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General Discussion => Essentially Flyertalk => Topic started by: joda on April 28, 2014, 06:08:58 PM
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For those of us that want to compare and contrast without the illiterate claiming spoiler even if all you say is books and who want to only talk about the books in the books thread.
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So how about that huge bombshell at the end. Didn't expect such a reveal ahead of the books so soon.
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And what about the bullshit of all the sudden Jon knowing Bran is alive? Oh, hey deeply emotion moment for someone but let's just casually mention that it must have happened off screen
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Good effort, but book people just love too much rough ridin' it for TV people.
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Good effort, but book people just love too much rough ridin' it for TV people.
That's why this is for fans of both. There's been some good discussion of the adaptations (both good and bad) but then someone comes and whines about spoilers though there where none.
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Bloodraven has been cast. For those of you who have read the books and don't know who that is... this is where we discuss that.
(Hint: It's not definitely Bloodraven but it's a pretty well accepted fact similar to Crastor boys becoming Others/WWs)
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Coldhands hasn't been cast, leaf has.
Unless of course Coldhands is revealed as benjen
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My call is that they are going to merge Bloodraven and Coldhands into one character and have him swoop in and rescue Bran et al.
I honestly have no idea, the show has diverged so far from the books, its tough how to see them right the ship without some kind of dramatic swooping in scene. Otherwise, they do meet, Vargo Hoat v.2 tries to kill Bran, Jon intervenes, and the two agree that it won't be safe South of the wall with the Bolton's trying to kill him (which will be stupid)
I think we're going to see more of these departures as GRRM continues to not write books and the show continues on. They still have 60% of the season left and like 15% of the 3rd book left for it. So they either need to: slow the show down considerably, start picking off story lines to advance beyond SoS, creating new content between the lines to fluff up the story.
I like some of the stuff they are doing with the later approach... flushing out more of Margaery's character has been interesting but then they go and gloss over scenes like Jon finding out his brother yet lives and the interaction between Dantos and Sansa. It is a good shout out to the book readers to start sprinkling in new revels that couldn't have been in the book due to the POV format, but it does seem like if they are hurting for content they could quit cutting things from the book out of the show :shakesfist:
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Coldhands hasn't been cast, leaf has.
Unless of course Coldhands is revealed as benjen
Hi seven, welcome to this thread where we can discuss this freely. :cheers:
Leaf is who is widely believed to be Bloodraven. I don't believe CH is Benjen, I think it's possible they're cutting the character out completely. (I have a theory on who he is but I'm not sure it is important to the show and if so those no real reason they have to introduce him)
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I can still see this in Tapatalk preview :angry:
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Coldhands hasn't been cast, leaf has.
Unless of course Coldhands is revealed as benjen
Not impossible, but the book does say that Coldhands died "long ago" and Benjen, if dead, could only be like 2 years gone.
Also, i should have mentioned it above, but i don't like that the Thenn's are cannibals. It doesn't make them seem badass, and i think it detracts from how they are developed later in the story.
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Coldhands hasn't been cast, leaf has.
Unless of course Coldhands is revealed as benjen
Not impossible, but the book does say that Coldhands died "long ago" and Benjen, if dead, could only be like 2 years gone.
Also, i should have mentioned it above, but i don't like that the Thenn's are cannibals. It doesn't make them seem badass, and i think it detracts from how they are developed later in the story.
Yea, also don't like that Tormund is south of the wall already. Makes me think they're going to kill him off
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It leaked out that HBO had been referring to the head Other at the end of this episode as "The Night's King".
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Who the crap is blood raven?
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It leaked out that HBO had been referring to the head Other at the end of this episode as "The Night's King".
Really? Hadn't seen that. The Night's King that Bran talks about has been my theory of who Coldhands is. Guess he still could be, especially if Coldhands never shows up in the show.
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Who the crap is blood raven?
Targaryean bastard who was an albino and believed sorcerer. Escorted Aemon to the wall and eventually became Lord Commander. Commonly believed to be the old tree guy (Leaf, 3eyed crow,etc) that Bran ends up with
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Oh yes, I forgot his name. Also I have not read dunk and egg or whatever
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Leaf is the last of the Children of the Forest. She has a friend, "The Last Greensear" (sp?). Her friend is Brynden Rivers, who is also known as Bloodraven. It is speculated that he is a warg.
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It leaked out that HBO had been referring to the head Other at the end of this episode as "The Night's King".
Really? Hadn't seen that. The Night's King that Bran talks about has been my theory of who Coldhands is. Guess he still could be, especially if Coldhands never shows up in the show.
It was in their episode synopsis on their website last night. It was quickly changed after a fan noticed it and took it to the ASoIaF BBS's. It is highly unlikely that The Night's King is Coldhands, but they both were brothers of the watch.
The Night's King was the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch. He ruled at the Nightfort, is rumored to have married an Other and was defeated by Joramun (the original King Beyond the Wall) and a Stark of Winterfell.
Old Nan also says that The Night's King was a Stark. She claims that he and the Stark of Winterfell who defeated him were brothers.
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It leaked out that HBO had been referring to the head Other at the end of this episode as "The Night's King".
Really? Hadn't seen that. The Night's King that Bran talks about has been my theory of who Coldhands is. Guess he still could be, especially if Coldhands never shows up in the show.
It was in their episode synopsis on their website last night. It was quickly changed after a fan noticed it and took it to the ASoIaF BBS's. It is highly unlikely that The Night's King is Coldhands, but they both were brothers of the watch.
The Night's King was the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch. He ruled at the Nightfort, is rumored to have married an Other and was defeated by Joramun (the original King Beyond the Wall) and a Stark of Winterfell.
Old Nan also says that The Night's King was a Stark. She claims that he and the Stark of Winterfell who defeated him were brothers.
That's all actually why I think NK and CH are the same person. His "I'm your monster Brandon Stark" line just stuck with me. Going with the "they killed him long ago" statement had me thinking of long dead Starks with a dark past.
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Anyone else feel like the show really glosses over the Faith of the Seven? They play a huge role as we move into the next phase of the story, and there's been limited delving into their backstory.
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Anyone else feel like the show really glosses over the Faith of the Seven? They play a huge role as we move into the next phase of the story, and there's been limited delving into their backstory.
It really hasn't delved deeply into the backstory of most of the deep ethnic, political, and religious division of Westeros. It would make for pretty boring tv though so I think it's just one of those things.
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It leaked out that HBO had been referring to the head Other at the end of this episode as "The Night's King".
Really? Hadn't seen that. The Night's King that Bran talks about has been my theory of who Coldhands is. Guess he still could be, especially if Coldhands never shows up in the show.
It was in their episode synopsis on their website last night. It was quickly changed after a fan noticed it and took it to the ASoIaF BBS's. It is highly unlikely that The Night's King is Coldhands, but they both were brothers of the watch.
The Night's King was the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch. He ruled at the Nightfort, is rumored to have married an Other and was defeated by Joramun (the original King Beyond the Wall) and a Stark of Winterfell.
Old Nan also says that The Night's King was a Stark. She claims that he and the Stark of Winterfell who defeated him were brothers.
That's all actually why I think NK and CH are the same person. His "I'm your monster Brandon Stark" line just stuck with me. Going with the "they killed him long ago" statement had me thinking of long dead Starks with a dark past.
The dialogue between Meera, Bran, Jojen and Coldhands is too muddled to make much sense of. That being said, my takeaway is this: Coldhands is an intelligent, undead creature, who to this point in the series has done nothing but help Bloodraven accomplish his presumed goals (i.e. get Gilly, her son and Sam south of the wall and bring Bran safely to him). The message is quite literal. Coldhands is a monster, Bran's monster.
Edit: I forgot to add this, it seems quite clear that Coldhands and Bloodraven are working against the Others. Old Nan's account of The Night's King alludes to him being married to an Other. I don't think the characters are the same.
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That's all actually why I think NK and CH are the same person. His "I'm Your monster, Brandon Stark" line just stuck with me. Going with the "they killed him long ago" statement had me thinking of long dead Starks with a dark past.
The only other interpretation I can make is that Coldhands is stating that the Three-eyed Crow is Bran's monster.
Whatever The Night's King was up to at The Nightfort didn't jive with the Starks in Winterfell or the Wildlings. Old Nan, who has a pretty good batting average thus far, states that he was defeated and wiped from the pages of history.
She doesn't say that he died, so you do have that. However, we can infer, that at the very least, he was banished to live north of the wall. A very long time has passed since those events, and allegiances do shift in GRRM's universe, but I think it's quite a stretch to assume that if The Night's King is still alive after all of these years, that he has denounced the woman he fell in love with and sided with the descendants of the group that stripped him of his seat and title and then exiled him.
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I really need to refresh my memory on all the characters/creatures north of the wall.
Coldhands is the guy who was leading Bran and his party, right?
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"We Free Folk have our stories, too. About how one of your King Crows found something... cold in the woods, with bright blue eyes. How he brought her home through your Wall and declared himself "Night's King.""
?Ygritte
The Night's King is an character in Game of Thrones, appearing in the "The Histories & Lore: The History of the Night's Watch" featurette included in the Season 2 Blu-ray. He is a legendary figure known both in the Seven Kingdoms and among the Free Folk dwelling Beyond the Wall.
The Night's King and the Night's Queen enslaved the black brothers and performed human sacrifices.
According to legend, the Night's King was originally a Lord Commander of the Night's Watch who found in the Haunted Forest a cold woman with bright blue eyes, seemingly a female White Walker. He took her to the other side of the Wall and declared himself "Night's King". For thirteen years the two ruled over the brothers of the Night's Watch, performing human sacrifices. The Free Folk rallied under the banner of a King-Beyond-the-Wall and marched against the Nightfort, which the Night's King had taken as his seat, defeating him with the aid of House Stark.
more from the books...
In the A Song of Ice and Fire novels, the Night's King was a Lord Commander of the Night's Watch during its earliest years, not long after the Long Night ended and the Wall was completed. He is considered a legendary, half-mythical figure, not far removed from Bran the Builder. If he really did exist, it was almost eight thousand years ago - consider that while the Night's King was the thirteenth Lord Commander, at the time of the War of the Five Kings, Jeor Mormont is the 997th Lord Commander.
However, the Night's King fell in love with a woman "with skin as white as the moon and eyes like blue stars"; he loved her though "her skin was cold as ice", and when he gave his seed to her he gave her his soul as well. He brought her to the Nightfort and bound the brothers of the Night's Watch to his will through sorcery. He declared himself "Night's King" and ruled over the Wall and the Gift as his own. The King in the North and Joramun, the King-Beyond-the-Wall, joined forces to defeat him.
After he was killed, it was discovered that he had been making human sacrifices to the Others - the White Walkers - and all records of him were destroyed, and uttering his name was forbidden, so it became lost to history. Nevertheless, it is believed he may have been a Bolton, a Magnar of Skagos, an Umber, a Flint, a Norrey, or a Woodfoot, though Old Nan claims to know a version of the tale where he was actually a Stark, brother to the King-in-the-North, named Bran.
After the defeat of the Night's King, the rule was enforced that the castles of the Night's Watch along the Wall should never be fortified against approach from the south, so that they cannot oppose the lands south of the Wall which they are meant to defend. The downfall of the Night's King also resulted in the strict enforcement of the rule that the Night's Watch is meant to be politically neutral, as guardians who do not "rule" the Wall but who serve the realms of men.
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As quite possibly the most fleshed out of Old Nan's tales, the NK obviously has some role to play in the story. Whether it's him personally or setting up someone else's storyline (see the Rat Cook).
I still am holding to him being Coldhands but until we know more about the Others it's pretty hard to say much more one way or the other
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so what was the big bombshell from the show
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so what was the big bombshell from the show
It showed one of Craster's babies getting turned into a white walker by some sort of super white walker. HBO's website called him the Night's King, but have since taken that down.
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so what was the big bombshell from the show
It showed one of Craster's babies getting turned into a white walker by some sort of super white walker. HBO's website called him the Night's King, but have sense taken that down.
:D
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:embarrassed:
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Has this been linked yet?
http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=kp&v=SVaD8rouJn0 (http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=kp&v=SVaD8rouJn0)
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Hey guys, this is also the thread where we :lol: at the poor suckers who just watch the show and think they have anything figured out.
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Is the show revealing more than the books on the Littlefinger/Lysa collaboration to kill Jon Arryn? (It's been so long since I've read the books that I can't remember what all was revealed.) I don't remember knowing that Lysa was in on her own husband's death and lied to Catlyn about it.
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Is the show revealing more than the books on the Littlefinger/Lysa collaboration to kill Jon Arryn? (It's been so long since I've read the books that I can't remember what all was revealed.) I don't remember knowing that Lysa was in on her own husband's death and lied to Catlyn about it.
Yea, it all gets revealed to Sansa by Lysa in one of Sansa's chapters in ASoS.
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Is the show revealing more than the books on the Littlefinger/Lysa collaboration to kill Jon Arryn? (It's been so long since I've read the books that I can't remember what all was revealed.) I don't remember knowing that Lysa was in on her own husband's death and lied to Catlyn about it.
Yea, it all gets revealed to Sansa by Lysa in one of Sansa's chapters in ASoS.
Yea, it wasn't quite as blunt though mainly because of what happened right afterwards in the book
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Is the show revealing more than the books on the Littlefinger/Lysa collaboration to kill Jon Arryn? (It's been so long since I've read the books that I can't remember what all was revealed.) I don't remember knowing that Lysa was in on her own husband's death and lied to Catlyn about it.
Yea, it all gets revealed to Sansa by Lysa in one of Sansa's chapters in ASoS.
Yea, it wasn't quite as blunt though mainly because of what happened right afterwards in the book
Littlefinger is very good at playing the game.
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Is the show revealing more than the books on the Littlefinger/Lysa collaboration to kill Jon Arryn? (It's been so long since I've read the books that I can't remember what all was revealed.) I don't remember knowing that Lysa was in on her own husband's death and lied to Catlyn about it.
Yea, it all gets revealed to Sansa by Lysa in one of Sansa's chapters in ASoS.
Yea, it wasn't quite as blunt though mainly because of what happened right afterwards in the book
Littlefinger is very good at playing the game.
He is, but I find it amusing that I'm pretty sure he thinks he actually slept with Catelyn.
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Oh man, what an episode. Got me really :excited:for next week
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That was a pretty great way to end this week
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Fantastic episode. So much wild stuff is just on the brink of happening you guys
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Fantastic episode. So much wild stuff is just on the brink of happening you guys
Yea, the teasers for next week :love:
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looking at the episode titles, it won't be next week's episode. it will be the one after that.
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the viper mountain battle is maybe the most exciting sequence in the books. so many twists and turns and :emawkid: and then :horrorsurprise: and then :sdeek: and then :runaway:
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the viper mountain battle is maybe the most exciting sequence in the books. so many twists and turns and :emawkid: and then :horrorsurprise: and then :sdeek: and then :runaway:
Can't wait for that episode to air the first weekend of June. It's going to make for some great social media watching.
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the viper mountain battle is maybe the most exciting sequence in the books. so many twists and turns and :emawkid: and then :horrorsurprise: and then :sdeek: and then :runaway:
Can't wait for that episode to air the first weekend of June. It's going to make for some great social media watching.
Yea, I really hope they keep that fight true to the books. That moment when you think Oberyn has won then the Mountain finishes him will be fantastic to see.
Also I can't wait for that moment Littlefinger pushes Lysa out the moon door.
Basically the rest of the season should be pretty fantastic.
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I think one thing the show has an opportunity to do, is highlight what a curve ball trial by combat could be. Tyrion could name Jaime his champion, with the knowledge that Cersei/Tywin wouldn't put him up against anyone who stood a chance of killing him. So then Jaime would either have to get Tyrion out of jail or be a total dick and refuse the request. Then how would it work with Cersei? Tywin would abhor the thought of both his male heirs being knocked out in one blow but is Cersei's lust for blood insatiable? She's grown distant from Jaime, but enough to send him to his death? Such a good delima that seems really in line with the show's exploration of the shades of gray of morality, and they never even explored that possibility in the books.
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the viper mountain battle is maybe the most exciting sequence in the books. so many twists and turns and :emawkid: and then :horrorsurprise: and then :sdeek: and then :runaway:
SPOILER ALERT! I knew about :emawkid:, :horrorsurprise:, and :sdeek:, but not :runaway:
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I'm pretty sure there is some legal reason that a Kingsguard cannot represent the King's accused killer in trial by combat.
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I'm pretty sure there is some legal reason that a Kingsguard cannot represent the King's accused killer in trial by combat.
IIRC, this is correct. I believe Jaime was Tyrion's first choice, but he was prohibited from championing for him. However, I don't remember why Bronn wouldn't/ couldn't do it.
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I'm pretty sure there is some legal reason that a Kingsguard cannot represent the King's accused killer in trial by combat.
IIRC, this is correct. I believe Jaime was Tyrion's first choice, but he was prohibited from championing for him. However, I don't remember why Bronn wouldn't/ couldn't do it.
I don't think Bronn is in King's landing/and or they can't find him.
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I'm pretty sure there is some legal reason that a Kingsguard cannot represent the King's accused killer in trial by combat.
IIRC, this is correct. I believe Jaime was Tyrion's first choice, but he was prohibited from championing for him. However, I don't remember why Bronn wouldn't/ couldn't do it.
I don't think Bronn is in King's landing/and or they can't find him.
Yeah, I think that is how the book was. How will they work it out in the show? Oberyn volunteers as soon as he learns the Mountain is Cersei's champion?
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When Tyrion is accused of murdering his nephew King Joffrey, Bronn refuses to champion him a second time in a trial by combat against the monstrous Ser Gregor Clegane, taking an offer from Cersei instead to marry into the wealthy House Stokeworth.
So sayeth the wiki. He marries Lollys Stokeworth. She's the one that got raped 50ish times during the riot in King's Landing. He duels some other Stokeworth husband and wins and is now boss of the Stokeworths. He named Lollys' bastard Tyrion.
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When Tyrion is accused of murdering his nephew King Joffrey, Bronn refuses to champion him a second time in a trial by combat against the monstrous Ser Gregor Clegane, taking an offer from Cersei instead to marry into the wealthy House Stokeworth.
So sayeth the wiki. He marries Lollys Stokeworth. She's the one that got raped 50ish times during the riot in King's Landing. He duels some other Stokeworth husband and wins and is now boss of the Stokeworths. He named Lollys' bastard Tyrion.
Oh yeah
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I don't think Lollys has been in the show though. They could still do it the same way of course. I do remember in the books when Lollys wanted to name her son Tywin and Cersei flipped her crap about a rape baby being named after her father. So then Bronn names him Tyrion. Great stuff.
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I'm pretty sure there is some legal reason that a Kingsguard cannot represent the King's accused killer in trial by combat.
IIRC, this is correct. I believe Jaime was Tyrion's first choice, but he was prohibited from championing for him. However, I don't remember why Bronn wouldn't/ couldn't do it.
I don't think Bronn is in King's landing/and or they can't find him.
Yeah, I think that is how the book was. How will they work it out in the show? Oberyn volunteers as soon as he learns the Mountain is Cersei's champion?
Most likely. If they dedicate any time at all to Tyrion considering Bronn, it will probably center around Bronn's pragmatism. I doubt Bronn thinks he can best the Mountain.
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I think that they should go ahead and have Bronn turn Tyrion down on the show. He's a good character, and the show is going to really need good characters for season 5. There is no reason at all for Cersei to keep Bronn around unless she buys him off.
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I think that they should go ahead and have Bronn turn Tyrion down on the show. He's a good character, and the show is going to really need good characters for season 5. There is no reason at all for Cersei to keep Bronn around unless she buys him off.
You're probably right. I think the Bronn and Jaime training sessions need to continue, even if they are off screen, for Jaime's story arc to continue developing the way it needs to.
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Didn't Tywin give Bronn a lordship or something for marrying Lollys?
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Didn't Tywin give Bronn a lordship or something for marrying Lollys?
They knight him after the battle of Blackwater, he then begins to go by Ser Bronn of the Blackwater. He becomes a lord after marrying Lollys and becomes Lord Protector of House Stokeworth after the botched assassination attempt by Cersei and one of his in-laws. So spaketh the wiki.
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Didn't Tywin give Bronn a lordship or something for marrying Lollys?
They knight him after the battle of Blackwater, he then begins to go by Ser Bronn of the Blackwater. He becomes a lord after marrying Lollys and becomes Lord Protector of House Stokeworth after the botched assassination attempt by Cersei and one of his in-laws. So spaketh the wiki.
so that was probably a factor. Dude's got it made now.
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Didn't Tywin give Bronn a lordship or something for marrying Lollys?
They knight him after the battle of Blackwater, he then begins to go by Ser Bronn of the Blackwater. He becomes a lord after marrying Lollys and becomes Lord Protector of House Stokeworth after the botched assassination attempt by Cersei and one of his in-laws. So spaketh the wiki.
so that was probably a factor. Dude's got it made now.
Yes, Cersei offers him the marriage to Lollys in exchange for refusing Tyrion's request to champion for him.
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:dubious:
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:dubious:
what? all I did was expand on what you posted.
He is knighted by Tywin after the battle of Blackwater Bay.
He becomes a lord after marrying the fat, unintelligent Lollys in exchange for not championing for Tyrion, and then becomes Lord Protector of House Stokeworth after killing the inlaw that Cersei send to kill him.
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It was for rusty.
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Didn't Tywin give Bronn a lordship or something for marrying Lollys?
They knight him after the battle of Blackwater, he then begins to go by Ser Bronn of the Blackwater. He becomes a lord after marrying Lollys and becomes Lord Protector of House Stokeworth after the botched assassination attempt by Cersei and one of his in-laws. So spaketh the wiki.
so that was probably a factor. Dude's got it made now.
how long have you been running jtksu
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I'm so lost, you guys! :D
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It was for rusty.
When I was googling for wiki purposes I ran across a blog post said that Bronn's actor leaked that his unnamed partner was almost badly injured in a fight they filmed for later this season. They're either making something up for him, or putting the Stokeworth duel on screen!
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/10/12/nycc-game-of-thrones-with-jerome-flynn
I suppose it could be misinformation. He might be talking about nearly injuring the actor that plays Jaime in a training scene.
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The show's made Bronn into such a good character it's going to be difficult to just push him into unseen antagonist to Cersei. It's a pretty easy storyline to flesh out a little too, IMO.
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Shae is going to redeem herself. Cersei obviously ran her down (what happened to Bronn?) and she's doing what she needs to do to live. Tyrion still loves her and threw in the whore insult at the end of the trial for her protection. The two will live happily ever after.
:lol:
dude is such a rough ridin' moron
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:lol:
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Shae is going to redeem herself. Cersei obviously ran her down (what happened to Bronn?) and she's doing what she needs to do to live. Tyrion still loves her and threw in the whore insult at the end of the trial for her protection. The two will live happily ever after.
:lol:
dude is such a rough ridin' moron
he might be the least intelligent person to ever post on this blog.
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So do you guys think that Shae turned against Tyrion just recently (i.e. when he sent her away and/or when Cersei bought her off/threatened her)? When reading the books, I had the impression that she was being directed by Tywin all along.
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So do you guys think that Shae turned against Tyrion just recently (i.e. when he sent her away and/or when Cersei bought her off/threatened her)? When reading the books, I had the impression that she was being directed by Tywin all along.
there was a scene a while back in the show where she and Varys had a discussion and it was implied he had been paying her to stay with Tyrion
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Yeah, Varys makes a ton of sense.
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She's a prostitute. She was never Tyrion's beyond his ability to pay her more than someone else was willing to. He had the attachment.
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She's a prostitute. She was never Tyrion's beyond his ability to pay her more than someone else was willing to. He had the attachment.
jfc margaery haven't you ever seen Pretty Woman?
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She's a prostitute. She was never Tyrion's beyond his ability to pay her more than someone else was willing to. He had the attachment.
jfc margaery haven't you ever seen Pretty Woman?
Well look who it is.
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So do you guys think that Shae turned against Tyrion just recently (i.e. when he sent her away and/or when Cersei bought her off/threatened her)? When reading the books, I had the impression that she was being directed by Tywin all along.
there was a scene a while back in the show where she and Varys had a discussion and it was implied he had been paying her to stay with Tyrion
Eh, this fits the nice narrative where Tyrion looks at her during the trial, says, "Shae...no," and she turns back to him and says that she's a whore.
I'm going to go with this from now on.
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She's a prostitute. She was never Tyrion's beyond his ability to pay her more than someone else was willing to. He had the attachment.
Well yeah, she was always in it because it benefited her. The question is when did she start taking orders from Tywin? Like, did Tywin send her in as a camp follower because he knew Tyrion had a weakness for whores and he wanted to have a backup plan of how to control Tyrion? Or after she came to King's Landing, then Tywin turned her? Or after Joffery was murdered then they threatened her into testifying?
I am leaning toward the second option, but could be the first.
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Shae is going to redeem herself. Cersei obviously ran her down (what happened to Bronn?) and she's doing what she needs to do to live. Tyrion still loves her and threw in the whore insult at the end of the trial for her protection. The two will live happily ever after.
:lol:
dude is such a rough ridin' moron
Wow. This is just...wow.
Well, this is just going to steal the breath right out of him.
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She's a prostitute. She was never Tyrion's beyond his ability to pay her more than someone else was willing to. He had the attachment.
Well yeah, she was always in it because it benefited her. The question is when did she start taking orders from Tywin? Like, did Tywin send her in as a camp follower because he knew Tyrion had a weakness for whores and he wanted to have a backup plan of how to control Tyrion? Or after she came to King's Landing, then Tywin turned her? Or after Joffery was murdered then they threatened her into testifying?
I am leaning toward the second option, but could be the first.
I don't think she was turned until Joffrey died and Cersei paid her to testify against Tyrion. She got a Bronn type offer from Cersei iirc. I don't think anyone needed to threaten her. Tyrion was in trouble one way or the other and wouldn't be paying her any longer. She needed a new meal ticket. Cersei offered her an opportunity to profit. Tywin was just having sex with a whore that was at hand imo. Nothing more elaborate than that. He always did with Tyrion as he pleased. He didn't need leverage to eff him over or treat him like crap. Cersei did.
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During Tyrion's trial, Shae betrays Tyrion by lying that he conspired with Sansa to murder King Joffrey and Lord Tywin, revealing the full and intimate details of their affair - including her pet name for him as her "Giant of Lannister"; in exchange for her testimony Cersei Lannister offered her a manse in King's Landing and a knight to wed.
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During Tyrion's trial, Shae betrays Tyrion by lying that he conspired with Sansa to murder King Joffrey and Lord Tywin, revealing the full and intimate details of their affair - including her pet name for him as her "Giant of Lannister"; in exchange for her testimony Cersei Lannister offered her a manse in King's Landing and a knight to wed.
I still think she could have been in someone's pocket before Joffery died. Remember that whore from the brothel that they beat up because they thought she was Tyrion's lover (but he was actually using her as a cover to sneak off to Shae)? I think that Cersei/Tywin knew that she was not really his lover, they just had her beaten to prove to Tyrion that they could get to his lover if they wished. (I can't remember if it was Cersei or Tywin that had her beaten.)
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I don't think she was anyone but Tyrion's until Joff's death. I think she actually was in love with Tyrion in a fashion. More because of his ability to give her the type of life she wants than actual love. She could see that wasn't going to continue and when she received a better offer from Cersei she felt she needed to take it.
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Shae is going to redeem herself. Cersei obviously ran her down (what happened to Bronn?) and she's doing what she needs to do to live. Tyrion still loves her and threw in the whore insult at the end of the trial for her protection. The two will live happily ever after.
:lol:
dude is such a rough ridin' moron
Also it was a huge :ROFL:moment when I saw this.
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I don't think she was anyone but Tyrion's until Joff's death. I think she actually was in love with Tyrion in a fashion. More because of his ability to give her the type of life she wants than actual love. She could see that wasn't going to continue and when she received a better offer from Cersei she felt she needed to take it.
If she was "loyal" to Tyrion until Joff's death, then why was she still in King's Landing instead of going to Bravvos or wherever he sent her?
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I don't think she was anyone but Tyrion's until Joff's death. I think she actually was in love with Tyrion in a fashion. More because of his ability to give her the type of life she wants than actual love. She could see that wasn't going to continue and when she received a better offer from Cersei she felt she needed to take it.
If she was "loyal" to Tyrion until Joff's death, then why was she still in King's Landing instead of going to Bravvos or wherever he sent her?
Maybe Varys outed her before she could get on the boat.
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During Tyrion's trial, Shae betrays Tyrion by lying that he conspired with Sansa to murder King Joffrey and Lord Tywin, revealing the full and intimate details of their affair - including her pet name for him as her "Giant of Lannister"; in exchange for her testimony Cersei Lannister offered her a manse in King's Landing and a knight to wed.
I still think she could have been in someone's pocket before Joffery died. Remember that whore from the brothel that they beat up because they thought she was Tyrion's lover (but he was actually using her as a cover to sneak off to Shae)? I think that Cersei/Tywin knew that she was not really his lover, they just had her beaten to prove to Tyrion that they could get to his lover if they wished. (I can't remember if it was Cersei or Tywin that had her beaten.)
Cersei did that because Tyrion had been rough ridin' with her plans left and right when he was the Hand. She really thought that was his #1 whore at the time, because he would visit her room and then take a secret passage to Shae. Tywin wasn't in KL when it happened.
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I don't think she was anyone but Tyrion's until Joff's death. I think she actually was in love with Tyrion in a fashion. More because of his ability to give her the type of life she wants than actual love. She could see that wasn't going to continue and when she received a better offer from Cersei she felt she needed to take it.
If she was "loyal" to Tyrion until Joff's death, then why was she still in King's Landing instead of going to Bravvos or wherever he sent her?
Maybe Varys outed her before she could get on the boat.
Or because the show made it so Tywin and Cersei knew who she was they simply plucked her off the boat before it set sail.
The whole Shae on a boat thing is different from the book anyway. If I remember right she was trying to talk Tyrion into letting her be at the wedding rather than being sent away.
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During Tyrion's trial, Shae betrays Tyrion by lying that he conspired with Sansa to murder King Joffrey and Lord Tywin, revealing the full and intimate details of their affair - including her pet name for him as her "Giant of Lannister"; in exchange for her testimony Cersei Lannister offered her a manse in King's Landing and a knight to wed.
I still think she could have been in someone's pocket before Joffery died. Remember that whore from the brothel that they beat up because they thought she was Tyrion's lover (but he was actually using her as a cover to sneak off to Shae)? I think that Cersei/Tywin knew that she was not really his lover, they just had her beaten to prove to Tyrion that they could get to his lover if they wished. (I can't remember if it was Cersei or Tywin that had her beaten.)
Cersei did that because Tyrion had been rough ridin' with her plans left and right when he was the Hand. She really thought that was his #1 whore at the time, because he would visit her room and then take a secret passage to Shae. Tywin wasn't in KL when it happened.
Yea, that was all Cersei thinking she had it all figured out.
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I don't think she was anyone but Tyrion's until Joff's death. I think she actually was in love with Tyrion in a fashion. More because of his ability to give her the type of life she wants than actual love. She could see that wasn't going to continue and when she received a better offer from Cersei she felt she needed to take it.
If she was "loyal" to Tyrion until Joff's death, then why was she still in King's Landing instead of going to Bravvos or wherever he sent her?
Maybe Varys outed her before she could get on the boat.
Or because the show made it so Tywin and Cersei knew who she was they simply plucked her off the boat before it set sail.
The whole Shae on a boat thing is different from the book anyway. If I remember right she was trying to talk Tyrion into letting her be at the wedding rather than being sent away.
Varys told Tyrion straight up in the books that if Cersei questioned him directly about Shae he would not lie. So Tyrion planned to marry her off to some knight to save her. This was just before Joffrey's death.
And I love you as well, sweetling. A whore she might well be, but she deserved better than what he had to give her. I will wed her to Ser Tallad. He seems a decent man. And tall…
All Cersei had to do was grill Varys and he would have told her exactly who Shae was and where to find her.
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I'm pretty sure there is some legal reason that a Kingsguard cannot represent the King's accused killer in trial by combat.
IIRC, this is correct. I believe Jaime was Tyrion's first choice, but he was prohibited from championing for him. However, I don't remember why Bronn wouldn't/ couldn't do it.
I don't think Bronn is in King's landing/and or they can't find him.
The quote about Bronn is correct, he refuses because someone offers him a better deal... IIRC he even asks Tyrion "Can you beat a lordship? [in reference to his earlier quote "If anyone asks you to betray me, whatever they're offering, i'll beat it!"]" To which he begrudgingly and without avarice acknowledges that he cannot.
However, in the books, Jaime was still on the road when Joff was murdered, and Tyrion is in chains when he returns to Kings Landing. He doesn't reveal his presence to Tyrion, and only observes his trial from afar. So Tyrion, both doesn't know hes available to call on, nor does he know of his disfigurement (no one tells him anything whilst in the cell, unlike the show he's kept in isolation) so he wouldn't even have suggested calling on Jaime to act as his champion.
As such, in the show Tyrion knows that Jaime is alive and availible and most importantly, not wanting to give the impression that he's lost the ability to fight... IMO, this sets up a plot twist that could be very in keeping with the spirit of ASOIAF and revealing about the characters involved. I.E - Tyrion hates Jaime for ever not because of his youthful betrayal, but for abandoning him as his champion.
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The quote about Bronn is correct, he refuses because someone offers him a better deal... IIRC he even asks Tyrion "Can you beat a lordship? [in reference to his earlier quote "If anyone asks you to betray me, whatever they're offering, i'll beat it!"]" To which he begrudgingly and without avarice acknowledges that he cannot.
However, in the books, Jaime was still on the road when Joff was murdered, and Tyrion is in chains when he returns to Kings Landing. He doesn't reveal his presence to Tyrion, and only observes his trial from afar. So Tyrion, both doesn't know hes available to call on, nor does he know of his disfigurement (no one tells him anything whilst in the cell, unlike the show he's kept in isolation) so he wouldn't even have suggested calling on Jaime to act as his champion.
As such, in the show Tyrion knows that Jaime is alive and availible and most importantly, not wanting to give the impression that he's lost the ability to fight... IMO, this sets up a plot twist that could be very in keeping with the spirit of ASOIAF and revealing about the characters involved. I.E - Tyrion hates Jaime for ever not because of his youthful betrayal, but for abandoning him as his champion.
I feel like this is a strange usage of this word.
Was it only in the show that Tyrion attempted to name Jaime as his champion in The Vale?
Cersei will name The Mountain as her champion and Oberyn will jump at the chance to avenge his sister. Tyrion is not that irrational. He wouldn't begrudge Jaime for not championing for him, given his state. I imagine that Tyrion is smart enough to know that it would be in the best interest of both of them for someone else to take up Tyrion's cause.
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Malice was the word I was looking for. Good catch.
He did try to name Jaime in the Vale in the books, and like the show he was denied naming an absent champion.
I dunno, I think it would be a smarter move to name Jaime than the greatest fighter in Westeros. He wouldn't be naming a champion who he thought could win, he'd be naming one he thought couldn't lose, i.e Tywin/Cersei wouldn't match him up against someone who'd kill him (or would she?).
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http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/05/14/george_r_r_martin_writes_on_dos_based_wordstar_4_0_software_from_the_1980s.html
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i hate him
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Yeah, he can eff right off. What a rough ridin' dipshit.
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Malice was the word I was looking for. Good catch.
He did try to name Jaime in the Vale in the books, and like the show he was denied naming an absent champion.
I dunno, I think it would be a smarter move to name Jaime than the greatest fighter in Westeros. He wouldn't be naming a champion who he thought could win, he'd be naming one he thought couldn't lose, i.e Tywin/Cersei wouldn't match him up against someone who'd kill him (or would she?).
In the books it's made clear that Cersei means to name the Mountain from the very beginning. I don't remember him even considering Jaime as an option, probably because a) he had no idea where Jaime was and b) he didn't think Jaime would actually do it because, as far as Tyrion knows, he and Cersei are still lovers. After Bronn refused him, Tyrion basically gave up the idea of tbc. It wasn't until Oberyn himself suggested it prior to the last day of the trial that Tyrion again considered it.
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
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pretty sure tarintino still uses the same dos word processer he used for resivior dogs or something
*side note, i spelled resivior so badly that spell check won't correct it for me
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
:sdeek:
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
:sdeek:
Well, he says it does "everything he need", but just looking at that screenshot you know it's slow as eff. And probably a disorganized clusterfuck. Hey might as well be using a rough ridin' quill.
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pretty sure tarintino still uses the same dos word processer he used for resivior dogs or something
*side note, i spelled resivior so badly that spell check won't correct it for me
if quentin tarantino took 20 years to write a screenplay you might have a point there
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pretty sure tarintino still uses the same dos word processer he used for resivior dogs or something
*side note, i spelled resivior so badly that spell check won't correct it for me
if quentin tarantino took 20 years to write a screenplay you might have a point there
just giving you guys nuggets of knowledge :D
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Malice was the word I was looking for. Good catch.
He did try to name Jaime in the Vale in the books, and like the show he was denied naming an absent champion.
I dunno, I think it would be a smarter move to name Jaime than the greatest fighter in Westeros. He wouldn't be naming a champion who he thought could win, he'd be naming one he thought couldn't lose, i.e Tywin/Cersei wouldn't match him up against someone who'd kill him (or would she?).
IIRC, tradition in the few trial by combat instances I have read so far holds that the accuser names their champion(s) first. Jaime is the only member of Tyrion's family that he has any attachment to, he would not send his brother into battle against Gregor with only one hand.
Why are we even debating the nuances of something that can't/ won't happen?
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
Weird.
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Malice was the word I was looking for. Good catch.
He did try to name Jaime in the Vale in the books, and like the show he was denied naming an absent champion.
I dunno, I think it would be a smarter move to name Jaime than the greatest fighter in Westeros. He wouldn't be naming a champion who he thought could win, he'd be naming one he thought couldn't lose, i.e Tywin/Cersei wouldn't match him up against someone who'd kill him (or would she?).
IIRC, tradition in the few trial by combat instances I have read so far holds that the accuser names their champion(s) first. Jaime is the only member of Tyrion's family that he has any attachment to, he would not send his brother into battle against Gregor with only one hand.
Why are we even debating the nuances of something that can't/ won't happen?
It can't won't happen in the books, but it could in the show. I don't recall any such nuance, but the episode in the vale did involve the accuser naming a champion first.
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Malice was the word I was looking for. Good catch.
He did try to name Jaime in the Vale in the books, and like the show he was denied naming an absent champion.
I dunno, I think it would be a smarter move to name Jaime than the greatest fighter in Westeros. He wouldn't be naming a champion who he thought could win, he'd be naming one he thought couldn't lose, i.e Tywin/Cersei wouldn't match him up against someone who'd kill him (or would she?).
IIRC, tradition in the few trial by combat instances I have read so far holds that the accuser names their champion(s) first. Jaime is the only member of Tyrion's family that he has any attachment to, he would not send his brother into battle against Gregor with only one hand.
Why are we even debating the nuances of something that can't/ won't happen?
It can't won't happen in the books, but it could in the show. I don't recall any such nuance, but the episode in the vale did involve the accuser naming a champion first.
It won't. The god damn title of episode 8 is "The Mountain and The Viper".
This trial also involved the accuser naming their champion first. The same also applies to the only other instance of trial by combat in the stories, trial by seven from the Dunk and Egg novellas.
I'm not saying that it is Westerosi law that the accuser names their champion first, but it seems to work out that way. People are usually hesitant to volunteer for the accused's cause without knowing what they are going up against first.
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
Weird.
GRRM was/is a struggling screenwriter that happened to Gump his way into the best fantasy series this side of the Wheel of Time and the Dark Tower.
He gets off on this crap. I think he's an asshat, but I'm too invested now.
I absolutely think he puts crap off simply for more attention.
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
Weird.
GRRM was/is a struggling screenwriter that happened to Gump his way into the best fantasy series this side of the Wheel of Time and the Dark Tower.
He gets off on this crap. I think he's an asshat, but I'm too invested now.
I absolutely think he puts crap off simply for more attention.
Speaking of The Wheel of Time, what's everyone's opinion on that series? I'm considering making it my summer reading.
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
Weird.
GRRM was/is a struggling screenwriter that happened to Gump his way into the best fantasy series this side of the Wheel of Time and the Dark Tower.
He gets off on this crap. I think he's an asshat, but I'm too invested now.
I absolutely think he puts crap off simply for more attention.
regardless, it's just a book.
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Metalhead, I'm not really as upset as my post may have made it seem.
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Metalhead, I'm not really as upset as my post may have made it seem.
I figured as much, I do that a lot too.
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I'm seriously thinking about not reading the last two books and just watching the show. Or maybe not even watching the show because I'm so sick of George RR Martin's bullshit.
Weird.
GRRM was/is a struggling screenwriter that happened to Gump his way into the best fantasy series this side of the Wheel of Time and the Dark Tower.
He gets off on this crap. I think he's an asshat, but I'm too invested now.
I absolutely think he puts crap off simply for more attention.
Speaking of The Wheel of Time, what's everyone's opinion on that series? I'm considering making it my summer reading.
I liked it. It is really long though, so it is quite a commitment and there are boring parts in the middle. 14 books for the main series plus a prequel and a couple of short stories. Also, I hope you like the phrase "She crossed her arms beneath her breasts" because it shows up at least once per chapter.
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So I think we may have had another teaser to a future storyline in the show when Mel was trying to explain why Shireen needed to go with them. Seems like it was implying Shireen will have a key role in the future when she's really done nothing in the books.
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She probably just plans on burning her. She's big on sacrificing children with possible royal blood.
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She probably just plans on burning her. She's big on sacrificing children with possible royal blood.
I was thinking the same thing.
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She probably just plans on burning her. She's big on sacrificing children with possible royal blood.
I was thinking the same thing.
That was what I figured too, it just seemed to be a tip of the hand a little earlier than the books
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I think we're going to learn a little bit more about greyscale (sp?). There was a significant portion of aDwD dedicated to it. Then again, maybe it is just a plot device to eliminate Jon Connington and Shireen from complicating the story further.
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I think we're going to learn a little bit more about greyscale (sp?). There was a significant portion of aDwD dedicated to it. Then again, maybe it is just a plot device to eliminate Jon Connington and Shireen from complicating the story further.
With the way Val freaks out about her I'm sure there's going to be some significance, not just oh, she died from it.
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i hope the show gets into what on earth qyburn is doing with the mountain
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Does Ygritte seem more vicious in the show than the books? Maybe we just didn't see it in the books because a POV character wasn't there when she was pillaging.
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Does Ygritte seem more vicious in the show than the books? Maybe we just didn't see it in the books because a POV character wasn't there when she was pillaging.
She let Gilly live, though.
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Does Ygritte seem more vicious in the show than the books? Maybe we just didn't see it in the books because a POV character wasn't there when she was pillaging.
She let Gilly live, though.
Yeah, that is the only thing making me unsure if she is more vicious or not.
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I think she was pretty vicious in the books, too. Jon Snow tamed her with his tongue, but nobody else has been able to tame that beast.
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Speaking of The Wheel of Time, what's everyone's opinion on that series? I'm considering making it my summer reading.
The first 6 books were masterful, and if he had wrapped the series in 10 it would have rivaled if not surpassed Tolkien. Unfortunately, Robert Jordan started to go crazy towards the end and the series got horribly bogged down in books 7-11 with way too many uninteresting characters and story lines. Then Robert Jordan died and Sanderson took over. He did a remarkably good job tying up the series with the final 3 books, but it wasn't nearly as good or satisfying as the first 6. Spent too much time wrapping up dumb story lines and rushed through others.
Overall, a good series but it will probably leave you at least somewhat disappointed.
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I watched last night's episode with TownieCat and really had to stifle my laughter following the chamber pot line. The next two episodes are going to be a whirlwind of excitement.
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I watched last night's episode with TownieCat and really had to stifle my laughter following the chamber pot line. The next two episodes are going to be a whirlwind of excitement.
Me too.
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I enjoyed when Tyrion told Oberyn that he should at least wear a helmet. All the episode was missing was that one-armed guy from Arrested Development popping in and saying "and that's why you always wear a helmet."
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I watched last night's episode with TownieCat and really had to stifle my laughter following the chamber pot line. The next two episodes are going to be a whirlwind of excitement.
Me too.
I didn't see you?! :runaway:
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I watched last night's episode with TownieCat Gooch and really had to stifle my laughter following the chamber pot line. The next two episodes are going to be a whirlwind of excitement.
Me too.
I didn't see you?! :runaway:
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I enjoyed when Tyrion told Oberyn that he should at least wear a helmet. All the episode was missing was that one-armed guy from Arrested Development popping in and saying "and that's why you always wear a helmet."
Oberyn asking about Tyrion's time in the fighting pits made me gasp a little bit too. Weiss and Benioff do some excellent foreshadowing.
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I watched last night's episode with TownieCat and really had to stifle my laughter following the chamber pot line. The next two episodes are going to be a whirlwind of excitement.
i watched with like 4 other people who are all in the dark and i was like OMG and looked back and forth and nobody else reacted at all. pretty great writing.
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I enjoyed when Tyrion told Oberyn that he should at least wear a helmet. All the episode was missing was that one-armed guy from Arrested Development popping in and saying "and that's why you always wear a helmet."
Oberyn asking about Tyrion's time in the fighting pits made me gasp a little bit too. Weiss and Benioff do some excellent foreshadowing.
oh my, i did not even catch that.
when do you think tyrion will meet jorah? probably epi 1 of season 5
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I enjoyed when Tyrion told Oberyn that he should at least wear a helmet. All the episode was missing was that one-armed guy from Arrested Development popping in and saying "and that's why you always wear a helmet."
Oberyn asking about Tyrion's time in the fighting pits made me gasp a little bit too. Weiss and Benioff do some excellent foreshadowing.
oh my, i did not even catch that.
when do you think tyrion will meet jorah? probably epi 1 of season 5
I don't remember exactly when their paths cross, so I can't say. I was disappointed in last night's scene. Daeny disassociating herself from Jorah is such a big moment for both characters. The scene just seemed weak.
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I enjoyed when Tyrion told Oberyn that he should at least wear a helmet. All the episode was missing was that one-armed guy from Arrested Development popping in and saying "and that's why you always wear a helmet."
Oberyn asking about Tyrion's time in the fighting pits made me gasp a little bit too. Weiss and Benioff do some excellent foreshadowing.
oh my, i did not even catch that.
when do you think tyrion will meet jorah? probably epi 1 of season 5
I don't remember exactly when there paths cross, so I can't say.
It's middle/late book 5? So it may be the first episode of Season 6. Season 5 will probably have him asking where do the whores go a million times and almost drowning and going into that camp as a slave or whatever.
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Yeah, seems like Tyrion has a bit of a journey before he meets up with Jorah.
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I enjoyed when Tyrion told Oberyn that he should at least wear a helmet. All the episode was missing was that one-armed guy from Arrested Development popping in and saying "and that's why you always wear a helmet."
Oberyn asking about Tyrion's time in the fighting pits made me gasp a little bit too. Weiss and Benioff do some excellent foreshadowing.
oh my, i did not even catch that.
when do you think tyrion will meet jorah? probably epi 1 of season 5
I don't remember exactly when there paths cross, so I can't say.
It's middle/late book 5? So it may be the first episode of Season 6. Season 5 will probably have him asking where do the whores go a million times and almost drowning and going into that camp as a slave or whatever.
His first marriage has been essentially ignored by the show, which is frustrating. That trauma is pretty important for Tyrion's character. I've been wondering how they are going to work that in.
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sorry yeah when i said 5 i meant season 6.
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the subreddit is hypothesizing that they're using Grey Worm and Missandei as a a replacement for the Stalwart Shield storyline. I suppose that is possible, but Grey Worm is pretty important. I'd be pissed if they killed him off.
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I enjoyed when Tyrion told Oberyn that he should at least wear a helmet. All the episode was missing was that one-armed guy from Arrested Development popping in and saying "and that's why you always wear a helmet."
Oberyn asking about Tyrion's time in the fighting pits made me gasp a little bit too. Weiss and Benioff do some excellent foreshadowing.
oh my, i did not even catch that.
when do you think tyrion will meet jorah? probably epi 1 of season 5
I don't remember exactly when there paths cross, so I can't say.
It's middle/late book 5? So it may be the first episode of Season 6. Season 5 will probably have him asking where do the whores go a million times and almost drowning and going into that camp as a slave or whatever.
His first marriage has been essentially ignored by the show, which is frustrating. That trauma is pretty important for Tyrion's character. I've been wondering how they are going to work that in.
i think it's been mentioned quite a few times. the bulk of it just happened to be in season one
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I thought the nights watch burned down everything on the south side of the wall when they were being attacked? Is that later? Also did grenn and pyp both die in the book? I don't remember that
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Preview of next week with someone slowly approaching a door... Gonna be sad about that one :frown:
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I thought the nights watch burned down everything on the south side of the wall when they were being attacked? Is that later? Also did grenn and pyp both die in the book? I don't remember that
Everything catches fire from arrows during the first raid, you are right. Grenn and Pyp both lived through the attacks in the book. They actually have somewhat important roles in a later event. I suppose they're just going to use Sam to fulfill that.
It should have been the one-armed blacksmith, Donal Noye that died holding the tunnel, but they never cast/ wrote that character in.
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I thought the nights watch burned down everything on the south side of the wall when they were being attacked? Is that later? Also did grenn and pyp both die in the book? I don't remember that
Everything catches fire from arrows during the first raid, you are right. Grenn and Pyp both lived through the attacks in the book. They actually have somewhat important roles in a later event. I suppose they're just going to use Sam to fulfill that.
It should have been the one-armed blacksmith, Donal Noye that died holding the tunnel, but they never cast/ wrote that character in.
Probably that rough ridin' SAG not letting anyone surgically remove an arm for the role, bastards.
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Why isn't anyone talking about how sad it was when Ygritte died in Jon Snow's arms?
Because that might have been the worst part of the episode. "Let's throw out all the guidelines we've used to shape the battle so far and have a heartfelt moment!"
Yeah, actually I think the book was more heart wrenching since they didn't even get a goodbye...but it was still sad dammit!
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Why isn't anyone talking about how sad it was when Ygritte died in Jon Snow's arms?
it would have been much more sad had it happened the way it happened in the book
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Why isn't anyone talking about how sad it was when Ygritte died in Jon Snow's arms?
it would have been much more sad had it happened the way it happened in the book
Truth be told, I think I might have cried when I read it in the book but I didn't even cry at all when watching the episode last night.
(I have a low tolerance for heart wrenching moments in books and movies.)
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the title of Episode 10 is "The Children". How far ahead are we going here? :sdeek:
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the title of Episode 10 is "The Children". How far ahead are we going here? :sdeek:
I think, well, I hope, it's a reference to what happens with Val's son and Gilly's son.
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the title of Episode 10 is "The Children". How far ahead are we going here? :sdeek:
We aren't going ahead just yet, but it looks like Bran is going to be all caught up. If GRRM doesn't get his next book out by the end of this year, Bran is going to get interesting.
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Preview of next week with someone slowly approaching a door... Gonna be sad about that one :frown:
I don't get this, are you sad about the toll it takes on the perpetrator?
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Why isn't anyone talking about how sad it was when Ygritte died in Jon Snow's arms?
Because that might have been the worst part of the episode. "Let's throw out all the guidelines we've used to shape the battle so far and have a heartfelt moment!"
Yeah, actually I think the book was more heart wrenching since they didn't even get a goodbye...but it was still sad dammit!
They got a goodbye in the book. He found her, they talked and she died.
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Why isn't anyone talking about how sad it was when Ygritte died in Jon Snow's arms?
Because that might have been the worst part of the episode. "Let's throw out all the guidelines we've used to shape the battle so far and have a heartfelt moment!"
Yeah, actually I think the book was more heart wrenching since they didn't even get a goodbye...but it was still sad dammit!
They got a goodbye in the book. He found her, they talked and she died.
I thought he found her dead. Maybe I am miss remembering, it has been a while since I read it.
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Why isn't anyone talking about how sad it was when Ygritte died in Jon Snow's arms?
Because that might have been the worst part of the episode. "Let's throw out all the guidelines we've used to shape the battle so far and have a heartfelt moment!"
Yeah, actually I think the book was more heart wrenching since they didn't even get a goodbye...but it was still sad dammit!
They got a goodbye in the book. He found her, they talked and she died.
I thought he found her dead. Maybe I am miss remembering, it has been a while since I read it.
yeah i don't think Bread is right (although he usually is)
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the title of Episode 10 is "The Children". How far ahead are we going here? :sdeek:
I think, well, I hope, it's a reference to what happens with Val's son and Gilly's son.
Tywin's son too i suppose. But when it comes down to it, everyone is somebody's child, so what do i know?
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the title of Episode 10 is "The Children". How far ahead are we going here? :sdeek:
I think, well, I hope, it's a reference to what happens with Val's son and Gilly's son.
Tywin's son too i suppose. But when it comes down to it, everyone is somebody's child, so what do i know?
I'm pretty sure Bran is going to meet the Children of the Forest and plug himself into that tree.
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Bread is right.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Ygritte
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the title of Episode 10 is "The Children". How far ahead are we going here? :sdeek:
I think, well, I hope, it's a reference to what happens with Val's son and Gilly's son.
Tywin's son too i suppose. But when it comes down to it, everyone is somebody's child, so what do i know?
I'm pretty sure Bran is going to meet the Children of the Forest and plug himself into that tree.
I think you are wrong. That doesn't agree with the timeline in the slightest.
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Bread is right.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Ygritte
Well ok. She even said the thing about how they should have stayed in the cave.
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the title of Episode 10 is "The Children". How far ahead are we going here? :sdeek:
I think, well, I hope, it's a reference to what happens with Val's son and Gilly's son.
On second thought, my original thought doesn't fit with the timeline either. However, there are some significant events that occur in the lives of the three Lannister children next episode.
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Also, could be Mereen. The released slaves all refer to her as Mother.
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Why isn't anyone talking about how sad it was when Ygritte died in Jon Snow's arms?
Because that might have been the worst part of the episode. "Let's throw out all the guidelines we've used to shape the battle so far and have a heartfelt moment!"
Yeah, actually I think the book was more heart wrenching since they didn't even get a goodbye...but it was still sad dammit!
They got a goodbye in the book. He found her, they talked and she died.
I thought he found her dead. Maybe I am miss remembering, it has been a while since I read it.
yeah i don't think Bread is right (although he usually is)
:excited:
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Bread is right.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Ygritte
Well ok. She even said the thing about how they should have stayed in the cave.
I remembered because I was glad she didn't die bitter at him and also him being relieved when he recognized that it wasn't one of his arrows.
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Bread is right.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Ygritte
Well ok. She even said the thing about how they should have stayed in the cave.
I remembered because I was glad she didn't die bitter at him and also him being relieved when he recognized that it wasn't one of his arrows.
OK, but in the book she didn't have the chance to kill Jon and then hesitate which showed she still really loved him....I don't know...something just makes me feel like there was more closure between them in the show than in the book.
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Bread is right.
http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Ygritte
Well ok. She even said the thing about how they should have stayed in the cave.
I remembered because I was glad she didn't die bitter at him and also him being relieved when he recognized that it wasn't one of his arrows.
OK, but in the book she didn't have the chance to kill Jon and then hesitate which showed she still really loved him....I don't know...something just makes me feel like there was more closure between them in the show than in the book.
Yeah, they never see each other during though he does see a redhead and doesn't shoot at it because it might be her. He's up on that tower the whole time shooting arrows in the book.
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Also, could be Mereen. The released slaves all refer to her as Mother.
But the reddit guys, who are better at this stuff than I am, seem to think Bran meets Leaf next week, so who knows.
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I could have sworn that I read somewhere that they cast somebody to play a child of the forest, so my prediction is mostly cheating. Maybe instead of coldhands, they are going to use leaf to guide Bran to the tree? That would fit the timeline a little bit better. If Bran actually makes it to the tree, they are going to skip some of his stuff and his storyline is probably going to get a lot different than it is in the books.
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Preview of next week with someone slowly approaching a door... Gonna be sad about that one :frown:
I don't get this, are you sad about the toll it takes on the perpetrator?
i assumed tywin was sitting on the crapper on the other side of the door. he's v. good on this show
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Cold hands is Benjen, right?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Cold hands is Benjen, right?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Unlikely, Coldhands admits to being much older than Benjen could possibly be... So the next epi is going to have a dead Tywin, Lady Stoneheart AND children of the forrest? Will this infact be the best final episode of all 4 seasons? Methinks yes.
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Cold hands is Benjen, right?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Unlikely, Coldhands admits to being much older than Benjen could possibly be... So the next epi is going to have a dead Tywin, Lady Stoneheart AND children of the forrest? Will this infact be the best final episode of all 4 seasons? Methinks yes.
That's not canon. The only piece of solid information we have to date Coldhands is Leaf saying, "They killed him long ago." Who the eff knows what that means.
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Preview of next week with someone slowly approaching a door... Gonna be sad about that one :frown:
I don't get this, are you sad about the toll it takes on the perpetrator?
i assumed tywin was sitting on the crapper on the other side of the door. he's v. good on this show
Yea, I like Charles Dance, but I'm still rough ridin' stoked about finding out whether or not he shits gold.
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Seriously, I can't think of a more satisfying death, for me, in the series.
Tywin > Viserys > Joffrey
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Cold hands is Benjen, right?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Unlikely, Coldhands admits to being much older than Benjen could possibly be... So the next epi is going to have a dead Tywin, Lady Stoneheart AND children of the forrest? Will this infact be the best final episode of all 4 seasons? Methinks yes.
That's not canon. The only piece of solid information we have to date Coldhands is Leaf saying, "They killed him long ago." Who the eff knows what that means.
Long ago to me would mean more than 2 years ago. :th_twocents:
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Preview of next week with someone slowly approaching a door... Gonna be sad about that one :frown:
I don't get this, are you sad about the toll it takes on the perpetrator?
i assumed tywin was sitting on the crapper on the other side of the door. he's v. good on this show
Yea, I like Charles Dance, but I'm still rough ridin' stoked about finding out whether or not he shits gold.
Unfortunately, I don't think I have heard the line "Tywin Lannister shits gold" one time on the show. The line is what made the death so satisfying to me.
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I find it interesting that Tywin tells Cersei in the show that the mines in the Westerlands have dried up. I don't believe that is information you get in the books, although I think it is implied.
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I find it interesting that Tywin tells Cersei in the show that the mines in the Westerlands have dried up. I don't believe that is information you get in the books, although I think it is implied.
I didn't like how the show introduced the Bank of Braavos. I thought it was a lot better in the books when the bank came to Stannis after Cercei was dumb enough to stop making payments to them.
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why was i kind of expecting stannis to show up in the last episode? that might be next season stuff i guess
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why was i kind of expecting stannis to show up in the last episode? that might be next season stuff i guess
Because in the books the group of wildlings from the south attacked Castle Black at least a day's time before Mance's group from north of the wall showed up. There were two separate battles.
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Didn't read thread and don't plan to beyond responses to this post, but I was just curious about what characters you book readers view differently as a result of watching the show. Because I find Jon Snow to be absolutely insufferable in the show, completely boring, dull, stupid, just a generic fantasy hero, but I find him a lot more interesting in the books (I've only read A Game of Thrones, fwiw) due to the pov and the added venom of Catelyn towards him and the increased focus on how the other members of the Night's Watch treat him, along with the look at his own thoughts and feelings that the book gives us.
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The battle scenes were really well done. I started laughing at Olly's head nod after the kill shot, which probably wasn't the reaction they were going for.
I came out of the episode a little disappointed though -- I think it was because there wasn't a huge twist at the end of the episode like the previous 2
-- Episode 7 -- Welp, episode's about over......and there goes Lysa.
-- Episode 8 -- Welp, looks like the Viper's going to win ...... and there goes his face.
They are saving the best for the last episode this season.
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What a dumbfuck way to start a post.
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The battle scenes were really well done. I started laughing at Olly's head nod after the kill shot, which probably wasn't the reaction they were going for.
I came out of the episode a little disappointed though -- I think it was because there wasn't a huge twist at the end of the episode like the previous 2
-- Episode 7 -- Welp, episode's about over......and there goes Lysa.
-- Episode 8 -- Welp, looks like the Viper's going to win ...... and there goes his face.
They are saving the best for the last episode this season.
The last episode will be the twistiest episode of the entire series, based on some rumors about its content.
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:lol:
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The battle scenes were really well done. I started laughing at Olly's head nod after the kill shot, which probably wasn't the reaction they were going for.
I came out of the episode a little disappointed though -- I think it was because there wasn't a huge twist at the end of the episode like the previous 2
-- Episode 7 -- Welp, episode's about over......and there goes Lysa.
-- Episode 8 -- Welp, looks like the Viper's going to win ...... and there goes his face.
They are saving the best for the last episode this season.
keep this crap in the book/show thread (where i have moved it).
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I can't even keep the discussions straight with 'clams moving posts around all willy nilly like.
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it is really confusing.
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I mean, we're being quite careful not to post spoilers. We're just trying to fill in the logical voids that the show leaves due to time and budgetary restrictions.
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this is a spoiler-
They are saving the best for the last episode this season.
how is this hard to figure out for some of you clods?
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this is a spoiler- They are saving the best for the last episode this season.
how is this hard to figure out for some of you clods?
Why don't you tell me what is going to happen in the last episode then?
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this is a spoiler- They are saving the best for the last episode this season.
how is this hard to figure out for some of you clods?
Why don't you tell me what is going to happen in the last episode then?
how about i just sit there and wait for whatever big is going to happen because i know something big is going to happen because mrs gooch said it was?
"there's no way joffrey let's ned go, mrs gooch said something huge was going to happen. oh, there it is, his head is gone. thanks mrs gooch"
just stay out of that thread since you can't help yourself but try to be the all knowing book reader. is it really that difficult?
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I liked it. It was just like she did it in the book.
She killed the Tickler in the book (who is now already dead in the show, killed by Jakken) not Raff the Sweetling, who should still be alive at that point in the books. Also, she goes all postal in the books and isn't so cool and collected as in the show.
Still, that scene was really satisfying.
Yeah, I had actually completely forgotten how that scene went down in the books. That was about 3000 pages ago. It was perfect, regardless. The show does a lot of things better than the books did them.
100% disagree...the show is great, but it misses a lot of connections that the books setup for later.
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I liked it. It was just like she did it in the book.
She killed the Tickler in the book (who is now already dead in the show, killed by Jakken) not Raff the Sweetling, who should still be alive at that point in the books. Also, she goes all postal in the books and isn't so cool and collected as in the show.
Still, that scene was really satisfying.
Yeah, I had actually completely forgotten how that scene went down in the books. That was about 3000 pages ago. It was perfect, regardless. The show does a lot of things better than the books did them.
100% disagree...the show is great, but it misses a lot of connections that the books setup for later.
rough ridin' idiot
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this is a spoiler- They are saving the best for the last episode this season.
how is this hard to figure out for some of you clods?
Why don't you tell me what is going to happen in the last episode then?
how about i just sit there and wait for whatever big is going to happen because i know something big is going to happen because mrs gooch said it was?
"there's no way joffrey let's ned go, mrs gooch said something huge was going to happen. oh, there it is, his head is gone. thanks mrs gooch"
just stay out of that thread since you can't help yourself but try to be the all knowing book reader. is it really that difficult?
:bawl:
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'lams's being really mean, you guys.
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I took coldhands to be benjen when I read it
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So, for you readers, do you think the last thing they do tonight is deal with Tywin, or do you think they'll do it sooner and then play out Tyrion's trip across the narrow sea and even have him meet up with Jorah as a cliff hanger?
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I want it to be the former, just for entertainment on social media.
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Supposedly zombie cat and bloodraven are tonight too. The creators think this is the best episode so far, so I'm pretty pumped
I think tywin will happen about midway through and then tyrion on a ship as one of the last few scenes. I'm betting bran stuff is the final scene
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Wait, zombie cat will probably be the last scene
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Tyrion covers some important plot points before he gets to Jorah. I don't think they'll go much past his trip across the narrow sea if that. Maybe his meet up with Illyrio max.
I wasn't a fan of the zombie cat plot line so far in the books. Why the eff are those dumbshits following her anyway? She's the former wife of a rough ridin' dunce and her eldest son was a rough ridin' dunce too. Hardly qualifies her for command. She would also have to be mostly if not totally insane. Silly. I hope they all get killed off in short order going forward.
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Another rumor going around is someone that hasn't died in the books yet will die tonight :runaway:
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Tyrion covers some important plot points before he gets to Jorah. I don't think they'll go much past his trip across the narrow sea if that. Maybe his meet up with Illyrio max.
I wasn't a fan of the zombie cat plot line so far in the books. Why the eff are those dumbshits following her anyway? She's the former wife of a rough ridin' dunce and her eldest son was a rough ridin' dunce too. Hardly qualifies her for command. She would also have to be mostly if not totally insane. Silly. I hope they all get killed off in short order going forward.
Zombie cat is extremely annoying and probably the worst part of the series. At least given what we know.
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Inferences:
So, Jojen is dead. It was speculated that Jojen's blood was mixed into the weirwood paste that Bran eats in the last chapter he was in in ADoD, and thats how he got the Green sight... confirmed?
The Hound doesn't die, so that was him at the Quiet Isle.
Also:
How are they going to cut out the Tyrion's first wife confession?
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Also, i'm watching Kit Harington and Ciaran Hinds in the replay toast to the dead and making shitty chit chat and getting pissed at how rushed the last 20 minutes was because they tried to jam to much into this episode, plus no Stoneheart.
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idiot
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idiot
:ROFL:
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The lack of the Tysha story kind of lowered the drama of Tywin/Tyrion, though I can't say I'll miss where do whores go all next season.
Leaf throwing fireballs was pretty unintentionally lolly.
Dany locking up the dragons was well done and pretty sad. Also thought the final scene of Arya and the Hound was very good.
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Tywin's death was so poorly done. Biggest eff up to date. That was a huge disservice to Dinklage and Dance. Rory McCann tho!
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Dance and Dinklage could have brought the house down and won every award. Nope, "I am your son".
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SOMEBODY BE ANGRY WITH ME
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When i saw there was 20 minute left in the episode before they'd cut to Arya or Tyrion, i was visibly concerned... the show seems to plow through really important scenes and draw out scenes in between the text. They could have cut Tysha back in if rough ridin' Kit Harrington would quit rough ridin' toasting the dead and hogging the episode.
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Cutting the Jaime/ Cersei scene would have been best. I also agree that there was too much time devoted to the wall. Let Stannis show up and beat the wildlings, Jon gives him advice, show the funeral pyres and table the story line. I'm not mad that Lady Stoneheart hasn't appeared yet. All the episode needed was a few free minutes to build the Tyrion conflict a little more. It felt so forced. I want to have discussions with several show-only people to gauge their reactions.
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Cutting the Jaime/ Cersei scene would have been best. I also agree that there was too much time devoted to the wall. Let Stannis show up and beat the wildlings, Jon gives him advice, show the funeral pyres and table the story line. I'm not mad that Lady Stoneheart hasn't appeared yet. All the episode needed was a few free minutes to build the Tyrion conflict a little more. It felt so forced. I want to have discussions with several show-only people to gauge their reactions.
I agree with all of this
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That said, the Brienne v. Hound battle was a nice invention to bring the show back in line with the books. I thought Rory McCann did an excellent job throughout that. Arya and the Hound was a very well done story arch.
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That said, the Brienne v. Hound battle was a nice invention to bring the show back in line with the books. I thought Rory McCann did an excellent job throughout that. Arya and the Hound was a very well done story arch.
Yea I imagine the show only people are pretty pissed she left him to die
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I am a bit surprised that they started on zombie Mountain, if they didn't touch on Zombie Kat. Apparently the TV writers see that as more important to the future plot.
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Yes, I was a bit disappointed in the Tywin death scene.
At the very beginning of the last Arya scene, when they first just showed the river, I thought it was going to be Nymeria pulling Cat out of the river.
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So Bran's storyline is caught up to the books. So there's going to be a bunch of new stuff for him in Season 5, right?
Also, shouldn't Bloodraven have been missing an eye?
P.S. Rogues comes out tomorrow which features another prequel short story by GRRM.
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Jojen dying was dumb. It basically tells me he'll offer nothing in the future books.
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Also, I was looking forward to some Coldhands, but nope.
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I think Gleganebowl is a sure thing now, maybe only in the show. Hopefully in the books too.
People have been speculating that Jojen has been dead for a while. Bran eats some nasty paste in Blood Raven's cave that seems like there is blood in it and he ends up with green sight.
I didn't expect Coldhands to show up, so I wasn't mad about it. I'm unsure of his identity, but having him appear on screen would probably ruin his later book reveal for the readers.
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I think Gleganebowl is a sure thing now, maybe only in the show. Hopefully in the books too.
People have been speculating that Jojen has been dead for a while. Bran eats some nasty paste in Blood Raven's cave that seems like there is blood in it and he ends up with green sight.
I didn't expect Coldhands to show up, so I wasn't mad about it. I'm unsure of his identity, but having him appear on screen would probably ruin his later book reveal for the readers.
I think this is guaranteed in the books... should we take this to a new thread to be mad about the TV show spoiling the books?
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Do you think they decided to hurry Bran's story along because he is going to look like a full grown adult by the time they start filming next season?
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Do you think they decided to hurry Bran's story along because he is going to look like a full grown adult by the time they start filming next season?
I suppose it will be a lot easier to mask that with him hooked up to a tree. I wish they would Blood Raven correctly. Do you think that was a CGI budget issue or a don't disturb show only people thing?
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I'm acquiring the armenian version of Rogues as we speak. I will report back once I have read it.
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Do you think they decided to hurry Bran's story along because he is going to look like a full grown adult by the time they start filming next season?
I suppose it will be a lot easier to mask that with him hooked up to a tree. I wish they would Blood Raven correctly. Do you think that was a CGI budget issue or a don't disturb show only people thing?
I think they didn't want him to be too weird/creepy.
When he said that he sees with a thousand eyes and one...Do the show people get that? Was there any reference to that in the show? Was it even mentioned in the main books? Seems like I only remember it from Dunk & Egg.
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Do you think they decided to hurry Bran's story along because he is going to look like a full grown adult by the time they start filming next season?
I suppose it will be a lot easier to mask that with him hooked up to a tree. I wish they would Blood Raven correctly. Do you think that was a CGI budget issue or a don't disturb show only people thing?
I think they didn't want him to be too weird/creepy.
When he said that he sees with a thousand eyes and one...Do the show people get that? Was there any reference to that in the show? Was it even mentioned in the main books? Seems like I only remember it from Dunk & Egg.
That easter egg was for people who have read the Dunk & Egg stories only.
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Do you think they decided to hurry Bran's story along because he is going to look like a full grown adult by the time they start filming next season?
I suppose it will be a lot easier to mask that with him hooked up to a tree. I wish they would Blood Raven correctly. Do you think that was a CGI budget issue or a don't disturb show only people thing?
I think they didn't want him to be too weird/creepy.
When he said that he sees with a thousand eyes and one...Do the show people get that? Was there any reference to that in the show? Was it even mentioned in the main books? Seems like I only remember it from Dunk & Egg.
That easter egg was for people who have read the Dunk & Egg stories only.
I also noticed at least two references to Ser Duncan the Tall in the first season.
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I don't remember those references.
@seven: so who do you think is the faith militant's grave digger then? a red herring?
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Wut
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Oh, the hound stuff. I dunno. Prolly zombie hound
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CleganeBowl is going to happen, dude. The Undead Robert Strong vs. Evangelical Sandor.
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I have no idea what you're talking about, I've read 400 pages of book 1 and Wikipedia for major points.
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The Hound totally didn't die, they wouldn't have made both scenes (book and TV) so ambiguous for no reason... GRRM is just misdirecting is he says otherwise.
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Also, in the books, Bran drank Jojen paste
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The Rogue Prince is probably GRRM's shortest novella yet. It is a prequel, of sorts, to The Princess and The Queen. It describes Daemon Targaryen's role creating the rivalries that led to The Dance of Dragons. It's pretty short. I didn't find it to be that enjoyable of a read.
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i do not remember jojen dying at all. that last book was a pretty big blur for me
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i do not remember jojen dying at all. that last book was a pretty big blur for me
It's never explicitly stated, but they get to the cave and you never read about him again, then Bran eats this paste stuff that looks like it has blood in it and he ends up with the green sight.
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GleganeBowl is going to happen, dude. The Undead Robert Strong vs. Evangelical Sandor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FGT7NzqDRU
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CleganeBowl is going to happen, dude. The Undead Robert Strong vs. Evangelical Sandor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FGT7NzqDRU
:billdance:
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I don't think Arya is yet to the point where she can kill out of anything but blind hate or true self-defense, therefore she didn't have the guts to kill the Hound. :th_twocents:
Wrong.
Compelling argument.
Arya specifically chose not to kill the Hound; it wasn't because she couldn't do it.
I'm just going off the books. Even with the benefit of a character's inner monologue, her motivations are far from clear, so it's certainly not a black/white issue, especially since Arya isn't very consistent with her actions as it is. Later, she realizes she has no monies and regrets not killing him and robbing him.
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Kit Harington cut his hair. :frown:
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good
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good
Pete, fetch me a block.
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Kit Harington cut his hair. :frown:
Noooooooooo!
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good
Pete, fetch me a block.
On it.
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Kit Harington cut his hair. :frown:
Hope the books and show vary widely quickly, then. really thought I had the book figured out with him and was pretty excited about it.
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Kit Harington cut his hair. :frown:
Hope the books and show vary widely quickly, then. really thought I had the book figured out with him and was pretty excited about it.
What is it that you thought you had figured out?
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Is this a spoilers thread?
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Is this a spoilers thread?
I think it is ok to post any insight you may have gained from reading the books since the thread title indicates this thread is for people who like the show and the books.
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Mrs. G, have you read the Rogue Prince yet? I remember you saying you read The Princess and the Queen on a scale of 1 to 5 lemon cakes, how many would you rate it?
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Mrs. G, have you read the Rogue Prince yet? I remember you saying you read The Princess and the Queen on a scale of 1 to 5 lemon cakes, how many would you rate it?
No, I haven't read the Rogue Prince. I only read the novellas when I can find them at the library...so I just put a hold request on that one.
The Princess and the Queen was pretty good. I give it 4 lemon cakes.
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I wonder what major character will die next? :dunno:
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I wonder what major character will die next? :dunno:
Have you read the books?
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I wonder what major character will die next? :dunno:
Have you read the books?
Nope. I hate reading. I'm too impatient. I need lous noises and pictures to keep me entertained. :D
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I wonder what major character will die next? :dunno:
Have you read the books?
Nope. I hate reading. I'm too impatient. I need lous noises and pictures to keep me entertained. :D
Probably in the wrong thread then fann man (there are 3, because GOT needs 3)
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Gotcha. Looks like the show starts back up on April 12th. :driving:
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Gotcha. Looks like the show starts back up on April 12th. :driving:
Go take your speculations on who is the next death to the show only thread so we can ridicule you in this thread. :ROFL:
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:shakesfist:
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:shakesfist:
Did you see my edit? :D
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:thumbs:
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Is this a spoilers thread?
I think it is ok to post any insight you may have gained from reading the books since the thread title indicates this thread is for people who like the show and the books.
I think we have discussed it in the other thread, but I thought Jon was the red lady's new horse and she planned to resolve the issue that jon had last we read about him and help him rise. Also, that he was a targaryenn and that the story would bend him and Dany together and against the powers that be
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Is this a spoilers thread?
I think it is ok to post any insight you may have gained from reading the books since the thread title indicates this thread is for people who like the show and the books.
I think we have discussed it in the other thread, but I thought Jon was the red lady's new horse and she planned to resolve the issue that jon had last we read about him and help him rise. Also, that he was a targaryenn and that the story would bend him and Dany together and against the powers that be
Yeah, I thought (or hoped at least) it would be Jon, Dany, and Aegon riding the 3 dragons. How long does it take dragons to get to ridable size?
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So because he got a haircut that can't happen?
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So because he got a haircut that can't happen?
He has a contract to not cut his hair as long as he is on the show. If he cut it then Jon Snow is dead. :bawl:
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So because he got a haircut that can't happen?
He has a contract to not cut his hair as long as he is on the show. If he cut it then Jon Snow is dead. :bawl:
Maybe that's just what they want you to think.
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Kit Harington is playing you all for fools.
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He actually did not cut it that short.
(https://usatlife.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/kit-harington-jon-snow.jpg?w=1000&h=786)
I think he could grow it back out to Jon Snow length by the time filming for the next reason starts up.
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Kit Harington is playing you all for fools.
He must have gotten permission to cut it; so it is the HBO producers who are playing us, not Kit Harington.
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They all are, Kit included. Laughing in everybody else's fat faces.
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Yeah, it's super possible that he gets red-lady'ed and comes back with a short do, or something.
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Sort-of-zombies can have shorter hair imo. If he makes it he's going to be pretty roughed up going forward. Could just be part of it.
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i don't remember him getting red lady'd. i thought he got stabbed by the bros
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i don't remember him getting red lady'd. i thought he got stabbed by the bros
Yeah, he did but people are suggesting that the red lady saves him...I think. Or that somehow that was not really Jon...like she did with Mance.
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well it was definitely him because that happens in his POV. but he could survive. i mean he could have just blacked out. i personally am more intrigued with Brienne's exit
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I hate the zombie storylines. They're trash.
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I hate the zombie storylines. They're trash.
i agree it seems like lazy writing by a big fat lazy person. On the other hand, the big overaching theme of the story is "winter is coming" and it is full of zombies :dunno:
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I've always hoped that he blacked out and went unconscious due to the severity of the injury. A Stark who was viciously stabbed in the leg did previously as did a Lannister when his hand was chopped off.
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All the stabs prob just missed his body and his his hair.
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All the stabs prob just missed his body and hit his hair.
LOL. That's what my co-worker suggested.
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Book cliffhangers are cheap and whoreish. Shame on that fat slob.
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Mrs. G, have you read the Rogue Prince yet? I remember you saying you read The Princess and the Queen on a scale of 1 to 5 lemon cakes, how many would you rate it?
No, I haven't read the Rogue Prince. I only read the novellas when I can find them at the library...so I just put a hold request on that one.
The Princess and the Queen was pretty good. I give it 4 lemon cakes.
I read the Rogue Prince, it was very good. I think it made it even more interesting because I had already read The Princess and the Queen and wanted the history to that story.
Also, the compilation book Rogues it was in included a story by Gillian Flynn about a girl who gives handjobs for a living, so that was an unexpected bonus.
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I started the first book last night! :excited:
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Oh man! Pretty jelly of you.
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that S05 trailer is one sexy SOB
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Glad to see these threads are getting warmed back up. Gets me excited for the new season.
Just a reminder of the apparent usage of each thread tho.
Show thread: Exclusively for show discussion and since apparently book is synonymous with spoiler over there it's probably best to avoid posting in it if you've read the books. Very fun to read "theories" over there and laugh.
Book thread: Primarily book discussion. Probably not going to need dusted off until George "I hate my fans" Martin finally finishes another book.
This thread: Used to compare/contrast the show and book, discuss how new "discoveries" from the show affect the books, and overall just laugh at show only people who think they have everything figured out. Show spoilers are welcome in here so if you don't want to see those, probably should avoid this thread.
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So do Bran and Jon Snow end up Warging the eff out of two of the dragons some day, and Daenerys Targaryen rides the other one, and that's how they win the battle against the white walkers and stuff? I vote yes.
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Sure. I'd watch that.
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Not gonna lie Pete, the wording there reminds me a little of what the porno remake description would sound like
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So Mance Rayder gave a very cool and collected last couple of words before being dispatched by fire and arrows.
The kind of speech someone like rattleshirt couldn't have made, nor would have had any motivation to, even if he wasn't largely absent from the show after being introduced.
Did we witness a rather large departure from the books or do you still think they'll say it was all a big switch-aroo?
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There are some stories online about how there was a shocking death and it is a departure from the book...but I don't think we know yet whether it is a departure from the book.
I agree about his speech - during it I was thinking "He shouldn't he talking so much because that doesn't make sense if he is that other guy." (I couldn't remember who it was exactly that had taken Mance's place.)
Also, I think Jon Snow shot him because he is compassionate and didn't want him to suffer - not because he thought it would help him later (although it will) or at least not as the main motivation.
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What do you guys think of the changes from the book to the show, especially in this last episode?
Sansa is going to marry Ramsey....Is she going to have to endure Joffery-style torture or worse? Does Littlefinger not know about Ramsey's cruelty or is he just willing to subject Sansa to that possibility?
Brienne and Pod following Sansa...
Tommen and Margaery had sex...
Jaime going to Dorne...
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What do you guys think of the changes from the book to the show, especially in this last episode?
Sansa is going to marry Ramsey....Is she going to have to endure Joffery-style torture or worse? Does Littlefinger not know about Ramsey's cruelty or is he just willing to subject Sansa to that possibility?
Brienne and Pod following Sansa...
Tommen and Margaery had sex...
Jaime going to Dorne...
I think it might make for better television.
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What do you guys think of the changes from the book to the show, especially in this last episode?
Sansa is going to marry Ramsey....Is she going to have to endure Joffery-style torture or worse? Does Littlefinger not know about Ramsey's cruelty or is he just willing to subject Sansa to that possibility?
Brienne and Pod following Sansa...
Tommen and Margaery had sex...
Jaime going to Dorne...
I think it might make for better television.
Cutting out Jamie's trip through the Riverlands makes sense, but who gets to play the role of Aerys Oakheart when they get to Dorne?
What if Brienne plays the role of Mance in Winterfell helping Sansa escape?
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-Jamie going to Dorne makes sense. It looks like they have the giant axe bodyguard guy still, which is good (can't remember his name from the book)
-Sansa marrying Ramsay is terrifying, so in that sense it's good for the book readers i guess
other stuff:
-peter dinklage continues to be absolutely incredible
-the sand snakes made me roll my eyes because it appears they went for a michelle rodriguez 2fast2furious look
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areo hotah ^
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Do you think that girlfriend of Ramsey's is going to come into play? Is she going to be a thorn in Sansa's side? Thwart her plans for revenge? Help Ramsey torture Sansa?
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The whole Winterfell situation will be interesting. I think the final outcome will be fairly similar (Theon escaping with Fake Arya/Sansa) but how they get there will have to deviate.
I'm a little disappointed, though not surprised, they cut out Tyrion on the riverboat. I thought that could have been pretty cool to show.
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Is Tyrion still going to meet up with that girl dwarf or do you think they will cut that out too?
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Is Tyrion still going to meet up with that girl dwarf or do you think they will cut that out too?
They will cut that. I wouldn't be surprised if they cut the whole slavery thing, too. It's too bad that they have to make these changes, but it's understandable.
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Is Tyrion still going to meet up with that girl dwarf or do you think they will cut that out too?
They will cut that. I wouldn't be surprised if they cut the whole slavery thing, too. It's too bad that they have to make these changes, but it's understandable.
If they do that, the Jorah story line will also be completely different, which will severely effect the relationship btwn him and Danny, which seems like is going to end up being very important. :dunno:
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The books and show will probably end up in the same place, but everything in between is going to be completely different. GRRM has the advantage of getting to watch the show first, so I'm sure his version will end up better.
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Glad to see these threads are getting warmed back up. Gets me excited for the new season.
Just a reminder of the apparent usage of each thread tho.
Show thread: Exclusively for show discussion and since apparently book is synonymous with spoiler over there it's probably best to avoid posting in it if you've read the books. Very fun to read "theories" over there and laugh.
Book thread: Primarily book discussion. Probably not going to need dusted off until George "I hate my fans" Martin finally finishes another book.
This thread: Used to compare/contrast the show and book, discuss how new "discoveries" from the show affect the books, and overall just laugh at show only people who think they have everything figured out. Show spoilers are welcome in here so if you don't want to see those, probably should avoid this thread.
or just do what you want
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Glad to see these threads are getting warmed back up. Gets me excited for the new season.
Just a reminder of the apparent usage of each thread tho.
Show thread: Exclusively for show discussion and since apparently book is synonymous with spoiler over there it's probably best to avoid posting in it if you've read the books. Very fun to read "theories" over there and laugh.
Book thread: Primarily book discussion. Probably not going to need dusted off until George "I hate my fans" Martin finally finishes another book.
This thread: Used to compare/contrast the show and book, discuss how new "discoveries" from the show affect the books, and overall just laugh at show only people who think they have everything figured out. Show spoilers are welcome in here so if you don't want to see those, probably should avoid this thread.
or just do what you want
Yeah, eff you if you think I am going to stay out of the show thread.
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Glad to see these threads are getting warmed back up. Gets me excited for the new season.
Just a reminder of the apparent usage of each thread tho.
Show thread: Exclusively for show discussion and since apparently book is synonymous with spoiler over there it's probably best to avoid posting in it if you've read the books. Very fun to read "theories" over there and laugh.
Book thread: Primarily book discussion. Probably not going to need dusted off until George "I hate my fans" Martin finally finishes another book.
This thread: Used to compare/contrast the show and book, discuss how new "discoveries" from the show affect the books, and overall just laugh at show only people who think they have everything figured out. Show spoilers are welcome in here so if you don't want to see those, probably should avoid this thread.
or just do what you want
Yeah, eff you if you think I am going to stay out of the show thread.
Yea, I won't stay out of it either. Just don't type the word book.
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OK, so they cut Aegon out of the show, right? Tyrion was traveling with him before he was captured by Jorah, right?....I am just trying to remember the order of things in the book...
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OK, so they cut Aegon out of the show, right? Tyrion was traveling with him before he was captured by Jorah, right?....I am just trying to remember the order of things in the book...
That is correct. As of now the show has no plans to introduce that character. Thankfully.
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OK, so they cut Aegon out of the show, right? Tyrion was traveling with him before he was captured by Jorah, right?....I am just trying to remember the order of things in the book...
That is correct. As of now the show has no plans to introduce that character. Thankfully.
Assuming that Victarion and Euron Greyjoy have been cut too.
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Yeah. I wish the show would have been one season longer so they wouldn't have had to cut as much.
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OK, so they cut Aegon out of the show, right? Tyrion was traveling with him before he was captured by Jorah, right?....I am just trying to remember the order of things in the book...
That is correct. As of now the show has no plans to introduce that character. Thankfully.
Assuming that Victarion and Euron Greyjoy have been cut too.
Okay, this is what hacks me off the most.
The whole Greyjoy arc in the books has been really enjoyable for me, and I love this whole storyline. To not see it in the show kills me.
And what does everyone have against Aegon? I mean he's going to be a big part of the story (presumably).
I mean, they effectively merged the whole Jon Connington/Jorah Mormont storylines and the Doom of Valarya/River attack scenes, right? Isn't that basically what happened the other night?
Oh, and killing Barristan Selmy was weak. Stupid.
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The show's been a lot more bold at giving things away recently than I expected:
R+L=J
- In the books, only Ned and Howland Reed knew the true origins. In the show, at a minimum, Littlefinger, Stannis, and Melissandre seem to know.
The Hound isn't necessarily dead. The possibility of a Clegane / Clegane deathmatch lives on. :emawkid:
WTF is going on with Dorne? They have to keep the number of characters lower than the books, but Jamie and Bronn both in Dorne and both still alive after the rescue attempt?
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The show's been a lot more bold at giving things away recently than I expected:
R+L=J
- In the books, only Ned and Howland Reed knew the true origins. In the show, at a minimum, Littlefinger, Stannis, and Melissandre seem to know.
The Hound isn't necessarily dead. The possibility of a Clegane / Clegane deathmatch lives on. :emawkid:
WTF is going on with Dorne? They have to keep the number of characters lower than the books, but Jamie and Bronn both in Dorne and both still alive after the rescue attempt?
Bronn is dead. Got cut.
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So in the book Margeary gets arrested by the faith, but it is because they think she was having an affair...which later gets refuted. So how is she going to get out of it now that her arrest is because she lied - and since that guy described Loras's birthmark it is pretty clear he is telling the truth? Are they just going to say that the squire could have seen the birthmark when he was helping Loras dress?
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The Ramsey/Sansa thing in the show is stupid.
I've really grown to dislike the show. Like a lot.
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So in the book Margeary gets arrested by the faith, but it is because they think she was having an affair...which later gets refuted. So how is she going to get out of it now that her arrest is because she lied - and since that guy described Loras's birthmark it is pretty clear he is telling the truth? Are they just going to say that the squire could have seen the birthmark when he was helping Loras dress?
Assuming Lady Olenna arranges to have the squire killed to avoid testimony at trial.
How is Cersei going to get trapped? The Kettleblacks aren't in the show and it seems a little late for her to get tripped up by Lancel's confessions.
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The Ramsey/Sansa thing in the show is stupid.
I've really grown to dislike the show. Like a lot.
I can't figure out how they are going to get this part of the story back on track with the books, and if they don't, then what's the rough ridin' point of it, ya know? I don't dislike the show, I just love the books.
I need to go back and re-read the books (I have never re-read a book before), but I had been waiting to do this until the next book is released. I am rusty on so much of it. I spend half the show going "was that in the book???" Dorne stuff has me really confused, for example.
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So in the book Margeary gets arrested by the faith, but it is because they think she was having an affair...which later gets refuted. So how is she going to get out of it now that her arrest is because she lied - and since that guy described Loras's birthmark it is pretty clear he is telling the truth? Are they just going to say that the squire could have seen the birthmark when he was helping Loras dress?
Assuming Lady Olenna arranges to have the squire killed to avoid testimony at trial.
How is Cersei going to get trapped? The Kettleblacks aren't in the show and it seems a little late for her to get tripped up by Lancel's confessions.
They could always reveal her incest with Jaime, but that would have a lot of far reaching consequences (like un-legitimatizing Tommen)....Wasn't she screwing anyone besides Lancel while Jaime was gone on the show?
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Lancel will come clean.
Also there are some theories that the high sparrow is howland reed
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Lancel will come clean.
Also there are some theories that the high sparrow is howland reed
Remind me who Howland Reed is?
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Lancel will come clean.
Also there are some theories that the high sparrow is howland reed
I like that theory, but I'm not sure how it fits age wise -- Howland was at the Tower of Joy with Ned fighting off the Kingsguard but the High Sparrow looks older than Barristan Selmy.
My favorite theory is that Jaq'en Hagar is Sylvio Forel and that Arya heading to the Faceless Men was put in motion when her water dancing started.
e.t.a. - Howland Reed is Meera and Jojen's father -- supposedly the only person other than Ned who would know that Jon Snow is Rhaegar Targaryan and Lyanna Stark's son.
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Lancel will come clean.
Also there are some theories that the high sparrow is howland reed
I like that theory, but I'm not sure how it fits age wise -- Howland was at the Tower of Joy with Ned fighting off the Kingsguard but the High Sparrow looks older than Barristan Selmy.
My favorite theory is that Jaq'en Hagar is Sylvio Forel and that Arya heading to the Faceless Men was put in motion when her water dancing started.
e.t.a. - Howland Reed is Meera and Jojen's father -- supposedly the only person other than Ned who would know that Jon Snow is Rhaegar Targaryan and Lyanna Stark's son.
wait what
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so Tyrion and Dany get a face to face, that's pretty neat.
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Howland is doing a damn good job pretending to be a devout worshiper of the seven, if he is indeed the high sparrow.
mocat, you've never heard R+L=J before?
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mocat, you've never heard R+L=J before?
:frown:
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So in the book Margeary gets arrested by the faith, but it is because they think she was having an affair...which later gets refuted. So how is she going to get out of it now that her arrest is because she lied - and since that guy described Loras's birthmark it is pretty clear he is telling the truth? Are they just going to say that the squire could have seen the birthmark when he was helping Loras dress?
Assuming Lady Olenna arranges to have the squire killed to avoid testimony at trial.
How is Cersei going to get trapped? The Kettleblacks aren't in the show and it seems a little late for her to get tripped up by Lancel's confessions.
They could always reveal her incest with Jaime, but that would have a lot of far reaching consequences (like un-legitimatizing Tommen)....Wasn't she screwing anyone besides Lancel while Jaime was gone on the show?
Moon Boy, probably
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mocat, you've never heard R+L=J before?
:frown:
are you about to go down the research wormhole?
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So in the book Margeary gets arrested by the faith, but it is because they think she was having an affair...which later gets refuted. So how is she going to get out of it now that her arrest is because she lied - and since that guy described Loras's birthmark it is pretty clear he is telling the truth? Are they just going to say that the squire could have seen the birthmark when he was helping Loras dress?
Assuming Lady Olenna arranges to have the squire killed to avoid testimony at trial.
How is Cersei going to get trapped? The Kettleblacks aren't in the show and it seems a little late for her to get tripped up by Lancel's confessions.
They could always reveal her incest with Jaime, but that would have a lot of far reaching consequences (like un-legitimatizing Tommen)....Wasn't she screwing anyone besides Lancel while Jaime was gone on the show?
Moon Boy, probably
:D
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mocat, you've never heard R+L=J before?
:frown:
Yeah, really surprised if you have never heard this.
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You assholes just book spoilered mocat, I hope you're proud of yourselves
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You assholes just book spoilered mocat, I hope you're proud of yourselves
R+L=J is pure speculation. Nobody spoiled anything.
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How does everyone feel about the show seemingly speeding up and over contents just to get out in front of the books? At least thats what it seems like to me. Why cut so much? You could include it and just embellish the crap out of things to make it more interesting if you don't think it plays well on screen.
I, for one, don't care for it.
:don'tcare:
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it doesn't matter. that fat idiot is never going to finish it before he dies.
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Wait! These books aren't even finished yet?!
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Next thing you know, the author is going to die and they'll be having Ashton Kutcher play his part. :frown:
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Next thing you know, the author is going to die and they'll be having Ashton Kutcher play his part. :frown:
wtf
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Next thing you know, the author is going to die and they'll be having Ashton Kutcher play his part. :frown:
wtf
It was a Steve Jobs reference for that awful movie about him and the soon to be movie made about this guys inspiration for GOT's. Duh.
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Wait! These books aren't even finished yet?!
You are not supposed to be in this thread.
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Next thing you know, the author is going to die and they'll be having Ashton Kutcher play his part. :frown:
wtf
Is was a Steve JObs reference for that awful movie about him and the soon to be movie made about this guys inspiration for GOT's. Duh.
alright
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Wacky, go start a Clifford the Big Red Dog thread for people who enjoy both the show and books and GTFOOH.
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:sdeek: :lol:
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How does everyone feel about the show seemingly speeding up and over contents just to get out in front of the books? At least thats what it seems like to me. Why cut so much? You could include it and just embellish the crap out of things to make it more interesting if you don't think it plays well on screen.
I, for one, don't care for it.
:don'tcare:
I want to bail on the show, but my wife doesn't want to watch it by herself. It's a weird conundrum.
When Tyrion met Dany, I didn't really know how to react because that event has been building in the books, but never happened after Dany rode Drogon out of Mereen. So, I'm not sure if they're just skipping that part or what.
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oh yeah they are just going to skip the queen flying out of a gladiator melee on the back of a dragon scene
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Man, the Dorne stuff on the show is just awful. It wasn't great in the books either, but its just a mess in the show.
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What in the eff is going on? They are freaking flying into uncharted waters now. This thing is off the book's rails. They have to kill Jon Snow ASAP, but I bet they now wait for the last episode of the season.
I am growing convinced that George doesn't bother to finish the books.
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I mean, the joy of this series, for me, was that it appeared to be a fairly faithful treatment of the book. Now, the show is both taking liberties with the story AND moving the plot past what has been written.
I am in mourning.
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my favorite speculation is jon dies end of next episode, then in 10 stannis dies and red lady does her prayer to raise stannis but it raises jon instead for end of season cliffhanger
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oh the good stuff is coming Pete, I promise, and it's going to be awesome!
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It's quite interesting to watch Pete have the freak out that I thought I would this season. Surprisingly, I don't mind where the show is headed. It has been good television.
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I want to see Cersei's walk of shame....I think that will be episode 10 based on the episode title but who knows.
Maybe Brienne is going to rescue Sansa while Ramsey is out killing Stannis's group.
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oh yeah they are just going to skip the queen flying out of a gladiator melee on the back of a dragon scene
The next episode is titled "The Dance of Dragons", so maybe it will still happen.
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oh yeah they are just going to skip the queen flying out of a gladiator melee on the back of a dragon scene
The next episode is titled "The Dance of Dragons", so maybe it will still happen.
ehh...
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Any of you read Wheel of Time? Started out awesome, then the author went crazy and bogged the story down with too many boring characters and irrelevant subplots, then the author up and died before finishing it. Is that where ASoFaI is headed?
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Any of you read Wheel of Time? Started out awesome, then the author went crazy and bogged the story down with too many boring characters and irrelevant subplots, then the author up and died before finishing it. Is that where ASoFaI is headed?
Yes, some of the middle books were tedious ("She folded her arms beneath her breasts" must have appeared in the books 100 times), but I liked the ending which was finished by a different author....maybe GRRM dying would be the best thing of ASoFaI.
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if the winds of winter was released today, i would start reading it but would need someone to recap the last thing that happened to every single character. it would be a tedious job, but i would pay well.
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Any of you read Wheel of Time? Started out awesome, then the author went crazy and bogged the story down with too many boring characters and irrelevant subplots, then the author up and died before finishing it. Is that where ASoFaI is headed?
Yes, some of the middle books were tedious ("She folded her arms beneath her breasts" must have appeared in the books 100 times), but I liked the ending which was finished by a different author....maybe GRRM dying would be the best thing of ASoFaI.
I agree that Sanderson did a remarkable job salvaging that series after RJ died. But it still read a bit like fan fiction at times. There was a lot of good stuff, and a lot of other things that just didn't seem to mesh with the overall body of work. In hindsight, it's easy to say that Wheel of Time would have been far better - maybe even the greatest fantasy series of all time - if RJ had kept the first four books exactly as is and then finished the series in another three. Instead he went batshit crazy.
Not to get too far off topic, but did you see the Wheel of Time "pilot" episode? It is one of the most gloriously campy, terrible things I've ever witnessed. Think Star Wars Christmas Special. Some company called Red Eagle Entertainment owns all the rights to WoT and had to get something produced and aired to keep the rights, so they slopped together a 30 minute "pilot" based on the prologue to Eye of the World and bought some infomercial time to air it. It's up on youtube.
Anyway, it's sad to see that ASoFaI may be listing the same way, but at least it spawned an amazing TV series.
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if the winds of winter was released today, i would start reading it but would need someone to recap the last thing that happened to every single character. it would be a tedious job, but i would pay well.
Jon may, or may not, have died, and moonboy, for all I know.
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no you would have to sit in the same room as me, and i would be reading and come across a character's name, and i would say it aloud and look at you with a puzzled look on my face, and you would be like "well the last time we saw so and so was..."
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what would you pay this person?
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Someone should just post ITT a list of the top 50 characters with an update. Maybe put it in premium. :dunno:
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Not to get too far off topic, but did you see the Wheel of Time "pilot" episode?
I just found this...I like the narrator of the audiobooks much better than the narrator at the beginning of this pilot...Also, Billy Zane is in it (and a producer) :surprised:...OK, back to watching it...
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Not to get too far off topic, but did you see the Wheel of Time "pilot" episode?
I just found this...I like the narrator of the audiobooks much better than the narrator at the beginning of this pilot...Also, Billy Zane is in it (and a producer) :surprised:...OK, back to watching it...
Yes, when Billy freakin' Zane pulls back the hood and gives the camera a wink, I just about lost it. :lol:
It's kine of like they didn't know how to stretch a 6-page prologue with minimal dialogue into a 30-minute pilot, so they just had Lew Therin yell ILYENA! for 20 minutes.
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I want to see Cersei's walk of shame....I think that will be episode 10 based on the episode title but who knows.
Maybe Brienne is going to rescue Sansa while Ramsey is out killing Stannis's group.
What if they just turn Sansa into Lady Stoneheart? Brienne would arrive too late, then get commanded to either go kill Jamie or find Bran and Rickon.
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catelyn died so long ago and we haven't seen the brotherhood without banners in so long that at this point if lady stoneheart shows up, people will just :rolleyes:
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it's too bad martin didn't finish the books before the show started
he's such a eff.
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catelyn died so long ago and we haven't seen the brotherhood without banners in so long that at this point if lady stoneheart shows up, people will just :rolleyes:
Maybe she could be resurrected by Melisandre, instead of Thoros....but still I don't see it going that way. I think there will be no Lady Stoneheart.
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catelyn died so long ago and we haven't seen the brotherhood without banners in so long that at this point if lady stoneheart shows up, people will just :rolleyes:
Catelyn's not coming back, but they could adapt Sansa into that role if she dies trying to escape the Boltons.
They've got to do something with resurrection tho -- otherwise there was no point to showing Thoros resurrect Beric Dondarrion in the show.
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Ramsay will kill stannis then go home and party until stannis is resurrected blowing everyones mind
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ramsey will kill sansa! :surprised:
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ramsey will kill sansa! :surprised:
Ramsey can't kill Sansa on purpose -- it would screw up his claim to Winterfell. Maybe he could accidentally kill her. I was going to say in a fit of rage, but he seems to have control of his emotions most of the time.
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i don't think it's going to be sansa. her wolf was named Lady tho! :surprised:
the part in the book when Brienne is being hanged and yells something out loud was a really intense part of the book, despite the fact that i do not particularly care about Brienne
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ramsey will kill sansa! :surprised:
Ramsey can't kill Sansa on purpose -- it would screw up his claim to Winterfell. Maybe he could accidentally kill her. I was going to say in a fit of rage, but he seems to have control of his emotions most of the time.
Sansa picked up a corkscrew or something a couple of episodes ago. Maybe Ramsay kills her in self defense.
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it's too bad martin didn't finish the books before the show started
he's such a eff.
I agree.
I still really enjoy the shows, and have loved the books...and I'll of course read the future books.
He morbidly talks about how if he dies no one can continue the book series. My guess is that George is a severely depressed alcoholic....I think he writes Tyrion as himself.
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Lady Stoneheart is probably out just because there are zero characters of interest in or around the riverlands, and no reason to think that will change, in the show.
Everyone talks about how disappointing it was that GRRM didn't get to introduce the battler for Hardhome, but i'm more upset about the Tyrion/Danny/Jorah scenes. The whole Jorah arc is just getting stupid and while i like Tyrion being witty and funny again, the whole storyline just seems thin. Jorah getting banished twice? Total snoozeville.
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it's too bad martin didn't finish the books before the show started
he's such a eff.
I agree.
I still really enjoy the shows, and have loved the books...and I'll of course read the future books.
He morbidly talks about how if he dies no one can continue the book series. My guess is that George is a severely depressed alcoholic....I think he writes Tyrion as himself.
He is tyrion, trapped in Sam's body, blessed with Pycell's flair for taut, concise prose
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Who was Pycell
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grand maester
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Who was Pycell
He's basically running the whole Seven Kingdoms right now.
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Lady Stoneheart is probably out just because there are zero characters of interest in or around the riverlands, and no reason to think that will change, in the show.
Everyone talks about how disappointing it was that GRRM didn't get to introduce the battler for Hardhome, but i'm more upset about the Tyrion/Danny/Jorah scenes. The whole Jorah arc is just getting stupid and while i like Tyrion being witty and funny again, the whole storyline just seems thin. Jorah getting banished twice? Total snoozeville.
What if Jorah winds up fighting Daario in the pits though? That could redeem the Jorah storyline somewhat.
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Lady Stoneheart is probably out just because there are zero characters of interest in or around the riverlands, and no reason to think that will change, in the show.
Everyone talks about how disappointing it was that GRRM didn't get to introduce the battler for Hardhome, but i'm more upset about the Tyrion/Danny/Jorah scenes. The whole Jorah arc is just getting stupid and while i like Tyrion being witty and funny again, the whole storyline just seems thin. Jorah getting banished twice? Total snoozeville.
What if Jorah winds up fighting Daario in the pits though? That could redeem the Jorah storyline somewhat.
"You may have bested my closest confidant in battle... But I still cannot have you by my side. Remove him from the city!". Snoozeville
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Lady Stoneheart is probably out just because there are zero characters of interest in or around the riverlands, and no reason to think that will change, in the show.
Everyone talks about how disappointing it was that GRRM didn't get to introduce the battler for Hardhome, but i'm more upset about the Tyrion/Danny/Jorah scenes. The whole Jorah arc is just getting stupid and while i like Tyrion being witty and funny again, the whole storyline just seems thin. Jorah getting banished twice? Total snoozeville.
What if Jorah winds up fighting Daario in the pits though? That could redeem the Jorah storyline somewhat.
"You may have bested my closest confidant in battle... But I still cannot have you by my side. Remove him from the city!". Snoozeville
The show should make it a running gag. Like what else can Jorah do and the Queen will STILL kick him out of town, THAT RASCAL JORAH!!!
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grantland had a good write up about the white walkers
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CB8QqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fgrantland.com%2Fhollywood-prospectus%2Fask-the-maester-the-origin-of-the-nights-king-the-wights-and-dragonglass%2F&ei=Tj9vVZ6gNsm5sAXWn4P4Cg&usg=AFQjCNH_oYr-Qg_PnHsz3SgrR7fPT0as2Q&sig2=f8lacfXtYd4hK2-wtR2Ezw&bvm=bv.94911696,d.b2w
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So you need dragonfire to make Valyrian steel but you can use any old forge to melt it down and make other weapons and it still has it's Valyrian steel properties?
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So you need dragonfire to make Valyrian steel but you can use any old forge to melt it down and make other weapons and it still has it's Valyrian steel properties?
In the books, it was about magic too, and the books make several mention to how since dragons had gone extinct magic was basically gone, but how crap like seemed to be returning(coincided with Danny and her dragons being born).
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http://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/06/01/g-r-r-martin-hopes-to-finish-the-winds-of-winter-before-game-of-thrones-season-6-airs-3272034?lt_source=external,manual (http://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/06/01/g-r-r-martin-hopes-to-finish-the-winds-of-winter-before-game-of-thrones-season-6-airs-3272034?lt_source=external,manual)
G.R.R. Martin Hopes to Finish 'The Winds of Winter' Before 'Game of Thrones' Season 6 Airs...
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So you need dragonfire to make Valyrian steel but you can use any old forge to melt it down and make other weapons and it still has it's Valyrian steel properties?
In the books, it was about magic too, and the books make several mention to how since dragons had gone extinct magic was basically gone, but how crap like seemed to be returning(coincided with Danny and her dragons being born).
Well, that's still a crap excuse for the logic on how Tywin could melt down Ice and make two more swords, merely using the local Smith.
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http://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/06/01/g-r-r-martin-hopes-to-finish-the-winds-of-winter-before-game-of-thrones-season-6-airs-3272034?lt_source=external,manual (http://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/06/01/g-r-r-martin-hopes-to-finish-the-winds-of-winter-before-game-of-thrones-season-6-airs-3272034?lt_source=external,manual)
G.R.R. Martin Hopes to Finish 'The Winds of Winter' Before 'Game of Thrones' Season 6 Airs...
What a fuckhead
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http://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/06/01/g-r-r-martin-hopes-to-finish-the-winds-of-winter-before-game-of-thrones-season-6-airs-3272034?lt_source=external,manual (http://moviepilot.com/posts/2015/06/01/g-r-r-martin-hopes-to-finish-the-winds-of-winter-before-game-of-thrones-season-6-airs-3272034?lt_source=external,manual)
G.R.R. Martin Hopes to Finish 'The Winds of Winter' Before 'Game of Thrones' Season 6 Airs...
What a fuckhead
Yep. He shouldn't be taking time off to "promote" the book, it will sell regardless. That's about his ego stroking, IMO. Oh well, we are just his faithful fans who bought his books and made him rich, who cares what we think.
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Hopefully he learns his lesson and keeps pounding away on the final book if he finds himself in similar circumstances at the end of the current one.
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So you need dragonfire to make Valyrian steel but you can use any old forge to melt it down and make other weapons and it still has it's Valyrian steel properties?
In the books, it was about magic too, and the books make several mention to how since dragons had gone extinct magic was basically gone, but how crap like seemed to be returning(coincided with Danny and her dragons being born).
Well, that's still a crap excuse for the logic on how Tywin could melt down Ice and make two more swords, merely using the local Smith.
Yeah, that's my point too.
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catelyn died so long ago and we haven't seen the brotherhood without banners in so long that at this point if lady stoneheart shows up, people will just :rolleyes:
I eyerolled when this happened in the book. I probably also eyerolled when I likely spoiled this moment for you by recanting the books before the show.
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Man, what a crappy episode. Wonder if the fighting pits and Drogon overshadowed everything for the show-only watchers.
* Shireen :frown:
- Thought this one would have worked better if Selyse had been suggesting it all along
* Merryn Trant's pedophilia :blank: There's not already enough motive for Arya to kill him?
* 20 Bolton men sneak into camp and burn all the stores AND all of the siege weapons in weather where it would be difficult to get fires going :blank:
* Dany riding the dragon. Cool CGI bro. :blank:
- Drogon in the pit was really well done though
Who's going to save Jon now? Melisandre's not at the wall, Thoros of Myr hasn't been seen in several seasons........white walkers? He could warg into Ghost, but that limits the possibilities going forward.
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Man, what a crappy episode. Wonder if the fighting pits and Drogon overshadowed everything for the show-only watchers.
* Shireen :frown:
- Thought this one would have worked better if Selyse had been suggesting it all along
* Merryn Trant's pedophilia :blank: There's not already enough motive for Arya to kill him?
* 20 Bolton men sneak into camp and burn all the stores AND all of the siege weapons in weather where it would be difficult to get fires going :blank:
* Dany riding the dragon. Cool CGI bro. :blank:
- Drogon in the pit was really well done though
Who's going to save Jon now? Melisandre's not at the wall, Thoros of Myr hasn't been seen in several seasons........white walkers? He could warg into Ghost, but that limits the possibilities going forward.
Jon's only hope is probably Bran magic. :frown:
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I'm thinking we might see Jon stabbed and then not know what happens until next Season.
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the dragon looked really cool up close, but not very good from afar slash when she was riding it.
so, tyrion is going to be in charge of mereen now?
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the dragon looked really cool up close, but not very good from afar slash when she was riding it.
so, tyrion is going to be in charge of mereen now?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rlgt4Tbt8hU
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I'm thinking we might see Jon stabbed and then not know what happens until next Season.
This. Let the show watchers chew on that for an uncertain amount of time!
Yeah, the Ramsay-raid is pretty dumb. This is a time without gunpowder or explosives or gasoline. They'd have to have hauled big jars of cooking oil and even that wouldn't have gone up that quick. Even if the explanation is supposed to be Wildfyre (which would be super rare outside of the capital) You'd still be talking about 20 men all carrying multiple gallons of the stuff over rough terrain, at night.
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it would be the greatest troll job OAT if the season finale ended with Jon getting stabbed, then we never encounter the Night's Watch again in the TV show or books.
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i got to watch roidhead dominate some GOT trivia yesterday. it was pretty impressive
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i got to watch roidhead dominate some GOT trivia yesterday. it was pretty impressive
i said no mayo.
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@ladygooch
http://www.theguardian.com/books/2015/jun/09/game-of-thrones-colouring-book-george-rr-martin
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@ladygooch
http://www.theguardian.com/books/2015/jun/09/game-of-thrones-colouring-book-george-rr-martin
That would be a perfect Christmas or anniversary gift for me.
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So who's reviving Jon - Fire or Ice?
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I still feel like Jon is the 'hero' of the show, so he will be back
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So who's reviving Jon - Fire or Ice?
He's in a rough ridin' dog.
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Oh good grief this show
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the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
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the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
She was there to illustrate what can happen when a red priest/priestess resurrects someone. They might be ok like Barric or they might end up zombie-ish like Cat....so when Jon Snow comes back we don't know what shape he will be in.
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the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
I love all of the zombie cat chapters in the book.
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I bet that zombie cat is on her way mocat, and it's gonna be awesome!
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the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
I love all of the zombie cat chapters in the book.
what did she do? I don't remember.
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the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
She was there to illustrate what can happen when a red priest/priestess resurrects someone. They might be ok like Barric or they might end up zombie-ish like Cat....so when Jon Snow comes back we don't know what shape he will be in.
She is also there to kill all of the Freys. She is going to tie up loose ends in the books that won't be tied in the show.
the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
I love all of the zombie cat chapters in the book.
what did she do? I don't remember.
She leads a band of outlaws around who hang anyone she points to.
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the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
She was there to illustrate what can happen when a red priest/priestess resurrects someone. They might be ok like Barric or they might end up zombie-ish like Cat....so when Jon Snow comes back we don't know what shape he will be in.
She is also there to kill all of the Freys. She is going to tie up loose ends in the books that won't be tied in the show.
the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
I love all of the zombie cat chapters in the book.
what did she do? I don't remember.
She leads a band of outlaws around who hang anyone she points to.
were they the group that was hanging Brienne?
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the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
She was there to illustrate what can happen when a red priest/priestess resurrects someone. They might be ok like Barric or they might end up zombie-ish like Cat....so when Jon Snow comes back we don't know what shape he will be in.
She is also there to kill all of the Freys. She is going to tie up loose ends in the books that won't be tied in the show.
the fact that zombie cat never showed up means she is not that important which also means eff you george for making me read about her in the first place
I love all of the zombie cat chapters in the book.
what did she do? I don't remember.
She leads a band of outlaws around who hang anyone she points to.
were they the group that was hanging Brienne?
Yeah. Brienne was taking Jamie to them at the end of the last book.
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yeah it was great reading but ultimately not important at all apparently
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yeah it was great reading but ultimately not important at all apparently
Well what about all that stuff with the Greyjoys? Was that pointless too? Are they ever going to show back up on the show?
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yeah it was great reading but ultimately not important at all apparently
These books are a series of stories with an overarching plot. She might not be that important to the overarching plot, but I think she'll be very important to Jaime's story.
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yeah it was great reading but ultimately not important at all apparently
Well what about all that stuff with the Greyjoys? Was that pointless too?
yes absolutely. there are other ways to deliver a horn to dany
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I read that they were casting greyjoys for next season. So, there you have it. Whatever that means
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I wonder if they are going to accelerate production of future seasons now that they've mushed GRRM in his fat, bearded face. They ought to, oughtn't they?
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they should recast Bran
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Bran is probably my favorite character and his storyline is the one that interests me the most. Can. Not. Wait.
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Bran is probably my favorite character and his storyline is the one that interests me the most. Can. Not. Wait.
lol
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I really liked this season. Like, a lot. TeamDanyJohnTyrian/Dragons.
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Still expecting an upcoming reveal when the White Walkers are shown to have less than evil motives. Also hope Jon is resurrected by the White Walkers and not fire magic.
#TeamWhiteWalkers
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I'm hoping that they burn Jon's body and he is resurrected Dany-style since he has Targ blood.
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I'll admit I think I'll enjoy it more since they'll be in completely uncharted waters with the show.
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I'm hoping that they burn Jon's body and he is resurrected Dany-style since he has Targ blood.
yes, that would be fantastic.
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I'm hoping that they burn Jon's body and he is resurrected Dany-style since he has Targ blood.
yes, that would be fantastic.
the thing about that is her brother died from hot gold on his head, so apparently it doesn't always protect your from fire. i mean you dump some hot gold on her head and she just needs to wash it off, no harm done. her brother dies horribly.
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I'm hoping that they burn Jon's body and he is resurrected Dany-style since he has Targ blood.
yes, that would be fantastic.
the thing about that is her brother died from hot gold on his head, so apparently it doesn't always protect your from fire. i mean you dump some hot gold on her head and she just needs to wash it off, no harm done. her brother dies horribly.
Molten gold being poured over your head is not the same as flames.
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it's all heat. he didn't drown, he burned to death.
He looks just as he had the last time she had seen him. His mouth is twisted in anguish, his hair is burnt, and his face is black and smoking where the molten gold has run down across his brow and cheeks and into his eyes.
it's not my fault grrm is inconsistent.
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targaryens burn. that's not news. #summerhall
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There's no proof that Dany wouldn't die if someone poured molten gold over her head.
Also, there is some speculation that Targaryens aren't really fire-proof; but that it was a special magical event (dragon's eggs hatching) that really caused her to survive. So maybe Melisandre could provide that magical event for Jon....or maybe the sacrifice of Shireen has already provided it.
Either way, GRRM has not been inconsistent on this point - it has just not been entirely explained yet.
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it's all heat. if fire doesn't burn you, then hot gold doesn't either. good grief. either she's fireproof or she isn't. if it was a one-time thing, then fine, but if it wasn't then she's hot gold proof too.
there doesn't need to be speculation that targs aren't all fireproof, there's plenty of proof they aren't.
her being possibly fireproof had nothing to do with human resurrection. you and cns are really flipping your dicks around on that one.
i don't see why the red lady couldn't just puke fire into him like thoros did with beric. jon doesn't need to be fireproof for that. or a targ.
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tune in next week to find out!
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to true detective!
:cheese:
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p sure martin has already said that dany surviving the fire was a one time thing. targs are naturally more resistant to heat, but not exactly fireproof
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p sure martin has already said that dany surviving the fire was a one time thing. targs are naturally more resistant to heat, but not exactly fireproof
well that's retardant
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p sure martin has already said that dany surviving the fire was a one time thing. targs are naturally more resistant to heat, but not exactly fireproof
That gypsy lady said some crap about magic and it costing life. Dany included the gypsy in the fire too. I assume that it was a spell and the fat gypsy was the payment for dragons hatching and not G'ingAF about the fire. :dunno:
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p sure martin has already said that dany surviving the fire was a one time thing. targs are naturally more resistant to heat, but not exactly fireproof
That gypsy lady said some crap about magic and it costing life. Dany included the gypsy in the fire too. I assume that it was a spell and the fat gypsy was the payment for dragons hatching and not G'ingAF about the fire. :dunno:
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Lord of light's already been paid Shireen, so they might have some store credit they can use towards Jon's revival.
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Guess he takes after his mom
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This show just keeps getting worse. I'm kind of over it. I say they just spend next season showing White Walkers murdering everyone from the Wall down to the tip of Dorne and then show dragons burning everything across the sea to ashes. Game (of thrones) Over and it ends in Fire and Ice. Boom.... :buh-bye:
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My wife finally decided to take the plunge so I am rewatching as she watches for the first time. It is a lot more enjoyable the second time.
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My wife finally decided to take the plunge so I am rewatching as she watches for the first time. It is a lot more enjoyable the second time.
My wife came into the room two different times in the past while I was watching the show. 1. Bran getting pushed and 2. One of the Little Finger's prostitute scenes.
She will not budge on giving it a try.
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Your wife sounds like she sucks
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Your wife sounds like she sucks
Yeah, why are your wives so reluctant to watch?
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Your wife sounds like she sucks
This is the thing. She loves the other shows I love. I mean, all but Dr Who. I keep telling her she would like it, but she can't get herself past little Bran.
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Your wife sounds like she sucks
This is the thing. She loves the other shows I love. I mean, all but Dr Who. I keep telling her she would like it, but she can't get herself past little Bran.
Did you explain his character is the worst and the show would have been fine had he just died then?
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Your wife sounds like she sucks
This is the thing. She loves the other shows I love. I mean, all but Dr Who. I keep telling her she would like it, but she can't get herself past little Bran.
Did you explain his character is the worst and the show would have been fine had he just died then?
Tell her that Bran is going to end up saving everyone from the ice zombies when he gets his super warg/wizard powers.
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My wife asked about rickon and I just do a :ck: but she thinks I'm just not spoiling something for her.
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My wife asked about rickon and I just do a :ck: but she thinks I'm just not spoiling something for her.
:lol:
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Your wife sounds like she sucks
This is the thing. She loves the other shows I love. I mean, all but Dr Who. I keep telling her she would like it, but she can't get herself past little Bran.
Did you explain his character is the worst and the show would have been fine had he just died then?
Tell her that Bran is going to end up saving everyone from the ice zombies when he gets his super warg/wizard powers.
Gooches, yep. I told her that he is going to be like top 3 important ppl in the story and that he wouldn't have realized his power if he didn't get pushed. She doesn't care.
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Your wife sounds like she sucks
This is the thing. She loves the other shows I love. I mean, all but Dr Who. I keep telling her she would like it, but she can't get herself past little Bran.
Did you explain his character is the worst and the show would have been fine had he just died then?
You are not supposed to be in this thread.
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http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/tower-of-joy#.dn61lrbOj6 (http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/tower-of-joy#.dn61lrbOj6)
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http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/tower-of-joy#.dn61lrbOj6 (http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/tower-of-joy#.dn61lrbOj6)
:Wha:
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boner city population me
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http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/tower-of-joy#.dn61lrbOj6 (http://www.buzzfeed.com/robinedds/tower-of-joy#.dn61lrbOj6)
:Wha:
What if since the next book isn't published yet GRRM intentionally changes course and shits on his original plan because it became a popular fan theory? Or he reveals Jon's identity while also leaving him permanently dead forever? He seems like that kind of freakazoid.
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Also strange for a show that never once has had a flashback to suddenly have a flashback
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Kinda had a flashback this season
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Kinda had a flashback this season
Oh yeah. The seal has been broken then, nm
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This could be an epic flashback. If by chance this isn't a flashback, then a spinoff series or movie should be made about the Mad King, Ed's sister, and the war that followed. There seems to be a ton of content prior to the beginning of GoT books.
Also, I really hope GRRM doesn't change his path just because fans predicted what might happen. Especially if he told the show writers the path he was going and changes it up in the books.
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it's his own fat fault for writing 5 books in twenty years
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grrm or mjk, i literally can't tell the difference
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I finally started reading the books. Book 1 is really good. It's also remarkable how faithful Season 1 is to the first book. I can't think of a single significant difference. I'm about half way through Book 2 now, and it is a bit slower but still good. I can understand why the writers cut and changed some things for the show. I haven't come across anything yet that I wish hadn't been cut. I particularly enjoy getting inside Tyrion's head, and the more elaborate backstory.
Also, having heard the Jon Snow theory on the interwebs, the foreshadowing sure seems obvious as I read Book 1. There are at least a half-dozen Ned Stark flashbacks to his sister telling him to "promise me" - to keep the secret obviously. He never even told his wife. Ned also spend a lot of time dwelling on Robert's penchant for killing Targaryan offspring.
There's been several mentions of a Howland Reed who was with Ned at the time and is presumably the only one else who know's Jon's secret. I'm only a book and a half in and no appearance of Mr. Reed so far. I think this character has been completely absent from the show, too?
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I finally started reading the books. Book 1 is really good. It's also remarkable how faithful Season 1 is to the first book. I can't think of a single significant difference. I'm about half way through Book 2 now, and it is a bit slower but still good. I can understand why the writers cut and changed some things for the show. I haven't come across anything yet that I wish hadn't been cut. I particularly enjoy getting inside Tyrion's head, and the more elaborate backstory.
Also, having heard the Jon Snow theory on the interwebs, the foreshadowing sure seems obvious as I read Book 1. There are at least a half-dozen Ned Stark flashbacks to his sister telling him to "promise me" - to keep the secret obviously. He never even told his wife. Ned also spend a lot of time dwelling on Robert's penchant for killing Targaryan offspring.
There's been several mentions of a Howland Reed who was with Ned at the time and is presumably the only one else who know's Jon's secret. I'm only a book and a half in and no appearance of Mr. Reed so far. I think this character has been completely absent from the show, too?
Howland Reed is jojen and meera's father
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Those are the two kids with Bran?
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Yes. Also, I mentioned it in the book recommendo thread, but did you guys hear that they think the next book is coming in spring? Some Spanish editor (or something in the biz) that works with Martin said so on some Spanish radio interview last month.
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Yes. Also, I mentioned it in the book recommendo thread, but did you guys hear that they think the next book is coming in spring? Some Spanish editor (or something in the biz) that works with Martin said so on some Spanish radio interview last month.
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I'll believe it when I see it.
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guess what CNS? spring 2028 is "in spring"
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:sad:
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All right, so this isn't my own theory, but damned if it doesn't make sense. What if GRRM went all Star Wars on us and gave Jon a twin sister? Ned and Howland split them up. Ned took Jon. Howland took Meera. They're the same exact age. HBO cast Meera to look like Jon's twin. And I'm reading Clash of Kings and just finished a chapter which ends with Danny and Mormont talking about Rhaegar's death at the trident. The next chapter begins with Meera. Fishing with a trident.
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Would get you two the three dragons and their riders.
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Would get you two the three dragons and their riders.
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Two "riders," but still three dragons. Jon's ass is warged into a Dire Wolf at the moment...he'll warg into one of the three dragons.
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Nope, he is gonna be red lady'ed
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All right, so this isn't my own theory, but damned if it doesn't make sense. What if GRRM went all Star Wars on us and gave Jon a twin sister? Ned and Howland split them up. Ned took Jon. Howland took Meera. They're the same exact age. HBO cast Meera to look like Jon's twin. And I'm reading Clash of Kings and just finished a chapter which ends with Danny and Mormont talking about Rhaegar's death at the trident. The next chapter begins with Meera. Fishing with a trident.
Pretty great stuff here dub
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(http://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/crop_0_0_630_292,scalefit_630_noupscale/55dd0975170000430156895e.jpeg)
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mybe :dunno:
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I'm 30 pages from finishing ACOK. I like the twins theory. I also agree that reading ACOK really put the theory's into motion and they all would make perfect sense.
This may have been posted, but I visit this website on the reg while I read to follow character paths and to get very familiar with the territory.
http://quartermaester.info/ (http://quartermaester.info/)
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ksuw: where/how does grrm indicate that jon and meera are the exact same age?
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ksuw: where/how does grrm indicate that jon and meera are the exact same age?
I think he lists details on all of the characters in the backs of the books. I never bother to read all of that, though.
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Finished ACOK last night. Going to start ASOS either tonight or tomorrow. ASOS is a really big book.
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Finished ACOK last night. Going to start ASOS either tonight or tomorrow. ASOS is a really big book.
well it's also the best book so enjoy it
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ksuw: where/how does grrm indicate that jon and meera are the exact same age?
Well, the same year at least. The nerds at the wiki have used various dates/ages provided in the books to piece together the following information:
Jon Snow, born 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Jon_Snow (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Jon_Snow)
Meera Reed, born 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Meera_Reed (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Meera_Reed)
Lyanna Stark, died 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Lyanna_Stark (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Lyanna_Stark)
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Well I'm sold
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ksuw: where/how does grrm indicate that jon and meera are the exact same age?
Well, the same year at least. Not sure where the wiki gets its information, assuming the appendices.
Jon Snow, born 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Jon_Snow (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Jon_Snow)
Meera Reed, born 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Meera_Reed (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Meera_Reed)
Lyanna Stark, died 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Lyanna_Stark (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Lyanna_Stark)
so it's not explicitly stated in the books? did you come up with this theory by reading the books, or by cruising a wiki of ice and fire?
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ksuw: where/how does grrm indicate that jon and meera are the exact same age?
Well, the same year at least. Not sure where the wiki gets its information, assuming the appendices.
Jon Snow, born 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Jon_Snow (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Jon_Snow)
Meera Reed, born 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Meera_Reed (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Meera_Reed)
Lyanna Stark, died 283 AC. http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Lyanna_Stark (http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Lyanna_Stark)
so it's not explicitly stated in the books? did you come up with this theory by reading the books, or by cruising a wiki of ice and fire?
I edited my post above. The nerds at the wiki caluclated those dates using various other dates and ages provided in the books.
And I didn't come up with this theory. It's floating around the internet. The thing that clinched it for me was the part in Clash of Kings where one chapter ends discussing Rhaegar's death at the trident and the very next page starts with Meera fishing with a trident. That's exactly the kind of super-subtle literary foreshadowing I would expect.
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Maybe she knows and that's how it will be revealed to Jon instead of bringing Howland into the picture
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Though a bit odd that no one says she's a bastard so kinda hard to just come back from war and claim your wife miracled a new kid
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Maybe she knows and that's how it will be revealed to Jon instead of bringing Howland into the picture
If I had to guess (and I haven't read this far but I'm going off the TV show), Bran is going to "see" it when he learns how to look back in time.
This makes sense considering the TV show. Jon just "died" at the end of Season 5, many are speculating that a new Season 6 shooting location in Spain and character casting is for the Tower of Joy, and Bran is back for Season 6.
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Though a bit odd that no one says she's a bastard so kinda hard to just come back from war and claim your wife miracled a new kid
Good point, but based on everything I've read it seems like the outside world is pretty ignorant of the crannogmen. It could very well be that nobody knows or cares about Meera's true parentage.
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i would pay pretty good money for an abridged version of asoiaf to re-read before twow
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They have chapter summaries on one of the fansites. It's really great but not exactly book form
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Fans also did detailed chapter synopses for the Wheel of Time books, which were very useful towards the end. Man just thinking about how great that series started and then fell apart as the author went senile makes me :curse:.
I really hope GoT doesn't suffer the same fate. It really might. That would suck.
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I'm getting pretty close to finishing ACoK. Great book. Man, the show really started changing a lot of stuff in Season 2. But so far, I can't say I'm upset about any of the changes. In fact, the show's Arya/Tywin plotline at Harrenhall was an improvement over the book. But the book explains much better how Roose Bolton came to control Harrenhall, and I wish they hadn't cut that fight scene.
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guys if i started the books now, and read them maybe like 10 minutes each night before i got bored, and know that i am a very fast reader, would i be done by april when the new season comes out?
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sure
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Books: Word counts
A Game of Thrones: 298k
A Clash of kings: 326k
A Storm of Swords: 424k
A Feast for Crows: 300k
A Dance with Dragons: 422k
=1.77 Million words
(Days between today and April 24th, 2016)*(minutes reading)
149*10=1490
(words)/(minutes)
1,770,000/1490 = ~1188 words/minute
Thats like 20 words a second... you might need to read a little more per day.
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I think once he started he would eventually read more than 10 minutes/day
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I'm now into Storm of Swords. I know watching shows first changes my perspective, but I like the changes the show has made, for the most part. Rob/Jeyne get a much fuller story, for example. That's been my biggest surprise so far in the books, what a relatively minor role Rob gets.
Books excel at the back story, and I wish some more of that had worked its way in. The Petyr/Lysa/John Arryn thing was really interesting and better explains what little they put in the show.
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yeah Rob is not a big deal in the books. the show producers have said he became a bigger deal because they loved the actor so much that they wanted to give him more screen time, plus it would make the red wedding even more jarring
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I also thinks it's interesting that every chapter is just titled "Tyrion" or "Sansa" or whomever's POV. You can kinda tell who the most important characters are by who gets the POVs. Rob hasn't had any. I don't think Stannis has had any either.
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sometimes the POV characters are just around the important characters
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Yes. Also, I mentioned it in the book recommendo thread, but did you guys hear that they think the next book is coming in spring? Some Spanish editor (or something in the biz) that works with Martin said so on some Spanish radio interview last month.
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about that . . .
http://grrm.livejournal.com/465247.html
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I read something about that this weekend. Sounds like he would have made March if he hit his first, second, or even third imposed deadline.
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Believe me, it gave me no pleasure to type those words. You're disappointed, and you're not alone. My editors and publishers are disappointed, HBO is disappointed, my agents and foreign publishers and translators are disappointed... but no one could possibly be more disappointed than me.
what an bad person
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I bet he finishes the book in time for it to come out in Spring of 2017.
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he's never hit a deadline yet. if his publishers or readers are surprised, they're idiots.
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it's not surprising but it sure is annoying every time
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just picturing him sitting there with his fat sausage fingers looking for the letter "Y", breathing loudly, giving up, and then staring out his window at the desert for several minutes, etc. makes me noticeably annoyed
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just picturing him sitting there with his fat sausage fingers looking for the letter "Y", breathing loudly, giving up, and then staring out his window at the desert for several minutes, etc. makes me noticeably annoyed
on his ancient word processor.
*heavy breathing* IT DOES WHAT *GASP* I NEED *wheezing*
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He is getting old. I bet he just has to make water like a bagillion times a day and all the interruption kills his thought process.
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I bet he's written the equivalent of 10 books and keeps revising ever-y-thing over and over again.
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He probably writes chapters including several key ppl then remembers they are dead, have the wrong back story, couldn't possibly be where he is currently talking about because of some other timeline already existing, or something. The next book is going to take 30yrs and that stupid IBM supercomputer Watson.
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i think he's probably just a slow writer.
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I'm about half way through Feast for Crows. This book slows down significantly. I don't really mind the slower pace so far. Most of the new POVs and storylines are interesting. I might be forgetting, but I don't think I've read a single POV from Danny or Tyrion yet. This is is definitely where HBO started cutting and changing a lot.
Probably the only storyline I'm bored with is the Dorne thing. I just don't care too much. Brienne's POVs and story are interesting, but I also like HBO's changes. I like having both alternatives.
The one thing I'm surprised HBO cut was Jamie's admission to Tyrion about Tysha. That was crazy! I'm guessing they're saving that for later.
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people warned me so much about how awful feast for crows is, so i was pleasantly surprised when i finished it.
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Finished Feast for Crows last night. I really enjoyed meandering along with some of these "lesser" storylines. Still don't really mind most of HBO's changes, but I'm also enjoying GRRM's parallel universe.
Probably the best change HBO made was truncating and simplifying the Sansa/Petyr/Vale stuff. This is my least favorite storyline of the books.
The Lady Stoneheart stuff is pretty cool and has a ton of potential. I wish HBO hadn't cut that.
I'm hoping the show returns to Riverrun and the Tullys in the upcoming season - I really enjoyed the Jamie/Bryden/Edmure stuff. One thing I'm a little hazy on is how Jeyne's mom was complicit in the Red Wedding.
The whole Iron Islands thing was interesting but I don't mind it being cut from the show.
The Kings Landing stuff is good but I'm fine the way HBO whittled down the characters. Tough to keep all those stupid Kettleblacks straight. You know what character HBO really changed? Qyburn. That dude's a malicious psychopath in the books. He seems pretty cool in the show. Also, the Margaery/Tommen stuff is quite a bit different and I'm not sure why HBO decided to make Tommen older and change that relationship.
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Probably the best change HBO made was truncating and simplifying changing the entire storyline of the Sansa/Petyr/Vale stuff. This is my least favorite storyline of the books.
I'm not sure why HBO decided to make Tommen older
They made everyone older.
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I'm maybe halfway through Dance of Dragons. This book is not as good as the preceding four. The Davos/Stannis stuff is just not that interesting. The Danaerys stuff is really not that interesting. The "I want to be strong but I want all these men to love me and think I'm pretty" inner monologue is stale and annoying.
The book has even managed to make Tyrion boring. It sure looks like this random discovery of Aegon is going to be a pretty big deal in the books, but I really don't mind that HBO cut it to move the story along.
I probably wouldn't mind the slower pace so much if I didn't know that this is the last book for another couple of years.
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you could be reading the wrong book. it's called A Dance with Dragons and it's pretty well regarded as a solid #2 in the series behind a storm of swords. just be patient
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I liked it a lot.
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When's the new book coming? It's been so long since I finished the last one I don't remember any of it.
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When's the new book coming?
:lol: :lol:
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you could be reading the wrong book. it's called A Dance with Dragons and it's pretty well regarded as a solid #2 in the series behind a storm of swords. just be patient
Yes, Tyrion has really peaked my interest asking the same question 18 million times. I mean, where do whores go?
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iirc michigancat loved that part
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Finished Book 5. For now my read is ended...
I liked it. Most of it. I'm really bored/annoyed by the entire Danny plot. Don't care about all her, don't care about all the Mereen stuff. Can't even keep the names straight and don't care enough to figure them out. Just kill her off already.
But otherwise, pretty awesome.
I'm glad the series simplified the Essos stuff. It was also probably the right decision to simplify the North stuff, even though I'm glad Stan is still alive. He's also not nearly as much of a POS in the books. So now Theon's gonna rat out the Umber betrayal, which should be good. Maybe he'll actually kill Bolton.
Oh I forgot - also kinda hate the Iron Islands crap with the brothers, but I like the girl. I'm glad the series kept her and ditched them.
So little Aegon's going to important. And that might be pretty cool. I guess this is where the series is really going to diverge.
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In a refreshingly frank and foul-mouthed interview, the 73-year-old actor ranted about his time filming for series six, saying he finds fans’ obsession with spoilers very frustrating.
It seems that while he enjoyed his ‘great’ HBO show Deadwood, he’s not all that bothered about the epic fantasy drama at all and is glad his character only appears in one episode.
He told The Telegraph: ‘You say the slightest thing and the internet goes ape. I was accused of giving the plot away, but I just think, “Get a rough ridin' life”. It’s only tits and dragons.
al swearengen guy
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I watched my very first episode yesterday evening. The friend who recommended it convinced me to give it a try. I want to watch more. Going to binge over the next week or two and see where it takes me.
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I watched my very first episode yesterday evening. The friend who recommended it convinced me to give it a try. I want to watch more. Going to binge over the next week or two and see where it takes me.
prepare to have your balls grabbed.
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I watched my very first episode yesterday evening. The friend who recommended it convinced me to give it a try. I want to watch more. Going to binge over the next week or two and see where it takes me.
prepare to have your balls grabbed.
I kind of got that feeling from the recommendation. Consider me prepared. Thx.
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Tower of joy in the preview for next week :Wha: :Woot:
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lady stone cat: yea or nay?
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I feel asleep during the epi last night. :frown:
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That was a pretty fantastic episode!
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during it i was rolling my eyes pretty hard, but reflecting on it, it was very enjoyable
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during it i was rolling my eyes pretty hard, but reflecting on it, it was very enjoyable
Weren't you just bitching about spoilers in the other thread? Get out of here.
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i go where i like.
and there's a reason i knew it was a spoiler, dur
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during it i was rolling my eyes pretty hard, but reflecting on it, it was very enjoyable
What were you rolling your eyes at? The Tyrion stuff is pretty weak so far but otherwise pretty awesome?
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roose's death, waldas death, balon/euron, more that i don't remember right now
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roose's death, waldas death, balon/euron, more that i don't remember right now
Don't those things seem pretty likely to happen in next book, or seems likely to have happened? That's a hell of a coincidence that Euron showed up almost exactly when Balon died.
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I want the next book God damn it
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roose's death, waldas death, balon/euron, more that i don't remember right now
Don't those things seem pretty likely to happen in next book, or seems likely to have happened? That's a hell of a coincidence that Euron showed up almost exactly when Balon died.
He's probably going to wait to show his face until the King's Moot and just say that's why he came...
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Are you trying to tell me that MR is Jon's twin sister just because she has a long horse face like Lyanna?
I'm moving this discussion here so that lib doesn't throw a fit even though it is all speculation that doesn't ruin the show at this point.
Meera Reed isn't a bastard, which means that if she really is Jon's twin sister then Howland Reed's wife was in on the cover up. Are you telling me that Ned was ok with Howland telling his wife the truth but didn't himself tell Catelyn?
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Are you trying to tell me that MR is Jon's twin sister just because she has a long horse face like Lyanna?
I'm moving this discussion here so that lib doesn't throw a fit even though it is all speculation that doesn't ruin the show at this point.
Meera Reed isn't a bastard, which means that if she really is Jon's twin sister then Howland Reed's wife was in on the cover up. Are you telling me that Ned was ok with Howland telling his wife the truth but didn't himself tell Catelyn?
The Crannogmen are a weird, isolated, and mysterious people. Do you really think it's such a stretch that Howland's wife would aid in the cover up to protect the baby? I don't think that's a stretch at all. And don't you think it's kind of significant that GRRM has made the Crannogmen so weird, isolated, and mysterious? I think there is a reason for that.
All the writing about the Tower of Joy, Howland Reed being Ned's friend and only other person to leave the Tower of Joy alive (aside from the twins), the tourney at Harrenhall, the same age of Meera and Jon - that's not all a coincidence.
It's not a coincidence that HBO cast Meera to look like Jon's twin.
And I don't think it is a coincidence that GRRM ended one chapter talking about Rhaegar dying "at the Trident" and the very next page opening with Meera fishing with a trident (I'm taking credit for that discovery btw because I haven't seen it discussed anywhere else).
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Are you trying to tell me that MR is Jon's twin sister just because she has a long horse face like Lyanna?
I'm moving this discussion here so that lib doesn't throw a fit even though it is all speculation that doesn't ruin the show at this point.
Meera Reed isn't a bastard, which means that if she really is Jon's twin sister then Howland Reed's wife was in on the cover up. Are you telling me that Ned was ok with Howland telling his wife the truth but didn't himself tell Catelyn?
The Crannogmen are a weird, isolated, and mysterious people. Do you really think it's such a stretch that Howland's wife would aid in the cover up to protect the baby? I don't think that's a stretch at all. And don't you think it's kind of significant that GRRM has made the Crannogmen so weird, isolated, and mysterious? I think there is a reason for that.
All the writing about the Tower of Joy, Howland Reed being Ned's friend and only other person to leave the Tower of Joy alive (aside from the twins), the tourney at Harrenhall, the same age of Meera and Jon - that's not all a coincidence.
It's not a coincidence that HBO cast Meera to look like Jon's twin.
And I don't think it is a coincidence that GRRM ended one chapter talking about Rhaegar dying "at the Trident" and the very next page opening with Meera fishing with a trident (I'm taking credit for that discovery btw because I haven't seen it discussed anywhere else).
No, I don't think it is a stretch at all that Howland's wife would be willing to protect a baby. I am saying, why would Ned be ok with Howland telling his wife about the cover-up when Ned wasn't even willing to tell his own wife? Ned would have known that Howland told his wife because Meera was presented as their child. So Ned trusted his friend and friend's wife more than he trusted his own wife (who be all accounts he actually loved and was loyal to)? Jon could have had a better life (relationship with Catelyn) if Ned would have told Catelyn the truth. But instead he was so intent on keeping the secret that he sacrificed a bit of all of their relationships.
It all fits except Ned's inconsistency on this point.
What happened at the Tourney at Harrenhall that is significant to this theory? I can't remember.
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Are you trying to tell me that MR is Jon's twin sister just because she has a long horse face like Lyanna?
I'm moving this discussion here so that lib doesn't throw a fit even though it is all speculation that doesn't ruin the show at this point.
Meera Reed isn't a bastard, which means that if she really is Jon's twin sister then Howland Reed's wife was in on the cover up. Are you telling me that Ned was ok with Howland telling his wife the truth but didn't himself tell Catelyn?
The Crannogmen are a weird, isolated, and mysterious people. Do you really think it's such a stretch that Howland's wife would aid in the cover up to protect the baby? I don't think that's a stretch at all. And don't you think it's kind of significant that GRRM has made the Crannogmen so weird, isolated, and mysterious? I think there is a reason for that.
All the writing about the Tower of Joy, Howland Reed being Ned's friend and only other person to leave the Tower of Joy alive (aside from the twins), the tourney at Harrenhall, the same age of Meera and Jon - that's not all a coincidence.
It's not a coincidence that HBO cast Meera to look like Jon's twin.
And I don't think it is a coincidence that GRRM ended one chapter talking about Rhaegar dying "at the Trident" and the very next page opening with Meera fishing with a trident (I'm taking credit for that discovery btw because I haven't seen it discussed anywhere else).
No, I don't think it is a stretch at all that Howland's wife would be willing to protect a baby. I am saying, why would Ned be ok with Howland telling his wife about the cover-up when Ned wasn't even willing to tell his own wife? Ned would have known that Howland told his wife because Meera was presented as their child. So Ned trusted his friend and friend's wife more than he trusted his own wife (who be all accounts he actually loved and was loyal to)? Jon could have had a better life (relationship with Catelyn) if Ned would have told Catelyn the truth. But instead he was so intent on keeping the secret that he sacrificed a bit of all of their relationships.
It all fits except Ned's inconsistency on this point.
What happened at the Tourney at Harrenhall that is significant to this theory? I can't remember.
I don't think the differing decisions of Ned and Howland would be that surprising at all. Two reasons:
1. They lead very different lives. The Starks are Lord and Lady of Winterfell. Not so easy to fake a pregnancy or keep a secret when you're constantly surrounded by and interacting with other people. By contrast, the Reeds live on some sort of floating island in a swamp. They're hanging out with Yoda or something. A lot easier to claim Meera as their own. The Crannogmen keep to themselves.
2. Ned made a "promise" to his sister. It's repeated about a dozen times in the books. That promise was almost certainly to never reveal the lineage of the twins. But Howland didn't make that promise - Ned did. So whereas the promise would be sufficient for Ned to lie about having a bastard (and boy did that promise weigh heavy on him), Reed could tell his wife.
Nothing happened at Harrenhall that directly supports the theory. But GRRM including Reed as a prominent character in the story about the Tourney, and Jojen going to great pains to tell Bran about the Tourney and his surprise that Ned never told Bran about it, doesn't seem like mere happenstance. It seems that Howland Reed is important to the story, and yet GRRM keeps him shrouded in mystery. Meera seems like the logical reason for that.
Finally, it seems more than a little convenient that Meera is accompanying Bran on his vision quest as he begins to uncover Jon's true lineage. Meera is wondering how she fits into all this and she's about to find out.
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1. They lead very different lives. The Starks are Lord and Lady of Winterfell. Not so easy to fake a pregnancy or keep a secret when you're constantly surrounded by and interacting with other people. By contrast, the Reeds live on some sort of floating island in a swamp. They're hanging out with Yoda or something. A lot easier to claim Meera as their own. The Crannogmen keep to themselves.
I get this. But even if they were presenting Jon as a bastard, Ned could have still told Catelyn the truth so she wouldn't hate Jon and treat him like crap.
2. Ned made a "promise" to his sister. It's repeated about a dozen times in the books. That promise was almost certainly to never reveal the lineage of the twins. But Howland didn't make that promise - Ned did. So whereas the promise would be sufficient for Ned to lie about having a bastard (and boy did that promise weigh heavy on him), Reed could tell his wife.
OK, maybe. But Ned revealed it to Howland (which would be breaking the promise) or else Howland was there too when she said not to reveal the parentage.
Nothing happened at Harrenhall that directly supports the theory. But GRRM including Reed as a prominent character in the story about the Tourney, and Jojen going to great pains to tell Bran about the Tourney and his surprise that Ned never told Bran about it, doesn't seem like mere happenstance. It seems that Howland Reed is important to the story, and yet GRRM keeps him shrouded in mystery. Meera seems like the logical reason for that.
Finally, it seems more than a little convenient that Meera is accompanying Bran on his vision quest as he begins to uncover Jon's true lineage. Meera is wondering how she fits into all this and she's about to find out.
GRRM has said that Howland Reed will show up eventually; so I do not doubt that he is somehow important.
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1. They lead very different lives. The Starks are Lord and Lady of Winterfell. Not so easy to fake a pregnancy or keep a secret when you're constantly surrounded by and interacting with other people. By contrast, the Reeds live on some sort of floating island in a swamp. They're hanging out with Yoda or something. A lot easier to claim Meera as their own. The Crannogmen keep to themselves.
I get this. But even if they were presenting Jon as a bastard, Ned could have still told Catelyn the truth so she wouldn't hate Jon and treat him like crap.
I hear you. But one could argue that Catelyn hating Jon and treating him like crap was a necessary part of the coverup. We're talking about Catelyn Tully here - Mrs. "Duty to House Above All Else". If she's all sweet to Jon, don't you think that would raise suspicions?
One clear theme of these books is that notions like "honor" are murky at best. I think it's pretty clear from reading the books that Ned feels extremely burdened by the strain of keeping his promise by lying to his wife.
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Having a twist that one of the main characters is secretly twins with a D-list character is a pretty lame twist.
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Who cares if he is a twin
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Who cares if he is a twin
The cover up is interesting. And it makes Dany, Jon, and Meera the three dragon riders. I don't buy the theory that Tyrion is a Targaryan.
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I think it would be a cool twist if Jamie and Cersei were Targaryans and Tyrion is Tywin's only son. The Targaryans were incestuous.
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What if Dany is actually a bastard stark
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What if Dany is actually a bastard stark
hmmmmmmmmm.................How would that be possible? Rhaella Targaryen had a secret affair with Brandon Stark? Maybe that's why the Mad King killed him? (not likely)
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And Dany wargs into ghost and kills ramsey
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And Dany wargs into ghost and kills ramsey
I mean, how is Ghost going to get to Winterfell? Wouldn't it be more realistic (and satisfying) if she warged into one of Ramsey's hounds to kill him?
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And Dany wargs into ghost and kills ramsey
I mean, how is Ghost going to get to Winterfell? Wouldn't it be more realistic (and satisfying) if she warged into one of Ramsey's hounds to kill him?
Ghost would just walk his happy ass to Winerfell.
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He's not even that far away, good grief ladygooch :facepalm:
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There's like 30 feet of snow.
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There was just a thaw
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And LOL @ snow being an obstacle for a rough ridin' direwolf
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a direwolf doesn't like walking in snow. now i've heard everything.
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At this point I think Sansa is going to freeze to death trying to get from Winterfell to Castle Black. (Due to all the snow.)
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a direwolf doesn't like walking in snow. now i've heard everything.
Well he's definitely not going to leave Jon Snow's side long enough to get through all that snow, what with Jon just coming back from the dead and all.
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Shireen was sacrificed to melt tha snow tho
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That wolf just got done leaving Jon Snow's side for months so he could wander around north of the wall and do his own thing. I think he could handle a short trip south of the wall to Winterfell.
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Shireen was sacrificed to melt tha snow tho
Yeah, but that didn't work....which was why Melisande was so distraught that she took off her "make me look fuckable" necklace.
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That wolf just got done leaving Jon Snow's side for months so he could wander around north of the wall and do his own thing. I think he could handle a short trip south of the wall to Winterfell.
JON SNOW WAS NOT JUST RETURNED FROM THE DEAD AT THAT TIME!
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Shireen was sacrificed to melt tha snow tho
Yeah, but that didn't work....which was why Melisande was so distraught that she took off her "make me look fuckable" necklace.
It did work, just stannis lost anyway
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That wolf just got done leaving Jon Snow's side for months so he could wander around north of the wall and do his own thing. I think he could handle a short trip south of the wall to Winterfell.
JON SNOW WAS NOT JUST RETURNED FROM THE DEAD AT THAT TIME!
Yeah. If I were Ghost, I'd want to get as far away from that dead bad person that warged into me as I could. I'd head straight for Winterfell.
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One of my few regrets with how the show has deviated from the books is Jamie's storyline. I like the direction the books take much better.
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Welp all the dumb Jon warged into his dog talk can be put to bed.
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Welp all the dumb Jon warged into his dog talk can be put to bed.
the writers are fairly obviously incompetent.
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Welp all the dumb Jon warged into his dog talk can be put to bed.
It'll be in the next book, tho.
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Welp all the dumb Jon warged into his dog talk can be put to bed.
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Thank god.
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Welp all the dumb Jon warged into his dog talk can be put to bed.
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Thank god.
Yes, this would have been uber stupid
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i wish i had thought of R+L=J on my own while reading. i mean good grief, the Tower of Joy scene from the last epi is like word for word straight out of Ned's dream/memory from the first freaking book
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great opportunity to IRL PI GRRM this week at worldcon if anyone's interested
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be a hero, somebody
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if you have two extra hours, i found these discussions of how utterly stupid and disappointing the later seasons were to be enjoyable and satisfying.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hys_m3BPTS8&vl=en
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGr0NRx3TKU
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at some point, this just can't be possible.
https://twitter.com/DouthatNYT/status/1357021900120223745
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book five was published in 2011. he's been writing this thing for ten years!
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There won't be books to finish.
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There won't be books to finish.
he's writing hundreds of pages every day, rage.
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book five was published in 2011. he's been writing this thing for ten years!
Haha, it's nice to have reminders about this stuff sometimes
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There won't be books to finish.
he's writing hundreds of pages every day, rage.
Hundreds every year.
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He finished a long time ago, he’s just too scared to release it while he’s alive.
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My favorite part is that over the course of typing all of the thousands of pages he's typed, he still hasn't bothered to learn how to type instead of hunting and pecking.
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He has no intention of finishing anything. He said eff it, gave the storyline to the show, saw the reaction to it sucking & is now just bullshitting it out until he dies.
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he's writing hundreds of pages every day, rage.
Hundreds every year.
sure, whatever sounds more plausible.
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I bet Winds of Winter does get released, around 2023. It will end on a cliffhanger involving a character not in the show. He will tell everyone that Dream of Spring will be out within 2 years, then die 6 years later, having not written a single page.
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He doesn't know how to finish it. He's started too many open threads and can't close them. He's just as lost as the writers for the TV show.
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that's what you suckers get for reading books
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I feel the same about the game of thrones books being released as I do about oscar Weber being retained. I just don't care any more
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that's what you suckers get for reading books
exactly how I feel. Just a stupid sucker.
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can't wait to enjoy all this new grrm content.
https://twitter.com/ThatElJefe/status/1375637002868174850
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What a lazy POS.
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He's just procrastinating!
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(https://media0.giphy.com/media/3o6ZtcAVp1d5tg9vzO/giphy.gif)
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The SNL weekend update with Cecily Strong grilling Bobby Moynihan as GRRM about why he still hadn’t finished the 6th book was 7 years ago & the 6th book still isn’t close. The book series is done as is.
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I don't think he's as lazy as he is scared. I honestly think he's terrified that that he won't live up to the hype, and is terrified of the risk of rejection on that. I think Patrick Rothfuss is trying to pull the same crap....try and get $ out of what he has via media rights, and promise to finish it later (never).
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It looks like he’s written 1,000+ pages of prequel novellas that are going to be the basis for some of the new HBO shows. He knew that’s where the money was going & has been prepping to cash in on new shows.
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him writing like 3 or 4 whole other books on the side is easily the most infuriating part of not finishing ice and fire.
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I don't care, hope he's enjoying life
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I support both him and his haters. Let the writers write (or not in this case) and the haters hate.
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he looks like he plays the banjo and drinks schaefer beer
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Guys!! Jon Snow spin off w/ Brienne and others!!!
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Guys!! Jon Snow spin off w/ Brienne and others!!!
Will watch religiously
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What are our thoughts about the new show tonight? I can’t decide if I’m going to watch, or wait a few weeks and see if it’s crap or not
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I think it will be good
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I'm excited and I think it has great potential, too.
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I’ll be watching
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it started off pretty clunky but by the end it was good. been a fan of paddy considine since hot fuzz, lol. he was great in the first ep.
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I was worried I wouldn't be able to get through that one scene, but it wasn't as bad as I feared. I don't like the actor playing Daemon. Hopefully that just sucks me in more since he's the bad guy and we're supposed to dislike him.
I like Paddy Considine, too. I remember him from The Outsider.
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I’ve decided to wait a few weeks and see what goEMAW thinks before I start watching
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it started off pretty clunky but by the end it was good.
this sums it up for me. has me excited.
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I was worried I wouldn't be able to get through that one scene, but it wasn't as bad as I feared. I don't like the actor playing Daemon. Hopefully that just sucks me in more since he's the bad guy and we're supposed to dislike him.
I like Paddy Considine, too. I remember him from The Outsider.
I wanted to jokingly ask, "Is that Neil Patrick Harris?" But then I was afraid to ask in case it actually was NPH.
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You guys never watch the Crown? sheesh
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It's weird to say, but the CGI was beautiful in this episode. I'm also looking forward to learning more about the crab people.
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I love it
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Yep. Very fun. Crab people seem interesting. I am also hoping for some Ricken Stark and Knights Watch moments.
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It’s absolutely filling a tv void I wasn’t sure was fillable. It’s like the 2011 cat football squad.
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Yep. I'll keep watching. The world sure feels smaller, though. Hopefully they introduce more characters/chaos soon.
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Yep. I'll keep watching. The world sure feels smaller, though. Hopefully they introduce more characters/chaos soon.
We’ve already been to dragonstone, harrenhall and king’s landing, with much talk of the free cities and mention of the far north, as well as a glimpse of the crab feeders, I believe in one of the free cities.
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Crab people disappointed me.
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Crab people disappointed me.
Indeed
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I have enjoyed it, but it has been different than what I had expected. That may have been foolish on my part. I want more battles and dragons. I was actually worried when it started that they may overdo it with the dragons. I've comforted myself knowing that most of the good drama in GoT came at the tail end of each season.
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Last night's episode kinda bored me.
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Last night's episode kinda bored me.
I think crap will get crazy once they age everyone 10-20 years. That should happen any episode.
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I have enjoyed it a lot so far. I like the flow that they have had and how they are handling stuff.
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The ser beefcake line is really boring but I like the political posturing.
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i'm really liking everything about the show
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i'm really liking everything about the show
It’s been great. Only real standout character so far has been Daemon tho. Alicent’s walk in w the green dress was phenomenal, but they could have alluded to green being the war colors and not just said it.
The actors portraying Alicent and Rhaenera (sp?). Sad to se them go.
Ser Cristen’s heel turn is already great and will get better IMO. I think he and Alicent will be dastardly.
Ser break bones, his lumpy bro and their dad are also going to be something.
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Sad to see rhys ifans go
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The new episode w/ new main actors and a ten-year time leap didn't sit well as a viewer.
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I guess, I knew that it was coming. but i'm sure casual fans were WTF
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As a female viewer, I'm pissed that all the women look older but the men look the same.
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Yes, and does every episode need graphic painful births?
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Ser beefcake turned into ser cuntface
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Ser beefcake turned into ser cuntface
V true. What a little bitch.
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Ser beefcake turned into ser cuntface
Very disappointing development. I liked him.
Yes, and does every episode need graphic painful births?
The first one really got to me. The latter two I handled better. Each one was less worse than the previous.
Aegon sucks, too. Like, I might dislike him more than Daemon by the end of this whole thing.
I cannot remember if I feel this way with each preview for the next week, but next week's episode looks particularly spicy.
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Ser beefcake turned into ser cuntface
Very disappointing development. I liked him.
Yes, and does every episode need graphic painful births?
The first one really got to me. The latter two I handled better. Each one was less worse than the previous.
Aegon sucks, too. Like, I might dislike him more than Daemon by the end of this whole thing.
I cannot remember if I feel this way with each preview for the next week, but next week's episode looks particularly spicy.
Are you telling me you wouldn't jerk the gerkin in the window if you had that kind of view? Because I don't believe you, if so.
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Ser beefcake turned into ser cuntface
Very disappointing development. I liked him.
Yes, and does every episode need graphic painful births?
The first one really got to me. The latter two I handled better. Each one was less worse than the previous.
Aegon sucks, too. Like, I might dislike him more than Daemon by the end of this whole thing.
I cannot remember if I feel this way with each preview for the next week, but next week's episode looks particularly spicy.
Are you telling me you wouldn't jerk the gerkin in the window if you had that kind of view? Because I don't believe you, if so.
That's not even what I find most repulsive about him.
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Holy buckets the last episode brought the goods. First one that felt like a real GoT. They could have just started here tbh
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What do we think guys? An all-timer from our guy king paddy last week. Last night was good but the ending was a bit silly (but still awesome)
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What do we think guys? An all-timer from our guy king paddy last week. Last night was good but the ending was a bit silly (but still awesome)
They didn’t have to kill all the townie peasants w the dragon scene. Unnecessary iyam.
It’s been good (enough) not great. Too many of the characters don’t have enough “character.”
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Why didn’t she just have her dragon flame all the nobles and king and such? Does that mean she is on their side?
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Naw bro, she was just giving alicent her response (ring the bell when you make your decision)
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Go back and watch season 1, ep 1 of GOT and compare it to HotD. The uniqueness and detail, allegory and characterization is night and day comparatively.
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I doubt anyone disagrees. I still really enjoy this show even if it's different
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Naw bro, she was just giving alicent her response (ring the bell when you make your decision)
But why not flame them?
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I agree that seems like the simplist solution. I think there is some honor and junk mixed up in it though, alicent was advocating for not murdering everyone and rhaenys was paying her the same courtesy maybe?
Like I said earlier, the ending was awesome but a little silly.
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I agree that seems like the simplist solution. I think there is some honor and junk mixed up in it though, alicent was advocating for not murdering everyone and rhaenys was paying her the same courtesy maybe?
Like I said earlier, the ending was awesome but a little silly.
I enjoyed it. I am not sure how we can get 4 seasons out of this plot line, but I will watch every minute of it.
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The black response should be pretty great. Can't wait to see what that rascal daemon does.
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While watching the episode I didn't feel like I was paying close enough attention. I couldn't figure out why those twin guys were chasing after Aegon. Probably not important in the grand scheme of things.
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I agree that seems like the simplist solution. I think there is some honor and junk mixed up in it though, alicent was advocating for not murdering everyone and rhaenys was paying her the same courtesy maybe?
Like I said earlier, the ending was awesome but a little silly.
I enjoyed it. I am not sure how we can get 4 seasons out of this plot line, but I will watch every minute of it.
I will gladly watch 4 seasons of GoT: rogue one
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I gotta admit, i've never considered jerking off to women's feet. Looks like a game changer.
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Dreamweaver, once you awaken that animal there's no going back. Trust me on this.
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:ROFL:
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:peek:
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These pregnant labor seens have gotten out of hand.
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These pregnant labor seens have gotten out of hand.
!!!!
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I misspelled scenes. I feel shame.
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Pretty good finale, but it still left me wanting more.
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They clearly have a problem on their hands with that big dragon.
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(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FfzQQskXgAE3toT?format=jpg&name=small)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FfzQp_iXgAgZNxu?format=jpg&name=small)
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good finale, we are set up nicely for season 2: dragonwarz
it sounds like we got the following matchup, am i missing something big?
team A
13 12 dragons, avg madden awareness level is like a 23 though
british royal navy from the master & commander era
total amount of army dudes could fit in like 6 gmc yukons
? money ?
team B
4 battle tested dragons that each look like DK metcalf
couple of rowboats
like 98% of all army dudes in the entirety of westeros
lannister bottomless mimosas warchest
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good finale, we are set up nicely for season 2: dragonwarz
it sounds like we got the following matchup, am i missing something big?
team A
13 12 dragons, avg madden awareness level is like a 23 though
british royal navy from the master & commander era
total amount of army dudes could fit in like 6 gmc yukons
? money ?
team B
4 battle tested dragons that each look like DK metcalf
couple of rowboats
like 98% of all army dudes in the entirety of westeros
lannister bottomless mimosas warchest
Cregan Stark is about to be an absolute badass.
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We're all Team Rhaenyra/Daemon, yeah?
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the fun of season 2 will be toying with us as viewers and making us second guess which team we're on.
Cregan Stark is about to be an absolute badass.
i have read 0% of fire & blood so i have no clue where this is going, should be fun
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We're all Team Rhaenyra/Daemon, yeah?
Completely
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#TeamTheRealm
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rhaenyra is going to have to kill daemon or something
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rhaenyra is going to have to kill daemon or something
Agree. The child that connected them died, and she seemed to laugh in his face about him not knowing about the vision after he choked her.
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rhaenyra is going to have to kill daemon or something
Agree. The child that connected them died, and she seemed to laugh in his face about him not knowing about the vision after he choked her.
There are two more
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Team black or team green, you must declare now and if you switch sides then you will die screaming.
#teamblack
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well team green sucks (alicent is a religious hypocrite and otto is like an early not quite as effective Tywin prototype) but they will pull me back in at some point next season. her son who is constantly making Blue Steel (TM) face has some upside, imo. his dragon is enormous
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Aemond is def the cream of the green
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rhaenyra is going to have to kill daemon or something
Agree. The child that connected them died, and she seemed to laugh in his face about him not knowing about the vision after he choked her.
There are two more
There are (were) three more sons, all with brown hair, and none are Daemon's. All bastards of Harwin Strong.
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rhaenyra is going to have to kill daemon or something
Agree. The child that connected them died, and she seemed to laugh in his face about him not knowing about the vision after he choked her.
There are two more
There are (were) three more sons, all with brown hair, and none are Daemon's. All bastards of Harwin Strong.
Wrong. There is Aegon III and Viserys II. The stillborn (Visenya) would have been numero 6 for the ol' Bitch Queen.
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Team Black, which is great because early on I was not.
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The crap is going to hit the fan in some very Damon/Aemon ways soon. Aemon can't act like it was an accident. That would make him look like fool. His fat ass dragon just wrote a check that Aemon's ass now has to cash. Damon's character is made for chaos and the exertion of power. He is about to dragon the world's face off. He wants harrenhall, well, if he can't have it, I bet no one will.
Can't wait for next season.
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yeah no way foot fetish guy is keeping harrenhall