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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Basketball is hard => Topic started by: EllToPay on January 24, 2011, 10:20:27 PM
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What the eff did Rodney do to you? It is an absolute sin to be sitting him the last 10 minutes of this game, especially after he hits a bit 3 and grabs 2 JYC rebounds.
Unreal.
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They won :dunno:
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Agreed. His confidence having been cac for two games, benching seems -- well -- as Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) as the play of the team.
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Things would be so much smoother if we had a good PG. But Frank rough ridin' refuses to recruit a good PG, so we clunk around, guys like McGruber are forced to do things they don't do well, they make mistakes and Frank punishes them for it.
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But Frank effing refuses to recruit a good PG
Oh, he recruits them; he just hasn't landed one in the past three years.
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jesus rough ridin' christ what a stupid thread.
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Man you guys are pissed. Who gives a shazbot! who played most? Wins a win.
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:facepalm:
Concussion.
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I just can't understand you, EllToPay.
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:facepalm:
Concussion.
:runaway: :runaway:
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:facepalm:
Concussion.
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Rodney was on the end of the bench w/o jersey on with a towel on his head. shortly before he was doing some running on the baseline during a TO.
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Nice work "pointer outers".
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I would prefer everyone focus on JHR's 17 worthless minutes...primarily the stretch where he tripped Pullen, causing a TO, then promptly committed a pussy foul on a dunk on the resultant possession.
Wally Judge must be the most horrific practicer of all time.
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Thanks captain. HIPAA? :ck:
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I would prefer everyone focus on JHR's 17 worthless minutes...primarily the stretch where he tripped Pullen, causing a TO, then promptly committed a pussy foul on a dunk on the resultant possession.
Wally Judge must be the most horrific practicer of all time.
why not focus on tay's minutes?
we probably would have one by 20+ if he plays another 10 minutes or so.
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I would prefer everyone focus on JHR's 17 worthless minutes...primarily the stretch where he tripped Pullen, causing a TO, then promptly committed a pussy foul on a dunk on the resultant possession.
Wally Judge must be the most horrific practicer of all time.
This play nearly resulted in disastrous consequences for several electrical devices in my house
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I would prefer everyone focus on JHR's 17 worthless minutes...primarily the stretch where he tripped Pullen, causing a TO, then promptly committed a pussy foul on a dunk on the resultant possession.
Wally Judge must be the most horrific practicer of all time.
This play nearly resulted in disastrous consequences for several electrical devices in my house
The thing that I'm noticing is that JHR is only an effective player against certain teams (i.e. Missouri). Otherwise, he's basically a liability on the floor. I mean, this can happen with multiple players on different teams. Sean May of UNC almost always had bad games against the bigs from Boston College like 5 years ago. Does Frank not know that JHR is a situational player at best? I'm more perplexed about this than I am about his choice in PG rotation.
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JHR probably does practice better than Wally. He also plays better in games.
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JHR probably does practice better than Wally. He also plays better in games.
Wally could hardly have played worse, but we'll never know, will we?
why not focus on tay's minutes?
we probably would have one by 20+ if he plays another 10 minutes or so.
I would have gotten around to it, but I found JHR's PT far more affronting today.
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JHR probably does practice better than Wally. He also plays better in games.
Wally could hardly have played worse, but we'll never know, will we?
why not focus on tay's minutes?
we probably would have one by 20+ if he plays another 10 minutes or so.
I would have gotten around to it, but I found JHR's PT far more affronting today.
I guess we'll never know if Potuzak could have played better, either.
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JHR played really hard today and that's why Frank left him in. He also is one of the few guys that can match-up length-wise with Baylor.
Don't know why Judge isn't playing, or Russell. But their decrease in PT seems to be tied together somehow, but maybe not. Just a weird deal with those two.
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JHR was extremely awful tonight, for the 19th time this year. I couldn't care less how "hard" he played; he looks like a stretched out wino in clown shoes who has never seen a basketball in his life.
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JHR played really hard today and that's why Frank left him in. He also is one of the few guys that can match-up length-wise with Baylor.
Don't know why Judge isn't playing, or Russell. But their decrease in PT seems to be tied together somehow, but maybe not. Just a weird deal with those two.
You can play hard all you want and still be a liability. That's what JHR was tonight, basically. That's why I don't get why Frank leaves him out there. And yeah, I think everyone on this board is wondering WTF is up with Judge.
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JHR was extremely awful tonight, for the 19th time this year. I couldn't care less how "hard" he played; he looks like a stretched out wino in clown shoes who has never seen a basketball in his life.
How many good games has wally played that weren't against north florida/somebody equally crappy to north florida?
I'm not saying JHR is good, but who cares if he comes off the bench ahead of judge?
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Russell's decreased playing time pretty closely tied to Southwell's minutes, I think. I have no problem with it.
Wally just doesn't produce.
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JHR was extremely awful tonight, for the 19th time this year. I couldn't care less how "hard" he played; he looks like a stretched out wino in clown shoes who has never seen a basketball in his life.
How many good games has wally played that weren't against north florida/somebody equally crappy to north florida?
I'm not saying JHR is good, but who cares if he comes off the bench ahead of judge?
I do. Judge is a far better investment long-term. 17 minutes to 1? GMAFB.
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JHR was extremely awful tonight, for the 19th time this year. I couldn't care less how "hard" he played; he looks like a stretched out wino in clown shoes who has never seen a basketball in his life.
How many good games has wally played that weren't against north florida/somebody equally crappy to north florida?
I'm not saying JHR is good, but who cares if he comes off the bench ahead of judge?
I do. Judge is a far better investment long-term. 17 minutes to 1? GMAFB.
I think there is a very real threat that Wally has reverted to a status of Permanent Bust, but one would have to think that he has a bigger ceiling than JHR. And aside from the situations where he can play well against certain teams, his ceiling doesn't appear to be that good.
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
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(https://goemaw.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F0JgRM.jpg&hash=2dbb80e9d13a0255ff1fe0ff370a9f90816f772e)
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JHR was extremely awful tonight, for the 19th time this year. I couldn't care less how "hard" he played; he looks like a stretched out wino in clown shoes who has never seen a basketball in his life.
How many good games has wally played that weren't against north florida/somebody equally crappy to north florida?
I'm not saying JHR is good, but who cares if he comes off the bench ahead of judge?
I do. Judge is a far better investment long-term. 17 minutes to 1? GMAFB.
Judge started most of the games in the nonconference. It's obvious that Frank wanted him to be the starter. He was given every chance to earn minutes, and he failed to do so. If he's no better than what he's shown so far, then why do you think he'll ever be really good?
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You dont know whats up with Wally? :facepalm:
He sucks. And Im so happy frank is running off Nick. (sarcasm)
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
I'll give him credit for being able to get down low and occasionally force some hacks by BU. His positioning isn't bad, and he sometimes plays with a decent BBIQ. But his post moves are so weak that he'll get blasted by the really good teams in the conference. That's why it's frustrating to see him out there when Wally could potentially get his crap together and tear it up. But, who knows, 5 stars do bust every once in a while :dunno:
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
17 minutes, 0-3 from the field (all from point-blank range). Huge lapses on D, tripping our best player with his clown shoes.
Terrible.
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
I'll give him credit for being able to get down low and occasionally force some hacks by BU. His positioning isn't bad, and he sometimes plays with a decent BBIQ. But his post moves are so weak that he'll get blasted by the really good teams in the conference. That's why it's frustrating to see him out there when Wally could potentially get his cac together and tear it up. But, who knows, 5 stars do bust every once in a while :dunno:
Hey, I want Wally to play and be good as much as the next guy, but its not like Frank hasn't went out of his way to give him every opportunity. For now, if JHR can give a few solid minutes when Kelly is being dumb, so be it.
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
17 minutes, 0-3 from the field (all from point-blank range). Huge lapses on D, tripping our best player with his clown shoes.
Terrible.
He had a few lapses, but he doesn't even come close to having the defensive lapses that Kelly does. Kelly is living proof that Frank will give an offensive player the benefit of the doubt if he absolutely has to.
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
17 minutes, 0-3 from the field (all from point-blank range). Huge lapses on D, tripping our best player with his clown shoes.
Terrible.
He had a few lapses, but he doesn't even come close to having the defensive lapses that Kelly does. Kelly is living proof that Frank will give an offensive player the benefit of the doubt if he absolutely has to.
I'm indifferent to Kelly at this point. A necessity. JHR? Not so much.
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
17 minutes, 0-3 from the field (all from point-blank range). Huge lapses on D, tripping our best player with his clown shoes.
Terrible.
He had a few lapses, but he doesn't even come close to having the defensive lapses that Kelly does. Kelly is living proof that Frank will give an offensive player the benefit of the doubt if he absolutely has to.
I'm indifferent to Kelly at this point. A necessity. JHR? Not so much.
Someone has to play when Kelly is in foul trouble or Frank gets ticked enough to pull him. If its Wally great, but right now its JHR.
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JHR was far from terrible tonight. Not great, maybe not even good, but he wasn't terrible.
17 minutes, 0-3 from the field (all from point-blank range). Huge lapses on D, tripping our best player with his clown shoes.
Terrible.
He had a few lapses, but he doesn't even come close to having the defensive lapses that Kelly does. Kelly is living proof that Frank will give an offensive player the benefit of the doubt if he absolutely has to.
I'm indifferent to Kelly at this point. A necessity. JHR? Not so much.
Someone has to play when Kelly is in foul trouble or Frank gets ticked enough to pull him. If its Wally great, but right now its JHR.
Yes, but I'm not indifferent to the Wally/JHR decision. I think it should be Wally every time, fouls permitting.
We've seen JHR's ceiling; it's what he does every rough ridin' game right now. That's it. That's all he's going to be.
If Wally sucks this bad from here out with extended minutes, so be it; but we won't have lost anything we wouldn't have lost by not playing him (and playing JHR instead) anyway.
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Someone has to play when Kelly is in foul trouble or Frank gets ticked enough to pull him. If its Wally great, but right now its JHR.
Hey, I want Wally to play and be good as much as the next guy, but its not like Frank hasn't went out of his way to give him every opportunity. For now, if JHR can give a few solid minutes when Kelly is being dumb, so be it.
Fair enough. But goddamn if he isn't frustrating to watch. Seeing all of these weak post moves by players other than Kelly have started to grate on me. It reminds me of how bad I am at posting up despite the fact that I'm built like an o-lineman.
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this whole thread is fantastic sys bait. however, i refuse to defend jhr.
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Frank said Rod whacked his head on the court, complained of things spinning. Trainer's decision for Rod to sit. Unknown if a concussion.
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question for doctors of medicine and philosophy: if mcgruder hadn't clipped his minifro, would he have been adequately protected from concussing blows to the head?
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question for doctors of medicine and philosophy: if mcgruder hadn't clipped his minifro, would he have been adequately protected from concussing blows to the head?
I've wondered WTF is with us and players with their concussions? Nino (he must have the elusive herniated concussion for as long as he's been out) and now McGruber. I'm not even touching the rampant stupidity that has plagued this team either. DAMNIT!!!
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I think it's pretty obvious that Frank considers JHR to be our secret weapon. The key to this new (awesome) offense that we're running is JHR getting the ball 20+ ft away from the basket and shaking it over his head while half of our players cut and move themselves out of position and the other half stare at each other from opposite wings.
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Frank said Rod whacked his head on the court, complained of things spinning. Trainer's decision for Rod to sit. Unknown if a concussion.
prob this...
http://www.vestibular.org/vestibular-disorders/specific-disorders/bppv.php
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We've seen JHR's ceiling; it's what he does every rough ridin' game right now. That's it. That's all he's going to be.
How do you know we've seen JHR's ceiling and not Wally's? Both are sophomores. Judge looked better last year than he as this year. JHR has shown improvement. At least JHR is willing to attack the basket (unsuccessfully in most cases).
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:facepalm:
Concussion.
Oh.
:users:
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/kansas-state/jordan-henriguez-roberts
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JHR is not horrible, what he is right now is inconsistent. Goddamn you guys with your blanket statements. And anyone that doesn't think he has improved must have forgotten his playing time last year. Now, that said, I'd still like to see Wally as the first choice at 5...but damn I'd like to see him get back to an aggressive attack the basket mentality that we seem to be sorely missing.
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
jfc, kougs. it was only a year ago. how can you have already forgotten how shitty jhr was as a freshman?
he's not good now, but he's like 8 times better.
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
jfc, kougs. it was only a year ago. how can you have already forgotten how cacty jhr was as a freshman?
he's not good now, but he's like 8 times better.
He's super shitty now. I think the Mizzou fluke has clouded the reality of his other 19 performances.
_FAN, I just looked at his stats per 40 from last year and this year, and they're nearly identical.
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
jfc, kougs. it was only a year ago. how can you have already forgotten how cacty jhr was as a freshman?
he's not good now, but he's like 8 times better.
He's super cacty now. I think the Mizzou fluke has clouded the reality of his other 19 performances.
_FAN, I just looked at his stats per 40 from last year and this year, and they're nearly identical.
Let's see; ORating, eFG%, True shooting %, FT Rate, OR%, DR%, TO%, and Steal% are ALL better. FT% and A% about the same, Block % slightly down.
Yep, no improvment.
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
jfc, kougs. it was only a year ago. how can you have already forgotten how cacty jhr was as a freshman?
he's not good now, but he's like 8 times better.
He's super cacty now. I think the Mizzou fluke has clouded the reality of his other 19 performances.
_FAN, I just looked at his stats per 40 from last year and this year, and they're nearly identical.
Let's see; ORating, eFG%, True shooting %, FT Rate, OR%, DR%, TO%, and Steal% are ALL better. FT% and A% about the same, Block % slightly down.
Yep, no improvment.
What you just saw was kougs getting his bbs'ing scrotum sliced off with a katana.
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
jfc, kougs. it was only a year ago. how can you have already forgotten how cacty jhr was as a freshman?
he's not good now, but he's like 8 times better.
He's super cacty now. I think the Mizzou fluke has clouded the reality of his other 19 performances.
_FAN, I just looked at his stats per 40 from last year and this year, and they're nearly identical.
Let's see; ORating, eFG%, True shooting %, FT Rate, OR%, DR%, TO%, and Steal% are ALL better. FT% and A% about the same, Block % slightly down.
Yep, no improvment.
Again, his stats per 40 are not significantly improved at all.
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You guys want a player to get more minutes because he was rated very highly in high school, regardless of whether he is performing better than the other option now?
Seriously, just want to be clear on your argument...
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
jfc, kougs. it was only a year ago. how can you have already forgotten how cacty jhr was as a freshman?
he's not good now, but he's like 8 times better.
He's super cacty now. I think the Mizzou fluke has clouded the reality of his other 19 performances.
_FAN, I just looked at his stats per 40 from last year and this year, and they're nearly identical.
Let's see; ORating, eFG%, True shooting %, FT Rate, OR%, DR%, TO%, and Steal% are ALL better. FT% and A% about the same, Block % slightly down.
Yep, no improvment.
Again, his stats per 40 are not significantly improved at all.
define significant
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JHR has shown improvement.
:lol:
jfc, kougs. it was only a year ago. how can you have already forgotten how cacty jhr was as a freshman?
he's not good now, but he's like 8 times better.
He's super cacty now. I think the Mizzou fluke has clouded the reality of his other 19 performances.
_FAN, I just looked at his stats per 40 from last year and this year, and they're nearly identical.
Let's see; ORating, eFG%, True shooting %, FT Rate, OR%, DR%, TO%, and Steal% are ALL better. FT% and A% about the same, Block % slightly down.
Yep, no improvment.
Again, his stats per 40 are not significantly improved at all.
slower pace this year
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You guys want a player to get more minutes because he was rated very highly in high school, regardless of whether he is performing better than the other option now?
Seriously, just want to be clear on your argument...
Yep. I don't think it's too far-fetched to say Judge's ceiling, due to athletic ability and the skills he's shown he possesses, is far higher than JHR's.
So if they both suck now, invest in the one that might actually not suck in the future. I guess I don't have the imagination to envision a world in which JHR doesn't suck at basketball, whereas I can easily envision Judge not sucking at basketball.
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Again, his stats per 40 are not significantly improved at all.
Did you look at the stats I listed? Which of the % based stats that I listed can be distorted?
BTW, I didn't say anywhere that his improvement was drastic, but its still improvement. I've said he's developed into a servicable post player off the bench and is at least an equal option to Judge.
I also haven't said its either/or with Judge/JHR. Both need to play; I've only pointed out that JHR isn't terrible, but is also far from being great. Just like most role playing post players in this league.
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You guys want a player to get more minutes because he was rated very highly in high school, regardless of whether he is performing better than the other option now?
Seriously, just want to be clear on your argument...
Yep. I don't think it's too far-fetched to say Judge's ceiling, due to athletic ability and the skills he's shown he possesses, is far higher than JHR's.
So if they both suck now, invest in the one that might actually not suck in the future. I guess I don't have the imagination to envision a world in which JHR doesn't suck at basketball, whereas I can easily envision Judge not sucking at basketball.
I would play the one who sucks less and hope that the other post (who got a ton of playing time and didn't do much with it against scrub competition) takes it upon himself to work on his game in practice and the offseason.
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equal option to Judge.
Exactly. An equal option now, which a much lower ceiling.
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You guys want a player to get more minutes because he was rated very highly in high school, regardless of whether he is performing better than the other option now?
Seriously, just want to be clear on your argument...
Yep. I don't think it's too far-fetched to say Judge's ceiling, due to athletic ability and the skills he's shown he possesses, is far higher than JHR's.
So if they both suck now, invest in the one that might actually not suck in the future. I guess I don't have the imagination to envision a world in which JHR doesn't suck at basketball, whereas I can easily envision Judge not sucking at basketball.
I would play the one who sucks less and hope that the other post (who got a ton of playing time and didn't do much with it against scrub competition) takes it upon himself to work on his game in practice and the offseason.
There's no substitute for game experience.
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judge isn't that athletic. tired of people claiming he's some incred athlete. it's a big part of why people's expectations for him are off, imo, and it isn't accurate.
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equal option to Judge.
Exactly. An equal option now, which a much lower ceiling.
I can live with that. Heck, I don't even disagree; but can you really say Judge hasn't gotten every opportunity to surpass JHR this year?
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equal option to Judge.
Exactly. An equal option now, which a much lower ceiling.
I can live with that. Heck, I don't even disagree; but can you really say Judge hasn't gotten every opportunity to surpass JHR this year?
Not really. Throw him in a conference game and leave him in even if he makes a mistake. Or at least put him back in later in the game. It isn't like JHR was playing mistake-free basketball out there.
And keep in mind I already have given up on this season, so if we suffer a bit short-term with Judge in there instead of JHR, I'm totally fine with that.
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You guys want a player to get more minutes because he was rated very highly in high school, regardless of whether he is performing better than the other option now?
Seriously, just want to be clear on your argument...
Yep. I don't think it's too far-fetched to say Judge's ceiling, due to athletic ability and the skills he's shown he possesses, is far higher than JHR's.
So if they both suck now, invest in the one that might actually not suck in the future. I guess I don't have the imagination to envision a world in which JHR doesn't suck at basketball, whereas I can easily envision Judge not sucking at basketball.
I would play the one who sucks less and hope that the other post (who got a ton of playing time and didn't do much with it against scrub competition) takes it upon himself to work on his game in practice and the offseason.
There's no substitute for game experience.
I think JHR can get much better with playing time and a lot of work in the weight room. Wally's problems seem to be mental. I'm not sure how much playing time will help him.
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I think JHR can get much better
Then I guess we're at an impasse.
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equal option to Judge.
Exactly. An equal option now, which a much lower ceiling.
I can live with that. Heck, I don't even disagree; but can you really say Judge hasn't gotten every opportunity to surpass JHR this year?
Not really. Throw him in a conference game and leave him in even if he makes a mistake. Or at least put him back in later in the game. It isn't like JHR was playing mistake-free basketball out there.
And keep in mind I already have given up on this season, so if we suffer a bit short-term with Judge in there instead of JHR, I'm totally fine with that.
fortunately for us the staff hasn't given up on this season yet. though if we lose to nebraska at home next wednesday then i'd agree, go with wally the rest of the way.
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:combofan:
question for doctors of medicine and philosophy: if mcgruder hadn't clipped his minifro, would he have been adequately protected from concussing blows to the head?
It was a nappy helmet so I'd say YES!
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:combofan:question for doctors of medicine and philosophy: if mcgruder hadn't clipped his minifro, would he have been adequately protected from concussing blows to the head?
It was a nappy helmet so I'd say YES!
Interestingly, starting around 5:45, Frank credits the haircut for McOreb's tremendous energy.
http://videos.kansas.com/vmix_hosted_apps/p/media?id=55870421
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I think it's pretty obvious that Frank considers JHR to be our secret weapon. The key to this new (awesome) offense that we're running is JHR getting the ball 20+ ft away from the basket and shaking it over his head while half of our players cut and move themselves out of position and the other half stare at each other from opposite wings.
put some clown shoes on JHR, standing at the elbow, back to the basket, shaking it over his head, with 4 players cutting around him....
Sounds to me that JHR is the perfect novelty act the Globetrotters need...
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Most fans will never like JHR just because he's so goofy.
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Most fans will never like JHR just because he's so goofy.
i dont like him b/c hes so uncoordinated...
anyone that thinks JHR has more potential than wally is an idiot. anyone that thinks that wally is currently a better player than JHR is also an idiot. i have personally witnessed enough terrible post players in my life to realize that by the time they have been around for 3 or 4 years they improve dramatically. wally very well could be a beast if he sticks it out until his senior year. JHR? most likely not so much, but i wont rule him out.
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JHR is better this year. He can't finish though.
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People who keep saying Wally's ceiling is so high are in for serious disappointment. Maybe if he transfers and gets into a different system, he could get better. He just doesn't have the right mentality to ever be good in Frank Martin's system.
JHR, on the other hand, needs to get stronger, not use his hands as much on defense, and develop some post moves that don't involve charging the defender. All of these problems can be addressed with playing time and work in the offseason. I would be surprised if JHR isn't head and shoulders better than Wally next year.
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People who keep saying Wally's ceiling is so high are in for serious disappointment.
Serious disappointment is what being a Q@s fan is all about. :dunno:
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finally kougs says something i can agree with :woot:
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People who keep saying Wally's ceiling is so high are in for serious disappointment. Maybe if he transfers and gets into a different system, he could get better. He just doesn't have the right mentality to ever be good in Frank Martin's system.
JHR, on the other hand, needs to get stronger, not use his hands as much on defense, and develop some post moves that don't involve charging the defender. All of these problems can be addressed with playing time and work in the offseason. I would be surprised if JHR isn't head and shoulders better than Wally next year.
I find it highly unlikely that Wally's big problem is the "system".
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Wally would be the same effing player he is now if he were somewhere else.