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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Basketball is hard => Topic started by: nicname on February 03, 2024, 11:03:38 PM
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Following today's loss at Oklahoma State (kenpom 123) our 2023-24 Cats bball squad has dropped to No. 76 in the latest basketball ratings by statistical guru Kenneth Pomeroy. If the season ended today that would put this year's team in between two Jim Wooldridge squads as the 7th worst ksu basketball team in the kenpom era.
How far will we fall ... or rise? Will we be helped by our conferences overall strength?
K-State cagers teams rated worst to first according to kenpom.com:
*List updated to include 2023-24.
**List now also includes 96-97 thru 00-01
161 (1999-00) Tan Tom
147 (2020-21) oscar
127 (1996-97) Tan Tom
120 (2001-02) Wooly
115 (2000-01) Wooly
96 (2024-25) Tang
90 (2019-20) oscar
83 (2004-05) Wooly
81 (2014-15) oscar
77 (2005-06) Wooly
71 (2004-05) Wooly
70 (1997-98) Tan Tom - NIT
70 (2023-24) Tang - NIT
61 (2021-22) oscar
60 (2002-03) Wooly
56 (1998-99) Tan Tom - NIT
57 (2006-07) Huggins - NIT
55 (2015-16) oscar
51 (2008-09) Frank - NIT
—————————————- NCAA Tournament Line
45 (2013-14) oscar
42 (2017-18) oscar
32 (2010-11) Frank
30 (2016-17) oscar
27 (2012-13) oscar
26 (2007-08) Frank
23 (2011-12) Frank
21 (2022-23) Tang
20 (2018-19) oscar
6 (2009-10) Frank
Obv. kp.c is not the only good measure for what makes a cat hoops team good or bad, but it does go back pretty far, so at least there is that!
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Which squad has had the widest discrepancy between good games and bad games (too lazy to look up the statistical term for that)? There have been some really fun performances (Villanova, Providence, Baylor) and some eye-wateringly terrible outings (OU, OSU, Nub, Northwestern Alabama).
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I think this team could lose out and still be at worst 3rd on the list.
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This team is definitely one of the worse at doing it most to themselves (turnovers)
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I think this team could lose out and still be at worst 3rd on the list.
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I think this team could lose out and still be at worst 3rd on the list.
We lost 4 in a row now.
We just lost to the worst team in the conference.
KU just beat Huston’s ass by 12.
You know what that means.
We are going to beat KU tomorrow.
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We might win the play hard chart tomorrow
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How were turnovers weighted on the play hard chart?
Kind of hard to believe that 1 in every 4 of our possessions results in a turnover
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Now that I think of it we may not win the play hard chart either. Team never slaps the floor and doesnt get very many oboards.
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How were turnovers weighted on the play hard chart?
Kind of hard to believe that 1 in every 4 of our possessions results in a turnover
I mean it's not hard to believe because I have eyeballs that work and I know what turnovers are, I guess the hard to believe part is that it keeps happening at this sustained clip
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Frank
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I think this team could lose out and still be at worst 3rd on the list.
We lost 4 in a row now.
We just lost to the worst team in the conference.
KU just beat Huston’s ass by 12.
You know what that means.
We are going to beat KU tomorrow.
We will have an inexplicable run in the second half to be up by double digits, ku pulls it back and takes it to OT. We don't lose in OT.
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what is the ken pom era?
obviously it is after asbury’s time
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what is the ken pom era?
obviously it is after asbury’s time
2001-02 and beyond.
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i'd consider it a victory if the team could fight their way back into the top 50.
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wtf is a cager?
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https://www.basketball.org/history/hub/cagers/
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https://www.basketball.org/history/hub/cagers/
My mans obv never was a fan of the Kansas (Salina) Cagerz.
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I think this team could lose out and still be at worst 3rd on the list.
We lost 4 in a row now.
We just lost to the worst team in the conference.
KU just beat Huston’s ass by 12.
You know what that means.
We are going to beat KU tomorrow.
We will have an inexplicable run in the second half to be up by double digits, ku pulls it back and takes it to OT. We don't lose in OT.
I almost called it
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I think this team could lose out and still be at worst 3rd on the list.
We lost 4 in a row now.
We just lost to the worst team in the conference.
KU just beat Huston’s ass by 12.
You know what that means.
We are going to beat KU tomorrow.
We will have an inexplicable run in the second half to be up by double digits, ku pulls it back and takes it to OT. We don't lose in OT.
I almost called it
Only got the second half run backwards. Moving in the right direction, Cats!
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Went from 76 to 78 after beating ku so we still have a chance
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I think this team could lose out and still be at worst 3rd on the list.
We lost 4 in a row now.
We just lost to the worst team in the conference.
KU just beat Huston’s ass by 12.
You know what that means.
We are going to beat KU tomorrow.
We will have an inexplicable run in the second half to be up by double digits, ku pulls it back and takes it to OT. We don't lose in OT.
I almost called it
Only got the second half run backwards. Moving in the right direction, Cats!
:bball:
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Went from 76 to 78 after beating ku so we still have a chance
Looks like 72 now!!
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this team might get top 5 status
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this team might get top 5 status
Staring top 5 right in the ball sack. We could be top three WOAT (since 2002 at least).
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Time to fire this bad boy back up! Cats coming in hot at kenpom No. 91 just 14 games into the season and most of the B12 slog yet to come!
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zeal
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This one is going to be rough.
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Following today's loss at Oklahoma State (kenpom 123) our 2023-24 Cats bball squad has dropped to No. 76 in the latest basketball ratings by statistical guru Kenneth Pomeroy. If the season ended today that would put this year's team in between two Jim Wooldridge squads as the 7th worst ksu basketball team in the kenpom era.
How far will we fall ... or rise? Will we be helped by our conferences overall strength?
K-State cagers teams rated worst to first according to kenpom.com:
147 (2020-21) oscar
120 (2001-02) Wooly
90 (2019-20) oscar
83 (2004-05) Wooly
81 (2014-15) oscar
77 (2005-06) Wooly
71 (2004-05) Wooly
61 (2021-22) oscar
60 (2002-03) Wooly
57 (2006-07) Huggins
55 (2015-16) oscar
51 (2008-09) Frank
45 (2013-14) oscar
42 (2017-18) oscar
32 (2010-11) Frank
30 (2016-17) oscar
27 (2012-13) oscar
26 (2007-08) Frank
23 (2011-12) Frank
21 (2022-23) Tang
20 (2018-19) oscar
6 (2009-10) Frank
Obv. kp.c is not the only good measure for what makes a cat hoops team good or bad, but it does go back pretty far, so at least there is that!
I'm guessing he's added more data since you did this but
127 (1996-97)
70 (97-98)
56 (98-99)
161 (99-00)
115 (00-01)
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I'm guessing he's added more data since you did this but
127 (1996-97)
70 (97-98)
56 (98-99)
161 (99-00)
115 (00-01)
Where did you get this? I don’t have a login anymore and the free site only has links going back to 01-02 for the rankings.
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I'm guessing he's added more data since you did this but
127 (1996-97)
70 (97-98)
56 (98-99)
161 (99-00)
115 (00-01)
Where did you get this? I don’t have a login anymore and the free site only has links going back to 01-02 for the rankings.
I have a login, for the next 8 days anyway, but I'm likely to renew
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I'm guessing he's added more data since you did this but
127 (1996-97)
70 (97-98)
56 (98-99)
161 (99-00)
115 (00-01)
Where did you get this? I don’t have a login anymore and the free site only has links going back to 01-02 for the rankings.
I have a login, for the next 8 days anyway, but I'm likely to renew
00-01 beating them No. 20 Iowa had a teenage nicname all geeked up for Wooly ball. Then the we added Nick Williams and got even better. I was pumped! Then he left us for Huggs :(.
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Good to know Asbury did indeed have the worst squad.
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Good to know Asbury did indeed have the worst squad.
That 99-00 team was just dreadful. The only thing that made that team watchable was seeing Tony Kitt play his ass off and give it everything he had every single game... only for us to still be terrible.
Cortez Groves was the "scorer" on that team - he averaged 16 ppg on 15 shots per game!
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(4) top 25 finishes in the past 30 years? It might be time to admit that it's hard to recruit/coach basketball in Manhattan ks
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That and we should rename bramlage after jacob pullen
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Good to know Asbury did indeed have the worst squad.
That 99-00 team was just dreadful. The only thing that made that team watchable was seeing Tony Kitt play his ass off and give it everything he had every single game... only for us to still be terrible.
Cortez Groves was the "scorer" on that team - he averaged 16 ppg on 15 shots per game!
I :bigtoke: with Big Tony a few times back in the day.
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WOOF
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This team is so bad 'fried won't even start a game thread to talk to himself
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Really thought we had em when it was 9-5. Dangit
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https://twitter.com/kellisrobinett/status/1878256125604475174?s=46&t=-jwPwnR3rKHM9sk9hA7h8g
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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His team gets beat on the offensive board 16-2, and he's OK with the effort? We're mumped.
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Well as long as we don’t play any more juggernauts we should be OK
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I think what we do here is let the season play out, then in late feb we launch an internal investigation regarding a minor ncaa rules infraction and as punishment we ban ourselves from post-season play this year and vacate all wins and losses.
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I think what we do here is let the season play out, then in late feb we launch an internal investigation regarding a minor ncaa rules infraction and as punishment we ban ourselves from post-season play this year and vacate all wins and losses.
Idk, that would really be achor.
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What is the 2025 version of finding a western Union payment in the trash can at Dillons?
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Forcing religion upon a team at a public school has to be some sort of violation, right?
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I think what we do here is let the season play out, then in late feb we launch an internal investigation regarding a minor ncaa rules infraction and as punishment we ban ourselves from post-season play this year and vacate all wins and losses.
Idk, that would really be achor. achor? More like a labor of love
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Forcing religion upon a team at a public school has to be some sort of violation, right?
It got Deb Patterson fired, didn't it?
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Why didn't I bet against them? Talk about easy cash. I'll have to look how we're doing ATS.
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(4) top 25 finishes in the past 30 years? It might be time to admit that it's hard to recruit/coach basketball in Manhattan ks
If only Manhattan were as appealing as, say, Ames, Iowa!
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Sitting at No. 96 after the Houston problem.
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Sitting at No. 96 after the Houston problem.
Wait, are you saying we're not a tournament caliber team?
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Sitting at No. 96 after the Houston problem.
Wait, are you saying we're not a tournament caliber team?
i think this team would be poised to make a deep tournament run as long as we don't run into any juggernauts.
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Real chance we end up in the triple digits after tonight’s home loss to Tech. It was close tho, and they are pretty good, so we may actually move up. Time will tell.
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the Red Raiders held Kansas State scoreless for the final 5-plus minutes in their 61-57 win on Tuesday night
We had something similar happen 2 games ago. This is disappointing. I’m just over here expecting to win.
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the Red Raiders held Kansas State scoreless for the final 5-plus minutes in their 61-57 win on Tuesday night
We had something similar happen 2 games ago. This is disappointing. I’m just over here expecting to win.
We played Tech close enough not to drop a single spot in the kenpoms
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Looks like the Cats had a 12 pt lead on the road with about 10 minutes to go and lost last night...
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Apathy has definitely set in on the basketball section of this blog. No game thread and hardly any posts :frown:
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I started watching when we had a 3 point lead and something happened where everyone was afraid to make a play. No one wants to shoot or create a shot. They were also having Hawkins chase around a shooting guard which was weird.
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Teams getting better imo but not enough and it's too late.
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I started watching when we had a 3 point lead and something happened where everyone was afraid to make a play. No one wants to shoot or create a shot. They were also having Hawkins chase around a shooting guard which was weird.
They were running some decent offense that got DNG good looks in the paint while building out the lead. Then went back to dribbling the ball 30 feet from the basket for 20 seconds and chucking a 3 at the end of the shot clock for some reason.
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D.Scott rejects the notion that we've lost any games lately.
https://www.kstatesports.com/sports/sportsextra/archives?page=1&path=se
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Trim, I was going to @ you last night because the game was on ESPNU, but there were no tac light type commercials. They've really upped their game, I was sad not to hear bub, bub, bub bubh, bulbhead, not a single time. I miss making fun of Big 12 hoops in gE chat :cry:
(https://images.crunchbase.com/image/upload/c_pad,h_256,w_256,f_auto,q_auto:eco,dpr_1/xyctug72gss31pi79y8u)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch9OS88nxZY
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Apathy has definitely set in on the basketball section of this blog. No game thread and hardly any posts :frown:
Yeah, I am full on it doesn't exist rn
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I started watching when we had a 3 point lead and something happened where everyone was afraid to make a play. No one wants to shoot or create a shot. They were also having Hawkins chase around a shooting guard which was weird.
Ha, I think we started watching at the same time. They were actually getting but passing up decent mid range looks only to dribble and pass around for another 10 seconds to take a way worse shot or throw the ball away. :sdeek:
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D.Scott rejects the notion that we've lost any games lately.
https://www.kstatesports.com/sports/sportsextra/archives?page=1&path=se
lol, He couldn't even come up with a puff piece in 3 weeks.
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D.Scott rejects the notion that we've lost any games lately.
https://www.kstatesports.com/sports/sportsextra/archives?page=1&path=se
lol, He couldn't even come up with a puff piece in 3 weeks.
Crisis of faith.
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Trim, I was going to @ you last night because the game was on ESPNU, but there were no tac light type commercials. They've really upped their game, I was sad not to hear bub, bub, bub bubh, bulbhead, not a single time. I miss making fun of Big 12 hoops in gE chat :cry:
(https://images.crunchbase.com/image/upload/c_pad,h_256,w_256,f_auto,q_auto:eco,dpr_1/xyctug72gss31pi79y8u)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch9OS88nxZY
I don't even get espnu anymore, but I'll acknowledge that game counts as being on tv. :lol:
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Who would you put at above 50% of being here next year?
Castillo, Hausen, and Tyreek Smith? Baye Fall?
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I'd put Taj Manning at 100%
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Sitting at No. 96 after the Houston problem.
The B12 is just too strong for us to drop much in kenpom it seems. We’ve actually gained a spot to No. 95 after the three straight losses following the Houston game.
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you don't realize how insignificant basketball is until your team sucks at it for a couple games
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you don't realize how insignificant basketball is until your team sucks at it for a couple years
Indeed
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D.Scott rejects the notion that we've lost any games lately.
https://www.kstatesports.com/sports/sportsextra/archives?page=1&path=se
lol, He couldn't even come up with a puff piece in 3 weeks.
Some words on being at a loss for words
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Who would you put at above 50% of being here next year?
Castillo, Hausen, and Tyreek Smith? Baye Fall?
I'd add Dug, CJ, and Mobi to this list
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Why are we -1.5 against WVU tomorrow? Does Vegas hate money??
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Who would you put at above 50% of being here next year?
Castillo, Hausen, and Tyreek Smith? Baye Fall?
I'd add Dug, CJ, and Mobi to this list
I like this list as long as we find 4-5 really good players in the portal, and maybe two assistant coaches.
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Why are we -1.5 against WVU tomorrow? Does Vegas hate money??
Vegas knows.
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Why are we -1.5 against WVU tomorrow? Does Vegas hate money??
Vegas knows.
Yeah they know more than anyone
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Who would you put at above 50% of being here next year?
Castillo, Hausen, and Tyreek Smith? Baye Fall?
I'd add Dug, CJ, and Mobi to this list
Dug?! You think he'll be want to stick around for another year to play for a guy that said he only started Dug because of "undeserved privilege"?
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His options may be limited
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We def need a new PG ready to be the man day 1.
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We def need a new PG ready to be the man day 1.
Losing Dai Dai was a killer. He’d be a junior with three years in the program starting next season with Castillo as a backup. I wish I knew the circumstances of him leaving/dug entering.
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We def need a new PG ready to be the man day 1.
Losing Dai Dai was a killer. He’d be a junior with three years in the program starting next season with Castillo as a backup. I wish I knew the circumstances of him leaving/dug entering.
Supposedly Dai dai’s ppl told him to bounce because he would get more money elsewhere. We should have matched.
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Dai Dai isn't very good
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anyone who says that dug isn’t a very good point guard doesn’t know basketball. ball don’t lie.
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Up to No. 68 after the win at ISU. I think we can shut this thread down for the season.
Good job of righting the ship by Tang and Co. A bit too late for an NCAA berth, but hopefully that can finish strong and build for the future.
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Waters calmed?
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Up to No. 68 after the win at ISU. I think we can shut this thread down for the season.
Good job of righting the ship by Tang and Co. A bit too late for an NCAA berth, but hopefully that can finish strong and build for the future.
I don’t think its too late. A play in is still on the table.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Greg we finished the regular season with 18 wins last year and then beat UT in the B12 tournament and still weren't even in the last 4 out. We would have to go 8/11 to finish the conference schedule and win another game in the tournament to just get to last year.