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General Discussion => The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit => Topic started by: gatoveintisiete on December 02, 2016, 05:25:54 PM
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The pros are pretty obvious, give companies a reason to do business in the USA, put the American worker back in the game. I'm sure there are cons let's discuss them.
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On what and how much
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Let's say OPEC over produces oil to flood the market and crash prices to a level that bankrupts American producers using more expensive methods, after they are gone OPEC cranks prices back up.
So let's say 45 puts a tariff on foreign oil to insure the American companies can keep producing and the tariffs from any foreign oil purchased by American companies go toward paying off national debt.
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I'm trying to picture Obama doing this and figure out how I would go about losing my crap over it.
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-Everything gets more expensive, all consumers end up paying a higher price for all goods and services
-Anti-capitalistic, doesn't play to America's competitive advantages
-Will promote US companies to find new ways to increase automation to reduce labor costs
Nothing like doing something to make things look good in the short term to hurt the long term. Even if it succeeds for a bit in getting those jobs here it'll only go back to it's slow march back to no tariffs and global free trade once everyone gets tired of spending the wages those companies dont want to pay for on goods that are more expensive.
FTR the Donald's plan to fix (if the carrier deal is to be seen as a precedent, and i guess coupled with tariffs of some kind) this is honestly not that different from what Bernie was wanting, both realized how things like NAFTA and free trade sucked the manufacturing away from the US, they will just go about it different ways but the idea of trying to keep manufacturing jobs here is the same. The answer though is simply if you want to make the economy like the 1950s, 1960s and 70s, you will get just that, a smaller and less powerful economy GDP wise, it's not like the economy hasn't grown since then (spoiler alert, it has).
Serious question, what do you think of those fast food workers asking for $15/hour? Cause if your answer is "those people need to keep advancing themselves and it's not supposed to be a living wage" and you laugh at the memes of automatic tellers and be like "yup see told you!" then how is a bunch of line workers with very little skill any different? You will get more factories like Elon Musk's gigafactory, which is basically a tribute to the alter of automation. And oh hai, lookie there, those workers still dont get any work cause they refuse to change to the new economy.
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So Obama guarantees his oil buddies a certain price for their oil. He tells Americans if they like their gas station they can keep it, and that their gas prices will go down (just lie to us) and then Subsidize the poor for their gas. I'd lose my crap.
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oh man, dax is going to really scorch your ass for wanting to make energy more expensive
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-Everything gets more expensive, all consumers end up paying a higher price for all goods and services
-Anti-capitalistic, doesn't play to America's competitive advantages
-Will promote US companies to find new ways to increase automation to reduce labor costs
Nothing like doing something to make things look good in the short term to hurt the long term. Even if it succeeds for a bit in getting those jobs here it'll only go back to it's slow march back to no tariffs and global free trade once everyone gets tired of spending the wages those companies dont want to pay for on goods that are more expensive.
FTR the Donald's plan to fix (if the carrier deal is to be seen as a precedent, and i guess coupled with tariffs of some kind) this is honestly not that different from what Bernie was wanting, both realized how things like NAFTA and free trade sucked the manufacturing away from the US, they will just go about it different ways but the idea of trying to keep manufacturing jobs here is the same. The answer though is simply if you want to make the economy like the 1950s, 1960s and 70s, you will get just that, a smaller and less powerful economy GDP wise, it's not like the economy hasn't grown since then (spoiler alert, it has).
Serious question, what do you think of those fast food workers asking for $15/hour? Cause if your answer is "those people need to keep advancing themselves and it's not supposed to be a living wage" and you laugh at the memes of automatic tellers and be like "yup see told you!" then how is a bunch of line workers with very little skill any different? You will get more factories like Elon Musk's gigafactory, which is basically a tribute to the alter of automation. And oh hai, lookie there, those workers still dont get any work cause they refuse to change to the new economy.
We're gonna need an answer to the automation thing.
It doesn't matter what the minimum wage is because it will always buy the least amount of crap in the market and the rest of the economy will just adjust for it, the adjustment will be painful and in the end nothing changes, that's why I don't support
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oh man, dax is going to really scorch your ass for wanting to make energy more expensive
I am just working through this in my head, have not formed my final opinion yet.
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the answer to automation is to go all in and also do a guaranteed income
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Sara palin is enraged
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Who is she?
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the answer to automation is to go all in and also do a guaranteed income
I don't like this solution.
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Oh man the crats could keep raising the tariffs to make room for unions to take things too far again, eff
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the answer to automation is to go all in and also do a guaranteed income
I don't like this solution.
We are going to have to get over the idea that working is necessary to "deserve" a living income over the course of the next 10-50 years
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35% tax. Everything is about to get very expensive
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the answer to automation is to go all in and also do a guaranteed income
I don't like this solution.
We are going to have to get over the idea that working is necessary to "deserve" a living income over the course of the next 10-50 years
Pretty much, or at least take a hard look at it. More and more people are going to be priced out of being able to work through no fault of their own.
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I honestly don't see any pros to tariffs. Maybe I'm missing something, though.