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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Football => Topic started by: sonofdaxjones on August 02, 2015, 11:33:59 PM
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Why I'm Rooting for the Big 12 to Be Left Out of the Playoff
2:40 PM
(10 votes)
Yes, I want to see our beloved conference get embarrassed again this year by being the only P5 conference left out of the playoff. I'll be rooting hard for the noncon opponents of TCU, BU, and OU to beat them and for the league contenders to beat each other up so that no one makes the playoff. What would really be golden would be for OU to be in the discussion and be shunned by the playoff committee. Why? Because I want to see OU get really serious about leaving this conference for the Big 10 with KU. And I want it to happen within the next couple of years, not 7 years from now.
Everyone who knows anything about college football knows that the Big 12 is Dead Man Walking and that it's only a question of when, not if, the conference goes the way of the dinosaurs. Until recently, I thought it unlikely it would occur before 2020 because of the GOR. However, after Boren's comments about OU's dissatisfaction with the conference resulted in all this speculation about a deal under which KU and OU would go to the Big 10, I've come to the belief that there is a real chance it could happen in the next couple years if things break right. I'm not a lawyer, but I've heard that many lawyers question the enforceability of the GOR-- that a court might conclude that it is unenforceable as a penalty or as overly punitive for merely breaching a contract. Also, it's possible, if not likely, that UT would leave the conference to go to the SEC or Pac when it is announced that KU and OU are leaving. Then it would be a mad scramble for all the other conference members to find homes in P4 conferences, with maybe two being successful. In that event, it would be impossible for the down and out members like KSU to enforce the GOR.
Going to the Big 10 would be a huge win for KU in so many ways. Academically, it is in a different galaxy than the Big 12. I actually think it would give KU a better chance of digging its football program out of the mess it is in. Minnesota, Illinois, Iowa and Northwestern would be schools that KU would have a chance of competing against in football. And I'd take our chances against Wisconsin or Nebraska over UT. Let's face it, in the Big 12 we'll always be taking the leftover recruits in Texas that don't get offers from all the conference schools that are within driving distance of their homes. And the minute KU goes to the Big 10 with KSU left to wallow in a non-P4 conference, we get our choice of all the Kansas and KC area recruits. And Big 10 basketball would be great for our BB program. I've seen many posts by Big 10 fans on message boards about how amazing it would be to have KU in their conference because of our elite BB program. It's heartening to see on all these message boards the amount of respect KU has across the country as a true blueblood BB program. I've come to believe that we are on strong ground whenever realignment does get hot again, provided Bernie and Sheahon Gump don't massively F up in the discussions and negotiations. I just want this to happen NOW, not 7 years from now.
Last edited 08/02/2015 1:22 PMby hawkfanatic
This is the kind of selfish stuff that's gaining a foot hold with little brother. First off, the Big 12 has been incredible for KU. KU has won many conference basketball championships in a row. The Big 12 allowed KU to go negotiate directly with the Orange Bowl providing the greatest moment for KU football over the last fifty years. Big 12 basketball officials have defined a system that perfects the "not the number of fouls called, and when who they're called or not called on" system that helps KU basketball a lot, which is fine. The Big 12 has made Kansas a very high revenue athletic program (albeit they seemingly can barely manage their expenses) and allows KU to pocket their relatively lucrative Tier III deal. The Big 12 gives KU access to Texas recruits.
Really, fanatic, you're gonna survive off of recruiting . . . Kansas City and Kansas? :lol: :lol: :lol: You brought in a football coach with supposedly huge Texas ties and you're gonna cut off his legs because you have such low self esteem that you don't think KU can stand on it own and thus must go suckle from Momma BiG, where KU will be a second class citizen for years?
Making the college football playoffs puts a lot extra money into the Big 12. Sadly lil Bro is extremely selfish. Based on how they're barely balancing their athletic budget, you'd think they'd want that money.
Sad
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he makes some very informed points
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Sure, but then he also makes some very dumb points.
I don't get this extreme butthurt about K-State, it borders on paranoia. K-State and KU are not going to be tied together.
When KU doesn't win the BiG 10 times in a row in basketball, are KU fans going to run around waving the conference banner because that's all they've got, like MU fans and a bunch of the SEC schools do because they never win anything in the SEC?
The BiG would be 16 teams, the pod system makes it more difficult to establish rivalries. Oh sure, KU would probably be back to playing Nebraska. So what's old is new again. KU losses to Nebraska every year in football because while weakend Nebraska is far more established, and KU beats Nebraska in basketball. Now that's an excitement generator. I suspect Corn fans would like it because then they could fill up Memorial Stadium on an easy road trip.
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Whoever wrote that is almost certainly a psychopath. No GoEMAWing.
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There is already a case study that shows that going from the Big 12 to the Big 10 is bad for business. Nebraska was already a fading national power in the old Big 12, and left thinking they could get away from mean ol Texas. Well now Nebraska isn't just fading, but completely gone from national recognition. Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, and to a lesser extent Wisconsin, all have more national notoriety than Nebraska. Hell, even Penn State amid all of their problems are still more noticed than Nebraska football. They are an afterthought. If ku fans want the same to happen to their hallowed basketball program, then enjoy the ride, cause it's a fast downhill slope.
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Again, the only way KU fans think they can make their football program better is to separate themselves from K-State by being in different conferences. Not sure why they think we would be left out of a P4 conference. Pretty weird actually....
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My boss, who is a Penn State grad, signs his emails with his initials 'GBR'. When I pointed out to him and the rest of our team that Nebraska fans use that as an acronym for Go Big Red, neither he nor anyone else knew that. Included in the group was a Michigan State fan and an Auburn fan.
Nebraska is officially irrelevant.
Gonna win 'em all!
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Case closed
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They want to be us :frown:
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If they were so vastly superior to us, they should already get the pick of the litter. I mean they own kc and everything.
It's just another case of a school with massive insecurities. Which is the real problem with every school that had left thus far. Colorado is probably the exception.
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That person has some serious issues with Kansas State University.
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It's going to be a lot harder to decouple us if we don't have a soft landing spot. That's not as easy as everyone thinks it will be.
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If they were so vastly superior to us, they should already get the pick of the litter. I mean they own kc and everything.
It's just another case of a school with massive insecurities. Which is the real problem with every school that had left thus far. Colorado is probably the exception.
Yes, this is very true.
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It's just another case of a school with massive insecurities. Which is the real problem with every school that had left thus far. Colorado is probably the exception.
So this pretty much confirms ku is leaving.
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Use of the term "P4 Conference" is a nice touch
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They just want to avoid the annual beat downs in all sports that we lay on them. I can get that. It's why Nebraska and MU left.
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Also, is it really THAT hard to at some point have success against Texas? Everyone besides ISU and KU have
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Also, is it really THAT hard to at some point have success against Texas? Everyone besides ISU and KU have
Everyone that didn't, left.
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"Everyone who knows anything about college football knows . . . " Pretty much excludes all KU fans.
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It's going to be a lot harder to decouple us if we don't have a soft landing spot. That's not as easy as everyone thinks it will be.
Decoupling will be easy if someone else breaks up the Big 12, and KSU, KU and everyone else are scrambling for a home. In that scenario, I think KU could easily break away.
Decoupling by being the program that breaks up the Big 12? I don't see the BOR ever agreeing to that.
In other words, if someone else (Texas? OU?) causes the downfall of K-State, then the BoR isn't going to force KU to go down as well. If KU tries to cause the downfall of KSU, things will not go the way they're hoping.
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It's going to be a lot harder to decouple us if we don't have a soft landing spot. That's not as easy as everyone thinks it will be.
Decoupling will be easy if someone else breaks up the Big 12, and KSU, KU and everyone else are scrambling for a home. In that scenario, I think KU could easily break away.
Decoupling by being the program that breaks up the Big 12? I don't see the BOR ever agreeing to that.
In other words, if someone else (Texas? OU?) causes the downfall of K-State, then the BoR isn't going to force KU to go down as well. If KU tries to cause the downfall of KSU, things will not go the way they're hoping.
That's the thing, OU is in the same boat.
Think them blowing up the Big 12 and leaving OSU without a life raft is going to go over well? Of course it's not. And, as you say, KU is in the same boat. If the Big 12 is still viable, the KBOR isn't going to allow KU to blow up the Big 12 so they can, maybe, beat Northwestern and join the CIC. That's just stupid.
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They hate us cause the anus
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KU-KSU hasn't been a real rivalry for well over 20 years. They can't compete with us in FB and they dominate in BB. It warmed up a bit in FB when Mangino was in Lawrence, but Ron was in charge here, so it didn't really catch fire. THe Huggy/Frank era also started some excitement, but that all went to Hell too quickly. I don't know if I would really miss them and wouldn't be butt-hurt if they did move on. Its a shame though. They don't care about FB and our AD doesn't GAF about BB apparently. Sad, really. :frown:
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Really bozo, you're going to sad, really a dax thread? How dare you
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I don't get this extreme butthurt about K-State, it borders on paranoia. K-State and KU are not going to be tied together.
Explain.
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My favorite was when he brought academics into the picture.
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It's going to be a lot harder to decouple us if we don't have a soft landing spot. That's not as easy as everyone thinks it will be.
Decoupling will be easy if someone else breaks up the Big 12, and KSU, KU and everyone else are scrambling for a home. In that scenario, I think KU could easily break away.
Decoupling by being the program that breaks up the Big 12? I don't see the BOR ever agreeing to that.
In other words, if someone else (Texas? OU?) causes the downfall of K-State, then the BoR isn't going to force KU to go down as well. If KU tries to cause the downfall of KSU, things will not go the way they're hoping.
Forget the BOR. Why on earth would the big 10 want to add schools by having courts rule that GORs are invalid. The big 10 schools are bound by a GOR. They're not in danger, of losing anyone but they still don't want all of their members to suddenly become free agents. That doesn't exactly drive up the value of the big 10 Network.
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It's going to be a lot harder to decouple us if we don't have a soft landing spot. That's not as easy as everyone thinks it will be.
Decoupling will be easy if someone else breaks up the Big 12, and KSU, KU and everyone else are scrambling for a home. In that scenario, I think KU could easily break away.
Decoupling by being the program that breaks up the Big 12? I don't see the BOR ever agreeing to that.
In other words, if someone else (Texas? OU?) causes the downfall of K-State, then the BoR isn't going to force KU to go down as well. If KU tries to cause the downfall of KSU, things will not go the way they're hoping.
Forget the BOR. Why on earth would the big 10 want to add schools by having courts rule that GORs are invalid. The big 10 schools are bound by a GOR. They're not in danger, of losing anyone but they still don't want all of their members to suddenly become free agents. That doesn't exactly drive up the value of the big 10 Network.
BoR refers to the Kansas Board of Regents, which governs KSU, KU and all of the smaller colleges in the state. The KSBOR would not allow KU to make a move that brings about the downfall of K-State and the Big 12. If the Big 12 has already been killed, then I don't think the BoR would stand in anybody's way as they look for a life raft.
The GOR, or Grant of Rights, is a completely separate topic and a whole other can of worms.
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There's a lot of "sky is falling, Big 12 is doomed" going on. Is this just a response to the not adding 2 more schools, or are we supposed to believe the Big 12 is dying?
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There's a lot of "sky is falling, Big 12 is doomed" going on. Is this just a response to the not adding 2 more schools, or are we supposed to believe the Big 12 is dying?
Because what ou ad said. And if they leave, the
conference is doomed
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There's a lot of "sky is falling, Big 12 is doomed" going on. Is this just a response to the not adding 2 more schools, or are we supposed to believe the Big 12 is dying?
Because what ou ad said. And if they leave, the
conference is doomed
I've heard the OU doesn't want to leave. They supposedly want us to add 2 and have a CCG sooner than later and are trying to force it. They don't think much of Bowlsby just kind of floating along. Sounds like instead of pushing the NCAA on the CCG with 10, he's just in wait and see mode.
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Floating along, and wait and see, is the right mode to be in. Plus, it's the will of the school presidents, not just Bowlsby being a doofus.
Looking back at Boren's statement, he says expansion with the right schools. Does anyone believe he was referring to Memphis or Cincy or UCF? Not me.
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It's going to be a lot harder to decouple us if we don't have a soft landing spot. That's not as easy as everyone thinks it will be.
Decoupling will be easy if someone else breaks up the Big 12, and KSU, KU and everyone else are scrambling for a home. In that scenario, I think KU could easily break away.
Decoupling by being the program that breaks up the Big 12? I don't see the BOR ever agreeing to that.
In other words, if someone else (Texas? OU?) causes the downfall of K-State, then the BoR isn't going to force KU to go down as well. If KU tries to cause the downfall of KSU, things will not go the way they're hoping.
Forget the BOR. Why on earth would the big 10 want to add schools by having courts rule that GORs are invalid. The big 10 schools are bound by a GOR. They're not in danger, of losing anyone but they still don't want all of their members to suddenly become free agents. That doesn't exactly drive up the value of the big 10 Network.
BoR refers to the Kansas Board of Regents, which governs KSU, KU and all of the smaller colleges in the state. The KSBOR would not allow KU to make a move that brings about the downfall of K-State and the Big 12. If the Big 12 has already been killed, then I don't think the BoR would stand in anybody's way as they look for a life raft.
The GOR, or Grant of Rights, is a completely separate topic and a whole other can of worms.
I understand that. My point is that it will never get that far. The big 10 depends heavily upon GORs being ironclad. The last thing they would want to do is encourage schools to find a way to have GORs deemed invalid because the big 10's GOR would also become worthless.
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Which schools in the big 10 would be looking to jump? Why would they GAF if Grant of Rights became unenforceable. tOSU isn't going to the Pac or SEC neither is Michigan, or anyone. They don't care or worry about someone being a free agent
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Which schools in the big 10 would be looking to jump? Why would they GAF if Grant of Rights became unenforceable. tOSU isn't going to the Pac or SEC neither is Michigan, or anyone. They don't care or worry about someone being a free agent
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The contracts are enforceable by the networks, not the schools. They are not going to let money run away. This is why, unlike the conference "let's stay together" contracts, these GOR contracts are almost impossible to get out of.
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I can see if schools like Rutgers can become free agents they would shop around for the best deal. ACC, SEC, they can offer the NE market and a easy football win for almost everyone on their schedule.
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Soon, if/when any big ego schools become free agents/begin looking at other options, they'll add up the numbers that their own tier 3 network could bring in, plus Big 12 money, that will blow their current conference payout out of the water.
Being bound by a conference network will hurt schools in the long run and things could get interesting, the Big 12 just has to tread water until then.
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Soon, if/when any big ego schools become free agents/begin looking at other options, they'll add up the numbers that their own tier 3 network could bring in, plus Big 12 money, that will blow their current conference payout out of the water.
Being bound by a conference network will hurt schools in the long run and things could get interesting, the Big 12 just has to tread water until then.
I would think we got a minimum of ten years or longer if they extend the GOR.
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Soon, if/when any big ego schools become free agents/begin looking at other options, they'll add up the numbers that their own tier 3 network could bring in, plus Big 12 money, that will blow their current conference payout out of the water.
Being bound by a conference network will hurt schools in the long run and things could get interesting, the Big 12 just has to tread water until then.
This isn't going to happen. The Big 12 sold virtually all of its content just to stay competitive, price-wise. Our Tier 1/2 contracts are comparable to other leagues, but will never blow anyone out of the water. Especially the big 10 or SEC.
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If the Big 12 "sold nearly all of its content" for Tier 1/2. Than there wouldn't be an LHN, there wouldn't be other Tier III deals grossing $4 to $8 million dollars per school. You think anyone is going to pay KU $6 million dollars a year just for the radio rights in 2015?
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Got in to it with a Nubb(football)/KU(basketball) fan this morning over the state of the Big12. Told me the Big12 wouldn't make it another 5 years and Oklahoma and KU are the only 2 teams who would land on their feet when the conference collapsed because of how valuable both schools are. Said when KU's football program gets turned around they'll be the most valuable school in the conference and will be heavily courted by the SEC and Big10 and will leave the conference for greener pastures in 5 years then Oklahoma will follow their lead and the conference will collapse.
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when did you move to Portland?
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Got in to it with a Nubb(football)/KU(basketball) fan this morning over the state of the Big12. Told me the Big12 wouldn't make it another 5 years and Oklahoma and KU are the only 2 teams who would land on their feet when the conference collapsed because of how valuable both schools are. Said when KU's football program gets turned around they'll be the most valuable school in the conference and will be heavily courted by the SEC and Big10 and will leave the conference for greener pastures in 5 years then Oklahoma will follow their lead and the conference will collapse.
:lol: Texas isn't going to make it.
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when did you move to Portland?
Never?? :dunno:
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when did you move to Portland?
This made me smile and laugh
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when did you move to Portland?
Well played sir.
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Took me longer than it should, I have to admit
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Damnit, Tobias... I don't get the joke.... :bang:
:buh-bye:
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Berms related. My guess.
Gonna win 'em all!
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Doesn't OregonHawk live in Portland? That's my guess. :dunno:
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Doesn't OregonHawk live in Portland? That's my guess. :dunno:
Seems like a legit reason