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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Football => Topic started by: sonofdaxjones on August 22, 2015, 08:44:16 PM
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:impatient:
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I voted Average! #CartierFence3
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slightly above
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I'm glad you chose an appropriate magnitude for this scale
I also said average
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Compared to what? People at my office? Average
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where are my slightly below brothers at?
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Compared to what? People at my office? Average
I really like you, but sometimes you're just not funny.
Sorry, it has to be said. Have a good night, tho.
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it had to be said
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where are my slightly below brothers at?
here
I would only put us above ku, isu and maybe TT using the conference as a reference point. I just can't say a team with our skill players is average.
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it had to be said
Yep, still think he's a great guy though.
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our athletes are above average or we wouldn't have won as much as we have the last five years. good crap you dumbshits are dumber than i thought. i mean we are sitting at 14 votes and 12 of you dumbshits honestly think our football team is average or below atheletically.
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Half this team would struggle for a spot on any Jayhawk conference juco team.
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On a scale of 1-5 for athleticism we are a 4.1.
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On a scale of 1-5 for athleticism we are a 4.1.
Our backups are a 2.4. Our issue is depth. The front line guys are fine.
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On a scale of 1-5 for athleticism we are a 4.1.
Our backups are a 2.4. Our issue is depth. The front line guys are fine.
Yep. That doesn't fit our typical fan/media narrative, though.
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We might give SDSU a run for their money?
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"I had a buddy of mine tour the new facility recently and he saw a lot of the players while he was there. He said he came away unimpressed with the look of our team. Said they just didn't look athletic or fast or really that big. Said all the OL just looked fat and the receivers looked soft. Now I know Bill can turn poop into an all-star but it does kind of bother me that we aren't getting players that at least look athletic. Does that matter to anyone else?"
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"I had a buddy of mine tour the new facility recently and he saw a lot of the players while he was there. He said he came away unimpressed with the look of our team. Said they just didn't look athletic or fast or really that big. Said all the OL just looked fat and the receivers looked soft. Now I know Bill can turn poop into an all-star but it does kind of bother me that we aren't getting players that at least look athletic. Does that matter to anyone else?"
Have you seen our WRs?
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Average
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our athletes are above average or we wouldn't have won as much as we have the last five years. good crap you dumbshits are dumber than i thought. i mean we are sitting at 14 votes and 12 of you dumbshits honestly think our football team is average or below atheletically.
it had to be said
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3.5, maybe as high as 4 tho
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On a scale of 1-5 for athleticism we are a 4.1.
Our backups are a 2.4. Our issue is depth. The front line guys are fine.
I sorta agree with this. However, when you look at the results, I mean, it kind of looks like we are avg to slightly above avg throughout the roster, otherwise we'd should see more of a drop off, no? The 2 years we had really good seasons, we had players at key spots that were between good and great college players (Klein, Harper, TBL, Brown, Zimmerman?). In the DoD we had above avg to great/elite talent throughout the roster and our draft picks then vs. now validate that, imo (as does our records throughout those years).
2009 Snyder 6–6 4–4
2010 Snyder 7–6 3–5
2011 Snyder 10–3 7–2
2012 Snyder 11–2 8–1
2013 Snyder 8–5 5–4
2014 Snyder 9–4 7–2
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QBs - Average (Possibly Untalented, though)
WRs - Below Average
RBs - ??? (Jones is at best average but who knows about Silmon or Warmack)
OL - Above Average
DL - Above Average and talented but undersized
LBs - Currently way below average but the two Freshman are hopefully well above average
Secondary - Elite Status
A nice little average mix with above average coaching.
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Thought: Ask yourself these questions:
1. What percentage of the Big 12 teams are bigger/faster on average compared to KSU across the board (full roster)?
2. What percentage of the SEC teams are bigger/faster on the average compared to KSU across the board (full roster)?
3. ACC?
4. Big10?
5. PAC 12?
Then, ask the same question about the American Athletic, Mountain West, Mid-American, Conference USA, and Sun Belt Conferences. Oh, and don't forget the independents.
My guess is that many are considering the Power 5 conferences, and in that ranking, KSU ain't gonna look pretty. Where KSU gains ground is against the other FBS schools. The problem is, KSU is the peer of the Power 5 set, not the other group.
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I took major conference to mean power 5, like the one KSU is in, and thus measuring them against peers.
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On a scale of 1-5 for athleticism we are a 4.1.
Our backups are a 2.4. Our issue is depth. The front line guys are fine.
I think this hits the nail on the head.
A follow up question is where would you say Alabama's back ups ranked. 3.5? Freshmen and Sophomores tend to suck at football.
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I took major conference to mean power 5, like the one KSU is in, and thus measuring them against peers.
When I look at it from that view, it isn't pretty.
Now, how much KSU kids get molded helps make up for some of the raw ability others have, but it ain't pretty.
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On a scale of 1-5 for athleticism we are a 4.1.
Our backups are a 2.4. Our issue is depth. The front line guys are fine.
Year by year, this is where we stand as a program. We usually have 20 athletes that would compete for a starting position anywhere in the in conference. We don't often have that level of athlete backing them up.
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If our starters are good, and our backups are not good, then my vote of AVERAGE sounds just about right. IN YOUR FACE DARIS
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now wait just a minute, are you guys honestly trying to tell me that our starters are better and more athletic than their backups :Wha:
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because if so, we're doing it all wrong. i bet on most teams their backups are just as good or even better. i mean can you even imagine how athletic the back up colorado right guard must be? wow i bet super athletic. :lol:
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you dorks want so hard for our players to be below average and for bill to be some kind of genius that still manages to win 9 games every year. maybe coach weber can do the same thing in basketball. coach em up coach. talk with bill about how to do it! :ksu:
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My perception of the athleticism of teams in the BIG XII.
1. Baylor
2. TCU
3. Oklahoma
4. Oklahoma St
5. Texas
6. KSU
7. WVU
8. Tech
9. ISU
10. Kansas
My perception is we're average athletically.
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My perception of the athleticism of teams in the BIG XII.
1. Baylor
2. TCU
3. Oklahoma
4. Oklahoma St
5. Texas
6. KSU
7. WVU
8. Tech
9. ISU
10. Kansas
My perception is we're average athletically.
it's kind of weird how you peg the two best teams in conference as the most athletic and the two worst teams as the least athletic but then switch things up w/ kstate and rank them quite a bit lower than what their results would merit. it's ok though, kstaters as a whole seem to prefer that narrative. i get it. i mean it's still wrong, but i get it.
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so every year, the rankings of teams in terms of athleticism is exactly mirrored in the standings?
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so every year, the rankings of teams in terms of athleticism is exactly mirrored in the standings?
you tell me. i'm just going off your rankings and the fact that every team pretty much just falls into place except little ol kstate where our atheletes could never be as good as those at oklahoma state :ohno:
so much easier for people to accept the narrative that our athletes are average and bill miracle workers them, than it is to just give them the athletes the credit.
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OSU athletes are all shine no grind. We whooped them last year in every facet of the game, but now they are more athletic than us?
Btw, Texas 0-line was very trashy last year.
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so every year, the rankings of teams in terms of athleticism is exactly mirrored in the standings?
you tell me. i'm just going off your rankings and the fact that every team pretty much just falls into place except little ol kstate where our atheletes could never be as good as those at oklahoma state :ohno:
so much easier for people to accept the narrative that our athletes are average and bill miracle workers them, than it is to just give them the athletes the credit.
they also hate giving snyder credit for recruiting good athletes! why?
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now wait just a minute, are you guys honestly trying to tell me that our starters are better and more athletic than their backups :Wha:
The athleticism gap between our 1s and 2s is much greater than at schools like Ohio St, Alabama, etc. That's the difference. If one of their studs goes down they replace him with another stud. If one of our studs goes down they get replaced with a 5 heart walk on.
If JV was a thing in college football we would not be very good, at least in terms of athleticism.
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now wait just a minute, are you guys honestly trying to tell me that our starters are better and more athletic than their backups :Wha:
The athleticism gap between our 1s and 2s is much greater than at schools like Ohio St, Alabama, etc. That's the difference. If one of their studs goes down they replace him with another stud. If one of our studs goes down they get replaced with a 5 heart walk on.
If JV was a thing in college football we would not be very good, at least in terms of athleticism.
Yep, but how many schools have functional depth in the country, 6ish?
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now wait just a minute, are you guys honestly trying to tell me that our starters are better and more athletic than their backups :Wha:
The athleticism gap between our 1s and 2s is much greater than at schools like Ohio St, Alabama, etc. That's the difference. If one of their studs goes down they replace him with another stud. If one of our studs goes down they get replaced with a 5 heart walk on.
If JV was a thing in college football we would not be very good, at least in terms of athleticism.
Yep, but how many schools have functional depth in the country, 6ish?
How many of our 22 starters could go down before you noticed a significant difference in how good our team is? 2? 3?
That number is much larger at several schools, especially at the skill positions.
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I think our #2 QB is probably more athletic than our #1.
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now wait just a minute, are you guys honestly trying to tell me that our starters are better and more athletic than their backups :Wha:
The athleticism gap between our 1s and 2s is much greater than at schools like Ohio St, Alabama, etc. That's the difference. If one of their studs goes down they replace him with another stud. If one of our studs goes down they get replaced with a 5 heart walk on.
If JV was a thing in college football we would not be very good, at least in terms of athleticism.
Yep, but how many schools have functional depth in the country, 6ish?
How many of our 22 starters could go down before you noticed a significant difference in how good our team is? 2? 3?
That number is much larger at several schools, especially at the skill positions.
Depends on the guy and the position. But if Baylor or TCU loses one of their studs I think they are hurting to a point where it matters. Bama, FSU and OSU can lose a stud and just move forward because of their collective whole is that damn good.
I think we could survive a corner, TE, FB or DT going down this year. maybe running back. Every thing else we would be hurting.
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(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi4.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy110%2FTHE_agnax%2FKUAthlete.jpg&hash=967f6029b12de8a62580d3cc6ff5630bcdeb4a55)
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OSU athletes are all shine no grind. We whooped them last year in every facet of the game, but now they are more athletic than us?
Btw, Texas 0-line was very trashy last year.
But the shine and no grind, as often is, is about how the programs are run. I'd generally love to have a bit more of the "raw" materials they have at UT, or even OSU. They just need a better atmosphere to maximize their potential.
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so every year, the rankings of teams in terms of athleticism is exactly mirrored in the standings?
you tell me. i'm just going off your rankings and the fact that every team pretty much just falls into place except little ol kstate where our atheletes could never be as good as those at oklahoma state :ohno:
so much easier for people to accept the narrative that our athletes are average and bill miracle workers them, than it is to just give them the athletes the credit.
I watched every game last year. There were IMO 5 games where one team was significantly more athletic than the other:
1. Baylor
2. TCU
3. Tech
4. Kansas
5. ISU
The other conference games, I don't recall PERCIEVING a big difference in athletes one way or the other. And yes, we kicked OSU's ass, but they had the worst offensive execution and QB play i can remember from a Gundy team.
Its perception Daris. the thread is about perception.
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so every year, the rankings of teams in terms of athleticism is exactly mirrored in the standings?
you tell me. i'm just going off your rankings and the fact that every team pretty much just falls into place except little ol kstate where our atheletes could never be as good as those at oklahoma state :ohno:
so much easier for people to accept the narrative that our athletes are average and bill miracle workers them, than it is to just give them the athletes the credit.
they also hate giving snyder credit for recruiting good athletes! why?
doesn't fit the narrative
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so every year, the rankings of teams in terms of athleticism is exactly mirrored in the standings?
you tell me. i'm just going off your rankings and the fact that every team pretty much just falls into place except little ol kstate where our atheletes could never be as good as those at oklahoma state :ohno:
so much easier for people to accept the narrative that our athletes are average and bill miracle workers them, than it is to just give them the athletes the credit.
they also hate giving snyder credit for recruiting good athletes! why?
they are more comfortable with a good strong midwestern work ethic being the reason for our success than they are with us just having guys that can run faster. having guys that run faster seems kind of cheating/using a shortcut.
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Where's dax?
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In a large sense it's also about Bill being "the face" of the program in all facets. It's all about LHC Bill Snyder as chess master and the players are just interchangeable faceless pieces*. Success is solely due to Bill in all aspects. To give credit to simply having a better player is to lessen the shine on the glory that is Bill's coaching, and in effect lessen the shine on KSU football as an entity.
Now I don't think Bill sees it this way, but like any very successful coach (especially one who turns around a moribund program) he has worshippers. KSU football for good and for bad* is LHC Bill Snyder football.
*Until something goes wrong and then they become identifiable as the players unable to "fit in" or understand the system.
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In a large sense it's also about Bill being "the face" of the program in all facets. It's all about LHC Bill Snyder as chess master and the players are just interchangeable faceless pieces*. Success is solely due to Bill in all aspects. To give credit to simply having a better player is to lessen the shine on the glory that is Bill's coaching, and in effect lessen the shine on KSU football as an entity.
Now I don't think Bill sees it this way, but like any very successful coach (especially one who turns around a moribund program) he has worshippers. KSU football for good and for bad* is LHC Bill Snyder football.
*Until something goes wrong and then they become identifiable as the players unable to "fit in" or understand the system.
Do you really think a coach is going to take the blame when things go wrong. There's millions of bucks involved here and no kid is going to mess that up.
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In a large sense it's also about Bill being "the face" of the program in all facets. It's all about LHC Bill Snyder as chess master and the players are just interchangeable faceless pieces*. Success is solely due to Bill in all aspects. To give credit to simply having a better player is to lessen the shine on the glory that is Bill's coaching, and in effect lessen the shine on KSU football as an entity.
Now I don't think Bill sees it this way, but like any very successful coach (especially one who turns around a moribund program) he has worshippers. KSU football for good and for bad* is LHC Bill Snyder football.
*Until something goes wrong and then they become identifiable as the players unable to "fit in" or understand the system.
Do you really think a coach is going to take the blame when things go wrong. There's millions of bucks involved here and no kid is going to mess that up.
No, of course I don't.
I was talking about how our fans react.
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In a large sense it's also about Bill being "the face" of the program in all facets. It's all about LHC Bill Snyder as chess master and the players are just interchangeable faceless pieces*. Success is solely due to Bill in all aspects. To give credit to simply having a better player is to lessen the shine on the glory that is Bill's coaching, and in effect lessen the shine on KSU football as an entity.
Now I don't think Bill sees it this way, but like any very successful coach (especially one who turns around a moribund program) he has worshippers. KSU football for good and for bad* is LHC Bill Snyder football.
*Until something goes wrong and then they become identifiable as the players unable to "fit in" or understand the system.
Do you really think a coach is going to take the blame when things go wrong. There's millions of bucks involved here and no kid is going to mess that up.
No, of course I don't.
I was talking about how our fans react.
You're a fan, aren't ya?
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In a large sense it's also about Bill being "the face" of the program in all facets. It's all about LHC Bill Snyder as chess master and the players are just interchangeable faceless pieces*. Success is solely due to Bill in all aspects. To give credit to simply having a better player is to lessen the shine on the glory that is Bill's coaching, and in effect lessen the shine on KSU football as an entity.
Now I don't think Bill sees it this way, but like any very successful coach (especially one who turns around a moribund program) he has worshippers. KSU football for good and for bad* is LHC Bill Snyder football.
*Until something goes wrong and then they become identifiable as the players unable to "fit in" or understand the system.
Do you really think a coach is going to take the blame when things go wrong. There's millions of bucks involved here and no kid is going to mess that up.
No, of course I don't.
I was talking about how our fans react.
You're a fan, aren't ya?
Indeed.
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In a large sense it's also about Bill being "the face" of the program in all facets. It's all about LHC Bill Snyder as chess master and the players are just interchangeable faceless pieces*. Success is solely due to Bill in all aspects. To give credit to simply having a better player is to lessen the shine on the glory that is Bill's coaching, and in effect lessen the shine on KSU football as an entity.
Now I don't think Bill sees it this way, but like any very successful coach (especially one who turns around a moribund program) he has worshippers. KSU football for good and for bad* is LHC Bill Snyder football.
*Until something goes wrong and then they become identifiable as the players unable to "fit in" or understand the system.
Do you really think a coach is going to take the blame when things go wrong. There's millions of bucks involved here and no kid is going to mess that up.
No, of course I don't.
I was talking about how our fans react.
You're a fan, aren't ya?
Indeed.
Well then is that the way you feel about it, because I don't. #generalization
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In a large sense it's also about Bill being "the face" of the program in all facets. It's all about LHC Bill Snyder as chess master and the players are just interchangeable faceless pieces*. Success is solely due to Bill in all aspects. To give credit to simply having a better player is to lessen the shine on the glory that is Bill's coaching, and in effect lessen the shine on KSU football as an entity.
Now I don't think Bill sees it this way, but like any very successful coach (especially one who turns around a moribund program) he has worshippers. KSU football for good and for bad* is LHC Bill Snyder football.
*Until something goes wrong and then they become identifiable as the players unable to "fit in" or understand the system.
Do you really think a coach is going to take the blame when things go wrong. There's millions of bucks involved here and no kid is going to mess that up.
No, of course I don't.
I was talking about how our fans react.
You're a fan, aren't ya?
Indeed.
Well then is that the way you feel about it, because I don't. #generalization
#whysodefensive
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I just get tired of posters calling KSU fans a bunch of stupid hicks; unable to think like a gE'er.
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Like, guys that run fast have to work hard to run fast.
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I just get tired of posters calling KSU fans a bunch of stupid hicks; unable to think like a gE'er.
no one called KSU fans hicks. chings eloquently stated his position.
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I just get tired of posters calling KSU fans a bunch of stupid hicks; unable to think like a gE'er.
Well I certainly did not do that. This is not a KSU-specific thought process.
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Like, guys that run fast have to work hard to run fast.
Most Olympic athletes practice most hours of the day to train to be the best; so yea I suppose they do.
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I would assume that outside of the top tier football programs, every team has a similar number of athletic kids. I think everyone would agree that we prefer players who know the playbook over kids who are athletic to a fault. I do not think that many other schools show as big of bias towards kids knowing the playbook as we do. That coupled with our success makes me think we have an average number of athletic kids (since our success would indicate that we have more athletic kids than other programs).
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Anyone who thinks the Katz' athletes are below average is a rough ride'n idiot. J_Squaks outed
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daris is using Snyder 2.0 to support his stance that KSU is very athletic, but i think a lot of people are answering the original question based on the perception of where the team is at going into 2015. 2015 KSU football does not seem very athletic compared to 2011, 2012, 2013 KSU football. :dunno:
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daris is using Snyder 2.0 to support his stance that KSU is very athletic, but i think a lot of people are answering the original question based on the perception of where the team is at going into 2015. 2015 KSU football does not seem very athletic compared to 2011, 2012, 2013 KSU football. :dunno:
I think we look less athletic when we have more unknowns going into the season, but once the seasons starts that can change really quickly. I think we are more athletic at every position group on defense compared to last year. We really didn't lose any freaks. Now Lee is going to be in the field more and he might be the freak of the freaks defensively during Bill 2.0. In fact if Kaleb plays their is another freak of the freaks on the field.
Offensively we lose one of the best in Tyler, but we could add as a whole. All of our running backs were broken last year. Our makeshift offensive line has a good chance to be less makeshift.
I think we currently have the best raw athleticism from underclassmen that we have had in a long long time.
It think this group lacks more than experience than raw athleticism and they can be exchange to a degree.
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I don't understand. Did you mean on a scale of Waters to Sams?