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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Basketball is hard => Topic started by: kstater on March 04, 2012, 03:28:59 PM
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Defensive Player of the Year: Jeff Withey, Kansas, C, Jr., 7-0, 235,
Newcomer of the Year: Royce White, Iowa State, F, So., 6-8, 270,
Co-Coaches of the Year: Fred Hoiberg, Iowa State Bill Self, Kansas
Sixth Man of the Year: Michael Dixon, Missouri, G, Jr., 6-1, 185, :nono:
Big 12 All-Rookie Team Pos. Ht. Wt.
Pierre Jackson, Baylor** G 5-10 180
Quincy Miller, Baylor F 6-9 210
Royce White, Iowa State** F 6-8 270
Le'Bryan Nash, Oklahoma State G/F 6-7
Myck Kabongo, Texas G 6-1 169
Co-Freshman of the Year: Quincy Miller, Baylor, Le'Bryan Nash, Oklahoma State
Big 12 All-Defensive
Team Pos. Ht. Wt. Cl.
Quincy Acy, Baylor F 6-7 235 Sr.
Jeff Withey, Kansas C 7-0 235 Jr.
Jordan Henriquez, Kansas State F 6-11 250 Jr.
Rodney McGruder, Kansas State G 6-4 205 Jr.
Michael Dixon, Missouri G 6-1 185 Jr.
Player of the Year: Thomas Robinson, Kansas
All-Big 12 First Team Pos. Ht. Wt. Cl. Hometown/Previous School(s)
Royce White, Iowa State** F 6-8 270 So. Minneapolis, Minn./Hopkins/Minnesota
Thomas Robinson, Kansas** F 6-10 237 Jr. Washington, D.C./Brewster Academy [N.H.]
Tyshawn Taylor, Kansas** G 6-3 185 Sr. Hoboken, N.J./St. Anthony
Marcus Denmon, Missouri G 6-3 185 Sr. Kansas City, Mo./Hogan Prep
J'Covan Brown, Texas G 6-1 197 Jr. Port Arthur, Texas/Memorial
All-Big 12 Second Team Pos. Ht. Wt. Cl. Hometown/Previous School(s)
Quincy Acy, Baylor F 6-7 235 Sr. Mesquite, Texas/Horn
Pierre Jackson, Baylor G 5-10 180 Jr. Las Vegas, Nev./Desert Pines/College of Southern Idaho
Rodney McGruder, Kansas State G 6-4 205 Jr. Washington, D.C./Arlington Country Day [Fla.]
Ricardo Ratliffe, Missouri F 6-8 240 Sr. Hampton, Va./Kecoughtan/Central Florida CC
Keiton Page, Oklahoma State G 5-9 165 Sr. Pawnee, Okla./Pawnee
All-Big 12 Third Team Pos. Ht. Wt. Cl. Hometown/Previous School(s)
Perry Jones III, Baylor F 6-11 235 So. Duncanville, Texas/Duncanville
Scott Christopherson, Iowa State G 6-3 195 Sr. LaCrosse, Wis./Aquinas/Marquette
Jeff Withey, Kansas C 7-0 235 Jr. San Diego, Calif./Horizon
Kim English, Missouri G 6-6 200 Sr. Baltimore, Md./Randallstown/Notre Dame Prep
Phil Pressey, Missouri G 5-10 175 So. Dallas, Texas/Dallas Episcopal
All-Big 12 Honorable Mention (Listed alphabetically by school)
Quincy Miller (Baylor), Chris Allen (Iowa State), Melvin Ejim (Iowa State), Jamar Samuels (Kansas State), Steven Pledger (Oklahoma), Romero Osby (Oklahoma), Le'Bryan Nash (Oklahoma State), Myck Kabongo (Texas), Elston Turner (Texas A&M), David Loubeau (Texas A&M)
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Love this. Hope the coaches keep all MU players off the all-league teams.
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Do they announce All Conference team with this?
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Yeah, will be last.
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Kabongo over Angel :flush:
What would Angels numbers looked like if he played for Barnes and was allowed to do whatever the hell he wanted to do?
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I was pretty pissed about that.
Question: If there was a Big 12 All-Adorable team, would it be Kim English plus 4 Wild Wildcats, or simply 5 Wild Wildcats?
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Tigerboards meltdown is amusing. Apparently inheriting a team with a eff ton of seniors and not winning a league title warrants COY.
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Tigerboards meltdown is amusing. Apparently inheriting a team with a eff ton of seniors and not winning a league title warrants COY.
Shouldn't have been co Hoiberg had no business being around that award. Maybe before the season ends he can get his best player to play hard for more than 7 minutes a game.
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Kobango is better than Angel. Hurts to say but it's true.
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Kobango is better than Angel. Hurts to say but it's true.
Maybe, but every time I've seen Kabongo play personally, he's been terrible.
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Grudz and JO All-defensive team.
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Kobango is better than Angel. Hurts to say but it's true.
How do you figure? He's better at getting to the rim. He isn't nearly the shooter, passer, or defender.
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Curtis Kitchen's meltdown is better than tigerboard's.
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Curtis Kitchen's meltdown is better than tigerboard's.
twitter, or what?
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
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Curtis Kitchen's meltdown is better than tigerboard's.
twitter, or what?
Twitter
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
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These awards are Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!). Only give reasons for fan bases to bitch.
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Would like them better if they had misc awards like "most likely to miss a clutch free throw" and let the players vote.
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
How?
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
How?
Kabongo is better than Angel in the areas you originally mentioned, statistically.
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
Kabongo is better in almost every category... maybe I'm failing to see your point?
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So if you include honorable mentions, 25 players made "All Big-XII". There are 50 starters in the Big XII.
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
How?
Kabongo is better than Angel in the areas you originally mentioned, statistically.
What? Angel scores more points per 40, has a higher 3 point percentage, more steals and more rebounds per 40 minutes. When you look at those numbers you need to remember that 1. Myck plays 9 more MPG and 2. Myck has a lot more freedom on the floor. The higher FG% is attributable to his ability to get to the basket that I said. He has a great assist total, I'll bet you anything that with J'Covan gone next year Kabongo's assist numbers will fall. Another thing to consider that those numbers don't show is the trend of the players as the season has progressed.
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
Kabongo is better in almost every category... maybe I'm failing to see your point?
Did anyone check to see that Kabongo is playing 9 more minutes per game? Is that too close to the top?
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So if you include honorable mentions, 25 players made "All Big-XII". There are 50 starters in the Big XII.
Last year they put either 6 or 7 on the first team. I think the teams are pretty good. If I were voting I'd trade Brown for Jackson, Withey for Ratliffe, and Page for Christopherson.
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
How?
Kabongo is better than Angel in the areas you originally mentioned, statistically.
What? Angel scores more points per 40, has a higher 3 point percentage, more steals and more rebounds per 40 minutes. When you look at those numbers you need to remember that 1. Myck plays 9 more MPG and 2. Myck has a lot more freedom on the floor. The higher FG% is attributable to his ability to get to the basket that I said. He has a great assist total, I'll bet you anything that with J'Covan gone next year Kabongo's assist numbers will fall. Another thing to consider that those numbers don't show is the trend of the players as the season has progressed.
Maybe you should read the stats again. Kabongo has better:
O-rating
3PT%
eFG%
True Shooting %
A/T Ratio
Assist %
TO%
When you're comparing PGs, that's pretty much "checkmate."
(I am still #teamangel though.)
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http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez (http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?add=myck-kabongo&p1=angel-rodriguez)
You kind of destroyed your own point there...
How?
Kabongo is better than Angel in the areas you originally mentioned, statistically.
What? Angel scores more points per 40, has a higher 3 point percentage, more steals and more rebounds per 40 minutes. When you look at those numbers you need to remember that 1. Myck plays 9 more MPG and 2. Myck has a lot more freedom on the floor. The higher FG% is attributable to his ability to get to the basket that I said. He has a great assist total, I'll bet you anything that with J'Covan gone next year Kabongo's assist numbers will fall. Another thing to consider that those numbers don't show is the trend of the players as the season has progressed.
Maybe you should read the stats again. Kabongo has better:
O-rating
3PT%
eFG%
True Shooting %
A/T Ratio
Assist %
TO%
When you're comparing PGs, that's pretty much "checkmate."
(I am still #teamangel though.)
The 3 point percentages were the same. I've already explained how I view the FG% numbers, pretty sure I said Myck is better at getting to the basket.
BTW since Angel was benched against OU, he's had more points and assists per 40 and less turnovers. I didn't check the percentages, didn't want or need to.
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I think the "per 40" talking point is kind of shitty. idk, maybe I'm in the minority here.
I just see that Kabongo is better in almost every category and that makes me think "gee, he's probably the better player this season" :dunno:
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I think the "per 40" talking point is kind of shitty. idk, maybe I'm in the minority here.
I just see that Kabongo is better in almost every category and that makes me think "gee, he's probably the better player this season" :dunno:
That's simple as hell. It isn't shitty when there is a 9 mpg difference. 9 minutes, not 2, do you have any idea how relevant that is? When you are assessing how good a player is you can't penalize a guy because of the system he runs. If Myck was here and Angel was somewhere else do you really think he'd play 30 mpg?
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I think the "per 40" talking point is kind of shitty. idk, maybe I'm in the minority here.
I just see that Kabongo is better in almost every category and that makes me think "gee, he's probably the better player this season" :dunno:
That's simple as hell. It isn't shitty when there is a 9 mpg difference. 9 minutes, not 2, do you have any idea how relevant that is? When you are assessing how good a player is you can't penalize a guy because of the system he runs. If Myck was here and Angel was somewhere else do you really think he'd play 30 mpg?
Honestly, they are statistically really similar, with Kabongo having a slight edge in most categories.
It's like 2 football teams, one with 300 ypg and the other 400. Which offense is better? There are all types of arguments you can use. "Well, Team A is run first, so their 300 ypg is more impressive." yadda yadda yadda.
Idk man, when I see things like 3pt% and A/TO I don't think minutes per game really has an effect on those categories. :dunno:
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I think the "per 40" talking point is kind of shitty. idk, maybe I'm in the minority here.
I just see that Kabongo is better in almost every category and that makes me think "gee, he's probably the better player this season" :dunno:
That's simple as hell. It isn't shitty when there is a 9 mpg difference. 9 minutes, not 2, do you have any idea how relevant that is? When you are assessing how good a player is you can't penalize a guy because of the system he runs. If Myck was here and Angel was somewhere else do you really think he'd play 30 mpg?
Honestly, they are statistically really similar, with Kabongo having a slight edge in most categories.
It's like 2 football teams, one with 300 ypg and the other 400. Which offense is better? There are all types of arguments you can use. "Well, Team A is run first, so their 300 ypg is more impressive." yadda yadda yadda.
Idk man, when I see things like 3pt% and A/TO I don't think minutes per game really has an effect on those categories. :dunno:
The per 40 has no bearing on percentages. I see those two players and I think Angel is better. As you said most of their numbers are similar, I'll go back to my points about how they've played in conference and how their stats are trending and games growing. I'm also fairly certain that if both players were on this roster Kabongo would need to learn to guard and to not freelance as much or he would be behind Angel.
I like his ability to get to the basket, I think it is very important, I just think Angel literally does everything else better.
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So if you include honorable mentions, 25 players made "All Big-XII". There are 50 starters in the Big XII.
lol
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I think the "per 40" talking point is kind of shitty. idk, maybe I'm in the minority here.
I just see that Kabongo is better in almost every category and that makes me think "gee, he's probably the better player this season" :dunno:
That's simple as hell. It isn't shitty when there is a 9 mpg difference. 9 minutes, not 2, do you have any idea how relevant that is? When you are assessing how good a player is you can't penalize a guy because of the system he runs. If Myck was here and Angel was somewhere else do you really think he'd play 30 mpg?
Honestly, they are statistically really similar, with Kabongo having a slight edge in most categories.
It's like 2 football teams, one with 300 ypg and the other 400. Which offense is better? There are all types of arguments you can use. "Well, Team A is run first, so their 300 ypg is more impressive." yadda yadda yadda.
Idk man, when I see things like 3pt% and A/TO I don't think minutes per game really has an effect on those categories. :dunno:
The per 40 has no bearing on percentages. I see those two players and I think Angel is better. As you said most of their numbers are similar, I'll go back to my points about how they've played in conference and how their stats are trending and games growing. I'm also fairly certain that if both players were on this roster Kabongo would need to learn to guard and to not freelance as much or he would be behind Angel.
I like his ability to get to the basket, I think it is very important, I just think Angel literally does everything else better.
Maybe, but he isn't on this roster.
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as much as i love mcgruder, if he's an all big 12 perimeter defender, this is a bad year for perimeter defense in the big 12.
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Remember when Jake didn't win POY last year, GTFOOMFA
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as much as i love mcgruder, if he's an all big 12 perimeter defender, this is a bad year for perimeter defense in the big 12.
I suppose he is seen as the team leader and of course Frank's defensive teams are rightfully respected so he was picked. I was surprised to see JO essentially ride a 6 game streak onto that team. Before the second KU game JO was just over 1 BPG in conference play.
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Tigerboards meltdown is amusing. Apparently inheriting a team with a eff ton of seniors and not winning a league title warrants COY.
Shouldn't have been co Hoiberg had no business being around that award. Maybe before the season ends he can get his best player to play hard for more than 7 minutes a game.
Oh no business at all...Just winning 12 conference games, when his team won 3 all of last year...Setting the Big 12 record for biggest turnaround in conference wins...Also RW is so talented its effortless for him...doesn't need to show physical strain to be the best all around player in the conference, let alone division 1 basketball....Leading his team in Points, Assists, Rebounds, Steals, and Blocks per game...
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Tigerboards meltdown is amusing. Apparently inheriting a team with a eff ton of seniors and not winning a league title warrants COY.
Shouldn't have been co Hoiberg had no business being around that award. Maybe before the season ends he can get his best player to play hard for more than 7 minutes a game.
Oh no business at all...Just winning 12 conference games, when his team won 3 all of last year...Setting the Big 12 record for biggest turnaround in conference wins...Also RW is so talented its effortless for him...doesn't need to show physical strain to be the best all around player in the conference, let alone division 1 basketball....Leading his team in Points, Assists, Rebounds, Steals, and Blocks per game...
That biggest turnaround record is quite significant with two more conference games. Maybe he shouldn't have went 3-13 last year :dunno: As for Royce not needing to play hard all game, you're right I guess he doesn't need to. I suppose Flood Aggy is good with being a 8 seed after finishing 3rd in the #2 rated conference, I suppose its okay to be the best talent in the league but completely off the radar for the POY and won't be considered for AA honors at all. It's all good when your coach let's you do whatever the hell you want.
BTW great court storming last night after beating the 4th place team in the conference. Hilton Magic for sure.
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BTW great court storming last night after beating the 4th place team in the conference. Hilton Magic for sure.
I about spit out my RC Cola when I watched that happen.
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Tigerboards meltdown is amusing. Apparently inheriting a team with a eff ton of seniors and not winning a league title warrants COY.
Shouldn't have been co Hoiberg had no business being around that award. Maybe before the season ends he can get his best player to play hard for more than 7 minutes a game.
Oh no business at all...Just winning 12 conference games, when his team won 3 all of last year...Setting the Big 12 record for biggest turnaround in conference wins...Also RW is so talented its effortless for him...doesn't need to show physical strain to be the best all around player in the conference, let alone division 1 basketball....Leading his team in Points, Assists, Rebounds, Steals, and Blocks per game...
That biggest turnaround record is quite significant with two more conference games. Maybe he shouldn't have went 3-13 last year :dunno: As for Royce not needing to play hard all game, you're right I guess he doesn't need to. I suppose Flood Aggy is good with being a 8 seed after finishing 3rd in the #2 rated conference, I suppose its okay to be the best talent in the league but completely off the radar for the POY and won't be considered for AA honors at all. It's all good when your coach let's you do whatever the hell you want.
BTW great court storming last night after beating the 4th place team in the conference. Hilton Magic for sure.
We'll see after next weekend, I'm sure the Mayor and Co. aren't content with just being in the tournament, they'll do some damage down in KC.....Also I was at the game in the student section but I didn't storm the court, ISU was supposed to win...2 pt favorite at tip-off...I thought it was complete asinine to do so...its Baylor, a team that hadn't ever won in Hilton, 0-10 all-time....
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BTW great court storming last night after beating the 4th place team in the conference. Hilton Magic for sure.
I about spit out my RC Cola when I watched that happen.
Kwik Shop doesn't have RC Cola. It's irritating.
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BTW great court storming last night after beating the 4th place team in the conference. Hilton Magic for sure.
I about spit out my RC Cola when I watched that happen.
Kwik Shop doesn't have RC Cola. It's irritating.
Well yeah. That's bullshit.
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BTW great court storming last night after beating the 4th place team in the conference. Hilton Magic for sure.
:sdeek:
They actually did this?
:lol: if true
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"Hilton Magic" is getting old. But yes, they really stormed the court
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
Yep. Storm the eff out of it.
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
But we stormed that first year, right?
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
But we stormed that first year, right?
Just the KU game iirc and that was in January
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
Fair point. Hilton Magic is so strong it will carry you into the NCAA tournament once every 5 years.
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
But we stormed that first year, right?
Just the KU game iirc and that was in January
I only remember 3 OOD stormings in my lifetime; UT (Wooly), KU (Mike/Beasley), KU (Jake).
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
Fair point. Hilton Magic is so strong it will carry you into the NCAA tournament once every 5 years.
that was mediocre coaching and talent that did that.
it wasnt hilton magic that beat us in manhattan.
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ECN...back in the house. welcome.
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ECN...back in the house. welcome.
:sdeek:
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
Fair point. Hilton Magic is so strong it will carry you into the NCAA tournament once every 5 years.
that was mediocre coaching and talent that did that.
it wasnt hilton magic that beat us in manhattan.
:confused: so the court storming was a delayed reaction to the one good road win they had, the reasoning for these random court rushes is confusing
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
Fair point. Hilton Magic is so strong it will carry you into the NCAA tournament once every 5 years.
that was mediocre coaching and talent that did that.
it wasnt hilton magic that beat us in manhattan.
:confused: so the court storming was a delayed reaction to the one good road win they had, the reasoning for these random court rushes is confusing
what? no.
i believe the purpose of said stormage of courtage is because of a great year. beating baylor to solidify 3rd in a league they were predicted to finish last probably, and light years ahead from last with an exceptional turnaround. its like blowing a load after being in prison for years and years.
good to be back gang.
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Oh okay I see. Just think its weird to see a court storming for a third place finish, I suppose there is some reason that storming the court for that is rare. They were picked 8th BTW.
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AP teams are out, in the article, just saw that Venson Hamilton was the Big XII POY in 1999... wow.
http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20120305/SPORTS020604/120305012/Iowa-State-s-Royce-White-named-to-AP-s-all-Big-12-team?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Sports
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I freakin LOVE the fact the all the coaches in the small XII are all giving mizzou the finger on the way out by not voting Haith the COY. LOVE IT. :love: :love: :love: :love:
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
Fair point. Hilton Magic is so strong it will carry you into the NCAA tournament once every 5 years.
that was mediocre coaching and talent that did that.
it wasnt hilton magic that beat us in manhattan.
Nope, It was.....
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thesportsbank.net%2Fcore%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F08%2Fscott-christopherson.jpg&hash=35e75d9dbfdc21cd954d682670c3fcac2123531d)
:eye:
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what a g00n. i mean, look at him
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
But we stormed that first year, right?
Just the KU game iirc and that was in January
I only remember 3 OOD stormings in my lifetime; UT (Wooly), KU (Mike/Beasley), KU (Jake).
OU (Altman) :cyclist:
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
Fair point. Hilton Magic is so strong it will carry you into the NCAA tournament once every 5 years.
that was mediocre coaching and talent that did that.
it wasnt hilton magic that beat us in manhattan.
Nope, It was.....
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thesportsbank.net%2Fcore%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F08%2Fscott-christopherson.jpg&hash=35e75d9dbfdc21cd954d682670c3fcac2123531d)
:eye:
I always thought he looked like this guy
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ghostinthemachine.net%2Ffanfox2.jpg&hash=3c40a91465d5ee8f79581dbb082f0f49875f07ce)
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i would have stormed it to. what a great year they had..
We've had 5 straight years like the one they just had.
bolded the reason for their storming.
Fair point. Hilton Magic is so strong it will carry you into the NCAA tournament once every 5 years.
that was mediocre coaching and talent that did that.
it wasnt hilton magic that beat us in manhattan.
Nope, It was.....
(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thesportsbank.net%2Fcore%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F08%2Fscott-christopherson.jpg&hash=35e75d9dbfdc21cd954d682670c3fcac2123531d)
:eye:
Jaundice