege is not extended to me
Post by: everyone shut up on November 10, 2015, 07:19:57 PM
i appreciate your effort, michigancathow often do the caucasians on this blog acknowledge their privilege? i stick with a breakfast/lunch/dinner routine so i don't forget. sometimes i get thrown off if i have a mid morning snack, but i suppose there's no harm in extra acknowledgement.I think about it every time I have to pee in public and waltz into a nice hotel lobby and no one gives me a second look.
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 07:20:10 PM
I'm not far from that!how often do the caucasians on this blog acknowledge their privilege? i stick with a breakfast/lunch/dinner routine so i don't forget. sometimes i get thrown off if i have a mid morning snack, but i suppose there's no harm in extra acknowledgement.I think about it every time I have to pee in public and waltz into a nice hotel lobby and no one gives me a second look.
i dress like a newly homeless person, so this privilege is not extended to me
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 10, 2015, 10:59:36 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 11:09:06 PM
This night. Yikes!terrible
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:16:42 PM
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 11:18:31 PM
what on earth
the fake ned has revealed himself as an awful person tonight
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 10, 2015, 11:19:43 PM
what on earth
the fake ned has revealed himself as an awful person tonight
he's always been a little too GPC'y for my personal taste
Post by: michigancat on November 10, 2015, 11:26:35 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 10, 2015, 11:34:05 PM
what has happenedthreats on yik yak about killing black people on campus tomorrow.
reports of KKK roaming in greektown (although no pictures yet).
some kid was apparently shouting racist crap in some public square.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2015, 11:36:13 PM
Post by: Kat Kid on November 10, 2015, 11:41:59 PM
Did fake ned delete the questionable tweets?
https://twitter.com/TheFakeNed/status/664305216322334720
https://twitter.com/TheFakeNed/status/664121743007612928
https://twitter.com/TheFakeNed/status/663793021255684096
https://twitter.com/TheFakeNed/status/663762014100041730
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 10, 2015, 11:59:37 PM
1)mine is not having to wonder about most stuff.
example- i'm at a restaurant in concordia, ks with a black friend and a white friend. my black friend does not get waited on well. like pretty crummy service. he does not get his drink order taken when we get ours and then does not his get his drink refilled when we get ours refilled. coincidence or racist ass waitress? i don't know and neither did the rest of us but man i'd be pretty miffed and bummed if i was the guy with black skin.
now extrapolate that over a ten, twenty, thirty year period of experiences like that. personally, i would lose my crap.
Post by: steve dave on November 11, 2015, 05:34:54 AM
Post by: chum1 on November 11, 2015, 06:09:57 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 11, 2015, 06:19:24 AM
Sorry for spreading completely unfounded and totally unsubstantiated rumors on social media. Creating a climate of fear and possible violence.
Warmest Regards:
Your Student Body President
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 11, 2015, 06:56:59 AM
I'm not 100% sure I'm doing it right but my fav is never getting selected for enhanced security screening at airports
that's a good one. another good one for me is getting warnings. the last five times i've been pulled over for speeding? all just written warnings. no tickets. never even searched me or my car! quite the deal. :gocho:
Post by: Kat Kid on November 11, 2015, 07:28:49 AM
Post by: DQ12 on November 11, 2015, 07:38:15 AM
Well to be fair that may just be cops looking out for other cops.I'm not 100% sure I'm doing it right but my fav is never getting selected for enhanced security screening at airports
that's a good one. another good one for me is getting warnings. the last five times i've been pulled over for speeding? all just written warnings. no tickets. never even searched me or my car! quite the deal. :gocho:
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 11, 2015, 07:44:27 AM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 11, 2015, 07:47:19 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 08:10:00 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 08:18:13 AM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 11, 2015, 08:19:10 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 08:20:46 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 08:22:47 AM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 11, 2015, 08:23:51 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 08:25:36 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 08:28:10 AM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 11, 2015, 08:30:45 AM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 11, 2015, 08:31:07 AM
I've been pulled over a million times for speeding and I think I've talked my way out of everyone, minus 1. It's been pretty amazing. Not trying to get racial up in here, but the one ticket I did get, the cop was not white. I totally deserved it tho.
now imagine being black and being pulled over a million times by white cops but instead of talking your way out of it, you get tickets or asked to step out of the car. not so fun now is it wacky? :frown:
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 08:34:08 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 08:35:21 AM
WC I think access to the chained portion of the store is Asian Privelge.It was a very bizarre scene, cf3. This couple had a baby in a stroller in that place.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 09:07:23 AM
The notion that a university where the climate is such that a gay African American male can be elected student body president inherently engages in INSTITUTIONALIZED racism is patently abused on every conceivable level. To think such literally renders the precept of institutionalized racism to the lowest and most impotent level of impact possible.
yeah I mean the US elected a black president and people are crazy enough to think racism exists there too!
He said INSTITUTIONALIZED racism. He even capitalized it for effect. How in the eff did you miss that?
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 09:12:34 AM
I've been pulled over a million times for speeding and I think I've talked my way out of everyone, minus 1. It's been pretty amazing. Not trying to get racial up in here, but the one ticket I did get, the cop was not white. I totally deserved it tho.
now imagine being black and being pulled over a million times by white cops but instead of talking your way out of it, you get tickets or asked to step out of the car. not so fun now is it wacky? :frown:
The ironic part about this...there are quite a few racists in the RCPD. You should try to change that rd.
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 09:27:51 AM
https://twitter.com/AlanBurdziak/status/664462750559567872
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 09:29:46 AM
I'm not 100% sure I'm doing it right but my fav is never getting selected for enhanced security screening at airports
that's a good one. another good one for me is getting warnings. the last five times i've been pulled over for speeding? all just written warnings. no tickets. never even searched me or my car! quite the deal. :gocho:
I don't even get pulled over in downtown KC, MO. Like, I can run a red right in front of a cop and he just looks down at his phone
Post by: DQ12 on November 11, 2015, 09:30:47 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 09:32:46 AM
this rough ridin' guy. from Lake St Louis, MOIs he even a student?
https://twitter.com/AlanBurdziak/status/664462750559567872
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 11, 2015, 09:45:58 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 09:47:30 AM
what is yik yakSome weird app where ppl troll and think they won't get caught. It's very unethical as @Trim would say.
Post by: DQ12 on November 11, 2015, 09:48:06 AM
what is yik yak"anonymous" localized bbs popular on college campuses. essentially a mobile version of yesteryear's juicy campus.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 11, 2015, 09:49:14 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 09:55:13 AM
yik yak sounds dumb
Imagine the #1thread but with even dumber college students
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 09:59:20 AM
Is he even a student?
he's a student at Missouri S&T
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 10:02:39 AM
:facepalm:Is he even a student?
he's a student at Missouri S&T
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 10:08:19 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 10:11:51 AM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 11, 2015, 10:28:04 AM
this rough ridin' guy. from Lake St Louis, MO
https://twitter.com/AlanBurdziak/status/664462750559567872
Terrorism????
What the eff is yik yak and what the hell did he write there???
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 11, 2015, 10:30:31 AM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 10:43:16 AM
That and not every cop is a racist prick!
Well...ya...but even I would expect a non-racist white cop to give a white dude a hard time about violating a firearms law. Cops can be pretty sensitive to stuff like that. I think it might even have been a felony?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2015, 11:17:12 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 11:40:11 AM
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 11:48:46 AM
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 11:49:44 AM
Post by: 8manpick on November 11, 2015, 11:52:58 AM
That wacko professor resigned her "courtesy j-school appointmemt". I assume that means she didn't resign her job in mass comm.
Pretty sure it came out that she was a student, not faculty.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 11, 2015, 11:59:07 AM
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 12:00:44 PM
And how should I feel that he was wealthier than my dreams?
According to my facebook feed his family's wealth is proof white privilege does not exist.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 11, 2015, 12:05:18 PM
this rough ridin' guy. from Lake St Louis, MO
https://twitter.com/AlanBurdziak/status/664462750559567872
Terrorism????
What the eff is yik yak and what the hell did he write there???
I thought the admin and police infrastructure there was unresponsive? Two known perps: 1 suspended from school, the second arrested and charged.
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 12:08:10 PM
Post by: steve dave on November 11, 2015, 12:14:58 PM
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 12:16:02 PM
And how should I feel that he was wealthier than my dreams?
According to my facebook feed his family's wealth is proof white privilege does not exist.
Obviously not. But he should consider himself really fortunate that he has multi generational wealth and doesn't ever have to work in his life.
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 12:16:32 PM
I have really not been following this much but sounds like maybe a lot of dumbasses involved on all sides?
can do nothing but confirm at this point
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 12:20:15 PM
I have really not been following this much but sounds like maybe a lot of dumbasses involved on all sides?
Fact. I think it's going to get worse. Stay tuned
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 12:23:50 PM
And how should I feel that he was wealthier than my dreams?
According to my facebook feed his family's wealth is proof white privilege does not exist.
Obviously not. But he should consider himself really fortunate that he has multi generational wealth and doesn't ever have to work in his life.
He probably does. I mean, without his wealth, he probably wouldn't even have gone to college, let alone make it to grad school and have the confidence (aka financial security) to devote his life to righting perceived wrongs. Most black men his age don't have that luxury, and are therefore less likely to take a stand. Good for him.
Post by: cfbandyman on November 11, 2015, 12:24:35 PM
I have really not been following this much but sounds like maybe a lot of dumbasses involved on all sides?
Fact. I think it's going to get worse. Stay tuned
Me too, once again so much misinformation causing more unrest. I think they just need to close it all down for a few days, have everyone go home. Cool it down.
Post by: chum1 on November 11, 2015, 12:26:50 PM
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 12:27:42 PM
And how should I feel that he was wealthier than my dreams?
According to my facebook feed his family's wealth is proof white privilege does not exist.
Obviously not. But he should consider himself really fortunate that he has multi generational wealth and doesn't ever have to work in his life.
He probably does. I mean, without his wealth, he probably wouldn't even have gone to college, let alone make it to grad school and have the confidence (aka financial security) to devote his life to righting perceived wrongs. Most black men his age don't have that luxury, and are therefore less likely to take a stand. Good for him.
Good for his parents too.
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 12:29:56 PM
Yes, they should be proud of their own accomplishments as well as their son's.And how should I feel that he was wealthier than my dreams?
According to my facebook feed his family's wealth is proof white privilege does not exist.
Obviously not. But he should consider himself really fortunate that he has multi generational wealth and doesn't ever have to work in his life.
He probably does. I mean, without his wealth, he probably wouldn't even have gone to college, let alone make it to grad school and have the confidence (aka financial security) to devote his life to righting perceived wrongs. Most black men his age don't have that luxury, and are therefore less likely to take a stand. Good for him.
Good for his parents too.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 11, 2015, 12:32:37 PM
I have really not been following this much but sounds like maybe a lot of dumbasses involved on all sides?
can do nothing but confirm at this point
If, by "sides," you are referring to the activists, faculty, administration, shitty football team, most of the media, and a few drunk and/or racist random retards, then yes, a whole lotta dumbasses involved on all sides.
If you're also referring to the people - aka rational adults - who correctly diagnosed this as a phony controversy ginned up by PC jackboot zealots and racial grievance mongers, then no, those rational adults aren't dumbasses. They were right.
Post by: chum1 on November 11, 2015, 12:37:06 PM
Post by: chum1 on November 11, 2015, 12:39:56 PM
Nah, he wanted to die of hunger strike.
Post by: _33 on November 11, 2015, 12:40:44 PM
And how should I feel that he was wealthier than my dreams?
According to my facebook feed his family's wealth is proof white privilege does not exist.
Obviously not. But he should consider himself really fortunate that he has multi generational wealth and doesn't ever have to work in his life.
He probably does. I mean, without his wealth, he probably wouldn't even have gone to college, let alone make it to grad school and have the confidence (aka financial security) to devote his life to righting perceived wrongs. Most black men his age don't have that luxury, and are therefore less likely to take a stand. Good for him.
He probably does. But would it kill him to acknowledge it?
Post by: AppleJack on November 11, 2015, 12:43:02 PM
He might as well have threatened to go to the moon and remove his spacesuit.
:lol:
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 12:44:20 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 12:46:54 PM
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 12:48:06 PM
why is the term "jackboot" constantly being used? Is Rush saying this a lot? @liblibliblibliblib?
Fun to say
Post by: sys on November 11, 2015, 12:49:06 PM
why is the term "jackboot" constantly being used? Is Rush saying this a lot? @liblibliblibliblib?
jackbooted.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 11, 2015, 12:57:29 PM
I have really not been following this much but sounds like maybe a lot of dumbasses involved on all sides?
can do nothing but confirm at this point
If, by "sides," you are referring to the activists, faculty, administration, shitty football team, most of the media, and a few drunk and/or racist random retards, then yes, a whole lotta dumbasses involved on all sides.
If you're also referring to the people - aka rational adults - who correctly diagnosed this as a phony controversy ginned up by PC jackboot zealots and racial grievance mongers, then no, those rational adults aren't dumbasses. They were right.
Nope. They were wrong, too.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 01:02:58 PM
why is the term "jackboot" constantly being used? Is Rush saying this a lot? @liblibliblibliblib?
Not that I've noticed.
Rush is going all in on "hungry kids dad made 8.4 million last year so obviously he's not sincere and he's a bored rich kid that got hooked in by the race hustlers and race industry to perpetrate a hoax"
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 01:18:11 PM
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 11, 2015, 01:21:17 PM
Post by: kstate16 on November 11, 2015, 01:23:40 PM
However, what i do know, is that Yik-Yak sounds like the worst idea ever.
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 01:29:36 PM
I feel bad for MIR guys, these situations always end up revealing his not so pleasant side. We love ya man.
He is fine
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 01:40:43 PM
:dunno:
Post by: _33 on November 11, 2015, 01:47:53 PM
Am I crazy for thinking the situation isn't all that serious/crazy and I don't think it will get much worse? I mean since Monday the craziest thing that has happened was that some hick posted something racist anonymously and a college kid spread an unfounded rumor.
:dunno:
You are not crazy. You are extremely sane.
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 11, 2015, 01:48:12 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 01:49:53 PM
Well the president lost a pretty good gig.
that happened on Monday
Post by: Cire on November 11, 2015, 01:52:12 PM
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Post by: lopakman on November 11, 2015, 02:09:07 PM
He threatened death. But there is, like, ZERO chance that he actually would have died from not eating.
yeah, the whole "he's dying and his life is on the line" b.s. by some people is so dumb. He was on a voluntary hunger strike and could have ordered a pizza anytime wanted.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2015, 02:15:04 PM
student body president was telling everyone the kkk was on campus? what a mess.
Were they not? After reading the anon kkk doxing and before hearing about this story I would have thought there was Klan on campus. Frankly after reading that doxing I'm convinced that Missouri is the worldwide hub of the Klan.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2015, 02:16:27 PM
I feel bad for MIR guys, these situations always end up revealing his not so pleasant side. We love ya man.
I've been not so pleasant itt? Interesting if true.
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 02:27:55 PM
student body president was telling everyone the kkk was on campus? what a mess.
Were they not? After reading the anon kkk doxing and before hearing about this story I would have thought there was Klan on campus. Frankly after reading that doxing I'm convinced that Missouri is the worldwide hub of the Klan.
they were not
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTgiCHgWcAAJ1xC.jpg)
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 11, 2015, 02:29:03 PM
I feel like some of you are marginalizing some of these deeper issues and I don't like it at all. I should note that if I previously didn't give a crap about you then I don't care what you say, yuk it up.
not sure if you're talking about me, but i'm not marginalizing or meaning to come off as i am. for me there are about a billion things everyday that happen and don't happen to me and i never have to wonder if the color of my skin factored into them. i'm already kind of a paranoid person and can't imagine adding color of skin into that. i'd lose my mind.
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 02:29:33 PM
http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/ (http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/)
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 02:37:22 PM
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 02:44:24 PM
Wait, are they still not going to class? I'd be rough ridin' pissed if I were a student and my classes were being cancelled over this bullshit.
certain students did not feel safe going to class today based on the threats that were occurring last night.
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 11, 2015, 02:47:47 PM
Wait, are they still not going to class? I'd be rough ridin' pissed if I were a student and my classes were being cancelled over this bullshit.
you would then become the first student ever to be pissed about their classes being cancelled.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 02:49:06 PM
Wait, are they still not going to class? I'd be rough ridin' pissed if I were a student and my classes were being cancelled over this bullshit.
No you wouldn't, you'd go to the bars and get drunk and maybe have sex with a woman, and you wouldn't be mad the entire time
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 11, 2015, 02:57:46 PM
I assumed it was a hoax drawn (painted? what's the right word when working in human crap?) by one of the nutjob activists - as so many of these "hate crimes" end up being. But now people are asking whether the thing ever even existed in the first place. There doesn't seem to be any evidence of it. None. No pictures. No police report. The closest people can come is a hearsay report by a res-hall advisor a couple of days after the alleged incident based on a flyer someone saw posted on the dorm wall.
http://thefederalist.com/2015/11/10/was-the-poop-swastika-incident-at-mizzou-a-giant-hoax/ (http://thefederalist.com/2015/11/10/was-the-poop-swastika-incident-at-mizzou-a-giant-hoax/)
It's past time for the media to get to the bottom of this.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 02:59:31 PM
But if I was paying my kid's tuition I'd be pissed!
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 03:01:14 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 03:03:09 PM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 03:06:35 PM
What a wonderful world ksuw lives in where rape, racism, and hate crimes are all hoaxes
I don't think he said "all." In fact I'm sure he didn't. If you're unsure just go back and read his post. Luckily it is right there and we can go back and look and me sure.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 03:12:39 PM
What a wonderful world ksuw lives in where rape, racism, and hate crimes are all hoaxes
I don't think he said "all." In fact I'm sure he didn't. If you're unsure just go back and read his post. Luckily it is right there and we can go back and look and me sure.
Sure, if you don't take into account his entire pit history.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 03:20:16 PM
What a wonderful world ksuw lives in where rape, racism, and hate crimes are all hoaxes
I don't think he said "all." In fact I'm sure he didn't. If you're unsure just go back and read his post. Luckily it is right there and we can go back and look and me sure.
Sure, if you don't take into account his entire pit history.
"entire" :sdeek: :runaway:
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 03:21:56 PM
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 03:38:53 PM
also, the professor that said he would still be holding an exam this morning has resigned.
http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/ (http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTj6gOvUAAArT6b.jpg)
Post by: Winters on November 11, 2015, 03:40:39 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 11, 2015, 03:43:44 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 11, 2015, 03:46:18 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 11, 2015, 03:48:51 PM
also, the professor that said he would still be holding an exam this morning has resigned.
http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/ (http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTj6gOvUAAArT6b.jpg)
my dear lord.....
Post by: 'taterblast on November 11, 2015, 03:49:53 PM
Post by: dmartin on November 11, 2015, 03:53:09 PM
Where does vine rank as a social media platform? I assume at least lower than twitter and instragram (maybe pinterest)
Post by: sys on November 11, 2015, 04:01:30 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 11, 2015, 04:08:35 PM
In liblib world someone just said all terrible things are hoaxes. Classic. :thumbsup:
Post by: lopakman on November 11, 2015, 04:10:34 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 04:12:08 PM
https://instagram.com/wtfvon/
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 11, 2015, 04:14:26 PM
Post by: dmartin on November 11, 2015, 04:17:37 PM
Von does not appear to be an MU student
https://instagram.com/wtfvon/
only 16k followers. Weak
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2015, 04:20:39 PM
interesting. wonder if yik yak narked on him.
one of their last updates you have to confirm your phone number, in the past they never asked for anything, so im sure they did.
what is yik yakSome weird app where ppl troll and think they won't get caught. It's very unethical as @Trim would say.
yik yak sounds dumb
Imagine the #1thread but with even dumber college students
:dubious:
http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=35120.msg1364638
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 04:22:11 PM
Love liblib world. So it's possible since there's no literal evidence of the poopstika, and thus with no real evidence, no actual pictures, no police reports (or at least that's what is being claimed") that it may be a hoax.
In liblib world someone just said all terrible things are hoaxes. Classic. :thumbsup:
Please link where I said any of that, smdh dax
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 11, 2015, 04:25:17 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2015, 04:27:15 PM
Post by: cfbandyman on November 11, 2015, 05:23:29 PM
why would you need to absolute value a positive number?
Mocat get in here and explain odd exponential powers to TBT. TIA
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2015, 05:31:22 PM
Post by: cfbandyman on November 11, 2015, 05:35:51 PM
:confused: wtf are you talking about
Plug -2 in for lib and tell me what you get.
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2015, 05:37:35 PM
:confused: wtf are you talking about
Plug -2 in for lib and tell me what you get.
I don't think you know what difference means
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2015, 05:39:01 PM
- lib^2
------------
lib^5
Post by: cfbandyman on November 11, 2015, 05:40:15 PM
:confused: wtf are you talking about
Plug -2 in for lib and tell me what you get.
I don't think you know what difference means
(-2)^7-(-2)^2 = -124
Post by: cfbandyman on November 11, 2015, 05:40:57 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2015, 05:41:18 PM
Post by: Tobias on November 11, 2015, 05:41:47 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2015, 05:42:52 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 05:48:09 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 11, 2015, 05:51:47 PM
Guys, I feel like not nearly enough attention has been given to the claim that somebody drew a swastika out of poop. That was a big deal in all the original stories - now nobody is mentioning the poopstika. What happened to the poopstika?!
I assumed it was a hoax drawn (painted? what's the right word when working in human crap?) by one of the nutjob activists - as so many of these "hate crimes" end up being. But now people are asking whether the thing ever even existed in the first place. There doesn't seem to be any evidence of it. None. No pictures. No police report. The closest people can come is a hearsay report by a res-hall advisor a couple of days after the alleged incident based on a flyer someone saw posted on the dorm wall.
http://thefederalist.com/2015/11/10/was-the-poop-swastika-incident-at-mizzou-a-giant-hoax/
It's past time for the media to get to the bottom of this.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
lib says this:
What a wonderful world ksuw lives in where rape, racism, and hate crimes are all hoaxes
Quote
Most hate crimes are hoaxes :lol:
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 05:55:20 PM
Post by: cfbandyman on November 11, 2015, 05:56:53 PM
Back to our regularly schedule show of throwing poopswastikas at each other regarding a potential hoax (?) of a very privileged black student asking a privileged white man to check his privilege and getting him fired for not acting on racial issues effectively set to a student body president informing that KKK is there but isn't while needing some muscle to remove the media from this I don't even know what to believe anymore devoid of all it's original intention story. You know, what the pit truly is about.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 11, 2015, 05:59:03 PM
we all know it's what he meant :dunno:
Pathetic . . . sad.
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 06:12:05 PM
Post by: sys on November 11, 2015, 06:19:30 PM
if that teacher really quit because students wanted to reschedule a nutrition exam my god what a thin-skinned crybaby. good grief.
he was terrified.
Post by: chum1 on November 11, 2015, 06:25:41 PM
Post by: wetwillie on November 11, 2015, 06:31:34 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 06:44:53 PM
Is suggest maybe try doing something about it without quitting his jobif that teacher really quit because students wanted to reschedule a nutrition exam my god what a thin-skinned crybaby. good grief.What if he had some nasty emails and there wasn't the proper support structure or safe zones in place?
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 06:45:09 PM
What would you eat after a hunger strike? If it's me I'm goin for a huge plate of loaded nachos.
cheeseburger is def #1
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 11, 2015, 07:24:07 PM
Post by: Trim on November 11, 2015, 07:28:20 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 07:29:30 PM
Why is it being implied that money background makes the hunger strike illegitimate?
because that means it's all a hoax
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 11, 2015, 07:32:04 PM
Why is it being implied that money background makes the hunger strike illegitimate?
It's ironic that the heir to a multimillion dollar fortune was accusing others of being privileged. And that's not implied - it's expressly hilarious.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 07:33:54 PM
Post by: Trim on November 11, 2015, 07:34:44 PM
Why is it being implied that money background makes the hunger strike illegitimate?
It's ironic that the heir to a multimillion dollar fortune was accusing others of being privileged. And that's not implied - it's expressly hilarious.
OK, so you're not asserting that the hunger strike itself was bogus, just that it his rationale for going on it was hypocritical?
Post by: Trim on November 11, 2015, 07:36:23 PM
Someone with resources who voluntarily starves himself is on a hunger strike.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 11, 2015, 07:51:52 PM
#unconcernedaupair0591
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 11, 2015, 07:52:31 PM
Why is it being implied that money background makes the hunger strike illegitimate?
It's ironic that the heir to a multimillion dollar fortune was accusing others of being privileged. And that's not implied - it's expressly hilarious.
OK, so you're not asserting that the hunger strike itself was bogus, just that it his rationale for going on it was hypocritical?
If you're asking whether I have any proof he snuck a jar or two of caviar during his strike, no, I can't say for certain that the strike itself was bogus.
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 08:55:09 PM
I went to school with some kids with this kind of wealth and their lives were very unique in the complete lack of pressure of any kind at any time.
Post by: Trim on November 11, 2015, 08:59:19 PM
His money does not change his message. The was just such a weird wrinkle. I mean, he is literally the 1%. He was born into the kind of wealth and privilege I doubt any of us will ever know.
I went to school with some kids with this kind of wealth and their lives were very unique in the complete lack of pressure of any kind at any time.
He def figured out a way to have some pressure.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 11, 2015, 09:19:22 PM
What would you eat after a hunger strike? If it's me I'm goin for a huge plate of loaded nachos.
cheeseburger is def #1
Chipotle 'rito
Post by: _33 on November 11, 2015, 09:31:55 PM
What would you eat after a hunger strike? If it's me I'm goin for a huge plate of loaded nachos.
cheeseburger is def #1
Chipotle 'rito
Clearly none of you have ever hunger struck (note to self: song parody potential) before. You can't eat a huge meal after not eating for a week. You have to ease into it or you will make yourself sick.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 09:43:47 PM
Quote
His hunger strike lasted a couple of days. I mean, big whoop. I once fasted for a whole month. Nobody had to resign. Nobody had to quit. I didn't threaten anybody. I just did it. I did it on a dare. I was 21, 22. Nothing but water. I took some vitamin pills.
People said, "If you're not eating anything, the vitamin pills are not gonna matter."
I said, "Well, they might psychologically."
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2015, 09:50:20 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 11, 2015, 09:50:54 PM
_33's post made me remember the mostomgpart of rush today.
QuoteHis hunger strike lasted a couple of days. I mean, big whoop. I once fasted for a whole month. Nobody had to resign. Nobody had to quit. I didn't threaten anybody. I just did it. I did it on a dare. I was 21, 22. Nothing but water. I took some vitamin pills.
People said, "If you're not eating anything, the vitamin pills are not gonna matter."
I said, "Well, they might psychologically."
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 09:51:06 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 09:53:55 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 11, 2015, 09:56:02 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2015, 10:11:16 PM
I feel like some of you are marginalizing some of these deeper issues and I don't like it at all. I should note that if I previously didn't give a crap about you then I don't care what you say, yuk it up.
not sure if you're talking about me, but i'm not marginalizing or meaning to come off as i am. for me there are about a billion things everyday that happen and don't happen to me and i never have to wonder if the color of my skin factored into them. i'm already kind of a paranoid person and can't imagine adding color of skin into that. i'd lose my mind.
Nah, I wasn't, thank you RD. I wish all men in blue were like you.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2015, 10:13:18 PM
the guy who wrote that email to the professor is named "Von"??? smdh. people and their names these days.
:ROFL:
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2015, 10:20:04 PM
I'd like for every non white male to acknowledge that, whatever their shortcomings in life are, very little if not none of it is the fault of white males. Then I want them to resign from being pathetic.
#unconcernedaupair0591
What if you don't have any shortcomings in life?
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 11, 2015, 10:55:55 PM
I'd like for every non white male to acknowledge that, whatever their shortcomings in life are, very little if not none of it is the fault of white males. Then I want them to resign from being pathetic.
#unconcernedaupair0591
What if you don't have any shortcomings in life?
Then do it for those who do
Post by: dmartin on November 12, 2015, 08:34:29 AM
the guy who wrote that email to the professor is named "Von"??? smdh. people and their names these days.
:ROFL:
I know two seperate Von's under the age of 10
Post by: 8manpick on November 12, 2015, 09:29:42 AM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 12, 2015, 09:33:09 AM
Post by: lopakman on November 12, 2015, 09:38:07 AM
What is the percentage of people who began a hunger strike who actually died? I can't find a single instance where someone threatened death by starvation if some conditions were not met, that actually died.
Yes people have died from hunger strikes. There was a unified Irish hunger strike in 1981.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 09:38:56 AM
So how do we feel about Jonathan Butler being "hit" by the car carrying Mizzou's president?
WAS IT A HOAX
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 12, 2015, 09:39:15 AM
So how do we feel about Jonathan Butler being "hit" by the car carrying Mizzou's president?
the only video I've seen of someone assaulting another person in this whole mess was the protectors of tent city going after the reporters.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 12, 2015, 09:39:52 AM
So how do we feel about Jonathan Butler being "hit" by the car carrying Mizzou's president?
WAS IT A HOAX
not really a hoax as much as an inaccurate statement.
Post by: 8manpick on November 12, 2015, 09:39:58 AM
I think maybe the car should charge Butler with running into itSo how do we feel about Jonathan Butler being "hit" by the car carrying Mizzou's president?
WAS IT A HOAX
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 12, 2015, 09:40:31 AM
What is the percentage of people who began a hunger strike who actually died? I can't find a single instance where someone threatened death by starvation if some conditions were not met, that actually died.
Yes people have died from hunger strikes. There was a unified Irish hunger strike in 1981.
I don't think he could have died here, though. When he finally passed out he would have been given medical care under the laws of implied consent.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 09:48:22 AM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 12, 2015, 09:51:42 AM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 12, 2015, 09:53:39 AM
I hadn't seen this until just now. The parade thing that really ramped up everything
Post by: AppleJack on November 12, 2015, 09:56:22 AM
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 10:05:17 AM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tim-wolfe-homecoming-parade_56402cc8e4b0307f2cadea10 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tim-wolfe-homecoming-parade_56402cc8e4b0307f2cadea10)
I hadn't seen this until just now. The parade thing that really ramped up everything
I'd like to buy them better megaphones.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 10:09:52 AM
Post by: chum1 on November 12, 2015, 10:10:40 AM
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.huffingtonpost.com%2Fasset%2Fscalefit_630_noupscale%2F56423127290000d7004dc9dd.png&hash=378ad41d994d6da4295d16c52f165a31ac312707)
Post by: chum1 on November 12, 2015, 10:13:13 AM
Melissa Click?
Also, youtube vid at 9:00.
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 10:14:40 AM
Melissa Click?
Also, youtube vid at 9:00.
Yep I was just at that point in the video. She has a very recognizable face.
Post by: DQ12 on November 12, 2015, 10:43:36 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 10:48:52 AM
Pick-Up Truck N Word: Alleged incident with no identified perps. Completely unknown if indeed it did happen and if individuals involved would fall under the oversight of MU, outside of the alleged incident possibly occurring on campus.
Campus N Word: Alleged perp suspended pending investigation.
Student Body President: Spreading unfounded and totally unsubstantiated rumors on social media. Creating an even greater climate of fear and disruption to the daily operations of a major university.
Hunger Striker: Protesting removal of abortion doctor access to University of Missouri Medical Facilities (a publicly funded entity), the loss of health care for graduate students (or graduate teaching assistants), and the alleged Pick-Up Truck N Word Drive by. The loss of graduate student/assistant healtchare coverage was solely and completely driven by the IRS and the IRS's interpretation of the ACA.
Oh Flying Spaghetti Monster . . . this is absolutely classic.
Bravo PC Brownshirts!!
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 10:51:20 AM
Dax, are you running aggie station's twitter account?
Post by: chuckjames on November 12, 2015, 10:53:00 AM
http://cjonline.com/news/2015-11-11/frustration-anger-toward-ku-administration-mark-forum-race (http://cjonline.com/news/2015-11-11/frustration-anger-toward-ku-administration-mark-forum-race)
Was reading the Eagle's story about this. One student's complaint was she felt like just a number. I LOLed pretty hard.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 11:01:50 AM
https://twitter.com/WesleyLowery/status/664806657050865664
Dax, are you running aggie station's twitter account?
First I've heard of a police report. so strike that one.
So if the Hunger Striker would have died. Would Obama, the ACA and the IRS have blood on their hands?
BTW, MU took the money that the IRS (enforcing ACA mandates . . . scary in and of itself) said they could no longer use to subsidize healthcare and made it available in the form of fellowships that GA's could apply for.
Post by: kstate16 on November 12, 2015, 11:04:25 AM
https://twitter.com/WesleyLowery/status/664806657050865664
Dax, are you running aggie station's twitter account?
First I've heard of a police report. so strike that one.
So if the Hunger Striker would have died. Would Obama, the ACA and the IRS have blood on their hands?
BTW, MU took the money that the IRS (enforcing ACA mandates . . . scary in and of itself) said they could no longer use to subsidize healthcare and made it available in the form of fellowships that GA's could apply for.
Oh the irony.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 11:05:02 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 11:06:28 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 11:08:18 AM
Blaming obamacare is pretty lol considering pretty much every other college with the same problem found a work around pretty easily. Mu admin decided to just cut it instead
Or make fellowships available to all GA's.
Not exactly a cut . . . but we are talking lib interpretation here, so with that comes the broadest brush possible, or would it be the narrowest?
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 11:17:34 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 11:18:15 AM
good grief, dax
good grief yourself, cRusty
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 11:19:16 AM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 12, 2015, 11:20:57 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 11:25:03 AM
37 pages and lots of dialogue here. Still gonna defer to black people at mizzou as far as how things are for black people at mizzou.
Since we can only judge this situation by the grievances laid out and then have to into account the prominent role multiple minority students have played in the fabric of the university, one could reasonably question that this is being overblown. But that's a no-no in New Outrage Nation.
Post by: kstate16 on November 12, 2015, 11:28:38 AM
37 pages and lots of dialogue here. Still gonna defer to black people at mizzou as far as how things are for black people at mizzou.
I feel like the vast majority of people at mizzou are not in fact racist. I mean, 3 out of the last 5 student body presidents have been black. It's missouri, so of course there will be some idiots that are.
Am I missing something here?
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 11:30:46 AM
37 pages and lots of dialogue here. Still gonna defer to black people at mizzou as far as how things are for black people at mizzou.
Since we can only judge this situation by the grievances laid out and then have to into account the prominent role multiple minority students have played in the fabric of the university, one could reasonably question that this is being overblown. But that's a no-no in New Outrage Nation.
Nah, I'm confident black people at mizzou have the best understanding about how things are for black people at mizzou.
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 11:31:49 AM
37 pages and lots of dialogue here. Still gonna defer to black people at mizzou as far as how things are for black people at mizzou.
I feel like the vast majority of people at mizzou are not in fact racist. I mean, 3 out of the last 5 student body presidents have been black. It's missouri, so of course there will be some idiots that are.
Am I missing something here?
Yeah.
Post by: DQ12 on November 12, 2015, 11:33:47 AM
should we defer to miffed small business owners who claim that they're being persecuted based on religious freedom?
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 11:46:49 AM
I understand what you're saying trim, and I think you're probably right in this instance. but it's a little silly to defer to agrieved individuals as the only authority on their grievances.
should we defer to miffed small business owners who claim that they're being persecuted based on religious freedom?
Nah. I'm sure those small business owners in some part believe they're being persecuted by having to do business with gay people. I can think that's a little wacky, but whatever.
When seemingly all black people at or who've been at mizzou (shout mizzemaw kim english) say - some louder than others - it's mumped up for black people at mizzou, I'm not gonna be swayed by clay travis or fake sugar dick saying it's not.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 12:20:47 PM
I understand what you're saying trim, and I think you're probably right in this instance. but it's a little silly to defer to agrieved individuals as the only authority on their grievances.
should we defer to miffed small business owners who claim that they're being persecuted based on religious freedom?
Nah. I'm sure those small business owners in some part believe they're being persecuted by having to do business with gay people. I can think that's a little wacky, but whatever.
When seemingly all black people at or who've been at mizzou (shout mizzemaw kim english) say - some louder than others - it's mumped up for black people at mizzou, I'm not gonna be swayed by clay travis or fake sugar dick saying it's not.
When you have staunch prog-liberal types in academia openly questioning the hyper PC climate that exists on college campuses these days . . .it's perfectly applicable to question the veracity of these situations. In addition, you have to account for the anarchist element that exist on nearly every college campus who is going to join in out out of the sheer enjoyment of causing disruption and stick it to the man regardless of whether they have any real grievance or not. To deny it exists means that you've probably never been to college, or went to some place like Liberty or BYU.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 12:21:41 PM
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
Post by: steve dave on November 12, 2015, 12:25:12 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 12, 2015, 12:25:56 PM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tim-wolfe-homecoming-parade_56402cc8e4b0307f2cadea10 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tim-wolfe-homecoming-parade_56402cc8e4b0307f2cadea10)
I hadn't seen this until just now. The parade thing that really ramped up everything
It seems to me that the activists created the confrontation, no? So if you're rolling down the street in a parade and a group of angry activists jumps into the parade route and blocks your car, what's the protocol? Is there like a standard respectful waiting period for them to have their tantrum, or do you just have to sit there for as long as it takes until the police arrive?
Is this the way to have a respectful dialogue? Jump in front of someone's car during a parade?
Post by: 8manpick on November 12, 2015, 12:30:15 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
This
Post by: 8manpick on November 12, 2015, 12:30:32 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 12:35:43 PM
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 12:36:21 PM
That's a pretty reasonable FSD post.
Yep. I don't agree with quite all of it, but making it clear he's not a mumped-up for black people denier makes all the rest much more readable. That president should've said "I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou and I know because I'm here. Let's meet up ASAP and go through your stuff and figure out what needs to be done about it and get it done."
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 12:36:47 PM
Should have ran those agitators over, right ksuw? That'll teach them to know their place
I don't think that he's saying that at all . . . but liblogic
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 12:40:48 PM
That's a pretty reasonable FSD post.
Yep. I don't agree with quite all of it, but making it clear he's not a mumped-up for black people denier makes all the rest much more readable. That president should've said "I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou and I know because I'm here. Let's meet up ASAP and go through your stuff and figure out what needs to be done about it and get it done."
While I think that's probably true, but as I've pointed out many times, there seemed to be a rather expansive infrastructure at MU for those kinds of activities. What were those people up to? Were they being stopped from doing their job? Or, we they failing to their job? If so, why aren't they being forced to resign as well?
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 12:41:36 PM
That's a pretty reasonable FSD post.
Yep. I don't agree with quite all of it, but making it clear he's not a mumped-up for black people denier makes all the rest much more readable. That president should've said "I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou and I know because I'm here. Let's meet up ASAP and go through your stuff and figure out what needs to be done about it and get it done."
Or alternatively "I frankly don't know what black students experience at mizzou. Let's meet up ASAP so I can be informed and then we'll figure out what needs to be done about it and get it done."
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 12:42:39 PM
That's a pretty reasonable FSD post.
Yep. I don't agree with quite all of it, but making it clear he's not a mumped-up for black people denier makes all the rest much more readable. That president should've said "I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou and I know because I'm here. Let's meet up ASAP and go through your stuff and figure out what needs to be done about it and get it done."
While I think that's probably true, but as I've pointed out many times, there seemed to be a rather expansive infrastructure at MU for those kinds of activities. What were those people up to? Were they being stopped from doing their job? Or, we they failing to their job? If so, why aren't they being forced to resign as well?
Maybe. That would've been something for the president to dig into once he was fully informed.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 12:43:29 PM
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 12:55:24 PM
Seems like the board investigated that dax, and felt the president and chancellor were responsible
prolly more like the the president had a lot of enemies and everyone just decided that getting rid of him would be better for pr than keeping him and they kinda wanted to get rid of him anyways, so eff it, he gone.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 12:57:14 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 01:00:14 PM
Seems like the board investigated that dax, and felt the president and chancellor were responsible
link
Post by: john "teach me how to" dougie on November 12, 2015, 01:02:23 PM
http://cjonline.com/news/2015-11-11/frustration-anger-toward-ku-administration-mark-forum-race (http://cjonline.com/news/2015-11-11/frustration-anger-toward-ku-administration-mark-forum-race)
KU's way of getting rid of a non-football-friendly president?
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 01:02:51 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 01:04:53 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
This
I would argue that without "immature and unreasonable behavior", nothing would have changed, and people damn sure wouldn't have been forced to think about what life is like for black students at Mizzou and across the country. People just don't give a crap unless you do something similar to what they did at MU. So while I think their interactions with the media have been wrong and just plain bizarre, I commend them for actually making change and actually making people think about race relations on college campuses.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 01:05:59 PM
You need a link that both the president and chancellor were fired after board meetings?
I discussed some very specific things . . . but, liblogic.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 12, 2015, 01:06:23 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
This
I would argue that without "immature and unreasonable behavior", nothing would have changed, and people damn sure wouldn't have been forced to think about what life is like for black students at Mizzou and across the country. People just don't give a crap unless you do something similar to what they did at MU. So while I think their interactions with the media have been wrong and just plain bizarre, I commend them for actually making change and actually making people think about race relations on college campuses.
Has anything changed?
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 01:07:15 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
This
I would argue that without "immature and unreasonable behavior", nothing would have changed, and people damn sure wouldn't have been forced to think about what life is like for black students at Mizzou and across the country. People just don't give a crap unless you do something similar to what they did at MU. So while I think their interactions with the media have been wrong and just plain bizarre, I commend them for actually making change and actually making people think about race relations on college campuses.
Has anything changed?
Yeah they got the president to resign. Give me a sec and I'll dig up a link.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 12, 2015, 01:08:27 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
This
I would argue that without "immature and unreasonable behavior", nothing would have changed, and people damn sure wouldn't have been forced to think about what life is like for black students at Mizzou and across the country. People just don't give a crap unless you do something similar to what they did at MU. So while I think their interactions with the media have been wrong and just plain bizarre, I commend them for actually making change and actually making people think about race relations on college campuses.
Has anything changed?
Yeah they got the president to resign. Give me a sec and I'll dig up a link.
How does that change anything for black people on campus at Mizzou, though?
Post by: 8manpick on November 12, 2015, 01:09:27 PM
Potentially unjust loss of employment?I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
This
I would argue that without "immature and unreasonable behavior", nothing would have changed, and people damn sure wouldn't have been forced to think about what life is like for black students at Mizzou and across the country. People just don't give a crap unless you do something similar to what they did at MU. So while I think their interactions with the media have been wrong and just plain bizarre, I commend them for actually making change and actually making people think about race relations on college campuses.
Has anything changed?
Yeah they got the president to resign. Give me a sec and I'll dig up a link.
Post by: Kat Kid on November 12, 2015, 01:11:16 PM
What is the percentage of people who began a hunger strike who actually died? I can't find a single instance where someone threatened death by starvation if some conditions were not met, that actually died.
Bobby Sands
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 01:14:20 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
This
I would argue that without "immature and unreasonable behavior", nothing would have changed, and people damn sure wouldn't have been forced to think about what life is like for black students at Mizzou and across the country. People just don't give a crap unless you do something similar to what they did at MU. So while I think their interactions with the media have been wrong and just plain bizarre, I commend them for actually making change and actually making people think about race relations on college campuses.
Has anything changed?
Yeah they got the president to resign. Give me a sec and I'll dig up a link.
How does that change anything for black people on campus at Mizzou, though?
If it doesn't change anything immediately, it's a significant step towards change. (according to black people on campus at Mizzou).
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 01:14:32 PM
Sounds like an ineffective University president, sys
that's a tautological statement, liblib.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 12, 2015, 01:15:17 PM
Should have ran those agitators over, right ksuw? That'll teach them to know their place
I don't think that he's saying that at all . . . but liblogic
Yeah, I didn't say that. But I guess it's easier for lib7 to respond that way rather than to actually answer the questions.
Post by: AppleJack on November 12, 2015, 01:17:23 PM
http://adamcarolla.com/tai-lopez-and-matt-atchity/
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 01:23:02 PM
Let the authorities handle it is the minimum, perhaps trying to talk with the students to understand why they are blocking his passage sounds reasonable too. But naw, just rev the engine and try to push them out of the way, who cares if someone is injured we have a homecoming parade to finish!
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 01:24:25 PM
just rev the engine and try to push them out of the way.
the driver clearly didn't do this. unless he did it at some time that wasn't included in the video.
Post by: 8manpick on November 12, 2015, 01:27:43 PM
Well you dismissed waiting for the police to handle it as unreasonable, so I'm not sure what the answer to your question could be. I would say revving the engine and creeping up on them is a bit unreasonable.
Let the authorities handle it is the minimum, perhaps trying to talk with the students to understand why they are blocking his passage sounds reasonable too. But naw, just rev the engine and try to push them out of the way, who cares if someone is injured we have a homecoming parade to finish!
You have to be joking. Did you see the part where they were actually backing up for a while trying to get out of the situation? When the guy got "hit" he was walking into the car quite a bit faster than the car was moving. It was deliberate on the "victim's" part
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 01:29:08 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 01:32:00 PM
When your measurement for success is "change" and you are attempting to make "progress" towards nebulous undefined eye of the beholder concepts like "social justice" "wealth equality" "race relations" you are going to spend a lot of time trying to count the stars.
You're not wrong, but again, they had a list of pretty clearly defined demands. I know how you feel about them, but they weren't defining "progress" in the terms you are using.
Post by: nicname on November 12, 2015, 01:35:07 PM
II. We demand the immediate removal of Tim Wolfe as UM system president. After his removal a new amendment to the UM system policies must be established to have all future UM president and Chancellor positions be selected by collective of students, staff, and faculty of diverse backgrounds.
III. We demand that the University of Missouri meets the Legion of Black Collegians' demands that were presented in 1969 for the betterment of the black community. Can be found here: https://diversity.missouri.edu/timeline/lbc-demands-universityarchives74.pdf
*1969 demands include, $300,000 contingency fund to support black faculty,creating accommodations for potential black faculty at the time ie. shifting of positions to better match expertise, clear cut job descriptions, money allocated for cultural buildings, black tutoring, etc.
IV. We demand that by the academic year 2017–2018, the University of Missouri increases the percentage of black faculty and staff campus wide to 10%.
V. We demand that the University of Missouri compose a strategic 10 year plan by May 1, 2016 that will increase retention rates for marginalize students, sustain diversity curriculum and training, and promote a more safe and inclusive campus.
VII. We demand that the University of Missouri increases funding for resources for the University of Missouri Counseling Center for the purpose of hiring additional mental health professionals; particularly those of color, boosting the mental health outreach and programming across campus, increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility of the counseling center, and reducing lengthy wait times for prospective clients.
VII. We demand at the University of Missouri increases funding, resources, and personnel for the social justices center on campus for the purpose of hiring additional professionals, particularly those of color, boosting out reach and programming across campus, and increasing campus-wide awareness and visibility.
Most of these demands are pretty tangible. I don't think whether progress being made towards them would be too hard to figure out.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 12, 2015, 01:40:26 PM
Media: Oh ya? Tell us about it!
Black students: No get out of here!
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 12, 2015, 01:51:33 PM
Well you dismissed waiting for the police to handle it as unreasonable
No I didn't. I asked the question. But my personal opinion is that if someone stands in front of my car and screams at me, I should't have to just sit there and wait for police if I can avoid it. I think it would be reasonable to try to slowly carefully drive around the person, which appears to be exactly what they were trying to do. And if you don't think that activist intentionally made contact with the vehicle, you're not watching the same video I am.
Let the authorities handle it is the minimum, perhaps trying to talk with the students to understand why they are blocking his passage sounds reasonable too. But naw, just rev the engine and try to push them out of the way, who cares if someone is injured we have a homecoming parade to finish!
Yeah, I'm going to go ahead and assume that trying to reason with the pack of activists wasn't going anywhere. I don't think you really believe that, either.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 02:14:09 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 02:20:40 PM
Post by: meow meow on November 12, 2015, 02:22:12 PM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 02:32:29 PM
When your measurement for success is "change" and you are attempting to make "progress" towards nebulous undefined eye of the beholder concepts like "social justice" "wealth equality" "race relations" you are going to spend a lot of time trying to count the stars.
You're not wrong, but again, they had a list of pretty clearly defined demands. I know how you feel about them, but they weren't defining "progress" in the terms you are using.
That list of demands perfectly accentuates how unreasonable and immature the group is. Nobody should or would continue reading that list after the very first sentence. There's nothing there that isn't insulting, arbitrary or would require substantial funding to duplicate existing programming.
The most plausible root of all of this is a pissed off segment of academia who manipulated students for their own pecuniary gain. That is pathetic and embarrassing. Faculty are in positions of trust, have enormous amounts of influence and power, yet bear no responsibility or liability when they misguided their students or worse manipulate and abuse them for personal gain/againF
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 02:34:52 PM
When your measurement for success is "change" and you are attempting to make "progress" towards nebulous undefined eye of the beholder concepts like "social justice" "wealth equality" "race relations" you are going to spend a lot of time trying to count the stars.
You're not wrong, but again, they had a list of pretty clearly defined demands. I know how you feel about them, but they weren't defining "progress" in the terms you are using.
That list of demands perfectly accentuates how unreasonable and immature the group is. Nobody should or would continue reading that list after the very first sentence. There's nothing there that isn't insulting, arbitrary or would require substantial funding to duplicate existing programming.
But they're still pretty easy to define/quantify.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 02:36:16 PM
When your measurement for success is "change" and you are attempting to make "progress" towards nebulous undefined eye of the beholder concepts like "social justice" "wealth equality" "race relations" you are going to spend a lot of time trying to count the stars.
You're not wrong, but again, they had a list of pretty clearly defined demands. I know how you feel about them, but they weren't defining "progress" in the terms you are using.
That list of demands perfectly accentuates how unreasonable and immature the group is. Nobody should or would continue reading that list after the very first sentence. There's nothing there that isn't insulting, arbitrary or would require substantial funding to duplicate existing programming.
But they're still pretty easy to define/quantify.
Well golly, lets kowtow to all demands as long as there, ya know, easy to define and quantify.
Post by: Winters on November 12, 2015, 02:37:29 PM
the guy who wrote that email to the professor is named "Von"??? smdh. people and their names these days.Incredibly strange name if you ask me.
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 02:37:44 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 02:39:09 PM
You're right, he should just keep ignoring his students and get fired for incompetence, sounds like a real winning strategy ksuw
Is there any kind of protracted timeline or chronology of requests that show that he ignored the students, or does liblogic dictate that university Chancellors are to drop everything and immediately take up any and all student demands? Were highly paid personnel put into place by the Chancellor to handle these issues as they came up?
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 02:40:43 PM
Well they should have asked for cars or gold then. Dont turn this into an exercise in semantics.
Pretty straight forward and highly quantifiable . . . throw in $20 billion while you're at it.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 02:47:19 PM
Well they should have asked for cars or gold then. Dont turn this into an exercise in semantics.
Well, they got demands 1 and 2 already. Do you think they could have accomplished that by acting reasonable and mature (as defined by you?) I don't.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 02:48:38 PM
37 pages and lots of dialogue here. Still gonna defer to black people at mizzou as far as how things are for black people at mizzou.
I feel like the vast majority of people at mizzou are not in fact racist. I mean, 3 out of the last 5 student body presidents have been black. It's missouri, so of course there will be some idiots that are.
Am I missing something here?
Yes
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 12, 2015, 02:49:46 PM
You're right, he should just keep ignoring his students and get fired for incompetence, sounds like a real winning strategy ksuw
First, engaging with them while they are breaking the law only encourages them to break the law. Second, these activists did not want a dialogue - they wanted a confrontation. That's what people want when they jump in front of your car and start yelling at you.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 02:53:45 PM
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 02:59:10 PM
Well they should have asked for cars or gold then. Dont turn this into an exercise in semantics.
Well, they got demands 1 and 2 already. Do you think they could have accomplished that by acting reasonable and mature (as defined by you?) I don't.
If you're going to act dumb, I'm not going to play anymore.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 03:01:34 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.
That's a pretty reasonable FSD post.
What? No it wasn't. I realize that post didn't have anything overtly racist in it so we're grading on a curve here but what he essentially said was the best way of dealing with people fed up with feeling like they haven't been heard is to laugh at them and if you don't agree with that you're part of the problem.
FSD refuses to acknowledge that we arrived at this seemingly sloppy place, I say seemingly sloppy because I refuse to let an occasional individual saying something that can be mocked or picked apart to hijack the larger issue, because of the long history of the leadership not handling these issues and more directly the now ousted president's outright refusal to sit and deal with this stuff.
This became mockable only after certain people chose to hijack the larger narrative by trying to create smoke screens about other small picture things real or made up.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 03:02:44 PM
Perhaps he should have listened to them before they felt it necessary to break the law to get his attention.
Could you provide a list of demands that were made prior to their need to jump in and disrupt a public event? If such demands were made, could you list how they were or were not being addressed?
Thanks Lib!
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 12, 2015, 03:04:20 PM
Perhaps he should have listened to them before they felt it necessary to break the law to get his attention.
Did they try to arrange a meeting with him before they jumped in front of his car? Does that excuse jumping in front of his car?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 12, 2015, 03:10:33 PM
http://www.thewire.com/national/2011/05/uva-law-student-caught-fabricating-racial-profiling-claim/37455/ (http://www.thewire.com/national/2011/05/uva-law-student-caught-fabricating-racial-profiling-claim/37455/)
http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/15467/ (http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/15467/)
http://www.bupipedream.com/archive/3063/bu-student-admits-racist-graffiti-im-so-sorry/ (http://www.bupipedream.com/archive/3063/bu-student-admits-racist-graffiti-im-so-sorry/)
http://fox6now.com/2012/02/06/student-on-uw-parkside-hit-list-admits-to-hoax/ (http://fox6now.com/2012/02/06/student-on-uw-parkside-hit-list-admits-to-hoax/)
[url=http://michellemalkin.com/2008/02/20/report-columbia-u-noose-professor-sanctioned-for-fraud/]http://michellemalkin.com/2008/02/20/report-columbia-u-noose-professor-sanctioned-for-fraud/ (http://dailycaller.com/2013/08/22/meet-the-privileged-obama-supporting-white-kids-who-perpetrated-cruel-oberlin-race-hoax/[/url)
http://dailycaller.com/2013/08/22/meet-the-privileged-obama-supporting-white-kids-who-perpetrated-cruel-oberlin-race-hoax/ (http://dailycaller.com/2013/08/22/meet-the-privileged-obama-supporting-white-kids-who-perpetrated-cruel-oberlin-race-hoax/)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1393418/posts (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1393418/posts)
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 03:11:45 PM
The president really could have avoided all of this by just taking some time to listen to his students and help work towards a solution.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 03:13:49 PM
By all accounts he had been ignoring these students for months which lead to "drastic" action (they held up a homecoming parade for a few minutes :jerk: ) and a list of demands to be heard. He continued to ignore the students until one of the few groups of students with real power joined the cause.
The president really could have avoided all of this by just taking some time to listen to his students and help work towards a solution.
The old "by all accounts" . . . whelp, that settles it.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 03:15:28 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.That's a pretty reasonable FSD post.
What? No it wasn't. I realize that post didn't have anything overtly racist in it so we're grading on a curve here but what he essentially said was the best way of dealing with people fed up with feeling like they haven't been heard is to laugh at them and if you don't agree with that you're part of the problem.
FSD refuses to acknowledge that we arrived at this seemingly sloppy place, I say seemingly sloppy because I refuse to let an occasional individual saying something that can be mocked or picked apart to hijack the larger issue, because of the long history of the leadership not handling these issues and more directly the now ousted president's outright refusal to sit and deal with this stuff.
This became mockable only after certain people chose to hijack the larger narrative by trying to create smoke screens about other small picture things real or made up.
Yeah, I didn't get a chance to post earlier, but my takeaway from fsd was that blacks should just shut up and accept racist crap happening to them at missouri
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 03:16:03 PM
Black students: It's awful for us here.
Media: Oh ya? Tell us about it!
Black students: No get out of here!
Yeah, that would have been a fruitful exercise. There are people that have fallen all over themselves trying to prove the poop swastika didn't exist, how do you think trying to explain institutional racism will go? The only time I've ever heard or seen the populace acknowledge racism was in the Donald Sterling thing. Even transparent, basic, shallow shows of racism are met with yeah buts and PC PC PC. Who cares if Riley Cooper called that guy a n-word, he plays with black guys and they all say it so why can't he. I can't believe that the PC police and race card players are mad at Jason Aldean for just wearing makeup, black guys can wear white paint and I won't care.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 03:17:05 PM
What office at MU sanctioned the poopstika?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 03:19:44 PM
When your measurement for success is "change" and you are attempting to make "progress" towards nebulous undefined eye of the beholder concepts like "social justice" "wealth equality" "race relations" you are going to spend a lot of time trying to count the stars.
You're not wrong, but again, they had a list of pretty clearly defined demands. I know how you feel about them, but they weren't defining "progress" in the terms you are using.
That list of demands perfectly accentuates how unreasonable and immature the group is. Nobody should or would continue reading that list after the very first sentence. There's nothing there that isn't insulting, arbitrary or would require substantial funding to duplicate existing programming.
The most plausible root of all of this is a pissed off segment of academia who manipulated students for their own pecuniary gain. That is pathetic and embarrassing. Faculty are in positions of trust, have enormous amounts of influence and power, yet bear no responsibility or liability when they misguided their students or worse manipulate and abuse them for personal gain/againF
Yep, they're definitely not smart enough to advocate for themselves, good for those well meaning white people for helping them, looks like we have a sequel to The Blind Side.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 03:25:33 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 03:27:43 PM
dax's inability to step back and see the big picture is a pretty remarkable thing to observe.
It's intentional and it's the easiest way to be dismissive and insular.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 03:29:14 PM
dax's inability to step back and see the big picture is a pretty remarkable thing to observe.
No more remarkable then the inability to understand that entire mechanisms to address all of these issues were put in place by the Chancellor at the University of Missouri. Which only leaves a couple of things, either the people charged to do those jobs, weren't doing them, or somehow what they were doing was being thwarted by the Chancellor(s). If it's the former, then all of those people should be forced to resign as well.
In addition, the complete dismissal of any discussion of manipulation and the like is utterly laughable, and naive (and that's being kind).
Post by: slobber on November 12, 2015, 03:30:46 PM
There is a great deal of anger itt.
There are some intelligent posters itt.
It took me about 10 hours to read it all because I had to call the MUPD about 76 times.
Gonna win 'em all!
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 03:32:20 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 12, 2015, 03:33:04 PM
It took me about 10 hours to read it all because I had to call the MUPD about 76 times.
If you need a safe space, just start a new thread.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 03:48:11 PM
dax's inability to step back and see the big picture is a pretty remarkable thing to observe.
No more remarkable then the inability to understand that entire mechanisms to address all of these issues were put in place by the Chancellor at the University of Missouri. Which only leaves a couple of things, either the people charged to do those jobs, weren't doing them, or somehow what they were doing was being thwarted by the Chancellor(s). If it's the former, then all of those people should be forced to resign as well.
In addition, the complete dismissal of any discussion of manipulation and the like is utterly laughable, and naive (and that's being kind).
No, you're more remarkable.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 03:50:04 PM
You had the student body president spreading false and malicious lies on social media . . . but yes, let's dismiss all talk of any type of manipulation.
Perspective is interesting isn't it. There are a faction of people who thinks the student body president spread "false and malicious lies" on social media. Sidebar, interesting bit of irony turning the singular tweet about the KKK into multiple lies told without the least bit of awareness. Anyway, and a faction of people who think he passed on bad information he got about the klan being on campus, because God knows no one has ever passed on bad info on twitter.
You're right about one thing dax, that incorrect tweet, just one tweet dax let's not exaggerate here buddy okay, that's bad. That one incorrect tweet is a game changer exposes all of these pc libtards as frauds.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 03:53:25 PM
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 03:57:48 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 04:02:58 PM
I'm still kind of in shock that fsd said that he believes things are mumped up for black students at mizzou. There could be some really wild stuff accomplished in this thread by the time it gets up to like 150 pages.
See, I read it like this:
(while he waves his right hand dismissively) "Yeah yeah yeah yeah things are mumped up for them, I get that. I just wish they would shut the hell up about it, they get to eat in the front of the restaurant now, what else do they need?"
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 12, 2015, 04:06:33 PM
Black students: It's awful for us here.
Media: Oh ya? Tell us about it!
Black students: No get out of here!
Yeah, that would have been a fruitful exercise. There are people that have fallen all over themselves trying to prove the poop swastika didn't exist, how do you think trying to explain institutional racism will go? The only time I've ever heard or seen the populace acknowledge racism was in the Donald Sterling thing. Even transparent, basic, shallow shows of racism are met with yeah buts and PC PC PC. Who cares if Riley Cooper called that guy a n-word, he plays with black guys and they all say it so why can't he. I can't believe that the PC police and race card players are mad at Jason Aldean for just wearing makeup, black guys can wear white paint and I won't care.
How can what these folks are purporting be validated without the media? Are we to blindly trust anything that comes from anyone? How can any of us be mother mumped for trying to understand and ask questions and then be doubtful after few of the questions can answered, the greatest reason of which is because they block a media presence? And if we question, we must be racists.
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2015, 04:08:43 PM
I'm still kind of in shock that fsd said that he believes things are mumped up for black students at mizzou. There could be some really wild stuff accomplished in this thread by the time it gets up to like 150 pages.
See, I read it like this:
(while he waves his right hand dismissively) "Yeah yeah yeah yeah things are mumped up for them, I get that. I just wish they would shut the hell up about it, they get to eat in the front of the restaurant now, what else do they need?"
:frown:
Post by: 'taterblast on November 12, 2015, 04:10:57 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 04:13:48 PM
Black students: It's awful for us here.
Media: Oh ya? Tell us about it!
Black students: No get out of here!
Yeah, that would have been a fruitful exercise. There are people that have fallen all over themselves trying to prove the poop swastika didn't exist, how do you think trying to explain institutional racism will go? The only time I've ever heard or seen the populace acknowledge racism was in the Donald Sterling thing. Even transparent, basic, shallow shows of racism are met with yeah buts and PC PC PC. Who cares if Riley Cooper called that guy a n-word, he plays with black guys and they all say it so why can't he. I can't believe that the PC police and race card players are mad at Jason Aldean for just wearing makeup, black guys can wear white paint and I won't care.
How can what these folks are purporting be validated without the media? Are we to blindly trust anything that comes from anyone? How can any of us be mother mumped for trying to understand and ask questions and then be doubtful after few of the questions can answered, the greatest reason of which is because they block a media presence? And if we question, we must be racists.
You don't honestly believe that, sorry you don't. What you just said is "tell us and it will be okay, we'll support you." The truth is in fact "tell us so that we can tell you how wrong and stupid you are." Also why do you need to know, there are many things in this country that you're perfectly okay with being in the dark about, let this be one of those things, they're not requesting our help.
Post by: AppleJack on November 12, 2015, 04:21:07 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 04:24:16 PM
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/
Somehow millions of college students have survived.
Post by: kstate16 on November 12, 2015, 04:35:14 PM
Post by: kstate16 on November 12, 2015, 04:40:19 PM
Post by: 'taterblast on November 12, 2015, 04:40:48 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 04:41:34 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 12, 2015, 04:45:03 PM
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/smdh.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 04:45:16 PM
Post by: slobber on November 12, 2015, 04:45:22 PM
Gonna win 'em all!
Post by: Fedor on November 12, 2015, 04:48:48 PM
I have been kind of taking this all in and keeping an open mind but now I am starting to get a little pissed off.http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/smdh.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 04:50:16 PM
I didn't watch the video, but they kind of unfairly summarized what she said if the text is accurate.I have been kind of taking this all in and keeping an open mind but now I am starting to get a little pissed off.http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/smdh.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 12, 2015, 04:56:07 PM
Quote
Smith-Lezama doesn’t say so directly, but one of the immediate implications of her response is that the First Amendment rights she’s tired of hearing about are responsible for “creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment.”
Maybe they should just stick with what she said directly.
Post by: Fedor on November 12, 2015, 04:56:52 PM
Yes, I was a little guilty of skimming and when I reread it, it does soften it somewhat. One thing that is starting to stand out is repeated references to "mental health professionals". Are college students more aware of mental health or are they just crazier/less adjusted than ever before?I didn't watch the video, but they kind of unfairly summarized what she said if the text is accurate.I have been kind of taking this all in and keeping an open mind but now I am starting to get a little pissed off.http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/smdh.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 04:57:43 PM
You had the student body president spreading false and malicious lies on social media . . . but yes, let's dismiss all talk of any type of manipulation.
Perspective is interesting isn't it. There are a faction of people who thinks the student body president spread "false and malicious lies" on social media. Sidebar, interesting bit of irony turning the singular tweet about the KKK into multiple lies told without the least bit of awareness. Anyway, and a faction of people who think he passed on bad information he got about the klan being on campus, because God knows no one has ever passed on bad info on twitter.
You're right about one thing dax, that incorrect tweet, just one tweet dax let's not exaggerate here buddy okay, that's bad. That one incorrect tweet is a game changer exposes all of these pc libtards as frauds.
Oh yeah, that's what I'm saying, it's all a fraud, MIR the master of the hyperbolic is going to MIR. None-the-less, one "incorrect tweet" of that inflammatory nature is extremely serious in these circumstances. Don't try and downplay it just because it was twitter, social media as you well know spreads almost exponentially in minutes, sometimes seconds.
I haven't turned that into "multiple lies" but it clearly points to how easily people can be manipulated . . . within a matter of seconds to a few short minutes, thousands, probably millions of people thought the KKK was running amok on the MU campus. It caused law enforcement and security to potentially be pulled off other protective duties to investigate.
Perspective and ramifications, even if its just "one tweet".
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 05:00:44 PM
I too believe that things are truly mumped up for black students at Mizzou because I have been there.
That doesn't mean we should not laugh at and denigrate the absurd behavior, reactions, demands and generally immature and unreasonable behavior of this group of people. The damage done to the public discourse on this matter and others so far outweighs whatever trivial progess and point they were trying to make. The only way to combat this regression is to marginalize and ignore it, and attempt to bring the discourse back up.
Anybody who condones or supports this conduct isn't really searching for a solution, imho.That's a pretty reasonable FSD post.
What? No it wasn't. I realize that post didn't have anything overtly racist in it so we're grading on a curve here but what he essentially said was the best way of dealing with people fed up with feeling like they haven't been heard is to laugh at them and if you don't agree with that you're part of the problem.
FSD refuses to acknowledge that we arrived at this seemingly sloppy place, I say seemingly sloppy because I refuse to let an occasional individual saying something that can be mocked or picked apart to hijack the larger issue, because of the long history of the leadership not handling these issues and more directly the now ousted president's outright refusal to sit and deal with this stuff.
This became mockable only after certain people chose to hijack the larger narrative by trying to create smoke screens about other small picture things real or made up.
Yeah, I didn't get a chance to post earlier, but my takeaway from fsd was that blacks should just shut up and accept racist crap happening to them at missouri
I am laughing at the people who "hijacked" the message. You are just so extreme in your rhetoric and deluded by you own misperceptions, that you are not seeing who is actually rough ridin' this up for everyone.
Lol @lib7, doesn't have the stones to speak first or think on his own, just coattail off someone else and lob rocks from the safety of his own insecurity. What a bitch.
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 05:06:03 PM
I didn't watch the video, but they kind of unfairly summarized what she said if the text is accurate.
her comments were fairly summarized (did watch the video, the text is accurate).
Post by: DQ12 on November 12, 2015, 05:07:02 PM
FWIW, I was smdh'ing at what she actually was quoted as saying, which is the following:I didn't watch the video, but they kind of unfairly summarized what she said if the text is accurate.I have been kind of taking this all in and keeping an open mind but now I am starting to get a little pissed off.http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/smdh.
Quote
“I personally am tired of hearing that First Amendment rights protect students when they are creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment for myself and for other students here. I think that it’s important for us to create that distinction and create a space where we can all learn from one another and start to create a place of healing rather than a place where we are experiencing a lot of hate like we have in the past.”Like...I'm sorry that you're tired of hearing that, but if you don't like someone's first amendment protected speech, you're either going to have to tell them they're wrong, or just kind of deal with it or whatever.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 05:23:04 PM
Isn't that kind of what she was doing on national TV? Again, I haven't watched the video or have any context with that quote.FWIW, I was smdh'ing at what she actually was quoted as saying, which is the following:I didn't watch the video, but they kind of unfairly summarized what she said if the text is accurate.I have been kind of taking this all in and keeping an open mind but now I am starting to get a little pissed off.http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/smdh.Quote“I personally am tired of hearing that First Amendment rights protect students when they are creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment for myself and for other students here. I think that it’s important for us to create that distinction and create a space where we can all learn from one another and start to create a place of healing rather than a place where we are experiencing a lot of hate like we have in the past.”Like...I'm sorry that you're tired of hearing that, but if you don't like someone's first amendment protected speech, you're either going to have to tell them they're wrong, or just kind of deal with it or whatever.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 12, 2015, 05:27:13 PM
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 05:31:31 PM
Isn't that kind of what she was doing on national TV? Again, I haven't watched the video or have any context with that quote.
the video does not provide any additional context not provided in the article. the quote is fairly clear - at least clear for a statement given in a semi-informal interview. she is stating that the first amendment right to free speech protects some students speech that creates a "hostile and unsafe" environment for other students. it is clear that she feels that this is unfortunate and she would prefer if students' right to a safe and comfortable environment on campus were given precedence over free speech.
Post by: cfbandyman on November 12, 2015, 05:41:55 PM
Isn't that kind of what she was doing on national TV? Again, I haven't watched the video or have any context with that quote.
the video does not provide any additional context not provided in the article. the quote is fairly clear - at least clear for a statement given in a semi-informal interview. she is stating that the first amendment right to free speech protects some students speech that creates a "hostile and unsafe" environment for other students. it is clear that she feels that this is unfortunate and she would prefer if students' right to a safe and comfortable environment on campus were given precedence over free speech.
If that's true what you said, than I'm sorry, but that's not how this works, not at all.
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 05:53:06 PM
If that's true what you said, than I'm sorry, but that's not how this works, not at all.
i'm more interested in michigancat's inability (or reluctance) to process her opinion than i am interested in her opinion.
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
I just thought the headline was misleading when I read the article. According to your summary, it apparently wasn't.If that's true what you said, than I'm sorry, but that's not how this works, not at all.
i'm more interested in michigancat's inability (or reluctance) to process her opinion than i am interested in her opinion.
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 06:00:08 PM
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 06:14:38 PM
also, the professor that said he would still be holding an exam this morning has resigned.
http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/ (http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/)
barstoolsports.com presented the professor's resignation as if he was disgusted with administrative pressure to reschedule the test and resigned in protest. today it is reported that his resignation was not accepted, implying that he resigned because he thought, or was pressured to feel, that he behaved inappropriately and needed to resign as a pr move (or because he, or someone superior to him, genuinely felt that his presence damaged the university). brief comments also support the latter interpretation.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/missouri-professor-resigns-after-telling-students-not-let-bullies-win-n461686
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 06:24:05 PM
why did you think the headline was misleading?I read "they" as reporters talking about their first amendment rights.
Quote
“I personally am tired of hearing that First Amendment rights protect students when they are creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment for myself and for other students here.
I don't think it's a significant story either way. She's a student talking on TV for possibly the first time.
Post by: sys on November 12, 2015, 06:34:41 PM
why did you think the headline was misleading?I read "they" as reporters talking about their first amendment rights.Quote“I personally am tired of hearing that First Amendment rights protect students when they are creating a hostile and unsafe learning environment for myself and for other students here.
i think she was. at least including them among others. the student reporters/photographers that were confronted the other day.
I don't think it's a significant story either way. She's a student talking on TV for possibly the first time.
well, student vice president and one of the protestors. it's not unfair to assume she represents more people than just herself
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2015, 06:36:42 PM
Post by: 'taterblast on November 12, 2015, 06:56:22 PM
also, the professor that said he would still be holding an exam this morning has resigned.
http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/ (http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/missouri-professor-resigns-after-he-is-pressured-to-cancel-an-exam-due-to-campus-tensions/)
barstoolsports.com presented the professor's resignation as if he was disgusted with administrative pressure to reschedule the test and resigned in protest. today it is reported that his resignation was not accepted, implying that he resigned because he thought, or was pressured to feel, that he behaved inappropriately and needed to resign as a pr move (or because he, or someone superior to him, genuinely felt that his presence damaged the university). brief comments also support the latter interpretation.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/missouri-professor-resigns-after-telling-students-not-let-bullies-win-n461686
that's pretty much the timeline of how i interpreted it too. at first i thought he was just pissed, but now it seems like he just thought he overstepped and felt bad about it. but, as with everything else in this stupid rough ridin' thing, who knows.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 08:17:35 PM
You had the student body president spreading false and malicious lies on social media . . . but yes, let's dismiss all talk of any type of manipulation.
Perspective is interesting isn't it. There are a faction of people who thinks the student body president spread "false and malicious lies" on social media. Sidebar, interesting bit of irony turning the singular tweet about the KKK into multiple lies told without the least bit of awareness. Anyway, and a faction of people who think he passed on bad information he got about the klan being on campus, because God knows no one has ever passed on bad info on twitter.
You're right about one thing dax, that incorrect tweet, just one tweet dax let's not exaggerate here buddy okay, that's bad. That one incorrect tweet is a game changer exposes all of these pc libtards as frauds.
Oh yeah, that's what I'm saying, it's all a fraud, MIR the master of the hyperbolic is going to MIR. None-the-less, one "incorrect tweet" of that inflammatory nature is extremely serious in these circumstances. Don't try and downplay it just because it was twitter, social media as you well know spreads almost exponentially in minutes, sometimes seconds.
I haven't turned that into "multiple lies" but it clearly points to how easily people can be manipulated . . . within a matter of seconds to a few short minutes, thousands, probably millions of people thought the KKK was running amok on the MU campus. It caused law enforcement and security to potentially be pulled off other protective duties to investigate.
Perspective and ramifications, even if its just "one tweet".
Dax, the quote right up there has you saying that he told lies, those are your words, so why are you accusing anyone else of hyperbole? In both of your posts I have quoted above you are guilty hyperbole at best but likely you are just a pathological liar because you can't stop doing it even in the course of calling other people liars. Can you substantiate this;
Quote
within a matter of seconds to a few short minutes, thousands, probably millions of people thought the KKK was running amok on the MU campus. It caused law enforcement and security to potentially be pulled off other protective duties to investigate.If so that's amazing, being it's the first I ever heard about it in this way.
I challenge you to type a post in this thread longer than 25 words where you aren't exaggerating the actual truth. I would say I believe in you but I'd be guilty of lying myself.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 08:39:30 PM
I have been kind of taking this all in and keeping an open mind but now I am starting to get a little pissed off.http://www.mediaite.com/tv/mizzou-student-vp-1st-amendment-creates-hostile-and-unsafe-learning-environment/smdh.
Can you or someone else please tell me why this is so upsetting? I mean the first amendment has been around for 226 years and literally every single day since someone has said something that is disparaging or contrary to what is stated in the first amendment. There has been nothing said that possesses a significant threat to free speech. In your head make up the most inflammatory thing anyone can say about the first amendment, now tell me what affect or effect, both apply, that these inflammatory words would have on anyone?
I heard Kevin Keitzman's monologue yesterday and heard him say that everyone that went to journalism school would be really offended by the attempt to silence the media, he actually strongly hinted that everyone at WHB were more offended by that than the "racial stuff." Well I went to j school and I couldn't give two shits about these people with no power to actually silence the media complaining about the media.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 08:44:41 PM
Get arrested for doing your job, that's cool, get out of McDonald's like you were told. Say you don't want the media around asking you questions and being intrusive, HOW DARE YOU!!!
Post by: wetwillie on November 12, 2015, 09:12:29 PM
Post by: Tobias on November 12, 2015, 09:14:12 PM
Did Wolfe publicly admit to his white male privilege prior to quitting?
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F5lVPSBq.jpg&hash=c5059dddb2244fad0214a8b6e0755002f35e57f3)
Post by: chum1 on November 12, 2015, 09:19:26 PM
Post by: wetwillie on November 12, 2015, 09:25:17 PM
I understood that to be an either-or situation.
I mean it got its own specific numbered point, I guess he probably didn't apologize for running into those people either then.
Post by: DQ12 on November 12, 2015, 09:31:43 PM
I have also greatly enjoyed this week seeing people lose their shits over college students stopping a guy from taking pictures from one location and other college students complaining about the media when a year ago the same people pissed off now we're making excuses for the police's treatment of the media in Ferguson.I was actually considering going to ferguson last year to let people know their rights but eventually thought better of it.
Quote
Can you or someone else please tell me why this is so upsetting? I mean the first amendment has been around for 226 years and literally every single day since someone has said something that is disparaging or contrary to what is stated in the first amendment. There has been nothing said that possesses a significant threat to free speech. In your head make up the most inflammatory thing anyone can say about the first amendment, now tell me what affect or effect, both apply, that these inflammatory words would have on anyone?There's been a ton of misinformation spread over the last few days about free speech rights. Just yesterday you and RATM were telling people that universities could rightly expel students for "hate speech" (good luck defining that) in a public forum. That's wrong and spreading that falsehood quells not just hate speech, but controversial speech in general (at least that's the theory according to first amendment jurisprudence). The police at MU sent a campus wide email telling students to call them if they were offended by students' speech so the police could "report them to the university." That's incredibly mumped up.
Just because you "don't give two shits" about this aspect of what's happening at MU doesn't mean others don't or that it's not important.
And not for nothin, but I agree with the underlying point of what this CS1950 movement is all about! Black people should be treated better on college campuses! I just think that it's important that people don't get swept up in stupid bullshit falsehoods and patently illegal messages from the police department that infringe on others' constitutional rights. And guess what -- the damn ACLU feels the same way. http://www.aclu-mo.org/newsviews/ (http://www.aclu-mo.org/newsviews/)
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 12, 2015, 09:37:06 PM
Just adds to the irony of the neo fascist "safe zone" in the middle of the rough ridin' public square.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 12, 2015, 10:16:06 PM
You had the student body president spreading false and malicious lies on social media . . . but yes, let's dismiss all talk of any type of manipulation.
Perspective is interesting isn't it. There are a faction of people who thinks the student body president spread "false and malicious lies" on social media. Sidebar, interesting bit of irony turning the singular tweet about the KKK into multiple lies told without the least bit of awareness. Anyway, and a faction of people who think he passed on bad information he got about the klan being on campus, because God knows no one has ever passed on bad info on twitter.
You're right about one thing dax, that incorrect tweet, just one tweet dax let's not exaggerate here buddy okay, that's bad. That one incorrect tweet is a game changer exposes all of these pc libtards as frauds.
Oh yeah, that's what I'm saying, it's all a fraud, MIR the master of the hyperbolic is going to MIR. None-the-less, one "incorrect tweet" of that inflammatory nature is extremely serious in these circumstances. Don't try and downplay it just because it was twitter, social media as you well know spreads almost exponentially in minutes, sometimes seconds.
I haven't turned that into "multiple lies" but it clearly points to how easily people can be manipulated . . . within a matter of seconds to a few short minutes, thousands, probably millions of people thought the KKK was running amok on the MU campus. It caused law enforcement and security to potentially be pulled off other protective duties to investigate.
Perspective and ramifications, even if its just "one tweet".
Dax, the quote right up there has you saying that he told lies, those are your words, so why are you accusing anyone else of hyperbole? In both of your posts I have quoted above you are guilty hyperbole at best but likely you are just a pathological liar because you can't stop doing it even in the course of calling other people liars. Can you substantiate this;Quotewithin a matter of seconds to a few short minutes, thousands, probably millions of people thought the KKK was running amok on the MU campus. It caused law enforcement and security to potentially be pulled off other protective duties to investigate.If so that's amazing, being it's the first I ever heard about it in this way.
I challenge you to type a post in this thread longer than 25 words where you aren't exaggerating the actual truth. I would say I believe in you but I'd be guilty of lying myself.
Laughable. So he didn't post this to twitter? "The KKK has been confirmed to be on campus"
This isn't some punk frat boy from LaDue, it's the student body president saying this on social media in the midst of a charged situation.
You can spin and twist it all want you MIR. It was an outright lie, and dangerous. The pics I've seen of the actual tweet as posted by other people on twitter retweeting, had the retweeting counts of the retweeters of 68-75-85 times. The FB post saying the same was shared over 500 plus times from his page, the guy has nearly 7,000 follower on Twitter.
Post by: 8manpick on November 12, 2015, 10:19:41 PM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 12, 2015, 10:24:04 PM
I was actually considering going to ferguson last year to let people know their rights but eventually thought better of it.
Which rights did you think they were unaware of?
Post by: DQ12 on November 12, 2015, 10:26:14 PM
First amendment stuff -- assembling, freedom of the press, etc. I had this weird notion that some people didn't know how much protection they were afforded under the first amendment.I was actually considering going to ferguson last year to let people know their rights but eventually thought better of it.
Which rights did you think they were unaware of?
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 12, 2015, 10:48:23 PM
First amendment stuff -- assembling, freedom of the press, etc. I had this weird notion that some people didn't know how much protection they were afforded under the first amendment.I was actually considering going to ferguson last year to let people know their rights but eventually thought better of it.
Which rights did you think they were unaware of?
Well, luckily they made it through somehow.
Post by: DQ12 on November 12, 2015, 11:05:00 PM
Uhh..yeah i guess so?First amendment stuff -- assembling, freedom of the press, etc. I had this weird notion that some people didn't know how much protection they were afforded under the first amendment.I was actually considering going to ferguson last year to let people know their rights but eventually thought better of it.
Which rights did you think they were unaware of?
Well, luckily they made it through somehow.
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/3/4/Justice-says-Ferguson-police-violated-1st-amendment-rights.html (http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/3/4/Justice-says-Ferguson-police-violated-1st-amendment-rights.html)
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 11:15:40 PM
I have also greatly enjoyed this week seeing people lose their shits over college students stopping a guy from taking pictures from one location and other college students complaining about the media when a year ago the same people pissed off now we're making excuses for the police's treatment of the media in Ferguson.I was actually considering going to ferguson last year to let people know their rights but eventually thought better of it.QuoteCan you or someone else please tell me why this is so upsetting? I mean the first amendment has been around for 226 years and literally every single day since someone has said something that is disparaging or contrary to what is stated in the first amendment. There has been nothing said that possesses a significant threat to free speech. In your head make up the most inflammatory thing anyone can say about the first amendment, now tell me what affect or effect, both apply, that these inflammatory words would have on anyone?There's been a ton of misinformation spread over the last few days about free speech rights. Just yesterday you and RATM were telling people that universities could rightly expel students for "hate speech" (good luck defining that) in a public forum. That's wrong and spreading that falsehood quells not just hate speech, but controversial speech in general (at least that's the theory according to first amendment jurisprudence). The police at MU sent a campus wide email telling students to call them if they were offended by students' speech so the police could "report them to the university." That's incredibly mumped up.
Just because you "don't give two shits" about this aspect of what's happening at MU doesn't mean others don't or that it's not important.
And not for nothin, but I agree with the underlying point of what this CS1950 movement is all about! Black people should be treated better on college campuses! I just think that it's important that people don't get swept up in stupid bullshit falsehoods and patently illegal messages from the student government and police department that infringe on others' constitutional rights. And guess what -- the damn ACLU feels the same way. http://www.aclu-mo.org/newsviews/ (http://www.aclu-mo.org/newsviews/)
1. I said a university can expel/suspend someone for hate speech, because it's happened and it's happened more than once, you argued the legality of that. I never disagreed with your assessment of weather it's legal or illegal it is only that it has happened. I'm not sure what that has to do with what I asked.
2. That message from the police department is in no way an infringement on anyone's rights, you are being incredibly hysterical for even suggesting it. People itt gave you a good reason why in the current climate at that school why the cops should be around if someone feels unsafe. If someone is walking alone and a guy comes up to them with a crowbar in their hands and says "whatcha up to n-word" they should just keep beeboping along like everything is gucci? What do you care if the UMPD wants to create extra work for themselves? It's been two days since that happened and we have had no reports of cops telling people what they can and can't say.
3. You took exception to me saying I didn't care about that lady telling that dude to back up to take pictures or that other lady saying she was annoyed by the first amendment, which is fine I guess. I didn't say you shouldn't be mad, I'm just wondering why you seem so heated. The next time an athlete or celeb shields their face from a camera will it be met with the same level of righteous indignation?
4.I'm not at all sure why you posted the aclu link, I haven't read anyone on here excusing anyone taking away the rights of someone else away. Did I miss someone advocating for Melissa Click or anyone saying Mark Schibecker and Tim Tai were wrong? Was there another case where someone's first amendment rights were stripped that I missed?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2015, 11:18:25 PM
Uhh..yeah i guess so?First amendment stuff -- assembling, freedom of the press, etc. I had this weird notion that some people didn't know how much protection they were afforded under the first amendment.I was actually considering going to ferguson last year to let people know their rights but eventually thought better of it.
Which rights did you think they were unaware of?
Well, luckily they made it through somehow.
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/3/4/Justice-says-Ferguson-police-violated-1st-amendment-rights.html (http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/3/4/Justice-says-Ferguson-police-violated-1st-amendment-rights.html)
Are you saying that they needed help with understanding what their rights were? That was one of the issues central to the actual protests, the police trampling on their right to assemble and dissent.
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 12, 2015, 11:29:32 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 13, 2015, 12:01:46 AM
Are you saying that they needed help with understanding what their rights were? That was one of the issues central to the actual protests, the police trampling on their right to assemble and dissent.I'm saying it wouldn't have been the worst thing to have some advocates who knew their way around first amendment law. Bubbles and I kicked the idea around. But let's not get lost in the weeds -- I only brought it up because you implied that some in this thread were only interested in protecting free speech in certain situations. The point is, is that I gave a crap about it then just like I do now.
Quote
1. I said a university can expel/suspend someone for hate speech, because it's happened and it's happened more than once, you argued the legality of that. I never disagreed with your assessment of weather it's legal or illegal it is only that it has happened. I'm not sure what that has to do with what I asked.Right. But just because a university can do that doesn't mean they should do that or are allowed to do that. It has to do with what you asked because when people assume that universities can suspend students based on the content of their speech, implicit in that assumption is that they're allowed to do it. They aren't. If I said "public universities can expel a student if the university finds out he's gay" you'd say bullshit, and rightly so.
Quote
2. That message from the police department is in no way an infringement on anyone's rights, you are being incredibly hysterical for even suggesting it. People itt gave you a good reason why in the current climate at that school why the cops should be around if someone feels unsafe. If someone is walking alone and a guy comes up to them with a crowbar in their hands and says "whatcha up to n-word" they should just keep beeboping along like everything is gucci? What do you care if the UMPD wants to create extra work for themselves? It's been two days since that happened and we have had no reports of cops telling people what they can and can't say.MIR, man, that is wrong. Sure, people in this thread imagined a good reason -- if it was merely precautionary to deescalate a potential situation (like in your hypothetical), by all means, call the cops. Trouble is, the police plainly said in the email "[w]hile cases of hateful and hurtful speech are not crimes, if the individual(s) identified are students, MU’s Office of Student Conduct can take disciplinary action." (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/11/10/missouri-u-police-call-us-about-harmful-or-hurtful-speech/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/11/10/missouri-u-police-call-us-about-harmful-or-hurtful-speech/)) Again, that's bullshit under the First Amendment because university action = state action. Maybe the police were making the same point you were, and meant that "the university CAN take disciplinary action even though that would be against the law." Anyhow police telling students the university can punish them based on the content of their protected speech is wrong.
Quote
You took exception to me saying I didn't care about that lady telling that dude to back up to take pictures or that other lady saying she was annoyed by the first amendment, which is fine I guess. I didn't say you shouldn't be mad, I'm just wondering why you seem so heated. The next time an athlete or celeb shields their face from a camera will it be met with the same level of righteous indignation?I don't know that I took exception to you saying you didn't care about the quad thing. You asked why people were upset by some of the First Amendment stuff and I explained why i was and why i think this stuff is important. I won't address the celebrity/athlete comparison because the comparison is pretty ridiculous.
And, if I'm coming across as a jerk about this, I don't mean to. I'm passionate about First Amendment protections, and I also think the students have the right message. I think its best for all parties that the message is advanced and fostered in a way that is also on the right side of all civil liberties.
Quote
4.I'm not at all sure why you posted the aclu link, I haven't read anyone on here excusing anyone taking away the rights of someone else away. Did I miss someone advocating for Melissa Click or anyone saying Mark Schibecker and Tim Tai were wrong? Was there another case where someone's first amendment rights were stripped that I missed?Well, you've been a bit dismissive about the whole first amendment issue here. You asked why it's upsetting and I let you know why I find it concerning. I posted the ACLU link to let you know that it wasn't just the FSDs and Daxs of the world that were concerned about the speech rights implications in all of this.
Post by: _33 on November 13, 2015, 06:51:21 AM
Post by: Missouriscribe on November 13, 2015, 08:18:48 AM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 13, 2015, 08:21:56 AM
Post by: 8manpick on November 13, 2015, 08:27:51 AM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 13, 2015, 10:49:36 AM
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/opinion-la/la-ol-would-university-of-missouri-students-protest-jewish-20151110-story.html
He does a nice job of documenting a lot of previous things that have happened on the MU campus that led to this point. Some people put cotton balls all over the grounds of the black culture center and received nothing but a littering charge.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 13, 2015, 10:58:28 AM
Black students: It's awful for us here.
Media: Oh ya? Tell us about it!
Black students: No get out of here!
Yeah, that would have been a fruitful exercise. There are people that have fallen all over themselves trying to prove the poop swastika didn't exist, how do you think trying to explain institutional racism will go? The only time I've ever heard or seen the populace acknowledge racism was in the Donald Sterling thing. Even transparent, basic, shallow shows of racism are met with yeah buts and PC PC PC. Who cares if Riley Cooper called that guy a n-word, he plays with black guys and they all say it so why can't he. I can't believe that the PC police and race card players are mad at Jason Aldean for just wearing makeup, black guys can wear white paint and I won't care.
How can what these folks are purporting be validated without the media? Are we to blindly trust anything that comes from anyone? How can any of us be mother mumped for trying to understand and ask questions and then be doubtful after few of the questions can answered, the greatest reason of which is because they block a media presence? And if we question, we must be racists.
You don't honestly believe that, sorry you don't. What you just said is "tell us and it will be okay, we'll support you." The truth is in fact "tell us so that we can tell you how wrong and stupid you are." Also why do you need to know, there are many things in this country that you're perfectly okay with being in the dark about, let this be one of those things, they're not requesting our help.
I guess I don't need to know, I'd just like to understand it, and I'm finding that difficult. That's not to say I haven't learned anything by reading this thread, I have. I just want to learn more. I think that what there is to learn could be applied in places outside of the University of Missouri, and some of those places might be more applicable or relevant to me.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 13, 2015, 11:27:42 AM
Are you saying that they needed help with understanding what their rights were? That was one of the issues central to the actual protests, the police trampling on their right to assemble and dissent.I'm saying it wouldn't have been the worst thing to have some advocates who knew their way around first amendment law. Bubbles and I kicked the idea around. But let's not get lost in the weeds -- I only brought it up because you implied that some in this thread were only interested in protecting free speech in certain situations. The point is, is that I gave a crap about it then just like I do now.
That didn't have anything to do with you or any one person in particular just an observation as to this specific case and how people utilize selective outrage based on sociopolitical convenience.
Quote
1. I said a university can expel/suspend someone for hate speech, because it's happened and it's happened more than once, you argued the legality of that. I never disagreed with your assessment of weather it's legal or illegal it is only that it has happened. I'm not sure what that has to do with what I asked.
Quote
Right. But just because a university can do that doesn't mean they should do that or are allowed to do that. It has to do with what you asked because when people assume that universities can suspend students based on the content of their speech, implicit in that assumption is that they're allowed to do it. They aren't. If I said "public universities can expel a student if the university finds out he's gay" you'd say bullshit, and rightly so.
We can end this one, because we agree more than we disagree to the point of we're having two different conversations. I said I never argued for the affirmative or the dissenting opinion just that despite legal precedent universities can and do suspend and expel students for hate speech. I'm not sure if that is the conversation that you and RATM were having but I was not.
Quote
2. That message from the police department is in no way an infringement on anyone's rights, you are being incredibly hysterical for even suggesting it. People itt gave you a good reason why in the current climate at that school why the cops should be around if someone feels unsafe. If someone is walking alone and a guy comes up to them with a crowbar in their hands and says "whatcha up to n-word" they should just keep beeboping along like everything is gucci? What do you care if the UMPD wants to create extra work for themselves? It's been two days since that happened and we have had no reports of cops telling people what they can and can't say.
Quote
MIR, man, that is wrong. Sure, people in this thread imagined a good reason -- if it was merely precautionary to deescalate a potential situation (like in your hypothetical), by all means, call the cops. Trouble is, the police plainly said in the email "[w]hile cases of hateful and hurtful speech are not crimes, if the individual(s) identified are students, MU’s Office of Student Conduct can take disciplinary action." (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/11/10/missouri-u-police-call-us-about-harmful-or-hurtful-speech/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/11/10/missouri-u-police-call-us-about-harmful-or-hurtful-speech/)) Again, that's bullshit under the First Amendment because university action = state action. Maybe the police were making the same point you were, and meant that "the university CAN take disciplinary action even though that would be against the law." Anyhow police telling students the university can punish them based on the content of their protected speech is wrong.
Fair enough. This is really about how literally one takes the word CAN in this case. Considering this is academia I would think that the students are aware of their rights and equally aware that the PD won't overstep their bounds, probably wrong of me to do so.
Quote
You took exception to me saying I didn't care about that lady telling that dude to back up to take pictures or that other lady saying she was annoyed by the first amendment, which is fine I guess. I didn't say you shouldn't be mad, I'm just wondering why you seem so heated. The next time an athlete or celeb shields their face from a camera will it be met with the same level of righteous indignation?
Quote
I don't know that I took exception to you saying you didn't care about the quad thing. You asked why people were upset by some of the First Amendment stuff and I explained why i was and why i think this stuff is important. I won't address the celebrity/athlete comparison because the comparison is pretty ridiculous.
And, if I'm coming across as a jerk about this, I don't mean to. I'm passionate about First Amendment protections, and I also think the students have the right message. I think its best for all parties that the message is advanced and fostered in a way that is also on the right side of all civil liberties.
You are not coming across as a jerk at all, I've enjoyed having civil discourse about this. I wish I could say the same about other layers of this Mizzou onion. We don't disagree about any of this, I just have a hard time getting upset about this particular aspect of what is going on when a lot of this conversation is abstract and hypothetical. My direct frustration with this thread and with some of the media coverage I've heard is that there seems to be a lot more passion about the freedom of press issues here without the slightest acknowledgment or genuine curiosity as to why we're at this point. Please don't confuse this with rationalizing unconstitutional or potentially unconstitutional behavior, it isn't, I'm just telling you how I feel about the totality of this issue, I'll elaborate a bit more on the next bullet point.
BTW the athlete/celebrity comparison is literally the exact same thing. They don't want their picture taken for some reason or don't want to answer any questions so them or someone else physically prevents their photo from being taken, that's exactly what happened on that quad.
Quote
4.I'm not at all sure why you posted the aclu link, I haven't read anyone on here excusing anyone taking away the rights of someone else away. Did I miss someone advocating for Melissa Click or anyone saying Mark Schibecker and Tim Tai were wrong? Was there another case where someone's first amendment rights were stripped that I missed?
Quote
Well, you've been a bit dismissive about the whole first amendment issue here. You asked why it's upsetting and I let you know why I find it concerning. I posted the ACLU link to let you know that it wasn't just the FSDs and Daxs of the world that were concerned about the speech rights implications in all of this.
I know there are legitimate first amendment issues here, like I said I haven't heard or read anyone outside of a few emotional stray voices at Mizzou saying coming close to advocating for the suppression of someone's rights. If anything I can make the argument that some are actually not practicing what they are suddenly so passionate about when it comes to first amendment rights, for instance people pissed off at the SGA VP for saying what she said about her view of the first amendment as it relates to these protests. She didn't suppress anyone's rights she just expressed an opinion, so why are people trying to stifle her opinions? People have made the first amendment issues here their out, it has become, "see look at what they are doing to the media, THE HORROR." The larger issue has been completely hijacked and that is incredibly frustrating to me. I'm not saying that people should ignore the first amendment issues, do whatever makes you happy, but the intentional changing of the narrative by some people is absolutely gross. Obviously I am not talking about you when I say that, but it absolutely needs to be said even though no one cares.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 13, 2015, 11:35:17 AM
I thought this was interesting.
http://www.latimes.com/opinion/opinion-la/la-ol-would-university-of-missouri-students-protest-jewish-20151110-story.html
He does a nice job of documenting a lot of previous things that have happened on the MU campus that led to this point. Some people put cotton balls all over the grounds of the black culture center and received nothing but a littering charge.
The Office of Equity at MU has been around since 2013. The director is an attorney with law degree from Northwestern. Did she press local law enforcement for greater punishment of the perps? Were the perps students, staff or faculty members of MU? In the first question, if the Office of Equity can't be counted on to work with law enforcement to see that hate crimes charges are sought when applicable. Then they are completely ineffective and should resign their position(s). In addition, is this a University of Missouri issue, or local courts issue?
Post by: mocat on November 13, 2015, 11:47:00 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 13, 2015, 11:49:02 AM
Black students: It's awful for us here.
Media: Oh ya? Tell us about it!
Black students: No get out of here!
Yeah, that would have been a fruitful exercise. There are people that have fallen all over themselves trying to prove the poop swastika didn't exist, how do you think trying to explain institutional racism will go? The only time I've ever heard or seen the populace acknowledge racism was in the Donald Sterling thing. Even transparent, basic, shallow shows of racism are met with yeah buts and PC PC PC. Who cares if Riley Cooper called that guy a n-word, he plays with black guys and they all say it so why can't he. I can't believe that the PC police and race card players are mad at Jason Aldean for just wearing makeup, black guys can wear white paint and I won't care.
How can what these folks are purporting be validated without the media? Are we to blindly trust anything that comes from anyone? How can any of us be mother mumped for trying to understand and ask questions and then be doubtful after few of the questions can answered, the greatest reason of which is because they block a media presence? And if we question, we must be racists.
You don't honestly believe that, sorry you don't. What you just said is "tell us and it will be okay, we'll support you." The truth is in fact "tell us so that we can tell you how wrong and stupid you are." Also why do you need to know, there are many things in this country that you're perfectly okay with being in the dark about, let this be one of those things, they're not requesting our help.
I guess I don't need to know, I'd just like to understand it, and I'm finding that difficult. That's not to say I haven't learned anything by reading this thread, I have. I just want to learn more. I think that what there is to learn could be applied in places outside of the University of Missouri, and some of those places might be more applicable or relevant to me.
I had a long post that I just deleted because it was rambling on and on, I'll just say this; even though there is a little bit of information out there there is enough for a starting point. These issues aren't at all new and the ones out there haven't been well received. I'm fatigued with trying to help people understand the most basic things so I can't imagine the frustrations of those people out there. The fact of the matter is when it comes to race most people don't want to legitimately know the minority opinion, they want comfort within the beliefs they already have. If you find yourself rebutting someone when they tell you how they feel when it comes to racial issues then you need to reevaluate how much you really want to know instead of wanting to know that you are right.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 13, 2015, 11:50:29 AM
i agree MIR, this thing should absolutely not be in the Pit :lol:
:) :dunno:
Post by: mocat on November 13, 2015, 11:52:58 AM
i agree MIR, this thing should absolutely not be in the Pit :lol:
:) :dunno:
srsly tho, i did not think this issue was going to fire everybody up so much. my facebook is disgusting right now
Post by: ednksu on November 13, 2015, 11:56:36 AM
Post by: DQ12 on November 13, 2015, 12:04:59 PM
The only thing I have left is re. the athlete/celebrity. The people on the quad were doing more than "shielding" their faces. People everywhere are allowed to shield their faces or refuse to talk to the press or what have you. People aren't allowed to make threats or "walk into" someone to move them backward in a public area. And anyhow, I don't think the students' behavior on the quad even implicated the First Amendment (they're not the state) -- I just thought they were being ridiculously juvenile and huge assholes and undermining their own cause.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 13, 2015, 12:11:50 PM
Black students: It's awful for us here.
Media: Oh ya? Tell us about it!
Black students: No get out of here!
Yeah, that would have been a fruitful exercise. There are people that have fallen all over themselves trying to prove the poop swastika didn't exist, how do you think trying to explain institutional racism will go? The only time I've ever heard or seen the populace acknowledge racism was in the Donald Sterling thing. Even transparent, basic, shallow shows of racism are met with yeah buts and PC PC PC. Who cares if Riley Cooper called that guy a n-word, he plays with black guys and they all say it so why can't he. I can't believe that the PC police and race card players are mad at Jason Aldean for just wearing makeup, black guys can wear white paint and I won't care.
How can what these folks are purporting be validated without the media? Are we to blindly trust anything that comes from anyone? How can any of us be mother mumped for trying to understand and ask questions and then be doubtful after few of the questions can answered, the greatest reason of which is because they block a media presence? And if we question, we must be racists.
You don't honestly believe that, sorry you don't. What you just said is "tell us and it will be okay, we'll support you." The truth is in fact "tell us so that we can tell you how wrong and stupid you are." Also why do you need to know, there are many things in this country that you're perfectly okay with being in the dark about, let this be one of those things, they're not requesting our help.
I guess I don't need to know, I'd just like to understand it, and I'm finding that difficult. That's not to say I haven't learned anything by reading this thread, I have. I just want to learn more. I think that what there is to learn could be applied in places outside of the University of Missouri, and some of those places might be more applicable or relevant to me.
I had a long post that I just deleted because it was rambling on and on, I'll just say this; even though there is a little bit of information out there there is enough for a starting point. These issues aren't at all new and the ones out there haven't been well received. I'm fatigued with trying to help people understand the most basic things so I can't imagine the frustrations of those people out there. The fact of the matter is when it comes to race most people don't want to legitimately know the minority opinion, they want comfort within the beliefs they already have. If you find yourself rebutting someone when they tell you how they feel when it comes to racial issues then you need to reevaluate how much you really want to know instead of wanting to know that you are right.
I am a minority, FWIW. But like you I was raised in white middle class America. Unlike you though the first half of my childhood I was on military installations, and race wasn't even a thing then. I never even thought about it until I moved to Kansas, and only then upon encountering some scummy folks.
Post by: mocat on November 13, 2015, 12:29:49 PM
The fact of the matter is when it comes to race most people don't want to legitimately know the minority opinion, they want comfort within the beliefs they already have. If you find yourself rebutting someone when they tell you how they feel when it comes to racial issues then you need to reevaluate how much you really want to know instead of wanting to know that you are right.
this is solid gold wisdom
Post by: sys on November 13, 2015, 12:32:33 PM
you have to actively fight your brain if you want to be even semi-objective.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 13, 2015, 12:33:40 PM
it's human nature to be attracted to information that supports preexisting ideas and to reject information that doesn't. that's not something unique to race.
you have to actively fight your brain if you want to be even semi-objective.
I fight my brain a lot, especially with race
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 13, 2015, 12:47:48 PM
Post by: Trim on November 13, 2015, 03:06:16 PM
https://twitter.com/kc_sportsradio
Post by: 'taterblast on November 13, 2015, 03:13:19 PM
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 13, 2015, 03:15:11 PM
pinkel resigning?
i started another thread. I'm the official mizzou thread starter this week.
Post by: sys on November 13, 2015, 03:23:10 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 13, 2015, 03:40:25 PM
Post by: mocat on November 13, 2015, 03:40:35 PM
"an open letter to..." is right up there with mommybloggers, in terms of hey who the F do you think you are man?
omg :curse:
Quote
An open letter to the white #Mizzou student who wrote the open letter to black student activists
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/mercynotsacrifice/2015/11/12/an-open-letter-to-the-white-mizzou-student-who-wrote-the-open-letter-to-black-student-activists/ (http://www.patheos.com/blogs/mercynotsacrifice/2015/11/12/an-open-letter-to-the-white-mizzou-student-who-wrote-the-open-letter-to-black-student-activists/)
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 13, 2015, 03:44:08 PM
"an open letter to..." is right up there with mommybloggers, in terms of hey who the F do you think you are man?
omg :curse:QuoteAn open letter to the white #Mizzou student who wrote the open letter to black student activists
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/mercynotsacrifice/2015/11/12/an-open-letter-to-the-white-mizzou-student-who-wrote-the-open-letter-to-black-student-activists/ (http://www.patheos.com/blogs/mercynotsacrifice/2015/11/12/an-open-letter-to-the-white-mizzou-student-who-wrote-the-open-letter-to-black-student-activists/)
At least this guy put his name on it.
Post by: mocat on November 13, 2015, 03:45:48 PM
Post by: sys on November 13, 2015, 03:47:22 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 13, 2015, 03:48:12 PM
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 13, 2015, 03:49:14 PM
how is "an open letter to..." clickbait any different than "20 celebrities you didn't know were gay. #17 will SHOCK you" et al. clickbait?
probably less likely to get a virus clicking on the open letter
Post by: michigancat on November 13, 2015, 04:03:50 PM
This is the last thing I think I'm gonna say in this thread. I just really want to know where the OoE and CDO offices at MU were in all of this. I just can't stand these administrative laden entities that are created and funded to help mitigate these issues and then they are highly ineffectual. Filled with people who say all the right things, attend all the conferences, go to all the meetings, put on the seminars, but when it's time to act and get things done, they don't do $hit. I just can't help but wonder if that wasn't the case here.
lol you only posted some version of this like 1000 times
Post by: star seed 7 on November 13, 2015, 04:06:44 PM
This is the last thing I think I'm gonna say in this thread. I just really want to know where the OoE and CDO offices at MU were in all of this. I just can't stand these administrative laden entities that are created and funded to help mitigate these issues and then they are highly ineffectual. Filled with people who say all the right things, attend all the conferences, go to all the meetings, put on the seminars, but when it's time to act and get things done, they don't do $hit. I just can't help but wonder if that wasn't the case here.
lol you only posted some version of this like 1000 times
To people that literally cannot provide an answer
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 13, 2015, 04:10:02 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 13, 2015, 04:11:20 PM
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 13, 2015, 04:17:12 PM
dude you said that was your last post!
I cannot let this aggression stand.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 13, 2015, 04:32:30 PM
This is the last thing I think I'm gonna say in this thread. I just really want to know where the OoE and CDO offices at MU were in all of this. I just can't stand these administrative laden entities that are created and funded to help mitigate these issues and then they are highly ineffectual. Filled with people who say all the right things, attend all the conferences, go to all the meetings, put on the seminars, but when it's time to act and get things done, they don't do $hit. I just can't help but wonder if that wasn't the case here.
You guys remember when I talked about asking questions when you're not actually interested in the answer. Yep, this.
LOL at the "last thing said" being a question wrapped up in a statement that was said about the dozen times.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 13, 2015, 05:04:38 PM
This is the last thing I think I'm gonna say in this thread. I just really want to know where the OoE and CDO offices at MU were in all of this. I just can't stand these administrative laden entities that are created and funded to help mitigate these issues and then they are highly ineffectual. Filled with people who say all the right things, attend all the conferences, go to all the meetings, put on the seminars, but when it's time to act and get things done, they don't do $hit. I just can't help but wonder if that wasn't the case here.
You guys remember when I talked about asking questions when you're not actually interested in the answer. Yep, this.
LOL at the "last thing said" being a question wrapped up in a statement that was said about the dozen times.
Nah, don't remember. But thanks
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 13, 2015, 11:29:12 PM
http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/mizzou-protestors-are-upset-that-the-terrorist-attacks-in-paris-are-getting-more-attention-than-them/
Post by: sys on November 13, 2015, 11:50:02 PM
Credibility for this front is gone!
http://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/mizzou-protestors-are-upset-that-the-terrorist-attacks-in-paris-are-getting-more-attention-than-them/
i looked up the twitter accounts of about three of those people. all just random stupid people on twitter, not student activists at the university of missouri. maybe all the ones i didn't look up were students.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 13, 2015, 11:53:22 PM
Post by: sys on November 13, 2015, 11:56:27 PM
bored college kids raising hail. Setting a trend, for nonsense.
i could write a poem comprised of wackycat08 quotes, i think.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 14, 2015, 12:04:10 AM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 14, 2015, 12:08:02 AM
Post by: OK_Cat on November 14, 2015, 12:08:22 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 14, 2015, 12:09:19 AM
Post by: sys on November 14, 2015, 12:09:49 AM
It would be a best seller, Sys. These kids got execs fired and forgot their cause. A kid worth 20 mill who's hung out at Mizzou for 10 years is in the front of this. eff that white privilege bull crap, when they beg for the media to cover them and then push them away at the same time. This whole thing is stupid and you know it. Now they feel Paris is taking the attention away. rough ridin' weirdos!
is it important to the story if the people who feel paris is taking attention away are different people? rough ridin' weirdos!
Post by: OK_Cat on November 14, 2015, 12:09:56 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 14, 2015, 12:14:43 AM
Everything you said is wrong, fanning. Delete your post and we will forget it happenednever. It's legit and right.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 14, 2015, 02:28:59 AM
Post by: Tobias on November 14, 2015, 07:02:50 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 14, 2015, 08:49:36 AM
Soooooo we're getting our news from barstool sports, coolI mean those are legit tweets, but yeah, Tobias, I actually hit an 8 last night.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 14, 2015, 09:25:36 AM
Soooooo we're getting our news from barstool sports, coolI mean those are legit tweets, but yeah, Tobias, I actually hit an 8 last night.
Sure, did it prove anything other than of the billion people on twitter that some of them are really stupid and the "publishers" of barstool sports think all black people are the same and seemingly most barstool commenters are very racist?
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 14, 2015, 09:41:41 AM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 14, 2015, 09:43:46 AM
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 14, 2015, 09:58:16 AM
Post by: mocat on November 14, 2015, 10:25:19 AM
I really don't think what I said last night was that bad. I definitely support the cause, there's just a lot of stupid ppl out there.
WHAT THE eff MAN
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 14, 2015, 10:52:24 AM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 14, 2015, 11:18:08 AM
I really don't think what I said last night was that bad. I definitely support the cause, there's just a lot of stupid ppl out there.
I think the issue is that you took barstool sports at their word that these were protesters at Mizzou instead of rando twitter morons. "Random twitter idiots tweet dumb crap about Paris shootings" probably gets much fewer clicks. You're fine wackster.
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 14, 2015, 11:49:26 AM
Post by: CHONGS on November 14, 2015, 01:31:30 PM
Post by: The Big Train on November 14, 2015, 01:33:37 PM
In vino veritas
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F15%2F11%2F14%2Fe962747873f4c4598cd057994377e3f0.jpg&hash=3f589303be9f5eadb982c6ce61b127d21fe5a19c)
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 15, 2015, 10:08:21 AM
Post by: Kat Kid on November 15, 2015, 04:14:55 PM
If Obama had a son, would he be hunger striking at the University of Missouri? http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/11/15/obama_ive_read_enough_to_know_there_is_clearly_a_problem_at_university_of_missouri.html (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/11/15/obama_ive_read_enough_to_know_there_is_clearly_a_problem_at_university_of_missouri.html)
no way he goes to Mizzou
Post by: wetwillie on November 15, 2015, 06:13:48 PM
If Obama had a son, would he be hunger striking at the University of Missouri? http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/11/15/obama_ive_read_enough_to_know_there_is_clearly_a_problem_at_university_of_missouri.html (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/11/15/obama_ive_read_enough_to_know_there_is_clearly_a_problem_at_university_of_missouri.html)
no way he goes to Mizzou
I mean just LOL at the son of a US president attending a public university
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 15, 2015, 09:22:55 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 09:23:51 PM
Post by: sys on November 15, 2015, 09:48:48 PM
the phog is very racist about it, shockingly
i'm probably a little on the phog/racist side of this one i guess (haven't looked at the phog). their demands are more reasonable than the mu demands. but also, like, those you're gonna starve yourself for that? it's good to have a hobby, i guess.
Post by: sys on November 15, 2015, 09:57:30 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 15, 2015, 10:02:10 PM
http://totalsororitymove.com/i-am-a-white-non-racist-non-violent-mizzou-student-and-i-actively-oppose-concernedstudent1950/
Post by: wetwillie on November 15, 2015, 10:14:03 PM
i guess there's just the one guy starving himself. and he's not really part of the protest group, just starving himself in sympathy with them (although they aren't starving themselves) and in sympathy with butler (although he's not starving himself anymore either). also he's not really starving himself, more consuming an unhealthy diet.
It's mask guy from last year. the report from the ljworld said he had plenty of coffee and juice..lol
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 10:43:57 PM
the phog is very racist about it, shockingly
i'm probably a little on the phog/racist side of this one i guess (haven't looked at the phog). their demands are more reasonable than the mu demands. but also, like, those you're gonna starve yourself for that? it's good to have a hobby, i guess.
No, racisty, like saying they are going to turn the school into a ghetto
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 15, 2015, 11:04:25 PM
http://www.kansas.com/news/state/article45027792.html (http://www.kansas.com/news/state/article45027792.html)
Quote
The resignation demand comes after last week’s unrest at the University of Missouri and after a forum that KU chancellor Bernadette Gray-Little moderated Wednesday in which a student group, Rock Chalk Invisible Hawk, presented diversity demands that include hiring a director for the Office of Multicultural Affairs by Dec. 15, mandatory “inclusion and belonging” training for students and faculty and increased diversity in hiring.
Senate vice president Shegufta Huma, who is also member of the committee, told the newspaper that the vote was the result of months of inaction that culminated in the officers’ reluctance to support the diversity demands. Pringle and George were singled out, with committee members saying they did not “stand in solidarity with their black peers and proclaim that Black Lives Matter” at Wednesday’s forum.
Ok, anybody (besides MIR) still siding with these fascists? Anybody (besides MIR) still not understand why appeasing them is a bad idea?
Edit: I totally overlooked this gem at the bottom of the article - a quote from the hunger striker:
Quote
“I’m kind of at an advantage because of my white privilege, so my suffering is self-inflicted,” said Cowan. “Others don’t have that choice; it’s inflicted upon them.”
:lol:
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 11:07:05 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 15, 2015, 11:09:27 PM
What horrible people :jerk:
They sure are, lib. They sure are. "Mandatory inclusion and belonging training"? These fascist lunatics are running the asylum, which is what happens when the universities start appeasing them.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 11:17:38 PM
Post by: sys on November 15, 2015, 11:19:27 PM
What a burden on the white race, a training course
it's a burden on everyone. all that wasted time adds up.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 15, 2015, 11:25:01 PM
What a burden on the white race, a training course
i'm not sure its worth dying over
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 11:26:53 PM
What a burden on the white race, a training course
it's a burden on everyone. all that wasted time adds up.
I felt English 1 and 2 were a waste of time as well, but the school gets to decide what we waste our time on
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 11:29:12 PM
What a burden on the white race, a training course
i'm not sure its worth dying over
Personally I'd agree, but I'd also agree this guy isn't as passionate as butler was. The hunger strike guy seems more in it for (personal) attention this go around.
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 15, 2015, 11:33:28 PM
What a burden on the white race, a training course
i'm not sure its worth dying over
Personally I'd agree, but I'd also agree this guy isn't as passionate as butler was. The hunger strike guy seems more in it for (personal) attention this go around.
i have no idea anyone's motives
Post by: sys on November 15, 2015, 11:33:46 PM
I felt English 1 and 2 were a waste of time as well, but the school gets to decide what we waste our time on
i went and talked to a dean or someone and he agreed with me that they were a waste of time and let me take other classes. kstate would be a better university if it didn't have a requirement that students take insultingly remedial classes and also the world would be a better place if stupid training sessions that everyone sleeps through weren't so ubiquitous.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 11:38:25 PM
Post by: sys on November 15, 2015, 11:41:42 PM
You should share that information with more people.
it was 20 years ago. i'm sure that dean has retired.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 15, 2015, 11:50:14 PM
Post by: sys on November 15, 2015, 11:59:52 PM
something like that.
Post by: sys on November 16, 2015, 12:13:43 AM
william feyerharm. assistant dean of arts and sciences.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 16, 2015, 08:23:57 AM
I felt English 1 and 2 were a waste of time as well, but the school gets to decide what we waste our time on
i went and talked to a dean or someone and he agreed with me that they were a waste of time and let me take other classes. kstate would be a better university if it didn't have a requirement that students take insultingly remedial classes and also the world would be a better place if stupid training sessions that everyone sleeps through weren't so ubiquitous.
I don't want to get too far off topic, but remedial prerequisites are how universities make money. As tuition continues to rise, I think we're going to see more and more kids attend JuCo for a year to knock out their basic pre-reqs at a much cheaper price (or even better, taking AP classes in high school). Politicians could encourage this, and help burst the tuition bubble, if they would stop expanding/subsidizing student loans. They're just encouraging more student loan debt, which strangles productivity.
Ok, let's get back to talking about universities appeasing these whackjob jackbooted fascists .
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 16, 2015, 01:12:36 PM
http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/the-buzz/article45066447.html#storylink=cpy (http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/the-buzz/article45066447.html#storylink=cpy)
Quote
When asked “do you agree or disagree with the University of Missouri student protestors’ actions in the past week,” 20 percent of those surveyed said they agreed, while 62 percent said they disagreed (18 percent were unsure.)
But 51 percent of African Americans surveyed said they agreed with the action, while just 38 percent disagreed [just?]. Among whites, just 18 percent agreed and 63 percent disagreed.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 16, 2015, 01:28:08 PM
Sounds like a perfectly plausible way to carry on a healthy discourse and resolution process.
Every time someone feels marginalized is cause for protest and demands for resignations?
Post by: meow meow on November 16, 2015, 01:36:55 PM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 16, 2015, 01:43:02 PM
Quote
“eff you, you filthy white fucks!” “eff you and your comfort!” “eff you, you racist shits!”
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmouth-protesters-disrupt-students-in-library-fck-you-you-filthy-white-fcks/ (http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmouth-protesters-disrupt-students-in-library-fck-you-you-filthy-white-fcks/)
Would MIR or anybody else like to make excuses for this one?
Post by: ednksu on November 16, 2015, 01:49:43 PM
The activists strike Dartmouth. Assaulted white students at the library. I wonder if they burned any books while they were there?Quote“eff you, you filthy white fucks!” “eff you and your comfort!” “eff you, you racist shits!”
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmouth-protesters-disrupt-students-in-library-fck-you-you-filthy-white-fcks/ (http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmouth-protesters-disrupt-students-in-library-fck-you-you-filthy-white-fcks/)
Would MIR or anybody else like to make excuses for this one?
If there is a video or witness that show a person was touched illegally by someone saying eff your white tears it's an obvious hate crime. :dunno:
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 16, 2015, 02:37:30 PM
Post by: michigancat on November 16, 2015, 03:05:58 PM
Post by: lopakman on November 16, 2015, 03:13:36 PM
The activists strike Dartmouth. Assaulted white students at the library. I wonder if they burned any books while they were there?Quote“eff you, you filthy white fucks!” “eff you and your comfort!” “eff you, you racist shits!”
http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmouth-protesters-disrupt-students-in-library-fck-you-you-filthy-white-fcks/ (http://www.mediaite.com/online/dartmouth-protesters-disrupt-students-in-library-fck-you-you-filthy-white-fcks/)
Would MIR or anybody else like to make excuses for this one?
impossible, black people could NEVER be racists.
also this
Quote
we raised hell, we caused discomfort, and we made our voices heard all throughout this campus in the name of standing up for our brothers and sisters across the country who are staring terrorism and assault directly in the face.
:lol: so they thought countering 'assault' with assault was the way to go. Brilliant. Can't wait to hear MIR's comment on how the whites brought this on themselves
Post by: 420seriouscat69 on November 16, 2015, 03:17:13 PM
Quote
gutter monkeys on campus. How did they ever find the library?
:sdeek:
Post by: star seed 7 on November 16, 2015, 03:44:58 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 16, 2015, 03:57:28 PM
Some of you are very stupid when it comes to mir, goodness
I've stopped worrying about those dumbfucks. People like KSUW and lopak are too busy feeling victimized to be able to reason with. In fairness it has nothing to do with me personally, I think they hate any black people that express an opinion outside of, "we should only focus on blacks killing other blacks and why black people should stop committing crimes."
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 16, 2015, 03:59:49 PM
Some of you are very stupid when it comes to mir, goodness
I've stopped worrying about those dumbfucks. People like KSUW and lopak are too busy feeling victimized to be able to reason with. In fairness it has nothing to do with me personally, I think they hate any black people that express an opinion outside of, "we should only focus on blacks killing other blacks and why black people should stop committing crimes."
Excellent deflection.
Post by: lopakman on November 16, 2015, 04:03:37 PM
Some of you are very stupid when it comes to mir, goodness
I've stopped worrying about those dumbfucks. People like KSUW and lopak are too busy feeling victimized to be able to reason with. In fairness it has nothing to do with me personally, I think they hate any black people that express an opinion outside of, "we should only focus on blacks killing other blacks and why black people should stop committing crimes."
nah, just tired of hearing you bitch and moan all the time, and if anyone's crying about being victimized it's you....all the time....in every thread.....blaming white people for everything that is wrong with the world.....never accepting any accountability.....accusing anyone who doesn't agree with you of being racist......not willing to listen to argument that disputes your beliefs......etc.
Post by: lopakman on November 16, 2015, 04:04:26 PM
Post by: DQ12 on November 16, 2015, 04:07:35 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 16, 2015, 04:11:53 PM
Some of you are very stupid when it comes to mir, goodness
I've stopped worrying about those dumbfucks. People like KSUW and lopak are too busy feeling victimized to be able to reason with. In fairness it has nothing to do with me personally, I think they hate any black people that express an opinion outside of, "we should only focus on blacks killing other blacks and why black people should stop committing crimes."
nah, just tired of hearing you bitch and moan all the time, and if anyone's crying about being victimized it's you....all the time....in every thread.....blaming white people for everything that is wrong with the world.....never accepting any accountability.....accusing anyone who doesn't agree with you of being racist......not willing to listen to argument that disputes your beliefs......etc.
Let's make a deal. If you find anything where I've blamed white people for something I'll leave the board forever, if you can't you leave. If there is a dispute we'll put it up for a vote. Deal?
Post by: MakeItRain on November 16, 2015, 04:20:20 PM
oh and you still didn't answer the KSUW's questions, but I never expected you to.
Yeah, you shouldn't have and I won't. You both framed this as, why I should answer to this because I blame white people for everything, when in fact I haven't blamed "white people" for anything at all. For the record, my count of calling people racist on this board is one for sure, dax, and probally should be two if we count the FSD sock. Frankly I don't have a choice but to think that the both of you are racist if you are going to minimize my words to "bitching" and "blaming white people." It's funny because I have absolutely said more than once that black people are just as responsible for devaluing black lives as white people but I was even criticized for that. Lopak, it's obvious that you read my posts with disdain instead of an open mind so lets agree not to interact on this board. This the first time I've engaged you and I really don't see a reason to do it again.
Let's bump up that MIR says "you're a racist" tote board up to (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/92/Junction_4.svg)
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 16, 2015, 04:55:58 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 16, 2015, 05:07:36 PM
Do a search for MIR posts with the word racist in it. I don't have time to count, but let's just say "4" isn't gonna cover it for how many people, states, countries, schools etc. that he has accused of being racist.
I will gladly take the same bet with you. Prove the accusation or shut the eff up. I'd rather you take the bet and just go away but alas you and lopak will do the search before taking the bet and neither of you race baiters will come back and apologize.
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 16, 2015, 05:19:01 PM
Do a search for MIR posts with the word racist in it. I don't have time to count, but let's just say "4" isn't gonna cover it for how many people, states, countries, schools etc. that he has accused of being racist.
I will gladly take the same bet with you. Prove the accusation or shut the eff up. I'd rather you take the bet and just go away but alas you and lopak will do the search before taking the bet and neither of you race baiters will come back and apologize.
Go fuk yourself, you disgust me.
Post by: star seed 7 on November 16, 2015, 05:29:14 PM
Do a search for MIR posts with the word racist in it. I don't have time to count, but let's just say "4" isn't gonna cover it for how many people, states, countries, schools etc. that he has accused of being racist.
I will gladly take the same bet with you. Prove the accusation or shut the eff up. I'd rather you take the bet and just go away but alas you and lopak will do the search before taking the bet and neither of you race baiters will come back and apologize.
Go fuk yourself, you disgust me.
:eek:
Post by: MakeItRain on November 16, 2015, 05:50:30 PM
Do a search for MIR posts with the word racist in it. I don't have time to count, but let's just say "4" isn't gonna cover it for how many people, states, countries, schools etc. that he has accused of being racist.
I will gladly take the same bet with you. Prove the accusation or shut the eff up. I'd rather you take the bet and just go away but alas you and lopak will do the search before taking the bet and neither of you race baiters will come back and apologize.
Go fuk yourself, you disgust me.
So you're not taking the bet? I didn't think so.
Post by: RickRampus on November 16, 2015, 07:48:25 PM
wait, could we have a hunger strike until we bring Venzy back to coach our Cats? asking for myself
I've had this exact thought, but about getting a replacement for Booce.
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 16, 2015, 07:56:00 PM
It's also just a little weird to me that college kids (well, mainly college kids) who are by and large being afforded an excellent opportunity at a very good education (hey I can admit MU is pretty decent school) feel the need to continually disrupt the campus because of what amount mostly to feelings. Yeah, there's some idiots running around over there, but most college campuses of 30,000 students have their share of idiots. But to listen to them talk they are in the midst of horrific repression at every corner of the university and that's simply not true. That doesn't invalidate what they're asking for but it certainly calls into question their hyperbolic nature and ridiculous disruption of the education process on campus. I think it's very apparent that their being listened to, so why should thousands of other students have to have their daily processes disrupted? But that seems to be the way it is in perpetually outraged nation.
I am also laughing at these demands that must be adhered to immediately with literally no discussion or people have to resign. That's just idiotic . . . how can anyone take that kind of thought process seriously?
Agree with us or resign. How positively totalitarian.
Post by: lopakman on November 17, 2015, 09:22:55 AM
Do a search for MIR posts with the word racist in it. I don't have time to count, but let's just say "4" isn't gonna cover it for how many people, states, countries, schools etc. that he has accused of being racist.
I will gladly take the same bet with you. Prove the accusation or shut the eff up. I'd rather you take the bet and just go away but alas you and lopak will do the search before taking the bet and neither of you race baiters will come back and apologize.
I don't need to go back and look at your posts to prove what I already know and lol at you for thinking I'd subject myself to re-reading any of your posts regarding this topic. They're painful enough the first time.
Post by: Fedor on November 17, 2015, 10:42:04 AM
p.s. the KU hunger striker lasted from Friday to Monday. It turns out he should have asked the oppressed peoples permission to speak out for them.
http://www.kansas.com/news/politics-government/prairie-politics/article45135573.html
Meanwhile, at WSU the students are demanding the president of the university resign as well, the list of grievances seems to be the weakest of all, including "more scholarships" and accounting questions regarding student fees.
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/education/article45075117.html
Meanwhile at the flagship university of the state...
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/2015/11/17/from-the-presidents-desk-42/
Post by: star seed 7 on November 17, 2015, 10:57:49 AM
Post by: lopakman on November 17, 2015, 12:03:46 PM
As we know KU could not stand to be left out of the news and had a racism forum. It seems the student body president and others in student government were not enthusiastic enough about joining the protest or something, so now there are calls for them to resign. Impeachment proceedings are scheduled to begin as well.
p.s. the KU hunger striker lasted from Friday to Monday. It turns out he should have asked the oppressed peoples permission to speak out for them.
http://www.kansas.com/news/politics-government/prairie-politics/article45135573.html
Meanwhile, at WSU the students are demanding the president of the university resign as well, the list of grievances seems to be the weakest of all, including "more scholarships" and accounting questions regarding student fees.
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/education/article45075117.html
Meanwhile at the flagship university of the state...
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/2015/11/17/from-the-presidents-desk-42/
It was inevitable this was going to happen. Stupid breeds stupid. I'm sure mir will avoid commenting on this like he avoided commenting on the dartmouth situation.
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2015, 03:42:03 PM
As we know KU could not stand to be left out of the news and had a racism forum. It seems the student body president and others in student government were not enthusiastic enough about joining the protest or something, so now there are calls for them to resign. Impeachment proceedings are scheduled to begin as well.
p.s. the KU hunger striker lasted from Friday to Monday. It turns out he should have asked the oppressed peoples permission to speak out for them.
http://www.kansas.com/news/politics-government/prairie-politics/article45135573.html
Meanwhile, at WSU the students are demanding the president of the university resign as well, the list of grievances seems to be the weakest of all, including "more scholarships" and accounting questions regarding student fees.
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/education/article45075117.html
Meanwhile at the flagship university of the state...
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/2015/11/17/from-the-presidents-desk-42/
It was inevitable this was going to happen. Stupid breeds stupid. I'm sure mir will avoid commenting on this like he avoided commenting on the dartmouth situation.
Says he doesn't want to read my posts, can't help but continuously asking for my opinions.
No thanks.
Go away shitbag and keep hating the blacks, I'm fine trying to convince people like you of anything. Keep being enraged about stuff you don't understand, you'll die angry and no one will care.
Post by: gatoveintisiete on November 17, 2015, 03:52:22 PM
Shouldn't you be busy Fuking yourself?As we know KU could not stand to be left out of the news and had a racism forum. It seems the student body president and others in student government were not enthusiastic enough about joining the protest or something, so now there are calls for them to resign. Impeachment proceedings are scheduled to begin as well.
p.s. the KU hunger striker lasted from Friday to Monday. It turns out he should have asked the oppressed peoples permission to speak out for them.
http://www.kansas.com/news/politics-government/prairie-politics/article45135573.html
Meanwhile, at WSU the students are demanding the president of the university resign as well, the list of grievances seems to be the weakest of all, including "more scholarships" and accounting questions regarding student fees.
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/education/article45075117.html
Meanwhile at the flagship university of the state...
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/2015/11/17/from-the-presidents-desk-42/
It was inevitable this was going to happen. Stupid breeds stupid. I'm sure mir will avoid commenting on this like he avoided commenting on the dartmouth situation.
Says he doesn't want to read my posts, can't help but continuously asking for my opinions.
No thanks.
Go away shitbag and keep hating the blacks, I'm fine trying to convince people like you of anything. Keep being enraged about stuff you don't understand, you'll die angry and no one will care.
Ps. I think you just called Lopakman a racist, which makes you a huge douche.
Post by: Fedor on November 17, 2015, 03:56:55 PM
Well I tried. I am leaving this thread to "you people".Shouldn't you be busy Fuking yourself?As we know KU could not stand to be left out of the news and had a racism forum. It seems the student body president and others in student government were not enthusiastic enough about joining the protest or something, so now there are calls for them to resign. Impeachment proceedings are scheduled to begin as well.
p.s. the KU hunger striker lasted from Friday to Monday. It turns out he should have asked the oppressed peoples permission to speak out for them.
http://www.kansas.com/news/politics-government/prairie-politics/article45135573.html
Meanwhile, at WSU the students are demanding the president of the university resign as well, the list of grievances seems to be the weakest of all, including "more scholarships" and accounting questions regarding student fees.
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/education/article45075117.html
Meanwhile at the flagship university of the state...
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/2015/11/17/from-the-presidents-desk-42/
It was inevitable this was going to happen. Stupid breeds stupid. I'm sure mir will avoid commenting on this like he avoided commenting on the dartmouth situation.
Says he doesn't want to read my posts, can't help but continuously asking for my opinions.
No thanks.
Go away shitbag and keep hating the blacks, I'm fine trying to convince people like you of anything. Keep being enraged about stuff you don't understand, you'll die angry and no one will care.
Ps. I think you just called Lopakman a racist, which makes you a huge douche.
:buh-bye:
Post by: lopakman on November 17, 2015, 04:13:46 PM
As we know KU could not stand to be left out of the news and had a racism forum. It seems the student body president and others in student government were not enthusiastic enough about joining the protest or something, so now there are calls for them to resign. Impeachment proceedings are scheduled to begin as well.
p.s. the KU hunger striker lasted from Friday to Monday. It turns out he should have asked the oppressed peoples permission to speak out for them.
http://www.kansas.com/news/politics-government/prairie-politics/article45135573.html
Meanwhile, at WSU the students are demanding the president of the university resign as well, the list of grievances seems to be the weakest of all, including "more scholarships" and accounting questions regarding student fees.
http://www.kansas.com/news/local/education/article45075117.html
Meanwhile at the flagship university of the state...
http://www.kstatecollegian.com/2015/11/17/from-the-presidents-desk-42/
It was inevitable this was going to happen. Stupid breeds stupid. I'm sure mir will avoid commenting on this like he avoided commenting on the dartmouth situation.
Says he doesn't want to read my posts, can't help but continuously asking for my opinions.
No thanks.
Go away shitbag and keep hating the blacks, I'm fine trying to convince people like you of anything. Keep being enraged about stuff you don't understand, you'll die angry and no one will care.
:lol: ok you keep blaming everyone else for all your problems, accusing anyone who disagrees you of being a racist and please continue to not take any accountability, and certainly don't comment on the violent protests.
I'm not enraged why would I be? (privaleged white male here according to you :D) but I can see you are, for all the wrong reasons of course.
Post by: DQ12 on November 17, 2015, 04:19:53 PM
Post by: lopakman on November 17, 2015, 04:32:37 PM
maybe MIR isn't commenting on it because you guys are being dicks?
hmm, I don't recall hurling any vulgar insults or resorting to name calling. Looking back I've been called a dumbfuck and a shitbag by mir, and of course a racist. I was stating my thoughts on a couple points of interest which differs from his. I think it's because he can't argue these points, refuses to accept any other viewpoint of his own, is incapable of even considering the fact he may be wrong on some points and therefore has chosen to go this route. Sad thing is I agree with the majority of his posts in his thread. Guess to be considered one of the cool kids I gotta agree on the other 10%.
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 17, 2015, 04:33:02 PM
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 17, 2015, 04:33:28 PM
Post by: puniraptor on November 17, 2015, 04:37:38 PM
They're both being dicks, IMO.
frat guys, amirite?
(;))
Post by: star seed 7 on November 17, 2015, 04:50:24 PM
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2015, 06:12:46 PM
They're both being dicks, IMO.
frat guys, amirite?
(;))
:lol:
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2015, 06:49:03 PM
They're both being dicks, IMO.
You and I disagreed and we talked about it rationally, why? You weren't a rough ridin' dickhead so I remained pleasant with you. If you accused me for "blaming white people for everything" I would have been an bad person to you too.
Post by: sys on November 17, 2015, 06:56:54 PM
Post by: star seed 7 on November 17, 2015, 06:57:23 PM
Post by: lopakman on November 17, 2015, 07:31:55 PM
They're both being dicks, IMO.
You and I disagreed and we talked about it rationally, why? You weren't a rough ridin' dickhead so I remained pleasant with you. If you accused me for "blaming white people for everything" I would have been an bad person to you too.
Well stop blaming white people for everything and then I won't have to 'accuse' you of what you already know you do. dumbass
Post by: MakeItRain on November 17, 2015, 07:42:38 PM
They're both being dicks, IMO.
You and I disagreed and we talked about it rationally, why? You weren't a rough ridin' dickhead so I remained pleasant with you. If you accused me for "blaming white people for everything" I would have been an bad person to you too.
Well stop blaming white people for everything and then I won't have to 'accuse' you of what you already know you do. dumbass
I've asked you to tell me what I've blamed on white people and your stupid ass hasn't yet. Your excuse is that you can't tell me because you don't read my posts yet all of your posts here are about what I've supposedly said, asking me for my opinion, or reading my posts when I'm not even addressing you. Like I said, just shut the eff up, or keep posting and embarrassing yourself either way I don't give a crap, you're the one burning with anger.
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 18, 2015, 08:34:59 AM
They're both being dicks, IMO.
You and I disagreed and we talked about it rationally, why? You weren't a rough ridin' dickhead so I remained pleasant with you. If you accused me for "blaming white people for everything" I would have been an bad person to you too.
I didn't think you were being a dick to me, FWIW. You guys were being dicks to each other.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 19, 2015, 09:29:10 AM
Post by: michigancat on November 19, 2015, 09:33:08 AM
The BLM Brownshirts want another scalp. http://dailycaller.com/2015/11/18/georgia-college-student-criticizes-mizzou-protesters-becomes-victim-of-witch-hunt/ (http://dailycaller.com/2015/11/18/georgia-college-student-criticizes-mizzou-protesters-becomes-victim-of-witch-hunt/)haha, here's the "witch hunt" victim:
Quote
Faz wrote above the link, “I swear if I see this B.S. at Southern I will make you regret even knowing what a movement or a hashtag is, and you’ll walk away with your tail tucked.”
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 19, 2015, 09:36:50 AM
The BLM Brownshirts want another scalp. http://dailycaller.com/2015/11/18/georgia-college-student-criticizes-mizzou-protesters-becomes-victim-of-witch-hunt/ (http://dailycaller.com/2015/11/18/georgia-college-student-criticizes-mizzou-protesters-becomes-victim-of-witch-hunt/)haha, here's the "witch hunt" victim:QuoteFaz wrote above the link, “I swear if I see this B.S. at Southern I will make you regret even knowing what a movement or a hashtag is, and you’ll walk away with your tail tucked.”
That's actually pretty cute. Here's the rest of her quote:
Quote
“The whole black lives matter movement is misguided and out of hand. Maybe no one likes or takes y’all seriously because no one can see past your egotistical bullshit. Some people might just look past it, but fair warning I am not one. All lives matter, that has always been the case, and you part of the problem if you think other wise [sic].”
:love:
Post by: michigancat on November 19, 2015, 09:38:55 AM
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 19, 2015, 09:41:05 AM
Why can't we be more like this instead of feeling the need to punish people for their opinions? The effort to silence those with whom you disagree is very weak-minded.
Post by: michigancat on November 19, 2015, 09:43:19 AM
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.reactiongifs.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F06%2Fopinionated.gif&hash=a2472eb7f109cc02be10378f274eb57cad1ffe60)Why don't you ask Emily Faz?
Why can't we be more like this instead of feeling the need to punish people for their opinions? The effort to silence those with whom you disagree is very weak-minded.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 19, 2015, 09:46:39 AM
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.reactiongifs.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F06%2Fopinionated.gif&hash=a2472eb7f109cc02be10378f274eb57cad1ffe60)Why don't you ask Emily Faz?
Why can't we be more like this instead of feeling the need to punish people for their opinions? The effort to silence those with whom you disagree is very weak-minded.
You really think she was threatening anyone?
Post by: michigancat on November 19, 2015, 09:55:32 AM
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.reactiongifs.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F06%2Fopinionated.gif&hash=a2472eb7f109cc02be10378f274eb57cad1ffe60)Why don't you ask Emily Faz?
Why can't we be more like this instead of feeling the need to punish people for their opinions? The effort to silence those with whom you disagree is very weak-minded.
You really think she was threatening anyone?
I don't think anyone here was seriously threatened, although she definitely announced she didn't want to see people express opinions she didn't like, which I definitely found amusing given the tone of your post and the article.
Post by: sys on November 19, 2015, 10:55:20 AM
I don't think anyone here was seriously threatened, although she definitely announced she didn't want to see people express opinions she didn't like, which I definitely found amusing given the tone of your post and the article.
michigancat is secretly lorenzo cain.
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on November 19, 2015, 11:34:34 AM
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.reactiongifs.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2013%2F06%2Fopinionated.gif&hash=a2472eb7f109cc02be10378f274eb57cad1ffe60)Why don't you ask Emily Faz?
Why can't we be more like this instead of feeling the need to punish people for their opinions? The effort to silence those with whom you disagree is very weak-minded.
You really think she was threatening anyone?
I don't think anyone here was seriously threatened, although she definitely announced she didn't want to see people express opinions she didn't like, which I definitely found amusing given the tone of your post and the article.
Fair enough.
Post by: michigancat on November 19, 2015, 11:36:16 AM
I don't think anyone here was seriously threatened, although she definitely announced she didn't want to see people express opinions she didn't like, which I definitely found amusing given the tone of your post and the article.
michigancat is secretly lorenzo cain.
definitely
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 19, 2015, 11:41:11 AM
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on November 19, 2015, 11:46:35 AM
I don't think anyone here was seriously threatened, although she definitely announced she didn't want to see people express opinions she didn't like, which I definitely found amusing given the tone of your post and the article.
michigancat is secretly lorenzo cain.
definitely
most definitely
Post by: mocat on November 19, 2015, 12:02:26 PM
Post by: Trim on November 27, 2015, 04:30:35 PM
http://deadspin.com/bomani-jones-cuts-straight-to-the-heart-of-the-laquan-m-1744646121
Post by: K-S-U-Wildcats! on December 13, 2015, 05:23:43 PM
I think this may explain some of the stupidity we're seeing in college campuses.
Post by: stunted on December 21, 2015, 11:17:14 AM
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2012/10/the-painful-truth-about-affirmative-action/263122/ (http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2012/10/the-painful-truth-about-affirmative-action/263122/)
I think this may explain some of the stupidity we're seeing in college campuses.
https://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/3xn4tq/navy_seals_wont_change_standards_for_women/?ref=search_posts
Good thread that relates to the affirmative action scam
Post by: 'taterblast on June 03, 2016, 10:57:36 AM