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General Discussion => The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit => Topic started by: sonofdaxjones on October 20, 2015, 09:33:54 AM
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Sounds pretty good.
Is the Federal Government in the course of providing "Free" college at public schools going to allow each school and/or college system and the respective oversight bodies to set policy, tuition/fees etc. etc. as they see fit? Is the Federal Government in the midst of paying billions for "Free" college going to allow each school or system to set curriculum/accreditation/course content/degree tracts etc. etc. as they see fit? Will the government in the course of the oversight review the political leanings and affiliations of those in charge of the schools/university systems and their respective oversight up through the state legislatures and governors? Will capital projects that are paid for with fees have to be approved by the Federal Government?
In a somewhat related note, I saw an article the other day, where I believe it was the faculty of Cornell said that allowing faculty members who were more conservative to teach at Cornell would diminish the quality of education at the school. Some of the answers they gave as to why were positively childish and immature. Painting a picture that anyone who might be of a conservative political viewpoint was going to walk in the hallowed doors of Cornell and immediately excoriate science, start talking about God and promptly deny Global Climate disruption. Yes, that's typically par for the course for individuals with the credentials to teach at a place like Cornell who might be conservative. :rolleyes: Sounds like a real open minded bunch.
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Increasing access to, and quality of, higher education is probably the best way to strengthen and grow the middle class.
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If they do this, is the government going to go back and help those that are struggling, making middle class $, while drowned in student loan debt?
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Increasing access to, and quality of, higher education is probably the best way to strengthen and grow the middle class.
While I agree that education is important, there must be jobs for these kids to fill. There's no economic sense in spending 4 years in school to get a communications degree and make $40k a year in some dead end crap job. I kinda think we are over-educated as it is right now, or at least educated in the wrong way. When a 30 y/o lineman in rural Kansas is making $100k a year, something is messed up.
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If they do this, is the government going to go back and help those that are struggling, making middle class $, while drowned in student loan debt?
Depends on who you are looking at. Sanders wants to make loans able to be restructured immediately at a very low rate. So, yeah.
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Can they touch Private student loans? For those who had to use them, because dependent students only get so much covered through government loans?
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Increasing access to, and quality of, higher education is probably the best way to strengthen and grow the middle class.
While I agree that education is important, there must be jobs for these kids to fill. There's no economic sense in spending 4 years in school to get a communications degree and make $40k a year in some dead end crap job. I kinda think we are over-educated as it is right now, or at least educated in the wrong way. When a 30 y/o lineman in rural Kansas is making $100k a year, something is messed up.
I certainly don't think we are over educated right now. I think there is a diff between being over educated and kids getting somewhat useless degrees in things that won't benefit them much other than simply having a diploma.
As for the lineman, you are as about supply/demand as it gets when talking about a technical job/hard physical job/and middle of no where usa. I heard a podcast last year than was about how the rural ks hospitals are using some recruiting plan/job structure that was developed by Doc's w/o Boarders to lure docs to middle of nowhere Africa.
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Can they touch Private student loans? For those who had to use them, because dependent students only get so much covered through government loans?
Don't know, Wacks. Assume that such a program would allow ppl to consolidate or refi any type of student loan, but I don't know for sure.
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I also think the more important component of the education push by sanders and others is the free pre school for all.
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if you could magically instantly give every American a bachelors degree of their choice for free, what would that change?
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Ehh, no thanks. I'd rather not pay to coddle kids with another 2-4 of highschool, which is what this will be. At some point, it's time to decide that you're either going to get a job or pay for some more advanced training. In other words, grow up.
Babysitting perpetual adolescents for another couple of years to "earn" some worthless degree is not going to help us.
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Increasing access to, and quality of, higher education is probably the best way to strengthen and grow the middle class.
the middle class, in the 20th century, was mostly made up of people who didn't go to college
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(https://fbcdn-photos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xta1/v/t1.0-0/p480x480/12143119_796792310430511_1383928269514302975_n.png?oh=1b42d073be7809264e4c5a1828665e24&oe=56BE9F88&__gda__=1456042749_e9d1b345a33c0d9e3ec4378e375bd493)
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to me the evaporation of the middle class has something to do with this
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.epi.org%2Ffiles%2Fcharts%2Fimg%2F7842.png&hash=d7b10cf6d88bad6c70da1811f8a196b48b834edd)
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So stocks have increased nearly 500% over the last half century? Thanks CEOs!
Seriously though, do you really think that paying a CEO of a large company a few million less is going to meaningfully increase every employees' wages? This line of thinking seems vaguely similar to the argument that we can meaningfully attack our deficits by raising taxes on the 1 percenters.
Also, what is "the middle class" nowdays? This will probably be the single most commonly uttered phrase out of politicans' mouths this election cycle, so it'd be nice if there was at least some agreement on what it is. Serious question.
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Of course none of you are taking on the ramifications to the individual schools. Unless you actually believe that the gov't is just going to write checks for tuition and fees with no strings attached.
Which could happen here in New Greece.
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This is why I actually agree with Obama's "make community college free." It would put a lot of students who have no business going to a 4 year college/ students who cannot afford four year degrees (or at least the debt those have with it) into a place where they can learn an employable skill and get a job that it above what a high schooler would get and live comfortably. It would make 4 year colleges still prestigious and would in my opinion lower the cost of 4 year colleges so they have to compete with students leaving to get a 2 year degree, all while overall costing taxpayers less. The real trick is convincing (or setting standards higher) students that such a path in going to a JuCo is still relatively lucrative, and and a better choice than trying to go to state college U and getting a degree in psychology/sociology/communications/insert worthless degree unless you get a masters+ with it and then graduate with massive amounts of debt and still be in no better place education wise than when you left high school but now you carry $80,000+ in debt.
I'm all for making college affordable, and that everyone regardless of economic background etc. should be able to go to college, but it's stupid to assume "everyone" can go to college. Some are cut out for it and others aren't. But those that aren't can still learn to be an IT tech, mechanic, welder, service repair person etc. and made some solid coin and live a good life.
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Has the middle class evaporated? :confused:
Second question, do you think this is contributing to global warming? :confused: :confused:
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Has the middle class evaporated? :confused:
Second question, do you think this is contributing to global warming? :confused: :confused:
Yes
Only if the middle class is greenhouse gas.
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New slaves
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the middle class is dead. There are only the 1%ers who go on $7k elk hunts and the 99% of us who are just trying to scrape up enough change to buy a new grill every 5 to 7 years
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i've never even known the pleasure of grill ownership :frown:
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i've never even known the pleasure of grill ownership :frown:
my mom said she was going to buy me one for my birthday this year (march). she still hasn't, and i mention it to her about twice a month.
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I'd be willing to guess the more the federal government has gotten involved in subsidizing or making higher education "free," the more it has ended up costing.
The cost of higher education has what, tripled in the last 15 years???
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Also, college is only a good idea if you major in something worthwhile (i.e., get a real job)
You want to curtail the individual debt load? Allow plaintiffs attorneys to sue every guidance counselor that ever told a kid he should go to the "best" college he could get into, study whatever he found neat, and borrow whatever it costs to get there. That reckless advice from someone in a position of trust is costing myriad french and social services master students half a million in debt and a life of indentured servitude to the man.
I fail to see how it is the responsibility of society to finance every misguided kid's 6-year curious trivial sampler curriculum at some $1300 per credit hour liberal arts school in rural iowa. We need educated people, not people that would smoke a couple categories on jeopardy.
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i've never even known the pleasure of grill ownership :frown:
my mom said she was going to buy me one for my birthday this year (march). she still hasn't, and i mention it to her about twice a month.
typical lib, looking for a handout. smdh
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i bought a new george foreman in the interim
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the middle class is dead. There are only the 1%ers who go on $7k elk hunts and the 99% of us who are just trying to scrape up enough change to buy a new grill every 5 to 7 years
Those two groups are not mutually exclusive. My grill is old as crap, but still works.
But if I get an elk I'll probably buy a new grill. :D
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i've never even known the pleasure of grill ownership :frown:
my mom said she was going to buy me one for my birthday this year (march). she still hasn't, and i mention it to her about twice a month.
Do you walk upstairs and ask her politely, or just holler from the basement?
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I'd be willing to guess the more the federal government has gotten involved in subsidizing or making higher education "free," the more it has ended up costing.
The cost of higher education has what, tripled in the last 15 years???
Yes.
Also, college is only a good idea if you major in something worthwhile (i.e., get a real job)
You want to curtail the individual debt load? Allow plaintiffs attorneys to sue every guidance counselor that ever told a kid he should go to the "best" college he could get into, study whatever he found neat, and borrow whatever it costs to get there. That reckless advice from someone in a position of trust is costing myriad french and social services master students half a million in debt and a life of indentured servitude to the man.
I fail to see how it is the responsibility of society to finance every misguided kid's 6-year curious trivial sampler curriculum at some $1300 per credit hour liberal arts school in rural iowa. We need educated people, not people that would smoke a couple categories on jeopardy.
Yes again. Instead of paying for "free" extended highschool, we should require every HS sophomore to attend a mandatory crash course in basic economics and fiscal common sense. Then a refresher course their senior year. I'd be willing to invest some money in that. It would slash the amount of crippling student loan debt and lead to a lot more productive degrees.
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i've never even known the pleasure of grill ownership :frown:
my mom said she was going to buy me one for my birthday this year (march). she still hasn't, and i mention it to her about twice a month.
She probably doesn't want you grilling in her basement.
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Why would I grill in her basement? You must be stupid
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Why would I grill in her basement? You must be stupid
Right. You only bake there.
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I don't think she even has a basement