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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Basketball is hard => Topic started by: _33 on January 23, 2013, 03:11:46 PM
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It's just that it's become so physical that nothing cool ever happens. It doesn't flow at all. Shooters suck for the most part so everyone just clogs the lane to make sure nothing exciting takes place. I know people love the intensity of the defense and stuff (I did too under Frank because we were winning) but it's hard to watch. They need to adopt several NBA rules (hand checks, defensive 3 sec, 24 sec clock, etc.) to open the game up. Allow skilled players to play.
Do you guys think this is just sour grapes from the game last night? Maybe. But I've been feeling this way for a while. I've watched zero college basketball games this year that don't involve KSU. Of course I probably only watched a couple college football games that didn't involve KSU. Maybe I'm just becoming less of a sports "junkie".
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sorry about your grapes
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Sounds like this grape has gone sour!
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I love college BB and don't really enjoy the NBA.
If you like bb with the NBA rules so much, I would recommend you watch the NBA.
Just like the charge circle, if they want to get the game back to the skill players, they have the rules needed to do so.
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It's just that it's become so physical that nothing cool ever happens. It doesn't flow at all. Shooters suck for the most part so everyone just clogs the lane to make sure nothing exciting takes place. I know people love the intensity of the defense and stuff (I did too under Frank because we were winning) but it's hard to watch. They need to adopt several NBA rules (hand checks, defensive 3 sec, 24 sec clock, etc.) to open the game up. Allow skilled players to play.
Do you guys think this is just sour grapes from the game last night? Maybe. But I've been feeling this way for a while. I've watched zero college basketball games this year that don't involve KSU. Of course I probably only watched a couple college football games that didn't involve KSU. Maybe I'm just becoming less of a sports "junkie".
I'd stay away from the Big 10 Network if I were you
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It's just that it's become so physical that nothing cool ever happens. It doesn't flow at all. Shooters suck for the most part so everyone just clogs the lane to make sure nothing exciting takes place. I know people love the intensity of the defense and stuff (I did too under Frank because we were winning) but it's hard to watch. They need to adopt several NBA rules (hand checks, defensive 3 sec, 24 sec clock, etc.) to open the game up. Allow skilled players to play.
Do you guys think this is just sour grapes from the game last night? Maybe. But I've been feeling this way for a while. I've watched zero college basketball games this year that don't involve KSU. Of course I probably only watched a couple college football games that didn't involve KSU. Maybe I'm just becoming less of a sports "junkie".
I agree that they need to make some rule changes. The game is way too slow and way too physical. Less talented teams will always try to junk things up and slow games down, though, regardless of what level or what sport we're talking about.
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I would like a shorter shot clock. Why do the women have a 30 second clock? I have no idea why it isn't 24 seconds like the NBA.
Interesting wiki (history of the shot clock): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shot_clock
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I would like a shorter shot clock. Why do the women have a 30 second clock? I have no idea why it isn't 24 seconds like the NBA.
Interesting wiki (history of the shot clock): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shot_clock
I agree, 35 seconds is way too long imo. 28 or 30 would benefit the game more than it would hurt it
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
It really is.
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
It really is.
Meh... have you ever been to a live NBA game? The atmosphere is terrible, and the game doesn't really get intense until the 4th quarter. The product has improved a lot over the years, and the players are ridiculously good, but I still think the college game is better overall when you factor in March Madness and the live game experience.
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With Weber's desired style, would a shorter shot clock, defensive 3 sec's etc. etc. help or hurt. I am inclined to think help.
Now I admit, I do watch some NBA games and actually enjoy them more than I did, but I just don't follow it that closely, so when you reference hand checking in the NBA, are they allowing more of it or less? (honestly don't know) :dunno:
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
It really is.
Meh... have you ever been to a live NBA game? The atmosphere is terrible, and the game doesn't really get intense until the 4th quarter. The product has improved a lot over the years, and the players are ridiculously good, but I still think the college game is better overall when you factor in March Madness and the live game experience.
You're clearly going to the wrong games then. I've attended games at Denver, Dallas, OKC, and Chicago and have absolutely no complaints about the atmosphere in any of those places. A Deroit vs Sacremento product is going to be pretty horrible, but so is a matchup between TCU and Texas Tech.
The average college basketball experience isn't Allen Fieldhouse. It isn't even Bramlage. Most college basketball games are 58-54 shitfests where the whole time fouls out involving Utah and Colorado on a Tuesday night in front of 6000 bored fans. It's a shitty product in shitty venues almost all the time.
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With Weber's desired style, would a shorter shot clock, defensive 3 sec's etc. etc. help or hurt. I am inclined to think help.
Now I admit, I do watch some NBA games and actually enjoy them more than I did, but I just don't follow it that closely, so when you reference hand checking in the NBA, are they allowing more of it or less? (honestly don't know) :dunno:
please consider the fact that oscar is essentially an NBA development enzyme. your Q? has been answered.
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The average college basketball experience isn't Allen Fieldhouse. It isn't even Bramlage. Most college basketball games are 58-54 shitfests where the whole time fouls out involving Utah and Colorado on a Tuesday night in front of 6000 bored fans. It's a shitty product in shitty venues almost all the time.
you're clearly going to the wrong college games then.
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The average college basketball experience isn't Allen Fieldhouse. It isn't even Bramlage. Most college basketball games are 58-54 shitfests where the whole time fouls out involving Utah and Colorado on a Tuesday night in front of 6000 bored fans. It's a shitty product in shitty venues almost all the time.
you're clearly going to the wrong college games then.
They seem to universally turn out to be 58-54 shitfests :dunno:
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my mom's been saying this forever. maybe she was on to something.
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There are lots of sucky games with 340+ Div 1 bball teams
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The NBA playoffs are the greatest.
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
I've tried. I really have. I just can't to it. It seems to me the players are too good/too fast for the officials. Every close game gets decided by the officials. I don't think they are really sure on 90% of the calls they make, they're just making their best guess.
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
It really is.
Meh... have you ever been to a live NBA game? The atmosphere is terrible, and the game doesn't really get intense until the 4th quarter. The product has improved a lot over the years, and the players are ridiculously good, but I still think the college game is better overall when you factor in March Madness and the live game experience.
You're clearly going to the wrong games then. I've attended games at Denver, Dallas, OKC, and Chicago and have absolutely no complaints about the atmosphere in any of those places. A Deroit vs Sacremento product is going to be pretty horrible, but so is a matchup between TCU and Texas Tech.
The average college basketball experience isn't Allen Fieldhouse. It isn't even Bramlage. Most college basketball games are 58-54 shitfests where the whole time fouls out involving Utah and Colorado on a Tuesday night in front of 6000 bored fans. It's a shitty product in shitty venues almost all the time.
I've been to multiple Portland Trailblazers games, where they've sold out 100+ consecutive times and have the 4th best attendance in the NBA. The Rose Garden is a great venue, and the games are a lot of fun. It just has kind of a ticky tack, corporate feel to it compared to the atmosphere at AFH and other college venues. I like the pep band, the student section, the tradition, the coaching legacies. College basketball just feels more "real" to me, if that makes any sense.
College basketball needs to make some rule changes (shorten the shot clock, expand the lane, defensive 3 seconds, etc.), but the one thing that's really hurting the quality of the game is the one-and-done rule. The best players are going pro after one year, whereas in football they're required to stay in school for three years. It hurts a lot of programs establish consistency from class-to-class. That's why teams like Gonzaga and Butler are so good nowadays. Most of their players are "program" players, who stay in school for at least 3-4 years and develop their games.
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I think college bb is much more entertaining. Not speaking against skill or ability, but strictly entertainment for me.
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
It really is.
Meh... have you ever been to a live NBA game? The atmosphere is terrible, and the game doesn't really get intense until the 4th quarter. The product has improved a lot over the years, and the players are ridiculously good, but I still think the college game is better overall when you factor in March Madness and the live game experience.
yeah, atmosphere is the only way it is better (and only in a select few venues - I mean the Pac 12 arenas are all pretty much snooze-fests). The players, quality of play, style of play, rules, the strategy associated with a grueling season, the playoffs (I mean the 7 game series are probably the best sporting events in the world), and just about everything else is better in the pros.
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There is nothing better than watching Eastern Washington vs Portland St at midnight on a monday because you have $100 on PSU +8
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Start watching the NBA, you rubes. It's basically a million times better than college in almost every way imaginable.
It really is.
Meh... have you ever been to a live NBA game? The atmosphere is terrible, and the game doesn't really get intense until the 4th quarter. The product has improved a lot over the years, and the players are ridiculously good, but I still think the college game is better overall when you factor in March Madness and the live game experience.
You're clearly going to the wrong games then. I've attended games at Denver, Dallas, OKC, and Chicago and have absolutely no complaints about the atmosphere in any of those places. A Deroit vs Sacremento product is going to be pretty horrible, but so is a matchup between TCU and Texas Tech.
The average college basketball experience isn't Allen Fieldhouse. It isn't even Bramlage. Most college basketball games are 58-54 shitfests where the whole time fouls out involving Utah and Colorado on a Tuesday night in front of 6000 bored fans. It's a shitty product in shitty venues almost all the time.
I've been to multiple Portland Trailblazers games, where they've sold out 100+ consecutive times and have the 4th best attendance in the NBA. The Rose Garden is a great venue, and the games are a lot of fun. It just has kind of a ticky tack, corporate feel to it compared to the atmosphere at AFH and other college venues. I like the pep band, the student section, the tradition, the coaching legacies. College basketball just feels more "real" to me, if that makes any sense.
College basketball needs to make some rule changes (shorten the shot clock, expand the lane, defensive 3 seconds, etc.), but the one thing that's really hurting the quality of the game is the one-and-done rule. The best players are going pro after one year, whereas in football they're required to stay in school for three years. It hurts a lot of programs establish consistency from class-to-class. That's why teams like Gonzaga and Butler are so good nowadays. Most of their players are "program" players, who stay in school for at least 3-4 years and develop their games.
also we should eliminate the 3 point line to make it tougher for those pesky upstarts
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With Weber's desired style, would a shorter shot clock, defensive 3 sec's etc. etc. help or hurt. I am inclined to think help.
Now I admit, I do watch some NBA games and actually enjoy them more than I did, but I just don't follow it that closely, so when you reference hand checking in the NBA, are they allowing more of it or less? (honestly don't know) :dunno:
I don't want to see a shorter shot clock in college. The guards aren't skilled enough and they would be getting into their offensive sets way too late and there would just be more terrible shots. I think this would further separate the haves from the have nots as a shorter shot clock puts a premium on athleticism and skill. I don't think Weber's offense would work as well having 14 seconds to find an open shot as opposed to 25.
Women having a shorter shot clock is further interesting considering that they don't have a 10 second backcourt count.
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also we should eliminate the 3 point line to make it tougher for those pesky upstarts
Looking forward to this in March :popcorn:
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With Weber's desired style, would a shorter shot clock, defensive 3 sec's etc. etc. help or hurt. I am inclined to think help.
Now I admit, I do watch some NBA games and actually enjoy them more than I did, but I just don't follow it that closely, so when you reference hand checking in the NBA, are they allowing more of it or less? (honestly don't know) :dunno:
I don't want to see a shorter shot clock in college. The guards aren't skilled enough and they would be getting into their offensive sets way too late and there would just be more terrible shots. I think this would further separate the haves from the have nots as a shorter shot clock puts a premium on athleticism and skill. I don't think Weber's offense would work as well having 14 seconds to find an open shot as opposed to 25.
Women having a shorter shot clock is further interesting considering that they don't have a 10 second backcourt count.
yeah, eventually you'd have to have much more transition offense instead of over-thinking college coaching dumbasses demanding stupid ass sets.
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What about clamping down on the contact and the grinding, wouldn't that seemingly free up a motion style offense??? . . . the other points about sets, and getting somebody open with a shorter shot clock and a motion style offense make sense. Would be interesting to see what K-State's average time before the first shot of each possession goes up.
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With Weber's desired style, would a shorter shot clock, defensive 3 sec's etc. etc. help or hurt. I am inclined to think help.
Now I admit, I do watch some NBA games and actually enjoy them more than I did, but I just don't follow it that closely, so when you reference hand checking in the NBA, are they allowing more of it or less? (honestly don't know) :dunno:
I don't want to see a shorter shot clock in college. The guards aren't skilled enough and they would be getting into their offensive sets way too late and there would just be more terrible shots. I think this would further separate the haves from the have nots as a shorter shot clock puts a premium on athleticism and skill. I don't think Weber's offense would work as well having 14 seconds to find an open shot as opposed to 25.
Women having a shorter shot clock is further interesting considering that they don't have a 10 second backcourt count.
yeah, eventually you'd have to have much more transition offense instead of over-thinking college coaching dumbasses demanding stupid ass sets.
There are 300+ D1 teams, 60+ "high major teams." I don't think there are nor will there ever be enough good guards to make this watchable. The defenses won't get any worse. I really don't think I could stand to see 99% of these college teams forced to play up tempo because they have to get shots off.
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What about clamping down on the contact and the grinding, wouldn't that seemingly free up a motion style offense???
That's certainly an issue, but the lack of skill is a more prevalent one. Can you imagine what will happen when they inevitably let HS grads back in the draft? Woof! There needs to be serious rule modifications to make this sport more watchable. I don't think the shot clock is the answer, but I do think there should be defensive rule changes. Just insisting/asking/hoping officials to call it tighter isn't a reasonable solution.
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With Weber's desired style, would a shorter shot clock, defensive 3 sec's etc. etc. help or hurt. I am inclined to think help.
Now I admit, I do watch some NBA games and actually enjoy them more than I did, but I just don't follow it that closely, so when you reference hand checking in the NBA, are they allowing more of it or less? (honestly don't know) :dunno:
I don't want to see a shorter shot clock in college. The guards aren't skilled enough and they would be getting into their offensive sets way too late and there would just be more terrible shots. I think this would further separate the haves from the have nots as a shorter shot clock puts a premium on athleticism and skill. I don't think Weber's offense would work as well having 14 seconds to find an open shot as opposed to 25.
Women having a shorter shot clock is further interesting considering that they don't have a 10 second backcourt count.
yeah, eventually you'd have to have much more transition offense instead of over-thinking college coaching dumbasses demanding stupid ass sets.
There are 300+ D1 teams, 60+ "high major teams." I don't think there are nor will there ever be enough good guards to make this watchable. The defenses won't get any worse. I really don't think I could stand to see 99% of these college teams forced to play up tempo because they have to get shots off.
It would evolve. I mean, we could be doing so much more with Angel if we had a shorter shot clock. Guards would be given more freedom and more emphasis would be placed in development of scoring off the dribble. (at least for good coaches).
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When i try to watch the nba, i don't enjoy it because everyone is too good. Seems like every shot falls, and it's boring to me.
For similar reasons i like college fb more than the nfl.
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When i try to watch the nba, i don't enjoy it because everyone is too good. Seems like every shot falls, and it's boring to me.
For similar reasons i like college fb more than the nfl.
there isn't a team in the NBA that shoots over 50%.
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When i try to watch the nba, i don't enjoy it because everyone is too good. Seems like every shot falls, and it's boring to me.
For similar reasons i like college fb more than the nfl.
The whole NBA thing seems less tense. I like like the tension. Maybe that is I emotionally place the tension on the game, but I don't think that is the case. I get this from games that have two teams I care nothing about.
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With Weber's desired style, would a shorter shot clock, defensive 3 sec's etc. etc. help or hurt. I am inclined to think help.
Now I admit, I do watch some NBA games and actually enjoy them more than I did, but I just don't follow it that closely, so when you reference hand checking in the NBA, are they allowing more of it or less? (honestly don't know) :dunno:
I don't want to see a shorter shot clock in college. The guards aren't skilled enough and they would be getting into their offensive sets way too late and there would just be more terrible shots. I think this would further separate the haves from the have nots as a shorter shot clock puts a premium on athleticism and skill. I don't think Weber's offense would work as well having 14 seconds to find an open shot as opposed to 25.
Women having a shorter shot clock is further interesting considering that they don't have a 10 second backcourt count.
yeah, eventually you'd have to have much more transition offense instead of over-thinking college coaching dumbasses demanding stupid ass sets.
There are 300+ D1 teams, 60+ "high major teams." I don't think there are nor will there ever be enough good guards to make this watchable. The defenses won't get any worse. I really don't think I could stand to see 99% of these college teams forced to play up tempo because they have to get shots off.
That's why you would have to also adopt rules that would make the game less physical (especially in the back court as it relates to guards bumping, riding and hand checking out top) and obviously adopting a defensive 3 second rule. Defenses would get "worse" in that they would be able to play as physical and they couldn't clog up the lane.
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It just has kind of a ticky tack, corporate feel to it compared to the atmosphere at AFH and other college venues. I like the pep band, the student section, the tradition, the coaching legacies. College basketball just feels more "real" to me, if that makes any sense.
Good point. I feel this way for any pro team/sport.
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There is way more tension in a NCAABB game than an NBA game, but man it's fun to watch an NBA game every once in a while just to see the insane shots/plays that those players can consistently make.
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When i try to watch the nba, i don't enjoy it because everyone is too good. Seems like every shot falls, and it's boring to me.
For similar reasons i like college fb more than the nfl.
The whole NBA thing seems less tense. I like like the tension. Maybe that is I emotionally place the tension on the game, but I don't think that is the case. I get this from games that have two teams I care nothing about.
Same problem as MLB: too many games in the regular season.